← Personal Injury Mastermind w/ Chris Dreyer
Personal Injury Mastermind w/ Chris Dreyer
306. Speed + Tech: How KurtzReilly Built an Explosive PI Firm in 12 Months
00:20:23
Brian Riley reveals KurtzReilly's blueprint for explosive growth by showing how they merged speed and technology into scalable systems, from three-click complaint filing to aggressive pre-litigation strategies that transformed their startup into a powerhouse in just 12 months.
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- [00:04]
Chris Dreyer
Speed without technology is unsustainable. Technology without a speed focused strategy is wasteful. Where speed and tech overlap, that's where the magic happens. Transforming a steadily growing firm into an explosive force. This is Personal Injury Mastermind, your guide to building better law firms faster. I'm your host, Chris Dreyer, founder and CEO of Rankings IO, the marketing agency of choice for elite law firms. To harness velocity, you must hold the reins on both tech and speed. My guest today is build a firm that's doing it better than most. Brian Reilly and Austin Kurtz launched Kurtz Reilly just a year ago. I don't care how long you've been in the game, these young stars are knocking out of the park, and everyone can learn from them. I had Austin on the show just a few weeks ago, so when you're done here, look for that episode in the show. Notes. In just 12 months, Brian's firm has found a way to turn speed into a competitive advantage. These guys grind and hustle, but that's not the only factor in their success. It's not about working harder or longer hours. It's about, it's about building systems where technology and velocity reinforce each other.
- [01:03]
Brian Reilly
We've really implemented as many AI and tech tools as we possibly can to make our processes extremely, extremely efficient. I mean, filing a complaint in our office, three clicks of a button, boom, boom, boom. You have all your documents prepared. It's just a matter of whether you're willing to, you know, submit it to Turbo Court online and get it filed or not and really move it forward. But, like, we really do make it that easy for, you know, ourselves and our staff to generate the documents so that if we're on the phone with the insurance company and they're really giving us a hard time, within 10 minutes, we put our money where our mouse is, where our mouths are. Right? You said this, we said that, we did this. Now it's your turn to step up.
- [01:46]
Chris Dreyer
And do something that's incredible and, and, and just your willingness to go and litigate and, and like, hey, we're going to do this. We're going to, we're going to fight you. This isn't the correct offer. You know, the other thing you mentioned is the time on desk. So this is one of those that, like, you know, I'm approaching that 300th episode. It's about to go live. But this is something that's just not talked about. I think I had one episode where James Farren from over in North Carolina talked a lot about it, about the time on desk and velocity and how that impacts cash flow. You know, just what are some of the things that slow it down or create bottlenecks and what are some of the actions you can take to speed it up?
- [02:25]
Brian Reilly
Obviously, it's our goal to convert that client as quickly as possible. The number one thing that would, you know, help drive the time on desk lower would be converting the intake at the time of the call, getting them set up with the proper medical treatment. It's like issue spotting. Right. As soon as the ins. You find out the insurance company is kind of giving you a hard time or they're not taking your case seriously, then you just gotta make a decision on it. Right. Whether it's a liability issue or a mechanism of injury issue or a causation issue, Zero in on the issue, figure out if you can win that issue, and then get aggressive and do something about it.
- [03:05]
Chris Dreyer
You had a personal experience with your dad growing up through the legal system, you know, as a plaintiff, you know, to. How did that light your fire in the life of law?
- [03:14]
Brian Reilly
Yeah, big time. My dad was. Yeah, he was a plaintiff for an incident that he discovered in about 2005, 2006. My uncle was stealing money from the family. I just remember back in the day, you know, coming home after football practice, my dad would have just like a shitload of papers out on the, on the dining room table. I was standing around the table with him, trying to figure it out with him for years. Probably didn't officially wrap up and settle and finalize till like 2020. I think I went through like two or three different phases of trial. I remember coming back from college and, and going to the Arizona Supreme Court and watching my dad's attorneys argue the, the motion that was ahead of them. And that was when I really, you know, just getting out of school and was kind of like, what am I going to do with my life? I said, I, I could probably do this attorney thing. That's when I decided to. Applied to law school and got started.
- [04:06]
Chris Dreyer
That's awesome. And man, what a. What a long case was that. 14 years.
- [04:11]
Brian Reilly
Geez. Oh, yeah. And the, you know, the expense was just insane. Terrible.
- [04:16]
Chris Dreyer
Unreal. Unreal. Yeah. Before you started the firm, Kurt Riley, you. You're already on the path to success, you know, can you walk me through, you know, how you got to Morgan and Morgan and just that experience.
- [04:27]
Brian Reilly
Yeah. So I started practicing in 2016. I've gone personal injury my, My entire career, so even when I was in law school, I got a job as a case manager, paralegal Intake types, worked at a firm for four or five years, went to trial, got some great results in my, you know, my first few years, and then eventually got recruited over to Morgan and Morgan, where I was there for three years and ran their Arizona office, which, by the way, was an awesome experience. You know, I kind of equate that to starting a firm in Arizona with the support of the biggest law firm in the. In the nation. And then, you know, being able to do it again, but on my own dime with Austin and you know, just really in our first year right now, building those foundation blocks, trying to do everything that I did three or four years ago for them and then create something new and different for us.
- [05:18]
Chris Dreyer
I had Bill Umansky on the podcast earlier and he was talking about like, hey, when you lose an employee, like staying in touch and just not always like villainizing the scenario. And I, that was, that was cool of you to say. Like, hey, this was a great experience.
- [05:34]
Brian Reilly
For anybody who's going through that. And it can be rough in some situations. Always trying to do the right thing, you know, stay above board, be honest, be transparent. Usually it will. It'll work out in the right way.
- [05:49]
Chris Dreyer
I really appreciate that. Thank, thanks for sharing that. You know, I talked to Austin too, and he mentioned that I was asking him, like, how do you divide the roles? Because you have a startup firm that's not just growing, it's like exponential growth, like significant growth quickly. You do a lot with the pre lit, of course, you guys both love going and litigating cases and you've got that experience and that's a differentiator because most people don't like to litigate. So I guess, you know, in that role, working with the pre let and the litigators, like, what kind of KPIs are you looking at? How do you oversee that department? You know, talk to me about that. That role.
- [06:26]
Brian Reilly
Yeah. So primarily right now, I'm working the pre wet files that we have here at the firm. We've been very fortunate to partner with many referral partners, you know, in the state and outside of the state, helping us get. Us get cases and obviously helping clients. And then, you know, as those cases advance, right. If we are not able to get them resolved for the right dollar amount and pre litigation, they go to litigation, which Austin kind of takes over. So, you know, for me, I mean, one of my favorite KPIs is, you know, you're either sending out a demand per day or you're resolving a case every single day. And soon enough, as the firm grows and the caseload starts to mature. I think we'll get to a point where myself and the other two pre litig. Pre litigation attorneys that work for me will be hitting that mark every single day. Right? Right. You're getting a case resolved and then you're finding another case. You're getting a demand out, and that's a simple KPI. But it does take a mature enough caseload and enough cases that are ripe to actually be able to achieve that goal. And I think that's really what we're looking for right now. If I can have my. My attorneys get out, you know, 10 to 15 new demands a month, I'm very happy with that. And then, of course, they all have banking goals. Right. Average fee is a goal that, you know, we're looking at right now in our first 10 months or so of being in a, you know, being in business. And that's a super important goal for me. I think that's super. That's like the most reflective goal of, you know, how good of an attorney are you on an average case? And then another KPI that I'm always looking at is time on desk. You know, if the case has been on your desk for a year and a half, are we moving this case to litigation or not? You know, what's the hold on? Right. So we're probably too young to really have a good idea of that KPI, but it is something that we're. We're looking at. And I know for, and I Probably have another 10 other KPIs I look at every single day. But those are the ones that, you know, we're trying to hit on the most. Right. If you're getting a bad offer on a case and we're willing to litigate it, let's get it to Austin. Let's get it into litigation. Let's get aggressive.
- [08:33]
Chris Dreyer
Let's face it, being a great lawyer isn't enough to succeed. You need to generate consistent leads. Personal injury is the most saturated niche, competition is fierce, and differentiation is everything. When the deck is stacked against you, you need a comprehensive resource to beat the competition. My latest book, Personal Injury Lawyer Marketing, is your roadmap to consistent leads and exponential growth. It is a masterclass on marketing for personal injury firms. It's packed with actionable strategies on where to invest your marketing dollars for maximum impact. No more guesswork, no more wasted ad spend, just clear, proven methods to transform your firm from good to goat. Grab your copy of Personal Injury Lawyer Marketing on Amazon. Link is in the show. Notes well, that's incredible that you're, you're collecting these KPIs out of the gate. I can only imagine what three and four years looks like in terms of optimizing for those numbers. You know, I don't know. Arizona average fees. I think I had Chad Dudley on and he made a comment that was like just a general nationwide. And I don't know how true this is because like there's states like Maryland where the numbers are really low on average. He said something like, if your fee, attorney fees are less than 10,000, you've got room to improve. 10 to 15 is okay. 15 to 20 is really good. Above 20k is great. It's that kind of fair, like an assessment of just overall.
- [09:56]
Brian Reilly
Yeah, I mean that's, that's exactly right in line of what I would, you know, save for Arizona. So in Arizona, the minimum state policy is 25,000. Right. So if you have a case and it's a real case with real insurance, a real liability, and you're helping your client out as best as you possibly can, ideally you're giving them the, you know, the full case value of the policy limits of 25,000. So that would equal like an $8,000 fee for 33 1/3% contingency. So that's kind of like the marker of where I would say, you know, average to good is. And then anything above that is great. I know for me and doing this, you know, kind of repeating this, starting a firm three years ago with Morgan and Morgan doing it again. Now I know for a fact that the average fee in the first year is usually a little bit lower. And then as more cases advance, mature and get into litigation, the fees start to go up. And I think litigation is actually the, the real catalyst to moving the average fee up. Not only are you going to get better pre litigation results, but when there is a bigger policy and your clients hurt and you know, deserves it, you gotta litigate to get the real number. And of course that ends up impacting your average fee.
- [11:12]
Chris Dreyer
Yeah, and I'm sure that the insurance companies probably challenge newer firms just to see if they are gonna litigate, maybe do things a little bit different than a firm that's been in business for 20 years or so. I'd imagine there's some, some aspect of that. So the talking about your logo, how it combines the wolf and the lightning bolt, and then the, the story to tell about your firm's identity. Let justice roll. So, you know, tell me this story. How did the, the branding and the logo kind of emerge.
- [11:41]
Brian Reilly
Well, you know, Austin is so creative. I mean, I like, I think one of the best things that I do at this firm is I just let him kind of run free and do whatever he wants and come up with these crazy ideas and things like that. And you know, we have a lot of really good conversations over lunch, over drinks. And then literally like in that conversation we're like, yes, yes, yes, we'll write it down. Let's implement this. Let's do this. And that's exactly what this. I mean, when we were trying to come up with our firm name and trying to figure out what to do, I mean, we started off with like the Super Crash Bros, which we thought was like, you know, obviously I play on Super Smash Bros. And we like that. We were really in love with it. We were talking to people about it. We were like, you know, we're the Super Crash Bros. Like two young attorneys ready to fight. Like, we just loved that whole thing. And then we started talking some more. And you know what I think him and I really bring to the, to the table along with the attorneys that we have here is we have a lot of energy and the lightning will, you know, and you see it on like the, the little emojis and stuff like that, like sending back and forth, you know, between text messages. It just, it's kind of a spark. And that's what we want to bring to our cases. That's what we want to bring to, you know, litigation or pre lit or whatever it is, even our market. We want to bring that spark. We bring something different. And then the wolf was such a. That, that's like me just saying something and that. He, he just couldn't tell me no. For some reason I think I was like, yeah, let's get a mascot. Let's get a wolf. And he was like, how does that have anything to do with this? And I was like, I don't know, it's kind of like outdoor, you know, foresty. Like it's cool. And, and then he did it and we made a, a cool design. And now the wolf's been part of our website since the inception.
- [13:21]
Chris Dreyer
Talk to me a little bit about the finances side. I'm really interested. It's not super exciting to talk about finances and, and the bean counter stuff, but you know, how do you think about, like, for an agency perspective, when I'm selling retainers, it's like, it's very simple. Like not very many transactions. You know, they're the same fee, predictable. Like, how do you approach for the financial engineering and management of a firm, especially with you guys doing so much volume so quickly.
- [13:52]
Brian Reilly
We do a lot of forecasting, right. With our cases. So, you know, putting together like a hit list, if you want to call it that, coming up with a list of. Here are the cases we expect to resolve in the next 60, 90 days, and here's what the expected settlements are that's really helpful for our cash flow. Being that we are, you know, reasonably new and signing up a good amount of cases, we want to make sure the cases are staffed right. Right. So if I know, you know, month over month, we're signing up more cases. Well, we need to make sure we're getting attorneys in who can handle those cases. And we also need to make sure that the cases that we have are getting the proper attention. Right. They're getting the medical records ordered, they're getting the experts hired, whatever it might be. Because we know in the next, you know, nine months, 18 months, what have you, those cases will be resolving. And if we don't do something now, we're going to be in trouble later. So finances is, like, probably not my strong suit.
- [14:53]
Chris Dreyer
We.
- [14:53]
Brian Reilly
We actually hired a director of operations who I'll pop into our office at least once a week and I'll say, hey, we good? Yep, we're good. All right, great.
- [15:00]
Chris Dreyer
What small change has had the biggest positive impact on your firm?
- [15:05]
Brian Reilly
The first thing that popped in my head was, like, using AI and tech and things like that. And we are using, actually this new app, it's called Quillia. We're starting with that, starting tomorrow, where it's integrated with our filevine system. It's essentially an app where clients can kind of click around on it, and then someone like myself or Austin can pop on the screen and say, hey, you know, you click the lost wages button. This is what they are, this is what they mean. If you have them, please upload directly into the app or email directly to your case manager. It'll get plugged into the file, and then we know that's a damage. Right. Or, you know, there's another section where you can just record notes regarding all of your medical appointments, the providers you've been to, upload your bills and all gets integrated directly into this system. And I think it's pretty affordable for what we get. So, like, that's a huge thing, right? Like making the client experience what we would want and what we would expect if we were going through something like that.
- [16:05]
Chris Dreyer
Speed and technology separately, they're just tools, but when you combine them with strategic intent, they become a competitive advantage that can transform your firm's trajectory. Brighton the team at Kurt Riley has shown us exactly what's possible in just 12 months. When you get this formula right, if you're ready to accept accelerate your firm's growth, don't forget to grab your copy of my latest book, Personal Injury Lawyer Marketing from Good to Go. It's packed with strategies to help build systems of scale. You can find the link in the show notes. And if you found value in today's episode, make sure you check out my recent conversation with Brian's partner, Austin Kurtz. It's the perfect companion piece to understanding how they built such a dynamic firm so quickly. This is Chris Dreyer. You've been listening to Personal Injury Mastermind.