Episode Overview

Podcast: Pitchfork Economics with Nick Hanauer
Episode: CORE Econ: Rewriting Econ 101 for the Real World
Guests: Wendy Carlin (University College London, CORE Director), Suresh Naidu (Columbia University, CORE Contributor)
Date: December 2, 2025

Theme:
This episode explores the shortcomings of traditional Econ 101 education, the paradigm shift from trickle-down to middle-out economics, and profiles the CORE Econ project—an initiative to fundamentally reinvent introductory economics. By introducing real-world relevance, up-to-date research, and a pluralist approach, CORE aims to excite students and reform how economics is taught.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Critique of Traditional Economics Education

• Outdated Approaches:
  • Hosts Nick Hanauer and Goldie recall their own aversion to traditional econ textbooks, describing them as “garbage” and “nonsense.”
    • “I got one quarter of the way through my Econ 101 course and dropped it. This is just not true.” —Nick Hanauer [01:30]
• Failure of Trickle-Down Economics:
  • Traditional models are blamed for inequality and policy missteps over the last five decades.
    • “The rising inequality and growing political instability that we see today are the direct result of decades of bad economic theory.” —Nick Hanauer [00:02]

2. Origins and Purpose of the CORE Project

• Catalyst: 2008 Financial Crisis:
  • Wendy Carlin describes CORE’s beginnings in response to students’ questions during the financial crisis, and the realization that mainstream economics lacked real-world explanatory power.
    • “We took that as a lesson that changing what happens in the classroom can really also change what happens in the world.” —Wendy Carlin [06:10]
• Collaborative, Evidence-Based:
  • Built from a global roster of economists, the project now includes hundreds of contributors, is free and online, and used in over 500 classrooms in 71 countries.
    • [06:39]–[08:33]

3. Differences: CORE vs. Traditional Textbooks

• From Abstraction to Application:
  • Suresh Naidu: Textbooks typically focus on simplified supply/demand and treat government intervention as “distortion.” In contrast, CORE foregrounds real problems like inequality and sustainability.
    • “All the textbooks are called Economics and not The Economy, because the idea is to teach you this way of thinking about the world, if it’s not actually about the world, doesn’t matter.” —Suresh Naidu [10:20]
• Active Engagement:
  • Wendy Carlin: CORE frames economic questions from the student’s perspective, starting with issues like inequality and climate change—real concerns of today’s students—and gives them tools to analyze these.
    • “They would learn almost nothing about [inequality] in their standard course. That’s number one.” —Wendy Carlin [14:27]

4. How Students & Academia Respond

• Student Reactions:
  • The material is seen as more challenging but also more relevant and interesting. Free, digital access boosts engagement, especially in public policy contexts.
    • “It’s more interesting. And I think particularly because we were offering it for free... that went a long way in making it very popular among the students.” —Suresh Naidu [12:35]
• Academic Freedom:
  • The open, nonprofit model frees the curriculum from publisher influence and allows more accurate, up-to-date content.
    • “You have to say things that are wrong because that’s necessary in order to sell the most textbooks.... We want to teach what is right.” —Wendy Carlin [19:28]

5. The Power of the Publishing Industry

• Publishers Limit Content for Profit:
  • Guest stories point out publishers’ incentive to keep changing only 15% of textbook content (“the 15% rule”) to preserve sales, at the expense of accuracy or updating.
    • [20:02]
• Economic Literacy and Policy:
  • Since most non-economists take only Econ 101, the misleading ideas they learn can have outsized influence on business and policy.
    • “Introductory economics...has poisoned the world because most of the people out there making policy never get beyond the introductory level.” —Goldie [21:10]

6. Pluralism: Not Just “Neoclassical” Economics

• Borrowing from Many Schools:
  • CORE is not strictly neoclassical or heterodox; it draws upon “the best ideas, the best models and the best evidence wherever they come from”—Marx, Schumpeter, Hayek, Coase, and more.
    • “It’s not neoclassical. Our attitude is...look for where the good ideas and the evidence comes from.” —Wendy Carlin [26:48]
• Innovation as Central:
  • Unlike standard texts, CORE places innovation and creative destruction at the heart of its curriculum—essential for understanding historical economic growth (“the hockey stick”).
    • “We begin with innovation.... The whole process of creative destruction is at the heart of understanding how the world came to look the way it does.” —Wendy Carlin [23:40]

7. Barriers to Adoption and Plans for Expansion

• Limited Penetration, Especially in Community Colleges:
  • Highest uptake is in elite research universities, least in community colleges—a major focus for future outreach.
    • [08:33]
• Ongoing Curriculum Development:
  • Expansion includes new materials for advanced courses and empirical projects, with special focus on community colleges.
    • [25:00]

8. The Broader Mission: Economic Literacy for Society

• Rethinking Economic Conversation:
  • If she could redesign how society learns economics, Carlin would have everyone start with real-life questions, assemble a framework, and continuously assess evidence.
    • “Start with your question: what is it that you want to understand? And then...begin to use the tools...” —Wendy Carlin [29:48]
• Joy of the Project:
  • For Carlin, the reward of working on CORE is both intellectual challenge and discovery.
    • “This is the hardest research project I’ve ever worked on...and it’s been a lot of fun.” —Wendy Carlin [30:53]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “If you write a textbook, then you have to put things in the textbook that you know are wrong.... We've just taken such a radically different approach.”
  — Wendy Carlin [19:28]
• “They carry these very simple notions of markets mainly work well.... I think there’s a sense that we can change what’s imprinted on the typical student.”
  — Wendy Carlin [22:18]
• “Adam Smith talked about the power imbalance between capital and labor.”
  — Goldie [17:56]
• “You shouldn’t just decide you’re going to use ideas from one particular so-called school of thought or another.... The best way of making progress in economics...is to keep an open mind.”
  — Wendy Carlin [26:48]

Timestamps for Important Segments

• [00:02]–[01:16]: Opening critique of traditional economic theory
• [04:15]–[06:10]: Wendy Carlin describes the origins and mission of CORE
• [09:19]–[12:35]: Suresh Naidu explains CORE’s methodological and pedagogical differences
• [13:48]–[16:55]: Discussion on how CORE addresses labor market realities and minimum wage, centering on real actors and power imbalances
• [19:23]–[21:08]: Academic publishing and profit motives vs. accuracy in textbooks
• [23:40]: Innovation and creative destruction in the CORE curriculum
• [26:48]: Pluralism—CORE as neither strictly neoclassical nor heterodox
• [29:48]: If she could redesign economic literacy, Wendy Carlin would start with real-life questions
• [30:53]: Why working on CORE is both hard and joyful

Conclusion & Call to Action

The episode closes with an endorsement for listeners—students, teachers, or interested laypeople—to explore the free, online CORE resources and take part in a movement to make economics not only truer to reality, but more accessible, pluralist, and empowering for understanding the pressing challenges of today’s world.

Resources

• CORE Econ website: www.core-econ.org
• Show Notes: Include curriculum link and newsletter signup

“Economic literacy is not just about understanding markets, but about understanding power, innovation, inequality, and the dynamics shaping our world. CORE is an audacious effort to put this knowledge in everyone’s hands.”