Podcast Summary: Pitchfork Economics with Nick Hanauer

Episode: The Story That Built Today’s Economy (with George Monbiot and Binyamin Appelbaum)
Release Date: January 6, 2026
Host: Civic Ventures (Nick Hanauer with co-host)
Guests: George Monbiot, Binyamin Appelbaum

Overview

This episode explores the origins, intentions, and impacts of neoliberalism on modern economies. With incisive commentary from journalist George Monbiot and New York Times editorialist Binyamin Appelbaum, the conversation dissects the “story” we've lived inside—how neoliberal ideas were consciously crafted and spread, how economists shaped (and justified) public policy over recent decades, and why telling a new economic story is essential to building a fairer society.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. What is Neoliberalism? Its History and Narrative Power

(08:06 – 18:17, Monbiot segment)

• Intentional Ideology, Not Natural Law:
  Monbiot traces neoliberalism to the mid-20th century, starting with thinkers like Friedrich Hayek and Ludwig von Mises. From the outset, it was a deliberate ideology meant to counteract socialism (11:16 – C).
• Core Beliefs:
  “Competition is the defining feature of human life... we are fundamentally selfish and greedy... society should really be governed by buying and selling.” (08:06 – C).
• Freedom for Whom?
  The neoliberals stressed “freedom” – but “they were very careful not to specify freedom for whom.” (12:00 – C). For example, the freedom of bosses to avoid labor regulation reduces workers' freedoms.
• Strategic Dissemination:
  Neoliberalism spread through networks like the Mont Pelerin Society (1947), thinktanks, and academics—all backed by wealthy benefactors (13:50 – C).
• Narrative as Power:
  Neoliberalism was refined over decades into an apparently “natural” way of seeing society, erasing the sense of it being ideology (15:40 – C).

2. The Role of Story and Narrative in Economic Life

(18:17 – 26:39, Monbiot segment)

• Humans Are Storytelling Animals:
  Monbiot: “…we use shortcuts. And those shortcuts are what we call stories. We tell ourselves stories…to try to work out what's happening.” (18:21 – C).
• Restoration Story Structure:
  All successful political transformations rely on the same plot: disorder is introduced by a villain, the hero overcomes it, harmony is restored. Neoliberalism’s plot: the villain is the state, the hero is the entrepreneur, the solution is the free market (21:20 – C).
• Why Neoliberalism Succeeded:
  When the Keynesian social-democratic model faltered in the seventies, neoliberals had a compelling, easily disseminated story ready; others did not (23:35 – C).
• Need for a New Story:
  The financial crisis (2008) exposed neoliberalism’s failures, but no new grand narrative has yet replaced it (24:10 – C).

3. Human Nature: Selfishness vs. Cooperation

(16:32, also at 26:39; Monbiot)

• Monbiot disputes the Hobbesian/Neoliberal idea that selfishness dominates human nature. Recent science shows our dominant traits are “community feeling, empathy, altruism, kindness.” (16:32 – C).
• “We are a society of altruists governed by psychopaths” (17:45 – C, Monbiot).

4. Economists' Hour – The Ascendance of Economics in Policy

(32:34 – 36:49, Appelbaum segment)

• Policymaking Revolution:
  Binyamin Appelbaum lays out how, starting in the late 1960s–70s, economists convinced governments to withdraw from active management of the economy in favor of “letting market forces work” (32:34 – E).
• Examples of Shifts:
  Abandoning the draft for a paid Army; deregulation of airlines and trucking; the end of currency controls; steep tax cuts for the wealthy; diminished antitrust enforcement (34:34 – E).
• "Rising Tide" Argument:
  Economists asserted that maximizing growth would naturally benefit everyone, disregarding inequality (36:58 – E).

5. Neoliberal Myths and Their Debunking

(38:00 – 40:43, Appelbaum segment; also 51:11 – E)

• Empirical Evidence Lack:
  Many neoliberal ideas, like “a rising tide lifts all boats,” were based on scant evidence and grand extrapolations from thin data (39:02 – E).
• Economics as Science—Or Not?
  “Economics was a much more theoretical enterprise in the mid-century...nothing like the data that economists have to work with today.” (39:02 – E)
• Self-Fulfilling Policies:
  Economists argued their views were apolitical, but in practice, research often aligned with their political preferences (40:59 – E).

6. Consequences: Inequality and Reduced Public Policy Scope

(36:49 – 38:00, Appelbaum; 57:06 – episode wrap-up)

• Policies justified by neoliberal logic led to exploding inequality and societal divisions.
• “The fundamental tenet of neoliberalism, that inequality is fine and you should just shut up about it, turns out to have been deeply, deeply wrong.” (57:33 – A, Hanauer)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Monbiot on Neoliberalism’s Disguised Power:
  “The cleverest trick the devil ever plays is pretending he doesn't exist. And this is what neoliberalism has done to great effect over many years…” (08:06 – C)
• On Freedom:
  “They started talking about freedom, but they were very careful not to specify freedom for whom.” (12:00 – C)
• On Human Nature:
  “We are a society of altruists governed by psychopaths.” (17:45 – C)
• On Economics as Narrative:
  “Economics is a narrative which affects much more than just economic policy, and it shapes society itself.” (59:32 – B)
• On Markets and Government:
  “Governments create markets. Markets don't exist without government... We've got to get that premise out of our dialogue.” (51:11 – E)
• Appelbaum on Policy Impact:
  “One of the main arguments I make in my book is that economists really came in and said to the government: you shouldn't worry about inequality. ... And the result was that inequality absolutely exploded.” (36:58 – E)
• Appelbaum, why he writes:
  “I just think that economics plays a really important role in our lives. Economic policy really shapes our lives, and people don't understand it… I just think of my job as being to try and illuminate that for people.” (55:34 – E)

Timestamps for Significant Segments

• Defining Neoliberalism (08:06 – 11:16)
• Narrative Power – Restoration Story (18:21 – 22:10)
• Human Nature is Not All Selfishness (16:32 – 17:45)
• How Neoliberalism Spread (13:50 – 15:58)
• Economists’ Takeover of Policy (32:34 – 36:49)
• Rising Inequality, and Policy Choices (36:49 – 38:00)
• Evidence, or Not, for Neoliberal Claims (39:02 – 40:59)
• Economists’ Blind Spots and Power (40:59 – 43:13)
• How Markets Are Made and Framed (51:11 – 52:05)
• What Should Be Done (52:08 – 52:38)
• Episode Conclusions: Why Story Matters (59:32 – 60:12)

Conclusions and Takeaways

• Neoliberalism wasn’t an accident—it was crafted as an ideology and spread by powerful interests through a compelling, simple narrative.
• This paradigm shift to “let the market decide” not only rewrote economic policy but shaped beliefs about human nature, power, and fairness.
• The myth that the economy runs on natural laws like physics must be challenged—economies are social constructs, and the rules can be rewritten.
• Telling a better story—one that centers cooperation and justice over greed and competition—is crucial for returning democracy and fairness to economic life.

Tone and Language

The conversation is sharp, irreverent, and passionate, with guests and hosts challenging conventional wisdom, puncturing myths, and advocating for bold new narratives. The hosts use humor and candor (“we are a society of altruists governed by psychopaths”), and never shy away from calling out the real-world stakes of economic ideas.

Recommended Listening Order

1. George Monbiot – for the philosophical and historical/theoretical grounding in narrative and ideology.
2. Binyamin Appelbaum – for the political and practical consequences, and the insider’s look at how economic “common sense” is shaped.

For more on the topics and to join the effort to “tell a better story about who gets what and why,” find Pitchfork Economics at pitchforkeconomics.com.