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- [00:02]
Sophie Ansari
Lemonade.
- [00:06]
Isa Gonzalez
And I've always been, you know, kind of a rebel. And not in, like, the cool way. Like a rebel.
- [00:12]
Penn Badgley
I mean, it sounds pretty cool. You were riding motorcycles at, like, 6 years old, so I don't know. I mean, I know it didn't feel cool, but it probably looked pretty. Pretty badass.
- [00:24]
Isa Gonzalez
I think if you guys say that I'm cool, I'll take it.
- [00:28]
Penn Badgley
Welcome to PodCrushed. We're your hosts. I'm Penn.
- [00:31]
Nava Kaplan
I'm Nava.
- [00:32]
Sophie Ansari
And I'm Sophie. And I think we would have been your middle school besties playing Silent Hill together in the dark, peeing our pants.
- [00:39]
Penn Badgley
I don't like it, but we're gonna use it. Cut. Welcome to pod. Oh, I got a little bit of. I got a little bit. I feel like I went into the red there. Did I blow out the. I should turn my input down.
- [00:51]
Sophie Ansari
Welcome.
- [00:51]
Penn Badgley
Welcome to pod. Crushed.
- [00:53]
Sophie Ansari
Welcome.
- [00:54]
Penn Badgley
I'm joined by only half of my co hosts today.
- [00:57]
Sophie Ansari
That's right.
- [00:58]
Penn Badgley
Sophie Ansari. Or no. I should have let the audience guess. Which co host do you think I'm joined by?
- [01:05]
Sophie Ansari
If you're not watching, they probably would have guessed. Nava, the more industrious. But it's me. You're stuck with me.
- [01:13]
Penn Badgley
Yeah. And you know what? You really got through it, too. Cause you're sick. I could even tell just a little bit today.
- [01:19]
Sophie Ansari
I don't want to make you self conscious, but you. I am the sickest I've ever been, I think.
- [01:23]
Penn Badgley
Really?
- [01:24]
Sophie Ansari
Yeah. I was not sure I would make it today, but I got through it. And actually, Asa was so lovely. She was so talkative and told so many stories that she made it easy. Thank God.
- [01:36]
Penn Badgley
Yeah. The moment I started doing research on her, I was like, oh, this is gonna be an easy one. Cause she has. I mean, Specifically, starting at 12, she has a very rich, very rich, very rich life story.
- [01:46]
Isa Gonzalez
So.
- [01:46]
Penn Badgley
You know what? You guys don't wanna hear more of us speaking unless you do.
- [01:50]
Sophie Ansari
We can go for hours.
- [01:52]
Penn Badgley
Yeah. The way the blood drained from your face said that so far.
- [01:59]
Sophie Ansari
But you probably won't, right? You could tell I was sick. At what point could you tell that I was sick?
- [02:05]
Penn Badgley
It was like, halfway through.
- [02:07]
Sophie Ansari
Oh, okay.
- [02:07]
Penn Badgley
No, no, no, no, no. It was halfway through. It was about halfway through. I could just. I was just like, oh, because, you know, you're pretty peppy. Yeah, you are pretty peppy. And. And you didn't. You did. You just didn't have it today.
- [02:17]
Sophie Ansari
No. Parenting yesterday. There was a moment where I was in, like, the dark room. Anais was with me on the bed. She's, like, trying to get me to play. All I can muster is, like, holding. And I've memorized it by now, so I'm reading it.
- [02:31]
Penn Badgley
So you just said.
- [02:32]
Sophie Ansari
Yeah.
- [02:34]
Penn Badgley
Do you remember. Do you remember when I said. I just. I don't know why I remember this, but there was something about. I think I was sick and Boone was sick, and you were like, oh, it must have been so hard. And I was like, actually, just wait until you have to parent while you're sick and the child is not. Oh, yeah, that. That is very. That. That's, like a different thing. Cause you're having to. Yeah, there's just. There's just different stakes, you know? Yeah, different stakes.
- [03:01]
Sophie Ansari
Oh, my gosh. Anyway, enough about this.
- [03:03]
Penn Badgley
That's enough about us and parenthood. Let's go on to our very talented guest today. We have the incomparable Asa Gonzalez, who you probably know from Netflix from Annette Frixis. 3 body problem. It was pretty big. It was pretty big. Listen, coming from a big Netflix show, I think I know when a Netflix show is big. And Three Body Problem was Three Body big. All right. She's also been in major motion pictures like Baby Driver and franchises like Hobbs and Shaw, which is the Fast and Furious Universe. Godzilla versus Kong. Her newest film is a real interesting, strange science fiction horror film from incredible music producer Flying Lotus. The film is called Ash. She plays a stranded and confused astronaut. And I won't say anything else, because if you start from the beginning, you're gonna learn so much. It's a mysterious thriller horror ride. Asa was a joy to talk to. You're gonna love this one. Don't go anywhere.
- [04:19]
Hasan Minhaj
I'm Hasan Minhaj, and I have been lying to you. I only pretended to be a comedian so I could trick important people into coming on my podcast. Hasan Minh doesn't know to ask them the tough questions that real journalists are way too afraid to ask. People like Senator Elizabeth Warren. Is America too dumb for democracy? Outrageous parenting expert Dr. Becky. How do you skip consequences without raising a psychopath?
- [04:44]
Isa Gonzalez
That's a good question.
- [04:45]
Hasan Minhaj
Listen to Hasan Minhaj. Doesn't know. From Lemonada Media. Wherever you get your podcasts.
- [04:53]
Isa Gonzalez
Tired of.
- [04:53]
Sarah
The same old political shouting matches and talking points? Looking for thoughtful conversations that go beyond the headlines and help you understand issues that matter.
- [05:02]
Isa Gonzalez
I'm Sarah.
- [05:03]
Sarah
And I'm Beth.
- [05:03]
Isa Gonzalez
Together we host Pantsuit Politics, a podcast where we bring grace, nuance, and perspective to the news because democracy deserves more than hot takes.
- [05:12]
Sarah
Join us as we approach politics and current events with curiosity, empathy and a commitment to understanding the bigger picture.
- [05:17]
Isa Gonzalez
If you want to stay informed without the anxiety, we're the show for you.
- [05:20]
Sarah
New episodes drop on Tuesdays and Fridays. Subscribe to Pantsuit Politics wherever you get your podcast.
- [05:34]
Penn Badgley
So 12 for you was. I mean as, as far as we can tell, you've spoken emphatically and with a lot of vulnerability and strength. About this time, obviously your father passed. That's, that's an enormous. I can't think of anything that could characterize and define a period of life more. So I just want to acknowledge that, that we're aware. I would love to start with A snapshot of 12 year old ISA to get a sense of what quote unquote, normal life had been like, might have been like before the two massive pillars of like grief and acting took you in such a different direction.
- [06:13]
Isa Gonzalez
You know, I think about it now as in my 30s and I really have so much admiration for that little girl. I really feel like I'm so much more fragile now than I was then. Like I think about that 12 year old girl in that way because it was traumatizing. I mean, imagine my father passed 10 days after my birthday. Like exactly 10 days. Yeah. There's so many different ways to die and there's no right or wrong. There's not one that hurts less than another. But they all have different impacts and they sort of build you in a complete different way. People that, you know, have long lasting illnesses and what that causes to the people around them or sudden deaths, which is what happened to me and what that does to the electricity of your brain. And especially as a non developed brain as a child, your brain as an adult, never, it doesn't stop developing until you're like in your mid-20s. And so imagine you're in the middle of like building this tissue in your brain and you just get a shot of electricity and adrenaline to your brain. And I've been working a lot with Dr. Amen who specializes in neuroscience and I've been studying my brain quite a lot because in that period of my life I just was obviously especially this is like early 2000s and so like 2001 and it was all about you've got to go to therapy and you were just thrown into therapy and you're just not ready for therapy yet. You're not, you've not done grieving. My hormones are all over the place, my arm's longer than the other. I have no clue who I am, I have no sense of my body Who I am, my identity is completely lost. And one big pillar of my life was my father. And my identity was really tied to his identity. And so that was completely removed. And then I'm like crazy insane human being and I'm like, let's add to this fame and the industry and working insane amount of hours and basically when you're in these TV shows, you know, we've all experienced it in a shape or form. You're exploded, you're. You're not sleeping, you're not resting. And I was on the go. I'm like, it was. I felt like Hannah Montana in that sense. I was like living two lives because I was really grieving, like deeply. I was deeply grieving when I found.
- [08:56]
Penn Badgley
This out that you not only had this, I mean like just life altering, landscape shifting event of losing your father. You. Yeah. You then also found both a passion and then this sort of like what it sounds like as a coping mechanism or, you know, and I don't mean that in a negative way. It's like everybody needs a coping mechanism and in fact career is often one of the most famous ones people turn to, you know, so there's, there's no judgment there. But. Yeah. Like how. So you're clearly very conscious of it now.
- [09:31]
Isa Gonzalez
Yeah.
- [09:32]
Penn Badgley
What was your. What was the way you saw it back then?
- [09:35]
Isa Gonzalez
I didn't see it at all. And it was so nuanced my experience because first of all, my father passed in a motorcycle accident and he slipped and broke his neck and it was immediate and died. And the hard part of that was that was my biggest passion was motorcycles and.
- [09:54]
Sophie Ansari
What?
- [09:55]
Isa Gonzalez
Yeah, yeah, I was trained since I was. I started really young. My father ran motorcycles professionally. Yeah. People. A lot of people don't know this.
- [10:06]
Sophie Ansari
Yeah, I did not know.
- [10:08]
Isa Gonzalez
Yeah. So my father and I's sort of bonding thing was adrenaline. And so I started with Fort Wheelers when I was little and then I had a dirt bike and then I started moving into sport bikes and around that age I was.
- [10:25]
Penn Badgley
This is like such a.
- [10:27]
Isa Gonzalez
It's insane.
- [10:27]
Penn Badgley
It feels like such a curveball. I mean, you have so many facets to like, to your youth. Okay, I'm sorry. Keep. Keep going.
- [10:35]
Isa Gonzalez
I know. It's like really jarring when people are like, wait, what? Because I feel like it doesn't connect and there's like a disconnect of how people perceive me versus who I really am. And yeah, I was like, I was an adrenaline junkie and so was my brother and my dad and I. And so the funny part Is my. My mom was a horseback rider. And so my. My brother sort of skewed towards the horseback riding, and I skewed into the running and motorcycles and competing. And so he was training me to be a professional, like, really, like, do it for a living.
- [11:08]
Sophie Ansari
Wow.
- [11:09]
Isa Gonzalez
And so when he died in the motorcycle, all of a sudden there was this confusion of the thing that I loved the most, I now hated the most, and this resentment to something that was so ingrained in me. And now I had to sort of take it out of myself and then think about my mother and not do it anymore for my mother's peace. And then thinking about my family members and simultaneously while finding a new passion. And I think that's how acting came in, because the one passion died with my father, and there was a kind of a hole left in there and a lot of energy and anxiety and fear and loss of loss of who I was. My identity was sort of lost and while simultaneously transitioning into another identity, which is becoming a woman. And it was terrifying. It was really terrifying. And I found so much solace the moment that I came across acting, because I'd always been sort of creative, but I never really knew where. Like, I love painting. I paint, and I used to sketch quite a lot. I was really into anime when I was young, and so I do tons of anime and. And I was always kind of quirky and weird, but I never thought of acting. It was more singing. And then I was transferred after my father's passing to a different school just to kind of give me a different kind of reset. And I was in a really scholar, very, very harsh school, like, very focused in education. It was passing for me. My. I wasn't mentally there, and I was coping with it, too. So I was having a lot of, like, eating disorders. I was really dealing with it. I gained so much weight because I was so depressed, and I was eating my feelings constantly. So then I. And then I went into puberty. And so now I'm like, puberty, I'm getting weight, I'm depressed. I'm dealing with the. It was wild. I don't know who I am. I don't have an identity. And I all of a sudden moved to this new school, and it was an English school, like, British. And, you know, theater is a ginormous thing in English culture. And so I started taking theater classes there. And that was it. That was the moment that it, like, clicked for me and sort of all this dark, heavy things sort of went away, and happiness in the sun came out again. For me. And I felt like I've sort of found again my footing and who I was and sort of my group of people too, because I was always kind of awkward and I didn't do really well in school. I was. I was kind of antisocial and I was quite bullied when I was young because I was clearly artistic and I didn't fit into like the sports world and stuff like swimming or cheerleading or those types of things. I was into really strange stuff. And I was heavily bullied my entire elementary years. And then I went to this school where there was more artistic kids. And then I started doing musical theater. And I found my niche of people. I just like, oh, I. I found my, my crew and. And there it started. But then I was thrown into sort of the second pair of. Of my life, which was overnight fame and, and grieving.
- [14:52]
Penn Badgley
You did this? Sorry, I don't know the name of it is.
- [14:55]
Isa Gonzalez
It was called Lola. It was like a soap opera where I was like a Cinderella story and I was like the nanny to these orphaned family and there was like an older brother and a bunch of kids and I kind of fell in love with the brother and that was kind of a story. And I sang and I toured. And it was like a wide search because it was a pretty big soap opera in Argentina and they were remaking it in Mexico. But the Argentinian soap opera was ginormous. It was one of the most successful shows ever been made in Latin America. And so the search, as you know, when they're like redoing Gossip Girl, we're not like it carries weight. So the title itself. So the search was pretty wide. And I'd been six months into dropping out of school. I dropped out of school. I convinced my mother to drop out of school.
- [15:49]
Penn Badgley
I heard this. So how did that happen?
- [15:52]
Isa Gonzalez
I brainwashed my mother. I don't know how. She says, in a very beautiful way, I stayed in like I was a 12 year old, very convinced. I was like, this is it. This is my, my life calling. And she says to the day, I find it hard to believe. I think it's more her desire to believe that, that I look so convinced about what I was doing. Like, I was like, this is my calling. I don't have to keep searching. I just want to jump right into it. But I think she really just saw me really happy. And she had seen a really sad kid for a very, very long time. And she was like, fuck it. If this is gonna give my life, my kid, a life again, she just did it. I was, I. I look back at it and we talk about it quite a lot. And I'm like, why? How? Like, I would. I would never let my kid drop out of school. You're crazy. I was. Well, I was 12. And she was like, drop out? And she said, you know, my mom is a really unconventional. Her life was quite unconventional. I think that really helped. But she said, you're going to take this very seriously. Like, if we're going to do this, you're going to study. You're going to study and you're going to really prepare. And I said, okay. That's what your father would have wanted. He would have never wanted you to be an actress, but he would have wanted you to be disciplined about it. And I did. And I auditioned for this acting school in Mexico, and you could only get there by auditioning. And it was like a dancing, you know, the typical dancing, singing, da da da da. And I got in and I was the youngest one in my generation. I was. I was turning. By the time I got in, I was like turning 14. And I got in with school and I was there for short of a year. And this audition came around and I started auditioning and I didn't think anything of it, and I booked it and I got it and it happened and it never stopped ever since.
- [17:45]
Sophie Ansari
Wow.
- [17:46]
Penn Badgley
You know, that's. That is incredible. And it's weird how much it mirrors. It's so specific. And it mirrors my. So I dropped out of school at 12 and moved to LA.
- [17:56]
Isa Gonzalez
Oh, wow.
- [17:57]
Penn Badgley
Then at 14, well, just before my 14th birthday, I tried to go to a month of high school and then got a role. That made the scheduling difficult. So then I actually dropped out of high school after about a month.
- [18:08]
Isa Gonzalez
Oh, wow. Very similar.
- [18:10]
Penn Badgley
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I've been reflecting on it a lot recently and talking. I had to ask my mom in order to remember certain aspects of it. And what you said about your mother resonates a lot because I think she had convention, just for whatever reason, just never worked for her. And our family kind of collapsed under the weight of it. So, you know, taking an unconventional approach, it just seemed sensible, you know, and for me, I was also, like, struggling at that time. A lot of sadness and anxiety and. And it was. It was somehow this really crazy thing.
- [18:52]
Isa Gonzalez
How did you feel when you were making those decisions? Like. Because I remember in my mind, like, it strangely doesn't. It doesn't differ from how I think about things now, like, and in the sense of the maturity.
- [19:07]
Penn Badgley
Yeah, I agree. No, I fully Feel like that kid still.
- [19:10]
Isa Gonzalez
Right. In a way. And it was just like quite pragmatic. Even though I think I hang out with 12 year olds and I mean, listen, 12 year olds now are like a billion times smarter than all of us combined.
- [19:22]
Sophie Ansari
I know, I know.
- [19:23]
Isa Gonzalez
I cannot believe it. Like these younger generations, and also they're so fearless. Like, I think for us, my story sounds fearless because our generation wasn't really curated to be that way. So, like there's like the few that kind of popped up like that really had it. And it really takes a village in the sense of people surrounding you, sort of supporting you, because you could want whatever you want if people around you aren't supporting. But I do think that now these generations are like so fearless and so confident about their decisions that I don't even feel that way now. Like, I feel shockingly, as I started saying, way more insecure or doubtful now than I did then. And I guess it's ignorance is blitz. Like you could name it whatever it is, but it is really shocking to think how I would think back then and with the lack of knowledge that I know now. And I think that's who I admire the most about how resilient I was or that we can be. Right?
- [20:32]
Penn Badgley
Totally.
- [20:33]
Sophie Ansari
Like just biologically, developmentally, prefrontal lobe. Yeah, yeah. You don't have that same inhibition. It's kind of like, like you were saying ignorance is bliss. Or like you don't know what you don't know. You don't. You aren't thinking through the consequences the way that you would. Yeah, you're stupid.
- [20:46]
Penn Badgley
That's what you're saying. You're making bad decisions.
- [20:49]
Sophie Ansari
Interesting. Like, how do you cultivate that now as an adult with the knowledge, with the inhibition? How do you still cultivate that same fearlessness?
- [21:01]
Isa Gonzalez
Well, because you start developing self awareness right with age. That's sort of the most pivotal thing. You become self aware. So now you're self aware, but in the process of becoming self aware, you are sacrificing certain things. And part of the sacrifice is this sort of nonchalant, ballsy mentality where you're just like, whatever. And I really genuinely, in the past few years try to really focus, to sort of reconnect to that version of myself. Because you do become jaded with age. And I thought that would never happen. I remember thinking, even my mid-20s when I was in the industry and I talked to people who are my age now, there was a lot of jadedness that really was like, I was like, damn, you're Debbie Downer, like, and now I see myself, and I catch myself sometimes being that, and I. And I hate it, and I don't like it, and. Because I used to be. And I've always been, you know, kind of a rebel, and not in, like, the cool way. Like a rebel.
- [22:06]
Penn Badgley
It sounds pretty cool. You were riding motorcycles at, like, 6 years old, so I don't know. I mean, I know it didn't feel cool, but it probably looked pretty. Pretty. Pretty badass.
- [22:17]
Isa Gonzalez
I think if you guys say that I'm cool, I'll take it. But at the time, you know, I wasn't cool because the girls that were cool were, like, you know, going to Abercrombie and Stitch and buying, like, limited to. And I was just, like, out there and dirty in a motorcycle and, like, ew. Like, I was definitely not. Yeah, the conventional what it was at the time. And I really, like think about kids a lot because, you know, that does feel like the end of the world at the time. It does. It does. And it makes me really, like, empathetic. And I'm very emotional. I'm a very emotional. Like, I'll see something and I'll cry. Like, I cry for other people constantly. And I just wear my heart and my sleep quite a lot in that sense. And so I think about, like, kids nowadays, growing up in this world, and it makes me really sad. It makes me really emotional because I feel like, damn. I feel pressure by, like, social media, and I see these things, and it makes me insecure to the bone. I'm 34. 5. I'm 35. I'm 25, and I'm in. It just. I go, I could. I would break. I don't know if I could do it. I really. I admire these newer generations so much.
- [23:40]
Nava Kaplan
Stick around. We'll be right back.
- [23:44]
Beth
Hey, Julia, Louis Dreyfus here. If you listen to me on my Wiser Than Me podcast, you probably already know that I'm an investor and an evangelist for the mill Food Recycler. There are a lot of reasons to love mill, but for me, it's all about the impact. Keeping food out of the garbage is one of the most powerful things we can do to help the planet every single day. We're talking banana peels, carrot tops, old takeout. When that stuff heads to the landfill, it becomes a huge driver of climate change. If you already compost, great. But of course, there's the smell, the flies, the running to the curb every day with a little leaking compost bag made of cornstarch that's where mill comes in. It makes keeping food out of the trash as easy as dropping it in. It can handle nearly anything from a turkey carcass to like 20 avocado pits. It works automatically while you sleep. You can keep filling it for weeks and it never ever smells. Mill makes dry, nutrient rich grounds that you can use in your garden, add to your compost, feed to your chickens, or mill can get them back to a small farm for you. But you kind of have to live with mill to really get it. And that's why they offer a risk free trial. Go to mill.com wiser for an exclusive offer.
- [24:58]
Sophie Ansari
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- [29:34]
Isa Gonzalez
You know, my mother was. Because my mom's from the border and that I don't know if that means anything in America, but in Mexico, if you're a woman who grew up in the border, you're like ballsy. You, you are, you're cut from a different scissor. You, you are. You know, my mom grew up in a, you know, in a very heavy like narco city. It like really dire, rough. She's one out of eight brothers and sisters, no money, zero money. Shared a three bedroom with a nine, ten family members. And she was sort of the only one that really got out. And when you have a mother and she's self made and so my, the church of my mother, you know, the church of Glenda, I call it, is a no bullshit zone. I am so grateful. When you're young and you grew up in the industry and it's easy to become a monster because you're sort of a product. So people want to keep the product happy so the product keeps providing. And there's a lot of yes people around. And when you have a mother from Sonora, where she's from, there's no yeses. There's no yeses. It's a lot of harsh honesty, but with a lot of love. And so my mom was just always sort of, I mean, what you see is what you get. And so. But at the same time, you know, my mom was my best friend. I had conversations with her in a way that I really want to like hone onto throughout my life where this is a really funny story. I walked into them having sex when I was like probably 9 or 10. I used to at night want to go and hang out with my parents. And you know, when you, your kids want to sleep with you. And I used to do it quite a lot. And then my, my parents. It feels like a ginormous bed now. It probably wasn't as big, but it was like a Cali King. And my dad was sort of by the door always. So I'd always go in and my dad would always kind of lift the, the, the bedding and let me hide under. And then like an hour later my mom was like, to your bed? And I would walk out. So I do it for years. And one time I walked in and having sex and I was, I was terrified. I was like shocked. I was like, I thought he was hurting her. I didn't know what had happened. I thought he was hurting I thought he was hurting. And so I ran back to my room and covered myself. And, you know, I think that I kind of sort of understood, but I really didn't understand what it was. And then the next day, my mom. My dad would have never had this conversation with me, you know, but my mom came in and I really, that that moment is so ingrained in my brain because I think that's the place where my never ending relationship with my mother started, where she just sat down and like laid it on me and I was like nine. She's like, sex is this. Sex is that. This is. There was no, like, the babies are making. It was just like, it's pleasurable. It's this, it's that I'm nine years old. And it was so transparent and so real. There was no like beating around the bush. And from there on, I built a relationship with my mother of a best friend. And so my mom knew my first time ever having sex. My mom knows every single time I've like, had a relationship, had, you know, and then we get to the point where like, obviously become a woman. And I'm in my 20s and 30s and I just have never been shy around my mother. And I've always been able to have real honest conversations. And that really helped me throughout my phase of being famous because I never tried drugs, I never did anything because I was. I felt so understood by my mother. I didn't need to escape. I think that it was in such pivotal moment of my life where I became a woman and I sort of started to discover nightlife, drugs, alcohol abuse, whatever you could imagine, right? Sex. And I always. She would always have a really, like, I was talking to my best friend conversations, no shying away from anything that I never felt like rebelling. I never felt like breaking the law. I never felt like pushing the boundaries. And she'd be like, you want to try? Let's try it. Like. And I'd be like, oh, I don't really want to. And then I would have conversations. Like, the first time I saw someone do coke in my life, I was pretty young and I was like at a party that I shouldn't have been. And I came back to her and it was someone that she knew actually. And I had this conversation with her and she walked me through everything. We googled it. She showed me what it was. I was like 13. She said, this is this drug, this is what it does. This is sort of the aftermath. It could make you feel really good. Like, that was always my conversations with my mother. So I don't know. I. I don't know anything else. That's all I've known because that's how I grew up. I just know that that really worked for me and it really helped me to sort of, in a world of discombobulation and chaos, of grief, work dealing with public, you know, complete exposure, dealing with issues with my body, understanding my body, understanding my womanhood. I had a ginormous best friend in the process, so I forever wanted her to follow that. The church of Glenda.
- [35:28]
Sophie Ansari
I have one more question about Glenda. I'm curious to know if after your father passed away, if there was anything that your mom did to sort of continue to cultivate your relationship with him, like any traditions or any. I don't know why that question.
- [35:43]
Isa Gonzalez
It was really complicated for me. It was really complicated for me because I lost faith. We are very religious. I'm from Mexico, so you can imagine, like, it's very. It's a very pivotal and poignant part of the culture. You know, church every Sunday, praying every night, thanking God and saying grace before dinner. And I just lost complete faith. I just detested the church. I. I didn't believe in anything good because, you know, my dad was. And I. And, you know, I. A lot of people would think this, but my dad. About their own parents, but my dad was a really good man. Like. Like my mom says, like, I'm not even a poor of the man. He was like, he was a good father. Like, a good. Like, to the core, sweet, thoughtful, always thought of other people. He was like Mother Mary. Like, he cared about animals so much. He cared about people so much. And. And I just couldn't connect the unfairness of him dying. I just. I just was like. From all the fucking shitty people in the world, him, like, it made me not believe in anything bigger. I just was like, there's no way that there's something bigger than this, because it's like the way that I feel when, like, children get sick. I just feel that within itself makes me not believe in anything. And so I lost faith completely. And I had a real hard realization of. Of my dynamic with my father. I. I wasn't able to cry for four years.
- [37:26]
Sophie Ansari
Wow.
- [37:27]
Isa Gonzalez
Five years. I didn't cry at all. And. And I was just in complete and utter denial. And simultaneously, I'd started my career and I needed to cry a lot for work. And it was really, really, really, where I just, like. It was the hardest thing, funny enough, I've ever done in my life, like, reconnect it's sort of. Something died in me and I just completely removed myself from my father. Like, I just couldn't. It was so unbearable that I just sort of walked away completely. And so I didn't have any of his stuff. I didn't read anything. Nothing. Zero. And, you know, it was quite. It was really. It was a really tough time, I think, in that. In that sense, because I sort of, you know, I dove into work and my. My complete sense of. I went into fight or flight mode. I was in survival mode constantly, constantly, constantly. And I. I couldn't look back. And it comes with amazing stuff and horrible stuff. Like, I. Yeah, it disconnected so much from my father, but it allowed me to sort of create an identity of my own because so much of my identity was my father. We were like this. Like, my mom doesn't really exist before that, because my mom was the breadwinner in the house. So he would pick me up from school. He would.
- [38:49]
Sophie Ansari
Interesting.
- [38:49]
Isa Gonzalez
He would do the homework with me. He would take me to this. So my relationship was like me and my dad and my mom did not exist. And my mom in some very profound way says that life has. God has a reason for that. And there was a reason why those 12 years of my life were completely devoted to him, because I was never going to have him again. And then she was going to have me for the rest of life. And so he really. Yeah. And she really sees it in a way. But I'm just. Yeah, it was really challenging. And then I had my own personal sort of reconnection with him. And it was, to me, I mean, really took me years. It took me years because I was. Yeah, I escaped from it really badly. I really escaped from it.
- [39:32]
Sophie Ansari
Yeah. Thanks for sharing that.
- [39:34]
Penn Badgley
That's incredible.
- [39:34]
Isa Gonzalez
What? Yeah.
- [39:35]
Sophie Ansari
That is so sweet.
- [39:37]
Isa Gonzalez
You're sweet. But. Yeah, it is. It is really. It's fascinating. I don't think people talk a lot about. I think humans go through the most hard time and the most vulnerable time of their lives. Like, life design is so fascinating to me because it gives the hardest moments of their lives and the most fragile moments of their lives. I think children live the hardest things. If I compare, and I speak to a lot of friends of mine, or maybe it's in the industry, I don't know. But you compare the sort of resilience that children have to have with the. With the axis of emotions that they have, and it's so much more complex than when an adult has to go through. And when you're an adult, you have a brain that fully functions to kind of deal with something. But somehow puberty happens in the hardest moment of your, like, development. And so that is the hardest. It's the birth of a human. It's your identity. It's the born of the birth of your identity happens there. That is who you're going to be for the rest of your life. It's crazy to think about. And so I always sort of, you know, I love Lauren, Aaron Paul's wife, who's in the movie with me. And she dedicates herself to kind of go. She has this amazing foundation that dedicates to help children in school and bullying. And that's where I actually connected with Aaron Paul for this movie before becoming friends is I was a fan of Lauren's work because as a child that it went through a lot of bullying. I just. I've always wanted to be able to help in that space because I knew how that felt like. And it was. It felt like life or death to me. It really did. It didn't. Nothing right now feels life or death to me in that time. It did. And it really makes me so emotional to think about it too, because you don't have the knowledge, the emotional access to sort of navigate this. And. Yeah, I've always sort of thought of the. The paradox of what that means of the most tender moments of your life involve the most definitive moments of your life.
- [41:51]
Penn Badgley
Yeah, it's so true. That's well said as well. And thank you for being so open and sharing so much about it. I feel like, you know, I know we only have you for 50 minutes or so. I want to. I want to just be mindful of time and. And move now into your career. I know you're promoting Ash right now, so maybe we can just lead up to that a bit. So I'm gonna talk about three body problem. Just a little. Yeah, that. That. That must have. I mean, it must have been the biggest because that was. I remember when I saw it, I watched. And I don't watch a lot of television. I watched it with my stepson, I think, when he was. Whenever it came out. So it was two years, like a.
- [42:33]
Isa Gonzalez
Year and a half ago.
- [42:34]
Penn Badgley
A year and a half ago, yeah. So he was like. He was like 14 or 15. We both loved it in our own way. And like, it's one of the things I kept reflecting on, apart from the intensely compelling mystery of it and really wanting to figure out what was going on. You know, as a person who worked in television, I was like, the freaking budget on this Thing.
- [42:57]
Isa Gonzalez
Oh, insane.
- [42:57]
Penn Badgley
Massive. I was like, where is this? What is this show? Why is it so. I know how much this costs. I am. I am blown away. And so it must have been the biggest production you were a part. It would have been the biggest production anybody would have been a part of. I feel like.
- [43:15]
Isa Gonzalez
Yeah, but you know what? It didn't feel that way, which is quite nice, because it's interesting when you're part of those things. I think it puts a lot of pressure. Like, I remember when I was like, in Godzilla vs. Kong, I was like, whoa, this. The pressure of this is jarring. I mean, it was like, in your face. Like, the money is like, whoa. I'd never been part of, like, a franchise on that extent. And somehow, of course, we knew that Three Body Problem was that because obviously Dan and Dave were coming from Game of Thrones, and who, for people that don't know, are the showrunners and creators of Game of Thrones, and so are they for the Three Body problem. And I knew that it was. There was a lot of expectation, a lot of pressure on them. I knew, you know, there was a lot of pressure on us and a lot of pressure from Netflix to make this incredible show. And so at the beginning, it was. It was jarring, sort of the. The sense of the. How grandiose this was. But once I do this thing where, like, once I get into what. Whatever the character is, I sort of forget about everything else. I'm just so in the mental space of I don't want to. I don't want to lose any minute or second that I have on set overthinking something that I'm going to look back and be like, why was I thinking about something else when I should have been focused on the scene? And so. And then it really helped that they're amazing. They're like family to me. They're like my best friends. They were really fun. They've been so supportive with me throughout my career, and I had a blast. But I really love the books. And the second and third season are the last two books. And if you thought that looked like a lot of budget, wait for this part, because this is sort of. If people are familiar with the books, it sort of move. You know, the show starts in the Chinese revolution and it moves a billion years ahead of time. So we move a billion years as the show goes on.
- [45:21]
Penn Badgley
You don't mean a billion as like a euphemism for a lot of time. You mean a billion years.
- [45:27]
Isa Gonzalez
Like, actually, because it's all about like, what's in the other world? And so, as you know, we leave it in the staircase project. And God knows what happens with the staircase project, but it's very interesting. So I'm very excited. We're starting to shoot the second and third season soon. So very exciting.
- [45:44]
Sophie Ansari
My husband and I notoriously cannot agree on anything to watch, but we both watched together and loved the Three Body Problem.
- [45:54]
Isa Gonzalez
Oh, thank you. I'm glad you did well. If you liked the first season, you will really like the second and third.
- [45:58]
Beth
I.
- [45:59]
Sophie Ansari
Good. I can't wait.
- [46:00]
Isa Gonzalez
Yeah, the source material is pretty spectacular.
- [46:02]
Sophie Ansari
I heard that you. You hesitated taking the role at first. What convinced you?
- [46:07]
Isa Gonzalez
Three Body Problem.
- [46:08]
Sophie Ansari
Yeah.
- [46:09]
Isa Gonzalez
Yes, I did. I did hesitate for a second. I basically was terrified. I have commitment issues. I have really bad commitment issues. And it was going to take a year of my life to go shoot that show. We shot 12 months. Wow. And it was. Yeah. And it was. You know, the first season, I was, like, not really happy with Auggie. I didn't love her. I was not really convinced. And it really. I had real issues with her. And. But then somehow, weirdly. Weirdly enough, I thought that was what caused me to do it because I sort of didn't agree with a lot of things, and I was like, maybe I just have to take a leap of faith. And not everything that I know is what's right. And I want to take. And these are amazing. Reuters. And I like the way they work where, like, one season you hate someone, the next season you love someone, then someone's the best person on Earth and they kill them. And I just thought when they started pitching me sort of the. The broad idea of her journey, I was like, okay, I. I think I can do it. And it was tough for me. It was tough for me to, like, buckle down for 12 months. And not because I love working. I mean, I'm. If you look. I mean, I have probably, like, five movies coming out this year because I work back to back. Yeah.
- [47:38]
Sophie Ansari
I was gonna say when we were looking, like, researching, I was. Is she, like, one of the most prolific people we've interviewed?
- [47:45]
Isa Gonzalez
Like, so many projects. I'm mexic. Like, it's in my blood. I'm a hustler. And, you know, I come from that school of soap operas, like you, just overworked and overtired, but there. And I kind of function my best in that space. I don't recommend it, but I definitely. And so I like it. And I just. I think I'm still in the state of. I Can't believe I get to do this. So I'm like, when I get like, someone like Guy Ritchie offering me my second or third movie, I'm like, how are you going to say no? Like, I, I guess I have to learn how to say no, maybe. And I'm trying to exercise that now because it really moving towards where I am, it becomes, you know, doing the right job is way more meaningful than just doing a lot of jobs. But I was, you know, I lived in the industry when minorities aren't getting any opportunities. So once you got an opportunity, you jumped into it. It's like there was a few roles for us a year, if there was any. And so I think that sort of lingered with me and I thought I had to keep working every time I had a job. And I'm not saying that I haven't chosen the right jobs. I feel like I have. But my sense of sort of decision making has changed in the last few years. That I feel way more comfortable owning who I am and that I deserve to be here and that I can take up space. I used to think I didn't deserve it and that, you know, I do think there's a sense of, if you look at the amount of work that some of, like, diverse actors do and the amount of, like, recognition or attention that they get is not similar. And they really, you really have to work ten times more to. To be acknowledged sometimes. And, and I don't look at it as a victim in the sense that. Oh, Pramitin. I'm not saying it in that way. I'm just saying I'm like, let's go. I'm game. You want me to work my ass off? I will do it. I will show up and I'll be prepared. And I sort of always had that hustler mentality, but I'm getting older, so I got to slow down a bit more.
- [49:49]
Sophie Ansari
25, though, I thought.
- [49:51]
Isa Gonzalez
No, yeah, yeah, 25 exactly.
- [49:54]
Penn Badgley
Listen, it really slows down your late 20s.
- [49:57]
Isa Gonzalez
Yeah, I can't wait. I'm eager to get there. I. So I heard.
- [50:03]
Sophie Ansari
And we'll be right back.
- [50:08]
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- [54:17]
Penn Badgley
So speaking of, you know, making the right decisions, doing projects you, you love, I mean, tell us about Ash. We. So I, I wasn't able to finish it, but I got far enough that I was like, what on earth is? Or what on earth? Whatever it is, I mean, it's a really compelling premise. It's also for a lot of it, it's just you. And for a lot of it it's just you and Aaron Paul, you know, just, I mean, tell us a bit about it for, especially for our listeners who don't know anything.
- [54:49]
Isa Gonzalez
Yeah. So Ash is, it's so hard, as you've seen, it's really hard to sort of pitch the movie without spoiling or misdirect. It's not a sci fi. Right. It's not necessarily a sci fi in the sense of you think of Interstellar as a sci fi or Blade Runner as a sci fi. It's, it's a survival slasher off the wall sci fi horror. And I just, how this came about is I was doing this movie at the time called the Ministry of Ungentlemanly Warfare with Guy Ritchie. And it was like so fun and it was about World War II and it was a complete different premise and I was doing sort of a very different role and I was itching for horror and I told my team if anything interesting comes around, I really want to like dive into horror. I feel like it's a very raw place for an actor to go. And I, by the way, I still think they don't get enough credit because after I did this movie, I'm like, holy cow. This is like the marathon of filming. Like, it takes so much stamina and.
- [56:03]
Sophie Ansari
And energy and focus all high and.
- [56:10]
Isa Gonzalez
Your cortisol, your adrenaline, you really have to be constantly recalibrating yourself. And I just remember reading the script, and I had heard that Aaron Paul has gotten it. And Aaron is one of my best friends for like 10 years. And so I, like, grabbed my phone, and by the time I grabbed my phone, I had a message from Aaron. He's like, have you read it? What do you think I would love? And we've been wanting to work together. And I was like, I'm gonna read it tonight. I'll tell you. And so we were going back and forth. He was gonna meet with Flying Lotus, I was gonna meet with him as well. And once we met with Flying Lotus, you know, the script, the premise was interesting, but wait a second.
- [56:46]
Penn Badgley
I did not realize this is Flying Lotus. That makes so much sense. It makes so much more sense now. Yes, because also, I haven't gotten the payoff of the end. And there's clearly. Cause also the body horror stuff. Like, I was like, this is real specific. It is so Flying Lotus.
- [57:04]
Isa Gonzalez
It's so Flying Lotus. And of course, he made all the music. And if people are familiar with Flying Lotus, he's a music producer and a dj and he's a protege. He's incredibly strong.
- [57:14]
Penn Badgley
Yeah, he's prolific. He's like a visionary. He also.
- [57:18]
Isa Gonzalez
Visionary.
- [57:19]
Penn Badgley
He has this one record. God, I. I can't. I think it's called. Is it called you'd're Dead?
- [57:26]
Isa Gonzalez
I think so, yeah.
- [57:28]
Penn Badgley
Where he first started. Real. I mean, as far as I understand, like, first really putting this horror cinema spin in into his music. That might. That may or may not be true. He may have done it way earlier.
- [57:41]
Isa Gonzalez
It is, it is, it is. And it has a bit of sci fi in it too.
- [57:44]
Penn Badgley
Yeah, it does. And it has one of the best Kendrick verses. As a Kendrick fan, it actually has. Seriously one of the best Kendrick verses I've seen.
- [57:54]
Isa Gonzalez
And he just was like, the way that you're speaking about him was the way that I sort of. My encounter with him was. I just. I met with him and, you know, this is a small budget movie. I don't know what you think after watching it.
- [58:07]
Penn Badgley
We made it for, like, so knowing. I have a good eye. Like, I could tell. I could Tell. And not in a way that is bad. I was just.
- [58:17]
Isa Gonzalez
No, but because you're an actor and you know, tell.
- [58:19]
Sophie Ansari
I'm not an actor. And I couldn't tell. I couldn't tell. When I heard it was an indie movie, I was like, what?
- [58:24]
Isa Gonzalez
And the thing is these movies take creative point of view. Like it's an independent film. You're going, you're taking a swing. It's a genre that has somehow sort of been made before, but in a different way. And it needs a. A strong point of view. It needs a strong creative point of view and a vision. And once we both sat with him, it was mind boggling. He had everything like. And you know, we've met throughout our careers directors, directors that really make it over the crossing lines of people that don't they have desire. You work with really good ones you work with not such great ones. And I was just dope. I was like, wow. I was kind of having a conversation with a veteran that didn't realize he was a veteran. Like he was already thinking about so many things that a director well experienced would have known and not someone that this is like their actual like technically their first movie. I mean he did Cuzo, but this is like the first real movie. And I just was like, this is a no brainer. And whatever the outcome, this is, this is gonna be a cool movie. And wait till you get to the. Because the payoff is pretty. Pretty.
- [59:30]
Penn Badgley
Yeah, I'm actually going to keep watching it which with Screeners for Podcast. Let me tell you, I do not do.
- [59:35]
Isa Gonzalez
Yeah, you should. It's fun, you know. And you know what it is really exciting for me is that it's going to theater because it is a movie made for theaters. I think horror is one of the most fun genres to go see in movie theaters because it's a collective experience. You know, I remember the first. I remember I went to go watch get out in Times Square in New York City. When I tell you that was the best experience I've ever had of a film. I've ever. The people were screaming at the screen. People were like clawing other people on the chairs. It was so fun. It's just like an exhilarating experience. And I love hearing the gas in movie theaters. I love. And it's so spectacularly beautiful that it just deserves it. And so yeah, it was a no brainer. We did it. It's a crazy movie. It's off the wall, you know, Flying Lotus and I from the get go. Immediately I was like, you know what this reminds me, because I was talking to him, and he's like, what do you think? I said, you know what this reminds me of? And he's like, what? I'm like, silent Hill. He's like, it's you. You have to do this movie. You understand it, because it's like. I played. I played video games growing up. I was really into Silent Hill, and I played all the Silent Hills, like, all the Resident Evils, but I was more.
- [60:50]
Penn Badgley
Can I ask how old you were when you started playing them?
- [60:53]
Isa Gonzalez
I was really young because my brother was the one that started, so I started probably. Wow. Eight, nine.
- [61:01]
Penn Badgley
Wow.
- [61:01]
Isa Gonzalez
Yeah.
- [61:01]
Penn Badgley
Wow.
- [61:02]
Isa Gonzalez
Really young.
- [61:02]
Penn Badgley
Those are scary. Those are legit scary.
- [61:05]
Isa Gonzalez
And I remember being, like, shivering with my brother. He would watch it, and I'd still play, and I'd be like. And he was such a bully. He would turn off all the lights in the room, and I'd be like, wow. Because mine started. My love started with Zelda.
- [61:21]
Penn Badgley
Oh, me too. You mean the Ocarina of Time?
- [61:24]
Isa Gonzalez
Ocarina of Time and Majora's Mask.
- [61:26]
Penn Badgley
Oh, those are the two of the best video games.
- [61:29]
Isa Gonzalez
The best video games of all time. I played Majora's Mask and Zelda, Ocarina of time probably 40 times. I still have my Nintendo 64, and I still connect it to my house. I love it. And I don't think they ever did a Zelda like that ever again after that. By the way, the visuals changed, the graphics change. I didn't like it. I'm a 64 Zelda girl forever.
- [61:51]
Sophie Ansari
Just the picture of you at 12 is building. Or like, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, you know, is building more and more as we get through this episode. I love it.
- [61:58]
Isa Gonzalez
Now you understand. You're like, oh, I see this girl. I see it well.
- [62:02]
Penn Badgley
I'm also real. So first of all, I know we're about to lose you. So what we typically have is a final question, which is going back to 12. But I'm also realizing, Sophie, we didn't do our classic questions about a crush and an embarrassing story. Can you just. Very quickly, very quickly, if you have the time, tell us a quick story about either an embarrassing one or a crush. First crush. Oh, you know, middle school. Ish.
- [62:32]
Isa Gonzalez
If there's something that describes me in a nutshell, is my actual first, like, thing that I ever loved as a child. Like, when I was a kid and I was in love, I had two massive crushes. One was Jack Skellington. That was, like, my main man. And the other one was Jafar from Aladdin.
- [62:53]
Penn Badgley
Oh, Jafar. Yeah. You liked Jafar?
- [62:55]
Sophie Ansari
That's the thing.
- [62:57]
Isa Gonzalez
I was in. I had, like, tingles in my body when I watch Aladdin. Like, and everyone would think it'd be Aladdin, but it wasn't. I was, like, in love with Jafar. And I think that says a lot about my mind.
- [63:12]
Penn Badgley
Wait, who's Jack Skellington? Is that from Nightmare Before Christmas?
- [63:15]
Isa Gonzalez
The Nightmare Before Christmas.
- [63:17]
Sophie Ansari
That's amazing.
- [63:19]
Isa Gonzalez
Those were my questions, you guys.
- [63:21]
Penn Badgley
So you like a lanky, halfway evil.
- [63:24]
Sophie Ansari
Yeah.
- [63:25]
Isa Gonzalez
Skinny, bony man. A bony dead man. And an evil, like, completely weird. Also creepy because he was really old.
- [63:38]
Penn Badgley
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [63:39]
Isa Gonzalez
No, no, not the daddy issues coming through.
- [63:42]
Penn Badgley
Yeah.
- [63:43]
Sophie Ansari
So funny.
- [63:44]
Penn Badgley
Well, it's forgivable. Okay, so our last question is, if you could go back to 12 year old Isa, what would you say or do?
- [63:58]
Isa Gonzalez
You know, I. I've thought of this a lot of times and I think I. Well, first of all, you know, a constant question that I get asked is like, would you change anything? Like, if you had the chance to change anything in a weird way? I wouldn't. I wouldn't. Because everything that I've gone through, the really horrible stuff and the really amazing stuff that has happened in my life has really made me. I feel very proud of who I am. You know, I. I really do. It's taking a lot of work and it's taken a lot of pain. And I wouldn't change. Like, I would have it happen exactly. All identical. The same way. I would change nothing. And I would just say, trust yourself more. Be more confident in yourself. I really struggle with my confidence a lot. And I've done through it through many years and from the little girl to now. And I just would remind myself, trust yourself. Be confident in yourself. And I think that's probably why I admire young boys and girls now. They're so confident. And I. I feel like I always lack that. I have earnesty, but I lack confidence. And, you know, I would just. And I still remind myself to kind of think that way.
- [65:24]
Sophie Ansari
Beautiful.
- [65:25]
Penn Badgley
Thank you.
- [65:25]
Sophie Ansari
Thank you, Asa, so much for being with you guys.
- [65:28]
Isa Gonzalez
It was so fun.
- [65:30]
Penn Badgley
Yeah. I really appreciate you making the time.
- [65:32]
Isa Gonzalez
Of course. Have a wonderful time. And hopefully I get to meet you guys in person.
- [65:36]
Sophie Ansari
That'd be lovely.
- [65:37]
Penn Badgley
Yeah, that'd be great.
- [65:38]
Sophie Ansari
Thank you.
- [65:38]
Isa Gonzalez
Thank you, God. Hi.
- [65:41]
Sophie Ansari
You can watch Ash now in theaters or on Prime Video. And you can follow Asa online at asagonzales. Podcrust is hosted by Penn Badgley, Nava Kaplan, and Sophie Ansari. Our senior producer is David Ansari and Our editing is done by Clips Agency. Special thanks to the folks at Lemonada. And as always, you can listen to podcrust ad free on Amazon Music with your prime membership. Okay, that's all. Bye.
- [66:10]
Reshma Sajani
Hey, I'm Reshma Sajani, founder of Girls who Code and Moms First. I consider myself a pretty successful adult woman, so why is it that in midlife as I'm about to turn 50, I feel so stuck? Join me as I try to find the answer on my so called midlife from Lemonada Media. I talk to experts and extraordinary guests about divorce, exercise, menopause, sex, drugs and more to understand what we're going through and how to make the most of it. Listen wherever you get your podcasts.
- [66:41]
Megan
Hi, I'm Megan and I've got a new podcast I think you're going to love. It's called Confessions of a Female Founder, a show where I chat with female entrepreneurs and friends about the sleepless nights, the lessons learned, and the laser focus that got them to where they are today. And through it all, I'm building a business of my own and getting all sorts of practical advice along the way that I'm so excited to share with you. Confessions of a Female Founder is out now. Hear new episodes each week ad free on Amazon Music. You can also ask Alexa Alexa, play Confessions of a Female Founder with Megan on Amazon Music and she will.