Our dream TV workplaces

Summary

Pop Culture Happy Hour – "Our Dream TV Workplaces"

Original Air Date: August 10, 2026
Panelists: Linda Holmes (host), Glenn Weldon (host), Stephen Thompson (host), Waylon Wong (guest; co-host of NPR’s The Indicator from Planet Money)

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Episode Overview

In this playful and insightful episode, the Pop Culture Happy Hour crew plus special guest Waylon Wong dive into a fun thought experiment: If you could work in any fictional TV workplace, where would you clock in, and why? The conversation ranges from athletic optimism and political idealism to Muppet mayhem and fantasy monkdom, offering reflections on what makes a dream job—on TV and in reality. The discussion is characteristically witty, nostalgic, and full of self-aware humor as each panelist shares and defends their pick.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Rules of the Game (03:36)

• Linda Holmes sets the tone by deciding not to limit herself based on qualifications or reality:

  "I gave myself complete freedom to pretend I was qualified...I chose to approach it as, I want this workplace more than I want this work." (01:31)

2. Linda’s Pick: AFC Richmond from Ted Lasso

Segment Start: 01:31

• Why AFC Richmond?

  • Emphasizes the importance of “being around good people.”
  • Cites the positive vibes, supportive coworkers, and Rebecca as a “nice boss.”
  • Not deterred by lack of soccer expertise:

    "I don't know very much about soccer football. I would have to learn. I'd be willing to learn." (01:43)

  • Seeks a role in marketing/PR or on Keeley’s team, wanting to “hype” others (05:00).

• On Work-Life Boundaries:
  Glenn Weldon expresses concern about blurred work/life lines (“tissue paper boundaries”), but Linda says she’s used to it:

  "My parents worked at my school, so I'm very accustomed to that." (04:09)

• Reflections on similar shows:
  Linda considered Parks and Recreation and government work but opted for sports instead.

• Panel banter:

  • Glenn: "It's not because I don't want to be around cheerful people [...] it's that the boundaries between work and life are tissue paper in that place." (03:48–04:08)

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3. Stephen’s Pick: The White House from The West Wing

Segment Start: 05:45

• Why The West Wing?

  • Initially considered 30 Rock but found real comedy writing environments exhausting from his Onion days.
  • Chooses The West Wing for the “ability and power to change the world,” appeal of “plucky dreamers,” and—tongue-in-cheek—because “the opinions of 53-year-old white men carry more weight” there (08:22).

• Ironies and Self-Awareness:

  • Stephen notes he “hates meetings more than anything on earth,” but still picks the world’s meeting-iest workplace.
  • Linda and the others tease him extensively:

    "Because ultimately your low tolerance for meetings springs from the part of your personality that thinks the absolute worst thing [...] is, 'I need to talk to you.'" (09:03) Stephen: "That might actually kill me." (09:37)

• Walk-and-Talks as Meetings:

  • The crew debates if Sorkin’s signature “walk and talk” scenes could make meetings less painful.

    Stephen: "Honestly, [it’s] a significant improvement...you eventually reach a destination at which point that meeting would end." (09:55)

• Cynicism versus Idealism:

  • Panel reflects on the show's idealized world compared to Sorkin’s later, more heavy-handed series. Glenn muses:

    "I will take sanctimonious over hectoring any day." (11:05)

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4. Waylon’s Pick: The Muppet Show

Segment Start: 13:39

• Why The Muppet Show?

  • Ultimate dream is "to meet the Muppets and to hang out with the Muppets."
  • Wishes to be an “order Muppet,” ideally as a replacement for Scooter—the go-between with a headset, keeping the chaos in check.
  • Envisions a career arc with “promotion” to movie set adventures:

    "Hopefully this is, like, the longer-term plan; if I’m a really good employee, then they’ll take me along when they do the movies." (15:14)

• Order vs. Chaos:

  • Waylon self-identifies: “I'm an order Muppet all the way. I'm Prairie Dawn.” (14:53)
  • Glenn pushes back: "It is a toxic workplace. There is too much chaos in that workplace. Too many Gonzos, too many New Zealands..." (16:09)
  • Waylon: “There’s only one Gonzo. There’s a lot of chickens.”

• Handling Muppet Madness:

  • Waylon insists the kindness and fun outweigh the chaos. Linda is skeptical:

    “I sort of feel like I’ve already worked at the Muppet show…having worked at Pop Culture Happy Hour.” (16:51)

  • Group discusses who would be Muppet HR (“It’s probably Sam the Eagle” (16:51); “Maybe Janice…No, she’s so mellow” (16:55)).

• Panel Banter:

  • Stephen: "So you want to be the underling of the Nepo baby?" (15:52)

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5. Glenn’s Pick: The Citadel from Game of Thrones/A Song of Ice and Fire

Segment Start: 18:10

• Why The Citadel?

  • Drawn to a university/monastery for scholars and scientists, with access to “forbidden knowledge”—especially magical studies.
  • Acknowledges it’s “not a very progressive institution” and “exclusively male,” which he admits would be “a chore” (18:45).
  • Haunted by dangerous realities of Westeros:

    "I have a very artisanal blend of softness. I'm a soft boy, and the softness of my ilk would not be welcome in the world of Westeros.” (19:16)

  • Gleeful about building his own multi-metal “chain,” collecting knowledge like charms.

• Downsides:

  • Teased about medieval working conditions (no dentistry, emptying bedpans, risk of murder):

    Waylon: "There's not even indoor plumbing in this world." (21:56)

  • Linda: “I find myself thinking about the fact that this is a world in which a relatively good and merciful death is having your head chopped off. And that's where you would like to work, because The Muppet Show is too toxic." (21:40)
  • Glenn—undaunted—fantasizes about “master of forbidden knowledge” (23:22) and “accessorizing.” (23:08)

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6. Brief Lightning Round: Other Workplace Fantasies

Segment Start: 23:30

• Panel weighs other options that were considered and ruled out, including:
  • News stations from Mary Tyler Moore, NewsRadio, etc. ("That's not even a fantasy" — already too similar to their real careers.)
  • Inns from Gilmore Girls or Newhart ("but that's dealing with people…”)
  • Antique store with Mrs. Kim from Gilmore Girls (“I think Mrs. Kim and I would actually get along really well because I grew up evangelical.” — Waylon, 24:07)
  • Cheers and other iconic settings filed under “fun, but not for me.”

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Linda Holmes on why the people matter most:

  “This pick is all about being around good people.” (03:30 – Stephen Thompson, summarizing Linda’s approach)

• Stephen’s Sorkin-era self-awareness:

  “There is no environment on television or on earth in which the opinions of 53 year old white men carry more weight.” (08:22)

• Walk-and-Talks Fix Everything?

  "If you could put all your meetings into walk-and-talk format, maybe that would be more tolerable." (09:45 – Waylon Wong)
  "Honestly, that is a significant improvement..." (09:55 – Stephen Thompson)

• Waylon on her Muppet arc:

  “I could be the one, you know, making sure that Rita Moreno gets from the green room to the stage. I'm keeping Miss Piggy's dressing room stocked. I am making sure that Kermit's water glass is filled. You know, I've got a headset on, and I think I'm very organized. I'm an order Muppet.” (14:38)

• Glenn on knowledge and chaos:

  “I would have access to a world of knowledge, including forbidden knowledge, which is, as we all know, the best kind of knowledge.” (20:23)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

| MM:SS | Segment | |--------|------------------------------------------------------| | 01:31 | Linda picks AFC Richmond (Ted Lasso) | | 05:45 | Stephen picks The West Wing | | 13:39 | Waylon picks The Muppet Show | | 18:10 | Glenn picks The Citadel (Game of Thrones) | | 23:30 | Brief lightning round of alternate workplaces |

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Episode Takeaways

• What makes a workplace appealing—even on TV—is usually about the vibes, the camaraderie, and the hope for meaning, even more than the specific job.
• The line between pop culture fantasy and their own actual jobs is often humorous and blurry.
• Each panelist’s pick reveals something about their real-life quirks and desires, from Team Spirit to the allure of order amidst chaos or the comforts of an ivory tower (with a dash of forbidden magic).
• The show ends with an invitation to listeners to share their own dream TV workplaces, underscoring the usefulness of pop culture as a way to muse on real aspirations and what "good work" means.

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“I think we've learned just a little something about each of us, as I thought we would. But now we want to learn a little something about you.” (24:21 – Glenn Weldon)

Transcript

[Announcer]

This message comes from Great Wolf Lodge. There's adventure for the whole family, including an indoor water park that's always 84 degrees, attractions, spacious suites and more. You're just a short drive away from an unforgettable family getaway. Learn [e-mail] I've been doing this show

[Linda Holmes]

for about 16 years, and I sort of feel like I've already worked at the Muppet show, so I don't know that that would really be a new horizon for me.

[Waylon Wong]

Yeah.

[Stephen Thompson]

Honestly, though, it's not that bad.

[Linda Holmes]

Yeah, it's true.

[Glenn Weldon]

Growing up, we all saw workplaces on tv, and whether we knew it or not, they were teaching us what our lives would look like for most of the time. Right. How and where we would be spending most of our waking lives. But of course, not all workplaces on TV looked the same or felt the same. So we were wondering, here's the topic. What fictional TV workplace would you like to work in and why? I'm Glenn Weldon, and joining me today on NPR is Pop Culture Happy Hour are my co hosts, Linda Holmes. Hey, Linda.

[Linda Holmes]

Hello, Glenn.

[Glenn Weldon]

And Stephen Thompson. Hey, Stephen.

[Stephen Thompson]

Hey, Glenn.

[Glenn Weldon]

Also joining us is the co host of NPR's Daily Economics podcast, the Indicator from Planet Money, Waylon Wong. Hey, Waylon.

[Stephen Thompson]

Hi.

[Waylon Wong]

I heard we were talking about the labor market. My favorite topic.

[Glenn Weldon]

We kind of are, in a way.

[Sponsor/Guest Speaker]

Yeah.

[Glenn Weldon]

Huh. All right, so, Linda, kick us off. What TV workplace would you like to work in?

[Linda Holmes]

Yeah. So I thought about this quite a bit, and I made a few decisions about the bounds of my thinking, which would be I gave myself complete freedom to pretend I was qualified. So I didn't go around thinking, like, well, I guess I could work at some show that was set at a magazine because I'm a writer and stuff like that. Like, I didn't. You know, I decided that even if I would be totally inept, I could do whatever I wanted. And I chose to approach it as, I want this workplace more than I want this work. Right. So what I came up with is I would work on Ted Lasso for Richmond afc, the soccer football team. Now, if you know me, I don't know very much about soccer football. I would have to learn. I'd be willing to learn. My real thinking was I think I would enjoy being around people who are involved in such an energetic endeavor as a sports team. I have a lot of spirit. I have a lot of team spirit. I enjoy being a hype person for other people. I think I've been a hype person for some of the people on this call at times love doing that. Love doing that. And also some of the people that I feel I would be working with are the kind of people I think I would enjoy working with. For example, I would have so much more patience than someone like, for example, Glenn with Ted himself and his relentless optimism. I would find this charming. I would find this charming. The big, big boss is Rebecca, who's a nice person. So I feel like you're not ultimately answering to any sort of snake or nasty person.

[Waylon Wong]

Right.

[Linda Holmes]

And many of the co workers are just people I think I would enjoy hanging out with. I think I would enjoy, you know, spending my time around the people who are in that office. I gotta sit down and have a long conversation with Coach Beard. I think that's.

[Waylon Wong]

That's the dream.

[Linda Holmes]

I think that' I feel like this

[Stephen Thompson]

pick is all about being around good people.

[Linda Holmes]

It is. I think that's right. It's a show made up of good people. I thought about, you know, there are other shows, you know, that are also about good people. You know, Parks and Rec and shows like that. But I don't want to work in government, so I decided I would rather work in sports. So that was my thinking.

[Glenn Weldon]

Yeah, I wouldn't want to work there. But it's not because I don't want to be around, you know, cheerful people. I count Stephen Thompson as a friend. So, you know, I'm totally fine with cheerful people. It's that the boundaries between work and life are tissue paper in that place. And this is a problem with a lot of television workplaces. Actually. Everybody is up in everybody else's business. It would be a little too much for me.

[Linda Holmes]

And I think the thing is, I grew up that way. My parents worked at my school, so I'm very accustomed to that. So I think it doesn't alarm me as much.

[Stephen Thompson]

Slippery work Life balance has been a big part of not only my adult life, but my childhood because my parents worked together and worked together doing something they deeply loved doing nothing but writing about something they deeply loved. Work as a all consuming passion is definitely made it hard to look at a lot of fictional TV workplaces and think this would be better than what I'm doing now.

[Glenn Weldon]

Right.

[Waylon Wong]

Linda, did you think about what job you might want within the organization?

[Stephen Thompson]

That's a good question.

[Linda Holmes]

Well, I did, and I was a little bit limited by my lack of knowledge of soccer, football, as well as my lack of athletics.

[Waylon Wong]

But that's part of the onboarding.

[Linda Holmes]

Putting that aside, I think I might be good in the Kind of like marketing and PR departments. As I said, I'm a good hype person. Social media, yeah, it's creative. So I think I might find myself sort of over on the keely part of the team. Although, listen, there are a lot of lovely people in that office. I could probably find my way into doing something useful, which is also how I approached coming to npr.

[Waylon Wong]

They said, put me in coach. I really did.

[Linda Holmes]

I sort of did. If you don't know what you want me to do, I'll figure out what

[Waylon Wong]

you want me to do.

[Glenn Weldon]

I think that's extremely fitting. I think we're going to learn a lot about each of us on this episode. Speaking of Steven, hit me. Where would you work?

[Stephen Thompson]

Well, one place that I strongly considered was 30 Rock. Being around funny people, being around creative energy had a lot of appeal. And then I kind of paused and thought, like, I kind of have worked in one of the professional environments that is actually, actually closest to 30 Rock. And it was very exhausting. I worked at the Onion for 12 years. I have been in rooms full of professional funny people. It can be extremely exhilarating. It can be extremely exhausting, including hitting that deadline time and time and time again. So ultimately, I decided to opt out of 30 Rock and into an even more stressful, even more exhausting, even more kind of immiserating environment. But for, I think, some very sound reasons, I went with the West Wing.

[Glenn Weldon]

Okay, you sweet summit.

[Stephen Thompson]

I know. I know what you're thinking. Linda Holmes. Again, it's politics. It's a bunch of speechifying. It's a bunch of.

[Linda Holmes]

You hate meetings.

[Glenn Weldon]

I hate meetings. You hate meetings.

[Stephen Thompson]

I hate meetings more than anything on earth. But hear me out. One, you have the ability and power to change the world for the better. This is very meaningful work.

[Linda Holmes]

Of course, according to Aaron Sorkin, running

[Stephen Thompson]

the US government is meaningful and does entail the power to make the world a better place, even if you choose not to pursue that option. Two, you are surrounded by plucky dreamers. You are surrounded by people who believe in a better world. Look, I understand how that has its limits, but it does have its appeal. Three, you only have to work those long, punishing hours for a maximum of eight years. This is limited term employment before you get to run off and live the rest of your life as some rich layabout like George Stephanopoulos.

[Glenn Weldon]

Yeah, or just a cushy consultant.

[Waylon Wong]

Yeah, yeah, exactly.

[Stephen Thompson]

There is ultimately a second chapter that is not televised. That is you collecting a big fat paycheck for spouting the Conventional wisdom circa when you had televised.

[Waylon Wong]

For.

[Stephen Thompson]

Every problem, no matter how complex, is solved with an impassioned speech. And I think the simplicity of that, the ability to kind of talk your way out of real complex problems, I understand the appeal of that. And five, and perhaps most important for this conversation, there is no environment on television or on earth in which the opinions of 53 year old white men carry more weight.

[Waylon Wong]

You're just writing like free college on a napkin at a bar and being like, look at me.

[Glenn Weldon]

Exactly.

[Waylon Wong]

I'm saving the world.

[Glenn Weldon]

My work is done here.

[Stephen Thompson]

Hold on. Everybody stop. A man is talking.

[Linda Holmes]

That's true. It does work that way. I have to say, like, first of all, much of this is very cynical, Steven. And I'm very disappointed in you for just wanting your future as a lobbyist or whatever you would be after this. But as you know, I do understand the surface appeal of hanging around in Aaron Sorkin world. If I were gonna do that, I would have chosen Sports Night, which I also considered. But that show is always on the brink of being canceled. Who wants to do that?

[Stephen Thompson]

Exactly.

[Linda Holmes]

But I simply think, as stated, your low tolerance for attending meetings would make this completely impossible. Because ultimately your low tolerance for meetings springs from the part of your personality that thinks the absolute worst thing for someone to say to you is, I need to talk to you. And you know what happens a lot if you work in the White House and you have a position of responsibility? Someone comes up and says, I need to talk to you. And sometimes it's stressful and they say, I need to talk to you later. And that would ruin your entire life.

[Waylon Wong]

Yeah, that's true.

[Stephen Thompson]

That might actually kill me.

[Linda Holmes]

Yeah, that might actually kill you. So, I mean, I hope you enjoy the speechifying because you're gonna hate a lot of the rest of it.

[Waylon Wong]

I have a question. Do you count a walk and talk as a meeting? Because if you could put all your meetings into walk and talk format, maybe that would be more tolerable.

[Stephen Thompson]

Honestly, that is a significant improvement in part, when you're walking around, you eventually reach a destination at which point that meeting would end. And I think it would feel less like I'm trapped in a conversation.

[Glenn Weldon]

Exactly. Because it's like a car trip. You're not looking at each other in the eyes. Right. Because you have to see where you're going so you can actually share real feelings.

[Linda Holmes]

It's a whole day of I need to talk to you.

[Stephen Thompson]

I'm talking about a four to eight year prison sentence followed by a lifetime of the cushiest work on Earth.

[Linda Holmes]

See, I would just not go to prison

[Glenn Weldon]

like Linda. I'm a little leery of the Sorkin quality here. Although we have to acknowledge that, as Linda referred to, there are eras of Sorkin, and this is a good era of Sorkin. Yes, it's an idealized Washington, D.C. but there are cynics on that show. There are bad faith arguments that people make, but they're always cast as the bad guys. They're constantly shown to be in the wrong. They get called out, usually in a pretty sanctimonious speech. But later on, he moved with the newsroom. He moved to hectoring. I will take sanctimonious over hectoring any day. And in the pilot episode, Sorkin is also letting us see that this is Bartlett's ego. Like, he loves rubbing someone's face and how wrong they are. And that is a character trait that is also a character flaw that gets mined a lot on that show. And later with the newsroom, that layering went away because the mission statement of that show was, you know, the news got it wrong. Here's how I would have gotten it right.

[Waylon Wong]

Yes, man, that show was insufferable. I would walk into the ocean rather than work in the newsroom.

[Stephen Thompson]

Yeah. You'll notice that I did not mention the newsroom or Studio 60.

[Glenn Weldon]

See also errors. Like Taylor Swift, the Man. Man has errors. All right, well, thank you for that, Stephen. We're going to take a quick break, and then we're going to come back with my pick and Waylon's pick.

[Sponsor/Guest Speaker]

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[Waylon Wong]

Historically, perimenopause and menopause have been very stigmatizing. So people haven't wanted to admit that they are in perimenopause and menopause as though it was, like, embarrassing, which is insane. It's just something happening to your body. So one of the things that we're trying to do is destigmatize these topics. Perimenopause and menopause are just women's health. So we try to educate women all the time. Maybe it's your hormones and we would like to help you. Yeah. And I find women actually want to talk about it. It's one of the things they always comment at MIDI is that they finally feel heard. One of the ways that women find MIDI is actually from other women.

[Linda Holmes]

And I think it's meaningful MIDI health.

[Sponsor/Guest Speaker]

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[Announcer]

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[Glenn Weldon]

Waylon, what fictional TV workplace would you

[Announcer]

like to work in?

[Waylon Wong]

You know what? It's time to play the music. It's time to light the lights.

[Linda Holmes]

It's time to play the music it's

[Glenn Weldon]

time to light the light.

[Linda Holmes]

It's time to meet the Muppets on

[Glenn Weldon]

the Muppet show tonight.

[Waylon Wong]

And you know, who could cue up the music? Who could light the lights? Me. Waylon Wong. I would like to work at the OG Muppet show, which, you know, then I was thinking about, you know, what is my ultimate dream? And my ultimate dream is to meet the Muppets and to hang out with the Muppets. This is, like, all I think about. And so I think working at the Muppets show would obviously put me in the orbit of all these Muppets. I think that, you know, in the show, Scooter's uncle owns the theater, and so he's kind of the gopher. And so I think that I could replace Scooter. And then I've already thought this through, and then he could get promoted to do kind of bigger, better things, right? But I could be the one, you know, like, making sure that Rita Moreno gets from the green room to the stage. I'm keeping Miss Piggy's dressing room stocked. I am making sure that Kermit's water glass is filled. You know, I've got a headset on, and I think I'm very organized. I'm an order Muppet.

[Stephen Thompson]

I was gonna say I was gonna ask.

[Waylon Wong]

I'm an order Muppet all the way. I'm Prairie Dawn.

[Glenn Weldon]

Yeah, sure.

[Waylon Wong]

I'm Prairie dawn of Sesame street. Like, directing the school play and getting really upset when, you know, like, Ernie forgets his lines. So I think I would really keep things Moving along at a very efficient pace at the mupp. And I think I would prove my value. And then hopefully this is, like the longer term plan. If I'm a really good employee, then they'll take me along when they do the movies. And then I would get to be on the set of Great Muppet Caper. Muppets Take Manhattan. Muppet Christmas Carol. So I basically just want a career with the Muppets.

[Linda Holmes]

I think you're the only one who came up with an arc.

[Stephen Thompson]

How do you bring down Scooter? What is your plan to destroy.

[Linda Holmes]

No, she doesn't want to bring down Scooter. She wants Scooter to get promoted.

[Waylon Wong]

Yeah. Cause, like, I think Scooter. I love Scooter. And I think, you know, like, Scooter definitely has a place in the Muppet universe. So it's like, I would just do the grunt work that Scooter gets hired for, and then he could get promoted to do other stuff. You know, maybe he wants to be on stage, whatever. And then I would just be the one fetching things. Yeah.

[Stephen Thompson]

So you want to be the underling of the Nepo baby?

[Waylon Wong]

Well, later on, the Muppets inherit the theater after Scooter's uncle dies.

[Linda Holmes]

Well, yeah. And she'd be working with everyone. When you're the production assistant, you get to work with everybody.

[Waylon Wong]

And I feel like they would treat me really well. Like, can you imagine Kermit being a toxic bul? Obviously not.

[Glenn Weldon]

You know, Miss Piggy, Maybe he's not a toxic boss. It is a toxic workplace. There is too much chaos in that workplace. Too many gonzos, too many New Zealands, too many crazy hackers.

[Waylon Wong]

There's only one Gonzo. There's a lot of chickens. I guess I'd have to wrangle the chickens as the pa. That would be hard.

[Glenn Weldon]

Link Hogthrub. You'd have to work with Link Hogthrub. I mean, come on.

[Waylon Wong]

He's a really good actor, though. Pigs in spaghetti.

[Glenn Weldon]

See, here's what this workplace is like. Somebody makes a fat joke to Piggy, Piggy responds with a physical assault. Everyone is in the wrong there. This is a toxic work environment. You need a Scooter, you need a Kermit, you need a Sam, you need a Roth. Who is HR it's probably Robin.

[Waylon Wong]

Robin's probably the HR It's Robin's HR But Robin's like a child. It's probably Sam the Eagle.

[Linda Holmes]

You know who I think it is? I think it's Janice. Oh, maybe Janice is so spacey she's so mellow. No, she's so mellow. She just makes everyone feel more calm. I will say I only have one hesitation about the Muppet show as a potential workplace for me, which is? Well, I've been doing this show for about 16 years as of this summer, and I sort of feel like I've already worked at the Muppet show, so I don't know that that would really be a new horizon for me. Having worked at Pop Culture Happy Hour, I think I've already had the Muppet show experience.

[Waylon Wong]

Amazing.

[Stephen Thompson]

Yeah. Honestly, though, it's not that bad.

[Linda Holmes]

Yeah, that's true.

[Waylon Wong]

Who's the Lou Zeland of Pop Culture Happy Hour?

[Glenn Weldon]

This is like 30 Rock, but with explosions. Crazy Har. Crazy Harry is like exploding things like. This is not. This is not a healthy workplace.

[Linda Holmes]

You got a guy throwing fish. Yeah.

[Waylon Wong]

Imagine getting to work alongside Rolf the Dog.

[Glenn Weldon]

Well, see, this is. You're speaking my language here, Wayland.

[Stephen Thompson]

You're in the show business. I get it.

[Linda Holmes]

And you also get this rotating. Like, you get to work with, like, Paul Williams and Rita Moreno. Oh, yeah.

[Waylon Wong]

Elton John, Raquel Welch.

[Linda Holmes]

Yeah. If it's OG Muppet show, you've got some really impressive people in those years.

[Glenn Weldon]

Yeah. All right. That's a pick. Waylon. I'm not gonna. I can't.

[Stephen Thompson]

I can't.

[Glenn Weldon]

I think it's really toxic, but I love that pic. My workplace is the Citadel, which is the home of the maesters from the Song of Ice and Fire books by George R.R. martin on TV. That's Game of Thrones, House of the Dragon, and Knight of the Seven Kingdoms. Maesters are this world's scientists, healers, scholars. And the Citadel itself is kind of a university slash secular monastery. A monastery dedicated to science and medicine, but it's also a school. Now, downside, it is not a very progressive institution. And it is also exclusively male, which I think that would be a chore for me, because, you know, where have I worked? I worked in bookstores. I've worked in the nonprofit world, and I worked in public media. My bosses have tended to be women. And if I can be gender essentialist for a second, broadly speaking, I think it just makes for a healthier, emotionally healthy workplace. It is a very political institution, because it has to be to survive in this very cruel and brutal world, where things like, you know, intelligence and empathy and compassion, they get viewed as weaknesses. Look, I have a very artisanal blend of softness. I'm a soft boy, and the softness of my ilk would not be welcome in the world of Westeros. So I would go to the indoorsiest of all indoors places. Cause the world itself is not a great place for indoor kids. I would go to the Citadel. Now we've only glimpsed one aspect of the Citadel in Game of Thrones. The character of Sam Tarly, who is played by John Bradley. He goes there to study and enters as a novice. And what we saw him doing there was mostly just, you know, emptying bedpans. And look.

[Waylon Wong]

Gotta start somewhere.

[Glenn Weldon]

Is that my dream job? No, but you know, shout out to the healthcare workers who do that extremely necessary, biologically necessary job every day. But you gotta remember, this isn't the real world. This is oldie timey fantasy fakie times where cleaning out chamber pots is like. It would just be part of your day, right? It's like running errands. It's like emptying the dishwasher. You get through it. It's just something you do.

[Stephen Thompson]

But you're choosing from all of the televised worlds. You're choosing one in which you empty chamber pots in fantasy Murderland or it's

[Glenn Weldon]

part of the deal.

[Waylon Wong]

I think you'd be really drafty too.

[Glenn Weldon]

Here's where it comes. I would have access to a world of knowledge, including forbidden knowledge, which is, as we all know, the best kind of knowledge. And look. Each maester gets a link in a chain that they wear around their neck of different metals that signify each field of study that they've mastered. For example, black iron chain is the study of ravens. Which sounds pretty random until you remember that.

[Linda Holmes]

Now I get why you want this.

[Glenn Weldon]

The ravens are like, you know, you

[Waylon Wong]

want a charm bracelet.

[Glenn Weldon]

Ravens are telecommunications. Bronze is astronomy. And look, if astronomy is just like recognizing patterns, I'd be down with it. But I'm sure there's azimuths that need to get calculated, so maybe I'd skip the bronze. Copper is history. I could deal with that. Gold is mathematics and economics. I'm not getting a gold chain. Iron is warcraft. I mean, I could fake it. I played the game. Silver is medicine. I could do that. And Valyrian steel. Here we go. Valyrian steel link is for studying the higher mysteries, which means magic. So I would ensconce myself in the locked vault where all the forbidden books are kept. I wouldn't get much sun, but it's not like I do anyway. And you know, Linda, you and I grew up in the Delaware Valley. I could wear a chain. We grew up very close to New Jersey. I could do it. I could pull it off.

[Linda Holmes]

You could?

[Glenn Weldon]

I think I could. I think I could. That's me.

[Linda Holmes]

I just find myself thinking about the fact that this is a world in which a relatively good and merciful death is having your head chopped off. And that's where you would like to work, because the Muppet show is too

[Waylon Wong]

toxic and there's not even indoor plumbing in this world.

[Announcer]

Yeah. You know what?

[Glenn Weldon]

You'd be part of the olden timey fakie times. It would all be kind of of a pie.

[Linda Holmes]

I really don't think you would like it, Glenn. I really.

[Glenn Weldon]

The Citadel, I really don't think you'd like it. Is a beacon of knowledge and critical thinking in a world that desperately needs it. People would come to us looking for. Looking for. Well, I mean, one of the jobs that people from the Citadel have is they're the scribes of this world. I could do that. I could totally write stuff for people.

[Waylon Wong]

Well, wouldn't you rather do Name of the Rose, then? If you're looking for, like, monastery cool, literary monk types to hang out with, they get to solve crimes, you know.

[Glenn Weldon]

Yeah. Yeah. If I could be Sean Connery, I mean, just in general, then, yeah.

[Stephen Thompson]

I'm also thinking about the dentistry of it all.

[Glenn Weldon]

Yeah.

[Stephen Thompson]

You know what I really like modern dentistry.

[Linda Holmes]

You know what I'm also thinking about, Glenn? Are you taking your husband to Westeros?

[Glenn Weldon]

Well, see, these are the things. I mean, it has an advantage.

[Linda Holmes]

Cause I don't think he's going to Westeros, buddy.

[Stephen Thompson]

I'm trying to imagine.

[Glenn Weldon]

I think we could sneak him in, you know. Sure. He's like, the maesters are kind of left to their own devices.

[Waylon Wong]

Well, until they get murdered or whatever.

[Glenn Weldon]

Yeah. You know, I still think it would be good. And I like the accessorizing.

[Stephen Thompson]

So, buddy, we want better for you.

[Glenn Weldon]

I think it would be great. And I would have access to a world of knowledge where I could work my terrible will.

[Linda Holmes]

I support you in whatever idiosyncratic career you want for yourself, including Master of Forbidden Knowledge. Cause I do think that sounds very cool.

[Glenn Weldon]

Yeah, see. Cause what I was thinking was, well, maybe it would be like the news station on the Mary Tyler Moore show or wkrp, WNYX from newsradio. And I'm like, well, that's not even. You kind of do that. It's not even a fantasy.

[Waylon Wong]

I know. Cause I was thinking about Mary Tyler Moore. Then I was like, I already worked.

[Stephen Thompson]

I thought about all of those things.

[Glenn Weldon]

Why would you do that? And then I thought, maybe the Dragonfly Inn from Gilmore Girls or the Stratford Inn from Newhart, but that's dealing with people.

[Waylon Wong]

Oh, I thought about the antique store in Gilmore Girls because I don't want to work for Lorelei. And I was like, I would work for Mrs. Kim.

[Linda Holmes]

Sure.

[Glenn Weldon]

Oh, see, now again, Mrs. Kim.

[Linda Holmes]

Yeah, that's a good idea.

[Glenn Weldon]

A little toxic, too.

[Waylon Wong]

No, I think Mrs. Kim and I would actually get along really well because I grew up evangelical.

[Linda Holmes]

It sometimes just takes a little balance to figure out, like what could you tolerate and what you couldn't tolerate, because I would probably have fun at Cheers, but I don't want to work in a bar.

[Glenn Weldon]

Yeah.

[Announcer]

You know.

[Glenn Weldon]

Well, I think we've learned just a little something about each of us, as I thought we would. But now we want to learn a little something about you. I'm sure everybody, you know, I asked this question at a July 4th party, and I got a host of different answers. So we want to hear from. That brings us to the end of our show. Waylon Wong, Linda Holmes, Stephen Thompson, thank you so much for being here.

[Linda Holmes]

Thank you, thank you, thank you.

[Glenn Weldon]

This episode was produced by Liz Metzger, Lennon Sherburne and Mike Katsiff, and edited by our showrunner, Jessica Reedy.

[Announcer]

And hello.

[Glenn Weldon]

Kim in provides our theme music. Thank you for listening to Pop Culture Happy Hour from npr. I'm Glenn Weldon, and we'll see you all next time.

[Sponsor/Guest Speaker]

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