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- [00:00]
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- [00:23]
Linda Holmes
The excellent Netflix series Mo is about a man who figures out how to get by, how to find work as someone who can't work legally, how to navigate the asylum process as a Palestinian refugee in Texas, and how to care for the people he loves. Both funny and fascinating, it's based on the life of the show's star and co creator, the standup Mo Amer, and touches on issues of immigration and identity and a family in a long limbo as they work to map out a secure future. The show just returned for a second season, so we thought it was a good time to revisit our conversation about the series. I'm Linda Holmes and in this encore episode of NPR Pop Culture Happy Hour, we're talking about Mo.
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- [03:13]
Linda Holmes
Joining us today is Vulture TV critic Roxanna Hadadi. Hello Roxanna, welcome back.
- [03:19]
Roxanna Hadadi
Hey Linda, how are you?
- [03:20]
Linda Holmes
I am great and I am so excited that you are here to talk about Mo, a show I really like liked In Mo. Mo Amer plays Mo Najar, a Palestinian refugee living in Houston whose family has been stuck in the asylum process for years because he can't legally work. Mo gets jobs under the table, but when he loses the latest one over the owner's fear of ice, he ends up selling counterfeit merchandise out of the back of his car. His girlfriend Maria, played by Teresa Ruiz, isn't his Muslim mother's first choice, but she is Mo's first choice and she's part of the reason. He's an adept speaker of Spanish as well as Eng, English and Arabic, all three of which languages are part of the show's dialogue. Farrah Bseso plays his devoted mother Yusra, who makes outstanding olive oil by hand, which presents both a business opportunity and some challenges for the family. Mo's older brother Samir, has Autism Spectrum Disorder. Mo is very protective of him as well. Samir is played by Omar Elba. Over the course of the eight episodes, you see Mo struggle with the uncertainty of his immigration status and you watch as he learns new things about his own family history and how they came to need asylum in the first place. Amber co created the show with Rami Yousef, whose own show, Rami, earned Yousef an Emmy nomination. Mo is now streaming on Netflix. Roxanna, you, I know not only have seen this, but you have spoken to Mo Amer and Rami Youssef about this series. What are your basic impressions of it? Where we can start?
- [04:53]
Roxanna Hadadi
Oh man, that's such a big question because I think the show covers so much. I mean, from a comedic point of view, I really enjoy that. If you have seen Mo's standup, you sort of get the rhythms of how he tells his stories and how he sort of integrates his own Palestinian background and his Muslim faith into this. So from a dialogue perspective, I like how much it syncs up just who he seems to be both on stage and off.
- [05:23]
Linda Holmes
He has a very specific and complete sort of presence that is really, really, I think, enjoyable.
- [05:30]
Roxanna Hadadi
Y the show somehow doesn't have that much setup, but you just immediately know who everyone is. Which I think is always sort of a triumph with any streaming show. Right. Because you need to grab someone immediately to then have them watch the second episode, the third, the fourth, or in this case, all eight. And I also just was very impressed by what an integration this show is of Houston. On the one hand, you obviously have the fact that Mo is Palestinian, he's a refugee. His family has been stuck in this asylum process for nearly 20 years when we begin the show. And so they're all these markers of his religion, his family's cultural beliefs, sort of the ways that they have assimilated in the ways that they have not. And then there also is all this integration of just Houston. Right. And he's talked about Houston being the city that is his second home. It's raised him, it's loved him. And so you have cameos from Bun B. And Paul Wall and like these Houston hip hop figures as well, which I just find really interesting. And I had heard and Mo confir that I guess this was the first sitcom ever filmed in Houston, which I think is so fascinating given the fact that the city is humongous, it has a very diverse population. So I just loved what a strong sense of character and a strong sense of place the series has throughout.
- [06:53]
Linda Holmes
Yeah, definitely. I mean, you never miss that this is taking place in a very specific community for him. And, you know, this mix up of the fact that his girlfriend is Spanish speaking is not the only reason why he speaks Spanish, but it's part of why he speaks Spanish. And. And they're very sparing about explaining too much about the dialogue. And he very much weaves in and out of Spanish and Arabic and English in a way that I think is very confident.
- [07:31]
Roxanna Hadadi
The iPhone 13 I was able to bring you up. You have a great day, huh?
- [07:35]
Linda Holmes
Me too.
- [07:37]
Roxanna Hadadi
What? Why are you speaking Arabic in front of customers? It's never a good sign.
- [07:41]
Linda Holmes
You know, you don't get that stuff where you feel like whenever people are speaking a language other than English, they feel like they have to somehow explain what they just said. I appreciate that a lot. And I think it's part of how. How much kind of specificity there is. You know, I saw an interview With Mo, where he was talk about the idea of, like, Muslim comedy, and he sort of was saying, like, I don't think there's any such thing as Muslim comedy, which makes sense because it's such an incredibly varied experience. And so it's interesting to me that he and Rami have worked together on this show and on Rami's show as well, because here are these two shows that both incorporate dramatic elements, but also comedic elements. And yet they are, in some ways, they do have things in common, but they're also really, really different. The things that those guys are up against are really different. I think the idea of this bureaucratic asylum process is in some ways really well suited to comedy, but placing it in that context is really unusual for any streaming or certainly network comedy. I feel like.
- [08:50]
Roxanna Hadadi
Yeah, I mean, watching it reminded me so much of being back in grad school and reading the Trial and just the absurd process of just any sort of, like, red tape, bureaucracy. And so it's very, on one hand, amusing to be like, oh, the family's first lawyer, who happens to be Palestinian. So they trust her. They believe that she is going to help them when Mo goes to finally confront her about, like, why haven't you been doing anything? And they're like, two pages in the family file. There's three people in the case, and you have two pieces of paper.
- [09:24]
Linda Holmes
Habibi Wallahi, I cannot seem to find your brother's application, but it's okay. It's fine. We can Xerox yours and then change the name.
- [09:32]
Roxanna Hadadi
And there's something, like, depressingly amusing about that, right? It's like you've given 20 years of your life to waiting for this, and the person that you've trusted to help you is not helping you at all.
- [09:43]
Linda Holmes
But there's a sense, too, of the loyalty that they feel, of course, to her, because she's been a presence and because she's sort of part of the community that they belong to and they feel a loyalty to her. And you also get the sense, or I got the sense that part of the reason she's not doing anything is that she's so overwhelmed. Your face tells me you did not get that sense.
- [10:06]
Roxanna Hadadi
Well, I think that's a kind reading. I mean, I think. I think what this show does very well, and I appreciate, and Rami does this as well, is it sort of walks the line of you feel a kinship as a refugee, as an immigrant, as an underrepresented person. You feel an immediate kinship with someone who is also of that Same group. Right. So there's, like, an inherent loyalty. I will speak for myself as an Iranian person. Like, we would go to Iranian grocery stores. We would go to Iranian restaurants. There is the sense that you want to support your community. Right. But then there also is the reality that, like, that doesn't mean you're all magically gonna like each other.
- [10:43]
Linda Holmes
Right.
- [10:44]
Roxanna Hadadi
And I think that's part of Mo's point about there isn't really Muslim comedy, because then there is this assumption that, like, everyone gets along.
- [10:52]
Linda Holmes
Right.
- [10:53]
Roxanna Hadadi
It's fine. And I think the show does a very good job of saying, well, that's not always the case. As an example, his family was forced to leave Palest and they settle in Kuwait. But, like, the Gulf War was because Iraq invaded Kuwait. Right. And, like, those are Middle Eastern countries that do not necessarily, in simplest terms, get along. So I think the show in and of itself is acknowledging, like, there are going to be people who you want to trust and you want to feel kinship with, and it might be smarter or better in some situations to move past that feeling and find alliances elsewhere.
- [11:29]
Linda Holmes
Yeah.
- [11:30]
Roxanna Hadadi
So I like that the show then gives them a Jewish lawyer who the mother at first does not trust because of that, and then she ends up being their strongest ally and someone who really comes to their aid. So I think with the menagerie of languages and with the incorporation of all these different cultural beliefs and communities, you are getting inherently sort of a political statement, which is like, I am representing my Palestinian culture and my ancestors and all of that. But I'm also acknowledging that we are in a country and a time where you have to make other friendships and accommodations and connections.
- [12:08]
Linda Holmes
Yeah. And, you know, I found this show so funny, and I find him so funny, but I also. There are these moments of, like, really profound beauty in this series. I found there's this whole story that about his mother kind of making olive oil is so kind of tactile in a way. These scenes of the olives and the olive grove, I guess, and the making of the oil are so luscious. And you really get that sense of how it connects him to his mom, who he really, really loves. And, you know, I think it's so interesting to see a family that is undocumented presented not in the emergency phase of their. Do you know what I mean? When they've sort of. A lot of times, I think when we get fictional representations of being undocumented, they omit people who are undocumented for long periods of time while participating in the asylum process. So it's not a secret. Everybody knows they're there, they're going through the asylum process. It's just that they can't work. And what they're able to do is very limited. It was really interesting to see a different chapter of the life of a family that is undocumented.
- [13:30]
Roxanna Hadadi
Yeah, I think it's very illuminating to see how every member of the family has their way of attempting to deal with this and like, carve out identities in this space that are Palestinian, that are also American, and like, the varying degrees of each. Because with Mo, you have a very specific sort of line that he's walking with his girlfriend. There are moments that are very profound, as you said, like when she takes him to confession and is like, I know that you're not Catholic, but you need to talk to someone about what you're going through. My father sent us to Houston two years ahead. Two years. I didn't see him. Had to be the man of the house. I could live up to that. And it was very funny going back and sort of researching to talk to Mohan Rami and see a clip of Rami on the Stephen Colbert Show. I think it was in 2019, and they were talking about Catholic versus Muslim guilt and they talked about confession. So I just. I love that they're sort of the continuation of these ideas in this show. But then you also have a character like Samir, who I immediately was like, I'm so curious about what his life is like. And we have this great little scene where he works at a chicken restaurant and he just all of a sudden decides that maybe the restaurant should add, like chicken tahini to the menu and maybe he should go buy some halal chicken and make that happen. And so again, there is the humor of, like, his abrupt decision to do that, but also that sort of sense of like, well, how do you meld two different identities into tangible things, like olive oil, like hummus, like food? What are the things that bring different people together and find commonality? And this series argues so much that it's, as you mentioned, those tactile, beautiful things like an olive garden or, well, not the restaurant the Olive Garden, but like, you know, but like a garden or a grove of olive trees or a wedding. I love that we get sort of. I think it's called the zafa, which is a pre wedding sort of ritual where the Palestinian men and come and sort of sing together. And so I think there are all these very specific cultural details that make their way into this show that just help it feel lived in and Realized.
- [15:54]
Linda Holmes
You know, the other thing that I thought was really unusual about this show was there is a kind of an underlying story in which Mo is becoming increasingly dependent on Lean, which he is getting from a. A guy that he knows. But what is interesting about that is it's not the main thing going on in his life. It exists as a kind of a growing issue for him that is related to the stress and difficulty of everything else that he's dealing with, of the work stuff and the family stuff. And this issue, this substance issue, it's lurking, and you can feel how it's playing about a bigger and bigger role for him. And people he knows who know about it are becoming concerned about it. But it's not a sort of. Let us now tell a story about addiction. Do you know what I mean?
- [16:50]
Roxanna Hadadi
Yeah. And Mo and Rami, when I talked to them, they said that the thing that they wanted to do with Lean was sort of make a political point, which is that healthcare in this country is sort of flawed. And the reason that it becomes addicted to Lean is that he gets shot at a mass shooting in a grocery store.
- [17:09]
Linda Holmes
Right.
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Roxanna Hadadi
And doesn't have the $5,000 or whatever that an ambulance ride and proper medical care would cost.
- [17:16]
Linda Holmes
Right.
- [17:16]
Roxanna Hadadi
So he is dealing with his pain through Lean and then becomes addicted to it. So on the one hand, it is that sort of, like, social commentary. This is something that affects immigrants and citizens and everyone in America story. Right. And then on the other hand, something they said that I thought was really interesting is that it's sort of an anchor to the grief and trauma that he feels about being separated from his father. And I think there is a lot of, like, lingering questions there. The things that you can't ask a parent who is absent.
- [17:48]
Linda Holmes
Right.
- [17:49]
Roxanna Hadadi
And there's this one scene where Mo is drinking the Lean, which is like cough syrup, and I think it's either water or soda and candy in his car.
- [18:00]
Linda Holmes
Yeah.
- [18:01]
Roxanna Hadadi
And he imagines his father next to him. And it is this really sort of somber moment of, am I living up to what you would have wanted? And sort of like, what is the illusion and fantasy of thinking what your parents might want for you?
- [18:18]
Linda Holmes
Right. And at the same time, like you said, there is this kind of grim comedy of the bureaucracy that they are dealing with over the long term, which is kind of the most obvious. You feel like maybe that's gonna be the story of the season. Everything is sort of knitted together in a way I found really satisfying.
- [18:39]
Roxanna Hadadi
I think that the asylum process, again, sort of being this simmering background issue when it comes to the forefront, when they do get their day in court and you find out that they have been waiting for hours in the wrong building, it's just one of those small indignities that is probably so revealing about how a lot of these processes work.
- [19:03]
Linda Holmes
Right.
- [19:03]
Roxanna Hadadi
I mean, all of these things that sort of add up into life changing moments that are a little bit tragic and a little bit funny and you have to sort of walk the line in between them to find truth. I think Mo makes that point over and over again. But there are some other streaming comedies that I think also do this really well. This fool on Hulu, I think is also making a point about what is it like to be someone who is released from prison and is trying to make a new path. I think that, of course, Reservation Dogs is also sort of doing this, finding humor in the indigenous community and the experiences that they have to go through. And I think, no, maybe there isn't a shared Muslim comedy, but I do appreciate that Mo exists and it is giving us a Palestinian perspective and a Muslim perspective on all of these things that so many of us can relate to.
- [20:02]
Linda Holmes
Right. And they have a fair amount of fun at times with his kind of frustration that when he says he's Palestinian, not everybody really understands what that, what he means by that or what the implications of that are. They don't understand necessarily his identity even when he's explaining it.
- [20:21]
Roxanna Hadadi
There's that recurring line. It's a branding issue.
- [20:23]
Linda Holmes
Yeah.
- [20:24]
Roxanna Hadadi
When people assume that what he means by saying he's Palestinian is that he's Israeli.
- [20:28]
Linda Holmes
Yeah.
- [20:29]
Roxanna Hadadi
But I agree with you. There is sort of this recurring. You made chocolate hummus. Like, why are you.
- [20:34]
Linda Holmes
Right.
- [20:35]
Roxanna Hadadi
I mean, chocolate hummus truly is just offensive.
- [20:37]
Linda Holmes
Yeah, just make a chocolate dip. Just make a chocolate pudding.
- [20:40]
Roxanna Hadadi
Yeah, that's fine. Just like mix together like marshmallow fluff and chocolate and like, you're good.
- [20:44]
Linda Holmes
Absolutely, absolutely. Well, we want to know what you think about Mo. Find us@facebook.com PCHHH and that brings us to the end of our show. Roxanna Hadati, thank you so much for being here as always.
- [20:56]
Roxanna Hadadi
Thank you, Linda.
- [20:57]
Linda Holmes
This episode is produced by Candice Lim and Mike Katzeff and edited by Jessica Reedy. Hello. Come in. Provides our theme music. Thank you for listening to Pop Culture Happy Hour from npr. I'm Linda Holmes and we'll see you all tomorrow.
- [21:15]
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