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- [00:00]
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- [00:28]
Ayesha Harris
Stop that Train is what you get if you took the gags a minute silly of Airplane, crossed it with the lighthearted friendship of Barb and Starr, and then filtered it through the bawdy lens of RuPaul's Drag Race. In case it's not clear this is
- [00:42]
Glen Weldon
a good thing, it stars mother herself, RuPaul Charles as the President of the United States. Because of course it does. Along for the ridiculous ride on this runaway train is a cavalcade of Drag Race alumni and comedy heavy hitters who are all here to serve looks and bring the shade. I'm Glenn Weldon.
- [00:58]
Ayesha Harris
And I'm Ayesha Harris. And today we're talking about Stop that Train on Pop Culture Happy hour from NPR.
- [01:07]
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- [02:18]
Ayesha Harris
Joining us today on NPR's Pop Culture Happy Hour is entertainment host, culture commentator and co host of High Key, Ryan Mitchell. Welcome back Ryan.
- [02:27]
Ryan Mitchell
Happy pride everybody.
- [02:28]
Ayesha Harris
Happy pride and happy Stop that Train. The reason I'm saying this is because every word comes with a exclamation point.
- [02:37]
Glen Weldon
No jury in the world will convict you.
- [02:39]
Ryan Mitchell
And to be honest, RuPaul would actually want you to say it like that. So I think you're doing a great job.
- [02:43]
Ayesha Harris
Thank you. I'm just trying to serve mother, as they say. So Stop that Train stars drag queens Jujubee and Ginger Minj as train attendants Dee Dee and Tess.
- [02:55]
Ryan Mitchell
I'm Tess. One time I eat a magnet and get stuck to a flagpole. Dee Dee. I was born with adult teeth.
- [03:01]
Ayesha Harris
Yes. They find themselves unemployed after the budget train line Stink Rail goes out of business. And then they quickly land a new gig aboard the Glamazonian Express, a luxury high speed railway. But a massive stormaganza threatens to make their first trip a bumpy ride. Enter President Gagwell, played by RuPaul, and traffic controller Donna Dusk, played by Rachel Bloom. They step in to help keep this train on its tracks and out of harm's way. Stop that Train is in theaters now. Ryan, tell it to me straight. How do we feel about Stop that Dream?
- [03:36]
Ryan Mitchell
I'm gonna tell it to you. Gay. Yes.
- [03:39]
Ayesha Harris
Thank you.
- [03:41]
Ryan Mitchell
No. I absolutely loved this movie. I was not sure what I was going to get, to be quite honest. I was like, one. I'm shocked that this film is going to theaters. I thought it automatically in my brain was like, wait, it's going to go to a streamer or it's going to be on the World of Wonder app and everyone can kind of take it there. But to know that they sort of got this moment to in theaters at this huge, large stage, I'm like, oh, this is going to be something major. And the cast is stacked. But ultimately I do love it. But it also feels like, okay, if you are a fan of RuPaul's Drag Race, honey, you are watching a rusical in a RuPaul's Drag Race challenge. Lock in because it's about to be wild.
- [04:22]
Ayesha Harris
Yes. Yes. Okay. I love it. Lock in, buckle up, fasten your seatbelts, all that stuff. Glenn, tell it to me however you want to. Straight, gay, whichever way you want. How do we feel?
- [04:32]
Glen Weldon
Yeah. I reviewed this movie for npr and I started out by saying something very similar to what Ryan just said, which is this is a better than average acting challenge on a better than average episode of a better than average season of RuPaul's Drag Race. And, you know, for those who know what that means, that's going to give them an accurate assessment of whether or not they're going to go to the movies, stream it, or avoid it like the plague. Most people, that's not going to mean anything. So if I can break it down for them, I would Say that long ago, back in the elder days when ichthyosaurs swam the turbid seas in the year 1980, a film you already mentioned, Aisha, called Airplane came out. There was a spoof of 70s disaster films which were then very thick on the ground. And it created this formula. The endless barrage of very dumb and very sweaty jokes and a lot of very game celebrity cameos. And all the goofiest jokes were played absolutely straight, with the kind of sort of same weighty intensity that the movies that they were parroting had, because that's why it worked. Except there was this island in the middle of that film, the character of Johnny, who was played by the late, great icon Steven Stucker. He was a guy who worked in the control room, and he was. I was gonna say he was coded as gay. There was no code. You didn't need an enigma machine to decrypt, like, flamingly gay. And if you're a queer person in that audience, and even as a queer kid, you see him come on screen, you kind of go into a defensive crouch because it is 1980, and you're just waiting there for a lot of really hateful, lazy jokes at Johnny's expense. Except not. Johnny is so charming and funny and he's such a chaos gremlin that you start to realize that everyone in the audience, including your parents, who never met a lazy, hateful, gay joke they didn't love, they're laughing with him, not at him. He's not the butt of the joke. He's our friend. He's bringing us into the movie. He's breaking the fourth wall. And what people are reacting to is not the gay stereotype, but this guy is just free and he's himself and he's hilarious. So I'll just put it this way. This movie is Airplane. Dumb jokes, celebrity cameos and real talk. A lot of the very same gags. We gotta. Yeah, let's be on. A lot of the very same gags.
- [06:42]
Ryan Mitchell
Oh, my goodness.
- [06:43]
Ayesha Harris
Yes. Yes.
- [06:43]
Glen Weldon
But it's Airplane. It was nothing but the Johnny bits. And that is a winning formula for me. But, Aisha, when I talked about this movie in, like, our summer preview, you expressed some, like, you know, enthusiasm for it. And I was surprised by that because. Well, I wasn't. Because I assumed from that that you must watch Drag Race.
- [06:59]
Ayesha Harris
No.
- [07:00]
Glen Weldon
But I learned that you don't. I don't.
- [07:03]
Ryan Mitchell
Really?
- [07:03]
Ayesha Harris
No.
- [07:04]
Glen Weldon
And then I learned that, well, she must have seen the trailer. But then I. Well, you avoid trailers. Famously. You avoid trailers. So how did this movie. Where did your enthusiasm come from.
- [07:13]
Ayesha Harris
Okay, so first, I will say I have seen exactly, like, approximately a half of an episode of Drag Race. One time when I was at a gay bar in Puerto Rico, and they were showing an episode that feels right. And so, like. But it was still. It was a bar. So it's like, there's only so much attention that can be paid when you are, you know.
- [07:30]
Glen Weldon
Oh, you missed the Byzantine nuances.
- [07:32]
Ayesha Harris
Yes, I did. I haven't avoided Drag Race for any particular reason. It's just. It feels, at this point, I guess, overwhelming. And everyone I talk to tells me a different season to start, and I don't know where to start, so I just haven't. But the thing is, I actually did see this trailer. It's a good trailer because I follow RuPaul on Instagram. And so it popped up, and I was like, what is this? And then I was like, what is this?
- [07:54]
Ryan Mitchell
And then I was like, yes, I want this. This is like, the one time your algorithm actually did you a favor.
- [08:00]
Glen Weldon
Yeah, yeah.
- [08:01]
Ayesha Harris
And so. And also learning that this was written by Christina Friel and Connor Wright. They're credited with the script here. They wrot a TV special, Christmas special that I very much enjoyed, the Bitch who Stole Christmas, which also stars RuPaul. So I'm like a RuPaul fan, just not within the context of Drag Race. I know that sounds strange, but that's where we are. And I very much enjoy this movie. Like you said, Glenn, it's like Airplane, but with just, like, a distinctly queer sensibility. And I loved so many things about it. I loved the many recurring gags, the many faces that. That we see. Sarah Michelle Gellar pops up here doing a fun bit. We got some great songs. We've got Rachel Bloom. Rachel Bloom. I love Rachel Bloom so much. She is kind of for me. And of course, she's, like, the straight person in this movie, but she really is, for me, kind of the surprise. I was surprised at how much I enjoyed her. Not because I haven't enjoyed her in the past, but I was just like, oh, they're really giving Rachel Bloom a lot to do here. And she can play with it. She can play against all these characters. Her and RuPaul have great chemist. She's just a delight. So I loved this. But I also feel like the problem. And I think, Glenn, you put this really, really well, and you articulated it well, but I always come up against this issue when talking about spoof movies, because it's like, how do you talk about this? Like, it's just gags, you know? And on top of that, it's like, it depends on what your humor is and how you respond to that. Ryan, I'm curious, like, outside of the RuPaul world, are you a spoof person? Do you enjoy spoof movies? Or, like, what about this made you excited about it, besides the drag race aspect of it, if anything?
- [09:49]
Ryan Mitchell
Yeah, I mean, when I think of spoof movies, I think of movies like Scary Movie, you know, And I love some of the earlier ones, but if we're talking about the newest one, please throw it away. And it just doesn't work. But because this is rooted, like, specifically in queer culture, and there's just like, oh, my God, I've had these either conversations or made these jokes or have seen this. It just feels like home. It felt like I was literally hanging out with friends, and we were all sort of, like, having the same joke. I think that is what really makes it work here. Because here's the thing. If you are really not someone that is necessarily a Drag Race fan, or if you don't, like, really have queer friends or you're in queer community, this may be like, what is this sort of deviant movie that is full of RuPaul literally running over a toddler and a train, you know what I mean? There's some things that you just won't understand because you're too serious. And I think queer culture allows you to sort of laugh at the things that you've sort of been, like, made fun of for so long. And I think for a spoof movie, this is actually quite perfect. And I think it's why the show RuPaul's Drag Race has worked for so long, because it embraces stupidity. And for me, when it's done really well, it just works. And there were moments in this film that I felt like, okay, this gag is going on, like, five, ten minutes, way too long. But other times, I felt like, oh, this felt really wonderful. It felt like, oh, my God, I'm leaving this film with multiple quotes that I'm going to say at all times, like vocal stems. So I think that's what makes a good spoof movie, because if you're not able to make fun of people or make fun of, like, stereotypes, well, it won't hit. It'll actually offend everyone, you know what I mean? And just will be like, oh, this was gross. Like, what is this? And I think other spoof movies, in my opinion, have sort of turned me off in that way where I've been like, okay, this could have been smarter. I need stupidity and smartness in my spoof movies. If it's not there, then girl, throw it away.
- [11:47]
Glen Weldon
Exactly. I mean, this movie benefits from two things. One, the joke density, which is like that of a neutron star. This is a very joke dense movie. And so the signal to noise ratio is gonna work out. Cause if this one didn't work, the next one might. It's also benefiting from the fact that something you mentioned is that I kind of went into this thinking I know exactly what this is gonna be. Cause some of these movies, and certainly a lot of acting challenges, nothing but references, Easter eggs, callbacks to things on Drag Race. And, you know, if 24 seasons of family Guy have taught us nothing, it's that references are not jokes. There's a difference. And this thing has some really well constructed, solid, but really dumb. Those are not mutually exclusive, really dumb jokes. Not just shout. I mean, there's some shout outs to like Drag Race catchphrases, but they're there to add seasoning. They're there for the nerds without shutting out the normal.
- [12:44]
Ayesha Harris
And Lea Michele catches a stray too, which I found hilarious.
- [12:47]
Ryan Mitchell
Catches a stray. The best stray, actually. And like, you know, this is how
- [12:52]
Glen Weldon
this movie is like a Marvel movie. It's one of many ways this movie is. It's there for the nerds, but the normals can kind of get it too and shut out.
- [12:59]
Ayesha Harris
I also think, to your point, Ryan, like, the question of why is this in theaters? Or like the shock that it's in theaters. Like, just what I know about the Drag Race fandom and the fact that, like I said, I was watching this at a bar and like, there are bars and communal spaces all over the world that are watching. And it is a communal experience. And so I can imagine. I did not watch this in a theater, but I can imagine this is the type of movie, like, if you're gonna go see it, you wanna see it with as many people as possible.
- [13:29]
Glen Weldon
Definitely.
- [13:30]
Ayesha Harris
Honestly, most spoof movies, that's kind of how I feel. Because you want that collective experience of laughing at something dumb. And if you're doing it when just by yourself, or maybe with one other person, it doesn't quite hit the same.
- [13:41]
Ryan Mitchell
But that's what makes this so interesting, though, because RuPaul's Drag Race, this is not accurate, but has been on for like 738 seasons. There is like an over saturation, like, to, you know, this show where a lot of people and a lot of the commentary, either from Queens or, like, fans of the show have been like, oh, I think after the 20th season of Drag Race, they may need to take a break for a little bit and revamp and then come back. So there is, like, sort of this tiredness of just the constant cycle, because it's not just RuPaul's Drag Race. It's all stars, it's globals, it's international seasons. And so, for me, when I saw that it was coming to theaters, I was like, wow, this is yet another example of how much RuPaul loves capitalism and is willing to make sure that he is everywhere. The brand is everywhere, World of Wonder is everywhere. I mean, even in the film, you see someone playing the RuPaul's Drag Race game. In the film, that's a classic Drag Race sort of like, callback, because the show is full of, you know, RuPaul's iconic music. By the way, RuPaul's discography is quite amazing. I want y' all to get into it. It is, but it's this cycle of just being like. It's like for Ru Bhairu. And so it's. I'm interested in seeing if people do go to the theaters to see this film, because there is, unfortunately, so much drama surrounding it. It's not even out yet. You know, it will be out by the time this has aired, but. But it's going to be really interesting with the juxtaposition of just people's sort of exhaustion overall with the show, if I'm being quite honest.
- [15:16]
Ayesha Harris
Okay, well, I do also want to talk a little bit or ask you all about the look of this, because the look also feels kind of much of the special effects, to me, kind of felt rendered as though it was like Windows 95, but on purpose. What do we make of the way this movie looks? There's this whole discourse that's unfolded online about AI and this movie. And the distributor confirmed there's a mix of CGI effects with some shots enhanced by AI. And it doesn't look like this is not what I would say is, like, mainstream, broad appeal. This is, like lo fi kind of tacky, but deliberately so. Ryan, I'm curious. You're nodding.
- [15:58]
Ryan Mitchell
Yeah, no, because I completely agree, actually. Like, I was sort of happy I
- [16:03]
Ayesha Harris
didn't see this in a.
- [16:05]
Ryan Mitchell
Because it was meant perfectly for a screener link. I felt that because there is so much conversation around possibilities of usage of AI in this film, of course, like, the team speaking out against that. It's just so interesting to me around, like, oh, RuPaul's Drag Race is such a place that's supposed to be all about, like, authenticity and like, you know, protecting queer art. It just gives me like, the ick when I do know and see something like this. Especially when you get your big breakup being in a theater that you're sort of cutting corners and it feels that way. There is a way where, yes, there could have been different decisions being made, in my opinion, over this.
- [16:46]
Glen Weldon
Yeah, yeah. At the end of the day, I'm old enough I don't know the difference between CGI and AI, really. I mean, I'm used to thinking that CGI looks muddy and AI Slop looks too clean, too bright, too sharp. And this errs on my humble estimation in the latter category there. But, you know, at the end of the day, it's exactly your point, Aisha. It looks tacky, it looks cheap, it looks low rent, which is should. That's the vibe. That's the aesthetic they're going for here. It doesn't look cheap and shoddy like it would in 1975 if they made this, you know, using practical sets and practical effects. But it looks cheap by today's standards. And I don't know, that kind of served the whole hey, Queens, let's put on a show vibe for me.
- [17:30]
Ryan Mitchell
Do you think they were actually intentional about it looking cheap and tacky?
- [17:33]
Glen Weldon
I kind of think so.
- [17:35]
Ayesha Harris
How could they not be? Right?
- [17:37]
Ryan Mitchell
That's what I'm saying, though. I genuinely feel like it's intentional for them to be like, oh, this is what this world looks like at such a. Like a high gloss angle of what this film could look like. But I don't know. I think they actually do think it looks really good.
- [17:53]
Ayesha Harris
Oh, interesting. Well, now we're just trying to get into their heads, but I don't.
- [17:57]
Ryan Mitchell
True, true, true.
- [17:58]
Glen Weldon
And Latrice Royale did an interview where she said Shankman was very clear with us not to contour. He didn't want us to have, like, sharp lines on our face, which tells me that he knew exactly how digital production would look and he was doing everything he could to soften it and make it look as good as possible in the realm of drag.
- [18:20]
Ayesha Harris
Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [18:22]
Ryan Mitchell
I mean, I still think everyone should see it. I think it's like, hilarious film and, you know, go see it with your friends.
- [18:28]
Ayesha Harris
Friends and enhancements. That is what we are. Such thing.
- [18:34]
Glen Weldon
This is coming out in theaters? Yes, it's coming out in theaters opposite a science fiction film by Steven Spielberg. So, I mean, you can call that counter programming or you can call that getting buried. I don't know. We'll see how it works out. But the only aspect to this movie that felt a little, I don't wanna say watered down, widened out for a mainstream audience is that look, you got drag queens on screen trading barbs, flaring their nostrils, slapping the bejesus out of each other. I felt like those barbs were a little placeholdery. They were cutting, but feeling like they should really lacerate, draw blood. And I felt like maybe we were hanging back, like we were on the threshold of the gay sex dungeon, but we were kind of lingering in the doorway, you know, just for the sake of the random straight stuff who might wander into the theater by mistake. But that's why I kind of felt like that was their eye towards box office. Ryan, do you get what I'm saying here? Does that resonate?
- [19:35]
Ryan Mitchell
I do. I do feel the same way. Because if RuPaul and this team wanted to push it, they could have pushed it. But I do think there was probably a reeling in of being like, all right, if we want to make this. Actually, this goes to a larger conversation about the mainstream ness of, like, drag and how drag race has sort of come into the everyday conversation of everyone. Right. Like, a lot of people don't.
- [19:56]
Ayesha Harris
Yeah. You mean drag brunch. Yeah, the proliferation of drag brunch.
- [20:01]
Ryan Mitchell
Yeah, exactly. Like, there's some. There has to be some editing that and some refinement that, you know, people at Masses can take, which sort of takes away, for me, the charm, because it's like, you were right there. Go over the finish line, and if you're gonna give me something completely disgusting, just do it, because I'm going to live for it, but because it feels like they're trying. Trying to make this palatable for all audiences. It's sort of like, why not just go to the audience that, you know is going to want to see this movie and actually, like, be very excited to see some of the OGs of Drag Race and some of the new phases and some of, like, their favorite, like, iconic, like, celebrities and queer icons and things like that. Like, just do it and not have to worry about sort of oddly, code switching in your films. It feels like a version of that in some ways.
- [20:53]
Ayesha Harris
Yeah.
- [20:54]
Glen Weldon
To Ryan's point, I mean, like, RuPaul always has an eye toward the bottom line. She wants to be as big as possible. So, yes, she's in the same queer cinema space as John Waters. She's never gonna be John Waters. She's never gonna try to be John Waters. She's always gonna pull back and have an eye for a wider reception, and good for her. I will say one thing, though. Like, if you feel inclined to see this movie, go see this movie. You'll be helping out your local theater. You'll be helping out the good folks at Bleecker street, the distributor. You'll be helping out Queer Cinema writ large. You'll be also be helping out Dragon as it manifests on RuPaul's Drag Race. And that's great, but, you know, if you're already out and about, think about, keep the night going and maybe take in a real drag show in your town. Get out your paper money. Go tip these performers who are sweating through their foundations for you. Because despite the success of Drag Race, as the show's gone on, this is something Ryan was talking about. It has highlighted and promoted a very. I will generously say a very bespoke definition of drag. And drag as an art form writ large is under threat. So spread the love to these performers who may not conform to a very specific, I'll go to say, niche demands of the Drag Race competition. Get out there. You're already out. Have a great time. Even a drag brunch.
- [22:04]
Ayesha Harris
Go to a drag brunch and try to support your local drag kings, not just your queens. I'm just saying.
- [22:10]
Ryan Mitchell
Absolutely, absolutely. Oh, my God. Shout out to King Molasses, one of my favorite drag kings. There you go.
- [22:15]
Ayesha Harris
There we go. There we go. Well, I think we've all said you should stop at that train line. Go see. Stop that train. I don't. I'm bad at metaphors. You know what I mean? This is the Glamazonian Express. It's not the stank rail. We enjoyed it. I would watch another one of these. It was very fun.
- [22:33]
Glen Weldon
Sure.
- [22:33]
Ryan Mitchell
I really did want to see what the stank rail looked like, though. Even more like I was like, I really need to see someone on this stank rail.
- [22:40]
Ayesha Harris
Yeah. I mean, there you go. We could have. I think. I think I could have handled the Steak Grill. I think I could have handled seeing it. RuPaul, you've deprived us. Well, that brings us to the end of our show. Ryan Mitchell, Glen Weldon, thanks so much for being here. This was so, so fun.
- [22:59]
Ryan Mitchell
Thank you for having me.
- [23:00]
Announcer
Thank you.
- [23:01]
Ayesha Harris
And just a reminder that signing up for Pop Culture Happy Hour plus is such a great way to support our show and public radio. You get to listen to all of our episodes sponsor free. So go find out more at plus.npr.org happyaur or visit the link in our show Notes. This episode was produced by Liz Metzger and Mike Katsip and edited by our showrunner, Jessica Reedy.
- [23:22]
Ryan Mitchell
Hello.
- [23:22]
Ayesha Harris
Come in provides our theme music and thank you for listening to Pop Culture Happy Hour from npr. I'm Aisha Harris. We'll see you all next time.
- [23:34]
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- [24:33]
Glen Weldon
I spoke with Alon Cohen, who heads research and development at UFC Insights Engine is not here to feel technical. We are bringing it to a place where you feel like you could even have an opinion because you understand enough of what's going on.
- [24:48]
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