We Fantasy Cast The Traitors

Summary

Pop Culture Happy Hour: We Fantasy Cast The Traitors
Released February 18, 2025

In the February 18, 2025 episode of NPR’s Pop Culture Happy Hour, hosts Linda Holmes, Glen Weldon, Stephen Thompson, and Aisha Harris delve into the intricacies of the reality show The Traitors, currently streaming its third season on Peacock. This episode, titled "We Fantasy Cast The Traitors", offers an engaging discussion where the hosts creatively cast their ideal participants for an upcoming season, blending real-life celebrities and iconic characters to enhance the show's dynamic of deception and strategy.

Understanding The Traitors

The Traitors is a reality competition that pits a group of participants against each other in a game of trust and betrayal. Hosted by the charismatic Alan Cumming, the show features celebrities navigating a castle where secretly appointed "traitors" work to eliminate the "faithful" through covert strategies. The faithful aim to identify and banish the traitors in order to win the grand prize.

Aisha Harris introduces the show by highlighting its blend of "treachery, foolishness, good and bad strategy", along with Alan Cumming's distinctive outfits (03:34). Glen Weldon echoes this sentiment, noting the show's knack for continually sourcing notable reality TV stars (04:46).

Fantasy Casting the Next Season

The centerpiece of the episode revolves around the hosts’ imaginative casting choices for the next season of The Traitors. Each host presents unique selections, drawing from a mix of sports figures, reality TV personalities, and even beloved fictional characters.

Glen Weldon’s Picks: Rob Gronkowski and Marshawn Lynch

Glen begins by emphasizing the importance of casting individuals who embody both strategic acumen and the endearing qualities of a lovable oaf. He suggests:

• Rob Gronkowski, the former NFL tight end known for his exuberant personality and media presence. Glen envisions Gronk battling seasoned strategists with his "wide-eyed man child" persona, predicting that his antics would provide "TV gold" (05:56).

  • "Gronk doing battle with Survivor strategists and duplicitous housewives... would be TV gold." – Glen Weldon (06:24)

• Marshawn Lynch, the former running back renowned for his strategic mind and gruff demeanor. Despite his reputation, Glen believes Lynch’s "ruthlessly practical and logical" nature would make him a formidable traitor, capable of "sowing chaos" within the game (07:26).

  • "Marshawn Lynch is gonna be a lot better TV than Gronk. That's just my instinct." – Unknown Speaker (08:18)

Glen’s selections aim to blend humor with strategic depth, anticipating intense interactions and unexpected alliances.

Aisha Harris’s Picks: Jonathan Penner

Aisha takes a different route by selecting Jonathan Penner, a notable contestant from Survivor. She praises Penner’s strategic prowess and his ability to navigate complex social dynamics:

• "He is ruthlessly practical and logical while also having no patience for people who are jerks." – Aisha Harris (15:53)

• Aisha recounts Penner’s impactful gameplay in Survivor: Cook Islands, where his strategic veto of an alliance moved him to fame. She believes Penner’s "incredibly strategic" yet "irritable and emotional" personality would add a layer of tension and depth to The Traitors (17:12).

  • "He is a really fun presence in something like this because he is incredibly strategic, but he also gets on people's nerves." – Aisha Harris (17:50)

Her choice underscores the blend of strategy and interpersonal drama that The Traitors thrives on.

Linda Holmes’s Pick: Tiffany Pollard (“New York”)

Linda Holmes brings a nostalgic twist by proposing Tiffany Pollard, also known as "New York" from Flavor of Love. She highlights Tiffany’s flamboyant personality and chaotic nature as perfect traits for stirring up the game:

• "She was trying to find a woman to date him and... she was the one person who was like, I'm gonna be the bad woman in this house." – Linda Holmes (09:17)

• Linda believes Tiffany’s "diva behavior" and "off the cuff comments" would introduce both chaos and entertainment, making her an unpredictable and engaging contestant (12:48).

  • "I think we need Tiffany. We need someone who’s gonna give off the cuff comments who actually might get very confused as well, but in a different way than the oafs and will just bring a little bit of fun to the game..." – Linda Holmes (12:48)

Her choice reflects the desire to inject high-energy drama and unapologetic personality into The Traitors.

The Muppet Twist: Kermit the Frog

Adding a whimsical element to the fantasy casting, the hosts entertain the idea of including Kermit the Frog from The Muppets. The playful banter explores both the logistical challenges and the entertainment value of having such an iconic character navigate the complexities of The Traitors:

• "Kermit is humble in a castle full of people with very inflated senses of selves... he would make a great faithful who gets recruited as a traitor partway through the season." – Glenn Weldon (18:25)

• Aisha humorously suggests alternative Muppets like Miss Piggy and Animal, each bringing their unique flair to the game (20:57).

  • "Miss Piggy and Animal in three different ways are all extra. And extra doesn't get you very far in the show." – Unknown Speaker (21:05)

While recognizing the playful nature of this suggestion, the hosts acknowledge how incorporating such characters would require creative production solutions but ultimately agree it would add a distinct layer of entertainment.

Dynamic Interactions and Potential Storylines

The hosts speculate how their fantasy cast members would interact within the game’s framework. For instance, Linda anticipates engaging dynamics between Tiffany Pollard and other strong personalities, such as Boston Rob from Survivor:

• "Miss Piggy and Tiffany Pollard together... yes, please, let's make that happen." – Linda Holmes (23:07)

Glenn envisions strategic alliances and rivalries, while Aisha emphasizes the humorous and dramatic potential of these unique cast members, highlighting how their diverse backgrounds and personalities could lead to unpredictable and compelling television.

Conclusion: A Blend of Strategy and Entertainment

The episode concludes with the hosts celebrating their imaginative casting choices, each bringing a different element to The Traitors—from strategic minds like Marshawn Lynch and Jonathan Penner to the vivacious and unpredictable Tiffany Pollard. The inclusion of a fictional character like Kermit the Frog adds a layer of humor and creativity, showcasing the hosts' enthusiasm for blending reality with fantasia.

Aisha encourages listeners to participate in future fantasy castings, fostering an interactive community around the show. The episode wraps up with a lighthearted reminder from Linda about supporting Pop Culture Happy Hour through subscriptions, ensuring listeners stay engaged with their favorite pop culture discussions.

Notable Quotes:

• "Gronk doing battle with Survivor strategists and duplicitous housewives... would be TV gold." – Glen Weldon (06:24)
• "Marshawn Lynch is gonna be a lot better TV than Gronk. That's just my instinct." – Unknown Speaker (08:18)
• "He is ruthlessly practical and logical while also having no patience for people who are jerks." – Aisha Harris (15:53)
• "I think we need Tiffany. We need someone who’s gonna give off the cuff comments..." – Linda Holmes (12:48)
• "Miss Piggy and Animal in three different ways are all extra. And extra doesn't get you very far in the show." – Unknown Speaker (21:05)
• "Miss Piggy and Tiffany Pollard together... yes, please, let's make that happen." – Linda Holmes (23:07)

This episode of Pop Culture Happy Hour not only offers a creative exploration of casting for The Traitors but also underscores the enduring appeal of reality competition shows. By blending celebrities, strategic minds, and fictional characters, the hosts provide a comprehensive and entertaining vision of what could make the next season of The Traitors a standout in the reality TV landscape.

Transcript

[Linda Holmes]

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[Stephen Thompson]

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[Aisha Harris]

The reality show the Traitors, now in its third season, continues to be a delightful mix of treachery, foolishness, good and bad strategy and Alan Cummings outfits.

[Glenn Weldon]

But with the way they're ripping through our supply of reality stars, are they gonna run out of good casting ideas? No. No they are not because we are here with some fresh inspiration. I'm Stephen Thompson.

[Aisha Harris]

And I'm L. Holmes. And today on NPR's Pop Culture Happy Hour, we are fantasy casting the next season of the Traders.

[Linda Holmes]

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[Stephen Thompson]

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[Aisha Harris]

Joining us today are our fellow co hosts, Aisha Harris. Hello, Aisha.

[L. Holmes]

Here and ready for murder, my friends.

[Aisha Harris]

And also Glenn Weldon. Hello, Glenn.

[Unknown Speaker]

Hi. Greetings, Lind holes.

[L. Holmes]

Very good.

[Aisha Harris]

I appreciate the fact that both of you went with the accent.

[Unknown Speaker]

Went at the accent.

[L. Holmes]

Yes, yes, yes.

[Unknown Speaker]

Hurled ourselves against the accent.

[Aisha Harris]

I love it. So the traitors exists not only in the United States, but in several other countries as well. It streams here on Peacock and the cast this year included 23 celebrities, including four survivors, four real housewives, representatives of the Bachelor franchise, Tom Sandoval from la Fair, Vanderpump rules, a former WWE wrestler, Zac Efron's brother, Britney Spears ex husband, and I am not making this up. The aristocrat host Alan Cumming takes them through a game where a small number of secretly appointed traitors among them meets in private to figuratively murder members of the rest of the group. And the whole group meets together to banish somebody who they think is a traitor. So basically, the traitors are trying to keep it a secret that they're traitors and the rest of the players who are faithfuls are trying to identify and banish the traitors, if that makes sense. Not every version of the traitors around the world relies exclusively on celebrities or celebrity ish product. But it's not really surprising that that is how we do it here. In celebration of that fact, we decided that we would get together and each suggest someone that we would cast if we were in charge of putting together the for a future season. Steven, I'm gonna start with you. Who did you choose to go on the Traders?

[Glenn Weldon]

Okay, so thinking about this assignment made me think about the secret ingredients that make the traders great. It's not just dazzling trader play. It's not just master strategists from other reality shows. It's not people who turn out to be great at strategy that you wouldn't expect to be great at strategy like pilot Pete from the Bachelor or Zac Efron's brother this season. It's not just people reading social cues and sett strategic traps. Part of why I love the traitors is that they know to also cast people who have no idea what's going on. As much as I love watching someone like Surrey Fields from Survivor or pilot Pete from the Bachelor turn out to be great at the traitors I also love watching people where you're basically watching someone lose at tic tac toe against a simple barnyard chicken. My version of fantasy casting the traitors is to tap into America Strategic Oaf Preserve to find the next Ryan Lochte, the next Tom Sandoval, the next mostly harmless lunk who's gonna bug his eyes out and be like, I knew Boston Rob was a traitor after like six episodes where Boston Rob was obviously a traitor. So my pick, next in line from the Strategic Oaf Preserve, former NFL tight end Rob Gronkowski.

[Unknown Speaker]

Okay, okay.

[L. Holmes]

I have no idea who that is, but I basically.

[Glenn Weldon]

Gronk's whole deal. You've seen him in commercials and whatnot. He does these USAA commercials and his whole Persona is that he's kind of a wide eyed man child to me. Gronk doing battle with Survivor strategists and duplicitous housewives.

[Aisha Harris]

The fact that they call him Gronk and it really seems appropriate, kind of gives you the feel of the guy.

[L. Holmes]

I mean, it reminds me of Kronk from Emperors in Greece, of course.

[Glenn Weldon]

And honestly, that's not too far Persona wise. They're actually pretty similar. But anyway, like, watching him do battle with people who are actually good at the traitors would be TV gold. And I would be stunned if they haven't already driven a dump truck full of money up to his house to get him to join the next cast.

[Aisha Harris]

Yeah, it's very believable.

[Glenn Weldon]

Also to me, the more you set this up as an archetype, the more you can surprise people with folks who appear to be dummies but are actually great at the game and might actually be great at being traitors. You would never make Gronk a traitor. I don't think. This is where I would offer a bonus. Bonus recommendation. Former running back Marshawn Lynch.

[L. Holmes]

Ooh, yes, I know him.

[Unknown Speaker]

Oh, see, yeah, he'd be good.

[Aisha Harris]

Too Smart, I think. Too crafty, I think.

[Glenn Weldon]

But this is the thing.

[Unknown Speaker]

So you make him a traitor.

[Glenn Weldon]

This is the thing. This is why I think people would think he was part of the Strategic Oaf Preserve. But actually he's not only very funny, but I think he would be good at being a traitor.

[Aisha Harris]

Well, and I will say there was an improv comedy show, I don't know if you remember this, on Netflix, where they were doing like a crime of the week. It was Will Arnett.

[L. Holmes]

Yes.

[Aisha Harris]

It was like a bunch of comedians and Marshawn Lynch. And the funniest thing about it was that the person who fared the best in the improv I thought was Marshawn Lynch. So the relationship between reality show contestanting and improv is. You know, there's some overlap, so I get it. I'm with you, Steven.

[Unknown Speaker]

Not only do I think you have successfully predicted the next season of this show, I gotta say, Marshawn lynch is gonna be a lot better TV than Gronk. That's just my instinct.

[Glenn Weldon]

They're very, very different. But I think one way you sneak Marshawn lynch in as a traitor is by setting up the archetype of the oaf. I'm just saying, in general, I love oves on traitors. I want Gronk next, and then I want Marshawn lynch, who is actually no oaf.

[Aisha Harris]

I get that.

[L. Holmes]

Yeah.

[Glenn Weldon]

I just love to watch a guy get confused.

[L. Holmes]

Yeah.

[Unknown Speaker]

Your criteria is mouth breather.

[Aisha Harris]

Yes, that's true.

[L. Holmes]

All right.

[Aisha Harris]

I love that pick, Steven. I love that pick, and I love, namely, Marshawn Lynch. Aisha, who did you choose?

[L. Holmes]

Okay, so let's be real. I started watching Traitors with season two, and my reality TV diet is not the same as what usually shows up on Traitors. So especially this current season, I knew absolutely no one on this show.

[Aisha Harris]

I didn't know a lot.

[L. Holmes]

Yeah, I was familiar with Bob the Drag Queen, and. Oh, actually, once Wes came on, I was like, oh, Wes. Yes. I watched the challenge for, like, far too long. So that's it. And the joy of the show, I think, is that, like, I don't have to know, because everyone is a type, and you learn the type within the first episode and you know who they are.

[Unknown Speaker]

Absolutely.

[L. Holmes]

So it was a little tough for me to kind of figure out, okay, who would. I think, like, let me reach back into the recesses of my mind when I was watching more of these types of reality shows, back when I was watching, you know, Surreal Life, various Rock of Love, Flavor of love, whatever from VH1. That era.

[Aisha Harris]

Charm School.

[L. Holmes]

Yes, Charm School. And I finally landed upon none other than Tiffany Pollard, AKA New York.

[Glenn Weldon]

Oh, sure.

[L. Holmes]

From the first couple of seasons of Flavor of Love, now she was the breakout star of that show. She was unhinged in her commitment to being the winner. And, oh, I should set this up for people who probably do have no idea what I'm talking about. Flavor Flav, who recently has had a renaissance, a resurgence in the culture, and who I actually thought of first for this. And then I was like, flavor Flav's too good for this show. I don't want him in this Reality show world anymore. Leave him out of it. But on that show, which was a kind of spinoff of the Surreal Life, because he was on that show, he was trying to find a woman to date him and, you know, become his girlfriend or whatever. And Tiffany was nicknamed New York. And she became the one person who was like, I'm gonna be the bad woman in this house. I'm going to be. She was the Omarosa, except it was less fraught because there were lots of other black women. She wasn't the sole black woman, so there were lots of different types of black women. So it was like, I was okay with it. It's fine. She had many infamous moments, including one of the other contestants claiming that her friends said that she reminds them of Beyonce.

[Aisha Harris]

Beyonce.

[L. Holmes]

Beyonce. Beyonce. You know, who you really. And part of why I think that she would be good on a show like Traitors is because do I think that she would necessarily be good as a traitor or a faithful? The problem is, is that, like, she was known for being sort of the bad person. The one who, like, doesn't give any. Cares about what anyone thinks of her, is proud of that. And I think when you come onto a show like Traitors, oftentimes people are gonna think that you're probably a traitor, which is not helpful, because then they're all gonna be gunning for you. But also, if you're a faithful, people are still gonna think you. And then it's like, oh, like, how do you play this? I don't know if she'd be actually good at this game, but what she would be good at is giving us at least two to three episodes of just pure gold of entertainment. In the same way, Steven, you, like watching the oafs go, you know, try, like, just talk themselves into the complete wrong person. I love when we have a little bit of, like, you know, some diva behavior and we have some, like, the Housewives, I think they get an unfair wrath. They're often not that bad. Like, everyone kind of gangs up on the Housewives in a weird way. But I think it would all kind of maybe turn to Tiffany. And let's be real, she's grown. At least she's done other, you know, reality shows. I think she would provide the comedy, the gold. I think, you know, maybe a comparable former, you know, traitor guest was probably, like, maybe Phaedra. And Phaedra actually turned out to be pretty good as a traitor.

[Aisha Harris]

She was fun to watch.

[L. Holmes]

Yeah, she was fun to watch.

[Linda Holmes]

Yeah.

[L. Holmes]

I think we need that. I think we need Tiffany. We need someone who likes is gonna give off the cuff comments who actually might get very confused as well, but in a different way than the oafs and will just bring a little bit of fun to the game in a way that we haven't quite seen before. So I want New York. I want Tiffany Pollard. I miss her.

[Glenn Weldon]

I like this pick.

[Unknown Speaker]

I like this pick.

[Aisha Harris]

Yeah, I like this pick too. I think that era of MTV and VH1 like reality shows is a very specific moment that the fact that there was not only Rock of Love but then there was Rock of Love bust. Yes, I'm glad to see that branch of reality shows represented because it hasn't been.

[Unknown Speaker]

If we can pinpoint a traitor behavior and I think that's an open question but if you can, it's the sowing of chaos. And Tiffany that is her metier.

[Aisha Harris]

Yes.

[Unknown Speaker]

Chaos is her. Is the very air that she breathes.

[Aisha Harris]

Love that. Love that. All right, Tiffany Pollard, thank you very much. Aisha Harris. The best way to explain my pick is to remind you that we once had a comedy series, the beginning of which went she was working at a bridal shop, the Blush and Queen. Her boyfriend kissed her out in one of those crushing scenes.

[Glenn Weldon]

Yeah, she's pretty busy.

[Aisha Harris]

I am not suggesting we get Fran Drescher. What you need to know is that in the song and she says till her boyfriend kicked her out in one of those crushing scenes. The boyfriend was played on the Nanny eventually by a stunning blue eyed actor by the name of Jonathan Penner. And Jonathan Penner then went on to appear three times on Survivor.

[Glenn Weldon]

One of my all time favorite Survivor contestants.

[Aisha Harris]

He played Survivor three times? Yeah, he played Survivor. And it wasn't the very beginning he played in the 13th season.

[Glenn Weldon]

No, he played Cook Islands.

[Aisha Harris]

Cook Islands, which is the famous separate the teams by race.

[L. Holmes]

Oh, God.

[Aisha Harris]

Yes. And then he was again on the 16th season, fans versus favorites. He went home early with an injury that season. Very, very sad for me. And then on the 25th season, which was in the Philippines, he never won, but particularly in Cook Islands, he very much changed the direction of that season. And the thing about him is he is ruthlessly practical and logical while also having no patience for people who are jerks. And that combination has always been irresistible to me. Without getting too into the weeds, what happened in the in the Cook island season is that Jonathan was part of an alliance that was the theoretical majority. But he found out that because of one of the game's little quirks, this immunity idol that they have, if they voted the way that they planned to his majority group, it might backfire and he himself might be voted out. So he prevailed on his team. He said, we have to change the plan. We can't do that because I will end up voted out if we do this. They blew him off. They thought he was just being paranoid. They said, oh, you know, and he was very conflicted about what to do. And I found his ways of describing it very funny. And I. And I brought a clip.

[Linda Holmes]

Oh, yes.

[Unknown Speaker]

Either way, people are going to be pissed. Either I'll have betrayed the railroad people and I'm a complete bastard or I didn't jump over to the ITU people and I'm a complete bastard who screwed them twice. I don't know what I'm going to do.

[L. Holmes]

Is that in D or work accent I'm detecting?

[Aisha Harris]

I assume.

[L. Holmes]

I assume sounded very New York.

[Aisha Harris]

The result was that he did switch sides to protect himself. He voted out a member of his own team. I mean, he definitely was very imperiled by the situation, but he also just really didn't like the people who are on his own team because they were jerks. So he flipped. His team got very angry in part because they were sure that the person he thought had the idol didn't, unaware that that person had actually showed the idol to Jonathan. So he already knew they had the idol.

[Unknown Speaker]

If I didn't throw in with them, they all would have voted for me. You all would have voted for Yule and it would have bounced off Yule and hit me.

[Aisha Harris]

Not if you told us about that. He doesn't have the idol.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yul does have the idol. He showed me the idol. I don't know what you think you're talking about.

[Aisha Harris]

Oh, those little loser noises where it goes. So the thing that makes this wonderful for traitor's purposes is that the person in that clip who is saying he doesn't have the idol is one Parvati Shallow.

[Glenn Weldon]

Yep.

[Aisha Harris]

Parvati shallow, Survivor later decided was a genius and a brilliant player and she had a couple seasons where she played very well. However, in this season, she was completely just defeated soundly by specifically this move by him. I very, very much like him. He is a guy I did meet a couple times at survivor parties back when I used to cover Survivor. He's a lovely person, but more to the point, I just think he's a really fun presence in something like this because he is incredibly strategic, but he also gets on people's nerves.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yes.

[Aisha Harris]

So he's irritable and emotional, but he's also very good at sitting down and playing out strategy. And I don't even know if I would want him to be a traitor or a faithful. I would love watching him on this show.

[L. Holmes]

He sounds like he'd be better as a faithful, to be honest.

[Aisha Harris]

He might very well.

[L. Holmes]

He seems like the type who might be able to convince other people, like, here's what we need to do.

[Aisha Harris]

That is very true. And people would probably think he was a traitor because he kind of has this reputation for being, like, slippery, I think more than he actually is.

[Glenn Weldon]

I think he would make a great faithful who gets recruited as a traitor partway through the season.

[L. Holmes]

Ooh. Yeah.

[Aisha Harris]

So my vote goes to the great Jonathan penner, One of my very favorite survivors of all time. And if we can have Boston Robb on, we can definitely have Penner on.

[Unknown Speaker]

Oh, definitely.

Yeah.

[Aisha Harris]

Glenn, I have a feeling that you have something epic in store. I don't know what it is.

[Unknown Speaker]

Well, I mean, y'all remember I was kind of worried when this topic was pitched because the only reality show I watch is drag race, and drag queens are already in this mix. Right. It wouldn't be a breakthrough. I wouldn't shatter a ceiling. And I thought, well, if this is fantasy casting, I want to lead into the fantasy. So here's a hint. The initial's kf. Any guesses?

[Glenn Weldon]

Kf.

[Unknown Speaker]

Middle initial T. Oh, my gosh. Last name Frog. First name is Kermit.

[L. Holmes]

I was like, I thought we were still talking about drag queens.

[Unknown Speaker]

Kermit T. Frog. Now, hear me out. There would be some legal and logistical hurdles to clear. Peacock is NBC Universal. Kermit is Disney. They don't play well together logistically. You'd have to creatively shoot the entire season so you don't see the puppeteer or the muppeteering.

[L. Holmes]

How is he gonna do challenges?

[Glenn Weldon]

He's at the bar a lot.

[Aisha Harris]

Yeah, he's at the bar a lot.

[Unknown Speaker]

He's at the bar a lot. You would need to dig a pit that the muppeteer could stand in at the round table. And, you know, every time he has to write a name on a chalkboard, you'd have to cut away. You know, allowances would need to be made. I'm not saying it would be easy. And, you know, in the physical challenges, he probably couldn't hold his own, you know, unless they involved riding a bicycle or playing the banjo. I do think he would be great on this show. And when I pitched it to our producers, Liz and Jessica, they were like, big time pilot Pete and I get it right. Contestant on season Two, we already talked about affable, amiable, also a good player. And that's his whole thing, right? Affable, amiable. So you don't make him a faithful. That's the rookie move. You make him a traitor. Consider, what does he do for a living? He stands at the very center of chaos. He'd keep a cool head. What he would do is he would win people over, especially these people, because he is a enthusiast, right? So every D list reality show star he meets in that castle, he'd go up to them and he'd treat them like they're his very special guest star. And then he'd say their name and then he'd go, yay. And now all these people are narcissists. So they would eat that up. They would come to trust him. Some other negatives he's given to self pity. That whole it's not easy being green thing. And that is, you know, dude, that is your privilege talking. And Lord knows, if he ever tries to whip out a banjo, he'd be that guy at the party and he'd make some enemies. So I was thinking maybe not Kermit, maybe some other Muppet. But everyone I came up with, I had reasons to shoot them down. So pitch me some Muppets here.

[Aisha Harris]

I think. I mean, I would say Miss Piggy.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah, sure.

[Aisha Harris]

Yeah.

[Glenn Weldon]

I was thinking Animal is basically the gronk, sure.

[Unknown Speaker]

Certainly mouth breathers. But I think Piggy, Fozzie and Animal in three different ways are all extra. And extra doesn't get you very far in the show.

[L. Holmes]

Sure.

[Unknown Speaker]

Cause it's gotta be Kermit because he is humble in a castle full of people with very inflated senses of selves.

[Glenn Weldon]

There's even a meme of him in a hood. In like a cloak with a hood.

[Unknown Speaker]

Think of anytime anybody is gossiping and throwing out ideas, you just cut away to a shot of Kermit sipping tea and all of America is going to be pointing at the screen like they're Leo DiCaprio. And speaking of memes. Yes, Steven, there is. Anyone who has seen Muppets Most Wanted knows he looks great in a black cloak. Talent brings their own wardrobe. Producers love that. So Kermit. Kermit all the way.

[Aisha Harris]

I am going to say some of the issues that we have talked about with the logistics could be solved if instead we go to Big Bird.

[Unknown Speaker]

Big Bird would be led around by the nose. Big Bird would not be good tv. Big Bird is a born follower.

[L. Holmes]

The thing with Kermit is that I think it would be interesting to see him on the show, I don't think he would make a good traitor. I would automatically assume he was a traitor because it just seems like, of course you're gonna make him a traitor. And, you know, we've seen that happen sometimes where people assume the nice person or the sweet one is like. They're just like, oh, they have to be like. Or they're always psyching each other themselves out, like, well, if the traitor wants us to think this, or whatever. Granted, oftentimes they just wind up not picking Boston Robb again for, like, the fifth time. And it's like, what are we doing? I guess I'm trying to think of, like, who would be best at defending themselves at the round table. Cause that's something you have to take into consideration as well. And I do think Kermit would be very entertaining to watch try to defend himself.

[Unknown Speaker]

He's got a good take. He's got a good shocked face.

[L. Holmes]

Yes. His mouth kind of wrinkles up, and I could totally see that. I mean, I also wanted to just throw out really quickly, like, Statler and Waldorf could be interesting. Chaos.

[Aisha Harris]

I thought about that, too. Like, as a team, maybe.

[L. Holmes]

Yes, Yes.

[Aisha Harris]

I think you're onto something there. I think that's a good idea. And I mean, any of these options would allow us the promise of Alan Cumming interacting with any of these Muppets. And I would watch that for sure. That's the other pro Miss Piggy argument is the Miss Piggy and Alan Cumming hang, I think needs to happen also.

[L. Holmes]

Like Miss Piggy and Tiffany Pollard together. Yes, please, let's make that happen.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah, that makes sense.

[Aisha Harris]

I agree. Miss Piggy and Gronk, also good. I mean, listen, I think I am forced to conclude that we just have an abundance of good ideas, and we're just gonna have to wait probably several seasons for them to get around to using all of them.

[L. Holmes]

Safe to say.

[Aisha Harris]

All right, well, we want to know who you want to be in the next season of the Traders. Find [e-mail] PCHH that brings us to the end of our show. Aisha Harris, Stephen Thompson, Glenn Weldon, thank you so much for being here. I consider you all faithfuls.

[L. Holmes]

Thank you, thank you, thank you.

[Aisha Harris]

And just a reminder that signing up for Pop Culture Happy Hour plus is a great way to faithfully support our show and public radio. And you get to listen to all of our episodes sponsor free. So please go find out more at plus.NPR.org happy hour or visit the link in our show notes. This episode was produced by Liz Metzger and edited by Jessica Reedy and Mike. Mike Katsif. And hello. Come in. Continues to provide our theme music. Thank you for listening to Pop Culture Happy Hour from npr. I'm Linda Holmes, and we'll see you all next time. Do not get banished before then.

[Stephen Thompson]

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