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The Diddy trial: Cassie’s "freak-offs" testimony
00:40:00
Sean “Diddy” Combs’s ex-girlfriend Cassie Ventura took the stand this week in his federal trial. Today, her harrowing testimony about the abuse she says endured and the sex parties she participated in.
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- [00:03]
Anne Brannigan
All right.
- [00:04]
Elahe Izadi
We don't have to go through everything.
- [00:06]
Anne Brannigan
I just want to hear your reactions.
- [00:07]
Elahe Izadi
From today, mostly because.
- [00:09]
Anne Brannigan
Yeah, this is the first day we saw Cassie. Yeah. What were your impressions? That was really, really intense testimony at times, emotional testimony.
- [00:25]
Elahe Izadi
That's audio producer Sabi Robinson and reporter Anne Brannigan. They were standing outside the courthouse on Tuesday where Sean Diddy Combs is on trial, and they were talking about testimony from Cassie Ventura, an R and B singer and Combs ex girlfriend. Tuesday was a big day in the trial because Ventura took the stand for the first time. She's one of the people central to the government's case against Combs. He's been charged with racketeering, conspiracy, sex trafficking, and transportation to engage in prostitution. Combs has pleaded not guilty to the charges. If convicted, he could be sent to prison for life. A lot of Ventura's testimony this week was really hard to listen to. She described the sex parties Combs held called freak offs. And she talked about being subjected to violence and abuse.
- [01:22]
Anne Brannigan
It was long. It was hours and hours. It was difficult. Like, the meticulousness of the testimony, like every little detail.
- [01:31]
Elahe Izadi
Why do you think it's so hard to talk about this right now?
- [01:36]
Anne Brannigan
I do think, you know, the defense even acknowledged this, that these are difficult images to see. These are difficult things to hear. And so, you know, sort of regardless of where you stand on the government's charges of racketeering and sex trafficking, the kinds of details that came out today are just like. They're painful.
- [02:02]
Elahe Izadi
Yeah. From the newsroom of the Washington Post, this is Post Reports. I'm Evahe izadi. It's Friday, May 16th. Today we're continuing our coverage of the trial of music mogul Sean Combs, also known as Diddy Puff or Puff Daddy. We'll be bringing you episodes most Fridays. And we should note we're going to be discussing sex, drugs and violence and thoughts of suicide in this coverage. If you haven't been keeping up with this case, our episode from last Friday catches you up on how the jury was decided. In today's episode, we'll take a look at how each side of the trial will argue their case. And Ann recaps the most important parts of Cassie Ventura's testimony. Hi, Anne.
- [03:00]
Anne Brannigan
Hello.
- [03:01]
Elahe Izadi
So, Anne, last week you told me that this week was going to be a really big week in the trial of Sean Combs. So tell me what it was like when you showed up on Monday morning.
- [03:11]
Anne Brannigan
Okay. So we showed up at 6:00am you know, so people began queuing up for this Courtroom the night before had stayed overnight. There was a line that, you know, traveled around the block of that federal complex. On either side, you know, you had tenths and tents and tents of camera crews. So we had Combs supporters, and we had people who just wanted to see what would happen. Our producer, Sabi Robinson, spoke to a few of these people who were in line, starting with Khali Crowder, who lives on Long island and came just for.
- [03:48]
Sabi Robinson
The day, you know, testimony. They say Cassie's supposed to come, and it's crazy. Like, you know, I mean, like, I did not know any of that was going on. And, you know, on social media, people always idolize their relationships, you know, her and Diddy. And I remember, you know, when they played her song me and you'd like all summer in 2006 when I was. Which tells us this does not feel like 20 years ago, y' all.
- [04:07]
Anne Brannigan
But Sabi also spoke to Shanoa Laurenson, who got there at 2am I'm out here because I really want to see the trial.
- [04:16]
Sabi Robinson
I want to see it firsthand as.
- [04:17]
Elahe Izadi
Much as I can.
- [04:19]
Sabi Robinson
Diddy's a public figure, you know, pretty.
- [04:21]
Anne Brannigan
Much familiar with him.
- [04:24]
Sabi Robinson
You know, bad boy, the 90s and all that stuff like that.
- [04:27]
Anne Brannigan
You know what I mean? But it was a scene, for sure.
- [04:30]
Elahe Izadi
It was a scene.
- [04:31]
Anne Brannigan
Yes.
- [04:32]
Elahe Izadi
So before we hear about Ventura's testimony, because I know this, that was the big thing of this week, I do wanna just start with the jury, because at the end of last week, they still hadn't finalized the jury. So what can you tell me about who is on this jury?
- [04:47]
Anne Brannigan
Right. So they finally selected their jury. And we have a fairly diverse age range here. They're from all over New York. They're 30, around 30 years old to, you know, mid-70s, from the Bronx, from Westchester, from Manhattan. Um, and we have, you know, the 12 jurors, the six alternates of that 12, we have eight men and four women. Um, and there's a bit of racial diversity, too. There's a few black people on it, a few white people.
- [05:23]
Elahe Izadi
Is it unusual that it's eight men and four women? That seems like it's kind of heavily tilted towards men.
- [05:28]
Anne Brannigan
I was a bit surprised by that. I haven't covered enough trials to know how unusual that makeup is. But considering the. The charges that they're being asked to consider and the kind of allegations that they're being asked to review, it is quite notable, I think.
- [05:46]
Elahe Izadi
So let's get to some of those allegations because, you know, I don't want to lose Sight of what the government is actually trying to charge Combs with here. As we dig into these details of Cassie Ventura's testimony, just remind us what does the government have to set out to prove here?
- [06:03]
Anne Brannigan
So there's three charges. The biggest one is racketeering conspiracy. The second one, and there's two counts of this is sex trafficking, and then there's two more counts of transportation to engage in prostitution. And those last two are pretty closely knit together. Racketeering conspiracy is the big umbrella charge that has a lot of other kind of things involved underneath it. So this relates to running a criminal enterprise, which is what the government is saying that Combs did by using his power, his influence, his staff, sort of across his companies to help carry out a range of crimes. And these crimes include arson, bribery, among other things.
- [06:46]
Elahe Izadi
Okay, well, I think that's relevant to just know about, because then, you know, the jury is sat, and then each side presents their opening statements, which, you know, like, when I've covered trials before, I think, like, this is kind of, like the preview or giving you a sense of, like, what their argument is gonna be. So I wanna know what each side said during that moment. Let's start with the government. What did they say during opening statements?
- [07:10]
Anne Brannigan
So what stood out to me was how they really honed in on Cassie Ventura. And, you know, their opening argument was about a half hour, which, to be felt, you know, kind of relatively concise. They painted a very vivid picture of an altercation that Sean Combs is alleged to have had with her, where, in a jealous rage, he broke into a man's house because he thought that she would be there. Um, and so, you know, we heard, you know, allegations that we've heard before in her lawsuits. Those were fleshed out again in those opening statements. But importantly, we were also introduced to the other victims in this case. We've heard that there were more women who were going to testify about things they say that Combs had done to them. They were pseudonyms. But we finally learned a little bit about who they are.
- [08:04]
Elahe Izadi
Mm. And then what about the defense? What was your takeaway from their opening statements? What did they focus on?
- [08:12]
Anne Brannigan
Their opening statement was much longer. It was an hour long. But the sentiment of the statement was fairly simple. Right. Combs lawyer Tenny Garagos said in opening statements that they fully acknowledge that domestic violence exists in that relationship, that it was abusive. But they reminded the jury that this is not a domestic violence case and that Combs sexual activities, even if they may be considered deviant by others or unusual that ultimately they were consensual.
- [08:53]
Elahe Izadi
I see. So the things that the kind of prepping the jury to hear, things that are going to be, like, difficult to hear and even acknowledging they might be criminal, but they aren't these crimes that this trial is about.
- [09:05]
Anne Brannigan
Exactly. And they said that. They said, you know, you. They said to the jurors, you might think he's mean, you might think he's a jerk, but remember what the charges are. Remember what this trial is about.
- [09:17]
Elahe Izadi
So let's get to the testimony we heard this week. And, you know, just sort of watching from afar, to me, it seemed like the big testimony. The headlines I was reading all about was about Cassie Ventura's. She was a witness called by the prosecution and just reminding everyone she is Combs ex girlfriend. And she had this civil lawsuit against Combs that really broke open a lot of these allegations against Combs and triggered, like, many more civil lawsuits against him. So, Anne, when you were at the courthouse, what were your impressions of Ventura?
- [09:49]
Anne Brannigan
Well, the first thing you'll notice about Cassie Ventura is that she's very, very pregnant. That was quite apparent and could be part of the reason why the prosecution wanted her to testify. So in this case, because it is a little bit unusual for a star witness to be so early to kick things off. Exactly. They tend to come later so the jury can have them more fresh in their mind.
- [10:14]
Elahe Izadi
And so what was her demeanor like when you watched her testify?
- [10:18]
Anne Brannigan
I was struck by how cool and composed Ventura seemed a lot of the time on the standard. You know, she is somebody who's very soft spoken. She speaks in a low voice, and she was asked a lot of very uncomfortable questions by the prosecution and by the defense. And she, you know, she was asked in detail about injuries that she might have sustained during the freak offs. She was asked about physical abuse she experienced. There were a couple moments, you know, over the two days that the prosecution questioned her where she did get emotional, but for the most part, she was very even keeled.
- [11:04]
Elahe Izadi
Anne, one thing that you just mentioned was the freak offs. Can you just remind us what that's about? What does that have to do with this trial?
- [11:12]
Anne Brannigan
Yeah, well, they are at the heart of this case, certainly at the heart of, you know, Ventura's allegations against Combs. And these are sex parties that involved male escorts. And Ventura says that she was, you know, introduced to these bike homes, that she was coerced and forced to participate in these sex parties and that they would be filmed. And that footage was used, she said, to blackmail her as the relationship Went on.
- [11:47]
Elahe Izadi
So I would imagine the government. Is that mostly what they were asking her about. How did their questioning of Ventura go? What did they focus on and what emergency?
- [11:56]
Anne Brannigan
So it was pretty wide ranging, covering, you know, the whole of their relationship, which began around 2007 and ended in 2018. So, you know, they were covering this 11 year relationship. You know, they began with how they met. And the portrait that emerged is of a relationship between a man who was 17 years old. She was this young, promising artist. She's enamored with him. She said that she, you know, grew up listening to his music, that she was a fan of his. And then this executive is paying her all of this attention, but at the same time, he's putting her in these situations that she's never been in. He introduces her to oral sex, she said, and so he really is introducing this very new lifestyle to her. And so that's where we start. And over the course of their relationship, she says that he introduces her to opiates, which he ends up getting addicted to. He introduces her to this swinger's lifestyle and this idea of voyeurism, which is where the freak off come in. And she says that as a young person who is in love with Sean Combs, that she wants to try this to please him. And she starts out trying it to please him, but that over the course of their relationship, he goes more violent. The violence is a way to control her. The footage, as we mentioned, is a way to control her. She, you know, says that he made her record hundreds of songs, enough material for nine albums, and none of that is ever released. And so financially, you know, she becomes quite dependent on him.
- [13:45]
Elahe Izadi
And when we're talking about these freak offs, you mentioned the word voyeurism. I mean, essentially what was taking place and where was this taking place?
- [13:54]
Anne Brannigan
Right? So to take a step back and sort of explain the voyeurism part of it. So what essentially this means is that Sean Combs wanted to watch Ventura have sex with other men. You know, that was the, you know, the quote unquote fantasy. And to do this, they would rent hotel rooms primarily. You know, these happened in their apartments sometimes, but primarily in hotel rooms. They would hire male escorts. One, sometimes more than one. And Combs would allegedly, you know, just be in the corner watching, masturbating along to what he was seeing. Now, he wasn't a passive witness, according to this testimony. He was key in orchestrating all of it. And in fact, these were, like, tailored to his preferences, one of which was a copious Amount of baby oil. You know, Ventura testified that he would insist on having them reapply baby oil constantly because he wanted her to be, quote, glistening. She described wanting to rush things sometimes because what she really wanted was to spend time with him on the other side of, you know, these days long events.
- [15:13]
Elahe Izadi
Days long events?
- [15:15]
Anne Brannigan
Yes, days long. Like some. One thing that she said, she said they could last two to three days, and that was typical. And that the reason they could was because there was a lot of drugs being consumed that Combs help keep her awake with a range of drugs from ecstasy, mdma, you know, ketamine. There was, you know, she had to go really in depth about her drug usage, and she had to go in depth about the toll that these freak offs had on her. This is where it got, you know, really graphic and really quite sad, I think, especially for anybody sort of listening to this testimony. Right. So she explained how she got frequent urinary tract infections, you know, quite painful infections, and that she would get them regularly because the freak offs were held so regularly. She estimated that they were happening about once a week. At one point, you know, she described, you know, sometimes having to have sex while having an infection. It got to a point where, you know, common medications for treating that didn't. She said they didn't work on her anymore. One thing Ventura acknowledged was sort of the murkiness of their relationship even after they broke up in 2018. So she talked a little bit about that period of time where she alleges that Combs actually raped her after they had already broken up. So how she described it on the stand was that she and Combs, you know, had separated. She was actually dating her now husband, Alex. Fine. But the two of them met up. But then afterward, you know, they went back to her house, and then Combs began to rape her. And she said, you know, she cried. She said no. She wasn't sure if he even took any of that in and that he left after he ejaculated, despite how horrible that sounds, though she does acknowledge that they did have sex consensually after that and maintained contact for many years. And to be clear, these are allegations that have came up before in Ventura's lawsuit. And Combs has denied this.
- [17:35]
Elahe Izadi
He denied raping her?
- [17:36]
Anne Brannigan
Yes, yes.
- [17:37]
Elahe Izadi
I mean, it sounds like that testimony was really powerful for a jury to see, especially, you know, given the optics of this very pregnant woman recounting these very, very difficult things that she endured. Did the lawyers present any other kind of evidence beyond asking Cassie Ventura these questions?
- [17:55]
Anne Brannigan
There were Photos of her injuries, black eyes, gashes above her eye. She had to identify a lot of male escorts. You know, she was given a binder, this big black binder that she was told to flip through. And in them, she was asked to identify all of these images of male escorts who she hired, who participated in these freak offs. And she was also asked, you know, where she hired them, in what cities, and in what cities they ended up participating in the freak offs. And so there were people who were used multiple times, who were hired, who were brought to multiple locations across the United States and even, say, in international destinations like Ibiza and Turks and Caicos.
- [18:47]
Elahe Izadi
And the escorts piece is important because that goes to the sex trafficking component of it all.
- [18:53]
Anne Brannigan
Exactly. One thing she expanded about was that, you know, she felt like it became her job to plan these freak offs, but also that a lot of other people in Combs orbit, his close orbit, helped with that. So trusted associates, trusted assistants and security guards would also kind of be involved in the planning and execution of this, of these pre coughs.
- [19:17]
Elahe Izadi
Yeah, like, almost like he's the director of this live action scene. But in order, the government is arguing, it sounds like for that to happen, all of these other people have to be involved to enable it.
- [19:29]
Anne Brannigan
Absolutely. So while he was, you know, while all of this was kind of done to his preferences and to his whims, you know, something that they asked Venter repeatedly was whether she wanted to do these things. And she would repeatedly say no, that it was Combs who wanted these things, who proposed these things. But ultimately the planning, the execution fell to her and close assistants and other, you know, a small group of people who were in his orbit.
- [20:01]
Elahe Izadi
And so how did Cassie Ventura react while she was giving this testimony over several days? That's like a long time to be reliving a bad relationship.
- [20:14]
Anne Brannigan
I wouldn't say that she looked comfortable at all, but she was calm. You could kind of see her looked down a lot. She kind of like spoke into her chest a little bit. Like that's how it might have registered, you know, her discomfort. But she didn't really seem to be holding back a whole lot. And she couldn't, you know, there were a couple moments when she got emotional. Once on the first day, once on the second. The first day was when she was recounting how these freak offs had come to make her feel that she felt worthless, that she felt that they were all she was good for, that they were humiliating and debasing. And, you know, she talked about how she hid them from her Family and from most people she knew because these, you know, she acknowledged, like, this wasn't normal. This wasn't something that was supposed to happen. Mm.
- [21:17]
Elahe Izadi
And, of course, Sean Combs is in the courtroom as she's saying all these things. How was he reacting during her testimony?
- [21:24]
Anne Brannigan
So the way I was watching and the way a lot of the journalists who you see doing sort of the live blogging, they're watching from a press room, so not in the courtroom itself. And they're watching from a closed circuit video feed that is shown on monitors that are in that press room. And these monitors will show Cassie. And to some extent, there's a wide view of the rest of the courtroom. And so you can see Combs there, but you can't really see his facial expressions. You can see what his body is doing. And so what we saw, he appeared stoic most of the time. You would see him conferring with his defense quite often, as he has done for the entirety of this trial so far. And occasionally, you know, when there would be a break, he'd turn to his supporters. His family sits in the second row behind him and, you know, kind of shout them out, do some sort of gesture to thank them. One thing that's striking is that his family is there, and so they have to listen, you know, his mom and his children.
- [22:37]
Elahe Izadi
Well, Ann, let's take a pause there. And when we return, let's get into how the defense questioned Cassie Ventura and what other government witnesses had to say about Combs. We'll be right back.
- [22:57]
Sabi Robinson
My name is Jason Rezaian, and I am the director of Press Freedom Initiative here at the Washington post. Back in 2014, when I was the Tehran bureau chief for the Washington Post, my wife and I were arrested from our home. I was held for 544 days. Almost a year and a half from the very first moments after my arrest, the Post was involved in trying to secure my release. Every day, journalists defend our democracy by holding power to account. My job is now to stand up for the rights of journalists in the United States and around the world, and especially those journalists who've had their voices silenced. I know what it is to lose a day or 544 of them of my life for the work that I do. And I don't want anybody else to suffer that fate. When you subscribe to the Washington Washington Post, you support this kind of work. Learn more@washingtonpost.com subscribe I'm Jason Rezaian, and I'm one of the people behind the Post. My name is Jacob Bo Gage, and I'm the Congressional Economic Correspondent at the Washington Post. I cover anything with a dollar sign in front of it in Congress. That means taxes, benefit programs like Social Security and Medicare trade. The Washington Post is personal to me. I grew up in this area. I grew up fighting with my brother for the sports page. So to be able to work at this institution when I can see outcomes of my reporting on really important issues, issues about the health of our democracy, the health of the most vulnerable people in this country. I've seen policies change specifically because of work that I have done with so many of my talented colleagues in this newsroom. I tell people they should subscribe to the Washington Post because we covered the most powerful city in the world from the most powerful city in the world. This is what we live every day. Subscribers support this work. Learn more@washingtonpost.com subscribe I'm Jacob Bogage, and I'm one of the people behind the Post.
- [25:16]
Elahe Izadi
So, Anne, we just spent some time on how the government questioned Ventura, Cassie Ventura, when they were building up their case. But then the defense had an opportunity to question her. What were the big things that happened there?
- [25:29]
Anne Brannigan
So the defense cross was interesting. So I'm gonna talk primarily here about the first day of their cross examination, which happened Thursday. You know, their primary goal here is to try to establish that all of this was consensual. It might have been unconventional, but it was consensual in that Ventura was an active participant, a willing participant, and an enthusiastic participant. And to do this, they showed her many texts, a lot of them from the beginning of her. Of their relationship, you know, Ventura and Combs relationship, and some that, you know, came later. And they're pretty, pretty uncomfortable. They're pretty sexually explicit. I will not be able to repeat some of the things that they showed, but quite graphic. And she had to look at them. She had to read them out. They gave her pages and pages and pages of BlackBerry exchanges. So that tells you how far back we're going. Conversations she had with Combs, where they're expressing love to each other, where Combs appears to be at some points deferring to her wishes, telling her that he wants to please her. So in their questioning, they're trying to do two things. They're trying to undermine her image of Combs as, like, this violent, controlling person. And they're also trying to establish that these were things that she wanted to do.
- [27:04]
Elahe Izadi
So what about the allegations that have been made that Combs used violence, threats of blackmail by releasing these videos to control her, to direct her to help him commit these crimes. How did the defense try to counteract that narrative?
- [27:21]
Anne Brannigan
So they introduced, I think there were two main threads here. One was the drug use, which, you know, earlier in the week, Ventura had talked about, you know, the fact that she was addicted to opiates. And the way that she talked about it when the government was questioning. Questioning her, was that she needed this to disassociate, that the freak off experiences, that the abuse was so intense that she needed to disengage from the world in order to. To do any of it. To do.
- [27:53]
Elahe Izadi
Yeah.
- [27:54]
Anne Brannigan
And they had to talk a lot more about her drug use. But they also seemed to imply that Combs, too, was an addict. What they seemed to suggest in that line of questioning was that Combs behavior could be tied to his own addiction issues. So I see that was one thread that came out. Another one was jealousy. And this is something that the defense teed up in their opening statement as well, that this was a relationship with mutual violence and a lot of jealousy that was animating the decisions that each party made. And so that's something they focused on as well. They asked Ventura how she felt about Combs being with other women, about him not being on vacations with her, that they didn't. They never spent Christmas together. You know, sort of suggesting that she had a lot of resentment over their relationship.
- [28:52]
Elahe Izadi
And then thinking about the violence piece of this, I think one big part of how the public came to understand some of the violence in their relationship was this security footage. It aired on CNN in 2023, and the footage dates back to 2016, and it showed Combs beating Ventura in a hotel hallway. So how did the defense handle that video during their cross examination?
- [29:20]
Anne Brannigan
Well, one thing that they did show was a series of text messages from around that time. And, you know, they highlighted very specific text messages. So, for example, when they were talking about their plans for around that time, they highlighted text messages from Combs saying, you know, what do you want to do? Essentially? And just either, like, whatever you want to do, I'm okay with, you know, kind of appearing to put the ball in her court. And they highlighted text messages where it seemed as though she was the one who was proposing freak offs. You know, they kind of stayed away from the actual sort of violent incident, but really tried to focus on Combs being a caring person who was maybe even deferring a bit to Ventura's wishes.
- [30:15]
Elahe Izadi
And one thing I'm really struck by in this trial, too, is. And just this case is we're Talking about all these celebrities, I'm wondering, did any other notable people emerge during this testimony this week?
- [30:28]
Anne Brannigan
Absolutely. So we knew a lot about Kid Cudi and Cassie Ventura already, who's a rapper. Yes, rapper, whose legal name is Scott Meschedy. And she first talked about him in her lawsuit where she describes, you know, a brief period in which they dated. Combs allegedly got incredibly jealous about this relationship, and while he was overseas, allegedly arranged to have Kid Cudi's car blow up. Right. And Combs has denied this. When the government mentions arson, we know that. I'm not sure if there's other incidents of arson, but we know that that is one of them.
- [31:14]
Elahe Izadi
Right, I see. I see. Anyone else?
- [31:16]
Anne Brannigan
Yeah. So she also mentioned, very briefly, Michael B. Jordan. And it came up actually in the defense's cross of her.
- [31:26]
Elahe Izadi
And so Michael B. Jordan, he's this actor that we mentioned last week. And there was this question of why is Michael B. Jordan's name on this list of questions that was given to potential jurors? And so now his name came up and what does he have to do with this?
- [31:41]
Anne Brannigan
Very little, actually. Like, that part did not last very long. It was part of this thread of, you know, the mutual jealousy in the relationship. So the defense brought it up because, you know, this was apparently during an on and off period. They were suggesting in their questioning that Ventura, who was upset about Combs with this other woman who had been an issue in their relationship while she was in South Africa shooting this film that she got with Michael B. Jordan, and that the timing suggests that this was, you know, perhaps an attempt to inspire jealousy. And, you know, that was a thread that they tried to connect with Kid Cudi as well, that she had done this to inspire jealousy.
- [32:28]
Elahe Izadi
I see. And before we get to the other witnesses, was there anything else that emerged during Cassie Ventura's time on the stand that was notable to you?
- [32:39]
Anne Brannigan
So one big revelation. We know that when Ventura filed her lawsuit in 2023, that she and Combs settled very quickly. They settled the next day, but we didn't know the terms of that settlement. During the government's questioning of her, we find out that, you know, it was $20 million. Right. And at the time, she was writing a book. But she gave a lot of context for this time. She said that the real breakthrough for her actually didn't come until 2023 when she was trying to shoot a music video with another artist and just had these horrible flashbacks, she said, where all of those experiences came back to her. And she described. And this was Quite hard to hear how she had kind of lost the will to live, that she went to her husband, Alex Fine, and was basically like, you know, you can do this without me. You can have this. They have, you know, a couple kids together. You can do this without me. And that she wanted to walk out into traffic and that he wouldn't let her. And so after that, she goes to rehab, she goes through trauma therapy, and she really unpacks all of these things that happened to her. And what Ventura says is that part of her way of processing that was to put everything on paper. And she wanted to put it in the form of a book. And she explained that one thing she wanted to do, she did want Combs to read it. And this is another part where she got very emotional describing that. Like she, after all this time, she doesn't think that Combs understands what he did to her and that she really wanted him to understand.
- [34:33]
Elahe Izadi
And the government also called other witnesses this week, aside from Cassie Ventura, briefly, who else took the stand and how did their testimonies go?
- [34:44]
Anne Brannigan
It's hard to remember because Cassie Ventura's testimony has been such the topic of interest this week that it's almost hard to remember that there were two witnesses who came before her. Those two witnesses, the first one was a man named Israel Flores. He's now a police officer with the LAPD, but he was a security guard in 2016. He was working the day of that hotel assault that we've seen captured in security footage. And that he was actually the one who responded to the incident.
- [35:22]
Elahe Izadi
Who else took the standard? You said there were two people. Who was the other one?
- [35:25]
Anne Brannigan
And the second one is a man named Daniel Philip. He was the manager of, you know, a male review, essentially like a male strip club. And he was hired over the period of about a year, starting in 2012, ending in about 2013, 2014. He was paid over the course of that year to participate in these freak offs to have sex with Cassie Ventura in front of Sean Combs. And he detailed some of those experiences. He detailed who paid him and how and what he witnessed while he was in those rooms.
- [36:03]
Elahe Izadi
So those are government witnesses. How did the defense questioning of them go?
- [36:06]
Anne Brannigan
They actually seem to be stronger under the defense cross examination than they were during the government questioning. And that's because they were really, really firm in their remembrance of these events, at times sort of correcting defense assumptions or questions of them.
- [36:26]
Elahe Izadi
So, Anne, you and I are talking Friday morning. Do we know what will happen next in this trial? What do we expect?
- [36:32]
Anne Brannigan
So we expect the defense wants to cross examine Cassi Ventura for the rest of Friday. They really want to take all day Friday to do that. The government wants to introduce its next two witnesses as early as Friday. It's kind of unlikely that they'll be able to. We do know that one really big name is on deck, and that's Dawn Richard, the former Danity Kane singer who we first met on Making the Band. That was Combs reality TV show. She has her own lawsuit that she filed against Combs, and she is going to be taking the stand next.
- [37:14]
Elahe Izadi
So, Anne, when we look at how this week went in this trial, what does that tell you about what we should expect from the rest of the trial?
- [37:24]
Anne Brannigan
I think this will be a very intense trial. I'm curious to see, you know, whether they're gonna bring forward male escorts that were involved in these freak offs, because they seem to be queuing that up during Cassie's testimony. I'm also very curious to see whether we see any former employees of Combs come to the stand. Their testimony would seem to be pretty crucial because they're integral to this argument of conspiracy. Right. That many people were used to commit these alleged crimes. And on the defense side, we know that they're gonna bring forward employees who say that they love Combs, you know, who can kind of undermine this image that the prosecution is trying to paint of him. And again, that they will not deny the worst aspects of his character when it comes to, say, violence or, you know, his unconventional kind of sexual preferences. But they'll say that this is a man who ultimately did not commit the crimes that the federal government is alleging that he did.
- [38:46]
Elahe Izadi
Well, Anne, thanks so much for making time to connect with us and explain all this. I appreciate it.
- [38:51]
Anne Brannigan
Thank you.
- [38:54]
Elahe Izadi
Anne Brannigan is a reporter for the Style section of the Post. You also heard audio producer Savvy Robinson in this episode. She contributed to reporting from New York and also produced this show. After we ended our conversation, Anne reported more details from Ventura's cross examination. On Friday, the defense continued attempts to portray Ventura as a violent person. They played an audio recording of the singer threatening to kill a man who seemed to have a video of her. Her having sex. And a previously unreported settlement was revealed. Before the trial, Ventura had reached a settlement with the Intercontinental Hotel. That's the hotel where the 2016 surveillance footage showing Combs beating Ventura took place. They settled for a sum of $10 million. Listeners, if you have any questions about this trial, what you're reading about, what a specific charge is all about. What does this evidence all mean? Anything? Let us know. We'll try to answer them in future episodes. Send an email or a voice memo to postreportshpost.com that's it for Post Reports. Thanks for listening. Today's show was edited by Rena Flores and mixed by Shawn Carter. Thanks to Carla Spartos and Shayna Jacobs. And if you love this show, help other people discover it by leaving a rating on Spotify or a rating and review on Apple Podcasts. We really appreciate it. Our team includes Martine Powers, Colby Ikowicz, Maggie Penman, Ted Muldoon, Lucy Perkins, Alana Gordon, Ariel Plotnik, Rennie Sfornofsky, Emma Talkoff, Peter Bresnan, Laura Benshoff and Renita Jablonski. I'm Elahe Izadi. We'll be back tomorrow with more stories from the Washington Post.
- [41:04]
Anne Brannigan
You don't know me yet, but I bet we have something in common. We all wish we were better functioning humans. Maybe figure out how to sleep better, have more meaningful relationships, cook more that search for practical knowledge. It's my job at the Washington Post. I host a podcast called Try this. Every episode is like an audio class, and we learn together. I'm Christina Quinn. Now you know me. Check out Try this wherever you're listening.