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- [00:01]
A
Welcome to the program today. Monte Gonzalez here in studio and I have with us Dinesh d'. Souza. And the question that we're going to discuss today is about the Dragon's prophecy and connected with October 7th. Is it in the Bible? Is there a pattern there? Stick around and you'll see.
- [00:17]
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- [00:52]
A
welcome back. We are here with Dinesh. And Dinesh, it is great to have you. Welcome.
- [00:56]
C
Good to be with you.
- [00:57]
A
You have done a major work with this film, the Dragon's Prophecy. I have it right here with me and I've watched it, of course, and phenomenal work. Footage that has not been seen anywhere else, et cetera, et cetera. Maybe give us the background about why and how you came across and wanted to do the film.
- [01:15]
C
The film is a bit of a departure for me. My earlier films have been mainly about American society, American history, the meaning of America. This is a film that is not only October 7, but covers Israel, Gaza, the Palestinians, radical Islam. It leans back to the ancient battles in the Bible between the Israelites and some of their classic enemies, notably the Philistines. It has a dose of biblical archeology that validates the Bible historically, archeologically, and it also has a hint of biblical prophecy. The film is based on a book by Jonathan Cahn of the same title, the Dragon's Prophecy. But the film goes beyond the book, particularly with the archaeological material. I think that Kahn relies heavily on a Christian audience that accepts the Bible. I'm putting the film out there. I want the film to be seen in Israel. I want it to be seen by Jews, Christians, maybe some secular people. And so the archeological section in there is aimed at validating the Bible and showing that the, the Bible is based upon real people and real events.
- [02:29]
A
You know, it's, that's very important, especially for our audience. And we talk a lot about prophecy. But of course, my background, I have background in archeology, biblical archeology, and so bringing that to the table. When you think about the validation of Scripture, you have prophecy and you have archeology. Those are to me, it's in my world as well, that's why I really loved the film, because it goes hand in hand. And for those that might not understand even the title, the Dragon's Prophecy, talk about that because I think super important, lays the foundation for, again, even what Jonathan Cahn wrote about and then how you develop it.
- [03:01]
C
In the film, the dragon's prophecy refers to a passage in the Book of Revelation where a dragon representing the devil goes to war against a woman representing Israel, and the woman is pregnant, representing the Messiah. So this is the theme of our film, which is that there is a world behind the world, and that the events in front of us, important as they are in their own right, are also a reflection and a reverberation of a great cosmic battle that began at the beginning of time itself between God and the evil one, God and the devil, and that we can use that framework to better understand even things that seem to be purely secular. So take, for example, antisemitism. I've been on some Israeli podcasts. I'll talk to secular Jews and I'll say, why do you think you have antisemitism through all the centuries? What is the explanation for it? And many of them will say, beats me. We don't know. We're puzzled. Why does Emri hate us? Now you can give antisemitism a secular explanation. To some degree, it's rooted in envy, the Jews are a very successful group, and so on, but it doesn't seem to do it full justice. What the film does is it basically says, look, there is a deeper explanation. The devil hates God, the devil cannot overthrow God, so the devil will pick on the things that God cares about. Like, why do you think the devil picked on Adam and Eve? They didn't do anything to the devil. And but Adam and Eve were the cherished creation of God. So the devil gets back at God by ruining Adam and Eve. And for the same reason and by the same logic, the devil goes, guess what? God has a chosen people. They're the Jews. How about if I go after them, run them out of their country, humiliate them, destroy them, kill them, burn them. And so here antisemitism takes on a deeper spiritual explanation. And I found even secular people listening to that God. Wow, that's really interesting because we never thought of it that way.
- [05:07]
A
You know, you spend certainly some time in the film bringing in, again, as I mentioned earlier, some. Some footage, some un. Unseen, unbeforeseen footage of October 7th. Talk about the power of October 7th, what happened there and how it really contributes to the overall dragon's prophecy.
- [05:27]
C
Right after October 7, I was seeing some of this footage of the Hamas guys riding over the fences, driving into the kibbutzes, massacring people. And I realized this is very interesting because as a filmmaker, I have to say, normally I'm used to seeing events from the victim's point of view, but I realized I was looking at footage October 7th from the point of view of the attackers. They're the ones who did the filming. They're the ones, in some cases, who livestreamed it. And so I realized that this film needs to begin with about 10 minutes of putting you on the scene of October 7th. And I was very fortunate in some ways. I was interviewing a young woman, Lisha Miran, in a kibbutz called Nahal Oz, right on the Gaza border. And she was describing, you know, these Hamas monsters climbed through my window. And my husband and I took our two children and we ran into the safe room and I was holding my baby. And I realized after my conversation with her that I had the exact footage of those events. I had the Hamas guys coming through the window. I had footage of her in her safe room clinging to her baby. So I can literally put you there on the scene at the time. And from a filmmaker's point of view, this is really very powerful. I think it sets up our film in a really good way. And the film begins very gritty, very much on the ground, but then it goes to the most cosmic events. You know, parallels between, let's say, the battles between Israel and Hamas and battles between the ancient Israelites and the Philistines. So the scope of the film is very large.
- [07:07]
A
Can you have any thoughts on why the world, as you mentioned, has kind of a double standard where these, this stuff that's publicly available. Why isn't the media showing the behind the scenes from the perpetrators, but they'll show you again a child in Gaza? Why, why. Why not show, though, what's. What's. What do you think's going on there?
- [07:28]
C
Again, I think there's a secular and a spiritual explanation. The secular explanation is just this, that the. The left, the political left, the cultural left, globally, has accepted the idea, a wrongheaded idea, but they've accepted it nonetheless. Israel is the bad guy and the Palestinians are the good guy. Israel is the colonizer, and they are the colonized. And therefore the suffering of the Palestinians takes precedence because these are the true victims. We should feel sorry for them. And that's what drives this coverage. So, for example, October 7th is seen by some of these same People as like, well, that was just an uprising of the colonized people who couldn't take it anymore. So that's how they see October 7th. So they're not sympathetic to Israel. They're basically saying that these poor Palestinians have been oppressed for so many decades that they finally had enough and they erupted. And, yeah, maybe they shouldn't have done what they did, but it's an understandable reaction to Israeli aggression. That's how they see it. So this explains the double standard from a secular point of view, from a spiritual point of view. It basically is one more, I would call it, signpost of the last era or the last days. And by signposts, I mean, I don't in this film get into the nitty gritty of biblical prophecy. I don't try to settle the issues between, let's say, the premillennials and the post millennialists. But what I do is I say, all right, let's look for some large biblical signposts. One of them, of course, is the return of the Jews to their ancient homeland. That's predicted repeatedly in the Bible. It was a very implausible prediction for many, many centuries. It didn't seem like it could come true, and yet it did come true in the last century. But another signpost is the rising temperature of hatred not only for the Jews, but also for the Christians. The Christians are, of course, engrafted onto the Jewish tree, as the Bible says. And so in the last age, we expect to see a increasing violence, increasing persecution, increasing targeting of both the Jewish people and the Christians. And that is, in fact, what we do see.
- [09:49]
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It's hard to deny that we are at the end of the age, especially, you know, Israel's, you know, 78 years ago now in the land, and of course, all the progressions of the different wars and the hatred continuing and getting worse and worse. So we're going to take a little break here where you could see how to get our magazine, which keeps you up to date on all the things that we're discussing about the end of the age. So take a listen
- [10:13]
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at Prophecy Watchers. We believe that God has called us to be a voice in these last days to warn you of things, to come, to educate you on the study of Bible prophecy, and to boldly proclaim the soon return of Jesus. For your gift of just $50 or more, here's what we'd love to send you. Twelve monthly issues of our four color magazine, the Prophecy Watcher, in your choice of print or digital, plus five bonus DVDs. Packed with eye opening teachings from prophecy experts including the mystery of the Rapture, the great Apostasy and the revealing of the Antichrist. Holy Fire in Jerusalem. New shocking discoveries surrounding the Shroud of Turin. The stones cry out the archaeological evidence for Jesus. The Mystery of the ten Kings. Could these be the wealthy and influential oligarchs who control our world today? As an added bonus, we want to send you a one of a kind Prophetic treasure. A book that examines every prophecy in the entire Bible. Exploring Bible prophecy from Genesis to Revelation is the work of two prophecy legends, Tim LaHaye and Ed Hindson. It's a book you'll find on the shelf of every prophecy expert. This 560 page masterpiece is our bonus gift to you. This $120 value can be yours for your gift of $50 with shipping included in the USA. Call us at the number on your screen or visit us online at ProphecyWatchers TV. For our international friends, please please note that additional shipping fees do apply and all prices listed are in US dollars. The signs are everywhere. The prophetic puzzle is almost complete and yet so many are still asleep. That's why the Prophecy Watchers exists. To shine a light in the darkness and help believers understand the lateness of the hour. We believe Jesus is coming soon and your support helps us take this urgent message to the ends of the earth.
- [12:21]
A
Well, welcome back. We are with Dinesh d' Souza about his film the Dragon's Prophecy. And Dinesh, in, in in the beginning you mentioned that Jonathan Cahn had a very large part of inspiring your film. So maybe talk about that and his book and how the book connects and maybe doesn't connect or how you developed it from the book itself.
- [12:42]
C
The book, when I read it had a blazing insight that jumped out at me and Jonathan Cahn said we're seeing this battle between the Jews and the Palestinians. He goes it is an eerie replay of ancient battles between the Israelites and the Philistines. Now more than that, the tactics of October 7th and the aftermath are very closely similar to the Palestinians. We can see this through the biblical example of Samson, who represents the strength of Israel. Samson is captured by who? Well, the Philistines. And where do they take him? To Gaza. Gaza is named in the Bible and they blind him. Which is in a way very similar to the way that Hamas and the terrorists blinded Israel. Not just metaphorically, they actually shot down a lot of the surveillance sites that the Israelis would be able to see them coming. They blinded Israel in that literal sense. And then it says in The Bible. The people of Gaza demanded that Samson be stripped and paraded so that he could, quote, entertain us. Sure enough, right after October 7th, captives were stripped at least to the waist. They were paraded, people were cheering, Allahu Akbar, celebrating, handing out sweets. And so what you have here is an echo that I had not heard until I read Jonathan Cahn's book. And I'm like, wow, these parallels are, they're multiple and they're deep. And so what Kahn is basically saying is that as it was in the beginning or as it was in ancient times, we're beginning to see some of those same things happen again and we should really ponder them in to see if we are witnessing not just the playing out of history, but the playing out of a biblical script that has a beginning, a middle and an end. So all of that I found very intellectually exciting and I realized that it could be the basis for a really good film.
- [14:53]
A
To me, it's fascinating where, you know, you go back a couple hundred years ago and there's no Israel in land. And so, you know, you have all these prophetic history and prophetic things going in the future. But once Israel became back in the land, it's like we were transported to me back before 70 AD or even in the Old Testament where here you have a real Israel, the real descendants of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob in the land. And you're looking around and you're saying, well, oh wow, how is God interacting with his people back in the land? They're back in the land for a purpose, as we know, as we're approaching the end of the age. But to me, to see the parallels, I try to tell people we're living in biblical times, people, this is what we're doing, were doing. And so I think the film does a great job of showing those, those I like the word, the echo, the parallels there.
- [15:40]
C
Well, you know, it's not insignificant that the greatest discovery in biblical archeology, which is the Dead Sea Scrolls, important because prior to the Dead Sea Scrolls, the oldest manuscript of the Hebrew Bible, the Old Testament was from about 1000 AD and the dead Sea Scrolls came along and you had manuscripts, including biblical manuscripts from like the third century to the first century bc. But what the Dead Sea Scrolls showed is that the Book of Isaiah, for example, the script from 300 BC and the so called Masoretic script from 1000 AD which was the earliest copy we had before that matched almost one to one. There were tiny discrepancies, but they not, not discrepancies in meaning. Only discrepancies of a letter here or a word that was inflected slightly differently there. Now my point is this, that the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls, 1947, the formation of the State of Israel, 1948, it's almost as if the validation of the Hebrew Scriptures and the founding of the state of Israel are hand in hand.
- [16:59]
A
You know, in one sense, I'm curious, you know, you have of course, the prophetic things with, you know, the October 7th, why, what led you to include the archeology in there and then in that case, maybe share with the audience a couple of the items that you
- [17:14]
C
did include for many centuries. You have important figures in the Bible that Christians and earlier Jews took on faith. So take a figure like King David or Isaiah, Jeremiah, even figures from the New Testament, Pontius Pilate, the high priest named Caiaphas. So these figures existed in the Bible, but for the most part they were only in the Bible. There was no non biblical support for them. Now Pontius Pilate, a couple of historians refer to him, but even those historical accounts have some problems with them. So you couldn't say for sure. You didn't have, you could say historical or archeological support until recently. And by recently I mean the last few decades. And so suddenly these figures of the Bible are validated. You have a clay seal that comes out of the ground that has, you know, Isaiah's name on it. You find the ruins of David's palace. You find inscriptions that say the house of David. And if there was a house of David, there was obviously a David. And then you find the bones of the high priest Caiaphas in a ossuary or casket that has his name on it. By the way, a lot of this I didn't know until just the last few years when I started making trips to Israel is I said, wow, why isn't this being screened from the rooftops of every synagogue and every church? When a pastor talks about Jeremiah, why doesn't he play a five minute video before that where he talks about the validation of Jeremiah through archaeological discovery? I guess pastors in general don't maybe know this material or they're uncomfortable talking about it. But I thought, wow, this is so fascinating. I want to actually write about it. And I'm currently working on a book that deals with these topics for charisma books. But I also said, look, I'm going to put at least a taste of this into the film to let even the most hardened skeptic realize that guess what? You can disagree about the miracles of the Bible or disbelieve the resurrection if you want. But I'm going to show you why you should take seriously the historicity of the Bible.
- [19:31]
A
Yeah, to me it's, it's one of the reasons why I went into archeology because I was so fascinated with the background of scripture and again, the reliability of the text. We do walk by faith, but God doesn't have us walk by some invisible, unverifiable faith. It's founded on, again, on truth and fact. One of the things you bring up in the film too, which I think is important, is just talk about the land of Israel itself, the ancestral homeland. Why, why is it such a, an important thing today? And why is it just continually. The land, the land, I mean that's all the fighting in the UN and etc, talk about that.
- [20:11]
C
Israel is positioned in what is now hostile territory. It is essentially the, you could say, home base of Islam and as it turns out, also a radical Islamic. And Israel is seen as the little Satan, America being the great Satan. And so there are political reasons why Israel is targeted. In some ways Israel is a surrogate for the west and for the United States. From a spiritual point of view, I think the Bible makes it really clear that even though God gives the land to Abraham and his descendants, they will never sort of live in that land undisturbed, unmolested, you know. And through the centuries the Israelites were tormented by the Assyrians, by the Babylonians. They were always fighting the Moabites and the Philistines. And even now they finally come back, they get their land. Can they finally like, you know, breathe a sigh of relief and live in peace? No, they cannot. They're surrounded by hostile enemies. And I think the Bible says that, look, you know, you can have a peace plan, you can exchange hostages, you can make things better, but ultimately can you solve that problem once and for all? No, you cannot. It will not be solved until the end of time. And so if you believe the Bible, you're not going to get ultimate resolution until the curtain comes down. I believe that. And so I think that is the spiritual explanation that doesn't displace the kind of secular explanation I gave a few moments ago. The two should be taken hand in hand. The two supplement each other.
- [21:57]
A
This film. I just want to encourage everybody, this is like a must see film in understanding not only the background there, but again, as Dinesh said, the echoes of what we see historically as well as prophetically, and again, the archeological value to it is phenomenal. We're going to take a Little break here where you can see how to get Dinesh's film. So take a listen.
- [22:17]
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October 7th is a day that will live in infamy. It was early morning when the news broke at our prophecy conference in Norman, Oklahoma. Tragedy had struck in Israel as drug fueled Hamas terrorists stormed across the Israeli border, slaughtering more than 1,000 innocent men, women and children in brutal, inhumane ways and taking hostages. That too, two years later, may never return alive. Best selling author Jonathan Cahn was quickly catapulted onto the worldwide stage releasing an amazing book that was inspired by the October 7th attack. The dragon's prophecy took us back to Biblical times, the time when Israel's ancient enemy, the Philistines roamed the land. Inspired by Jonathan's work, Dinesh D' Souza began planning a documentary on October 7th, a 90 minute film that will leave you in stunned silence as you witness video footage you've never seen before. Taking the viewers to Ground Zero, the Gaza crossing, Dinesh shares the terror of the initial attack. He interviews the emotional victims, people who shared their miraculous survival accounts as their friends and family were killed. D' Souza offers the Palestinian perspective on October 7, sharing interviews with indoctrinated school children, terrorists and the spouses of the hostages who were never returned home. The documentary is gripping as you'll see what really happened that day. Interviews with Prime Minister Netanyahu, Mike Huckabee and other Israeli experts take us back in Israel's history to prove who owns the land. It's the definitive answer to the ongoing debate claiming that the Jews in Israel today are not the people God brought back to the land in 1948. The Dragon's Prophecy documentary is available today for your gift of $30 or more with shipping included anywhere in the USA. It also comes with a free bonus a live conference presentation from Jonathan Cahn on the tragedy of October 7th. This is a presentation you won't want to miss, delivered with passion and human emotion. Call our toll free number 247 or visit us online at ProphecyWatchers TV. For our international friends, please note that additional shipping fees do apply and all prices listed are in US Dollars. Your faithful support enables us to proclaim the Gospel, teach God's prophetic word, and reach people around the world with the hope of Jesus Christ. During these critical days, every program you watch, every resource you share, and every order you place helps extend that mission to countless people who are searching for truth. There are no bigger fans of Israel than Prophecy Watchers. In spite of this tragedy, we know God has a plan for the Jewish people join us in praying for the peace of Jerusalem and may God open their eyes and help them recognize their long awaited Jewish Messiah, Jesus of Nazareth.
- [25:16]
A
Welcome back. We are with Dinesh and Dinesh. In our last few minutes here, one of the things that I thought was really just valuable or important was you had the opportunity to interview Prime Minister Netanyahu on this and which is, is a great privilege, especially for he's been great for Israel in, in so many ways. He's also attacked by a lot of people. But what, what was, you know, what, what was that like and what was your kind of key takeaways from interviewing him directly?
- [25:47]
C
Well, my way of doing these interviews is I realized that I'd seen some interviews with Netanyahu. He tends to be a little bit, somet, a little stiff maybe. And I think it's because he's on the defensive. He's, wherever he goes, he gets sort of encircled and they're, the questioning is typically fairly hostile. So I thought to myself, how do I get Netanyahu to sort of bring out an aspect of Netanyahu that is not always seen? And I thought maybe one of the ways to do that is to surprise him a little. So one of my first questions to him was just like this was, what do you make of Jesus? Right? So think about this. Here I am, I mean, I'm a Christian, but I am talking to the Jewish head of a Jewish state and asking him about the most famous Jew of all time, Jesus. And you could see that he was a little startled and his mind is processing it. And then he gave a very good answer. He actually emphasized the Jewishness of Jesus, in effect claiming Jesus, saying Jesus is one of us. You know, we may not agree with the theology of Jesus and maybe most, you know, Jews will reject him as the Messiah. But guess what? Jesus was a Jew and his name was Yeshua and his mom was Miriam and his dad was Yoseph. And they, you know, they ate Jewish food and celebrated the Jewish holidays and they spoke Aramaic and Hebrew and they, Jesus walked the pilgrimage road and went to the temple and bathed in the Pool of Salaam. So I love this stuff. I mean, I thought it was fascinating to see hear it from Netanyahu. And then I went on to ask him about some of the questions that Tucker Carlson and others have raised, like, are the Jews of today really the descendants of the Jews of the Bible? And again, it was just very valuable to have Netanyahu kind of weigh in on that, establish a continuity between the Jews then and now, this all tied beautifully into the themes of the film.
- [27:45]
A
Amen. Amen to that. Well, Dinesh, I really appreciate your time today and thank you everybody else for watching. As Nish said, there's hope. There's hope in Jesus Christ and that's why we're here to share all that God is doing in the world today. We always appreciate your prayers and support for what we're doing and we'll catch you next time.
- [28:04]
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Thank you so much for joining us today here at Prophecy Watchers. We hope today's program has started, strengthened your faith and given you a deeper understanding of God's prophetic word. As you may know, Prophecy Watchers is a viewer supported ministry made possible through the faithful support of friends like you. You can give easily by visiting ProphecyWatchers.