Jane Doesn't Like Her Dogs

Summary

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Proxy with Yowei Shaw

Episode: Jane Doesn't Like Her Dogs
Date: May 5, 2026
Host: Yowei Shaw
Guests: Jane (pseudonym), Jen Blough (proxy guest, therapist, animal welfare professional)

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Episode Overview

Theme/Purpose:
In this episode, Yowei Shaw investigates the intensely specific but emotionally universal case of “Jane,” a lifelong dog lover, trainer, and animal welfare professional who now finds herself disconnected from and irritable with her two (previously beloved) dogs. Jane seeks to understand if anyone has felt similarly, if it’s permanent, and how she might regain her spark. Through a proxy—licensed therapist and animal welfare expert Jen Blough—Yowei unravels threads that connect Jane’s experience to concepts of compassion fatigue, anticipatory grief, and the hidden costs of a life spent caring. The episode explores empathy, identity, and healing for animal professionals—and anyone who’s ever loved and then felt distant from what once brought them joy.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Jane’s Dog-Loving Identity in Crisis

• Jane’s lifelong devotion to dogs: her first word was “dog,” her life and identity revolved around them, and she even chose a dog over a boyfriend (04:00).
• She left her job as a dog trainer in early 2025, anticipating more time and energy for her own pets—only to find herself emotionally numb and exhausted by them instead (07:07).
• Formerly, coming home to her dogs made the worst days okay; now even their barking and nearness feel suffocating (07:35–09:13).
• "I need them to stop following me around the house... It's okay to lay next to me. You don't have to be on me." – Jane (09:13)
• The shift: Jane loves her dogs in action and care but has lost the feeling that once accompanied it.

  “I’m grateful and I do love them. But as far as that feeling that goes with it—I don’t have it.” – Jane (10:53–11:03)

2. The Exhaustion & Self-Doubt of “Losing the Spark”

• Jane struggles with guilt, confusion, and self-blame, questioning whether something is “wrong” with her since caring for dogs lost its joy.
• She’s especially worried her dogs might sense the connection fraying—possibly leading them to withdraw (12:12).
• The loss of Baxter, her sick dog, became a further emotional and practical upheaval; she adapted her whole life to his care for years.
• Jane wonders, is this just burnout? Why now, with only two “easy” dogs and no active training (12:34–13:03)?

3. Finding the Proxy: Enter Jen Blough

• Yowei searches extensively for someone with experience like Jane’s—even dog professionals say Jane’s case is rare (16:27).
• Jen Blough, animal welfare professional and therapist specializing in compassion fatigue, shares a resonant story:

  “It’s not that I didn’t love them. It’s not that I didn’t care for them. I was just going through the motions. And that passion, that joy... it just wasn’t there.” – Jen Blough (19:05)

4. Compassion Fatigue: Naming the Invisible Weight

[23:10] Jen introduces “compassion fatigue”:

• Not just for doctors, therapists, or vet med; it affects anyone exposed to others’ (or animals’) suffering.
• Compassion fatigue combines secondary trauma (exposure to distress, suffering, loss in one’s caring role) and classic burnout (overwork, lack of control, exhaustion).
• Physical and psychological symptoms include emotional numbing, hypervigilance, tension, and for some, intrusive thoughts or even suicidality.

  “My jaw just dropped... all these things he’s saying are resonating so deeply. Are you familiar with compassion fatigue?” – Jen Blough (23:10) “A very severe symptom of compassion fatigue... is suicidal thoughts.” – Jen Blough (25:03)

[29:16] Misconceptions:

• People outside the field think animal work is all joy, not seeing the emotional stakes, helplessness, and aftermath.
• “The more sensitivity, empathy, and compassion you have, the more at risk you are for developing compassion fatigue.” – Jen Blough (28:57)

5. The Physiological Cost: Grief, Hypervigilance, and Identity Loss

• For Jane, years of caregiving, loss, and vigilant management—especially with Baxter’s illness—left her body in constant fight-or-flight, drained by anticipatory stress/grief.

  “The thing that’s difficult for me is that the dogs used to actually recharge the battery... and that’s not happening.” – Jane (22:06)

• Jen identifies the survival logic at play: when our bodies are stuck in survival mode, emotional energy—like pleasure or affection for dogs—gets shut down to conserve resources (32:38–33:04).

• The aftermath of Baxter’s death is not just grief for his absence, but for the “role” and identity of caregiver now lost (42:07).

6. Anticipatory Grief & Self-Protection

• Jen introduces the idea of “anticipatory grief”: grieving before the actual loss (37:42).

  “Anticipatory grief is basically grieving before a loss. This can happen if we learn that an animal... is terminal.” – Jen Blough (37:58)

• Jane describes more trauma from being a long-term caregiver than from the loss itself, echoing Jen’s experiences (41:02–42:59).
• The mind, seeking protection, may wall off further bonding and affection to avoid future pain—especially after repeated loss (38:57–40:12).

7. Tools, Healing, and the Path Back to Connection

[44:44–48:33] Jen offers practical advice to address compassion fatigue:

• Seek therapy, pet loss support groups, or other support systems

• Develop hobbies or self-care outside of animal work/care

• Regularly check in with your body for tension and consciously release it

  “If we're walking around with tense muscles, you're going to be irritable, you're going to be impatient... you just have to keep doing it.” – Jen Blough (45:22–45:49)

• Practice “compassion satisfaction”—noticing, naming, and savoring small moments of joy or fulfillment in animal work or pet care. This is a researched antidote to burnout/fatigue.

  “Compassion satisfaction is the joy and the fulfillment that we get from this work... when you do notice those little moments... really try to take that in.” – Jen Blough (47:13–48:07)

• Daily gratitude: List three positive things about your dogs, however small. Both Jen and Yowei vouch for this practice as mood-shifting (48:33).

Jane’s Reflection (49:10):

• “Jack is really, really friendly, and he had to go to the vet the other day, and everybody enjoyed seeing him... Rose is still... softly coming up and laying her head on me. She is a good dog. They’re both good dogs... I’m grateful for that, too.”

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On losing identity:

  "Now who am I? Now what is my role? And so even though there's this burden that's kind of lifted in some way, you can actually grieve the person you were... that full time caregiver you were to the dog." – Jen Blough (42:12)

• On the invisibility of compassion fatigue:

  “I never really considered a thing like a dog trainer would have that too.” – Jane (27:27)

• On surviving as a caring professional:

  “People don’t understand, oh, you’re a dog trainer—must be fun. You get to play with doggies and puppies all day long, and they don’t see the behind the scenes... all of the information, the best job, but if they mess up once—that could lead to a bite... that’s what I struggled with the most.” – Jane (29:54)

• On the irony of compassion:

  “The more compassion somebody has, the higher risk they are for this… it sounds like it’s almost unavoidable.” – Jane (45:49)

• On hope:

  “Compassion satisfaction... is one of the antidotes to compassion fatigue.” – Jen Blough (47:16)

• On validating the struggle:

  “You are still probably actively grieving. Grieving takes so much energy... it’s hard to kind of give that energy back to your other animals. It’s hard to give that energy back even to yourself.” – Jen Blough (40:36)

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Important Timestamps for Segments

• [06:21–13:03] Jane describes the disconnection, guilt, and confusion with her dogs
• [17:17] Introduction of proxy guest Jen Blough; Jen’s credentials and animal family
• [19:03–22:06] Jen shares her own story of emotional detachment after her parrot Albert’s death; parallels to Jane’s case
• [23:10–26:21] Compassion fatigue defined, described, and destigmatized
• [27:27–30:18] Addressing the overlooked labor and emotional cost of “routine” dog work
• [32:24–35:21] The physical/mental toll: hypervigilance, panic, sudden loss routines, and nervous system shutdown
• [37:42–40:51] Anticipatory grief, protective emotional walls, and compassion fatigue mechanisms
• [44:44–48:33] Concrete recovery tools and the principle of “compassion satisfaction”
• [49:10] Jane practices gratitude in the present moment—beginnings of emotional reconnection
• [50:39–end] Yowei’s closing notes: the arc of Jane’s progress, further resources, and show credits

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Final Thoughts

• This episode of Proxy opens a window onto the emotional lives of those who care for living things—reminding listeners that even our greatest sources of joy can, under stress and pressure, become burdens, and that this is natural, not shameful.
• Through Jane’s vulnerability and Jen’s expertise, the episode normalizes compassion fatigue, brings hope for recovery, and makes a compelling case for awareness and self-care in all helping professions.

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Further Resources Mentioned

• Jen Blough’s book: To Save a Starfish: A Compassion Fatigue Workbook for the Animal Welfare Warrior
• Compassion fatigue and pet loss grief groups, animal professional mental health resources
• For crisis support: Call or text 988 (U.S. Suicide & Crisis Lifeline)

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[This summary skips advertisements and focuses on the main narrative and supporting dialogue.]

Transcript

[Yowei Shaw]

If you had to vocalize the sound of this conundrum, what would it be?

[Jane]

I don't know why, but it sounds like a hiccup. I have no idea why.

[Yowei Shaw]

Hey everyone, it's Yowei. On Proxy, we believe no one is ever alone with their problem, no matter how niche, no matter how weird. Because statistically, somewhere out there is someone who gets it. And through the powers of reporting, we find them. Today's case? The dog trainer obsessed with dogs who stop feeling close to her own. A problem I was intrigued by because of its extreme specificity but, as I discovered, speaks to issues a lot of us will end up relating to whether or not we have dogs. That's after the break.

[Jen Blau]

Ever wondered why some trends are just suddenly everywhere? Newsflash. Nothing gets popular by accident. I'm Brittany Luce and on the It's Been a Minute podcast, I take the things you and I are both obsessing over and show you the invisible forces behind the scenes that make us love it or hate it. Be smarter about what you're consuming. Listen to the It's Been a Minute podcast today.

[Yowei Shaw]

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[Jane]

So yeah, tell me about what.

[Yowei Shaw]

What have you been dealing with? What's the situation?

[Jane]

I am having trouble really Engaging and enjoying my dogs. I'm finding myself not having normal reactions to them. Things that in the past, I've had zero problem with. I'm really kind of struggling with.

[Yowei Shaw]

Mm.

[Jane]

I've worked with dogs and had dogs and pretty much been obsessed with them my whole life. It's been the only real constant. And so for that to shift for me not to find that enjoyment in them, it's really weird.

[Yowei Shaw]

At the beginning of 2025, Jane left her job as a dog trainer because her company couldn't provide health insurance anymore, and she started a new job in a new field. She was excited to try something different, and she thought, now that I'm not working with dogs, I'll be able to give my own pups all my dog love. But Jane quickly realized something was off and has been for the past year and a half.

[Jane]

It used to be that, you know, leaving work and coming home to my dogs and. And seeing them happy and excited, that's what made my day. That no matter how bad my day was, like, that's the thing that made it okay.

[Yowei Shaw]

But now Jane finds herself exhausted by her dogs. For instance, she told me about this thing that happened with her dog Rosie, a very empathetic Malinois cattle dog mix.

[Jane]

Rosie is very in tune with how I feel, and if I get frustrated or upset, she wants to be right there, you know, to kind of soothe me, calm me down. And in the past, it's been a nice kind of reminder of, okay, just breathe. It's not that big of a deal.

[Yowei Shaw]

But the other day, Jane was having trouble getting an app on her phone to work and getting annoyed. And Rosie did what Rosie does. She tried to soothe Jane, and she ran over and.

[Jane]

And she shoved her head through my arms, and then the phone goes flying, and it's like, that's literally the worst thing that you could have done in that moment. That was my thought versus how would

[Yowei Shaw]

you have reacted in the past?

[Jane]

I probably would have laughed. I mean, because it's silly, right? I mean, it's pretty comical. But in that moment, it was just like, you've got to be kidding me.

[Yowei Shaw]

These days, Jane is just more irritable with her dogs. She finds their presence suffocating.

[Jane]

I need them to stop following me around the house. They still get in my lap. But even after a while, it's okay to lay next to me. You don't have to be on me.

[Yowei Shaw]

Or take her dog, Jack, a sweet, husky American Eskimo mix who never fights, never stands up for himself, but does get very Excited at dinner time and likes to bark, which now drives her nuts.

[Jane]

I can't tune out the barking anymore. It's like demanding. Can you just give me a second? I'm trying to make your food. It will go faster.

[Yowei Shaw]

In the past, would you get annoyed at your dogs?

[Jane]

I think the most dogs I had for any length of time would was 10 dogs.

[Yowei Shaw]

Oh, wow.

[Jane]

It's a lot. Yep. And they would have times where one would start up and everybody would join in and it was just like a chorus of dogs. And that never bothered me. And then now if they did that, I need them to be quiet.

[Yowei Shaw]

This is maybe a weird question, but could it be anything that your dogs did?

[Jane]

No. Rosie and Jack are. They're good dogs. They're good hearted, they mean well. Actually, they're here. They're asleep right next to me. There's Rosie. Aw, they're so cute. There's Jack.

[Yowei Shaw]

So right now, as you look at them sleeping, being extremely cute, what do you feel?

[Jane]

I'm grateful and I do love them. But as far as that feeling that goes with it, I don't have it.

[Yowei Shaw]

How do you know you still love them if you don't feel emotionally close to them?

[Jane]

Because I do anything for them.

[Yowei Shaw]

I know. Jane means it because for the past two years, up until two months ago, she had another dog, Baxter, who was sick, had been having seizures. And Jane's whole life revolved around taking care of him. For instance, when she realized Baxter's seizures were triggered by excitement, well, no more visitors to the house for company or to help her out. And when Baxter needed medication and meals multiple times a day, Jane just adapted her schedule, didn't complain. So Jane is stepping up and giving her dogs everything they need. And she tries to pretend nothing's different, but she worries that after incidents like the one with Rosie and the phone, they can tell what she's feeling inside.

[Jane]

What's been hardest for me is their reactions after those moments. I don't know, it's not necessarily like a rejection, but you can see that, that connection if this goes on, you know for too long, that they're going to just withdraw.

[Yowei Shaw]

I asked Jane if she's just burned out and she says she only has two dogs now, not the ten she used to. And she's not even training dogs anymore, so that explanation doesn't make sense to her.

[Jane]

I mean, it definitely feels like there's something wrong with me. This is not how somebody with my experience and background should feel about their pets.

[Yowei Shaw]

And this is why Jane came to us. She wants to know, has anyone else experienced this? Is this permanent? Is there anything she can do to get the spark back? When we return, another dog lover turned dog hater.

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[Yowei Shaw]

How are you doing?

[Jane]

I'm good.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

How are you?

[Yowei Shaw]

The day of the proxy conversation, Jane has an update. Not about her current dogs, but about a dog she helped get to an animal sanctuary a decade ago.

[Jane]

There's kind of this pressure in rescue that if you pull a dog from a shelter or you bring a dog in, you kind of have to support that dog forever. And I had a call from this rescue and they asked me to take it and I felt such dread about the whole situation. I had to say, no, I will help with training or whatever, but I can't take. Made it very, very clear, like I cannot do the things I used to do.

[Yowei Shaw]

Yeah.

[Jane]

Yeah.

[Yowei Shaw]

Okay, the proxy is right here. Are you ready for me to let them in.

[Jane]

Uh, sure.

[Yowei Shaw]

So, the proxy. I found it very difficult to find someone who'd been through the same thing as Jane. I talked to animal professionals and researchers who study the human animal bond and dog behavior. I went through podcast guests with names like drinking from the toilet. Nothing. No one had heard of a case just like this. And I was like, I think I'm going to have to write Jane and say, I'm sorry. I can't find anyone. Luckily, I didn't write that email before. One last flurry of messages, which delivered me someone who would end up being so perfect. Perfect for Jane. A woman named Jen Blough.

[Jen Blau]

Hi.

[Jane]

Hi.

[Jen Blau]

Nice to meet you.

[Jane]

Nice to meet you, too.

[Yowei Shaw]

If I'd known our proxy would be named Jen, I would have encouraged Jane to use a different pseudonym. But you'll just have to keep up our proxy. Jen blau has been obsessed with animals since she can remember. She has years of experience in animal welfare, from shelter work to animal control officer working on cruelty investigations. And today she's a licensed therapist who focuses on people who work with animals.

[Jen Blau]

And I have nine rescue animals.

[Jane]

Oh, I gotta know what kind.

[Jen Blau]

Okay, so we got two dogs. We have a rat terrier mix, and our latest addition is a senior pomeranian mix. And I have two bunnies, four parakeets, and a beautiful goat named Gracie, who I adore.

[Yowei Shaw]

Now's a good time to say on proxy we do not do therapy. No one's getting diagnosed or treated. A proxy conversation is just that. A conversation between two strangers who happen to have something in common to talk about.

[Jane]

I have found myself.

[Yowei Shaw]

Jane shares her conundrum with Jen, how dogs have been her whole identity in life. But now she finds herself exhausted by her own two dogs and unable to connect.

[Jane]

As much as I love my dogs, I don't enjoy them.

[Yowei Shaw]

And to top it all off, her third dog, Baxter, just died after two years of intense caregiving.

[Jen Blau]

I'm so sorry. Oh, goodness. Is it all right if I share a little bit about some of my experiences with this?

[Jane]

Yeah.

[Jen Blau]

So I had a special needs parrot named Albert who was. I don't know if you believe in soulmates or not, but he was my little feathered soulmate. We were so incredibly bonded. He was under veterinary supervision, and we were medicating him, and something took a turn for a worse, and he died one night. And I was completely devastated. And I found myself just checking out emotionally. And it was my husband who, you know, finally had to say to me one day, he's like, jen, you've got to get out of bed. You have the rest of this family to look after. And by family, he meant all of our other critters. I had another parrot. We had two dogs. We had some rabbits. And just like you, I really struggled to connect. It's not that I didn't love them. It's not that I didn't care for them. I was just going through the motions. And that passion, that joy that you spoke of, it just wasn't there. And now I know better. But I felt like they were taking away the energy that I needed to grieve for Elbert, and I was resentful of that. They needed me to feed them, they needed me to walk them, they needed me to cuddle with them, to play with them. I just lost Albert. And here you are wanting to play ball.

[Jane]

I feel like I was probably in that place, not disconnected yet, but maybe on that way, even prior to Baxter getting sick, because I had 10 dogs. And while I found homes for a few of them, they were long term fosters, all the rest were older. And I lost them. So, I mean, it's a process that I had gone through several times even before getting to him. And so I didn't necessarily feel resentful. It's just. It was very confusing why my body was reacting before my brain, because I can rationalize it and know that, yeah, my dogs, they're dogs. Even when I'm sad, I'm, you know, mourning Baxter and Jack and Rose, they're going to need all the same things that they need. Of course, their lives actually improved when he passed because they don't have the same restrictions of staying out of the areas he was. I'm around more often. And so after he passed, they were happier. And I mean, the human part of me, yeah, that's upsetting, but I understand it.

[Jen Blau]

Do you almost feel like your battery is like, you know, the little red part where it's showing drained and needs to be charged?

[Jane]

Yeah. And I think the thing that's difficult for me is that the dogs used to actually recharge the battery. Yeah. And that's not happening.

[Jen Blau]

Mm.

[Yowei Shaw]

Proxy Jen says that after her parrot Albert died, she was in the same place as Jane, struggling for about a year and a half on her own. Back then, there weren't as many resources for pet loss as there are today. But then Jen remembered one of her special talents as an animal control officer, that when she had to inform an owner that their pet had died, she was weirdly good at holding space for their grief.

[Jen Blau]

And So I thought to myself, well, you know what? Maybe I should become that resource. Why don't I go back to school and get a degree and actually become a pet loss grief counselor and be that person I wish I had had?

[Yowei Shaw]

Jen went back to school to get her master's in counseling psychology, and she still remembers the moment her professor mentioned the term compassion fatigue.

[Jen Blau]

My jaw just dropped and this light bulb goes off in my head because all these things that he's saying are just resonating so deeply with me. Are you familiar with compassion fatigue? Do you know what that means?

[Jane]

Not much. No.

[Jen Blau]

Okay, well, kind of the simplified answer is, it is the combination of.

[Yowei Shaw]

Jen explains that compassion fatigue is physical, mental, and emotional depletion that comes from two things. First, the stress of constantly being exposed to the suffering of people or animals.

[Jen Blau]

The abuse, the neglect, the abandonment.

[Yowei Shaw]

A secondary trauma where you absorb that pain indirectly and the symptoms are very,

[Jen Blau]

very similar to ptsd.

[Yowei Shaw]

And then on top of that, there's burnout, which is often about workload, lack of control, and exhaustion. In Jen's case, her burnout was a product of the helplessness she felt in her work, never feeling like she was able to do enough.

[Jen Blau]

I could investigate animal abuse. Whether the DA was actually going to prosecute it was one thing, and whether the person was going to be convicted was a whole nother thing.

[Yowei Shaw]

Compassion fatigue is most often studied in nurses, doctors, therapists, social workers, and first responders. But researchers have also found it in animal care professions. And looking back at her career, Jen says so much makes sense now, why she crashed out on jobs again and again, cycling in and out of the animal welfare field. For instance, there was a time she was working in a shelter where one of her responsibilities was to decide which animals weren't safe enough to be put up for adoption, and then she had to euthanize them.

[Jen Blau]

And it seemed to me, looking back, it was about every two or three months I would put down an animal, and then my assistant would leave the room, and I would find myself in the fetal position in the corner of the room, sobbing, absolutely sobbing. And I recognize now I had put up those protective walls just so I could get through the day, and I wasn't processing anything when I got home at night. So it would just be like a dam would break one day, and I would just. Just sob and sob. And I remember at one point holding a needle in my hand and calculating how much pentobarbital it would take to end my own life. Well, little did I know that suicidal thoughts are a Very severe symptom of compassion fatigue. I know better now that compassion fatigue, it is a consequence of caring. It is an occupational risk. When we work with suffering animals or people, we are at risk of developing compassion fatigue.

[Jane]

I know that that was a really difficult thing to share, and I appreciate you sharing that with me. I think that that speaks to how much of an impact these positions can have, because animal control, shelter workers, veterinarians, that's what I think of when I think of the secondary trauma.

[Yowei Shaw]

I remember in one of our earlier conversations, I had asked Jane, have you heard of compassion fatigue? And she said, yeah, but she thought that was only a thing, really, for veterinarians. And she mentioned that a vet of hers had actually died by suicide. She said, it's not a dog trainer thing. And anyway, when her vet died, Jane took it upon herself to not be burned out. That's why she cut back on volunteering. No more fostering, no more rescue, just dog training, and built her life around having a manageable dog situation. Just a few dogs, not 10.

[Jane]

I never really considered a thing like a dog trainer would have that too.

[Jen Blau]

Yeah. And that's why I think that this conversation is so, so important. I remember giving a workshop once for a large shelter, and all of their staff was there, including their maintenance team, and one man had the courage to raise his hand and say, you know what? I feel a little weird about kind of, you know, asking this question because I'm, quote, unquote, only maintenance. And I'm not, you know, I don't have to do the things that all the other shelter workers have to do. But this. This concept of compassion fatigue is resonating with me. And I told him, I said, you are exposed still to, you know, you hear about animal suffering. You see dogs and cats in cages one day and then not the next day. Right. And, you know, not all of them are getting adopted. So, please, I'm so glad you spoke up. I don't want you to discount your own experience, because if you think about it, someone else out there has it worse than me, than you, than all of us. It doesn't mean that your experience still isn't valid. It may be different than an animal control officer. An animal control officer is different than a veterinarian, but it's still valid. And the thing that people don't realize is the more sensitivity, empathy, and compassion you have, the more at risk you are for developing compassion fatigue. And it makes sense, right?

[Jane]

It makes perfect sense.

[Jen Blau]

People don't understand, oh, you're a dog trainer. Must Be fun. You get to play with doggies in little puppies all day long and they don't see the behind the scenes. You work with the animal maybe one hour a week and you're expected to, quote, unquote, fix everything. If you don't train my dog to not bite, we're going to have to euthanize. Or maybe an owner will say to you, I don't know, do you think my dog is safe enough or should we put him down? That is a lot of pressure to be put on someone.

[Jane]

Oh, you've nailed it. All of that, Every bit of it. I have zero control when I'm training over the outcome. I can give all of the information. I can do the best job that I can do, and even the owner can do the best job that they can do. But if they mess up once, that could lead to a bite. Yeah, that's what I struggled with the most.

[Jen Blau]

This is another misconception that a lot of people have. Well, they put the dog down. Why are you so upset? It wasn't even your dog. Well, you are so emotionally invested in that dog's success. I wonder if the owner makes a decision to euthanize, how much self blame, how much guilt you go through?

[Jane]

I don't know if it's just the way that I coped with those situations, but when I realized that that might be the outcome or that's the likely outcome, I emotionally just turned towards the person and was more concerned about them at that point. Several of my clients that wound up having to euthanize their dogs, I've gone with them. It's not a decision that's easy. It's not easy on them. And I've been in that situation where I've had to do a behavioral euthanasia on my own dog.

[Jen Blau]

Yeah.

[Jane]

And it's hard. And nobody should have to do that alone. I also think that I got stuck in this really hyper, vigilant state. Even if I had great lessons that day, it could be a month or two later that I get a phone call that there's been a problem. And so you're always kind of waiting for the other shoe to drop. And I think that when Baxter got sick, that tied into it too. I was constantly just on edge.

[Jen Blau]

So this is so common in really all caregiving and helping professionals. Right. Because a lot of these roles we're dealing with, life or death, you are always on alert. So when you are hypervigilant, what is going on in your body? The racing heart, the shallow breathing, tense muscles.

[Jane]

Yep.

[Jen Blau]

She's nodding yes. You know, I know. I know that all too well. I'm going to ask you something. I want you to check in with yourself real quick. Do you have any tension in your body?

[Jane]

Yeah, so much.

[Jen Blau]

Okay, so that says to me you are still stuck in somewhat of a fight or flight response activation that takes all your energy. So if your brain thinks that we are in danger, we are in survival mode. Why am I spend energy petting you or playing fetch with you when I'm trying to like, literally,

[Jane]

Oh, a hundred percent. Actually, when Baxter passed, even though, like, I knew it was coming, what actually happened was kind of sudden. He had just a run of the mill seizure and that actually left him paralyzed. So I wound up having to euthanize way before we expected to. And so it went from this extremely rigid, structured schedule to nothing overnight. And my body was still so stuck in that state that for weeks I would have moments of panic thinking I forgot to give him a medication.

[Jen Blau]

Yeah.

[Jane]

Or one of the other dogs was next to me and they'd start scratching. Immediately I would think that that was a seizure.

[Jen Blau]

Exactly. I remember a time when I was an animal control officer and we would have these rotating on call shifts at night. And I remember one night I came home, I had taken off my uniform and put on some cozy clothes. And I'm sitting there with my husband and we're watching tv and the phone rang on the TV and I literally jumped off of the couch to go put my uniform on before my brain realized, oh, my God, this wasn't my phone, this was a phone on the tv. But I was so hypervigilant and so still emotionally at work that I literally jumped up to put my uniform on. Here's the thing is, sometimes the nervous system says, wait a minute, we've been in fight or flight for so long and this isn't working. We still don't feel safe. So you know what? We're just going to shut down. So when you talk about having this almost like disconnect from your animals, I wonder if part of you is almost going into shutdown mode to reserve that tiny little bit of energy that you still have. That's where you get some depression, some sadness, some fatigue. You know, you're kind of sluggish, you know, disconnected emotionally. So I wonder if maybe that could be going on too.

[Jane]

I'm processing. Honestly, it's making me emotional because I look back and understand what I didn't understand at the time, how to better protect myself or take care of myself. I thought I was doing it. And I can imagine a lot of other people in these fields think that too. And yet I still wound up here.

[Jen Blau]

I mean, the thing is, you know, we do the best we can with what we have. At the time, I understand how it feels to, like, feel validated, but then almost look back and go, oh, my gosh, all those years, I wish I had known then what I know now. But moving forward, you know, I imagine you have friends that are still in this animal welfare world and now you can help them. You can normalize this for them.

[Yowei Shaw]

After the break, how to start feeling again. Hello. Hi, it's Yowei. If you're listening and thinking, oh, my God, compassion fatigue is probably what my cousin has been dealing with, well, be a good cousin and send them this episode also. We're an independent show, and that's how most people find us. All right, Ads. Welcome back to the show. So, in our conversations, Jane had told me there was this thing that fundamentally didn't make sense to her. When her dog Baxter died two months ago, she said she suddenly felt all of her expected feelings for him. She was devastated. She missed him. She was totally fucked up by grief. But at the same time, the feelings weren't coming back for Jack and Rosie. She was still stuck in that gray place. And Proxy Jen, when she heard about Baxter's death, she was like, oh, I think there's something here. This might be a key.

[Jen Blau]

You lost Baxter two months ago, right? Well, when we kind of learn that an animal's death is imminent, we go through something that's called anticipatory grief. Have you ever heard of that term?

[Jane]

No.

[Jen Blau]

So anticipatory grief is basically grieving before a loss. This can happen if we learn that an animal or a person, of course, is terminal. The day you find out that Baxter has brain cancer, you probably went into the grief cycle. So you could have had. Again. I don't. Don't know that much about you personally, but I'm wondering if, you know, you've had two years of, like, it's almost a preemptive grieving, which is very, very hard on the body, I think.

[Jane]

Not necessarily in a way that I would have been aware of grieving, but the fact that you mentioned it's hard on the body. It is almost a physiological reaction. Before I think about it, I'm having these in the moment reactions with my animals that are not normal for me.

[Jen Blau]

So one of the reasons that we sometimes can have that reaction, it's oftentimes a protective mechanism. This is part of the reality of animal welfare and having companion animals, they generally leave before us. And a lot of people, a very, very high percentage of people, view their animals as part of the family. Some people view their animals as children, especially if they don't have human children. And we are supposed to outlive our children. So even though logically we know that a dog has 10, 12, 15 years on this earth, emotionally, we can't really reconcile that. And so sometimes we can start to feel disconnected from the other animals as a way to protect ourselves. That loss was way too painful. So you know what? We are not going to bond anymore. I am not going to get any. And again, this is all kind of subconscious. Right. You're not, like, saying this out loud, but your brain is kind of saying, whoa, that hurt way too much. I'm going to put up some kind of wall so that it never hurts like that again.

[Jane]

That's actually something that one of my family members brought up that, you know, maybe that's playing a role because I have lost so many over the last seven years. And I definitely think that it. It could be. I don't know what to do with that.

[Jen Blau]

Yeah, I would imagine it's only been two months. You are still probably actively grieving.

[Jane]

Oh, absolutely. Yeah.

[Jen Blau]

Grieving takes so much energy. Oh, my God. Physical, psychological, mental, emotional energy, that it's hard to kind of give that energy back to your other animals. It's hard to give that energy even back to yourself.

[Jane]

I almost feel like it wasn't losing him that was the trauma. It was actually taking care of him that last year.

[Jen Blau]

That was traumatic. Yeah.

[Jane]

Every time he had a seizure. Right. Every problem he had, it's so hard to keep your wits about you. Get his medication, get it in him, talk to the vet. I think that was more traumatic than losing him.

[Jen Blau]

I'm curious to see if this resonates with you, Jane. A couple years ago, so we had three dogs. Our third dog was Della. She was a pit bull mix. And she. She got to a point where she eventually lost the use of both of her back legs. And so now I'm in a position where I am having to 40 pounds of pure muscle pit bull. I have to take her out to go potty. I have to help her walk around the house. I have to carry her. And sometimes I do travel and give compassion fatigue workshops. And so now I have to take her with me. And I'm, you know, I'm at a rest stop, driving down to wherever I'm going, and I'm at a rest stop. And I have, you know, her little harness thing. And I'm. I'm at the rest stop trying to help her go potty. And, you know, it became my whole life. It was this constant, am I doing the right thing? Am I doing enough? Should I be keeping her alive? Should I be doing this? Should I be doing that? And the thing that really kind of struck me when we finally had to make that decision to let her go. You mentioned this afterward. There's this, okay, now what? Now who am I? Now what is my role? And so even though there's this burden that's kind of lifted in some way, you can actually grieve the person you were. You can grieve that full time caregiver that you were to the dog.

[Jane]

I can definitely relate to that. It was so disorienting once he was gone. And then it was just like, I have no restriction on my time. I can go have dinner with somebody if I want. Somebody can come in my house. He's not there to have a seizure. Yeah. It also meant that I couldn't use that as a distraction from the lack of connection with the other two, because once he was gone and I didn't have those tasks to do every day, it's just front and center.

[Jen Blau]

And so now does it seem like you're trying to force that connection?

[Jane]

I'm trying to go easy on myself and not force it too much. But I'll say without Baxter, they're getting pushier about it because I don't see any reason I shouldn't be able to give them attention. Like right now,

[Yowei Shaw]

this is the central thing Jane is flummoxed by. She desperately wants to connect with her dogs and give them affection, but she has this involuntary reaction of blech and Jen. The proxy says totally. And actually, detachment from companion animals or the animals in one's care is a more common symptom of compassion fatigue than people realize. Maybe because people are ashamed to talk about it. Jen has worked with several clients who've had this symptom, and she says there are specific things you can do to change that reaction. She proceeds to give Jane a long list of tools. I'll just mention a few here. Going to a therapist to process your compassion, fatigue and grief. Going to a pet loss support group. Having hobbies outside of caregiving for dogs.

[Jen Blau]

And I know that might make you go, ah, yeah.

[Yowei Shaw]

And definitely doing body scans to check for tense muscles.

[Jen Blau]

I would say this is especially important when interacting with your animals.

[Jane]

Got it.

[Jen Blau]

Is to check in with yourself. Am I all tense? Okay, deep breath, relax, soften.

[Jane]

I'm gonna have to do that one a lot.

[Jen Blau]

If we're walking around with tense muscles, you're going to be irritable, you're going to be impatient, and playing with the dog is not on the priority list. When your brain thinks it's in danger, it's kind of like this thing that you don't even realize is happening. Tense again. So, like 10 minutes later. Okay. You just have to keep doing it, keep doing it, and keep doing it.

[Jane]

Well, the thought that I keep having, especially since you mentioned the more compassion somebody has, the higher risk they are for this, is just based on what you've said, it sounds like it's almost unavoidable. And it's something that you just have to. If you don't know ahead of time, you just learn to manage.

[Jen Blau]

Yeah, when I start to get impatient or irritable with my animals, I'm like, whoa, okay, hold up. Time to do a check in. Because that's when I know that my compassion fatigue is kind of flaring up, and that's okay. I also have a chronic pain condition, probably related to all the trauma that never got processed. I am always going to have to manage that. It's just part of the cards that I was dealt. I chose to put myself in those positions. I'm going to have to manage the consequences, and would I change it? Not for the world. I go back and do it all over again.

[Jane]

I really appreciate all of these ideas because I can see how they'll be helpful.

[Jen Blau]

I think another thing that might help you, and this might be difficult at first, is have you ever heard of something called compassion satisfaction?

[Jane]

No, never. That sounds much better than compassion fatigue.

[Jen Blau]

Okay, well, interestingly enough, it is one of the antidotes to compassion fatigue. We know from research that the more compassion satisfaction someone has, the less risk there is for compassion fatigue and burnout. So compassion satisfaction is the joy and the fulfillment that we get from this work, whether that's your professional work in animal welfare and behavior, or whether it's with your own companion animals. Now, this is not something that you can just force. And so what I would recommend is when you do happen to notice those little moments of feeling joy or those little moments of feeling satisfied and fulfilled, even if they're fleeting, like you catch your dog doing something goofy and you smile. I want you to recognize that. I want you just to really try to take that in.

[Yowei Shaw]

Jen had one other last suggestion for Jane. Every day, at the end of the day, Say three things you're grateful for. This is, of course, a bit corny and cliche, and I've been doing it myself for about six months, and on a couple of occasions where I was feeling pure despair, it pulled me out. I recommend it.

[Jen Blau]

In your case, I would try to start out with, like, either three things you're grateful for about your dogs or three positive things about your dogs. Just the tiniest little thing. So the two dogs played together today, and that made me laugh. Or, you know, I looked over at so and so and saw them sleeping like a baby, and that just warmed my heart, even if it was for only three seconds.

[Yowei Shaw]

Jane, how do you feel about trying that right now?

[Jane]

The positive things about my dogs.

[Jen Blau]

Just the littlest things.

[Jane]

Jack is really, really friendly, and he had to go to the vet the other day, and everybody enjoyed seeing him and he enjoyed being there, and that's positive, and I'm grateful for that. Rose is still. Even on the days that I might be a little more irritable, she's still very softly coming up and laying her head on me or just trying to engage. She is a good dog. They're both good dogs.

[Jen Blau]

Yeah. Like I said, that Bond's still there, that compassion's still there. It's just buried right now under a lot of grief and a lot of exhaustion.

[Jane]

I mean, they're actually both in the room next to me right now. They're super quiet. And that is. I'm grateful for that, too.

[Jen Blau]

There you go. Three things.

[Jane]

Well, I have a. A lot to look into and a lot to think about. Jen, I can't thank you enough. I really, I appreciate it.

[Jen Blau]

Yeah. Thank you, Jane. Thank you for trusting me.

[Yowei Shaw]

Thank you to Jane for being our guest. Since we spoke, Jane has been trying to pay attention to when she feels something, anything with her dogs that's positive. She says while she still can't connect with Rosie and Jack. The other day, something happened. Her family came over and the dogs got excited playing with them, and Jane noticed. She felt a hit of joy. And thank you to Jen Blau for being our proxy. Jen wrote the book To Save a Starfish, A Compassion Fatigue Workbook for the Animal Welfare Warrior. And she has a new compassion fatigue certification program specifically for people who work or volunteer in animal welfare. We'll have those links in our show notes along with more resources on compassion fatigue, pet loss, and mental health support for people working in animal welfare. Proxy will be back on Tuesday, May 19, and every other Tuesday till summer. Follow the show so you don't miss the the Next Case. And if you're new here, I recommend trying Bisexual Wife Guy. It's one of the clearest examples of what the show does. Proxy is an independent show, which means it grows almost entirely by word of mouth. So if this episode made you think of someone, send it to them. That one text is how people find us. If you want to step deeper into the proxyverse, go to proxyhq.org that's where you'll find our free newsletter file under Feelings, which is full of episode liner notes, show gossip and dispatches from the Emotions beat. We just started a series called Emotional Scoops where I ask friends and professional crushes invasive questions like what's their most toxic emotional trait? It's fun. You should sign up and if you want to support the show, you can become a paid member of our Patreon and get ad free listening bonus episodes and live Proxy hangs again. Just go to proxyhq.org thank you to everyone who's become a member this spring season literally wouldn't have happened without you. And if you've been thinking about joining, now's a great time. Your support is what keeps the show going. This episode was edited by Tim Howard, mixed by Kyle Pooley and produced by by me. Music in this episode by Tim Howard. Our theme music is by Breakmaster Cylinder. Funding for the story was provided by the University of California, Berkeley's Greater Good Science center as part of its Spreading Love through the Media initiative supported by the John Templeton Foundation. Proxy is a proud member of Radiotopia from prx, a network of independent creator owned listener supported podcasts. Audrey Martovich is the Executive Director Producer of Radiotopia. Yuri Lozordo is the Director of Operations discover audio with Visionadiotopia FM. You can follow us on Instagram ProxyPodcast and I'm awayshaw. And remember, if you have a niche emotional conundrum you'd like investigated by proxy, get in [e-mail] we're taking cases. Okay, thanks for being here guys. Later.

[Jen Blau]

Sa.