Proxy Podcast Episode Summary: "Zakiya Used to Be So Fun"

Title: Proxy with Yowei Shaw
Host/Author: Y3 Productions
Episode: Zakiya Used to Be So Fun
Release Date: July 15, 2025

1. Introduction to Zakiyah's Story

The episode begins with Yowei Shah introducing Zakiyah Gibbons, a vibrant and extroverted individual who once thrived in social settings but has recently found herself distanced from the very interactions that defined her. Yowei shares a personal connection with Zakiyah, recounting how they met at a podcast event and immediately bonded over light-hearted conversations, highlighting Zakiyah's natural charisma and exuberance.

Notable Quote:

• Yowei Shah (00:05): "I didn't realize that you could develop it."

2. The Transition from Extroversion to Anxiety

Zakiyah reminisces about her past, describing her life in her late 20s filled with an active social calendar, a fulfilling career as a podcast producer in New York City, and a lifestyle centered around nightlife and spontaneous adventures. Her typical week was bustling with work, social dinners, parties, and vibrant interactions, painting a picture of a life full of joy and connection.

Notable Quote:

• Zakiyah Gibbons (06:02): "Like nightlife is extremely important to me. I kind of like being chaotic and having plans on plans on plans."

However, the onset of the 2020 pandemic marked a significant turning point. Lockdowns forced Zakiyah into isolation for the first time, leading her to discover a newfound appreciation for solitude. While she enjoyed the peace, this period also sowed the seeds for her subsequent social anxiety.

Notable Quote:

• Zakiyah Gibbons (07:31): "I love just being in my PJs. I love just my own thoughts, not having to answer to anyone."

3. The Role of 2020-2023 in Zakiyah's Life

As restrictions lifted with the advent of vaccines, Zakiyah attempted to reintegrate into her social life but experienced a severe panic attack at a brunch event in 2023—a first for her in a supposedly safe and familiar environment. This incident marked the beginning of a prolonged struggle with social anxiety, leading her to increasingly avoid social gatherings and withdraw from her previously cherished extroverted lifestyle.

Notable Quote:

• Zakiyah Gibbons (08:32): "I have a full blown panic attack which I've never had."

Multiple stressors compounded her anxiety, including her mother's illness, a breakup, a toxic work environment, and her own health issues. These events collectively deepened her retreat into solitude, making social interactions increasingly daunting and draining.

4. Personality Psychology and The OCEAN Model

To delve deeper into Zakiyah's predicament, Yowei introduces Dr. Bill Chapek, an associate professor of psychology specializing in personality change. Dr. Chapek explains the OCEAN model—Openness, Conscientiousness, Extraversion, Agreeableness, and Neuroticism—as a framework for understanding personality traits and their evolution over time.

Notable Quote:

• Dr. Bill Chapek (20:11): "Personality psychologists have really drilled it down to kind of five things to describe someone."

Zakiyah reflects on her own scores within this model, identifying significant decreases in Openness and Extraversion while maintaining high levels of Neuroticism and Agreeableness. This introspection underscores her internal conflict between her innate personality and the changes she has undergone.

Notable Quote:

• Zakiyah Gibbons (21:19): "I scored a 4.5 out of five on neuroticism. And I didn't really know what that word meant back then."

5. The Proxy Conversation with Dr. Bill Chapek

The core of the episode revolves around a "proxy conversation" between Zakiyah and Dr. Chapek, moderated by Yowei. They explore whether Zakiyah's personality has fundamentally changed or if she can reclaim her former sociable self. Dr. Chapek introduces the concept of normative personality changes, noting that while some traits typically remain stable, significant life events—like the pandemic and personal crises—can catalyze substantial shifts.

Notable Quote:

• Dr. Bill Chapek (25:32): "If you listed everything you did the past week and... those lists would probably be really different... That suggests that maybe you have changed."

Zakiyah grapples with the reality of her transformation, expressing a sense of loss and mourning for her former self while acknowledging that change is an inherent part of life.

Notable Quote:

• Zakiyah Gibbons (25:59): "It's very sobering to hear from someone who does not know me but also knows very well what I'm talking about."

6. Possibility of Change and Practical Steps

Dr. Chapek presents research indicating that personality traits are malleable, especially during early adulthood. Through structured challenges and intentional efforts to engage in new behaviors, individuals can effect meaningful personality changes. He emphasizes that change requires deliberate action, often necessitating stepping out of one's comfort zone despite internal resistance.

Notable Quote:

• Dr. Bill Chapek (35:05): "If you want to change, the thing you have to do is change."

Zakiyah contemplates the practicality of these methods, acknowledging the difficulty but also recognizing the potential for growth and reintegration into social life.

7. Zakiyah's Personal Homework

In a candid moment, Zakiyah shares her personal "homework"—a list of goals and challenges aimed at re-engaging with the world and rediscovering her sociable nature. Her list includes activities like dancing, making new connections, and striking up conversations, reflecting her commitment to change despite her anxiety.

Notable Quote:

• Zakiyah Gibbons (38:25): "So what you're saying is, even if it feels like what you need, don't do it."

Dr. Chapek praises Zakiyah's proactive approach, highlighting the importance of diversifying experiences and pushing personal boundaries to facilitate genuine change.

Notable Quote:

• Dr. Bill Chapek (39:33): "There's socializing stuff, there's wholesome joy in it... and then there's a bunch of risky stuff on here too that will certainly get you outside your comfort zone."

8. Conclusion and Final Thoughts

The episode concludes with reflections on Zakiyah's journey and the broader implications of personality change. Dr. Chapek reiterates that while significant shifts are challenging, they are achievable with sustained effort and intentional actions. Zakiyah expresses a renewed sense of purpose and determination to reconnect with her sociable self, embracing both her need for solitude and her desire for meaningful interactions.

Notable Quote:

• Zakiyah Gibbons (42:26): "I feel like I've been a closed fist for a minute now, and I just feel like the loosening, the fisting isn't."

Yowei wraps up by thanking Dr. Chapek and Zakiyah, encouraging listeners to engage with Zakiyah's other projects and fostering a sense of community support.

Key Takeaways:

1. Personality is Dynamic: Zakiyah's story illustrates how significant life events can alter personality traits, emphasizing that change, while challenging, is possible.

2. Importance of Intentional Action: Deliberate efforts to engage in new behaviors and social interactions can facilitate meaningful personality shifts.

3. Balancing Solitude and Socialization: Recognizing the need for both alone time and social connections is crucial for mental well-being.

4. Support Systems Matter: Building and maintaining supportive relationships can provide the necessary encouragement to pursue personal growth.

For more insights and discussions, consider listening to the full episode of Proxy and join their community on Instagram at @proxypodcast and Patreon to support emotional investigative journalism™️.