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Pursuit of Wellness
Ozempic 101: Microdosing, PCOS, Fertility & Building Metabolic Health w/ Dr. Tyna Moore
01:07:11
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- [00:00]
Dr. Tina Moore
The reason I came out with this concept of utilizing these GLP ones outside of weight loss and diabetes was because we had all this data showing that they had these impacts on different organ systems of the body. Why not?
- [00:13]
Mari Llewellyn
This is the Pursuit of Wellness podcast and I'm your host, Mari Llewellyn. What is up, guys? On today's episode of the Pursuit of Wellness, we have Dr. Tina Moore. She is a naturopathic and chiropractic physician with expertise in regenerative medicine. She is joining us today to provide clarity on GLP1 medications, aka OIC and variations of OIC. I have touched on this in a few episodes with other experts, but finally we have an expert who really is honing in and focusing on GLP1 and giving us the information that we want to know. She has a background in metabolic health and chronic pain management. She explains how GLP1 can benefit individuals with weight loss goals, PCOS and insulin resistance. She shares valuable advice on individualizing doses, understanding how these medications interact with insulin and muscle mass, how to approach conversations.
- [01:14]
Fiona Attucks
With your doctors about dosage.
- [01:16]
Mari Llewellyn
We also cover the risks associated with oic, especially in those dealing with metabolic dysfunction, and discuss how these drugs impact areas like fertility, chronic pain, and even addiction. What I found really interesting about this conversation with Dr. Tina Moore is she's one of the first people to discuss.
- [01:34]
Fiona Attucks
The positive effects of GLP1 outside of weight loss.
- [01:38]
Mari Llewellyn
It's pretty incredible, the studies that are coming out about this drug. And she also talks about the importance of dosing. It really seems like a lot of people are taking too much of this medication. I think we've all seen, know some of the influencers in LA who lose a ton of weight all of a sudden, or, you know, people taking it who maybe shouldn't be, or taking too much of it. She discusses the benefit of micro dosing or cycling, and she talks about that today. And I think a lot of people have questions about this drug. And she really, really got into detail. She also talked about things like addiction, which I think is just mindblowing. She made a comment about the homeless population and how potentially GLP1 could be a helpful solution for people who really cannot break their addictive habits. And I just think that that's a really crazy concept. And honestly, I've been thinking about it ever since she said it. So today's episode's really, really interesting and I would just urge you guys to go into it with an open mind. I'm someone who. I've heard a lot of different opinions on GLP1. I've had people come on this, the show who say it's awful. Some people say it's beneficial. I think it's important to have an open mind. Listen, you know, check out the studies, see for yourself. But this, this episode really sort of shifted my opinion on things a little bit and opened my eyes to people who could be benefiting from this in other ways. So before I get rambling, let's hop into this episode with Dr. Tina Moore. Just a reminder to subscribe or follow if you enjoy the episode, leave a review, let me know what you think, and let's hop right in.
- [03:18]
Fiona Attucks
Dr. Tina, welcome to the show.
- [03:20]
Dr. Tina Moore
Thank you for having me. I'm excited to be here.
- [03:22]
Fiona Attucks
We've already been chatting behind the scenes and I'm just so excited to have a new, fresh perspective on this topic. You've become known for being an advocate for microdosing, semaglutide for benefits beyond just weight loss. So really excited to dig in there. You have an amazing resume. You're an expert in holistic regenerative medicine, resilient metabolic health. You're a licensed naturopathic physician and chiropractor.
- [03:50]
Mari Llewellyn
And a podcast host.
- [03:51]
Fiona Attucks
Yeah, I don't know how you manage all of those things, but congratulations.
- [03:54]
Dr. Tina Moore
Thank you.
- [03:55]
Fiona Attucks
I'd love to start just by hearing how you got into this field to.
- [03:58]
Dr. Tina Moore
Begin with on the subject of GLP1s.
- [04:01]
Fiona Attucks
In particular, just in naturopathic medicine in general.
- [04:04]
Dr. Tina Moore
So I was a very sick little kid. I was just from the time I came out the shoot, a very, very sick child, subjected to a lot of interesting medical interventions and gas lit and ignored and didn't have my questions answered. When I, even as a child, I would ask good questions to doctors and they wouldn't answer me and putting on, you know, a litany of drugs that have, many have since been taken off the market. And it turned out, all in all, it was really just like low key autoimmune nonsense happening for my entire life. And I had to go through naturopathic medicine, the training process, just to figure out what was wrong with me and what was going on. And really I became a naturopathic physician so that I could learn and help myself, which I think many of us go on the journey of medicine to do, but more importantly to protect my family because I knew the system as a whole, as we've really seen the past few years, is pretty busted. So to keep my loved ones out of that as much as, as possible, because I don't like doctors, I, yeah, I went down this route. And then I specialized in regenerative injection therapies for the bulk of my career. And that involved, obviously, a lot of injections of natural substances into joints to regenerate them, but also bioidentical hormone replacement, because that's a huge component of pain and immune modulation and then peptides. So getting into the GLP1s was just a natural transition for me because I was like, oh, well, this is just part of the toolkit, right? And it's a really powerful tool. And so started incorporating that into my own personal life, really just discussing it with anybody who would listen. All of my colleagues, I asked, are you guys trying this for anything outside of weight loss? Have you dove into the literature on this? Are you seeing what I'm seeing? And really, it was just a lot of crickets and people wanting to utilize higher doses regardless, so we can talk about that. Like the real concept of microdosing versus what a lot of doctors seem to be doing. Not to say it's wrong, but there's just some difference of opinions there. And all in all, thoroughly blown away with the impact. And while I don't have my big practice anymore, I cannot believe what a massive lever puller this one peptide is in particular. And I think had I had this tool when I was seeing, you know, dozens of patients a week, I definitely would have utilized it more because it's. It. It checks off all the boxes.
- [06:44]
Fiona Attucks
At the beginning, when you first started incorporating it in your practice, what was some of the initial success stories you saw, or was we yourself?
- [06:53]
Dr. Tina Moore
It was me.
- [06:54]
Fiona Attucks
Okay, me.
- [06:55]
Dr. Tina Moore
And then my daughter wanted to try it. She, like many young women, had, you know, an excess £20 or so that just wouldn't come off. PCOS, just very common. This is. This is so many young women's story right now. And I think it's because we are generationally into a pretty adulterated food supply and a toxic burden in the world and a litany of interventions that are applied to us as children. And I think that all that adds up to a lot of women struggling, and then they end up in their 20s and 30s and dealing. They're maybe not even aware that that's what's going on. And then they end up infertile and is a crisis right now that no one's talking about. Even the women doing all the things right. Like, yep, everything, everything right. And then it still seems to be a problem. So I don't think people realize what's happening with fertility rates.
- [07:54]
Fiona Attucks
It's insane. And it's a very Emotional thing to go through. And I feel like I had zero understanding of just how, like, I feel like in life you can work really hard at things and make it happen. Like, I feel like a lot of what I've done I've just worked hard at. And this is the first thing in my life where I feel like I'm working hard and it's not making a difference. And the more I talk about it publicly, the more responses I get from girls my age, older, younger, struggling with the same thing. And it's confusing. When you eat healthy, exercise, do all the right things, sit in front of red light panels, like, you do everything and it still doesn't work.
- [08:35]
Dr. Tina Moore
Yeah. And then the social media influencers make you feel terrible because they have the one thing, the one magic thing, you know, the one, just do this and this is the way. And just eat this way and do this. And it's just not that simple.
- [08:46]
Fiona Attucks
Well, have you seen the trends of, like, Mucinex? Girls are taking Mucinex. Oh, wow.
- [08:51]
Dr. Tina Moore
Just to thin out.
- [08:52]
Fiona Attucks
I mean, I don't really know how.
- [08:53]
Dr. Tina Moore
It works, but probably to thin out, it's a mucolytic. So it's probably to thin out the mucus, which would change the composition of the mucus at the. At the cervix.
- [09:04]
Mari Llewellyn
Hmm, okay.
- [09:04]
Dr. Tina Moore
Which would potentially change the entry of sperm ability.
- [09:08]
Fiona Attucks
I mean, I might try it. Honestly, at this point on TikTok, you see all these things happening and.
- [09:13]
Dr. Tina Moore
Well, NAC is a mucolytic, though, so nac and iodine are both mucolytics.
- [09:17]
Mari Llewellyn
Okay.
- [09:17]
Fiona Attucks
So you could take that too.
- [09:19]
Dr. Tina Moore
Pretty potent ones.
- [09:20]
Fiona Attucks
So I think I heard you when you were speaking about your daughter's PCOS and how semaglutide help her. I think you mentioned cystic acne, too.
- [09:27]
Dr. Tina Moore
Yeah, really severe cystic acne.
- [09:30]
Fiona Attucks
And how does GLP1 help with that?
- [09:33]
Dr. Tina Moore
I think it helps in a myriad of ways. So first and foremost, it impacts the immune system. That was what was most interesting to me. So for me personally, it was about the impacts on the neurologic system and on the immune system, because I'm an autoimmune girl and many of us are. I mean, I think my story is I was experiencing what so many young women are experiencing now. Only I was an outlier in my generation. So I'm Gen X and I was one of the few. And everybody's like, oh, you're fine, especially when you're thin and you look fit and healthy. They're like, what could possibly be wrong with you? And I've had so many neurologic, immune driven issues. And so for me, that was it. So the immune impact I think is huge. We are seeing overall some, definitely some impacts on the hormonal system because I don't know about the friends that, you know that who have taken it, but women will often report shifts in their menstrual cycle as they Adapt to the GLP1. So even at really tiny doses, I'm noticing that to some degree, but it tends to normalize. So it's, I believe it reminds me much like when women go on HRT when they're hitting menopause, there'll be like a 90 day adjustment period where they might have some breakthrough bleeding or they might have some shifts in their menstrual cycle. So it seems to be favorable, not unfavorable. It tends to regulate that out and make it become a little bit more normalized for the woman. Or I shouldn't say normal, but just more predictable.
- [11:07]
Fiona Attucks
Yeah.
- [11:08]
Dr. Tina Moore
Because there's no definite number of what the perfect cycle is. I think that we see massive changes in metabolic health overall, which ultimately is what's driving PCOs. I think the confusing part is, you know, currently we have some folks going around on the podcast saying, oh, you can completely reverse PCOS with diet and you can do it in 12 weeks. And that's incorrect statement. That study was actually 12 weeks of showing initial shifts in PCOS symptomology. It wasn't a cure all. There's no, there's no button that we can push on PCOS to say, this is it. Fix your insulin resistance, it's gone. I wish it were that simple, but as someone who has actually been a treating physician for decades, it is not that simple. We have to pull several levers with pcos and it really comes down to the individual and what's driving it for them. And I think what people don't appreciate is that your mother's health is having a significant impact on whether you have PCOS or not, your grandmother's health. So this is an epigenetic lineage that's happening. And so young women today are experiencing infertility and their doctors are like, oh, here, just do this. And in fact, some of the allopathic interventions are great, like spironolactone. I mean, some of those are wonderful because spironolactones lowers your androgens, which ultimately can help balance the hormonal profile. Right. It's not that we want anything high or low, we just want it working in somewhat of a balance, which is then going to impact your metabolic health. GLP1s do a similar thing with the metabolic health. And ultimately we have to pull several levers if we want to normalize out the experience for that young woman. So I also think it helps rev the mitochondria, which is going to supercharge detox pathways.
- [12:57]
Fiona Attucks
Yeah, that's true.
- [12:59]
Dr. Tina Moore
There's a piece there too. Right? So there's just all these different components. And I'm always thinking of simplicity and compliance. I mean, why would you want to take a litany of supplements, pharmaceuticals, and basically starve yourself into orthorexia? Because you're worried about all the food you're putting in your mouth at such a microscopic level of nuance? Or can we potentially bring in a peptide like GLP1 and have many of these systems regulate out? So maybe you can have a glass of wine once in a while and live a normal life. Or maybe you can have a slice of pizza with your girlfriends when you go out. And it's not, you know, you're not sitting there beating yourself up. There's just, there's impacts here. And I'm not saying it's the lazy way out either. You know, it's just, why not? Why are we white knuckling things?
- [13:52]
Mari Llewellyn
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- [16:23]
Fiona Attucks
Right? No, it's really interesting you say that with PCOS because. So I had cystic acne on and off for 10 years of my life and I was the person who was terrified of eating the wrong thing. I mean, like I was eating pretty much meat, fruit and that was it.
- [16:39]
Dr. Tina Moore
Yeah.
- [16:39]
Fiona Attucks
And like weird coffee replacement. And I was just doing all types of things because it was making me feel better. And like, mentally I thought that these foods were causing my acne, but it was so much deeper than that, I think. And I'm also. PCOS confuses me because I feel like there's no true definition.
- [17:00]
Mari Llewellyn
I feel like everyone just has this.
- [17:01]
Fiona Attucks
Like cluster of symptoms. I know I have like a high follicle count, for example. I've had acne, I've had hair growth. I've had different symptoms. But I live a very healthy, clean lifestyle. I have a regular menstrual cycle. I ovulate, I test for those things. But it's really intimidating when you get a PCOS diagnosis. You kind of feel like trapped in it.
- [17:23]
Dr. Tina Moore
Yeah.
- [17:23]
Fiona Attucks
And you don't really know how to move forward from there. So very interesting that microdosing this semaglutide could be helpful for that because I think I Mean, I'm hearing tons of women responding to my show telling me they have pcos.
- [17:38]
Dr. Tina Moore
I think it's a syndrome. And unfortunately, a syndrome is sort of a blanket umbrella statement in medicine where we're like, we don't know, but it really is. It's a culmination of symptoms, and it's happening to a specific cohort of women. I was diagnosed with PCOS when I was 19, and I was skin and bones and didn't have any cysts on my ovaries, right? So it's a. It's a terrible name in the first place because you don't have to have cysts on your ovaries. It was just one identifying feature of the disease process. And again, it's not a disease. In my head, when a patient walks in and they say, oh, I have pcos, or I see a series of lab markers that are pointing to it. For example, my daughter was showing on labs, she was showing symptomology also at age 6. And I told my entire family, she is going to have PCOS when she grows up if we don't intervene with, at the very least, the foods we're letting her eat. And because she was between households, because I was divorced, everybody was sort of feeding her however they wanted. And I'm over here, like, watching a train wreck in slow motion, right? And so, lo and behold, she hits her adult years and it's like, boom, we have PCOS. And with that comes. I mean, she's 24 now, right? It's a decade. It's been a decade of really severe acne, which is devastating to your social life. It's devastating to your courage and confidence. And it's just. And then people want to start splitting hairs whether it's okay to take a GLP one. And I'm like, well, that's nobody's business. First of all, our medical decisions about what we do is nobody's business. Never has been. I don't know why it was popularized in 2021 to suddenly start asking everybody about their personal medical information. But if we have something that we can apply that's inexpensive, seemingly very safe, I mean, the safety profile in these peptides is showing itself to be pretty incredible and pretty cool data is coming out showing its protective mechanisms on all the things we're concerned it might be causing. And I do think that the dose matters here to some degree. We'll see. I mean, maybe even at the high doses, the studies are showing really great protection against certain things that seem to plague us as humans these days. So what if we could do away with a whole arsenal? Like the average PCOS girly is on birth control, she's on spironolactone, she might be on an antidepressant, you know, then there might be a metformin thrown in as she's getting a bit older. There's usually some weight that's stubborn, that doesn't want to come off, that's driving all the inflammation. And it's just this vicious downward spiral for these girls and they end up my age and they're a complete disaster. So I'm over here like, hey, can we sprinkle a little GLP1 on this? And actually correct it from a root cause perspective? It is healing, it's anti inflammatory, it's healing and it's regenerative to these tissues. So what if applying it to a younger woman might actually help her avoid that hot mess completely when she gets to be my age?
- [20:37]
Fiona Attucks
And ideally remove some of those pharmaceuticals from the list.
- [20:40]
Dr. Tina Moore
Yes. I mean, or get them down to a dull roar of dosage. Right. The very least that, that's always the goal is like let's improve lifestyle style so that we can get all the pharmaceuticals including the GLP1. So you can dose that too high, you can eat right through it, you can drink yourself right through it, you can lifestyle yourself right through that low dose and it won't work anymore. So that's why it's so critical that people do all the other things so that we can keep the dosages of everything we're on super low.
- [21:09]
Fiona Attucks
What other benefits have you seen low dose GLP1 doing for people? So we said hormones, obviously, weight loss, what else have you noticed?
- [21:18]
Dr. Tina Moore
So the metabolic implications are pretty huge. And that's happening on a couple levels. We get improved insulin signaling so it signals when it's supposed to. We get improved insulin reception so the cells actually start to hear it. Instead of becoming insulin resistant, we see certain metabolic pathways revved that are favorable for not only glute 4 translocation, which is the ability of the cell to uptake glucose and use it as fuel, but improved mitochondrial performance. So like the AMPK cert 1 pathways are favorably pushed with the use of GLP1s, we see just sort of body wide inflammation coming down, which is going to improve metabolic health overall. Metabolic health isn't as simple as like glucose into the cell and we want to make it. Everyone hears about insulin resistance, but that's not the only way that glucose gets into the cell. And then once it's in the Cell. Is it being utilized as fuel properly? That's up to the mitochondria. So all of those systems are favorably imp. Impacted with the use of GLP1s. We start to see some of that inflammatory fat come off, particularly the visceral fat, which is driving. It's like a chicken and egg downward spiral when it comes to metabolic health. We see this with young women with a pcos. And I would say the mirror image of that in the older woman my age is when all of a sudden is what was happening to me. Like, boom, £15 around my midsection. We all turn it. I joke, and I don't mean this in any derogatory term, but you know how when you start to approach puberty as a child and that, like, eight, nine year old girl, they all turn into little potatoes? You know what I mean? All the little. We all went through it. Like, we all turn into a little potato shape for a hot minute.
- [23:01]
Mari Llewellyn
Yeah.
- [23:03]
Dr. Tina Moore
We turn back into a potato shape when we hit menopause or perimenopause, and that's insulin resistance. So I'm over here waving the flag like, ladies, we got to jump on this. I've been telling my patients for decades, like, you have to nip that in the bud. But we didn't have anything great to nip into. Nip in the bud. And we're doing the same thing as you were doing. We're doing all the things. There's no more levers to pull.
- [23:27]
Fiona Attucks
Yeah.
- [23:27]
Dr. Tina Moore
And we induce this orthorexia into people, which is just as bad. I mean, I am a lifetime survivor of anorexia, and I've been through orthorexia, and it's like you can't go out, you can't travel, you can't do anything without having.
- [23:41]
Mari Llewellyn
Yeah.
- [23:42]
Dr. Tina Moore
You feel like you live in a bubble. It's like a walking bubble. And we've glamorized it on social media. Yeah. Like, who can be the most restrictive? I only eat beef and salt.
- [23:54]
Fiona Attucks
I've been there. I mean, I do. I know exactly what you mean.
- [23:57]
Dr. Tina Moore
Yes.
- [23:58]
Fiona Attucks
Like, I. When I think about living in LA and the way I used to live my life, I feel horrible for myself.
- [24:03]
Dr. Tina Moore
Yeah, me too.
- [24:04]
Mari Llewellyn
Sad.
- [24:05]
Fiona Attucks
It's sad. And now I feel like I can have a glass of wine or. It's not about, like, it's not about living an unhealthy life. It's about living with freedom.
- [24:13]
Dr. Tina Moore
Right. And I think that there's friendship and food and there's culture and there's. I. I joke because every time I go to LA or any of the bigger cities to do podcasts my friends have. All their friends are on, like, the higher doses of the GLP ones.
- [24:27]
Mari Llewellyn
Yeah.
- [24:27]
Dr. Tina Moore
And they're like, it's no fun anymore. Nobody goes out to dinner. Nobody goes out for drinks. Like, none of their girlfriends want to put anything in their mouth. So they're literally dosing themselves into their orthorexia.
- [24:36]
Fiona Attucks
Yeah.
- [24:37]
Dr. Tina Moore
So anyway, I'm just arguing for a moderate. There's a middle ground. We have to live, and we also have to keep ourselves in check. And we live in a current state of toxic soup on this planet. And so all bets are against you as a woman because of the estrogen receptors that we have. These toxins act as xenoestrogens, and so we're just kind of swimming through this. You were born into it. I was basically fed into it. I was the first generation with the really adulterated food supply when they really started messing with things. And so for young women of your generation, I. I just feel terrible. Like, I feel terrible the way you guys were. You came out of toxic moms.
- [25:18]
Fiona Attucks
It's like dodging bullets.
- [25:20]
Dr. Tina Moore
Yeah. And there's just so many young. And I'm not advocating that we throw children on GLP1s, but there are some young girls out there coming into puberty, and all bets are against them just by means of the fact that they were swimming in insulin and utero because their moms were so metabolically compromised. And they're marked now genetically and epigenetically for life to have a significant risk for obesity and type 2 diabetes. And why are we waiting until people are obese or type 2 diabetic at all? Like, there's decades in there where interventions could happen. So I just. On that. And I'm. Again, I'm not arguing for GLP1s as a weight loss tool. That. That is a whole other argument I could make for. I could go on for hours about that, but because obesity is complicated. But why are we waiting until people are so far down? I'm just over here saying, hey, we have a tool, so let's just put it out on the table. That personalized, individualized dosing. Maybe not even call it microdosing. I kind of want to kick myself for spreading that term around because it's really just personalized, individualized, inclusive dosing.
- [26:29]
Fiona Attucks
Yeah.
- [26:29]
Dr. Tina Moore
Right. Like, what dose do you tolerate that's going to help you move the needle for the goals that you have, which may have nothing to do with weight loss, but it will always have something to do with metabolic health just by the state of the world we live in and and why are we not discussing that as an option?
- [26:53]
Mari Llewellyn
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- [29:18]
Fiona Attucks
People hear metabolic health, they think, oh, that doesn't apply to me because I'm not obese.
- [29:23]
Dr. Tina Moore
Right.
- [29:23]
Fiona Attucks
Would you say that applies to everyone?
- [29:25]
Dr. Tina Moore
Yes.
- [29:26]
Fiona Attucks
Okay, how come?
- [29:27]
Dr. Tina Moore
Well, 2018 data. Let me just go back. I started in practice in 2008, and my mentor taught me to screen everybody because he was talking about metabolic health back in the 90s. He was like, get off the treadmill, lift weights, eat meat, avoid. There was no carnivore diet. There was no paleo diet even. He was just like, stop eating white foods that are high in starch and carbs.
- [29:48]
Fiona Attucks
Because ahead of his time.
- [29:49]
Dr. Tina Moore
Yeah. And he was telling me to keep a check on waist circumference at all costs. Keep a check on blood pressure, keep a check on waist circumference, and make sure people are strength training to optimize their bone mass and their muscle. Muscle mass. And, you know, live in moderation, get outside, make sure you get sunlight. I mean, all the things that are popularized now. Like, I was hearing this straight out of College in the mid-90s. So I go into practice and I start running metabolic markers on everybody, and everybody has some version of compromised metabolic health. It's glimmers sometimes. It's not like full frank disaster zone. It's just, hey, you're headed down this path. And if we don't do something, like, maybe we're seeing some changes in lipids, we're seeing some changes in serum insulin, we're seeing some changes in your blood sugar handling, we're seeing some changes in your inflammation. Maybe you're not able to get your vitamin D levels up because you're inflamed. Like, these are all glimmers. And when they add up together, they add up to a story. And then you look at the individual in front of you and how they literally appear, and you take some measurements and some vital signs, and then you take their history and you're like, okay, you are headed down this path. And the only way to get out of that is everything I just mentioned. And my colleagues would give me shit. They were like, oh, Tina thinks everybody has metabolic dysfunction. And here we are in 2024, 2018. Data showed that roughly, gosh, 94% of US adults have busted cardiometabolic health. That was pre lockdowns, so God only knows what it is now. And so, yeah, I would say metabolic health concerns applies to everyone, including children. And so it has not nothing to do with what Size you are, you can be skinny fat, which is that thin on the outside, fat on the inside, where you're just fat and bone. I saw this all the time in practice. I don't know how many of your friends probably still the ones who brag, oh, I can fit in my jeans from high school, but they haven't seen the inside of a gym and they wouldn't know a squat if it hit them in the face, you know, And I'm like, well, good luck with your hip fracture when you're 80. Like, have fun with that.
- [31:49]
Mari Llewellyn
Right?
- [31:49]
Fiona Attucks
I like that one. That's a good one. I'm going to pull that out.
- [31:52]
Dr. Tina Moore
Have fun with that when you're, you know. And then I'm in the gym this morning at the hotel, and we're at a pretty booty bougie hotel and it's all these skinny women with their little dumbbells. I made a post about it on Instagram. I was like, ladies were trying to build bones in an ass. We're not trying to tone our arms. Like, what are you doing?
- [32:08]
Fiona Attucks
You know, I hate the word tone. I. It drives me insane. If people tell, they say the word tone to me, I'm like, what does that mean to you? Like, what is the definition of tone? Because what they, what it actually means is that you can see muscle and to get muscle you have to lift heavy. Yeah, yeah, I agree with you.
- [32:25]
Dr. Tina Moore
It was literally a bunch of, of skinny squishy women with little tiny dumbbells going like this, like, doing this like angel thing for their arm sculpting. And I was like, oh my God, just go do some push ups.
- [32:36]
Fiona Attucks
I'm glad you're saying this and not me, because I agree with you, but I don't have to say it.
- [32:42]
Dr. Tina Moore
Pick up something heavy, do some squats. We're trying to build an ass. Because when you build your butt, the big muscles of your thighs and your booty are what keep your metabolic health in check. Metabolic disease starts in the thighs and. But so for that middle aged woman who was like, I used to have an ass and now it's completely flat, I don't know what happened. That's your insulin resistance starting. That's what's happening. And when you end up insulin resistant, especially if you look at diabetics, they get the visceral fat and the big belly and then they start to atrophy in the appendages. It's a feed forward mechanism. So you literally start to lose muscle mass in your legs and arms.
- [33:17]
Mari Llewellyn
Interesting.
- [33:18]
Dr. Tina Moore
As your insulin Resistance and your metabolic dysfunction function is blooming, if you will. And then that makes it worse.
- [33:26]
Fiona Attucks
Yeah.
- [33:27]
Dr. Tina Moore
So they end up frail, weak, fat in the wrong places. Even if they're still thin, they're still fat in the wrong places, and then their bones are brittle, and then, you know, that's. That's my age cohort.
- [33:41]
Fiona Attucks
This makes me feel better about having muscular legs because I feel like a lot of girls want stick legs because it's kind of the trend, you know? But, I mean, helpful to know that having muscular legs is going to help us later in life, too.
- [33:51]
Dr. Tina Moore
Oh. Every time I see pictures of you on Instagram, I text Drake and I'm like, she has such a great lower body. How do I get that? Because I. Best case scenario for me, I'm like, I'm going to be the potato shape no matter what, you know, so I'm always over there. Like, how do I get hips and thighs?
- [34:07]
Fiona Attucks
You are so far from a potato. You look amazing.
- [34:09]
Dr. Tina Moore
Thank you. But I mean, I am prone to. My whole family is a bunch of little apples, you know, with little stick legs and so. And no bet. And I'm like, I can't lose the booty. Trying to keep the thighs. You look great. Thank you.
- [34:21]
Fiona Attucks
But I always said I had rugby legs growing up because my dad's Welsh and he's. He's got thick legs, too, so I don't know. But I'm gonna keep lifting weights. I feel good about it now.
- [34:30]
Dr. Tina Moore
It's great. Trust me, this is going to help you age. And this is. You're going to be way better off than your skinny girlfriends when you're my.
- [34:38]
Mari Llewellyn
Age, Fee, that's usually.
- [34:40]
Dr. Tina Moore
Yeah.
- [34:41]
Fiona Attucks
I've also heard you say that GLP1 can help with the microbiome.
- [34:46]
Mari Llewellyn
How does that work?
- [34:47]
Fiona Attucks
And I think you told a story of your mother's Crohn's disease.
- [34:50]
Dr. Tina Moore
Yeah.
- [34:51]
Fiona Attucks
How does that help the microbiome?
- [34:53]
Dr. Tina Moore
So all the studies I'm finding show that it shifts the gut microbiome. So we have favorable organisms and we have pathologic organisms. I hate to make it that blanket of a statement, though, because I think of the gut microbiome, I think of everything as symbiotic until it's not. So everything has a place. Like, we all have strep in our throats right now. It's just a matter. When people say, oh, I got strep throat, I'm like, no, you have strep in your throat. It's just a matter of how your immune system's doing as to whether the strep gets to take hold and have a party. And so we have a mishmash of fungus and bacteria in our gut and they're all well and good until they're not. And so we never want one group to take too much power. Kind of like our political system, right? We never want one group to take too much power. We, we want to balance in the force and we have organisms that are favorable usually, but they can also be unfavorable. So we're always looking for, for the balance there. GLP1 seem to be that regulator best, best way I can put it from all the data that I'm looking at that it just seems to shift the microbiome. I do think that. But when people start on these, there is a little breaking in period where they'll start to see a shift. A lot of people report that they actually have improvement in their bowel movements. So they'll say, wow, my bowel movements are way better formed. They're much more comfortable. Others will say, now I'm constipated and it's uncomfortable. Others will get diarrhea and it takes a minute for that to sort out. I think that's the gut shifting. So I think if people are dosed too high, too fast, it can be a really uncomfortable shift. And that's where we're seeing some of the nausea and vomiting. It's not just the GLP one directly impacting gut by slowing gastric motility or causing nausea. I think it's actually a die off reaction of a lot of these organisms in the gut getting shoved too fast.
- [36:47]
Fiona Attucks
Interesting.
- [36:48]
Dr. Tina Moore
So again, my reasoning behind slow and low because we just want to nudge the system. So we want to nudge the individual who's taking whatever it is we're giving them and we want to nudge their microflora. That could be your skin microflora, that could be your gut microflora. We're just trying to like gently walk you down the line to better health and to optimization instead of like, hey, let me slam you with this, you know, and hit you with a brick. So I think that there's potential for people to have a really difficult transition on these if it's done too abruptly.
- [37:20]
Fiona Attucks
What are people doing wrong with Ozempic? Because I guess my first experience seeing it in action, I was living in LA when it got popular. LA is a very aesthetic place. There's a lot of models, people, you know, who make a living off of the way they look and a lot of like really lean girls Getting on the medication and getting really, really skinny.
- [37:45]
Dr. Tina Moore
Yeah.
- [37:46]
Fiona Attucks
What's, like, going on there? Are people addicted to it? Like, let's talk about the way people are using it wrong.
- [37:52]
Dr. Tina Moore
I think people are addicted to being thin.
- [37:54]
Fiona Attucks
Yeah.
- [37:55]
Dr. Tina Moore
Which I have been guilty of. Like, it's pretty addictive. I. I do think, too, that there's such a profound impact on the brain with GLP1s that people feel really good on it. And I dare say the word antidepressant, but for me and for others that I know, that has been a really favorable side effect is just this mood boost, and we have data to support that of it reducing anxiety and improving mood pretty significantly. I think you can overdo it there, and you can put yourself into this, like, state of not wanting anything. And that's not great either. We don't want to overdose people into not wanting to eat, not wanting to seek joy, not wanting to have, you know, any kind of intimacy with their partners. Like, you can go there too, with it. But I think that there's a sweet spot, and they feel good. And that part's addictive. You're always chasing the dopamine. Right. And it does impact dopaminergic pathways, so people. And serotonergic. So we're getting serotonin and dopamine on board. So that might be the reason people think more is better. And then, of course, being really thin is. That's just been going on forever, though. Like, the whole being skinny addiction, like that has been popularized for many generations. It just comes in and out. I heard the other day that the Kardashian hips and butt images out, and now they're calling it the ballerina body and the, you know, the plastic surgery clinics. And I'm like, this is ridiculous. Like, we're all built differently. Why don't we just optimize how we're built like our own?
- [39:30]
Fiona Attucks
Doesn't it make you wonder, like, how long celebrities have been using Ozempic?
- [39:34]
Dr. Tina Moore
Oh, yeah.
- [39:34]
Fiona Attucks
You know?
- [39:35]
Dr. Tina Moore
Yeah.
- [39:36]
Fiona Attucks
Like, I'm sure for longer than we realize.
- [39:37]
Dr. Tina Moore
Yeah, right. Yeah.
- [39:39]
Fiona Attucks
And now, like, we're watching influences. I mean, people throw allegations around all the time. And I don't. I don't think many people are open about it, but you can kind of tell when someone just suddenly dropped 30 pounds out of nowhere.
- [39:52]
Dr. Tina Moore
Yeah.
- [39:53]
Fiona Attucks
And what is that?
- [39:54]
Mari Llewellyn
So.
- [39:54]
Fiona Attucks
So I obviously had a large weight loss journey in 2017 before Ozempic, which is really funny to think about. Like, I've had a lot of people ask me, like, would you have used it back then? I Don't know if I could have afforded it, but I'm almost. I'm glad I didn't have it then because I think I learned a ton. Like I wouldn't have learned what I learned if I had had that as a tool. But now I'm learning more about the other benefits. It's. It has.
- [40:28]
Mari Llewellyn
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- [41:49]
Fiona Attucks
I'm just curious, like these people dropping weight this quickly, like what are the side effects of that?
- [41:54]
Dr. Tina Moore
Let's talk about that. So first of all, it induces neuroplasticity. So there's your brain is rewiring when you're on it. So whatever you're doing in your lifestyle during that period is getting hardwired in, which can be really cool if you think about it. If this person is being supported with all the lifestyle changes and they have this window of opportunity to learn all the ways of taking good care of themselves through diet, nutrition and optimizing their sleep and all that jazz, then that's going to get more hardwired in. So they're creating new habits in a much more intense way, which is very cool. But if we go too far, especially too fast, you do end up losing muscle and you do End up losing soft tissue and you end up potentially much worse off than you started. But again, that's been going on since the beginning of time. You know, back when I was a teenager, it was like Kate Moss and heroin chic, everybody. We were all trying to be. I was guilty of it. I mean we were bone thin. I was always, I have these big gymnast wrists because I, you know, from landing all the time in gymnastics. And I was always trying to make sure that my upper arm was as small as my wrist.
- [43:03]
Fiona Attucks
Wow.
- [43:04]
Dr. Tina Moore
That is how I live.
- [43:05]
Fiona Attucks
That's crazy.
- [43:06]
Dr. Tina Moore
So I changed. We just chain smoked our way into it.
- [43:09]
Fiona Attucks
You're like, we use cigarettes.
- [43:11]
Dr. Tina Moore
So we just chain smoked and starved ourselves and lived off coffee.
- [43:15]
Mari Llewellyn
Great.
- [43:15]
Dr. Tina Moore
You know. Yeah. I wonder why I was sick all the time. So. And induced all my autoimmune disease. That's been going on forever though, you know. So this is just another tool.
- [43:25]
Fiona Attucks
Yeah.
- [43:25]
Dr. Tina Moore
And you end up crashing out your metabolism for the long term. So now as I hit menopause, I am struggling with metabolic dysfunction. Even with the best of intentions, even, you know, I started training when I was 40. I wish I had found strength training earlier, but I didn't start till I was about 40 because I did not want to walk into menopause and have it be a total train wreck disaster. So I trained for menopause. But even with the best of intentions, I still ended up with this like low key insulin resistance. And that's loss of estrogen too. I mean there's other pieces to this puzzle but. But that's what you do you think about, I don't know if you remember any of the like rock goddesses from the 70s, like oh, Stevie Nicks, of course, you know, and then Linda Ronstadt and they were all super skinny and beautiful and they were all on cocaine and they were. That was the tool they used. Right. We've all had our tool. So every generation has its tool. So my generation had fen pen. Right. Everybody was. Had a tool to get themselves rail thin. But there is a cost to living at rail thin without muscle. And that is years later, your metabolism completely turns on you and it's a train wreck. So all of those women ended up ballooning and getting quite big. Right. And so it's, it's a balance. The, the only way out truly is through muscle and good health and good nutrition. And then we have tools.
- [44:49]
Fiona Attucks
Yeah.
- [44:50]
Dr. Tina Moore
That we can use. So I think, to answer your question, I think these women are just using the GLP1 as the only tool.
- [44:55]
Fiona Attucks
Right.
- [44:56]
Dr. Tina Moore
That's a Disaster.
- [44:56]
Fiona Attucks
Waiting and not changing their lifestyle with it.
- [44:59]
Dr. Tina Moore
Oh, that's a disaster. But you know what? That's on them.
- [45:01]
Fiona Attucks
Yeah.
- [45:02]
Dr. Tina Moore
Like, we all worry so much what everyone else is doing, and I'm like, well, good luck. Like, you're gonna have diabetes and you're gonna probably be overweight when you're 50. But have fun with. And, you know, definitely the osteoporosis. I'm just looking at all their bones. I'm looking at some of these celebrities that are so, so thin. And I'm like, oh, you're gonna take a step wrong when you're my age and it's not going to go well. Right. So I'm always thinking, long game for.
- [45:25]
Fiona Attucks
Someone listening who maybe has been on semaglutide and has lost a lot of weight and is feeling really good about it, but now they are concerned about coming off of it, lowering their dose. I think a lot of people kind of feel stuck and they don't know where to go from here. What would you recommend they do moving forward?
- [45:47]
Dr. Tina Moore
That's tough because they've acclimated their cellular receptors to needing that much of a substance. So that would be like a bodybuilder who's taken a ton of testosterone, and then they end up in my clinic in middle age, and they're like, I really, you know, they're. They really need some testosterone and they want physiologic dosing. And that doesn't always work. Sometimes we have to keep things a little bit higher. So I guess it depends on how long they've been on it, how old they are, what their metabolic health is overall, how much muscle mass they preserved. But you can titrate anything down. Right. So this is, again, why I'm a proponent of keeping things slow and low. And when I talk microdosing, I'm talking like a fraction of the starting dose. A lot of these clinics and medi spas are talking about using the standard starting dose and calling that a microdose.
- [46:35]
Fiona Attucks
What's the starting dose?
- [46:36]
Dr. Tina Moore
The standard starting dose of semaclutide is 0.25 milligrams. And. And it's 2.5 milligrams of tirzepatide. And they're starting people there, and they may be jumping them up to the next tier, and they're calling that a microdose. That is not a microdose, in my opinion. That's a low dose, but that might be what that person needs. It depends on how compromised their metabolic health is. It's completely individualized for the person sitting in front of me. And then I have a whole litany of other things that go in there. So there's other peptides we use and there's hormones and there's, you know, we're treating them comprehensively. This is what I teach inside my course and it's a course for clinicians, but I let the general public in because this is a comprehensive treatment approach so that we can keep the GLP one. It's just a tool in the tool belt. It's one of many. It's a huge tool and it's a big lever puller. But we want to keep that dose as low as possible. And so when folks are saying like, how do I get off of it? Or I stopped losing weight on it or it didn't work for me, I'm like, well, how are the rest of your hormones? How is your gut health? How's your adrenal health? How's your thyroid? How's your strength training going? How's your muscle mass? These are all things that we have to consider because that's what needs to be in place. So when someone says, how do I get off this whomp and dose I'm on? I'm like, how's everything else going? Right? And focusing on all of those being in balance so that we can bring that down to the lowest dose necessary. If it's only used as a monotherapy and it's the only crutch we have, not great. That's not a great long term strategy in my opinion.
- [48:02]
Fiona Attucks
I'm just thinking like, so you're a naturopathic doctor. I feel like if these medi spas and places where people are getting it from are putting people on these high doses to start.
- [48:15]
Dr. Tina Moore
Yeah.
- [48:16]
Fiona Attucks
Are they even recept? Like let's say you go. I mean, Fee has talked about her ozempic journey on here, so I'm just going to throw Fee under the bus right now. But like Fee is wants to explore microdosing. Can she go to her regular doctor and say like, oh, I heard someone recommend this, I want to try it. I'm like, what could we recommend? Can people request that from their normal doctors? Like a normal doctor's gonna understand that concept.
- [48:43]
Dr. Tina Moore
I think any doctor who. So I think doctors are inherently good. I think they get a bad rap. I think it's the system that's busted that they are forced to practice within that gives them a bad rap. And I think any doctor worth their salt who has a brain is always going to prefer a lower dose of any medication over a higher dose.
- [49:01]
Fiona Attucks
Yeah.
- [49:02]
Dr. Tina Moore
So a reasonable doctor is going to happily agree to help you titrate down.
- [49:08]
Mari Llewellyn
Okay.
- [49:08]
Dr. Tina Moore
So just the idea of titrating down to the lowest minimal dose. And I think people might be surprised, especially if they're young and healthy and active and they're eating well, you know, the opportunity to get that dose lower is probably there. If we're talking about somebody who is older, you know, like my dad, severely diabetic and overweight. I only have him on like half the standard dosing journey though, you know. So semaclutide starts at 0.25 and it goes up to 2.5, and I've got him somewhere in the middle. And we took a whole year to get there. And he's having great weight loss and great success and great changes in his lab markers. So we're just going to stay there. So my argument to everyone listening, whether they're health practitioner or just the general public, is just go slow and low because you'd be really surprised how little somebody may need. Although don't be afraid to give them something more if they need it. I'll give you an example. I have some colleagues who never really talked to me about my strategies and claim to be microdosing themselves. And they've got patients on these really low doses thinking that that's preferable and maybe it's helping these folks with their autoimmune symptoms. But these folks have weight to lose and they do have metabolic dysfunction. And then I check in with these folks because I know them all and I say, how's it going? And they're like, I haven't lose a pound, I haven't lost a pound, I haven't lost any weight. And I'm like, well, you need a higher dose. Why are you not taking a higher dose? You are more metabolically compromised. The healthier and metabolically more metabolically optimized someone is the lower dose they need is what I found. But that's not. It's individualized. I've got people who are full of muscle mass and eating super well and super healthy with very little weight to lose. And a microdose doesn't move the needle. So we need to go to more of a standard dosing. So it's just a matter of working with the person and then the person being a proponent and an advocate for themselves. And that's where getting educated comes in. That's why I have my course or all the free content I have out there about this is because, like, if you're educated, you're empowered. And I think that, that any therapeutic that you choose, whether it's hormones, peptides, all of it, the better you go in, the more educated you are, the better conversations you're going to have with your doctor, and the better you guys can work as a team. Because I've learned a ton from my patients over the years who came to me with ideas and strategies that they'd either read about or learned about somewhere else. And I'm like, hey, yeah, let's try it out. As long as it's sound, it's not going to hurt anyone. We have some data to support it, but even if we don't, the reason I came out with this concept of utilizing these GLP1s outside of weight loss and diabetes was because we had all this data showing that they had these impacts on different organ systems of the body. Why not? We are allowed to use things off label. Right. So just to wrap that all up, we're just titrating up to the minimal dose necessary or maybe titrating down. But for those who are really severely metabolically compromised, who've been on very high doses for a long time, I don't know if there's going to be a comedown. I don't know if microdosing is in their cards. And microdosing is not a weight loss strategy either. It might be for someone your age and of your health, but it's generally. I'm getting a lot of pushback out there. Like in news articles and online people saying, Dr. Tina said microdosing is amazing for weight loss and it's not working. And I'm like, no, I never said that. Actually, it's for other things. If you are metabolically optimized. Yeah, it can help you lose weight if you're metabolically optimized at the micro doses. But if we are talking about 30, 40, 50 pounds, we probably need a more standardized dose and we may need to go up a little bit.
- [52:48]
Fiona Attucks
I think there's like a gray area.
- [52:50]
Mari Llewellyn
Right.
- [52:50]
Fiona Attucks
And people don't really like to talk about the gray area. They want the black or the white.
- [52:53]
Dr. Tina Moore
Yeah.
- [52:54]
Fiona Attucks
They want, you know, a definite answer.
- [52:56]
Dr. Tina Moore
Yeah.
- [52:57]
Fiona Attucks
Are you a fan of cycling? Of, like, going on, going off, going on, going off?
- [53:01]
Dr. Tina Moore
Yes.
- [53:02]
Fiona Attucks
Okay.
- [53:02]
Dr. Tina Moore
I think cycling anything. So we're always trying to keep the receptors sensitized. We always want to make sure that the receptors hear what we're giving. So even with hormones. Right. So with progesterone, we take the week of menstruation off. I may even Take time off in between estrogen dosing. Depends on what we're using it for. Testosterone, same thing. I've got several patients in my career, I've had several patients that were young men who had histories of traumatic brain injury because maybe they played hockey or they were football players or whatever, and they needed testosterone because they'd really done damage to their brain earlier in their life and that impacts your hormones down the line. And they didn't want to be on it 247 because they wanted to have children and they wanted to be fertile. And so utilizing testosterone in a cyclical fashion, and that might be a couple times a year, it might be taking, you know, doing a cycle and then taking a cycle off. It might be with the GLP1s. I've got people taking a couple weeks off in between shots. We've got people taking a couple months off. It really just depends on what we're.
- [54:04]
Fiona Attucks
Using it for and what is the difference? Okay, there's O Tide Wagovy.
- [54:13]
Dr. Tina Moore
Okay, so Semaclutide is the generic name, the FDA approved drug version of that, which is. That's. That's your Ozempic. Ozempic isn't actually for weight loss. So it's kind of funny that everybody's throwing around Ozempic for weight loss. It's still semaclutide. It's just FDA approved for type 2 diabetes, is OIC. FDA approved for weight loss is Wegovy, but it's also tied.
- [54:38]
Fiona Attucks
Got it.
- [54:38]
Dr. Tina Moore
And then we have Tirzepatide, which is the generic name of Manjoro, which is FDA Approved for type 2 diabetes, and Zepbound, which is FDA approved for weight loss. And now Zepbound comes in bile form, not just the pen. So there's opportunities for more individualized dosing. There again, I want to hit myself with the microdosing thing because that definition has gone. I mean, I've seen people on TikTok, they're like, I'm splitting up my dose throughout the week. So I guess I'm microdosing now. And I'm like, no, no, no, no, no. That's all I'm proposing is that we just consider individualized dosing. Because even in the realm of weight loss and type 2 diabetes, there's still some folks who cannot tolerate that standard starting dose. It makes them too nauseous and sick. Why are we making them suffer until their body adapts or they get off of it and they say it's not for me. I think it's exciting that they're Zepbound now in a vial. And we can use compounded, of course, but the vial gives us opportunity to individualize that dose.
- [55:35]
Fiona Attucks
Right, and why are people choosing certain forms of it than others? Like are some better than others? Is the price different? Like, what's the differentiator with the brand names?
- [55:46]
Dr. Tina Moore
There doesn't seem to be much of a price difference. It's all just exorbitantly, ridiculously expensive. Which is silly because there was a study that came out recently showing it costs like five to seven dollars for them to make it it. And then they're selling it through pharmacies for a thousand, roughly a thousand bucks, give or take, sometimes less, sometimes more. The same exact drug is being sold in Germany and Canada for like a couple hundred bucks. So I don't know what's going on there. That's a whole other thing. The compounded version, semaclutide is easily the most affordable. Tirzepatide is three to four times as much in the compounded versions. Semaclutide is just a GLP1 agonist. So it sits on the GLP1 receptor and it acts as GLP1. It's basically bioidentical to our own endogenous, bodily made. So we make GLP1 in the gut and we make it in the brain and that's where it's used. It's used throughout the body. But the fact that was what got me excited. I'm like, wait, if it's made in the brain, there's probably a reason it's in the brain. That's not just appetite suppression. There's other things going on there. So that's semaclutide. It just has been tweaked to keep its half life longer. Endogenous, naturally made GLP1 is in and out, it's produced and then it's used up or becomes inert very quickly within hours. And the semaclutide is good. The half life on it's like four to seven days. And then tirzepatide is a GLP1 agonist and a GIP. So it's acting on glucagon as well, directly. I think the implications there are going to be more applicable to those struggling with a bit more insulin resistance and a bit more metabolic dysfunction. So your PCOS girlies are probably going to find some benefit with that gip. Interestingly, with glucagon, whether we agonize it or antagonize it, it seems to have good impacts on the body. So we don't have anything we have, we have some coming to market. It looks like that might impact glucagon the opposite way and still have a favorable impact on the GLP1's ability to do good things in the body. So that's a nerdy way of saying we don't entirely understand how these are working, but it's pretty cool that we have that little extra added. I will say though, in somebody like myself, Tirzepatide can really bottom out the blood sugar. And so that's something that I have several women that I know that are my age who you would look at them and be like, oh my gosh, phenomenal figures. You know, six pack abs, still really, really great muscle mass and physiques, doing everything right, eating like saints. And all of a sudden their blood markers, their blood sugar handling is starting to get wonky and that's just part of the transition into menopause. And it's, you know, they've got familial stuff going on and it's really frustrating for them. And so we try a tirzepatide and a little bit too much can be a lot too much in the those folks because all of a sudden they're calling me, freaking out and I'm like, check your blood sugar. And it's just bottomed out. And it can hit you at the most inopportune times where I'm like driving and I have to pull over and eat something. So that gip, that's what I'm getting at. Having that on board can really start to impact the insulin and sometimes it's not so favorable. So those are folks that I might try going to the semaclutide and saying maybe that's more appropriate. Okay, it depends though. Some people love the semaclutide, some people love the tirzepatide. It just depends on how they feel on it. I don't like semaclutide. It makes me super nauseous. Tirzepatide doesn't seem to have the same impact. So I just do what works best. And again, price what's not, not only affordable, but long term, like what can they sustain? Right. And so when we start anybody on a medication, I think it's really important to ask, ask those patients because they might get excited and they can do it right now. But is this something that you can sustain affordably? And when we're talking microdosing with the semaclutide at the doses I'm talking about, that might be like 30 to 50 bucks. A month, really affordable, with the potential of not needing other medications. Maybe, you know, maybe it does away with some of these others. And so when people say, oh, it's so expensive, I'm like, well, it depends on what context we're talking in. Because I've got folks who were spending 30 to $50 a month on their semaclutide, and they're not having to spend all this other money on all these other things.
- [60:01]
Fiona Attucks
Right. I've also heard it's very beneficial for drug, alcohol addiction, binge eating. Why does it help with those problems?
- [60:12]
Dr. Tina Moore
So it plays on our dopamine pathways and really interesting. Again, I think too much can sort of bottom out those pathways and make you not want anything. The term for that is anhodynia, where you just are sort of like apathetic and you don't care and you don't want anything. It's like, I remember when I first started on them, I was like, oh, I'm taking too much because I don't even want chocolate. Like, I love dark chocolate. And I didn't even want it. You know, I didn't want anything. I didn't want wine, I didn't want food, didn't want anything. And so when we impact the dopamine pathways, it gives us the onus of control back. I think that's what's happening. And so people are in the driver's seat again. And so I've had multiple people. I have, you know, I don't have a following year size, but I have a pretty sizable following. And I'm getting feedback from tons of people online, and it's been wild. People are telling me they're not addicted to their social media anymore. They're not addicted to online shopping. They're just suddenly they have control back over whatever their dopamine dragon was, as I call it. And so some people like their alcohol, some people like their marijuana, some people like smoking. We've got data coming out. Looking at opioid use, I found this one gentleman who I can't think of the name of his blog right now, but he's written these incredible blogs on substack talking about the potential use of GLP1s to impact the homeless problem that we're having, because a lot of these folks are drug addicts on the street or they become drug addicts on the street because it sucks living out there. And I'm from Portland, where, like, this is a huge issue. And it's really difficult to get medications in folks that are homeless because of compliance, like they don't remember to take it every day, or maybe they don't have access. But the thought of an inexpensive GLP one once a week dosing to give them the onus of control back. I mean, there's just these implications. When you give people control back over their brains, who knows what they will choose or not choose to do. Although I do think you can. Again, you can eat through it and you can drink through it. So if you override that, it's not like it shuts it off completely. It just. Just dials it down.
- [62:14]
Fiona Attucks
Right.
- [62:14]
Dr. Tina Moore
And that might be enough for somebody to step back into their willpower. Right. Because willpower is fleeting, but it's just a tool to give them a bit more of that leg up.
- [62:24]
Fiona Attucks
Yeah, I think that's so powerful. And something I actually didn't even think about was the homeless population. And I've seen this greatly benefit people in my life. I've also seen people abuse it when they shouldn't. So I think this is a very interesting and helpful perspective. I'm sure a lot of people listening are wanting to run and start microdosing semaglutide now. So what would you say to those people who are now eager to start doing this? What. What should they do first?
- [62:55]
Dr. Tina Moore
First make sure you have the foundations in place.
- [62:57]
Fiona Attucks
Yeah.
- [62:58]
Dr. Tina Moore
And so this is twofold, though. Some folks are in such a bad place that getting the foundations in place seems daunting and overwhelming. And this is where people say, well, when do we bring in the GLP1? And I'm like, it depends. Because if you need a little leg up to get started, it really can help. I've noticed a lot of folks go on it and they just want to start moving after a while. After a while, the body just wants to start moving. They feel better. And so it's a great tool to get people rolling in the right direction. However, the basics are always necessary. The sleep optimization, the strength training, the circadian rhythm, going outside and getting daylight throughout the day, making sure that we have stress mitigation and mindfulness in place, like those are all critical and non negotiable whether you're on a GLP1 or not. And I think that once the commitment is made to. And I see people though, they say, oh, I promise I'll do that. And then they just rely on the GLP1 and don't do any of the things. So we got to do all the things. And I think that starts with education. So podcasts like yours and making sure I have a ton of Free, free content on my podcast and on my Instagram and just making sure that you know what you're getting into first of all. And then talking with your doctor. Start with your doctor. This concept is getting out there since I've been on the podcast. So thank you for giving me an audience to say it to because I think more importantly, I just want the doctors understanding that there's opportunity here for them to help their patients in a different way than maybe they thought they could. And so finding a doctor who's open to having this discussion. Start with your own doctor. If they're not, then keep looking. I really don't love the idea of Medispas doing this, to be honest. I think that that's a. This is not a here's your injections and good luck. Like this is a comprehensive strategy if we really want this to work well for the long term. So it's short term goals. Long term goals. Right. It's like the short term obvious. Long term not so obvious. You're a businesswoman, you know, we understand that. So I have a video, a free video on my website on how to find a good doc that people can get started. I have a whole in depth modul inside my paid program and then I have a four part video series that people can opt into. And it's basically part one is just the ways that GLP1 impacts the body that we really didn't entirely get into that are favorable. Besides weight loss, I talk about all the big scaries where I dispel all the myths because I think there's a lot of myths to dispel and then just other interesting information that they should have as education. And then I have my paid program if they're interested in that. So lots of free content.
- [65:28]
Fiona Attucks
Where can they find all of your podcasts, your resources?
- [65:32]
Dr. Tina Moore
Drtina.com so it's D, R, T, Y, N A and then I'm on Instagram, I'm on YouTube and I have, gosh, I think like 12 or 14 hours of free content just on OIC and the topic of GLP ones between all of it.
- [65:44]
Fiona Attucks
So incredible.
- [65:45]
Dr. Tina Moore
Yeah.
- [65:45]
Mari Llewellyn
Final question that I ask every guest.
- [65:47]
Dr. Tina Moore
Yeah.
- [65:48]
Fiona Attucks
What does wellness mean to you?
- [65:50]
Dr. Tina Moore
Wellness. To me it means freedom. If I don't have my health, I don't have anything. And if I don't, I am someone who struggles with chronic pain. So if I don't have my health, I have pain and pain is just misery and you do nothing. So really it's freedom. I work every day to stay healthy and optimized so that I can have as much medical autonomy as possible in my life.
- [66:13]
Mari Llewellyn
Fantastic.
- [66:13]
Fiona Attucks
Thank you so much for coming on the show.
- [66:15]
Dr. Tina Moore
Yes, thank you for having me.
- [66:17]
Mari Llewellyn
Thanks for joining us on the Pursuit of Wellness podcast to support this show. Please rate and review and share with your loved ones. If you want to be reminded of new episodes, click the subscribe button on your preferred podcast or video player. You can sign up for my newsletter to receive my favorites@marin.com it will be linked in the show Notes. This is a Wellness Loud production produced by Drake Peterson, Fiona Attucks and Kelly Kyle. This show is edited by Mike Fry and our video is recorded by Luis Vargas. You can also watch the full video of each episode on our YouTube channel at Mari Fitness. Love you Power Girls and Power Boys. See you next time. The content of this show is for.
- [66:56]
Fiona Attucks
Educational and informational purposes only. It is not a substitute for individual medical and mental health advice and does not constitute a provider patient relationship.
- [67:04]
Mari Llewellyn
As always, talk to your doctor or health team.