Real Talk: Real Estate Discussions with Andrew Kirsh

Episode 85: From Data to Deals – Leveraging Technology to Scale a Shopping Center Portfolio with Sandy Sigal

Guest: Sandy Sigal, President & CEO, NewMark Merrill
Release Date: December 19, 2025

Episode Overview

In this rich and insightful episode, host Andrew Kirsh sits down with his longtime friend, mentor, and client Sandy Sigal, President & CEO of NewMark Merrill. The conversation dives into how Sandy has uniquely fused technology and data-driven strategies to grow and optimize a shopping center portfolio of over 100 properties, while maintaining a forward-thinking, community-centric approach. The discussion covers Sandy’s journey from computer programming to shopping center mogul, technology’s evolving role in real estate, retail trends in a post-COVID world, and practical advice for the next generation.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Gratitude and Personal Reflection ([00:31] - [04:21])

• Andrew opens with personal reflections on 2025, referencing the Palisades fire, gratitude for support from community, and wrapping the year on a high note, professionally and personally.

2. Sandy Sigal’s Career & The Birth of NewMark Merrill ([04:22] - [06:45])

• Sandy’s varied roles in Andrew’s life: mentor, friend, client, peer.
• The origin of NewMark Merrill (not affiliated with brokerage Newmark):
  • Started career as a computer programmer and later in real estate by computerizing accounting for homebuilders at a young age.
  • Founded NewMark Merrill in 1997 with a focus on building, managing, and owning shopping centers, and a strong emphasis on technology.

Quote:
“My entire background was based around neighborhoods and shopping centers. ... What we do is we build, we manage, we own shopping centers in four states, just over 100 shopping centers, about 2,000 tenants. ... We also have a technology division that focuses on proptech and ways to integrate technology with our shopping centers, our communities.” — Sandy Sigal [05:48]

3. Technology in Real Estate – Early Adoption & Cultural Lag ([07:01] - [10:01])

• Sandy’s unique tech-first background highlighted as a rarity among real estate leaders of his generation.
• The “antiquated” nature of the real estate industry regarding R&D and technology adoption.
• Missed opportunities in leveraging data for property performance.

Quote:
“We're a very generational business. ... From a technology perspective, we're way behind. ... Our projects throw off a lot of data. And to not look at that data, not to synthesize that data, is a big mistake.” — Sandy Sigal [08:52]

4. AI and Data: From Anecdotes to Action ([10:03] - [14:16])

• Early adoption of AI and analytics; Sandy was asking about AI in legal practice before it became mainstream.
• Utilization of geofencing and mobile data to understand customer behavior at shopping centers.
• Sentiment analysis: Scraping thousands of online reviews to assess tenant performance and customer experience, informing direct action with tenants.

Quote:
“We scrape all that data and it gives us what we call Net Promoter Score. ... One negative is worth like 10 positives.” — Sandy Sigal [14:27]

5. Portfolio Strategy & What Makes a Prime Center ([15:44] - [18:40])

• Focus on grocery-anchored and up centers, avoiding enclosed malls.
• Aiming to own the dominant center in a given community, allowing scale for leveraging technology and marketing for impact.

Quote:
“I don’t want to be ... the fifth shopping destination in a community. We want to be the number one ... So it’s very important we have scale because scale helps us leverage all the other things we do, the technology, the marketing and all the other support.” — Sandy Sigal [16:23]

• Selection criteria: Looking for underserved markets, not fixated on high-income areas, working with municipalities eager for development.

6. Development vs. Acquisition Process ([18:48] - [20:47])

• For ground-up developments: Secure key anchor tenants before proceeding, not speculative builders.
• COVID pivot: Adapted tenant mix and site use in real time based on market shifts and data, resulting in fully pre-leased projects.

7. Resilience & Evolution of Retail ([21:18] - [26:07])

• Reflection on the repeated “death of retail” narrative pre- and post-COVID.
• COVID as proving ground for physical retail – people’s inherent need for gathering and commerce proved more resilient than digital predictions.

Quote:
“COVID turned out ... to be the great proof that we were sustainable for long term in this new environment.” — Sandy Sigal [25:36]

8. Investor Appetite Shifts ([26:07] - [28:44])

• Post-pandemic, retail has become a favored asset class as other sectors (apartments, office, industrial) face their unique pressures.
• Data-rich retail environment increases confidence among investors and lenders.

9. Evolving Tenant Relationships ([28:52] - [31:39])

• The landlord-tenant dynamic has shifted from arms-length to partnership.
• Emphasis on mixed uses within centers (gyms, schools, medical, etc.) and shared use of data/marketing between landlord and tenants.

10. Retail Risk, Private Equity & Market Outlook ([31:39] - [35:26])

• Cautious about transactions involving private equity – past involvement has been uneven.
• Labor and regulatory challenges in CA mean some national tenants avoid the state.
• Rigorous risk management: Don’t allow overexposure to a single tenant; ongoing monitoring with proprietary data.

11. California Demographic Changes ([35:26] - [37:43])

• Data confirms outmigration from California, especially among resourceful, investing classes.
• Public policy often misunderstands the needs of private investment; Sandy advocates for more involvement at the state level.

Quote:
“The ones California appears to be chasing are the ones that we need the most, which are people who have resources and are prepared to invest back in the community.” — Sandy Sigal [36:06]

12. Time Management & Community Engagement ([37:46] - [40:09])

• Sandy credits his energy and activity to deep focus on what matters, efficient use of time, and a passion for people and communities.
• Sleep is sacrificed for impact and meaningful work.

13. Lightning Round: Personal Recommendations & Trends ([40:23] - [48:02])

• Current Shows/Books:
  • Sandy enjoys The Jerry Jones Story, Landman, and AI for Leaders (book).
  • Strong interest in biographies and real-world inspiration.
• On AI’s Future:
  “The convergence of AI is amazing. … The robotic physical integration world is going to be the biggest thing that's probably three, maybe five years, not too far.” — Sandy Sigal [42:40]
• Underrated Markets:
  • Chicago for risk-adjusted opportunity
  • Sacramento (the city, not state politics)
  • Encourages a local focus for problem solving

14. Mentorship & Advice for Young Professionals ([48:03] - [49:57])

• Passion, uniqueness, and hard work are vital for entry into the real estate business.
• Money as a motivator is insufficient; candidates must demonstrate a compelling “Why.”
• Sandy offers open-door mentorship to newcomers.

Quote:
“Get out of your head. The world's not waiting for you... you gotta have a passion. You gotta explain your passion... I'm willing to work harder than anybody else. I'm gonna outwork everybody, and I'm willing to get paid nothing to prove my worth. That's what it's gonna take.” — Sandy Sigal [48:18]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the Data Opportunity in Retail:
  “If you know a lot about the customer, first, the customer is going to get a better experience … then you’re going to be able to understand, am I attracting the people I want? Is there a pocket of people I should be attracting that I’m not attracting?” — Sandy Sigal [12:39]

• On AI Integration Timeline:
  “The ability to talk to AI in real time in this kind of environment and have it interact with you ... is certainly an 18 to 24 month kind of thing. Robots are probably a little farther out ... three, maybe five years.” — Sandy Sigal [42:40]

• On Building Community Through Shopping Centers:
  “Our centers are an expression of human experience. ... Humans evolve, and as humans evolve their design, what they wear... It's all an evolution, and we got to be prepared for that. It's got to be priced in the model.” — Sandy Sigal [24:06]

Important Timestamps

• [04:22] – Sandy’s background & NewMark Merrill origins
• [07:02] – Early adoption of computers and programming
• [10:03] – Discussing technology’s place in real estate, early work with AI and data
• [14:18] – Using sentiment analysis and Net Promoter Score for tenants
• [16:01] – Portfolio strategy and focus on community dominance
• [18:48] – Example of ground-up development in South Rialto
• [21:18] – Perspective on retail “death” and resilience post-COVID
• [26:07] – Investor appetite for retail real estate
• [29:19] – Major shifts in tenant needs and expectations
• [34:22] – Risk management, concentration limits, and private equity caution
• [36:06] – California outmigration and public policy
• [38:39] – How Sandy manages his time, stays involved
• [40:23] – Lightning round: personal media and book recommendations
• [42:40] – Future of AI and robotics in real estate
• [45:32] – Under-the-radar real estate markets
• [48:03] – Mentorship and advice for aspiring real estate professionals

Tone and Takeaways

The conversation is candid, witty, data-driven, and steeped in decades of experience—with both speakers trading jokes and deep insights seamlessly. Sandy’s enduring curiosity and passion for technology, community, and mentorship shine through. His blend of tech mindset and pragmatic dealmaking offers a model for the next phase of retail real estate.

For Newcomers:

Sandy's parting guidance—be genuinely passionate, bring a unique story, be willing to outwork others, and seek mentorship—encapsulates the ethos of success in real estate’s next era.

(Summary compiled and formatted by AI based on episode transcript. For questions or deeper dives, connect with Andrew Kirsh or Sandy Sigal directly.)