← Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey
Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey
Ep 1106 | 'I Was Living a Double Life:' Breaking Free from LGBTQ Sin | Guest: Richard Matthews
00:51:25
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- [00:01]
Allie Beth Stuckey
Richard Matthews has gone viral on TikTok for his videos explaining his testimony, going from an actively, openly gay man to a repentant Christian. He is here today to share his testimony in person. This episode is brought to you by our friends at Good ranchers. Go to goodranchers.com code ali. That's goodranchers.com code Ali.
- [00:33]
Unknown Sponsor Host
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- [01:06]
Allie Beth Stuckey
Our new friend, Richard. Richard, thanks so much for taking the time to join us. I'm so glad you're here.
- [01:16]
Richard Matthews
Yes.
- [01:16]
Allie Beth Stuckey
We just want to hear your testimony. I've seen your videos. I think I've reacted to your videos. Yes, I think that you shared on TikTok. Yeah. Is that what it was?
- [01:26]
Richard Matthews
Yeah, that was one of the videos where I was just walking in the city.
- [01:29]
Allie Beth Stuckey
Yes.
- [01:30]
Richard Matthews
And you reacted to it. And I was like, oh, there's Allie.
- [01:32]
Allie Beth Stuckey
Yeah, I love that. Okay, let's start from the beginning. Tell us who you are and how you got here.
- [01:38]
Richard Matthews
Yeah, absolutely. So I'm originally from Georgia. I grew up there in Lithonia. But growing up, my family was divorced, separated, and things of that nature. My father, he comes from a background of about three marriages and three divorces with a few children as well. A lot of, like, infidelity and lust and addiction as well. And I like to mention this because bloodline is so important in families, but I was raised just with my mom, and me and my brother were 15 years apart with two different dads as well. And then he went off into the Navy. So I kind of just been raised with her, you know, and I just grew up in church, and I grew up with a nice, big megachurch down in the South. My mom sung in choir, so I guess I was a church kid. That's kind of where I felt like, really the inspiration to be creative and to dance. I would be in some of the plays at church, but then also my mom would just put me in sports and things. So I played sports. Then I was singing. I was Dancing. And then I had to make a choice at one point, so I was just like, mom, I'll just dance. And then I got into a performing arts high school. But all throughout that time, I got through a lot of bullying while I was growing up, not having a dad. People would pick up me about that and then just make fun of me. My voice, the way I stand, you know, the way I would act. And then they would use that one word called gay. And I was so confused about, like, where this was coming from.
- [03:09]
Allie Beth Stuckey
So even as a. As a little kid, you had. It was just peers telling you this or any adults in your life.
- [03:16]
Richard Matthews
It's a. It wasn't. I would say, peers, children, kids, school environments. And even in church environments, too, there's this weird sort of, like, picking and nitpicking that would happen. My mom has. She remembers that, like, sometimes she would get calls from school because I would, like, run away and just kind of hide and try to be away from people. I even wrote in a journal about, like, why, you know, I didn't have my father. And so, like, there were moments, you know, like that. And my mom just, you know, I guess, like, in the best way that she could, we kept active because she was a single mom working really hard. And so me having activities was one of the ways where I could, like, you know, express myself, but also just kind of, like, be busy without really thinking about all of those things. But I kept thinking about the word gay. Like, where is this word coming from? From? And I looked it up on my own. And then somehow, one way, the Internet was opening and I got into pornography. I was around 10 or 11 by that time, and I was having a hard time really even figuring out what this means with the Lord and at church. Because when the word gay would be brought up, it would be this weird, taboo word. Like, people didn't want to talk about it, or people would somehow, like, you know, kind of gossip about some people with this word. And then eventually what ended up kind of happening was that I looked in the Bible what gay means, what homosexual means, and what the Lord had to say about it. And I saw Leviticus 18:22, where it says, you know, homosexual is a abomination. But I internalized it, to me being an abomination, and that was very hard.
- [04:48]
Allie Beth Stuckey
And how old were. So just to clarify the timeline a little bit, so when you were about 10 or 11, you were getting bullied and called feminine and gay because of how you talk. You decided to look it up on the Internet to be like, why are people calling me this? What does this mean?
- [05:02]
Richard Matthews
Yeah.
- [05:03]
Allie Beth Stuckey
And then, sadly, that led you to being exposed to gay pornography. You became addicted to pornography, would you say around 10 or 11? And did anyone know this?
- [05:14]
Richard Matthews
No, I kept it hidden. I kept a secret.
- [05:16]
Allie Beth Stuckey
Did you have your own. Like, I don't know how old you are, but, like, are you. This is like, family computer, or did you have your own device? Like, how are you able to hide this at such a young age?
- [05:27]
Richard Matthews
That time, like, I can't remember. I think I did have my own computer at the time. And I think I also was, like, had my own cell phone. And I think the Internet was just coming out, so people were still filling out what to do, what's really safe and what's not. I will say everything was very slow when I was on it, but as I continued through high school. So I'm 30 now, high school, like 2012. And a little bit earlier, like, everything started to get faster.
- [06:00]
Allie Beth Stuckey
Yeah. And I would say that's how old I am. So it's not. The Internet wasn't new, but, like, certainly our personal devices and things, like, absolutely. That were new. And a lot of parents, you know, obviously you had a single mom who was busy anyway, but a lot of parents just didn't know how to navigate supervision of those devices at the time.
- [06:20]
Richard Matthews
I mean, people were afraid to use credit cards, too, at the time. So, like, people were, like, still trying to navigate, like, what is this Internet type of situation. But that happened with me. And I also want to say, like, I didn't really have a strong biblical foundation. I didn't really have the church to lean on to really talk about this. And then what ended up happening was my pastor fell and our whole church collapsed.
- [06:43]
Allie Beth Stuckey
And what do you mean by fell?
- [06:44]
Richard Matthews
By fell, he actually had cheating and a lot of sexual allegations against young men in the church.
- [06:51]
Allie Beth Stuckey
Oh, gosh.
- [06:51]
Richard Matthews
So the very person that I was supposed to look up to, to be this, who was preaching the word of God and, you know, speaking about going to heaven and not going to hell and not sinning is the very thing that happened with Him. And so I just felt very discouraged along with being alienated. And it really skewed my relationship with the Lord to where I just really thought I couldn't please him and that I had this shame and condemnation and that he hated me. So, you know, that happened around my high school when the whole church fell. My mom stopped going to church, we stopped going to church. It was like a big rift in everything in our community as well, but I just focused on school. So I went to college and I then declared that I was going to be a dance major. My background is in the arts and as a performer. And I've always loved it, like I said, from being young. But also those environments, they're not the best and they're not biblical and unholy in a way. They're very loosey goosey flowy. Do whatever you want to do. We start lear these philosophies now in these, you know, liberal art classes where we're talking about, you know, God's not dead. We're talking, we're introducing what homosexuality means and like it can be a part of your creativity. So all of that is being fueled. I did have just, I feel like the grace of the Holy Spirit where I didn't really dive into anything else. Like I wasn't really a partier or drinker or whatever, but I felt like I already had blood on my ledger because this porn thing I continued to do.
- [08:23]
Allie Beth Stuckey
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- [08:24]
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- [09:20]
Allie Beth Stuckey
And were you openly identifying as gay at this point?
- [09:23]
Richard Matthews
I wasn't. So I still held on to questioning whether I would come out or not because I just felt like it would just be really hard on my mom and my family. And I also was wrestling with what the Lord says about it. But I think when you're in those environments, things start to. You continue to question and then get ingrained into them. Like my sin, like going into pornography. Looking back into it, I wouldn't say I had the desire to be in pornography. I didn't necessarily have a desire to be in homosexual same sex relationships. But as I continued to become in agreement with the enemy with that sin, the Bible said sin becomes iniquity and then transgressions, inequity is repeated. Sin, that becomes your identity. So it literally becomes my identity. So of course, when people are saying being born this way, a part of it is like, yeah, I kind of believe you. Because sin is passed down and we live in a fallen nature. And the more you keep doing it, the more it's iniquity. So pouring in, you know, all of that lust, temptation, whatever you, whatever it is, it became a part of, like, everything that I did. I did it when I was sad, I did it when I was mad, when I was angry.
- [10:30]
Allie Beth Stuckey
So the same way it's like your escape.
- [10:32]
Richard Matthews
Yeah, it was my escape to numb everything. But I still thought about the Lord and everything that I did. A lot of the dances that I would create, a lot of the art that I would create, would still just acknowledge the Lord in some way. So the Holy Spirit was definitely still moving and working. But I never, when people ask me, I would say, I don't think I'm gay. I don't know. But, you know, I just went through. Went through college and then graduated and became a performer. My performing was not fulfilling in the way that I thought it was. Sometimes we like to put our identity in different things, and it never satisfies you if it's not from the Lord. So I had about a five year career just performing and dancing. Ballet, jazz, modern, tap, all the things. I worked on a cruise ship, I lived in Hawaii, I lived in Virginia. I lived everywhere. But in 2020, when the pandemic happened, no one was dancing. And I felt like a big shift and a reset to where, like, I don't really even want to, like, dance anymore right now. I want to kind of take a break. And during 2020 and 2021, I started to learn more about, like, self help. I started to go into therapy, my therapy. My therapist actually was a pastor and a preacher, so that was great.
- [11:44]
Allie Beth Stuckey
And where were you living at that time?
- [11:46]
Richard Matthews
I moved to New York in 2020.
- [11:48]
Allie Beth Stuckey
And you found a Christian pastor therapist in New York. Wow.
- [11:52]
Richard Matthews
Yeah, it was through a lovely connection with some good friends of mine, and I just started to work in corporate. I was thinking about being more creative and entrepreneurial and all these things, but none of it was still satisfying. And so I told my therapist about my porn and all the things, and he's like, we gotta, we gotta get you into recovery. And I just had this revelation that my life was out of control. I was watching porn even at work, and I was like, this is not good. So I Felt a shift in two ways. Ali I would say, one, I was like, I need Jesus, so let me go find church. And then the other thing was I feel really sad and alone. So I feel like I need to be in a relationship and I need to come out. So there was this weird double life happening now around 2022, where I was going to church at my home church, now at V1 Church, shout out to Pastor Mike and Julie Signorelli. And I started to go on dates and I started to explore what this would look like since I had been holding onto this and not coming out for about, like, what is this, 20 plus years?
- [12:55]
Allie Beth Stuckey
Yeah. Had you had relationships?
- [12:58]
Richard Matthews
I hadn't had any, like, real relationship, really. Any real, like, homosexual relationships. I had crushes on people in high school and in college. I had some, you know, gatherings together, maybe with a few people with the crush that I had, but it was never really actually, like, a relationship together. 2022. I did get into a relationship though. Okay, So I went on some dates. I did get into relationship with a guy for about maybe two months. And then we just ended up not working out. But I felt like the pull was like, I need Jesus to really come out of this pornography. So I had this, like, real, like, critical, like, crucial, like, reality of like, my life is not good. And in the queer community. And I've been around, you know, some of events that they would have. And it's like, everything's great and we're just drinking it away, we're sexing it away. And I'm like, why is my worth attached to how much partying or how much sex that I can do now? You know, obviously I was, you know, I grew up a little bit in church, so I feel like that played a part into it, but I just felt like, still alienated. Even in the community, like, they kind of like, are cliquish in a way. Like, you're too feminine, you're too masculine, you're too tall, you're too fat, you're too this. So this, like, loving community wasn't really loving. And so I decided to go to my church in V1 and I went into the recovery group. That was my first small group that I was in. And there I learned that the Lord loved me. Because all this time I thought the Lord hated me and that I thought I couldn't, like, amount to what he was asking me to do. And I realized, and for anyone listening, the Lord is not asking you to do anything. He just wants you to receive. Identity is a gift for you to receive. It's not something that you have to define or earn.
- [14:52]
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- [15:36]
Allie Beth Stuckey
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- [15:37]
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- [15:51]
Richard Matthews
So 2022, I'm going through recovery, 12 steps, going through all of this. I'm still kind of battling with this idea of maybe potentially being a gay Christian because nothing was working where my porn wasn't resolved and I still had these desires and attractions. So I made a prayer or I said a prayer in 2023 of January where I said, lord, like, I feel like I can't change and I feel like I can't really fully come to you and devote myself to you. I said, if being gay and being Christian is not true, let me know and I'll accept it. But if it's true, that's great, I'll accept it, you know. But I said, at this point, I just want you. My prayer was not for me to be straight. My prayer is that I wanted Jesus. And when I said that to the Lord. Sorry, that's okay. When I said that to the Lord, I heard him tell me to come to him. And that's what it says in Matthew. Come to me all who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. And I'm so thankful that I heard him and he was able to really give me a new heart and transform me and all of those desires. And everything started to go away around March. I woke up one day, like I haven't watched. Poured in like two weeks. And so it was an act and a mercy and a grace and a miracle of God that he literally transformed my life and started to really transform my desires. But ultimately that prayer was really what changed everything. A few months later, I got through deliverance because often people don't really know that there is a spirit behind homosexuality. The agenda that is happening in our country and against our kids. It's not a new thing. It's an old thing that has been talked about in the Bible. And so we have to overcome these principalities with the power of the Lord. And so I went through deliverance, but it was so sweet how the Lord did it. I got deliverance in my bedroom and with a dream that I had. And it was like I was asleep, but I was awake. It was really beautiful. And the very room where I would watch pornography, the very room that was death and destruction and torment. Like, I was depressed, I was anxious. I had like insomnia moments where I couldn't go to sleep. I would have nightmares. Like, I would have. Like, I wouldn't want to be able to go to work. I wouldn't want to be able to get out of bed. Like I was that stress and anxiety induced to the point where I like was I wanted to disconnect from everything. Even having just unalive thoughts and things of that nature and being so severely depressed, where the Lord transformed all of that in one night in my bedroom. And I had so much peace the next day and then a couple months later.
- [18:29]
Allie Beth Stuckey
And what did that look like? Because I come from a reformed background, so we really don't use language like deliverance or like a particular spirit behind a sin. I would say that it's all of the flesh, it's all demonic, it's all satanic, anything that draws us away from God. And so that's not. That's not, you know, theological language I would use. So can you describe what you mean by that?
- [18:57]
Richard Matthews
Yeah. So this is what I will say. I know people have different backgrounds and they can agree or Disagree, but in 2023, what happened for me was I was unemployed, I was furloughed, and I spent all my time reading the Bible. And when I read the Bible, we see there are miracles and signs and wonders in the Old and New Testament, but what Jesus does in the New Testament is he calls and speaks to people and speaks behind the spirits for them to be, you know, casted out of them. And so this might be new and new language for some people, but the agenda, the sin, everything is there's a spirit behind it. And so I guess I really don't know another way to say this, but I will say all of the thoughts that you have, they come from the flesh, but they also come from the enemy, Satan. And he has things orchestrating where his goal is. To destroy families and destroy men, destroy women. And he does that. I mean, he's not omniscient, he's not omnipresent. He's not everywhere all at once, but he sends his enemies out to be able to torment you. And it happens when we come into agreement, like the Lord is life, like pornography is not life, it is death. Everything that we do that is outside of the will of God is, you know, sin is separation from God and it's death. And in order to be resurrected and redeemed from death, we need the power of God. And so in order to do that, deliverance is a way to do that. So you just once you profess Jesus as your Lord and Savior and you confess him in your heart, just like it says in Romans, and believe, you know, you have authority now that God gave Adam and Eve, which says that in Genesis that the devil took back, but now you have authority, so you just declare his name. And anything that is not of God, anything that is not bringing life, it has to go. You know, the Bible says that we are a holy temple unto the Lord. So our bodies are reflection or even like the tabernacle in the wilderness. You know, we have the outer courts, we have the holy place, and then we have the most holy of holy place. That is an analogy of also your body. So you are being a holy temple that is holding the presence of God. And so we want to be able to purify and consecrate that as much as possible. But, you know, people can agree, or maybe they have questions about that. I encourage people to dive in and read as much as they can, but this is my story and my testimony. And I know a lot of people need to know the love of the Lord and they need freedom. Deliverance is just the love of the Lord. That's all it is. You know what I'm saying? So that's what I would say for that.
- [21:53]
Allie Beth Stuckey
We might use different language, but we both mean similar things when we talk about sanctification. When the Lord starts working on your heart, CS Lewis has this amazing quote, and I'll butcher it if I try to paraphrase it, but basically, he doesn't want part of you. He wants all of you. When he walks into your heart, he's not just taking up one room. He says, no, this is all mine, and I am going to make it my own. If this is going to be, you know, where I sit on my throne like this, I'm going to make this my own. And that working out our salvation with Fear and trembling, the sanctification that is required, the continual self sacrifice that is required does mean God ridding us of sin. And that doesn't mean that we won't struggle. That doesn't mean that we won't have temptation. That doesn't mean that we'll never feel anxious or fearful. As long as we are on this side of eternity, we still have to bear some consequences of the reality of the fall and sin. But Jesus in ourselves, salvation and the grace that he gives us. You're right, it's not only salvation, it also can be deliverance from sin. And he can change our desires. That's something that a lot of people don't believe. Or he can rid us of some struggles. So I think what you're saying there, that God can take away desires, he can change desires. I think that's important to acknowledge.
- [23:19]
Richard Matthews
Listen, I was literally one way before and now I'm not. It's only through the power of the Lord, you know, and even you can look back in Exodus with Egypt, that was a deliverance. The Lord was delivering his people from slavery and bondage out. Same thing is happening with his people. This is what we're talking about here when we're talking about there. Is there, yes, there has been attack. But the Lord is coming in and he's bringing back his children and he's saving lives and he is indeed sanctifying them, you know. And so a few months after, you know, my deliverance and me going through a process with my church being sanctified, the Lord told me to start to share my testimony, which was around, I would say May of 2023, I opened up a TikTok. I never had a TikTok before. I was like done with social media. And the Lord was like, no, you need to open it. And I was so frustrated, but I did. And then a video went viral from a short, like clip of my testimony. And then I just kept posting and sharing on TikTok all throughout 2023, 2024 comes around and thankfully I'm working in corporate again, I'm in videos. But then unfortunately around June of 2024 this year, they saw some of my content. And listen, I, you know, I was recording in some conference room, but a lot of my content is, yes, talking about the Lord, but also just being silly with the Lord because the joy of the Lord is our strength. You know what I'm saying? And so I was having, you know, videos that went across that also went viral. Me just walking in the street talking about the Lord I believe David Harris, he reposted one of my videos, which was cool. And I think that's also the video you posted. And then they called me in one day out of nowhere. I was praying with the Lord and the Lord was like, prepare my heart. And I was like, what's gonna happen today? But he was like, I need you to pray. I need you to fast. I was like, okay. And then a couple hours later in the afternoon, they let me go. And so I was just. And I wasn't surprised. Like the Bible talks about in First Peter. He was like, don't be surprised. A shock for any persecution. And just as we suffer for Christ, we're gonna suffer in his glory. So blessed are the ones who are persecuted. So, you know, I let the Lord handle all the things that he handles on the back end. Vengeance is his. But my story has catapulted since then through the grace and the favor of the Lord and what the enemy meant for my harm. You know, the Lord has brought it for good.
- [25:44]
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- [26:31]
Allie Beth Stuckey
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- [26:33]
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- [26:50]
Allie Beth Stuckey
Tell me about that time that you, you joined this small group for recovery.
- [26:55]
Richard Matthews
Yeah.
- [26:56]
Allie Beth Stuckey
And then before you actually were saved and the Lord helped rid you of your addiction to pornography and healed you, was the church that you were a part of, were there people telling you directly, no, you cannot be actively gay and be a Christian because today it can be really hard to find Christians or a church who will tell you that. They'll say, it's fine. You can do both at the same time. So was there anyone in your life who was telling you the truth?
- [27:29]
Richard Matthews
Yeah, I Wouldn't necessarily say in my small group. I would say in the actual sermons of my pastor, you know, but also, like I said, the Lord was doing a work in my heart where I felt like I needed the Lord and I'm gonna stay, even if it feels uncomfortable. I would do that. They would preach and speak about the truth of what the Lord says about sexuality, what he says about marriage, what he says about, you know, your identity. And I would stay, you know, sometimes people would leave. But I just felt this such conviction to stay and know truth. I think when you're hungry for truth, you're gonna find it. But also, like I said, it was the understanding that I think sometimes we think Christianity is, oh, what not to do. And it's like, yeah, for sure. But it's also, I love the Lord so much because he is good, and I obey him because he's good and because he loves me, and I'm undeserving and worthy for it. So I think sometimes people kind of get caught in that trap and it becomes very religious. It comes very, like, condemning in that way to think almost that you are trying to, like, work your salvation through works, which is not even the gospel. So in that small group is where I learned Jeremiah 29:11. No, I have good plans for you. Plans to prosper you, not to harm you. My life verse that saved my Life was Matthew 3:17. I learned that with my friends Aaron and Frank and Chris. About this is my beloved son and whom I love, and I'm well pleased with him. This is what God says to Jesus when he's baptized. Before Jesus did anything, before Richard did anything, before Allie did anything, you are loved by God. And that is so freeing. So to answer your question, yes, I always was hearing truth, but it was the combination of the truth, along with the mercy and the grace and the love and kindness of the Lord that transformed me to. Now that I know that I know I'm a royal priesthood period. I'm his son. I'm a son of the great High King. And if you're not going to die for me, you have nothing to say to me. So I will gladly crucify my flesh. Because he crucified his flesh on the cross.
- [29:47]
Allie Beth Stuckey
Yeah.
- [29:47]
Richard Matthews
You know?
- [29:48]
Allie Beth Stuckey
Yeah. What would you say to someone because this. A lot of people say this, well, you didn't have to give up being gay. You could have stayed in that relationship. And you can be both at the same time. There are plenty of people watching this and listening to this that think that. What is your response to Them.
- [30:04]
Richard Matthews
God is a God of covenant. In the Bible, he's often described as the bridegroom, and we are the bride, the body of Christ. We are in a marriage and a covenant with him. The Lord doesn't do open relationships, just like a regular marriage doesn't do over relationships. He is looking for us to be in a complete covenant and total surrender with him, because he is a God that doesn't change and doesn't lie and keeps his promises to us. In Exodus, it says, to have no other God before me. So when you are wanting to compromise your sexuality with your faith, in a way, you are holding your sexuality above the Lord. That's idolatry. It even talks about this in Malachi. Malachi 1 and 2. I was reading about the offerings that the Jews were giving unto the Lord, and the Jews were thinking, everything's fine, Lord, like, I'm giving you offerings, like, I'm giving you a sacrifice. And the Lord's like, no. Like, the sacrifices and offerings that you're giving are compromised. They were supposed to give their first, their best, the lambs, the goats. And they're giving things that are defective, that are compromised. And then the Lord continues to talk about. I'm not even worried about the sacrifices at this point. I'm worried about your heart and the intention behind it. Your own heart is even compromised. So the word of the Lord has been true from the beginning of days to now, and it's continued to be consistent. You cannot serve two masters. So, you know, when I talk about this for people, I tell them that you have to love the Lord completely. Jesus Christ died for you completely. He didn't die for you halfly. So we must do that as well.
- [31:45]
Allie Beth Stuckey
Yeah, And I'm sure you get plenty of criticism and pushback all the time from people online. What are some of the things that you hear?
- [31:53]
Richard Matthews
Um, one of the, like, the two craziest things is that one, I'm still gay.
- [32:01]
Allie Beth Stuckey
That's what people say.
- [32:03]
Richard Matthews
And then the other thing is, I was never gay.
- [32:06]
Allie Beth Stuckey
Oh, okay.
- [32:08]
Richard Matthews
So it's like this weird, like, do, si. Do.
- [32:12]
Allie Beth Stuckey
Why do people say those things? What's their reasoning?
- [32:15]
Richard Matthews
You know, people, like, people are going through their own healing and sanctification. And so, like, a lot of them, they'll be influenced by those spirits where they're just, like, acting out, you know? And people are saying these things because they don't really believe that God is good. And, like, I get it. I think sometimes we don't take our faith seriously. And we are not like the Bible Says Paul talks about this in Corinthians. I just read this. He said, christianity, the way following Jesus is not about talk. It's about the power of God. And so when we look at all these other religions, we've kind of been kind of lukewarm and unfaithful, kind of sitting around on the benches. But when we are serious about our faith, you say, like, no. Like, this is what truth is and this is what good is, and this is what life is. Because that's what God is. That's a part of his character and his nature. He says, I'm here to give you life and life more abundantly and that he's good. But you will never know unless you read this. You will never know unless you see the consistency of the Lord. When I started reading this, and I read this thing for myself, I care less what you have to say. I've read this. The words that the Lord has spoken about me has just been so beautiful. Like, I came from a spirit of being an orphan, being abandoned and rejected. And a lot of those people who, you know, maybe they're out in their sexuality, that's. That's really what the root is. The sexuality is a leaf on the tree, Them wanting to be transgender, them wanting to do all those things. It's a leaf on the tree. The root is. There's a disconnect of the unbelief and the goodness of God. That's really what sin is. So we need a revelation of that, and so we want to share that as much as we can.
- [33:54]
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Allie Beth Stuckey
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- [34:52]
Allie Beth Stuckey
You know, you mentioned when you were young, which I just find so heartbreaking that anyone would say this to a child, that people would criticize you for your mannerisms or how you talk, or maybe that you were in dance and they said, that's feminine, that's gay.
- [35:04]
Richard Matthews
Yeah.
- [35:05]
Allie Beth Stuckey
And still today, when I see some of the comments that people leave, they say, oh, well, you still seem this way. And how. I mean, how does that make you feel? And how do you respond to something like that?
- [35:18]
Richard Matthews
I like to quote my pastor about this. Like, about just having an unoffendable heart. And so if I'm saying that I'm crucified and I've died with Christ, I'm truly dead. So you can keep kicking, but I'm a corpse. And I'm going to be resurrected to new life as a new creation. So they can keep saying those things, but they're talking about a corpse. And everything else has just been me being a new creation with the Lord. I don't really have anything to say. You know, if the Lord is leading me to evangelize and share the gospel to people in some way, if he's giving me room to connect with them in that way, I will. But I'm not on a mission to try to make people understand me if they've already committed to misunderstanding me.
- [36:05]
Allie Beth Stuckey
Yeah, I think that's probably good advice for all of us. That's true. What do you have to say about this kind of dichotomy that we see playing out, or this competition between just affirming people, just being nice to people, never telling anyone hard truth, and then speaking the truth in love?
- [36:24]
Richard Matthews
Yeah. Paul says this. He says, I came to you in weakness, in timid and trembling, and my message and my preaching to you were very plain rather than using clever speeches or persuasive words. I relied only on the power of the Holy Spirit. I did this so that you could trust not in human wisdom, but in the power of God. There is a fear of not telling truth because you want to be kind, or affirming because you have pride in your image, which is idolatry. You're fearing what other people think about you. And then there's also the other end of. Of being obsessed with hard truth and weaponizing it to where there's an abuse there, which is also pride. And neither of those is how we share truth and love. The way to do that, as Paul talks about, is through the power of the Holy Spirit. And the Holy Spirit is not a gimmick. It's not a genie. It's not like a, like a quick thing. It is a part of the Godhead of the Triune God. He's important. He allows people to move, to speak to what they need to be to hear. Not everyone is going to need all, all of the scriptures. The Holy Spirit will tell you, be quiet and just listen to their story. The Holy Spirit will tell you, hey, like, I'm going to give you a word of knowledge and I'm going to tell you some facts about them to bring up so that we can talk about a conversation. The Holy Spirit is going to tell you what to do because we are not the Savior and we do not convict. Only the Holy Spirit, only Jesus Christ is able to do that. And I say this to say, and I'm so passionate about it, because when we read scripture and when we look at our lives, we have to remember that we were once an enemy of the Lord. So whether you feel like, oh, I don't want to speak, to offend, or whether you feel like I need to get this out, and you're trying to hammer stuff, it's because you have forgotten that you were once an enemy of the Lord. What the Lord gives me to speak or not to say, I do it through his love and his obedience. And knowing that, wow, like, I'm only here because of you. So we have to do away with pride and do away with idolatry. And the Bible, it says Mary Magdalene, the woman with, you know, the seven demons in her. It doesn't say the woman with the seven demons. It says Mary Magdalene. We have to get off our couches and go up to people and talk about and ask them their name. They have a name because, yes, they were born in sin and they were born in this fallen world, but they are made in the image of God.
- [39:02]
Allie Beth Stuckey
God.
- [39:04]
Richard Matthews
Jesus loves Mary. She was there at the resurrection. He knows her name. The Lord does not get pleasure in being quiet or wanting to offend people in that way or hammer things down in that way. He doesn't get pleasure out of that. It says a scripture that it's the kindness of the Lord that leads one to repentance. So the only thing that we have to do is allow the Holy Spirit to move and tell us what to say, and we say it and then that's it. Whether the person receives it or not, it doesn't matter. Yeah, but I've been putting myself in more positions to just hearing people and seeing the image of God, even past whatever they're going through. And we need to be a church if we're supposed to welcome these people. We want people to get truly saved. We need to do the work of sharing the gospel and having people be saved by going out to them and being inviting to the church when they come in. Because it's not going to be about their exterior or appearance. It's going to be about their heart. And we have to minister the truth to their hearts through the power of the Holy Spirit. That's it. Allie, if you want to get better at whatever you need to say, you need to lean and yield to the Holy Spirit, period.
- [40:13]
Allie Beth Stuckey
Amen. You know, so much of what you say reminds me of, you know what, Christopher Yuan, who has not the same testimony, but a similar testimony of coming out of homosexuality and just being separated. As you said, an enemy of God is we all once were in the passions of our flesh. We were by nature children of wrath like the rest of mankind. That's Ephesians too. You're absolutely right. We were all that. But his testimony is similar to yours in the sexuality aspect. And I just remember my mind kind of being blown by what he said in his first book. Just about how your sexuality and your sexual desires are not contrary to what the world says, who you are.
- [40:55]
Richard Matthews
Absolutely.
- [40:55]
Allie Beth Stuckey
This is not your identity. You mentioned something earlier about how the first thing that you were repenting of or the primary thing that you were repenting of wasn't your sexuality, was actually your unbelief and you were becoming a believer in Christ. And through that process, he delivered you from sin, he saved you, he sanctified you. I think that's so important for people to understand and free. No matter what your sexual inclinations are or your thoughts about your identity or how you present your gender, the important thing is that those things and how you feel, your confusion, your desires, your lust, they are not who you are. The only person who can define you is the God who made you.
- [41:41]
Richard Matthews
Yes.
- [41:41]
Allie Beth Stuckey
And it's actually such, like a freeing thing. It is that we don't have to self identify that when we become new creations, we just become co heirs with Christ. And that's our new title. That's it.
- [41:53]
Richard Matthews
I said that with my pastor. I was like, being outside of the will of God and trying to divine yourself is so exhausting.
- [41:59]
Allie Beth Stuckey
Yeah.
- [42:00]
Richard Matthews
Because it's always new. Like when I was growing up, it was, you know, how the LGBTQ in the community is right now was. It's way crazier than it was growing up. And then we hear about lgbtq and now we're adding letters to it. I'm like what are all these letters?
- [42:16]
Allie Beth Stuckey
And then there's just a plus sign.
- [42:18]
Richard Matthews
I looked at the flag and I was like, why is. There's all these different colors and there's a circle. What does this mean? What does that mean? And so it's just like this never ending sort of definition. But when we come to Christ, the Lord defines us with a period. He says, this is my son. That's it. That's so freeing that I don't have to define myself. And it's so freeing to know that I am love and that I don't have to. I don't have to earn love by what I'm doing or even through sexual inclinations. Like that doesn't define me. I'm defined and I'm already loved as I am them. And there's a friend of mine says this. There's. There's no other man that can love me the way that the Lord loves me. Because. Are you going to die for me? The answer is no.
- [43:03]
Allie Beth Stuckey
Yeah.
- [43:04]
Richard Matthews
Dying for someone that you hate. That's love.
- [43:07]
Allie Beth Stuckey
Yeah. Or dying for someone who hates you.
- [43:10]
Richard Matthews
Right.
- [43:10]
Allie Beth Stuckey
Dying for. For someone who is an enemy. Someone who spat at you. Which again, we all once were. And the Bible even says that for maybe for a righteous person, one would surely die. But Christ showed his love for us in this. That while we were still sinners, he died for us. That's the amazing thing. As yet we were undeserving. And not only undeserving, but didn't even want or realize that we needed salvation.
- [43:38]
Richard Matthews
Yeah.
- [43:39]
Allie Beth Stuckey
Christ died for us. And no one, even if someone would sacrifice himself for. On our behalf because. Because people do that. But nothing is comparable to God sacrificing himself on our behalf.
- [43:54]
Richard Matthews
It doesn't compare. The Bible says in Hebrews. I read this this morning, he was innocent, he was perfect. And he is now our great high priest who is interceding for us. That's like, no other man is going to do that.
- [44:07]
Allie Beth Stuckey
Yeah.
- [44:12]
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- [45:05]
Allie Beth Stuckey
You know, you talked about before we started rolling, you said that you had listened to the conversation between Christopher Yuan and me and you said that you had. After I reacted to one of your awesome videos, you were like, were you already familiar with relatable before that by that time?
- [45:24]
Richard Matthews
Yeah. So 2023 was like a year of early sanctification and we're all still being sanctified until we get our glorified bodies. Thank the Lord because the earth is ghetto. But I was doing so much of a deep dive of just getting constant testimonies too because I think another fear or another lie that we see is like, oh, you can't be free of this and there's no testimonies. So your channel was just really awesome. And you know, I saw Ross Johnston, I saw Christopher Dr. For Christopher Yuan, Dr. Rosario on here and just like learning so much. I also know Beckett Cook, he has been instrumental. And Jackie Hov, you know, just different testimonies. Jackie Angel Cologne. People in Rainbow Revival, just hearing testimonies in your channel was a big part of that. So by that time, yeah, I got all of that in, you know, well.
- [46:14]
Allie Beth Stuckey
It'S, it's their stories and their courage and I love all of the people that you mentioned and that's why I love having conversations like this. Because, okay, you listen to Christopher Yuan, which I think my. One of my very first episodes was my first conversation with him. And then I've had him on since then. But now you are. It just. I love how the Lord works. You listen to the. Their episodes and they encouraged you. And now you're here and God is going to use you and your testimony to encourage someone else. And you, I know you already know this, but it's good for me to remind myself too. Like you don't. You will not know everything that your testimony does until you get to glory. And God and his grace will reveal the constellation of lives that have been impacted by your courage. And that is the hope that we have even amidst the mean comments and the pushback in the lies. And I know you're a strong person, so you don't need to hear it from me. But you know, it's. It's good for us to all remember that, that that's what matters. That God Right now.
- [47:17]
Richard Matthews
Yeah.
- [47:18]
Allie Beth Stuckey
Puts is putting together the solar system of people's testimonies that all somehow in his providence, work together for his glory and our good, even as the chaos of the world roars, even when sometimes it seems like the devil is winning. I like to say that God's eternal plan of redemption is always going off without a hitch.
- [47:38]
Richard Matthews
Since Genesis.
- [47:39]
Allie Beth Stuckey
Since Genesis. And by his grace, he uses. You know, he uses his believers.
- [47:44]
Richard Matthews
Yeah.
- [47:45]
Allie Beth Stuckey
He uses the simple obedience of believers to accomplish that purpose. So thank you for playing your part in that. Is there anything else that you would like to share?
- [47:56]
Richard Matthews
I mean, I was just gonna say, like, I'm. I'm just honored to be here. And I'm honored, you know, that the Lord has. He's literally placed me here. Like, I. This was not a part of my bingo card. I'm just here from the Lord. And I know you, you know, talked about I can come off strong, but I'm strong because, you know, I boast about my weakness in Christ like, I am nothing. Like, the only good thing about me is because of Jesus Christ, he makes me good. I'm still a sinner just like everyone else, but, you know, now I'm a saint because I have Jesus with me. I'm made holy and righteous with him. And testimonies are powerful. It's the spirit of prophecy. So, you know, if the Lord can do it for Dr. Christopher Yuan, he did it for me, and he's going to do it again, you know, And I just want to encourage anyone who's listening. Like I said earlier, seek Jesus. When we read Scripture, he says, I will give you a new heart.
- [48:51]
Allie Beth Stuckey
He.
- [48:51]
Richard Matthews
He said, I will renew a right spirit in you. He doesn't say behavior modifications. He doesn't say, try to, like, be masculine or feminine, whoever you are, or try to, like, leap into maybe marriage or some kind of relationship. Seek the Lord, and the Lord will transform you inside and out. Because the Lord is not interested in behavior modifications. He's not interested in your works. He's just interested in you opening your hand, and he's interested in holding it and saying, I love you. You are my son and my daughter.
- [49:25]
Allie Beth Stuckey
And your behavior does necessarily modify when you start to follow Christ.
- [49:31]
Richard Matthews
Absolutely.
- [49:31]
Allie Beth Stuckey
But to your point, that's not what saves you. He's not saying, change these things before you come to me.
- [49:38]
Richard Matthews
Right. Just come to him.
- [49:39]
Allie Beth Stuckey
Yeah, it's the. You know, it's the prodigal son walking back home, probably stinking with the, you know, the slop and poop of pigs and his father sees him from far away and he starts running to him. And he, the son didn't clean himself up. He did. He couldn't do anything. That is who we are to the Lord.
- [49:59]
Richard Matthews
Yeah.
- [50:00]
Allie Beth Stuckey
We are dead in our sin.
- [50:03]
Richard Matthews
Absolutely.
- [50:03]
Allie Beth Stuckey
Which. And a dead person can't earn anything.
- [50:05]
Richard Matthews
Right.
- [50:06]
Allie Beth Stuckey
A dead person can't work for their salvation. They stink and they're helpless. And it is by grace, through faith that we are made alive in Christ. And so. Thank you.
- [50:16]
Richard Matthews
Yeah. You get washed through the blood of the Lamb and you get conformed to his image as you continue to grow in him. And things will start to shift inside and out, slowly but surely. Yeah.
- [50:25]
Allie Beth Stuckey
Yes. And amen. Well, thank you so much, Richard. I appreciate your boldness. And thanks for coming on. Relatable.
- [50:30]
Richard Matthews
Yes. Thank you so much for having me.
- [50:32]
Allie Beth Stuckey
Thank you.