← Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey
Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey
Ep 1340 | Ex-Muslim: The Only Way to Stop Sharia Law in the US | Shahriq Khan
01:18:09
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- [00:01]
A
Shahrukh Khan was raised a devout Muslim. After 9 11, he decided it was his goal in life to represent Islam as well as he could in America and convert as many people to Islam as possible. But God changed his heart when he was in college. His story is absolutely amazing. And now he has an approach to winning Muslims over to Christ. And it might not be what you think. We have a lot to learn in today's episode. It's brought to you by our friends at the Last Stand. This is incredible Pro life conference where I will be speaking along with Seth Gruber, Frank Turek. So many more. This is June 5th and 6th in Denver, Colorado. Go to the last stand.com use code ally for a discount at. Check out the last stand.com code ally. Shark. Thanks so much for taking the time to join us. Can you tell us who you are and what you do?
- [01:01]
B
Yeah. Well, first of all, it's an honor and it's a pleasure to be your brother in Christ, to have such a powerful sister in Christ to be here with. My name's Shahrukh Khan. I am 27 years old. I'm the founder of Christ Underground. It's a global ministry now by the grace of God that helps equip the church to reach the most about Muslims. And my heart posture and our ministry's heart posture goes very hand in hand. I have a full conviction that the Muslims must become Christian, and there's no other way around it. I was born and raised in New York City, and I'm a New Yorker at heart. But I moved down to Texas and I got saved in college, which I'm sure we'll dive into that testimony.
- [01:40]
A
But tell me a little bit more about your upbringing, being raised Muslim. Tell me about your parents.
- [01:45]
B
Yeah, Well, I want to start here. It really starts with my father. And I want to bring this up because it'll tie into the whole thing. But when you're engaging Muslims in their faith, I want you to know what you're really dealing with. So. So my father is from Pakistan, and bless his heart, he's amazing. He was one of 17, and he was like the golden child. Like, he has to come here to America. He's the one that's gonna get the American job, get the American income, send money back home, bring people over, and he did it. He did it. He came here at 19 with $60 in his pocket. He was a taxicab driver. He worked his entire way through school.
- [02:19]
A
Wow.
- [02:19]
B
And he actually would meet my own mom as a taxicab driver. She was Like a New York hot rod Indian lady. And they would fall in love. She would get him a job at the banks. And my dad just climbed this American dream that everybody's just so yearning for when you're overseas. Like, my dad loved America. He studied, like, the train systems and the electronics. And, like, he was like, this is it. This is like God's country.
- [02:42]
A
And this was like, in the 80s, 90s.
- [02:44]
B
Yeah, this is in the 80s. And so. So my dad would end up coming here to America. He would climb the corporate ladder from a taxicab driver. He would become the senior vice president of a bank on Wall street, and he would run their entire cybersecurity metrics. And it was on September 11th of 2001. My dad actually had went into the office, and I was about three and a half at the time, and the city was just in chaos. And this was in between the first plane and the second plane hitting the Twin Towers. But my dad would actually go up to the 34th floor of his building, and him and his entire team were watching this, like, smoke brigade from the Twin Towers. And my dad actually saw the second plane hit the Twin Towers with his own eyes. And the reason I'm bringing this up, because if you want to understand who I am, my earliest identity was given to me six hours later when my dad came home. We didn't hear from him from six hours. I was watching the news. Everyone's like, what is Islam? Like? I mean, nobody really knew it was terrorism or Islam at the beginning of it, but people were like, what's happening? Like, who is this? There's accusations. My dad came home, and one of my earliest memories was him saying to my older siblings and my mom as well, sharik, what kind of Muslims are we gonna be like? We don't know what's happening, but we need to prove to the entire west that this is not what Islam is. And when it came out that the motive behind it was a terrorism group, that it was associated with Muslim ideologies, radical ideologies, it was very clear that the fear of the Lord from a very young age came upon my life. And I was sitting there watching the news the next few months. We lived in a blue collar city in New York. So our city was a bunch of firefighters and policemen, first responders, and everyone was treating us differently. Like, after 9, 11, it was very clear that my role in life was to be the Western light of Islam. And so I was so passionate about Islamic faith. I loved it so much. And that was an identity that I Would carry all the way. Until college. I was known as this Muslim kid. You know, I really come in and out of the faith a lot, But I truly loved God with all my heart. I yearned for him. I prayed to him every single night.
- [04:50]
A
And you wanted people to know you felt passionate about people knowing, like, Islam isn't what you saw on 9 11.
- [04:56]
B
Exactly.
- [04:57]
A
It's something different. It's something better than that.
- [05:00]
B
Yeah. Because how do you harmonize that? Right. Like, my father is one of the most hard working, most loving, most caring and provider men I know. But then Islam is right here, and it's challenging our family directly. And so we have to prove that, and we have a mandate to prove that. Like, when we were in our mosques getting discipled by our sheikhs and our scholars, they were like, we reference 911 a lot. We're like, this is not what Islam is. And our radical ideologies do not define us. And you see that in the fruit with all the Muslims that I know here in our area, our metroplex, they're doctors and lawyers. They're the head of Baylor Hospital, and they're doing so many humanitarian things for this world. It's like, how do you harmonize this? And it felt like that target on our back was our version of Christian persecution that, like, now we can actually go out there and. And we can prove like, hey, this isn't who we are, but this is what we're actually about. And it's actually an invitation to see the real Islam and the real Allah that's going to be the most merciful and most kind for all of humanity.
- [05:55]
A
Would you say that is the general sentiment of Muslims in America today, and then especially post 9 11, to say, no, we're not a part of that radical group? Because I think we've seen, especially after October 7th, there seems to be some sympathy among Muslims in America toward Hamas or they. It seems like a lot of prominent Muslims, even, you know, Mamdani, the mayor of New York, won't come out and say that there's a genocide going on against the Israelis or something like that. And I'm not even trying to get into a conversation about geopolitics, but I'm just curious what you think the general sentiment is about Islamic terrorism and about those Islamic groups abroad among Muslims in America?
- [06:38]
B
Yeah. So a very big principle, I think that's discipled really well into the Muslim generations are we have to separate Eastern Islam, like, in the. In that side of the world, and Western Islam, like, we are the 21st century. Muslims, we know that Islam is a timeless religion, or so it says it is. We aren't the 7th century Arabs who are enforcing these radical ideologies. So even with Mamdani, like, Mamdani is a Shia Muslim, which is in my opinion, you know, I was a Sunni Muslim, which is a 90% majority sect of Islam. There's like 1.5 billion of us. I say that as if I'm still in there.
- [07:08]
A
Yeah.
- [07:09]
B
But, you know, even the Sunni Muslims are like, you know, Mamdani isn't really a Muslim. Like, he's more of a politician. You know, no Muslim would be parading around doing lgbqt, giving it like a stamp of approval, you know, like, I understand loving trans people and loving people who aren't in your religion, but him, like enforcing and actually parading certain ideas. The entire, like, conservative Islamic population, which is majority of us, we're all looking at him very concerned. We're like, this guy is actually not a Muslim. And it's funny that people, people try to say that he's lying to us about his Islamic agenda, but the reality is I just see him as an extremely lukewarm Muslim. That's, I think, with the majority opinion as well, that he's a politician, that he needs to grow in his faith and he needs to get more convicted, which if he doesn't want to keep the Muslim majority vote behind him, he's going to have to get pretty radical in terms of his ideas, which is just more of like a conservative American standpoint too.
- [07:58]
A
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- [09:36]
B
Yeah, there was a lot. I have a very particular story that I was in kindergarten at the time and my teacher, I had gone to Pakistan to visit our family for a bit and our Pakistani family's amazing. There's like 80 first cousins there, like 30 more of me. But when I had come back to my kindergarten class, my kindergarten teacher looked at me and said, we wish you stayed over there and like, we wish that you didn't come back because, you know, it was. I think she maybe had somebody that was lost in 9 11. And so I was one of the only Muslim kids in my year that time. And so it was very, very prominent. And if it wasn't direct, it was very like subconscious in terms of people are just reacting to us and nobody knows how to trust us. And it made us just triple down on our identity. It made us study the Quran harder. It made us try to understand the Hadith, the teachings of Muhammad, to understand these end times, to understand how we as Muslims can implement this global mandate of what we want to make everybody Muslim. So people think Muslims are lying about that too. I'm like, we're not lying about anything. Like, the Muslims are saying everyone should become Muslim no matter what. And that's like an end times sign. That's an end times prophecy that Muhammad gave us. And so I'm stepping back into this lens of Islam and I'm saying of course it happened. Of course it happened. Of course they're persecuting us. Of course they're treating us differently. And the truth was, as a Muslim, we were so dependent on Islam because we actually had a guarantee of salvation. We all believe in Islam and Islamic theology that Muhammad would actually come back and intercede on the Day of Judgment and that through that he would actually save all the Muslims who just said la ilaha illallah, that Allah is the one God. And that was our assurance, salvation. So this 2 billion person religion that's so strong and so prominent, that's coming into America at record speeds now. They have so much power and faith. It's like, how do we handle that? Like, what's our role as a church and what do we do there as well?
- [11:23]
A
You moved to Texas when you were 12. What was that like?
- [11:26]
B
It was fascinating because nobody really knew what Islam was like in New York. It was everywhere. I come to Texas, and my high school, I think, was like 93% white. And I was like, okay, like, it's like a fresh start. Like, everyone just sees us as like the good Muslims, as they said in the Texas accent. And it didn't really feel like we were all that persecuted anymore. It was like a fresh start. I could focus on school. I could become excellent. I can live out my Islamic faith. We had our own mosques. We could practice our own beliefs. We had our own, you know, societies almost, and we could just be in that. And it was so peaceful. And so it was kind of like a breath of fresh air. I was like, yeah, it's amazing. And Texas is so fruitful. Muslims actually really do align with conservative ideology. So that's. I mean, tons of them are coming here because Texas is just an amazing place to live, and we're one of those families. We really loved it.
- [12:15]
A
And so you continue to be a devout Muslim, basically a Muslim apologist, a Muslim evangelist, people to become Muslim. And then you went to college in the Dallas area at a college where a lot of Muslims go.
- [12:29]
B
Yeah, and actually, one of the biggest MSAs Muslim student associations is at the University of Texas at Dallas, which is where I went. And I went as an insecure Muslim kid who was challenged so much in his faith, who my identity was proving Islam. And when I had gotten to college, I realized I broke out of indoctrination. But because in Islam, we have this chain of command. If I had any issue, I would go to my parents, they would go to their imam, and then they would go to the shaykhs and the scholars who would say, you know, under Sharia law, this is how you operate. This is how you act. And so there was never really a time for me to be challenged in my beliefs. And I was actually known as this Muslim kid who I would argue. And really, I've had to repent for this. Tear away the faith of a lot of my Christian fraternity brothers because I was just, like, so insecure. I was so insecure. And my adult.
- [13:15]
A
Yeah, what do you mean? What do you mean by that?
- [13:17]
B
Tear away their Faith that I would challenge them. I would, I was trained. And all Muslims are trained on this now. Muslims are very devout. We were trained to surgically handle all of the truth claims in the Old Testament and the New Testament. In the Quran, it says those who say Trinity are blaspheming. And that is amongst the worst sin to make something like the Trinity equal to God, that God would never become a man. They completely denied the theology of theophanies, which we can get into in a second. But even the crucifixion claim that it wasn't really Christ on the. Sorry, Christ on the cross. Yeah, all of that was drilled into us from a young age. When I learned that argument when I was in like third grade. And so seeing it in real time and challenging Muslims on their faith. Sorry, challenging Christians on their faith, attacking the New Testament, attacking Paul, attacking the Transmission, attacking, you know, the 40 different Gospels, not just the main four that made it in the Bible, but using all of those together. That's what we were surgically trained on doing. And the truth was I was winning because like what 19 year old is trained on how to handle Islamic apologetics and polemics towards Christianity? Like none of them were.
- [14:18]
A
Yeah.
- [14:19]
B
And so my opinion was my opinion. My, my standard was if I'm just 1% more confident in my faith, if I just win one more argument than my Christian brothers, I'm good and I'm Muslim. And eventually when they're 80, maybe they'll come to Islam because of a seed I planted.
- [14:34]
A
Wow.
- [14:34]
B
Yeah.
- [14:34]
A
Yeah. It sounds a lot like what Christian evangelists feel about planting seeds.
- [14:38]
B
That's where I get it from.
- [14:39]
A
Yeah. And you say that you were insecure, but that was manifesting itself in apologetics and evangelism. Can you talk more about that?
- [14:47]
B
Yeah, I was absolutely obsessed with it. I mean, every day I was, you know, I was playing college rugby, I was doing, you know, I was a 3, I had a 3.4 GPA. I was a pretty okay student. But in all my free time, I would just go home and just study apologetics. I mean, there was a point where it was two or three hours almost every single night. I had free in college for four or five years, I was like, this is everything to me and this is the moment it happened. By trying to read the Bible, by going through the Old Testament, by going through the New Testament, trying to debunk it, and reading my Quran side by side. And I've read the Quran so many times now I'm reading them side by side and I'm Like, I don't even know. I can't defend this. Like, I can't defend my Quran anymore. And that was just so heartbreaking because I'm praying and I'm literally holding the Quran, like, praying into it. There's a surah. I think it's Surah 67 or 68, called Almut. And, like, that surah is going to, like, intercede for you on the day of judgment in Islamic belief. And I'm praying that Surah over and over and over. And I'm like, what's happening?
- [15:46]
A
You know, what was it that you felt that you couldn't defend in the Quran?
- [15:51]
B
So it was. It was just how different it was that the Quran is claiming to stand on the authority of scripture, that it's claiming to be the final revelation, like the updated iPhone of the God of Jacob, Isaac and Abraham. And just reading it side by side. And I would love to show you these differences because you're going to see it. And I pray that it just, like, ruins you for evangelizing Muslims. I think it will. But reading it in a good way, in a great way.
- [16:18]
A
Yeah.
- [16:18]
B
In the best way possible. Yeah. Like, your heart will change completely for that. Ruin for the gospel kind of a way.
- [16:23]
A
Yeah.
- [16:25]
B
But I'm reading it and I'm just like, there's no way this thing can be corrupted. And I'm looking at all the archaeological evidence. I'm looking at the crucifixion evidence, and the way I describe it is, like, there's this plastic bag that I'm holding, and the crucifixion evidence is one rock. And all the New Testament stuff is one rock. And all the Old Testament theology, all the connections is just rock and rock and rock. And eventually this plastic bag just breaks. It just rips right in half. And in 2020, I was a senior in college and I actually decided to leave Islam, but I hadn't let Christ heal me yet. I was, like, honestly, just so agnostic. I was like, I don't want anything to do with any religion. I was so hurt from losing my identity in Islam. I didn't have to tell anybody. And I just got so into the world and I got, you know, hedonistic. I was this young man who was zealous who, like, was just so passionate about religion. And I had no hole to, like, nothing to fill that hole anymore with. And I'll take you to this night because this is where I want to land the plane. It was November 1st. It was 2022, and this was actually the Time in my life where I was most suicidal because I really had not figured out this religion thing. And when the fear of the Lord comes on you at three and a half because of nine, 11 and your family and now you're 24 and there's no identity that you can even grasp onto. Christ hasn't come into my life and healed me yet. I didn't really ask him to. I was lost. And it's actually this is my iPhone background that I read every so often when I need to like kind of rejuvenate myself for the mission, you know, it's. I wrote this prayer and I actually, in 2022, I actually reverted back to Islam on the night that I was most suicidal. And this is what I said. I said, allah, please save me. Why is my mind letting me down? I am so numb and do not care about myself. Why can I not get my mind right? Every day is so painful. Every moment is so harsh. I can't relax anymore. I can't see clearly anymore. I can't enjoy the smallest things anymore. Why have I done this to myself? Please help. And this was the night I was most suicidal. And despite leaving Islam two years later, I was ready to go all the way back in. I felt like I owed it to my Muslim girlfriend who I had to leave. I felt like I owed it to my Muslim community of doctors and lawyers who were mentoring me. I felt like I owed it to my mosque where I can go there for anything I need. There's seven figure surgeons bowing their head down in reverent prayer next to a homeless guy and they're shoulder to shoulder. I loved it. I loved it so much and I felt so disrespectful towards it. And I was like, allah, I'm so sorry, like, put me back in. And that was a night where I had a dream. I had a dream and it was just so white. And I heard the words and I only knew it was Christ because my Christian friends were forcing me into Bible studies and I was defending, I was reading the New Testament, trying to debunk it, but I heard the words like, get up and go, like you have been healed. And so that was the first time I like recognized Christ in my life. And I knew it was his words. I was like, that's not a lot. That's Christ. And I had this feeling that it was Christ, but I just couldn't prove it. And so I have this emotional experience, this dream, and I like, I'm sitting there and I wake up and those words just Pierced my soul because I was sitting there and I was, I was in my bed and I was waking up at like 2pm because I was so depressed and anxious all the time. And I was staying up till 4am and like just trying to work. I was in my high school bedroom because I was getting into all this debt, trying to be an entrepreneur like nothing was working. And for the first time in years I woke up and the light was brighter and the pool in the backyard was a little bluer and I like hugged my mom a little tighter and like the eggs tasted amazing in the morning and I just remember that dream and I'm like, is this Christ's grace? And so that was when I made a decision to go all the way back in with Christ. I'm like, I'm not going to tell anybody about this. I'm just going to make sure that me and Christ are good. And that would be.
- [20:06]
A
Did you even know at that point what really that meant?
- [20:09]
B
No, I had no clue. I had no clue. What I did know. Well, from the Christian side, I had no clue. From a Muslim side, I knew that me leaving Islam was the most blasphemous thing in the world. And it's actually a teaching in the Quran that if you know the message of Allah and you mislead people, you are responsible for their sins on the day of judgment. And I'm like, man, if I went back to Islam, I am screwed right now for sure because I am a word evangelist. We're going hard, but that's what it, that was the weight of it.
- [20:43]
A
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- [21:38]
B
I told my mom about this, you know, maybe a few days later. And she would cry because I was wearing this Christian cross. When I told my dad I wanted to be Christian, he almost swung at me like he was physically abusive, which there's so much grace there. Like, my dad was beat probably 15 times harder by his dad. And so I'm happy to break that chain off my family and like love on him through that. My brother and sister all cried. It was like a four on one. And they're like, shark, you're on drugs, you're being manipulated. You're being, you know, Satan is in your ear. They're very passionate about shaitan or Satan. Like, Satan has a grip on my son and they're like praying deliverance over me. Like they're getting Christian on me, right? And I remember all of this and I'm just thinking like, there's this unshakable conviction in my soul that Christ is Lord. And I knew it because I'm just debunking the Quran over and over in my head. But I'm like, how do I prove it? And I told my parents about this dream. And like, Muslims believe in dreams. And this is something I really stand against. It's a principle of our ministry. You know, everyone is like, hey, we need to pray for dreams and visions in the Muslim world. And as a Muslim who has had a dream and vision of Christ, like, that's not a good excuse. Like, Christ said, pray for more laborers to be sent out because the harvest is plenty, but the laborers are few. He didn't say, lay your hands on a globe and pray for more dreams and visions. Like, I love it when the Holy Spirit moves. I love it because he did for me. But we can't use that as a crutch anymore. We have to like actually understand the Quran at a level that they don't even have to and win them over by reasoning off their scriptures.
- [23:04]
A
So 2022, that's when you felt suicidal. You prayed to Allah, you had the vision of Christ and you felt then that you kind of became a Christian. You said that you bought the Christian cross. You told your family, hey, I think I'm a Christian. You didn't totally know exactly what that looked like. You knew Islam was wrong. You knew Christ had something for you. So before we get to two years later, what did the next two years look like? Were you going to church? Did you join a Bible study? Were you reading the Bible? Or was it just kind of the vague sense of like, okay, I want to be good with Christ, but I Don't know what that looks like.
- [23:36]
B
Totally the vague sense. I. I didn't enter a church until late 2024, okay? Because I was trained to hate the church. Like the church was the most blasphemous thing in the world to me. I would never step foot in there despite me believing in Christ. I also had a lot of church hurt. You know, my Christian friends were not great exemplary Christians by any means. And my Muslim friends were, you know, they were actually more Christian than I think the Christian friends I had were. So it was really just me and just idolizing work and keeping to myself and just the grace of the Lord on this two years like plan in my life because he just kept me so hidden and he kept me so like treasured. And it was basically just me and my Bible. It was me and my Bible for two years straight. And just being in the world, not engaging. But of course I felt extremely disobedient because I have this ex Muslim testimony. I know how to handle the Quran, I know how to remove it as an authority in Muslims lives to pave a way for the gospel. And I'm studying it and I know it. But I remember I reading the Bible and reading the scripture that the world will hate you for saying my name is what Christ said. And I was like, man, the world really loves me. I'm just like that good boy Christian. And I'm still showing up to the parties, you know, I'm still kind of lukewarm. I'm not in the church, I'm friends with everybody. I have this ex Muslim testimony that's like in my heart, but I'm not sharing it with anybody. And my whole family's Muslim. And I wake up every day thinking if Genesis 1:1 is true, Islam is the biggest satanic stronghold on our people today. There's 2 billion Muslims, the largest unreached people group. And I just like kept shoving that down and down and down until actually another piece of Scripture. Jeremiah 20, verse 9. Like that the fire, like me wanting to talk about the Lord was like a fire in my bones. I grew wary holding it in until I couldn't anymore and eventually just like exploded out. So it was years of that. I look back, in hindsight, I'm like, oh, that was just secret place, time. But in the moment it was just muddy and bloody and I was deconstructing my Muslim identity without really having any accountability. And I wouldn't wish that on my worst enemy. I really wouldn't. Because like, you got to be strong, man. You got to Be so strong to do that.
- [25:47]
A
Okay, so to 2024, you said February of 2024. What happened then?
- [25:52]
B
So I was once again so skeptical of the church. And I was definitely not as charismatic as I am now. But I was at this prayer retreat and it was just me and maybe 15 of my friends, and we were just praying in a circle. And my buddy, he felt called to pray over me, and he just, like, laid his hand on me. And I had never told him about my suicidal thoughts that had been like, rampant in my deconstruction phase. But he laid his hand on me and he's like, we're just going to pray off the spirit of suicide, off you and your family. And for the first time ever, like, I am, like, so skeptical. I try to be so logical. I was on the floor, like, it felt like £10,000 were on my shoulders. And then I don't even remember what he prayed, but he was praying on me. And it was maybe like 40 seconds. And I just like, once again felt that, like, this lightness come up after this prayer. And I'm still, you know, I'm. This is 2024. So I've only been a believer for maybe two years. Like, seriously. So I'm still wrestling with it a lot, but I'm like, was that like, deliverance? Was that like, casting a demon out of me? Like, is that gonna still happen? I don't know, but it felt like it was. I don't have a better answer for it honestly, but that when that demon was casted out of me, that spirit of suicide, same thing. Like, I felt that lightness and that grace in my life, and I was like, christ, like, you have delivered me, like, hallelujah. And that's what really lit my fire for now, public evangelism. So that was in 2024. Now this next year is very crucial from 2024. This is February 2024. I now I enter the church. I have discipleship. I'm in community. I joined a bunch of men's ministries. I'm just growing so much in the faith. Little thought in the back of my head. I'm an ex Muslim. There's 2 billion Muslims. There's 2 billion Christians. And no one's talking about it. No one has a solution. I'm like, what are we doing, guys? So this was April of 2025, actually almost one year ago today. So we're celebrating our one year anniversary of our ministry, which is really exciting. I picked my parents up from Saudi Arabia. They went to Mecca to do the Muslim Pilgrimage and my mom, you know, I throw my dad in the passenger seat, I throw my mom in the backseat. I throw their luggage in the back of my car. And I'm looking at my mom through the rear view mirror and this like she's explaining her experience. She's like, it's so dangerous. All the Muslims were pushing past her. She has this like torn mcl. They're pushing past her to go get close to the Kaaba, touch the Kaaba, kiss the Kaaba and, and what's the Kaaba? The Kaaba is the big black cube in Saudi Arabia that the Muslim circle that they believe that Abraham and Ishmael made. And if you're, we'll talk about that in a second. If you're engaging Muslims in their faith, you have to talk about the Kaaba. It is like the pillar of Islam. It's one of the pillars of Islam actually to go there and perform this, this ritual. So she's at the Kaaba and it's so dangerous my dad had to like put her, his arms around her so that people stop shoving her. And it's like pinnacle of Islamic theology and spiritual experience and like reverence for God. She's sitting there and I look at her in the mirror and the same spiritual death that I saw in my own eyes, I recognized it in my own mother. My heart just completely shatters. And that very night I remember going home and saying a very simple repentance prayer. I said, lord, I repent for being a good boy Christian. I call it like the khaki pant wearing Christians, like the guys that just really aren't making anybody mad at them for speaking of Jesus. I had this ex Muslim testimony that I was so passionate about that I just wasn't sharing with anybody. And I repented. I said, Lord, please just add me to the body of Christ that is responsible for ending all false religions. One sentence. And I went to bed that Friday was actually Good Friday. And I just felt this insane conviction in my soul to launch something, do something about it. That was the day I started my first YouTube video. And that very first YouTube video ends up just exploding on the Internet. And the ministry that we started today has come off of that. So that was April 18th, our first YouTube video. And we were celebrating our one year anniversary of that video with the whole team. And since then that's turned into a global content machine. It started our ministry. We now have almost 10,000 people in over 100 different countries learning the master key, which I'll talk to you about in a Second, it's our apologetic system to reach the most devout Muslims. And the Instagram brand exploded. And now all of a sudden I'm thrusted to the front lines of Muslim revival and there's like a real burden to save the 7 million Muslims here in the West. It's only 1.5% of our population. I think if we save them now, yesterday really is what needed to happen, then they'll be the ones to go spread the gospel to all of the 53 Muslim majority countries. It doesn't have to be American missionaries anymore. We focus on America as a mission trip. I really feel like that's the key because I know if my dad comes to Christ, his first inclination is, oh, the 80 plus first cousins we have in Pakistan, they need to know they've been misled and he'll go back and he speaks the language, he has the passports, he has the authority to go over there. And I think it's so prophetic. It's like the entire conservative movement is saying, deport the Muslims. I was at Amfest, some people were saying like, we should just kill all of them. I'm like, what are you guys talking about? Why don't we just make them Christian? Like, when did we become so incapable? If we can't defend our faith against Muslims, we shouldn't. Like, maybe we should just become Muslim if they're that persuasive.
- [31:09]
A
So tell me about sharing the gospel with Muslims. And we might not all know because most of the audience is not Muslim exactly what you're talking about, but we want to know. We want to learn about all you're talking about, the inconsistencies, where to go with them. We want to know more about Islam so we can be effective evangelists. So tell us, let's do it.
- [31:27]
B
Okay. So the key principle is we have to use a biblical scripture approach. So it's so easy to come at morality claims. We can call Muhammad certain words. We can say he's a warlord, a pedophile. We can come at their politics. None of it is persuasive to Muslim. If you guys learn one thing from me, two things. First, we have to use what's persuasive to Muslims, not to Christians. So as Christians, it's very easy to get in this echo chamber of hearing, you know, Islam isn't compatible with the West. Sharia law needs to be banned. I don't know a single Muslim who looks at that and is like, oh, you know, that's a really convincing argument. And I'm gonna go and leave My faith. We have to do one thing, and that's undermine the authority of the Quran. This is the only thing we need to worry about. Nothing else matters. This book has authority over 2 billion people that are still made in the image of God. Sharia law, politics, wives, moral code, ethics, everything comes from this. So if we can remove this, that they think this is the divine word of God. If we get this out of the way. Straight path to the gospel.
- [32:34]
A
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- [33:47]
B
But Matthew 23:15 says this. It says, woe to you, the Pharisees who travel land and sea just to make one single convert. You make them twice the son of Satan that you are. And in the church, what we're doing is. I don't think he's just talking to the Pharisees. He's saying Christ is calling us sons of Satan because we're ripping away people's faith away from Christ. And what we're doing as a church right now is we're deconstructing Islam, but we're not reconstructing biblical foundations. And you end up with a bunch of sharks who, by the grace of God, I got saved. But I was agnostic for years, and I almost took my own life. Like, we don't have that. We can't have that. We can't have Muslim to atheist, Muslim to agnostic. We can't have Muslim to New Age. None of that. It needs to be Muslim to Christian.
- [34:27]
A
Yeah.
- [34:28]
B
So how do we do that? We need to deconstruct the Quran using only the Bible, specifically this, the Torah. The Torah is the key. And I'm gonna show you. I'm just gonna read you a few stories, and I want you to tell me what stands out to you. So this is Surah 28. This is in the Quran.
- [34:47]
A
And this is actually surah is like a chapter. Verse.
- [34:49]
B
Chapter.
- [34:50]
A
Okay.
- [34:50]
B
Yeah. Think of it like Genesis. Like Genesis, yeah. And so surah and then verse or ayat is what Muslims will say, but for this case, it's Surah 28, verse 26 to 29. I'm gonna read this to you. You tell me what stands out. So this is Moses getting married at the well of Midian. It says, oh, my two daughters. Sorry. One of my two daughters suggested, oh, my dear father, hire him. A strong, trustworthy person is definitely the best to hire. The old man proposed to Moses, I wish to marry one of these two daughters of mine to you, provided that you stay in my service for eight years. If you complete 10, it'll be a favor from you, but I do not wish to make it difficult for you. God willing, you'll find me an agreeable man. Moses responded, then it is settled. Whichever term I fulfill, there will be no further obligation on me. And God is a witness to what we say. When Moses had completed the term and was traveling with his family, he spotted a fire on the side of Mount Tur. That's the burning bush. Did anything stand out to you in that story? Who was. Who was the Israelite who had to serve two terms for his wives?
- [35:52]
A
Jacob.
- [35:52]
B
It was Jacob. Was it Moses?
- [35:54]
A
No.
- [35:55]
B
How many daughters did Jethro have? This is a very niche Bible question.
- [35:58]
A
I don't know if I know.
- [35:59]
B
So he had seven. And we also notice Jacob's story conflated with Moses, because at the very end, it says, when Moses had completed the term and was traveling with his family, he spotted a fire, the burning bush. But we know in Genesis 30, Jacob is the one that says, give me my wives and children after I fulfill my term, and I'll be on my way. So what's happening? This divine word of God? The Muslims are claiming our scriptures are corrupted.
- [36:24]
A
In 2026, the Christian scriptures.
- [36:26]
B
The Christian Scriptures are corrupted. They're claiming that our Bible, Old Testament and New are completely corrupted. Totally wrong. And in 2026, we have let them get away with that claim way too much. Specifically, how is it corrupted? They're saying that we Made up the story of Jacob with Rachel and Leia. That we made it up. It was actually Moses. And so we actually corrupted Exodus 2. Now that Moses was actually with his family. Now he's not with his family. We changed seven daughters to. To two daughters. We changed. I mean, what else in there? Right. The service terms that Jacob served for a wife. No, no, it was actually Moses. They're saying that the Jews corrupted all of those scriptures all throughout time. Let's keep going. This is in every single story.
- [37:06]
A
And the Quran obviously was written many centuries after the Torah was written. And so. And yet they claim that. Is this inspired? This might be a very, like, fundamental question, but they believe that the Quran is inspired by Muhammad, that Muhammad is one who wrote the Quran.
- [37:27]
B
Great question. Okay, so Muhammad was illiterate. It's actually a miracle in Quran in Islam that Muhammad couldn't read or write and that he's actually getting all these stories of the Old Testament correct. And that's a miracle. It's like proof of his prophethood. Okay, okay.
- [37:41]
A
And what is it verified against? Like, we can look at the Old Testament and we can look at archeology, and we can look at different historical documents at the time that existed in addition to the Torah, and we can say, okay, like, these things are checking out. Are there verification processes that Muslims have to say, okay, no, it really was Moses and not Jacob?
- [38:04]
B
Yes. So that's a fascinating question. And you're. You're kind of asking, like, well, where are these stories really coming from? Like, what other source? Yeah, I'm going to get there because I want to build a. Really? That's a great question. That means you got the apologetics down to his tea. Okay, I'm going to get there because I'm going to build a cumulative case for you, and then I'm going to really land the plane for you.
- [38:18]
A
Okay. Awesome.
- [38:19]
B
Okay, this is Surah 2, verse 249. Tell me, what stands out with this one? When Saul. So this is Saul versus Goliath. Okay. David and Goliath. When Saul marched forth with his army, he cautioned, God will test you with a river, so whoever drinks his fill from it is not with me. And whoever does not taste it except for a sip from the hollow of his hands, is definitely with me. They all drink their fill, except for a few. When he and the remaining faithful crossed the river, they said, now we're no match for Goliath. But those who believed were certain that they would meet God. And they reasoned, how many times has a force Vanquished a mighty army by the will of God. So Saul's army went to advance Goliath and his warriors, they prayed showers with perseverance. They defeated Goliath's army by God's will. And then David killed Goliath. And then David was immediately blessed with kingship. That's the next line. Okay, what stood out there for you? A few things.
- [39:12]
A
Yeah, well, a few things. Obviously David didn't automatically become king. Saul wasn't happy that that who thing happened. He was afraid that David was going to take his throne. All of that stuff.
- [39:22]
B
Right, exactly. So. And then also, wasn't David and Goliath a 1v1? And then they got inspired.
- [39:26]
A
Right.
- [39:26]
B
And then that first part, who was the Israelite? He was a judge who tested his army with a river and they had to lap like dogs and sit from the hollow of his hands. Was that Saul? He had 30,000 people. That got whittled down to 300. Yeah, it was Gideon. Yeah, it's the Gideon 300 in Judges 7.
- [39:44]
A
Mm.
- [39:45]
B
That was Saul. How did that end up in the Quran?
- [39:47]
A
Right. And why.
- [39:49]
B
Okay, that's my story.
- [39:51]
A
I can't let go that question. Like, why would we change these? It's like you keep the same stories, but you just change the characters. It's interesting.
- [39:57]
B
I have an intense theory on that that I really want to land with you. I'll tell you why after I do a few more examples.
- [40:01]
A
No, go ahead.
- [40:02]
B
Okay. This one to me is absolutely insane. The Muslims will say, your Bible is corrupted. I'm saying specifically how. This is Surah 17, verse 101. How many plagues were in the Bible?
- [40:14]
A
There were nine plagues.
- [40:15]
B
There's ten.
- [40:15]
A
There were ten plagues. The tenth one was the first plague.
- [40:20]
B
So the tenth one was the most important one. Okay, 17, verse 101. We surely gave Moses nine clear signs, and two of those were the hand in the shirt and I believe the serpent getting thrown down. So there's seven plagues in the Quran. Guess which plague they conveniently leave out?
- [40:35]
A
The tenth one.
- [40:36]
B
Yeah. The death of the firstborn, the Passover lamb, the blood on the doorposts, the angel passing over. They conveniently leave that out. So when they're saying our Bible's corrupted, our scripture is corrupted. The Passover is mentioned 70 plus times all throughout since Exodus through the New Testament. They're saying that the Jews just made that up, that they still believe it today, that we just added it in Scripture for fun, for giggles. That's what they're claiming when they Say our Bible is corrupted. Like, let's press them on this. You're saying our scripture's corrupted? Let's defend it. Let me give you a really funny one, okay? Who adopted Moses? Do you know that one?
- [41:12]
A
Miriam? Well, no, Miriam was his sister. Correct.
- [41:16]
B
Okay. The daughter. The.
- [41:18]
A
The daughter of Pharaoh. Yeah, I don't remember her name.
- [41:20]
B
I don't remember her name either. I'm still a new Christian, so give me grace on that one.
- [41:23]
A
No, you know a lot about. I don't remember the, the Pharaoh's daughter's name who picked him up out of the river, but it was Miriam who was his sister.
- [41:31]
B
Yeah, so. So in the, in the biblical account, it's an Exodus 2. Pharaoh's daughter went down to the Nile and Moses was, I think, in the basket. And she found him and rescued him and said, hey, we should adopt him, sir. 28, verse 9. Pharaoh's wife said to him, this baby is a source of joy for me and you. Do not kill him. Perhaps he may be useful to us or we may adopt him as a son. So even the littlest details. Pharaoh's daughter to Pharaoh's wife. Have you seen the Prince of Egypt movie?
- [41:58]
A
Yeah.
- [41:59]
B
Okay. In the Prince of Egypt, they have Pharaoh's wife adopting Moses. And everyone in the Christian scene was like, wasn't it Pharaoh's daughter? Like, why did they get that detail wrong? It's a Muslim movie. They did it in the Quran. Yeah, the Pharaoh's wife details in the Quran.
- [42:12]
A
The Prince of Egypt is a Muslim.
- [42:13]
B
They use Muslim theology. They use Muslim scripture.
- [42:16]
A
I had no.
- [42:17]
B
Isn't that hilarious?
- [42:18]
A
Wow.
- [42:18]
B
So whoever made that movie might have been really misled. Or they're just a Muslim.
- [42:21]
A
I had no idea. Okay. That's so interesting.
- [42:23]
B
Yeah.
- [42:29]
A
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- [43:32]
B
There is a cumulative case that we're building. There are thousands of differences here that end up in the Quran. The most prominent ones, and this is the kill shot, the story of Joseph. Because you're asking where these stories come from. Why was it changed in this way? What's the motive? This is Surah 12 and this one's really important because we use this in our ministry a lot in treat evangelism. This is the story of faking Joseph's death. And when they presented the bloody robe to Jacob, his father, the Quran says this. Then the brothers returned to their father in the evening weeping. And they cried, our father. We went racing and left Joseph with our belongings. And a wolf devoured him. But you won't believe us no matter how truthful we are. They brought his shirt stained with false blood. And Jacob responded, no, your souls must have tempted you to do something evil. So I can only endure it with beautiful patience. It's with God help, God's help, that I seek to bear your claims. So let me summarize what's happening. The brothers come home in the evening weeping. They make a claim, they hand him the shirt and they say, Jacob, you're not going to believe us. But Joseph was devoured by a wolf. And Jacob in the Quran doesn't believe him. He says, no, no, Joseph is alive. And I know that. And I can just only bear witness to what you say. And that's later corroborated in the Chronic's account. My favorite verse in Genesis is Genesis 37, verse 34. Jacob sees the reaction and he says, Joseph has without doubt been torn to pieces. Jacob knows for sure that Joseph is dead. Very minute difference. But in the Quran it's a miracle that Muhammad can say the entire story of Joseph word for word, bar for bar. And he doesn't get it wrong. He does it all in one go for 98 verses. That's a miracle of Muhammad. Guess how many differences there are in the story of, of the Quran and the Torah with the story of Joseph?
- [45:22]
A
I don't know.
- [45:24]
B
Take a guess. There's 98 verses in the, in the Quran. Throw a number out there,
- [45:29]
A
47.
- [45:30]
B
47. That's a good number. That was maybe four or five. There's 944.
- [45:34]
A
Wow.
- [45:35]
B
Differences in between the story of Joseph in the Quran and the Torah.
- [45:39]
A
Wow.
- [45:40]
B
And even the sheikhs, like Dr. Yasir Qadhi, who's the head of Epic, who I was with last Friday, even he says it's a miracle that these stories are so similar. Are they? Because that one detail change, Jacob knowing he's alive or dead means that we randomly corrupted all of Genesis 37 to 50, all of it. So what we're doing is we're pressing him on it. Now let me answer this question for you. Where are these stories coming from? I'm going to build a case. This is a theory of mine. I think it's the strongest theory we have. Who is telling these stories to Muhammad? Well, if you look at the, the landscape of Saudi Arabia, the Jews get kicked out of the temple in 70 A.D. they actually migrate south and they actually end up, you know, in the seventh century around Mecca, Medina and Khabar. These are Saudi Arabian cities. Okay. There's not a lot of Christian influence there. A lot of these Jewish legends that they have. It's called Midrash Judaism. Are you familiar with Midrash Judaism? So Midrash is basically ancient folklore that the rabbinical Jews made to expand on the Torah stories. Those are rampant in the Quran. Muhammad is hearing the stories from rabbinical Jewish people who deny the Messiah and it's ending up in the Quran. I'll give you two pieces of proof.
- [46:50]
A
Interesting.
- [46:51]
B
In Surah 12, that story of Joseph, Jacob suddenly thinks Joseph's alive despite the Torah. The Torah very clearly says Jacob knows Joseph is without doubt torn to pieces. Okay. I'm trying to make this as entertaining as possible because now we're getting deep, deep apologetics.
- [47:06]
A
No, it's good.
- [47:08]
B
In the Jewish Midrash, we have this. Oh, I wish I had it with me. We have this giant textbook. It's called Legends of the Jews. It's written by. It's compiled by Louis Ginsburg. And my team is like eating that thing for breakfast. Like, the more we read into it, the more we're finding Quran similarities left and right. There's a story, a commentary on the Torah that says, you know, Jacob knew Joseph was without doubt torn to pieces. But actually there's a rabbi that makes an interpretation saying, but, you know, because Jacob is, you know, a prophet of God, which he is in Islam as well, that he wouldn't know this. And it's actually impossible to mourn the death of somebody who's actually alive. And so Jacob actually knows that Joseph's alive. That detail ends up in the Quran. One more detail. This one's really good. This is Surah 1267-68. Give me some grace here as I flip through our Qurans. Okay. This is the most. And for like the audience too, guys. Like, this is like making sense out of nonsense sometimes. So just bear with me. There's a verse. Jacob is instructing his, his sons to go through a different gate. So the sewer says this. He then instructed them, oh my sons, do not enter the city all through one gate, but go through separate gates. And he just says that one random sentence and there's no motive, there's no explanation. And then he says it's only God who decides. That exact same random passage is in the Jewish legends from before the time of Muhammad. That they're saying, hey, Jacob is saying to his brothers, sorry to the, to the brothers, do not enter from the same gate because of how handsome you are. And then there's one more line and it says, lest the evil eye will smite you and take advantage of you. So enter from one gate, leave through another gate, have a clean entrance through the city gates. Wow, that city. Sorry, that city. That story is in the Quran too. It's all over the place. There's even more niche ones like disbelievers being transformed into apes. That ends up in the Quran, obviously not in our Torah. Yeah, Rabbinical Jewish legend saying that that's going to happen.
- [49:15]
A
So you believe that Muhammad was really influenced by the Jews and the Jewish teaching of the time. He couldn't read it, he heard it, he tried to piece it together into his own religion. That sounded kind of like an Abrahamic religion. And it's. Islam is typically categorized as an Abrahamic religion. Christianity, Judaism and Islam. But are you saying that it's kind of really not? Because it's not genuine.
- [49:41]
B
Right. There is. There is one Abrahamic religion and it's fulfilled in the Jewish Messiah, Jesus Christ. Okay, so that's actually a good point. So the claim that Islam has of how Muhammad is actually even related to Abraham is through the line of Ishmael. But in Genesis 21, verses 1 through 21, Muhammad actually takes that story and he changes it too, that they actually Abraham casted out Hagar and Ishmael and they would end up wandering in the desert of Beersheba, which is about 17 miles from Gerar, which is where Abraham resided. That's Genesis 20, verse one. And that's near modern day Gaza. So from modern day Gaza to Beersheba was the journey of Hagar and Ishmael. And he put a water on her shoulder and when they ran out of water, she stopped moving. Okay, really normal story. And the question is like, why did Hagar and Ishmael really even get cast out in the first place? It was because of the mocking on Sarah's child Isaac. Muhammad takes that story and he repurposes it to have Hagar and Ishmael go 800 miles down to Mecca and Ishmael is now an infant. So now they're saying that we corrupted our scriptures, that before Isaac was even born, Hagar and Ishmael got cast out of the house. So that entire mocking narrative is removed and that 17 mile journey from Gerar to Beersheba is now gerar to Mecca, 800 miles south. I'm like, really? They made that journey? Are you serious? To a barren valley in the middle of nowhere on God's command. So even the claim that Abraham and Ishmael built the Kaaba, which then goes, it's even, oh my gosh, everything's contradictory. It's insane. Even in Genesis 21, verse 21, it says that Hagar got Ishmael a wife from Egypt. He twists that detail and he says, no, no, not Egypt. Muhammad says that Ishmael got a wife from an Arabic tribe called Jerome, and that's how he eventually got related to Ishmael. So it's blaspheming the Torah.
- [51:43]
A
Last sponsor for the day. I'll get into that in just a second, but let me remind you. Subscribe to Blaze TV. Go to blazetv.com ally get 20 off your subscription. All subscriber exclusive stuff from not just me. All kinds of posts that you don't get on the big tech platforms that could kick us off and censor us at any time. Go to blazetv.com ally to subscribe today. And let me tell you about my friends at Alliance Defending Freedom. I don't know if you know this, but May is National Foster Care Month, and my friends at Alliance Defending Freedom are supporting foster care and adoptive families in America. Over 300,000 kids are in foster care right now, and states desperately need parents to fill that need. Unfortunately, progressive government officials are turning away Christian parents who want to help these foster kids because they won't go along with the LGBTQ agenda. They won't sign a document that says, sure, I'll help transition this child. If they decide that they're the opposite sex. That's really happening. Jessica Bates is one of those women up in Oregon. We had her at Share the Arrows. She won the Share the Arrows award. ADF is defending her in court. They're defending Christian parents because these Democrat state governments are fighting against these Christian parents ability to be able to help these kids. And so one way that you can support foster kids is by ensuring that Christian parents are free to adopt them and to foster them by supporting Alliance Defending freedom. Go to joinadf.com ali make your donation today. This can really make a difference. Joinadf.com Ali. So all these inconsistencies, I'm hearing that Christians need to know our Old Testament really well.
- [53:25]
B
Really well.
- [53:25]
A
We need to understand the Torah. We need to be able to press people on the inconsistencies. But for those who are like, okay, you know what, I'm a busy mom of five. I've got a new mosque behind my house. I really just want to love those people and share Christ with them. Don't know if I'm going to become a scholar in the Quran. Like what is a message of Christianity that would resonate with a Muslim? That would at least make them think, huh? Like I've never heard that before. Like I, I remember now, I'm forgetting his name, but he was an ex Muslim pastor, you probably know who he is, who died several years ago of cancer. And he was talking about when he was seeking comfort and he was a Muslim and he was looking for verses of comfort in the Quran. They're technically there, but they're not the same as the Bible. And he was reading, you know, Jesus's sermon on the Mount in Matthew. Blessed are the peacemakers, Blessed are those who mourn for you will be comforted. And that really just was like, oh my gosh, kind of like how you felt when you felt the light of Christ. Christ in that dream, he read that and was like, that's what I'm looking for. Is there anything like that that you could tell a Christian? Like, hey, if you're going to go with a message, say this, go with this angle.
- [54:39]
B
Yeah, I, I have a very hard principle on this and I use my own experience. His name was Nabil Qureshi and he's an incredible guy. Incredible guy. He, he gets discredited a lot because he came from Ahmadiyya Islam, which is a very like almost 1% minority sect of Islam that actually believes that Jesus was 120 years old and died in Kashmir. That was his like theological background. So he was a great Muslim. He is a Warrior for the kingdom. But even his approach is very New Testament focused. And the issue is that the Muslims handled his approach. He was a monster. He dropped Seeking Allah, Finding Jesus. Incredible book. I read it like three times when I was Muslim. He was huge in my journey too. But I'm very plugged into the Muslim ecosystem. Yeah, they've handled all those claims at a very well level. So we have to reach people based on their worldview. And sadly it's the Muslims are surgically trained in a way as if they're almost like rabbinical Jews in real time to handle the truth claims of the New Testament. So the truth is we have to get this out of the way first. And even if we say Jesus loves you and we give him Jesus teachings, they're gonna say we love him too, but he's not God. Because their theology is gripped by this book.
- [55:52]
A
Yeah.
- [55:53]
B
So we have to undermine the authority of this. Now the truth is all those stories I gave you, we. The thing I love about this is that we're not getting into politics or morality or ethics. I've led workshops with like 13 year old kids who know the story of Joseph, who know the story of Moses, who know their biblical story so well. So the first thing for like the mom who doesn't want to become an apologist, train your kids on knowing like every single Bible story. Show them the videos, walk them through it yourselves. If we have a biblically literate generation where the stories of the prophets are the key, we're going to save Muslims left and right and they can engage students in their schools.
- [56:28]
A
I mean, how do we address the claim though, that their claim, even if we say, okay, well the Quran says this, the Bible says this, they think that the Bible is corrupted. How do we address the claim?
- [56:39]
B
Yeah, so this is called pressing the differences. So it's a general claim. It's so large. Specifically where was it changed? And we have thousands of examples like that. So let's use the Moses, Jacob example. Why? You have to give a motive, you have to prove it. So there's two types of corruption and this is apologetics here. There's two types of corruption. There's unintentional corruption, which is like a pen slip from like a Hebrew scribe, or there's intentional corruption, which is what we saw. Like how did Moses become all the way Jacob? You can't, you can't like pen slip your way into mixing those two stories. You can't pen slip your way into corrupting all of Saul into Gideon. That's impossible. It has to be intentionally corrupted. So for intentional corruption you need to have a motive. And there's four motives. I give the Muslims these four motives open saying you can add anything else if you want, but if it's not, if you can't prove a motive for corruption, it didn't happen and the Quran is wrong. And no Christian will ever convert to Islam unless you can prove a motive for corruption. Those four motives are this, I call it ppet. Ppet. Prophecies of Muhammad. So let's go through an example together that Moses, Jacob. Example, let's say Moses served for wives, but that's actually what happened and we corrupted it to make it Jacob. Okay, the first corruption incentive is to hide a prophecy of Muhammad that this guy Muhammad was coming around and we don't want him to be known anywhere.
- [57:57]
A
And we're talking about the motives of the Jews at the time to have corrupted. Yes, the Torah.
- [58:04]
B
Exactly.
- [58:04]
A
Okay, so these are the, these are the motives that a Muslim would maybe ascribe to a Jewish person.
- [58:11]
B
Exactly.
- [58:11]
A
Got it. Okay, go ahead.
- [58:12]
B
So I found four motives, Muslim friend, my lovely Muslim brother. Give me some more if you find some. The first one is prophecies of Muhammad. Does that specific change hide any prophecies of Muhammad? Are there any prophecies of Muhammad in Moses serving for a wife or Jacob serving for a wife? No. Okay, ethical motives. Does it change your stance on abortion or premarital sex or anything of the Ten Commandments? No, it's a story of serving for wives. Okay, theological motives. Does it affect the oneness of God? Does it affect the Holy Spirit? Does it affect crucifixion or Trinitarianism or anything? No, it's just a story of Moses getting married to two wives or Jacob in our sense. The last one is what else? Political motives. Is there like a land exchange? Is there a political incentive? Is there any reason why politically they would make that change in scriptures and then do it across every Hebrew Torah in the world? No, it's a story. And so the key here is that the Old Testament stories are saving Muslims because they can't prove anywhere that it's corrupted. And that's using just the Quran. So we have this thing called the Dead Sea Scrolls, okay? And there's manuscripts that are from 250 BC and there's a copy of Genesis in the Dead Sea scrolls dated at 125 BC that matches what we read in our Old Testament today. So we have this insane manuscript chain and what they are essentially claiming, and I say this very publicly to Every Muslim apologist that's trying to debunk Shahrukh Khan, you have to explain thousands of corruptions, the motive to do so. And you have to prove that for some reason From Moses to 250 BC the Jews were just corrupting everything they had over and over in all the prophet books with no motives. I mean some have theological motives maybe, but they were doing that and then it just stopped in 250 BC that. From 250 BC for the next 2200 years until today, nobody wanted to corrupt anything. It's a conspiracy theory. I call it the global Torah conspiracy theory. It's like, it's an insane claim. You have to prove that. Or Occam's razor. Muhammad heard the stories wrong because he was already illiterate. Which you confirm. Which one is it Muslim friend? And the beauty of this is because we're only using the scriptures to debunk the authority of the Quran. Now we can use the scriptures to lay the prologamina, the, the foundations of the Messiah that all come from the Torah. So because we use the Torah to deconstruct the Quran, what does the Torah really say? Original sin, blood atonement, theophanies, God wrestling with Jacob, God walking in the garden. God was a man all the time. Jeremiah 1. The word of the Lord touched my mouth. The word of the Lord was physical. God was physical. Yahweh was physical. The burning bush like he was manifesting on earth all the time. Then we go into like the messianic prophecies, like the suffering servants, a great one. And before we ever touch the New Testament, we now have this giant foundation of the three step process which is deconstruct Quran. Reconstruct those biblical foundations. Now the gospel lands like butter in our ministry. We have the most about Muslims, Muslims who are way more devout than I ever was coming to faith. And because we build it right and we do it right, the first thing on their mind is I need to learn this so I can bring my family with me. That's discipleship. And I'm sitting on this and I'm like, why is like we need this, we need you to know this, we need people to know this. Because if we do that, if we just stop this like Christian echo chamber of Islam is incompatible. Like we know it's been uncompatible for the last 1400 years, but there's 2 billion of them. What's the solution? Yeah, we have to get this out of the way.
- [61:51]
A
Yeah.
- [61:52]
B
And I, I'm really, I have a lot of foresight the only other way. If you can somehow explain the thousands of corruptions that the Jews made for no reason, some of them that we went over today. If you can somehow explain that, you would still need to do one thing, which is to like debunk Shahrukh Khan and debunk this argument. You would need to go and excavate all of Saudi Arabia and you would have to find just one Torah scroll that has the Moses Jacob remix, that has the Saul Gideon remix, that has all of these differences. Just one, Just find one. And I guarantee that every Christian in the world would pay attention to it, but they would never do that because Saudi Arabia is a cash cow for Islam. The Kaaba is so important. They can't just dig it up. And what if they dig it up and they'll probably find our Torah scrolls? Then what? Yeah, Islam shouldn't exist. I don't think it should be existing past this year. If we get this message out, I am very passionate about that. And the best part is that this can help Muslims come to Christ.
- [62:46]
A
Right?
- [62:47]
B
And I'll land the plane here. I've been landing like seven different planes this whole time.
- [62:52]
A
No, that's great.
- [62:54]
B
Ex Muslims make really great Christians. They make really great Christians. I stand as a living example of that. When they are discipled correctly and they are ripped out of it, the fire that the second largest world religion we now can close the door on forever. We don't have to defend Muhammad or Islam anymore. When we become Christian, we don't shut up. And my first inclination is my whole family's got to come with me and we go and make disciples. So I think the Lord blessed us so much with his scripture and like the reverence that I've had for God's word now seeing all the differences, I'm like, this is incredible. It really is.
- [63:25]
A
Tell me about your family's response to this. This.
- [63:29]
B
They hated it when I became Christian.
- [63:32]
A
Right.
- [63:33]
B
Very, very emotional. Still one of the hardest things I've ever done. My mom still calls me every single day cuz she's sees my content and she's like, please stop. She's like, please stop, Sharik. Like, this is ridiculous. Like some people treat her differently now because of me. Like her son's like the biggest apostate and he's not shutting up. And my dad is like, you know, this is before. There's two stages to this. When I first started the content, they. I mean, it's like the hardest thing I've ever dealt with. Like the Lord says to honor Your mom and dad. And I, like, I just don't feel like I'm doing that. So I feel like I'm being so disobedient. But then, like, the Lord has exalted this ministry, this mission. I don't know if it's in my own power. I really don't think it is. But it's like, what's the balance there?
- [64:15]
A
Yeah. Honor your father and mother. And then also Jesus says, if you're not willing to hate your father and mother, take up your cross and follow me, then you're not worthy to be my disciple. And so there's. Yeah, I mean, there's both of that. And obviously God tells us to do both. And so there's a way to honor. While also saying, okay, my allegiance is completely sold out to Christ and I'm trusting that he's going to take care of them because he loves them even more. I bet that's really hard.
- [64:43]
B
Yeah. But thank you for sharing that with me. I actually needed to hear that because I think I focused so much on that first half.
- [64:48]
A
Yeah.
- [64:48]
B
But, like, he's. He's come with a sword that is going to divide families. And, like, how much more willing are you guys going to be to bear your cross?
- [64:54]
A
Right, right.
- [64:56]
B
Yeah. Well, that got me.
- [64:57]
A
Yeah. That's a really tough position to be in. So they haven't. Yet their hearts have not softened towards the gospel. But you're working on it.
- [65:05]
B
Yes. And so this is. This is, you know, quite personal. But I. I run this master. We call it the Master Key. I run the master key with them multiple times. And I've been discipling my mom for the last year. And she's devout. She's been in it. She's been in it for a long time.
- [65:23]
A
And you said she's from India. Yeah, she was raised an Indian Muslim. Your dad from Pakistan?
- [65:27]
B
Yeah, my mom was raised Hindu. She converted to marry my dad.
- [65:29]
A
Oh, interesting. Okay. Didn't know that aspect.
- [65:31]
B
And she teaches at a high level, too.
- [65:33]
A
Okay.
- [65:34]
B
So she's actually a teacher in Islam. And my dad is Pakistani. Muslims are the most. I say this with no pride. The most about Muslims out there. They are in it like this. The schooling Systems, the. The PhDs that come out of Pakistan. Dr. Yashir Qadhi's Pakistani. Like, they're all amazing.
- [65:48]
A
Yeah.
- [65:49]
B
So I was deep.
- [65:51]
A
Yeah. Can I ask you a question? Because you're talking about part of the. Right that is like saying things that are true, like Islam as an ideology is compatible with the Christian values of Western civilization, obviously we see a lot of violence out of Muslim majority countries. Even those who are radicalized come here down in Austin, there was that shooting and all of that. And so there's a lot of fear. On the one hand, I think that inhibits people from sharing the gospel. But then on the other hand, I see people on the so called right. I don't know if on the left too, but I saw the other day, Tucker Carlson was like, well, Muslims already love Jesus. They already love Jesus because they exalt him as a prophet. So I think there's also part of the right that's like, we don't need to share the gospel because we basically have the same values and a lot of the same beliefs. What do you think about that?
- [66:40]
B
I want to talk to Tucker Carlson about that. I think his stance is very interesting. It's not compatible with the West. I mean, under Quranic standards, we would be under Sharia law, which directly conflicts with the Constitution. And the Muslims know this. Like, no Muslim in America is going to be like, yeah, we should replace the Constitution with Sharia law. But yeah, it's not because it would rewrite the American values that we were built on, the Protestant values that we built on. So the truth is, it's not at all. But in Islamic theology, they have a mandate that we need to make as many people Muslim as possible. And then you get, you know, I was in Dearborn last month and I was doing evangelism trainings up there.
- [67:17]
A
Wow.
- [67:17]
B
Yeah. And I'm very front lines. And it's a whole different world out there. Like Islam is. You go there. And I felt like I was visiting Pakistan again. It really did. Which isn't a bad thing. I mean, I love the culture, I don't mind it, but I could see how Americans are very uncomfortable with it. I'm just, I'm just like, you know, what with everybody, I've been in this church echo chamber for so long, I'm like, so what? Like, we know it's not compatible. We know Sharia law has very dangerous components to it. It has a lot of beautiful components to it. Like no interest. That's a great one. Like, my, my dad doesn't take any interest on any of the loans he gives out because it's like, yeah, Sharia law, sure. So people do benefit from it. But I'm like, so what? Like there, what's the solution? We, let's get radical for a second. Like, we can't deport all of them. We can't put them all in One area and have a genocide that's not very biblical. We can't do. We can't become Amish. And like, we, you know, the Christians, we're gonna have our side of the world and then let the Muslims come in like crazy. And you guys have, like, California. Sure. Right. Like, these are like, we can give them a part of the nation to have them rewrite the Constitution because maybe there was one Muslim in 1776 in the US and now it's a different time, so we gotta make up for that. None of these, like, none of these are my conviction. I'll make that very clear. But these are all things that I've spoken on influencer and politician plant, like panels. And I'm like, why is this our solution? Like, does. Does nobody see the main solution? We just make them Christian. Like, I was a liberal Muslim. I was a very liberal Muslim. I voted blue all the time. I loved it. Well, the one time I could vote.
- [68:42]
A
Even though Muslims have conservative values.
- [68:45]
B
Yes.
- [68:45]
A
Still end up voting Democrat. Yeah.
- [68:47]
B
Yes. Because we were very anti evangelical Christian. Very anti. That's like, that's like, for us in Islam, that's like the spawn of Satan is what. What, what's happening with that?
- [68:57]
A
And would you say there's an aspect of being anti Israel and perceiving Republicans as being pro Israel? Totally part of it.
- [69:02]
B
Yeah, totally. I was at. I was at a lecture this Friday at. At Epic Mosque with Yasser Qadhi. He was speaking to the entire congregation. And I was just sitting there, which is, like, amazing because, like, I'm like this big ex Muslim guy, but I'm still walking right up to him. And he, he probably said Christian Zionism like, six times during it. And he's equipping the Muslims to not only deconstruct it, but to come against it with a radical faith. And we don't see it in the west because Western Muslims are beautiful people. They're very Americanized. I'm one of them. But they're still funding Islam. They still send thousands of dollars to mosques, to overseas initiatives where somebody in Nigeria or Ethiopia or Afghanistan or Pakistan, they're all getting discipled by the same people. And so, like, we have American civilization to rely on with our laws that are very powerful, that Muslims submit to. Don't get it wrong. But the message here is going overseas to where we don't have control, and that's where this radical, like, impact is. We're seeing it. We're seeing it with the pro Palestine movement. We're seeing it with Hamas Support. And in Islam, it's like, yeah, of course we support Hamas. Like, that's our ummah. That's our Muslim brothers and sisters.
- [70:06]
A
Yeah.
- [70:07]
B
And they're resistance. And like, I go to. I went to Epic Mosque, and like, they're all wearing, you know, the kafiya, the Palestinian one, that represents freedom and unity. And they're so passionate about it.
- [70:16]
A
Yeah.
- [70:16]
B
And like, you know, I was Muslim. I see. I see both sides. I understand it's a conflict that goes way beyond just October 7th. You know, I've seen the history of it, and I'm like, man, like, both people think they have a claim to that land, and both people are operating in theological claims. And none of them are Christian. So what? Even the solution to that is, why don't we just make them all Christian? Why don't we make the Muslims Christian? Why don't we make the rabbinical Jews Christian, the Orthodox Jews Christian? Let's make everybody Christian. And I think that has to be the only solution.
- [70:43]
A
I think there's a lot of fear, understandably, for the evangelical Christian to witness to the Muslims in their neighborhood. I have a lot of Muslims in my neighborhood, and there's just fear, especially like hearing what you just said, that the Christian Zionist, whatever that even means, whatever that evangelicals are, that are so demonized. I think that a lot of people are afraid that going into a Muslim community and sharing the gospel, that you're going to get hurt, that you're going to get threatened or killed or whatever. And people would say, yeah, the gospel is worth it. But then when it comes to your kids, when it comes to protecting your family, people have a lot of fear. Should they have that fear?
- [71:26]
B
That's a great question. Should they have that fear? I try my best to be an example that I wouldn't give advice that I haven't lived out myself. I purposely go to Dearborn and the mosques, and I go right to them. They all know my face. I get recognized immediately in all these places, and I still have fruitful conversations with them because I'm not doing what a lot of the big Christian apologists are doing. We have politicians that are shooting Qurans with snipers that are burning him as, like, pyrotechnic stunts. We have Christians that are attacking the character of Muhammad, which anything in his life, I don't even care what he did, if he did it, great. The Muslims can wrestle that after they're Christian. We have our scripture. We can stand on the word of God to debunk this. Once this is out of the way they don't care about Muhammad anymore. He's just a random Arab guy who had, like, a pretty sinful past. Sure, bless his heart, hope he repents and comes to Christ, however that works. And the truth is, is that we. I really feel like we're kind of doing it to ourselves to an extent, because we are so unequipped. And whenever I go to Muslim majority areas or mosques, they are kind of like laughing at us. They're like, they don't take the Christians seriously at all because we're screaming on stages and we're not trying to understand them based on their worldview. We're straw manning so much of them. I understand the fear. And this is where I need to humble myself too, because I'm blessed to be in the west and I can shout it on Instagram and walk publicly, but I have women in our ministry who have, who are 16, 17, 18, who have come to Christ, but they're in Egypt and they get kicked out of their house and they don't have anywhere to go. Their parents are threatening to murder them. That's happened in my ministry with young girls that we've helped save through the master key. And we're like, we have people flying in to, like, help them out, get them housing. We're trying to find them jobs. And it's humbled me so much. And the truth is, you know, it's Hebrews 2, it says the fear of death is from Satan and that Christ became one of us to break that fear of death over us. And so we need to get really radical. And I understand, like, I understand the fear of getting hurt and persecution, but if we are Christian and we really believe that Islam is a stronghold, a demonic stronghold on 2 billion people, there's going to be a very muddy and bloody consequence to a lot of things. But the thing that I cling to personally is he did it first. Christ did it first. Like, he got crucified. I pray to God I don't get crucified. Also, I pray to God this is a Muslim thing that they're teaching on. Like, the Muslims are like, hey, like, you want to convert as many people to Islam as possible and you do not want to be alive during Armageddon. It's going to be muddy and bloody. So, like, do your job here on earth. And I think that's. There's a beauty of that. I think that's where I get it from. I'm like, I don't want to be alive when Christ comes back. I heard, like, there's some pretty crazy prophecies about what's going to happen. And you know, what if people don't believe? And it puts a real fear of God on me. So yeah, I'm just like, let's just be as present as possible. I think the missionaries that are overseas are equipped to handle overseas affairs. I think if we handle Islam in America right now as a church, we unify just for like a year on this. I really think the scholars here will disciple the entire world. And we don't even have to touch the Muslims after that. I think we're blessed to have just only 7 million Muslims here in the US that I get, get a lot of hate for saying this, but I think the Lord moved him here on purpose, just like my family to hear the gospel for the very first time in their lives. My dad's been in this country for 30 something years and he only heard the gospel from me like two years ago. 28 years of nothing. Despite being in corporate America in, in the arena in New York. Wow. So I'm wondering what, you know, I'm not too big on like prophetic end time stuff right now. I think it's like we have no idea what it is, but I think there's something very prophetic about the time that we're in that we have a very scarce opportunity to reach Muslims here. Two of the biggest scholars, Omar Suleiman and Yashir Qadhi are within 10 miles of us and they have millions of followers. They're discipling hundreds of millions of Muslims every year. Why don't we just try to convert them? What if they switched? That's a nuke, right? That's where my faith is. I have giant faith for them also. I think the church needs ex Muslims because we run a really tight ship. We know how to run stuff.
- [75:39]
A
Yeah, for sure. Can you tell people how they can find the master key, how they can support you in your ministry?
- [75:46]
B
Yeah. We have a free online community. It's school S K-O-O-L.com Christ. You have to apply to get in. But it's just like a quick application. But we have hundreds of hours of training on this. But we also have this, which I'll give to you as well. This is our cheat sheet for the master key. And when we do like street evangelism, we just have this and we train our apologetics people on this and it's just story comparison. It's just like knowing your Bible and knowing how to press a corruption claim. And that's it. So all that's available for completely free, it's on our ministry. We're like a grassroots ministry. We started a year ago, so we're just kind of running. You know, you can connect with me on YouTube, but truthfully, like, I don't care about, like, the views and the content. Like, get in the ministry. Get trained on this, and, like, let's go save some Muslims. Like, there's. It's so much fun. My faith has never been stronger. Seeing Muslims come to Christ.
- [76:31]
A
Praise God. Well, thank you so much, Sharik. I really appreciate the boldness of your testimony and just how the Lord has used you. I bet it's really difficult to have grown up in one culture, one belief system, to love your parents and your siblings so much and to say, I'm gonna give it all for Christ. And I just have a lot of confidence knowing that what you're doing is going to change the hearts of your family, of your mom and your dad and your sisters and your brother. So I just pray that. And I pray that you are effective and fruitful and that the Lord would use you. So thank you so much.
- [77:01]
B
Thank you so much, Ali. It's an honor. It really is. Thank you so much. I appreciate that.