← Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey
Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey
Ep 1364 | War on Dads, Is Podcasting Preaching? & the Worst Pregnancy Comments
01:09:08
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Forget the war on Christmas. It's the war on Father's Day that we've got to pay attention to. Also, Dr. Al Mohler is here to clarify what is the function of a pastor that a woman cannot biblically fulfill. Also, did he really say he doesn't believe in female Christian podcasters? Also, at the end of this we got some lifestyle pitter patter. Here's what you should and should not ever say to a pregnant woman. This episode is brought to you by our friends at Good ranchers. Go to good ranchers.com use code ALI at checkout. That's good ranchers.com code Ally Foreign. Hey guys, welcome to Relatable Happy Wednesday. Hope everyone has is having a wonderful week and has had a wonderful week so far. We got a lot to talk about today. I first want to cover this war on Father's Day that is going on. And look, I haven't talked about the war on Christmas and some of the paranoid things that Christians are accused of caring about, but truly, blatantly, grossly, there really is a battle against celebrating good fathers and good mothers too. Like what does this say not only about our culture's perspective on the family, which we already know is completely degraded, but also just our view on the Imago day, our view on the authority of all things, the creator of all things. It really is that deep, y'. All. It really is that deep. So we'll get into that. As you can see, I'm in a remote setup. I will be for the next couple episodes. Um, next week will be a little bit different. We'll have a Monday, Wednesday episode. Then for the 4th of July we will not be having an episode next Friday. And then the next week we're taking off for recording. So it's a vacation week for the Relatable team and we might be putting out some interviews that you haven't heard before that we have stocked up or we might be doing some replays. But just FYI, what's coming down the pipeline in the next couple weeks? Also, if you haven't gotten your share the Arrows tickets women we are expecting probably, if the Lord wills, to sell out. But looking at the numbers now, we are so far ahead of where we were this time last year by orders of magnitude. And so we have a 7,000 person limit. And if you have not gotten your tickets yet, I really do encourage you, go ahead and get them. Bring your small group, bring your mother in law, bring your mom, bring your sisters, bring your friends. Whether you're a Christian or you're a skeptic. If you've never been to a Christian women's conference or if that is like your thing, this is going to be different for you. You're going to love it. You're going to feel refreshed, you're going to leave with lifelong friends. It's going to be hard hitting, gospel centered and so edifying. If you go to share the arrows.com you can get your tickets today. That's on October 10th in Dallas, Texas. Shane and Shane leading worship. We've got Alisa Childers, we've got Rosaria Butterfield, we've got Kosti Hen, a whole group of incredible speakers that I cannot wait for you to hear from. It's brought to you by our friends at We Heart Nutrition this year. So, so go to Share the arrows. Com get your tickets today. All right, let's look at what the New York Times decided to publish this weekend. Of all weekends, of all things. Now, as I read you this headline, you might be thinking, really? In the year of our Lord 2026, this is what the New York Times is talking about. I thought we were over this madness. I thought we realized and successfully stigmatized roping kids into being sources of affirmation for gender delusion. But apparently there's the expiration date on that has not come to pass, at least for the New York Times. So just let me read you what their most circulated story was from this weekend apparently was supposed to celebrate Father's Day to my daughter. The headline says my gender was never complicated. Now if you didn't pick up on this, this is a woman who, who has, quote unquote, transitioned into being a man. And I say quote unquote because it's not actually possible. You can't change your DNA. That was already determined at conception. But you can tragically take off your breasts, you can inject yourself with synthetic hormones which are not good for your body at all, and you can present yourself as a man and you can convince your children that the mother that they have is actually a father. And because children are hardwired to please our parents and to make sense of the world that they are in because they're so vulnerable and they have to orient themselves to make themselves feel safe and secure, that child will probably affirm, affirm whatever the parent wants. And so that is what this article is about. And it's filled with these like comic weird animations. Like you've seen this. This is like the progressive calling card. I don't know why they use this kind of animation, but you can see we've got what is supposed to look like a father and a daughter. It's the kind of cartoon, if you're just listening to this, that all of the limbs are really fat and the heads are really tiny and everyone kind of looks gender neutral. It's aesthetically, objectively, very ugly art, which progressivism ends up devolving into ugliness. Anyway, that's just what happens when you deny truth. So you can see here, here's one of the comic strip things, I guess, if you can call it that. So the top says they kids can move between complex topics. And then the text bubble, or the word bubble says, how long did you have breasts for, dad? What a tragic, tragic line for a child to utter. The daughter is later shown at school with friends where a friend says, you can't grow a beard. You're a girl. And. And the daughter responds, my dad did, and he was a girl. And these children are like hanging from monkey bars. And this is supposed to prove that this is super simple. Or maybe it proves that it is so delusional that a child who still believes that there is a fat man that can circle the universe in one night, fit down their chimney, and put presents under the tree like that, they believe it because they believe all kinds of fantastical things. It doesn't actually speak to some kind of transcendental it truth just because a child believes it. So this entire article is about a woman trying to convince her daughter that she is really a man and that she is really a dad, which is really the opposite of what fatherhood is, because fatherhood requires sacrifice. It's about putting your needs and your wants in subjection to what your child actually needs. And so you are sacrificing certainly your illusions, your most carnal desires in order to serve your children well. And this woman can't do that because she will never be a dad. And this is what the New York Times chooses to highlight on Father's Day. Someone who is not a father and who can never be a father. And hoisting this person up is actually the pinnacle of fatherhood. It's just meant to be subversive. It's meant to be as far from actual healthy fatherhood and masculinity as possible. And that's really the point. It's really a humiliation ritual for men. It's really a belittling, condescending practice that is trying to say, look like men aren't really that important. Fathers are completely replaceable. Nothing that is innate within you is something that a child needs or that this world needs. You can dawn it like a costume and you can, you know, force it into your children and say that it's some kind of spiritual affirmation of who you're supposed to be. It really is just like saying two plus two equals five. It's satanic. Goes all the way back to the beginning. All right, we have more examples of this. Let me pause tell you about our first sponsor for the day and it is WE Hard Nutrition, the very same lovely company that is sponsoring share the arrows this year. I took my prenatals last night as I always do with my iron supplements and with my magnesium and with all of the, let's see, probiotics. I take all of the We Heart Nutrition supplements that you can possibly take. I think I've tried them all. The wholesome balance when I'm not pregnant, I've taken their immunity tablets. They're all so effective because every ingredient comes in the most bioavailable form. A lot of these, even expensive supplement companies, they have the synthetic compound of these things that your body needs, but you're not actually absorbing it. So you're spending all of this money and you're not doing anything to help your body. That's not true. With We Heart Nutrition, everything is in its most natural form, so your body actually uses it. You'll be able to tell in your blood work too. Plus, this is a Christian family owned pro life company. We've had dinner with Kristen and Jacob. They're the real deal. They are awesome. They donate a percentage of their proceeds or their profits to pregnancy centers every year. It's really incredible what they do. Go to we heart nutrition.com use code ALLY. You will get 20% off your order when you do we heart nutrition.com code ALLY. The New York Times also has a podcast and in their daily podcast, they did a Father's Day episode and it was called Can a Bad man be a Good Father? In the interview, Jenot describes discovering his father's collection of extreme porn and his father's romantic and sexual relationships with women he met while selling handbags, all while married. Here's that. Saw two.
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The thing about my dad was he presented himself in a very forthrightly sexual way. And it wasn't like that was simply for show. My father had an affair with my first friend's mother when I was three years old. And I knew it. You knew it? I knew it. Somehow, somehow I knew that something was wrong, something was off, something that made my mom unhappy.
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Okay, so in this not Highlighting a good father. I mean, from what I could tell, this is the. This is the only episode they had honoring fatherhood. It's an interesting question. Can a bad man be a good dad? Like, I think of Tony Soprano, there are certainly moments when he was, I guess, a loving father to his. To his kids. But again, we're seeing something subversive. We're seeing something scandalous. We are presenting something, or we're being presented by the New York Times. New York Times with this thing that you think is really bad or really awful or stigmatized. It can actually be okay. It can actually be healthy. Could actually probably be good. There's another op Ed dads get postpartum depression, too. Look, there's a lot of things that men can get. There's a lot of issues that should be highlighted for the sake of men. Can, like, you just let us have this one. Can women have the postpartum depression? Can we just hold on to that one? There's another one. The pain of caring for a parent who abused you. So again, highlighting abusive parents. That's not to say it's not important to talk about that or to talk about people's experiences and having these very complicated and bad parents. It's fine to have those conversations. But I would like to see among that some positive stories of what a great impact the dad your dad had on you, how present he was, how much he loved you, how much he cheered you on, and how that shaped you for the rest of your life. But we don't see any unapologetically positive stories about dad from the New York Times. Here's another one that I just find terrible. These are all in 2026. Okay, so these are all leading up to Father's Day. This is the. The road to Father's Day was paved with all of these stories about bad debts. My father's death, this is a New York Times article, was the start of my life. It was written by a woman who gives an account of her relationship with her emotionally absent father and credits his death with understanding her own mortality. All right, so again, just subversive. It's kind of like that book by Jeanette McCurdy, which actually was a really interesting and compelling book, but the title was I'm Glad my Mom Died. Okay, that's on her own personal story. I'm not saying that's a bad title, is an interesting title and a very, like, interesting story of her life. But again, the New York Times is only going to highlight things like this of, oh, your dad's Death was a good thing because he was bad. There was also this piece and the Toronto Star, a Modest Proposal. Why it's time to abolish Father's Day. It claims that the holiday puts an undue burden on kids to scramble to buy useless gifts. Now, this is a little bit of bait and switch. It's a little bit of clickbait because the author claims, like, the real gift is quality time. Okay, so if your problem is materialism, that's one thing, or you just think it's an, you know, a made up reason to buy Hallmark cards, that's fine. But the title we need to Abolish Father's Day or We need to Abolish Mother's Day. Another thing that I've heard in the past done due to some undue burden that's just perpetuating this idea that celebrating fathers in positive fatherhood is not something that we need to do. It's just excessive and even oppressive in some ways. And then, if you'll remember Mother's Day, we've had this conversation for the past two years. Why does it seem like Mother's Day is a day that requires so much coddling from companies? It's not that trauma around your experience with your mom is not legitimate, or if you lost your mom, that you shouldn't be sad about it, or that it's not a sensitive day. It just seems like these companies go out of their way to say, you know what, anyone can be a mom, no matter what kind of mothering you take on. It's all the same validity, it's all the same importance. And then also, you can opt out of seeing any kind of celebration of motherhood whatsoever, not trying to be insensitive to the real pain that you can carry when it comes to bad experiences with your mom or dad. But also, like, at some point we just need to say, take my feelings out of it, my experiences out of it. That's my responsibility. I'll do what I have to do to protect myself that day or work through those feelings or heal. But the more important thing is that in general, mothers and fathers need to be celebrated. At the very least, these roles need to be celebrated. There's this article in Popsugar. No, Mother's Day isn't just about mothers. And here's why. Instead of having the day revolve around only mothers, we should celebrate the many fantastic roles all women out there have. So minimizing the importance of motherhood and being the giver and the nurturer of life by saying it's basically the same as working at a marketing company. It's basically the same as planting flowers. Those things can be good and they can glorify God, but they're not the same as motherhood. Last year, in a New York Times op ed titled My Mother and I Bond Over Ignoring Mother's Day, the author celebrates the fact that she and her mother neglected the holiday despite big florist. All right. In May 2017, the Washington Post ran the headline for some gay parents, Mother's Day or Father's Day is Awkward. So again, centering the subversive or transgressive aspects of our society on a day that's supposed to celebrate the the institution that has existed since the beginning of Time. A Time magazine piece about Mother's Day a few years ago wanted to refocus the holiday not on women who have children, but on women being able to kill their children. Not joking. Aubrey Hirsch's article was titled Flowers and Cards are Nice. I'd Rather have Bodily Autonomy. She wrote that it's the first Mother's Day since Roe was overturned. So again, I think this was 2023. It would have been. Why is this a problem? This is having seriously serious effects on the lives of people who can become pregnant. People who can become pregnant. That's not just moms. According to Time magazine, research by the Society for Family Planning shows a sharp drop in the number of abortions in the six months after Roe v. Wade was overturned, suggesting that many people who might have otherwise terminated a pregnancy, another euphemism there, killed their child, could not legally do so. So what's most important important, according to this article in Time magazine, on a day celebrating the fact that only women can get pregnant, only women can bear life, only women can mother is that one. Anyone can be a mom, girl or boy, mom or dad or man or woman. And that the real pinnacle of purpose and motherhood is the ability to legally kill the baby inside your womb. How satanic is that? In 2020 Psychology Today, a journalist there or a writer there argued that society should abolish Mother's Day altogether. Mother's Day is an unfair holiday to push upon the world, an unjust holiday to force upon people who have lost their mothers, lost a child, hate their mothers, hate their children, want to be a mother but can't, don't want to be a mother and are societally shamed for it. Thought they wanted to be a mother and realize, whoops, that was a mistake. Okay? These days are not meant to cater to every single subsection of society. Or every single person's trauma or emotions. That's not what these days are for. We are so unable to read something or to see something and say that is true or that is good in principle, even if it doesn't apply to me. And this is not just true of the secular world. I see this every day online. Someone says something that is generally true or even puts a million caveats on what they're saying and says, you know, this is what I believe and I think that in principle this is right. You'll get a million comments from people saying why their situation is the exception to the rules that person just articulated. That is a narcissistic, me centered way of consuming information in the world. Like I like to say on social media, if it's not about you, it's not about you. If what someone is saying doesn't apply to you, then it's not about you. And actually you will conserve a lot of your energy that is much better channeled towards other people or channeled towards your own joy and fulfillment if you don't exhaust it trying to explain away why one person's celebration or one person's observation isn't applicable to your specific situation. Like, you know, we talk a lot about therapy culture and how therapy culture has kind of infected the church in some ways and infected different parts of society. But it's like people believe that everywhere is therapy, that every person is their therapist and they just are dying to be understood in the most minute way. That's actually not a great way to live. And I blame like which Disney princess are you quizzes the personality test that we were all required to take in high school and college. And not saying that there's no benefit to understanding yourself, but it comes like it comes with limitations, with parameters. Like eventually you just have to de center yourself and realize the world and Mother's Day and Father's Day and Christmas and all of these things that might make you sad, they aren't about you. And it also just speaks to our need for a savior. Our need for like a source of joy, a source of purpose that is transcendent, that is outside of ourselves. I think it's exchanging the God of scripture for the God of self. When you worship the God of self, you see everything through the lens of the God of self and it really steals your joy. Everything becomes about victimizing you and sliding you. And that is a way to live that will impede your happiness. Ironically, because these are the people who claim to always be pursuing their happiness and doing what makes Them feel good. All right, we'll get into more of that in just a second. Let me pause, tell you about our next sponsor for the day. It's Adele Natural Cosmetics. I love Adele Natural Cosmetics. I'm actually wearing their moisturizing blush. It comes in a little stick and it's. I guess I don't know how to describe. It's not. It's not powder and it's not liquid. It's somewhere in between that and it goes on really easily, really smoothly. All of their makeup dyes, I love the pink coral, but they have lots of different shades. And I love their moisturizing bronzer and foundation as well. Everything is completely holistic, totally natural. Comes in the best ingredients. This is another family owned pro life, unapologetically Christian company. They make everything by hand in Texas, which is incredible. I love their skin care too. I use their essential moisturizing cleanser every single night. I love their moisturizing spray. I mean, they're the real deal. I've been using these products for several years. They're so Good. Go to adelenaturalcosmetics.com use promo code ALI for 25% off your first purchase. That's a down. Natural cosmetics.com code ALI. So secular leftism, and I would just say leftism in general, I don't even know if it needs a modifier. But secularism, leftism typically go hand in hand. It really is just a rejection of not only the created order and a rejection of things that have worked, a rejection of things that are true and good and natural, but also a rejection of the creator of those things. And so if you wanna know, like, why would you do this? Why are you trying to be so transgressive? Why are you trying to undermine what clearly has brought stability to every society in all of time? Designations of male and female, the necessity of mom and dad, the strength of a cohesive nuclear family with mom and dad and children all living under the same roof and working together. Why would you want to undermine something that works so well? Because everything is about rejecting the creator. Everything is about worshiping the creature and worshiping the self and worshiping and following carnal desires. We've seen that in every society that has existed for all of time. When you try to defy nature, when you try to defy God's moral truth, chaos ensues. Sexual chaos, which always ends in the victimization of children, societal chaos and corruption. Go back and listen to the episode that I did with Seth Gruber, and he talks about the history of this and how societies that embrace this kind of sexual confusion and depravity, especially once it is institutionalized, commercialized, normalized, glorified, seen as good. That nation typically only has about 90 more years of survival. And the clock is ticking for us. And so go back, listen to that episode, because super insightful. The beautiful thing is for Christians, this doesn't have to be complicated. And in a world where I think a lot of people, especially children, as we saw in that first New York Times article, they're searching for clarity, they're searching for understanding. It's not that gender confusion and depravity is good and normal and right to them. They're searching for the truth. They just won't answer. So the reason that they simplify these very weird, complex things like, oh, a woman became a man and a mom became a dad, is because they're seeking truth. They're seeking what is clear. And Christians have this wonderful privilege and honor, and not only that, but this responsibility to say it actually is really easy. Not only is the science straightforward and easy, XX and XY and the anomalies that exist within that just point to the fall and the fact that nothing is perfect on this side of heaven. But it doesn't negate the rule. The exceptions don't rewrite the rule of XX and xy, but theologically it's clear. Like it was so clear and so fundamental that God put it in the very first chapter of the first book of the Bible that we are made in his image male and female. That means somehow, kind of mysteriously, since God himself is not actually in a gendered body, that to be made male and female is to be made in God's image. And to be made in God's image is to be made male and female. That's what Genesis 1:27 tells us. It's like God was like, you don't even have to read 30 verses before I tell you what's up. Y' all are going to be so confused about this. And if you end up denying Genesis 1:27 when it comes to marriage, when it comes to gender, when it comes to the existence of that institution to create and to protect children and to be the building block of society, you're gonna end up messing up everything else too. It's a trickle down effect. And this is true whether you are a secular society, whether you're a Buddhist society, or whether you're a Christian society, but specifically within Christianity, you absolutely see that once you deny Genesis 1:27, that person almost always ends up denying John 14, 6. When Jesus says, I am the way, the truth, the life, no one comes to the Father except through me. That just ends up being the theological direction that people go in. Because if you are denying the authority of the Creator when it comes to biology, then of course you're going to deny the authority of the Savior when it comes to salvation. Why would you accept one that takes a lot more faith than seeing the reality of the biological distinction between male and female? You know, in talking about this whole thing about female pastors, which we're about to talk about more in a second when we talk to Al Mohler, my brother texted me something that I hadn't thought about when I was talking about this on, on Monday. We were talking about what the Bible actually says, what this First Timothy passage, um, means when it's talking about, hey, women aren't supposed to be exercising authority over men in the local church. They're not supposed to be pastors. They're not supposed to be preaching and teaching to men, he says. My brother Paul gives Timothy at first Timothy 1, 8, 18 through 20, one of the reasons why there shouldn't be a woman in this type of role. He tells Timothy that others who have not followed the instructions that he gives in the chapters that follow have shipwrecked their faith. This issue is no small issue. It wasn't to Paul and it shouldn't be to us. And isn't that so true that when you see Christians start saying, well, you know, I just don't agree with that part of Scripture, and I actually think that it's okay for a woman to become a pastor or whatever it is, eventually they fall away in other ways, too. I'm not saying every single time. I'm not saying that's 100% a rule. But Paul is saying, hey, people who haven't followed these instructions, which have been given to me by the Holy Spirit, they have ended up walking away from the faith that they thought saved them? That's really scary. That's a really big deal. And I hadn't really connected that previous verse to the verses later about women not exercising authority over men in the church. So if denying the gender differences within the church leads to chaos, I mean, just imagine how much bigger the consequences are when it comes to society in general. When we look at how this actually manifests itself in legislation, one thing that comes to mind is this effort by New York lawmakers to remove any gendered language from state family law, replacing terms like mother and father with gestating, parent and non gestating parent. See, the funny thing is, is that these progressives who simultaneously will be like women are so much more then wombs. They're so much more than just their bodies. They're so much more than just mothers. Well, they've now reduced us to our ability to have kids or not. That's all. That means gestating and non gestating, which I actually think goes to the biological brass tacks even more than the terms women, men, mother, father. Okay, gestating parent, non gestating parent. The bill is now on Governor Kathy Hochul's desk awaiting her signature or veto. This is what happens. You know, we talk a lot about people who try to out nice God or out love God or out mercy God by disagreeing with him, saying oh, his dictates when it comes to sexuality and sin, those are just too harsh. I think I can out mercy him and out compassion him. So let me try that and kind of apologize for God. Can't do that. God is love first. John 4:8 People also try to outsmart God, like, ooh, what newfangled language can I use? What euphemisms can I use to try to deny this very blatant reaction reality and reconstruct society in our image? You know, they tried to do something like that with the Tower of Babel and God confused them. And I see a lot of the reflections of that story in our world today that we are starting to use language that people don't even understand within the same country. And not because of a different in accents or different in dialects or a difference even in our original primary languages, but because of a difference in belief system. We don't even have the same language anymore. Just interesting. As G.K. chesterton observed, the men and women who for good reasons and bad revolt against the family are for good reasons and bad simply revolting against mankind. And that is absolutely true. When you look at the stats on fatherlessness. It is absolutely undeniable that God knew what he was doing when he created this incident institution, when he made Adam our first father, when he calls himself our father. We don't have as many statistics on motherlessness because it's a cultural anomaly in the history of the world. It's pretty new. This phenomenon of children being raised motherless. And why it's happening is not because suddenly moms are denying their maternal instinct and they're no longer raising their children. Of course that happens in a way through abortion. But children being born and abandoned by their moms, it's much rarer than children being born and abandoned by their fathers. But we are re engineering society by allowing two men to buy eggs and rent wombs and create these children and steal the children away from their mother and away from their gestator and to raise them motherless. I mean, it's cruel. We talk about that all the time. We don't have the statistics on that. We probably will never have all of the statistics on on that because it's politically incorrect. So about 1 in 4 children in America don't have a father in the home. One in four. And the number of children living only with their mother has doubled in the past 50 years. Black Americans hit absolutely the hardest. I think it's about 70% of black children do not have a present father in their home. Historically, around 70% of incarcerated youths didn't live with both parents while growing up. According to an NIH study, children without fathers had poor social emotional adjustment and worse adult mental health. One study of juvenile Delinquents found that 66%, 2/3 had experienced fatherlessness. Okay, this is true about sexual promiscuity, teen pregnancy. This is true about eating disorders, anxiety, likelihood of poverty. All of those things go up when you don't have a present father in the home. Not a perfect father, but a present father. On the hopeful side, the fathers who are present are much more involved than they used to be. In a study from April, economic analyst Aziz Sundurgi outlined how modern dads spend far more time actively raising their children than previous generations. I mean, this is true. We've all seen this. We've all experienced this with our husbands. Fathers today spend more time caring for their children than fathers did 50 years ago. Millennial dads do four times more child care than boomer dads did. Now, some of that is probably because women are working outside of the home more. And that doesn't have a positive impact when all of these women are outsourcing their care to, you know, daycare centers. But we're talking about present dads. We're not just talking about outsourcing care to strangers. And dads being more present and doing more things with their kids is a good thing. Dads who spend more time caring for their children report higher levels of happiness. Today, fathers prefer to care for their kids more than watching tv. That is wonderful. That's not something that you expected to see. I do think Covid had a lot of negative impacts, especially when it came to child abuse and things like that. But for the dads who have been able to work from home and really be with their kids, and spend time with their kids for the past six plus years. They're like, yeah, this is amazing. I get a front row seat to like the best show ever. And that is seeing all of these little moments that dads in the past have historically strictly had to miss, or in some cases have chosen to miss. Psalm 103:13 says, As a father shows compassion to his children, so the Lord shows compassion to those who fear him. For what son is there whom his Father does not discipline? He disciplines us for our good, that we may share in his holiness. Hebrews 12 talking about a father disciplining his children because he loves them and God disciplining us because he loves us. Over and over again we see that a father's love is supposed to reflect God's love for us. Parents are to train up their children with godly instruction. Train up a child in the way he should go. Even when he is old, he will not depart from it. That is a principle. Obviously that is not always true, but Proverbs is filled with principles that it's better to do it this way because it's more likely to lead to this outcome. That's Proverbs 22:6. Hear, my son, your father's instruction and forsake not your mother's teaching. So both mother and father. Therefore it's not that parenting is only a mom's job, it's both of your jobs. You do different things in different ways, in necessary ways. But both the teaching of the mom and the father's instruction is necessary, for they are graceful. Garland for your head. Proverbs 1:8 through 9, My son, keep your father's commandment and forsake not your mother's teaching. That's Proverbs 6:20 and what we also read in Ephesians 5 through 6, typically what the secularists, what the subversives will point out, is only that Ephesians 5 verse that we've talked about so much, oh, wives, submit to your husbands. Oh, how oppressive, how awful. Well, that would have been very normal. At the time, women were seen as submissive. They were seen as in a submissive and a lesser role in many of these secular and pagan societies. Even in societies where they're worshiping female deities, in practice, women were not seen as full people. And so this idea of a woman submitting to her husband wouldn't have been radical. What was radical is that husbands had to love their wives as wives love the church. It wouldn't have been radical for an Ephesians 6 Paul to say, hey, children, obey Your parents? Yeah, of course they were supposed to. What would have been radical was the parameter and the rule of the chastisement given to fathers. Fathers, do not provoke your children to anger, but bring them up in the discipline and the instruction of the Lord. Don't provoke your children to anger. That is a parameter for the dad. This was a time where men really weren't given these kind of authority structures, besides the government, besides by people more powerful than them, to treat those weaker than them with dignity and with grace and with love and with gentleness. Colossians 3, 21 also echoes this. Fathers, do not provoke your children. Children less. They become discouraged. That's because the Father's word and the Father's discipline and the Father's instruction, his actions, his disposition, his mood, his facial expression has a huge effect on children. Again, not looking for perfect fathers or perfect mothers, but present ones, loving ones. That is why it is so important for moms and dads to submit themselves to the Lord. Because we can't do it on our own. On our own, we become these crazy New York Times headlines that are denigrating fatherhood and motherhood. We become very confused, we become very selfish, we become very angry. We become very overstimulated. And we excuse ourselves for all kinds of failures. As people and as parents. We need the Lord and we need his grace. And gosh, this country does too. Because we are very confused about very fundamental things. You can't outsmart God. You can't out kind him. You can't out wisdom him. You can't out science him. He created all of it. And the most loving thing that we can do as Christians, if we believe God's ways are better, if we believe he is love, is to be agents of this clarity in a world of chaos, to push back against the darkness, forced motherlessness and fatherlessness. The denigration of fathers and mothers started in our own homes. How we treat our spouses, how we talk about marriage, how we talk about children, how we talk about to our children. That is true if you're single. You got a bunch of single friends in your Bible study who don't like the idea of children or get easily annoyed or have feminist mentalities about getting married and having godly marriages. Maybe you're the voice of truth in that group or at work with your friends, with your family, whatever it is, you can be an agent of clarity in this world of chaos. And God does great things through that obedience, even if it seems small right now. All right, speaking of the truth about gender roles and how this matters within the church. I want to talk to the author of this constitutional amendment that is still up for a vote next year in the Southern Baptist Convention, Dr. Al Mohler, about what actually went down and why it matters. It'll be a short conversation, then we'll have some lifestyle pitter patter about pregnancy at the end. But before we get there, let me pause tell you about our next sponsor for the day and that is seven Weeks Coffee. I love seven Weeks Coffee. We drink it all the time in our home because I have to have my coffee every day and they're just, it's so good. I love black coffee. And so the coffee that I get has to be really great tasting and it has to be high quality and it has to be mold free, pesticide free, clean, all of that good stuff. And that's what I get from Seven Weeks Coffee. And I love that they donate 10% of every single sale to pregnancy centers across the country. They've now donated over $1.8 million to these pregnancy centers. So this is tangibly saving babies lives. Every time you drink a cup of coffee, every time you decide not to go to that coffee company that unfortunately supports things like abortion like transing kids, all of this craziness, this demonic destitution in our country, a lot of these famous coffee companies are actually supporting with your money. You don't want to be a part of that. You can allow your coffee to serve a higher purpose, to literally save lives, to share the gospel with these women, with these fathers through pregnancy centers. So go ahead, subscribe to Seven Weeks Coffee. You'll save 15% on your orders every month when you subscribe. Plus with my code Ali, you save an extra 10%. So that's a lot of savings. Go to 7weekscoffee.com code Ally. That's 7weekscoffee.com Code Ally. Doctor Mohler, thanks so much for joining us again. You know, one of the questions that I've gotten is we've talked about your truth and unity amendment, even from people who agree with us about this role of pastors being exclusive to men as outlined so clearly in scripture is what exactly the word function means in this constitutional amendment. Yes to office. But some people seem to be worried that the word function will be too all encompassing. So can you clarify like what is, what is meant by that? What would qualify as a woman occupying the function of pastor in a way that is unbiblical?
- [40:54]
B
Well, you know, when the language is, is seen in what the SPC has, has taken the first step to Adopt. It says function, specifically preaching to the gathered assembly. So this goes back, Elie Beth, and it's so good to be with you. It goes back to historic Baptist confessions, and in particular, it goes back to 1689. So, of course, you know, I want it to be the most classic Baptist language, biblical language that Baptists can muster. And that confession makes very clear that the pastoral role is both a, an office and a function. And I'll tell you why it's necessary. It's because right there in the state of Texas, you have had churches that have had women preaching on Sunday morning and not called them pastors. So if we don't say that that specific function is reserved according to scripture, to men as qualified by scripture, then we basically are leaving a barn door open. And so, in other words, the entire office of pastor, overseer, elder is reserved for men as. Not for all men, but men as qualified by Scripture. And the function, the specific function of preaching to the gathered assembly is reserved to those men. Does that make sense?
- [42:13]
A
Yes, it totally makes sense.
- [42:14]
B
And if you don't put function in, then you could have people who say, well, she's not called a pastor, she's not called an elder, she's not called an overseer, but if she's preaching to the gathering assembly, that. That's, that's what the pastor is to do.
- [42:30]
A
You know, this conversation kind of got lumped in with a. An answer that you gave on your podcast to a woman who had written in asking, what about a woman in our church who doesn't occupy the office of a pastor, but she is answering questions about the sermon on a church podcast. I remember I got some messages about this from some people saying, oh, my goodness, can you believe this podcast? I listened to it and I was like, that's it. That's what people are worried about. Your answer to that seemed very clear and very limited to the situation that this woman had asked about. But could you talk about that a little bit more, Maybe expound upon that? Why in this situation, is a woman that's a member of a church expounding upon a sermon for the church? Why would that be considered something that is outside of a woman's authority in the local body?
- [43:25]
B
Well, let me say, first of all, I really appreciate you bringing this up. And I can also say that there's, you know, you can. You can teach an old dog new tricks. I did not see the timing coming between that particular question and the right and the SBC action. There was no premeditation there. But the bottom line Is. Is that the. The woman who wrote the question? It was a woman who sent in the question. She was troubled because this was presented as an explicit extension of the preaching ministry of the church. So, in other words, it was an incredibly specific context. And so I just wanted to answer, if you set the context as the continuation of the sermon, more or less, well, then I'm just going to say, obviously I wasn't speaking to Christian women doing podcasting. Otherwise I wouldn't be so glad to be with you today and so thankful for you. That's not at all what I was talking about. It was a specific situation. And yeah, I stand by my answer. Because if you're going to say to me this is a continuation of the church's preaching ministry, that's what it's presented as. Well, you just answered your own question. I don't think that's what's taking place in most podcasts. And by the way, I don't think there's anything wrong with a woman in particular responding to a sermon, but it was clearly in what was understood to be something of an official teaching role. So, you know, usually when you have a question like that, the answer is implicit in the question.
- [44:52]
A
Right.
- [44:53]
B
So I hope I have clarified and not further confused the situation. If you're going to say that what we're doing on this podcast is continuing the preaching ministry of the church, you just answered your own question. I'm clearly not talking about women on Christian podcasts. That. That. That was not even in my imagination when that's.
- [45:13]
A
What.
- [45:14]
B
What. How the question came.
- [45:15]
A
No, it was. It was very clear in the context of the question, in the context of your answer that you were talking specifically about this woman's question. And to me, it was very clear that you didn't go beyond that in that answer. And if that was something that you believed about podcasts in general or about Christian women in general, I don't think that you would be afraid to say it. But you were very specific in your answer. But as things go, things change and more fun social media, all different kinds of things end up happening. And yeah, the timing. The timing was interesting. It got kind of lumped into the whole conversation about women preaching and pastors and about this specific constitutional amendment. Reiterate to us again why it is important that it's not just what we read in the Baptist faith and Message, which is very clear from 2000, that only women are supposed to be pastors, but that this actually becomes a constitutional amendment.
- [46:11]
B
Well, the Baptist faith and message statement is very Clear that the office of pastor is limited to men as qualified by Scripture. So, again, it's not all men. What the New Testament reveals is those particular men called to fulfill these roles, but not women. And that's in the sovereignty of God. I think the vast, and I do mean capital letters vast majority of Southern Baptists are absolutely clear on this, and their churches are clear and in right order and in right doctrine. The issue, though, is that the Southern Baptist Convention is an assembly, and you have people from thousands and thousands of churches. And honestly, in any large group, you've got to be clear about how this is applied. And so, Ali Beth, 30 plus years ago, the Southern Baptist Convention was confronted with the real challenge of the LGBTQ revolution. And so the Southern Baptist convention more than 30 years ago, just put in the Constitution a definition of a church in friendly cooperation with the SBC as one that takes no step to affirm or to legitimize or in any way make a positive statement about LGBTQ issues, behaviors, relationships, et cetera. I just want to tell you that that was not only right, it was necessary, and it has been incredibly efficient for the sbc. There has not been a debate on the floor over these issues at the Southern Baptist Convention for more than 30 years. And I think that's a tremendous achievement. That is exactly the achievement I want through this constitutional amendment so that the issue on the role of pastors and in men serving as pastors, that that is a constitutional issue so that it should free the SPC from having to deal with this on the floor every year here.
- [48:00]
A
Next sponsor is Alliance Defending Freedom, y'. All. I love adf. That's why I have them as guests on this show so often because they are doing such great work. I am always looking to partner with them in any way I can. They are serving on the front lines, not just in the US but around the world, protecting Christians rights to speak up, to live out our faith in our business, whether we're an elected official, mom trying to adopt kids from the foster care system, but we are unwilling to compromise on our faith. ADF wants to make sure that we have our rights fully protected under the Constitution. So they take these cases all the way up to the Supreme Court and every case that is fought for and won by Alliance. Stephanie. Freedom. That has a positive effect on you and me. It has an effect on my ability to do this show freely without fear of punishment. It has your ability to adopt and foster as a Christian parent who won't go along with the LGBTQ agenda. And so if you can, if you've got the resources to support them. You're not only supporting ADF and all of their clients, you're supporting you. You're supporting the next generation, the future of our country, which depends upon protecting the Constitution. That's what ADF is doing, especially for Christians, for women and girls, exercising our First Amendment rights, our rights to our own private spaces and fairness and competition. They're at a deadline for fundraising this year and they need all the support they can get. What a great cause. Go to joinadf.com ally every dollar you give will be doubled thanks to a special matching Grant. That's joinadf.com ally foreign. Thing that has surprised me and some of the pushback that I've seen is that it doesn't just come from progressives, those who deny the reality of gender altogether. I've seen some people that are politically conservative, even in some ways theologically conservative, really push back against this, push back against, against the entire idea that women can't be pastors. And they'll appeal to some form of scripture and they'll say that these commands against women preaching in the church that they had to do with something extremely culturally specific at the time, that it's not a general principle or a general regulation for the local body. And these are people, like I said, who are conservative in many ways, but when to it comes it comes to this, have a very progressive interpretation of scripture. You know, don't end up following the rest of the verse, which actually goes all the way back to creation, for the reasoning why women should be exercising authority over men in the church. I'm sure you've seen lots and lots of arguments like this for decades. They're not really new. But what is your response for pastors even who say, you know what, that's just because women were yelling at the time, it was specific. Disorderly context in that culture has nothing to do with today.
- [51:04]
B
Ellie Beth, I so appreciate the question and the two dimensions of it you ask. And so let me go first to the explicit biblical text. And here's where we have both a positive and a negative. So we have in scripture very clear setting out of the office of pastor. So think of, of 1 Timothy, 3 Titus, chapters 1 and 2, and look at this and you'll see that there's the positive statement, the objectively, just absolutely crystal clear statement of the men who are qualified for these posts and with extended biblical texts. But you also have very clear text and you make reference to it. For instance, the apostle Paul, he doesn't just ground this in a local church problem, as you rightly said. And this is so key. He grounds it in creation order. Order. So, in other words, he makes the point. This is not an episodic, particular, eccentric, local church issue. This is a creation order issue, which is to be reflected in the order of the church. There's a second dimension. This I want to mention, and I've been at this for a very long time, and I will just tell you, and I will stake my reputation on this, the way of interpreting the Scripture that is necessary in order to get around those very clear texts, limiting the teaching office to men. There are all kinds of, I would say, liberal mechanisms to try to get out of that problem. They're the same mechanisms that authorize LGBTQ issues in direct violation of Scripture. And so I'll just tell you, you look historically at the denominations that have moved to affirm the ordination of women overwhelmingly. They're the dominations that one generation later approves the LGBTQ agenda and the rainbow flags out front. And it is because the pattern of biblical interpretation, of getting around the text in order to meet a cultural end, that is a parallel process. And I know it infuriates some people for me to say that, but I'm sorry, we've got decades of experience to know that that's exactly what has happened. And, you know, I think there are some people who just don't like saying no. And so I'm just being blunt here. They just don't like saying no. But, you know, I think we need to recognize the scripture often just says no. You know, even in the Ten Commandments, you shall and you shall not. Obedience includes the shall nots as well as the thou shalls.
- [53:35]
A
Yeah, gosh, that's absolutely true. And it all comes down also to how we read Scripture. Do you read Scripture thinking, what can I get away with? How can I finagle this in a way that is going to allow me to ultimately do what I want to do? You could do that for a very long time and find all kinds of seeming permission slips. If your goal in life is just to follow what you want to follow, if that's the case, then Christianity isn't for you. It's not for any of us who want to do that. But if we read Scripture, which it's a process, sanctification is a process of reading scripture like this as much as we possibly can. But asking the question, how can I glorify God the most? How can I do the holiest thing? Not just what is God telling me not to do. But what is God telling me to do then? That actually, you know, some people see that as restrictive. It's actually the most freeing thing that you can do. And I think it's the best and the safest way to regard Scripture. Otherwise, we play a game of trying to figure out how we can sin but make excuses for it.
- [54:35]
B
No, Ali Beth, I think that's exactly right. And I appreciate the very gracious but clear way you set that out. Let me also just say this past Lord's Day was at our church, 3rd Avenue Baptist Church in Louisville, Kentucky, sitting with my wife in worship and with this wonderful congregation. And we're looking around, and what we see is a recapitulation of creation order. It is ordered by Scripture, ordered by gospel. The building is full and, by the way, of over overwhelmingly young adults and of husbands and wives and mothers and fathers. And they're just all gathered together. And I just want to say holding fast to biblical authority and to the biblical pattern actually produces enormous health. Why in the world would evangelicals want to follow the way of mainline liberal Protestantism, which has been nothing more than the dust of death and disaster? I just want to say. And so unless we say no to that. That future, then we're not saying no to it. I mean, that's the problem. I think what you're pointing to is there's some people who don't want to take responsibility for saying yes, but they will not take the responsibility to say no. And I think the vast majority of Southern Baptists need to understand right now we need to say yes to all that scripture affirms and no to all that scripture restricts and then go on with Christ's business.
- [55:57]
A
Amen. Amen. Dr. Mueller, thank you so much. Thank you just for your clarity and for your courage, for being an example in clear, articulate, and brave communication for so long. I'm just so thankful for you and your leadership and continue to pray for you. And I'm just very, very grateful for the impact that the Lord has through you.
- [56:17]
B
Ali Beth, so, so kindly said. And I'm so thankful for you and God bless you and your family.
- [56:24]
A
Thank you. You too. All right, y'. All. Last sponsor is Good Ranchers. They've got a great deal going on right now for America's 250th birthday. They are celebrating all 50 states. Yes, even the blue states, because we know that there are many, many of you who love God and love America in those blue states. You're holding on for dear life. Trying to change your state. And for that you need to be celebrated. That is why in celebration of all 50 states, they are giving $50 off to any product on their site. When you use my code Ally, if you haven't tried good ranchers, this is the time to try. It's so good. It's what we rely on exclusively in the Stucky home. We love all of their steak, their different cuts of steak. We love their ground beef that we eat multiple times a week. Better than organic chicken. It is so versatile, so good. Go to goodranchers.com use code ALI for $50 off. That's good. Ranchers.com code ALI. All right, y', all, let's do some lifestyle pitter patter. You might have seen my video that I posted on Instagram. I was at the gym and looking and feeling very pregnant. Now I'm only a little over halfway, but this is my fourth pregnancy. And you know that the more pregnancies you have, the more you pop sooner. The sooner you pop, I should say. And you just, your, your belly just looked bigger than it did when you had your first pregnancy. And so you're like, I'm sitting there thinking, do all of these people think that I look 30 weeks pregnant? Oh my gosh, I look so much bigger than I should. I haven't worked out as much as I should. I'm like beating myself up for that, not eating as healthy as I should. And oh, I said this was going to be different. All of these things swirling around in my head, okay? Feeling very self conscious, insecure in my own issues. Now, some of it is valid because when you are pregnant, there is a segment of the population that abandons all filters, okay? And you know how toddlers, when you pass by a person like in a wheelchair or a person with disability, say a person doesn't have an arm or doesn't have a leg and they'll just stare at that person and you're like, oh my gosh, my child is make is just like gawking at this person. I'm trying not to make a scene, but how do I say, yeah? It's the same way when you're pregnant for a certain segment of the population, it is stunning to them. It's like they never seen the species before. And they will say things to you. They'll just make comments and sometimes it's well intentioned, other times just like. Did that really just come out of your mouth? Most of you pregnant women, if you've been pregnant before, have probably experienced something like that. And so at this point, I start to, like, anticipate things that people could be saying. And as I'm about to leave the gym yesterday, this sweet lady doing a wall sit stops me and she looks at my belly and she looks me in the eye and goes, you look so pretty. Pretty, pretty. That is literally the last thing I was thinking about myself. The last thought I had about myself in my head was that I looked pretty in that moment. Of all the adjectives to describe me in the gym, no makeup on, with my hat on, feeling about 35 weeks pregnant, even though I am not even close to that. And. And this lady tells me I look pretty. And so that is my. That's my encouragement to myself, but also to all of you out there. Not all of you. Only women. This is only for women. If you are a man, please don't take this advice unless you are talking to your wife. But if you are a woman and you see a pregnant woman out there, especially a woman who is in the third trimester past where I am, but she's waddling through the grocery store, she's huff puffing in the gym, I want you to stop her and I want you to tell her, you look so pretty. The oxytocin will probably fill her body in that moment and she will just go into labor because she will be so happy to hear the last thing she was thinking about herself. And there are some things that I just want to help you out, maybe some of you older related bros out there who might feel tempted sometimes to say things to pregnant women. I just want to. And it's not just. It's not just men at all. I have been told crazy things by people. Some like public figures backstage at speaking events who have said things. I'm like, I won't. I won't embarrass those people, but people say crazy things. So let me just give you some examples of things that you should not say and then things that you absolutely should say to pregnant women. Okay? And this is not. Oh, pregnant women are so sensitive. And you need to be, you know, extra just, like, gentle with them. But you probably should. And we are, like, a little bit sensitive, and that's okay. But also, this is just basic manners. Okay? So here are some things to never, never say, never say, never ask if there's more than one in there. Don't do that. Don't say, are you sure there's just one? Have you asked the doctor? And you know what, Janet, you can come with me to my next sonogram appointment if you're curious about that. People used to say that with my first. I always get large and in charge when I'm pregnant. Okay? So y' all can just anticipate that if this is your first time being around pregnant Ally, you there's gotta. Or you've gotta be almost there. That's another one. Because you might say that and she's like 28, 28 weeks pregnant, okay? She's not almost there. Don't even say it. Don't say it. You really grown since I saw you last. No. That's something that you could say to your five year old nephew. It's not something that you say to a pregnant woman. Okay? And you, this next one I wouldn't say unless you're close to this person, okay. And you talk to them regularly. Don't say this to the stranger at the grocery store. You hanging in there because she might be like, wow. I took a shower and brushed my hair this morning. I put on a little makeup. I thought I was looking great. And this person just told me I look exhausted. Another one, don't tell someone they look exhausted. That's just general. But don't tell a pregnant woman. You must be exhausted. You must be so tired. I personally just would not express, unless you know them, intense sympathy for that person, okay. Because that just makes them feel bad about themselves and more tired than they already are. Don't tell them they look tired. You know, before I announced, I was giving. Getting very obvious that I was pregnant, okay? Because I was like 20 weeks when I announced. And I posted a video from a speaking engagement and which was very obvious that I was pregnant. And I wasn't worried about people knowing I was pregnant. I knew that we were about to announce in a couple days and that was fine. But the things people said to me, I'm talking people who are fans of relatable message me. You should fire your stylist if you're not pregnant. You're either pregnant or that dress should never be worn again. You should throw that dress away. Basically saying, if you're not pregnant, you look really fat in that dress. Now tell me, sweet ladies, why you would ever utter that to a human being. If you cannot picture yourself coming up to me in person and saying that you shouldn't say it, you shouldn't say it. I want you to think about, okay? If I saw Ally in public, would I say this to her face and would she have a positive reaction or not just me to anyone. If you would not go up to someone and say that in Church. Hey, if you're not pregnant, you should fire your stylist. Then don't say it online.
- [64:04]
B
Come on.
- [64:05]
A
This is, like, basic social interaction, okay? So just don't say things like that. Don't ask someone unless you really, really know. It is, like, abundantly obvious. And you know the person if they're pregnant. Phil Robertson used to tell this really funny story about how he asked a woman at some, like, family engagement when she's due or if she was expecting, and she was not expecting. So now I think the first time I met him, I was literally, like, eight or nine months pregnant. He didn't say a word. He did not say a word about it because he was like, I learned my lesson. You just never know. I was feeling good about myself. At one point, postpartum, I went to an exercise class, and I. I was not at all overweight in any way. This was after. This was after my third. But I do have some diastasis recti. And so, you know, the stomach kind of curves out a little bit because of that. And the instructor afterwards, like, I was feeling good. I was feeling pretty strong. I was feeling like, yeah, I'm back working out. The instructor afterwards, afterwards was like, oh, my goodness, congratulations. How far along are you? And, I mean, the color drained from her face when I was, like, not pregnant, not pregnant. She tried to save it, but you really can't save it after that, can you? You really can't. So I would just not do that. Now I feel pretty comfortable as a woman and as a mom myself, if a mom, like, if I'm in an interaction with her and I don't know her and she is very, very pregnant, and I can tell it is pregnancy to say like, oh, my goodness, what are you doing? That's so exciting. But I. You really have to, like, test it out. It has to be the proper circumstance. It's always an option to say nothing. There's nothing wrong with saying nothing. I just want to say that. But if you were going to say something, this is what I would. These are the options that I would say. I wrote some things down. You look so pretty. That woman, she will have a place in my heart forever. My husband tells me I look beautiful every single day, multiple times a day, which obviously means a lot to me. But everyone knows that a compliment from a stranger at the gym, you're like, whoa, that. That's really going to speak to me forever. It's going to carry me through the rest of this pregnancy. Another thing you could say to someone, especially if she's got a lot of kids running around with her, and she's pregnant. You are so blessed. I am thrilled for you. You are glowing. How wonderful. Your baby is so blessed to have you as a mom. You look so peaceful. All of this is better than saying, we're almost there. You got this. Or you have your hands full. That's not always wrong to say, but sometimes it's interpreted as like, why did you have this many kids? All of these positive things are better than gawking at them. You can say, what incredible blessings. You're an awesome mom. If you clearly see, like, I've done this in an airport before, if I'm traveling by myself. If you see that a mom is really struggling. She's got her. She's got all of her luggage. She's trying to open doors. Just open the door for her. Grab something for her. It's like, you're doing a great job. You're doing a great job. Not, oh, my goodness, are you okay? Because then they're like, oh, my gosh, do I look stressed? I look exhausted. She's, like, doing a great job. And open the door for her. Okay? It's always an option to do or say nothing. But if you feel the urge to say something to a mom or to a pregnant woman, these are some good things to say. I don't know why our filters go away when we see pregnant women. Even me, sometimes I'll see a pregnant woman, and I just feel the urge to be like, how far along are you? Oh, my goodness, you look tired. I don't know why. I don't know why we shouldn't. We shouldn't just only say positive things. Okay? Thank you to the woman who told me that I look pretty in the gym. That was so sweet. All right, that's my advice for you today. Go tell a pregnant woman that she's pretty. I'll see you on Friday.