Raising the Bar featuring Stacey Abrams

Summary

Episode Summary: "Raising the Bar" Featuring Stacey Abrams

Podcast Information:

• Title: ReLiving Single
• Hosts: Erika Alexander and Kim Coles
• Episode: Raising the Bar featuring Stacey Abrams
• Release Date: June 25, 2025

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1. Introduction

In the "Raising the Bar" episode of ReLiving Single, hosts Erika Alexander and Kim Coles dive deep into Season 1, Episode 7 of the iconic sitcom "Living Single." This episode not only revisits memorable moments from the show but also features a special guest appearance by Stacey Abrams, a prominent lawyer, author, and political figure. The discussion intricately weaves together character analyses, thematic explorations, and insights from Abrams, offering both longtime fans and newcomers a comprehensive look into the legacy of "Living Single."

2. Episode Breakdown

a. Plot Overview

The hosts begin by setting the stage for Episode 7, titled "Full Court Press." The episode centers around Khadijah, who finds herself in a car accident with an older woman, resulting in a $1,500 debt. Unsure of how to navigate the aftermath, Khadijah turns to her best friend, Maxine Shaw, portrayed by Erika Alexander, for legal assistance.

• Erika Alexander [00:00]: Introduces the concept of Maxine Shaw as one of television's premier lawyer characters, comparing her to other notable TV lawyers like Claire Huxtable and Olivia Pope.

• Kim Coles [05:07]: Highlights Max's unwavering confidence, stating, “As a matter of fact, I've not lost a case. And he said, neither have I.”

b. Character Analysis

The discussion delves into Maxine Shaw's character traits, emphasizing her competitiveness and dedication to her clients.

• Kim Coles [07:14]: “Black people have, you know, a tenuous relationship with the law because the law hasn't always worked for us. But Maxine Shaw is there, right?”

• Erika Alexander [10:00]: "She's doing the work and not getting paid for it."

The hosts explore the tension between Max's professional prowess and her personal relationships, particularly her friendship with Khadijah, who struggles to accept Max's help due to pride.

3. Themes and Discussions

a. Legal Representation and Friendship

A significant portion of the episode examines the complexities of legal aid intertwined with personal friendships. Maxine's competitive nature leads her to take the case to court, despite Khadijah's preference to settle out of court, highlighting the ethical dilemmas lawyers often face.

• Kim Coles [10:16]: “And so can competitive be seen as aggressive? Like, there's that angry black woman thing again.”

• Erika Alexander [11:15]: "You could always lift someone else up. You can always offer a kind word or a smile or just a moment of sympathetic silence."

b. Representation of Black Women in Media

The hosts reflect on Maxine Shaw's portrayal as a strong, intelligent Black woman, discussing the impact of such characters on societal perceptions.

• Stacey Abrams [29:02]: “The ability of that character to show Black women in particular, the full scope of our intellect, our power, and our capacity for joy was a transformative thing for me.”

4. Guest Interview: Stacey Abrams

Stacey Abrams joins the conversation, drawing parallels between her real-life advocacy and Maxine Shaw's fictional representation.

a. Inspiration from Maxine Shaw

Abrams shares how Maxine Shaw inspired her own career in law and politics.

• Stacey Abrams [28:39]: “I'm a tax attorney who was writing romance novels...”

b. DEI in Storytelling

The discussion shifts to Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion (DEI) in media and storytelling, emphasizing the responsibility of creators to represent diverse narratives authentically.

• Stacey Abrams [40:34]: “And that's part of the beauty of DEI. DEI doesn't diminish someone else. It doesn't... It says that diversity works, that equity is possible, and that inclusion means everyone can come along and everyone should have a place.”

c. Resilience and Purpose

Abrams provides insights into building resilience and living purposefully, drawing from her experiences as a writer and activist.

• Stacey Abrams [32:28]: “...you can always do something for someone else. You can always lift someone else up.”

• Erika Alexander [46:37]: “I want every one of those phrases on a quote card...”

5. Conclusion

The episode culminates with a heartfelt exchange between the hosts and Stacey Abrams, celebrating the enduring legacy of "Living Single" and its influence on future generations. Abrams expresses her admiration for the show and the characters, particularly Maxine Shaw, who embodies the principles of DEI and resilience.

• Kim Coles [56:31]: “We can't say enough. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, Stacey.”

• Stacey Abrams [47:28]: “...it is a delight and an honor to meet you, and thank you both for just adding joy to the world every time.”

The hosts encourage listeners to support Abrams's upcoming book, "Code of Justice," and hint at future collaborations, leaving the audience inspired by the intersection of entertainment, law, and social advocacy.

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Notable Quotes:

• Erika Alexander [00:00]: "Maxine Shaw is considered one of the best lawyer characters on TV."
• Kim Coles [05:07]: “I've not lost a case. And he said, neither have I.”
• Stacey Abrams [29:02]: “The ability of that character to show Black women... was a transformative thing for me.”
• Stacey Abrams [40:34]: “DEI doesn't diminish someone else. It says that diversity works, that equity is possible, and that inclusion means everyone can come along and everyone should have a place.”
• Stacey Abrams [32:28]: “You can always do something for someone else. You can always lift someone else up.”
• Kim Coles [56:31]: “We can't say enough. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, Stacey.”

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This episode of ReLiving Single not only celebrates the timeless appeal of "Living Single" but also bridges the gap between fiction and reality, showcasing how television can inspire and shape real-world advocacy and leadership. Through engaging dialogue and insightful discussions, Erika Alexander, Kim Coles, and Stacey Abrams illuminate the enduring impact of strong, multifaceted Black female characters in media.

Transcript

[Erica Alexander]

Okay, so we know that Maxine Shaw is considered one of the best lawyer characters on tv, but there have been others. Let's start with Claire Huxtable. She was stylish. She was sharp. She made the law look luxurious. And you worked with her.

[Kim Coles]

Yes. She's slick. She's like a caramel pamphlet.

[Erica Alexander]

She is.

[Kim Coles]

She is.

[Erica Alexander]

And let's not forget Olivia Pope. She's chaotic but iconic.

[Kim Coles]

Come on. Go. Kerry Washington. Well, she was petite but mighty. Now, see, listen, I've got to say, I'm more of an Annalise Keating kind of girl. You know, dark, dramatic.

[Erica Alexander]

Viola Davis. Listen, woman king. Before there was a woman king.

[Kim Coles]

Come on. She has a walk. Okay? She ambles hard.

[Erica Alexander]

She does.

[Kim Coles]

She does.

[Erica Alexander]

But none of them had the swag of the suits. The comebacks of Maxine Shaw, attorney at law.

[Kim Coles]

Hello. Come on, now.

[Erica Alexander]

Full court press, baby. That's episode seven, when the gavel met the maverick.

[Kim Coles]

Hey, welcome back to Reliving Single, the official unofficial Living Single Rewatch podcast.

[Erica Alexander]

Okay, this is when we finally get to meet the big dog in her own element. The master and the blaster.

[Kim Coles]

Come on. Maxine Shaw, attorney at law.

[Erica Alexander]

Did you ever think that she would become such a big presence? I mean, people just revere her. They love her. They love Max.

[Kim Coles]

Well, no. I mean, Wait, listen. It was fun to play her. It felt very powerful. I mean, she had the wardrobe. It was super, super sexy. Thank you, Ceci. And the heels that towered over everyone and lifted my buttocks so wonderfully.

[Erica Alexander]

I love when you put on your swagger. And the walk was amazing. And you always say that your mother sent you to modeling school to help you out with your walk, right?

[Kim Coles]

Yeah. Yeah. You know, we always talking about Viola Davis walk, but I got a walk. That was problematic for my mother, at least. I mean, when I was in 8th grade, I got an award for PE and when I got up to accept it, she said it looked like I had gotten off of a horse.

[Erica Alexander]

Oh, wow.

[Kim Coles]

Yeah. And when I showed her the pin, the first thing she said was Erica. I was so embarrassed. My mom is, like, old school. She's like the great Sammy Jean.

[Erica Alexander]

Yeah.

[Kim Coles]

Doesn't want her daughter looking like she's a cowboy. Okay. So she sent me to Black Glamour Modeling School.

[Erica Alexander]

What's the number one thing you learned at Black Glamour Modeling School?

[Kim Coles]

Well, how to be glamorous and black. Number one, but no. Who got best walk in the class?

[Stacey Abrams]

Ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding.

[Kim Coles]

Me. Come on. You throw me in the deep end, I may go down, but I'mma fight my way back up and then I'm going to be a good swimmer. I love it. Then I'm going to be a great swimmer. Then I'm going to win.

[Erica Alexander]

I love it.

[Kim Coles]

And I did that in that modeling class. And you know, I got to say just the song that I would rock walk to.

[Erica Alexander]

What?

[Kim Coles]

Tina Marie sweetheart was a kiss that just held me captive in your sweet embrace. And I would.

[Erica Alexander]

This is what they're teaching in modeling school.

[Kim Coles]

Yes.

[Stacey Abrams]

Tina Marie.

[Erica Alexander]

Using Tina Marie's music. Wow.

[Kim Coles]

Tina Marie. We would walk. So. Yeah. So thanks black glamour.

[Erica Alexander]

Thanks, Black Lemma.

[Stacey Abrams]

This is the way it feels to move through summer in Lululemon iconic aligned softness without the front seam.

[Kim Coles]

For our.

[Stacey Abrams]

Smoothest look and feel ever. Summer won't know what hit it. Stretch your limits in the non stop flexibility of the new Lululemon Align no line pant in select stores [e-mail].

[Kim Coles]

You know that one friend who somehow knows everything about money? Yeah. Now imagine they live in your phone. Say hey to Experian, your big financial friend. It's the app that helps you check your FICO score, find ways to save, and basically feel like a financial genius. And guess what? It's totally free. So go on, download the Experian app. Trust me, having a BFF like this is a total game changer.

[Erica Alexander]

It's time for the rewind where we watch and relive living single with you. So it's now time for living single. Season 1, Episode 750 Full Court Press Khadijah gets into an accident with an older woman, owes $1,500. She needs an attorney and enlists the help of her best friend Max. Guest starring Montrose Hagan and Marcus Giamatti.

[Kim Coles]

Yeah, so can't wait to get into this one. Let's go. Guess I better call my insurance company. Now, Khadijah, you don't want to do that. You don't want to deal with those slimy blood suckers. What you need is a lawyer. What was she driving?

[Erica Alexander]

Oh, God, Max.

[Kim Coles]

I don't know.

[Erica Alexander]

It all happened so fast. I think it was a late model.

[Kim Coles]

Cadillac Fleetwood, special edition with special bumper.

[Erica Alexander]

Trim and cruise control.

[Kim Coles]

An old biddy and a Cadillac. Sounds like there's justice to be served.

[Erica Alexander]

Nice. We see that, you know, Khadijah was in an accident with an older woman. Regine and Max suggest that she sue. Khadijah wants to settle out of court. She's like, I don't want to go through all that.

[Kim Coles]

Yeah, but it's the Same old story again. Khadijah needs help again. Max can help again. But Khadijah's pride won't allow her to accept the help again. Wow. So this is a lot of energy.

[Erica Alexander]

In this first scene. Because she comes in, in this accident, we learn right away what's going on.

[Kim Coles]

Yeah, thank you. Because Sinclair tells them in like some sort of weird sound effects. It was like emoji. Before they were real. Then the other, then me. Thank goodness Khadijah was driving. They had an accident but nobody got hurt.

[Erica Alexander]

How much do I love that? Overton's been paying enough attention to her that he can speak Sinclair.

[Kim Coles]

He can speak Sinclair.

[Erica Alexander]

He can speak Sinclair.

[Kim Coles]

That's when you know that you're made for each other. When you can do all that and they don't complain that they don't understand you. They can read between the lines.

[Erica Alexander]

And he understands her. All her lines, all the lines. That's what she's been really paying attention and says that he's been studying her to get to know her and to get in there. Right. You know, he's got this multi yeared plan. So that's real speak. I love that. Also Regine, you know, in the middle of the scene is she goes to take some sort of painkiller of some kind, like aspirin or Tylenol or whatever it is. And when she limps out of the room, like one of us could have gotten injured, you know, just. It's hysterical.

[Kim Coles]

She getting ready to sue.

[Erica Alexander]

Getting ready to get ready.

[Kim Coles]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And well, you know what, that wouldn't be unusual. Cause sometimes when you get hit, people start to grab their back. They do, yeah, limp and all sorts of stuff. So she getting ready to work that.

[Erica Alexander]

I love that you come in ready. I'm like, Max.

[Kim Coles]

Must you scream out.

[Stacey Abrams]

Of the window like a no class lowlife coming.

[Erica Alexander]

The timing of this scene. So like you said, lots of energy, lots of comedy and it played really well and it still does that last four years.

[Kim Coles]

Well, you know, they're lucky they have an in house lawyer with Max, which is great because you know, black people have, you know, a tenuous relationship with the law because the law hasn't always worked for us. But Maxine Shaw is there, right?

[Erica Alexander]

Ready?

[Kim Coles]

Yeah.

[Erica Alexander]

And like, come on, girl, throw me in the game is what you're saying.

[Kim Coles]

Really put her in, coach, put her in. And so like a lot of people, you can already see that she's saying, I don't want to sue that old lady. I don't want to do that. She's like, no. You know, something should happen, but at least allow me to be there. Right.

[Erica Alexander]

And not just throw me in coach. But it was really like, let me help my friend. Like, this could go really. You know that you have me. Like, let me help you navigate this. Well, I'm the best person to do the job.

[Kim Coles]

Well, yeah. Because most people do settle, and it's encouraged. You know, it's cheap, sure. You know, it's quick, but I don't know if that's gonna happen.

[Erica Alexander]

We don't know. We're about to see, aren't we?

[Kim Coles]

We'll accept the settlement. You're making a wise choice. I always do. Things won't have to get ugly. Exactly. You don't have to suffer a nasty loss in court. Excuse me. I know how humiliating a crushing defeat can be. Well, I don't know personally, but I've heard. So you're saying I'd lose your words. Oh, no, no, no, no. I don't think so. My words are, keep your little $800. We're not settling. We're not? No. We'll see you in court. You do realize I've never lost a. Well, it just so happens that I've never lost a case. Well, one of us is gonna lose a case. Well, I guess it's gonna be you. You, You, You, You, You, You, You.

[Erica Alexander]

Well, that didn't end very well.

[Kim Coles]

No, it depends on how you look at it. So Khadijah and this older woman meet, but she brings a lawyer. Remember, she thought, oh, she's not gonna bring a lawyer. But Khadijah uses Max's expertise, and Khadijah wants to settle. But Max got competitive, and now Max and Khadijah.

[Erica Alexander]

Khadijah is underrepresented. She thinks that she's just gonna. This is gonna just be a short conversation. And by the way, shout out to the beautiful Montrose Hagan. Every role that I've ever seen her play. She's always very elegant and beautiful. And one lawyer, that's almost none. And so here we are in the thick of it.

[Kim Coles]

Yeah. And I think the core characteristic of Max is a huge level of competition. Yeah, she's very competitive. If you click that button or, you know, trigger her, then you just set it off. She's coming for you, and she's a winner.

[Erica Alexander]

And so she's not afraid of the competition because she knows she's going to win. As a matter of fact, I've not lost the case. And he said, neither have I.

[Kim Coles]

Never.

[Erica Alexander]

You you, you, you, you. You like, oh, no, I'm going to win.

[Kim Coles]

That's right. She was fine to settle until he said, you know, too bad, because if you would come to court, you would have lost.

[Erica Alexander]

Oh, say what now?

[Kim Coles]

Say what? Say what?

[Erica Alexander]

Right.

[Kim Coles]

Would I. So that's not gonna sit there, you know.

[Erica Alexander]

Now, Khadijah didn't want to fight, but Max took it there, and so now we're there.

[Kim Coles]

And so can competitive be seen as aggressive? Like, there's that angry black woman thing again.

[Erica Alexander]

Listen, I think in this case, it's not angry. It's just competitive. It just call it what it is. And her way of being, her style. It didn't feel angry to me. It felt like, oh, no, you. You saying, I can't do this? Oh, watch me do this.

[Kim Coles]

Yeah, but, you know, and we'll talk about this more, but I think every time a woman sort of asserts herself, it does throw people off.

[Erica Alexander]

I get that.

[Kim Coles]

I guess that's when people get called bitches and all these other things, but.

[Erica Alexander]

That'S a long conversation to have. Like, everything. In this case, I. You know, it's so funny how within the culture, we. We can read when it's really angry and really aggressive and when it's passionate. And I think there are times when we're just being passionate and it' as something else, and because it's threatening to them, whoever they are.

[Kim Coles]

Yeah, right. Yeah. But did she act. Did Max act in the best interest of her client, Khadijah, or did she suddenly tap into her own selfish, you know, what do you think?

[Erica Alexander]

What do you think?

[Kim Coles]

She did not act. She did not act in the best interest of Khadijah.

[Erica Alexander]

No.

[Kim Coles]

Because even if you disagree with your client, you have to do what they say.

[Erica Alexander]

Right.

[Kim Coles]

But she could not separate those.

[Erica Alexander]

She could not in that moment.

[Kim Coles]

Yeah. And so now Khadijah's on the hook.

[Erica Alexander]

Right.

[Kim Coles]

Because if it's also, remember, that puts her at risk if you lose the case, you owe.

[Erica Alexander]

That's right. That's right.

[Kim Coles]

Yeah.

[Erica Alexander]

That's right.

[Kim Coles]

Yeah.

[Erica Alexander]

Ooh. What would have happened? Ooh. Well, we don't know.

[Kim Coles]

Or damage the friendship. Right. You just lose the case.

[Erica Alexander]

You lost everything.

[Kim Coles]

Yeah. Ooh.

[Erica Alexander]

You could lose everything.

[Kim Coles]

You could lose everything. Wow.

[Erica Alexander]

But in that moment, she wasn't thinking of the risk.

[Kim Coles]

No. No. Let's see what goes on. What if we lose Max? Lose Khadijah? I am Maxine Shaw, attorney at law. I lose weight. I lose patience. If you keep working my nerves, I may lose my mind. But I do not lose cases. So you just get your butt used to leather. Cause you're coming home from court in Alexis. You coming home from court in Alexis, hit your butt. You see?

[Erica Alexander]

Let her great writing.

[Kim Coles]

So they're arguing and they're bickering now because she has not done what Khadijah wanted. Right. She has to contemplate, you know, what if you lose? And she says that to Max. And Max is like, lose, lose.

[Erica Alexander]

Right. That's not gonna happen. Like, I got us into this and I'm gonna win in the end. Yeah, she's clear about that and certain about that.

[Kim Coles]

That's right. The mythology of the Maxine Shaw character is partly because of her great surety of self. And it's funny because later on, we start to see cracks in it.

[Erica Alexander]

There comes the conflict that we need to see. We need to see the vulnerability to make her a whole character. And what I love about this episode is this. And I didn't realize this until we started rewatching this. This is the first time that you say, Maxine Shaw, attorney at law.

[Kim Coles]

Yeah.

[Erica Alexander]

And how did that feel to take that line on? Cause you're still getting to know who this character is. How did it feel to wear that.

[Kim Coles]

You know, in your ear? Maxine Shaw, attorney at law. It rhymes. So, I mean, in a way, you want to say it. Cause it's fun to say it. And frankly, again, I am leaning very heavily on the fact that I am a preacher's daughter. One thing is that preachers in the cogic, pastor, and I'm not trying to be disrespectful, is they selling God and God don't lose.

[Erica Alexander]

You hear me?

[Kim Coles]

Ooh.

[Erica Alexander]

True, true.

[Kim Coles]

So if you come into court with me, you know, you got the backing of that kind of like, power behind you. And inside of Maxine Shaw's character is, you know, Erica Alexander, surety that if, you know, if God be with you, nothing can be against you. Okay.

[Erica Alexander]

Okay.

[Kim Coles]

There, you see? Boom shakalaka. Hallelujah. Regene. Let's go over your testimony again.

[Erica Alexander]

No, no, that's it. It's one o' clock in.

[Kim Coles]

Good morning. Enough is enough. I'm sorry, but we have a court date tomorrow, and you guys are nowhere near to being prepared. These answers have to become second nature. Peabody's gonna bombard you with questions like, how many lanes were in the road? What was the exact time of day? I don't know exactly. How fast were you traveling?

[Stacey Abrams]

27.5 miles an hour. Well within the legal speed limit. But Fast enough to injure a spleen.

[Kim Coles]

Okay, maybe she's ready, but the rest of you need work. I'm going to bed. No, wait. You have to go over the diagram of the intersection. Exhibit A, Day 3. Have you lost your ever loving mind? I do not want to grow old doing this. I'm taking the 800 and I'm out. Well, if you want to settle, do it your damn self. So there's Maxine Shaw, trying to get her clients and her witnesses all on one page and prepared for court. And they're doing a horrible job because they're tired.

[Erica Alexander]

She's getting ready, which is powerful, which is great.

[Kim Coles]

That's why she wins. We're seeing why she wins now. But they can't take the heat, Right. They want to get out the kitchen.

[Erica Alexander]

My favorite line in that scene is, okay, maybe she's ready. But the rest. He is. Right?

[Kim Coles]

Yeah. So I admire that, because I think people don't really realize that if you can do it, ain't bragging if you can do it. But we're also seeing that it's not just bragging. She's willing to do the work.

[Erica Alexander]

She's doing the work and not getting paid for it.

[Kim Coles]

Putting them through their paces, not getting paid for it, but wanting again to advance her own interest in winning. And this is what gets her in trouble. And finally, she starts bragging, saying, hey, you know, this dude's gonna drag this out. Peabody is gonna drag it out. But guess what? Week one, week two, week three, week four. And then Nakiji said, wait, that's enough.

[Erica Alexander]

That's enough.

[Kim Coles]

You trippin' Straight up, I'm gonna settle, and I'm gonna represent myself.

[Erica Alexander]

So. Okay, then you're on your own.

[Kim Coles]

There's horrible, though. Charts and graphs, everything. And she. But here's also. Here's the other thing. She's demanding. Y' all have to tell the truth.

[Erica Alexander]

Oh, yes.

[Kim Coles]

Get acquainted with the truth. We're going to win this the right way, Right?

[Erica Alexander]

Right, Right.

[Kim Coles]

So she's, you know, not willing to take any shortcuts, and now she's lost a client.

[Erica Alexander]

Yeah.

[Kim Coles]

Perhaps a friend. Aw. Let's see what goes on.

[Erica Alexander]

What happens next.

[Kim Coles]

So what are we talking about here, you, Honor? A simple car accident? No, I think not. That Jeep was my client's only means of transporting each and every issue of her struggling magazine to the printer. A magazine that gives voice to New York's African American community. A voice the defendant almost steeled.

[Erica Alexander]

Hmm.

[Kim Coles]

So today we ask. No, you, Honor. No, I think, uh, we demand Compensation so that my client may continue to pursue her lifelong dream of freedom of speech, freedom of the press, and freedom for all. Wow. Okay, so first of all, let's say Max is a winner.

[Erica Alexander]

Max is the winner. The winner came through in the end. Still had her preparation. And do you feel that she went to the courthouse knowing that Khadijah just might need her?

[Kim Coles]

Yeah, she knew Khadijah would need her. Khadijah would need her.

[Erica Alexander]

Do you have an opening statement?

[Kim Coles]

Yes, I do. I. I have the right to remain silent, and anything I say and do.

[Erica Alexander]

Will be held against me.

[Kim Coles]

Which, as you pointed out, this is. She knew that Khadijah didn't understand. Right. That this could go really bad. And once she did, she may be on the hook for a lot more money to this older woman. Right. So, yeah, I mean, I think that she understood what was at stake, and then she got up and did her thing, and we see why she gets the big money. We're prepared to renew our previous offer. I know of no such offer. 800. 1500. 1,000. 1,500. 1,500. And an apology. I apologize, ladies and gentlemen. This case is dismissed.

[Stacey Abrams]

First time for everything, Jack.

[Erica Alexander]

I love. There's a couple of moments in this scene where you set and then you say what you have to say. You get into position, you handle your situation. You put on those glasses with that great chain, and then you set, and then off you go.

[Kim Coles]

I'm trying to tell you.

[Erica Alexander]

Was the chain your idea? Cause you're much too young to have a pair of glasses with a chain on.

[Kim Coles]

Absolutely my idea. Because they props. And I said, I need some glasses so I could read. Now, at the time, I had 2020 vision, and now I don't. You know what I'm saying? But at the time, I had 2020 vision. But I thought since I was always reading briefs, that I wanted to look like I was reading. So it was just a really kind of cheesy way to indicate that she's a reader, but also to indicate that she put. I didn't necessarily need those glasses on to do the opening statement, but, you know, she puts it on. Cause she's, as you say, getting ready to do your cook.

[Erica Alexander]

Oh, she's getting ready to cook. Let me cook.

[Kim Coles]

Let me cook.

[Stacey Abrams]

Let me cook.

[Kim Coles]

So she cooking, and then she puts it on. That's training that you get from in theater. And just what I did just a moment ago is when you let silence sort of make a gap so people can hear what's coming next. Because if it folds, all folds in itself. There's no marker. So she does that sort of to lay her case out. But she also gives a dramatic pause.

[Erica Alexander]

It's great.

[Kim Coles]

It's great.

[Erica Alexander]

Like, get ready, it's about to go down.

[Kim Coles]

And where do they do the most dramatic pauses in church? When the preacher goes, okay, let me tell you something, okay? And somebody say, all right, all right. That's when the amen corner. Be like, come on, take your time. Those pauses are always given over and over again so that the pastor or the minister can make sure that the congregation is with them.

[Erica Alexander]

Yeah, yeah.

[Kim Coles]

And that you lean forward. And so she does that a lot. And that's definitely something that I picked up.

[Erica Alexander]

I'm gonna just liken that to comedy. The best comedians know when to hold and let the audience laugh and know when to hold. And sometimes the hold gets a laugh. Like, what's the anticipation of? What's fitting to come next?

[Kim Coles]

Exactly.

[Erica Alexander]

Yeah. That's beautiful.

[Kim Coles]

Yes. Doing the work for you.

[Erica Alexander]

Yeah.

[Kim Coles]

You know, and it's like a racehorse pacing himself. You know what I'm saying? And so I actually, actually, I haven't seen that in so long, frankly. Yeah. I don't. I didn't even know what was gonna come next. We love the judge. The judge played by the great Richard Stahl.

[Erica Alexander]

Richard Stahl. And if you notice at the beginning, he reads her name and says, okay, Cottagey James.

[Kim Coles]

It's funny because in a previous episode of Reliving Single, Steve White, who came to play Elmo, Sable kept repeating her name and sort of, we were having fun with it, but the producers at the time did not want that to happen. And this is different, I think, you.

[Erica Alexander]

Know, culturally, you know, maybe he wouldn't have known how to say Khadijah. You know, that's a name that he doesn't see all the time coming in his courtroom. And so kadajay, I think it was allowed because culturally, that's funny. It's a name that this man would not have ever seen before. And he gets to.

[Kim Coles]

Mr. Yeah. You know, and frankly, it was a name that a lot of people hadn't seen before. There was a time in the 70s, Black Power Ungawa. And because of Muslim sort of raw influence that everybody wanted to name their child something that was an Arabic name or something like that. So in my family, you can see the switch.

[Erica Alexander]

Okay, do the switch.

[Kim Coles]

And you're right. Okay. So I'm born in the 60s, and I'm the last born in 60s, but there's four before me. First one's John John. The next one's Robert. The next one's Carolyn. Then there's Erica. That's something different. And then the 70s hit and. And it becomes Sharlanda and Maisha. That's what it is. Like she just got black powered.

[Erica Alexander]

Right, right.

[Kim Coles]

And wanted to add it in. And there were a lot of names, you know, Shaquifia and Shaflana and all that.

[Erica Alexander]

Latisha.

[Kim Coles]

We started making things up.

[Erica Alexander]

Right. Because it was, you know, that's our creativity and that's us wanting to separate ourselves from that and hold our culture near. Even if they weren't really African names or really Arabic names. We were making them up.

[Kim Coles]

Yeah. And there was a lot of people had to get used to saying different names, especially when speaking about black people, of course, you know, and again, that's us trying to find a path to our original self.

[Erica Alexander]

And it's.

[Kim Coles]

Even if it's as the crow flies.

[Erica Alexander]

And it's, I'm sure, intentional. Why Queen Latifah chose Latifah?

[Kim Coles]

That part. She was Dana Owens and she's Queen Latifah. Latifah, yeah.

[Erica Alexander]

When we first meet Max, I want to say in the first episode, she comes in the room, don't touch me unless you want to get burned. We know that that is what she says after she wins. And she says it here. We see her win and we see.

[Kim Coles]

Don'T touch me unless you want to get burned.

[Erica Alexander]

We know that that is her clarion call for the excellence that she has just displayed.

[Kim Coles]

And they go home and they celebrate and they got cake and they're, you know, partying it up and dancing and, you know, really having a. It's a win a hoop nanny. And they bring in the cake and Khadijah takes it as Max is, you know, bragging again. And bam.

[Erica Alexander]

Right in the face.

[Kim Coles]

Right in the face.

[Erica Alexander]

Was that written in the script or was that an ad lib? I'd like to know.

[Kim Coles]

That was written in the script because we had to get permission from the director to actually do it. And they told us, okay, the show is in the can, you could do it. Because if they didn't, they'd have to reset my makeup, and that would've taken.

[Erica Alexander]

A long time and fix your clothes and have a sex.

[Kim Coles]

So it had to be the last shot of the night.

[Erica Alexander]

Right.

[Kim Coles]

And so they had to get, you know, you know, signed off. But, you know, I think that it also took away some of Max's power.

[Erica Alexander]

You think so it did.

[Kim Coles]

Let's Talk about power. Because why couldn't they just let Max, you know, sit there and be smiling and be happy and have the last word?

[Erica Alexander]

Well, because you flipped the script on her and said, oh, here's my bill. Here's my bill. So something you had offered to do for free. That's true. And then in the last minute, and, you know, maybe you could say that, you know, you had your chance to have it free at the last minute, I came in and saved you. So I think that was her payback for you saying, okay, here's, you know, let me pay you right now.

[Kim Coles]

So that's true.

[Erica Alexander]

I hear what you're saying, though. Like, we needed another button. And, you know, in comedy and in sitcom, we call it the button. And so you had. You have that extra button and you try things.

[Kim Coles]

I mean, that's the thing. You throw something in there and you see if it works, and everybody does their best. And then if it doesn't, you try again. And certainly that's good fun, because it's not every day you get cake in your face. And so, you know, that's a classic comedy trope.

[Erica Alexander]

Oh, my goodness.

[Kim Coles]

Is the pie in the face, please? And there, you see it working there.

[Erica Alexander]

Do I have a memory of you? I remember looking at you going, like, Erica's gonna start throwing cake. Did you start throwing cake?

[Kim Coles]

Or like, I think we all started to. But you don't see that because that's when the show is over.

[Erica Alexander]

Right.

[Kim Coles]

And, you know, we have a conversation, really, about who defends people who are defenseless because they've got Maxine Shaw. She is a great lawyer, but not everybody has that. They end up taking these types of, you know, settlement and that type of thing. And so it is very hard to get great representation in court, not only for yourself, but for your family.

[Erica Alexander]

We know so many tragedies for years on end for, you know, that people don't get justice, that they end up staying in jail for forever and forever. But it makes me wonder how many people are sitting, you know, in trouble or received small settlements whose lives are ruined by something that happened to them or something that happened in their life. And they never got justice, and they never had a justice.

[Kim Coles]

And we all need justice fighters. Everyone needs an avenger.

[Erica Alexander]

Yeah.

[Kim Coles]

And you know what?

[Erica Alexander]

What?

[Kim Coles]

I really feel like we could use an avenger right now. Right now to talk about how it is being a real life lawyer who happens to have all the things that Maxine Shaw had fighting for the people. Yeah. The skin, the hair, all of that. And that kind of mask coming for the Avengers. Coming for you. Defending you.

[Erica Alexander]

Well, where can we find one?

[Kim Coles]

What's that? What is that?

[Erica Alexander]

It's a call.

[Kim Coles]

That phone works. I thought it was a prop.

[Erica Alexander]

You know, normally this would sit on the wall.

[Kim Coles]

Answer it, Kim.

[Erica Alexander]

What? We have a call from an Avenger. Yes, of course. Patch her through immediately.

[Kim Coles]

An Avenger.

[Erica Alexander]

We have something better than an Avenger.

[Kim Coles]

Who?

[Erica Alexander]

Just in time for the Reverb. This episode is brought to you by LifeLock. Between two factor authentication, strong passwords, and a VPN, you try to be in.

[Stacey Abrams]

Control of how your info is protected.

[Erica Alexander]

But many other places also have it, and they might not be as careful. That's why LifeLock monitors hundreds of millions of data points a second for threats. If your identity is stolen, they'll fix it, guaranteed.

[Stacey Abrams]

Or your money back.

[Erica Alexander]

Save up to 40% your first year. Visit lifelocked.com podcast for 40% off.

[Stacey Abrams]

Terms apply.

[Erica Alexander]

This is the Reverb. Our time to reflect on the episode's themes and how they still echo throughout the culture.

[Kim Coles]

Oh, come on. All right, now we have got Stacey Abrams on the orange line.

[Erica Alexander]

Hello. Listen. Hello. Hello. And I wanna read this, and I wanna get this right. Here we go. She's a lawyer, a voting rights super, a New York Times bestselling author, a political icon, and let's be real, she's the only person we know who could argue a case, write a novel, and.

[Kim Coles]

Said that she was inspired by the Maxine Shaw, attorney at law character. Today, we are making a full circle moment happen. Please welcome to Reliving Single, Stacey Abrams. Yay.

[Erica Alexander]

And the crowd goes wild. And the crowd goes wild.

[Kim Coles]

This is awesome.

[Erica Alexander]

It's so wonderful to have you, Stacey. Thank you for being here.

[Stacey Abrams]

Thank you for having me. This is a delight.

[Kim Coles]

This week we are on episode. What is it? Episode seven, and this is the first time it's season one that we see Maxine Shaw, attorney at law, in the courtroom. And she's representing Khadijah, who has gotten.

[Stacey Abrams]

Into a wreck, a car accident, with an older woman. Yeah, I've seen every episode of the show.

[Erica Alexander]

She's like, I know this.

[Stacey Abrams]

I'm true. Sinclair is still flirting gently with Obi. Hasn't quite figured out how she's gonna make her make him her man. Yeah. Come on now.

[Erica Alexander]

So is it really true that you were inspired by Maxine Shaw, attorney at law?

[Stacey Abrams]

Absolutely. I'm a huge consumer of television, and when I was becoming who I needed to be, there was living single and there was Maxine Shaw, attorney At law. And the ability of that character to show. Show black women in particular, the full scope of our intellect, our power, and our capacity for joy was a transformative thing for me. And I will say this, even though we're talking about Max, I will love on you, too. Because Sinclair, as this character who was trying to find herself, was also incredibly important. I love the fact that you had that acting bug that you watched Burgeon, and the reason that mattered. You know, I'm a tax attorney who was writing romance novels, and I maintain multitude. And so watching someone who had one thing she was told she was supposed to be, but finding her creative passion was important. But now we'll get back to Max, and so.

[Erica Alexander]

Yeah, well, we all get to feel the love. Thank you.

[Kim Coles]

No, that's wonderful. I mean, so you are bold, you are brilliant. You are those things, and you're constantly underestimated as a successful woman in law and politics and in your career. How do you push back?

[Stacey Abrams]

The most important way to push back is to be unapologetically yourself. You can attempt to mask who you are or to fit yourself into the construct that others would set for you, but you are going to fail. You might make it work for a time, but there's gonna be a moment where the mask slips or when the language doesn't work and you reveal who you are. I find it easier to just show up that way in the first place, because when you are using pretense, you are also diminishing the value of what you can offer. And so for me, it was, if you're gonna like me or dislike me, I'm just gonna let. I'm gonna let you do it for real.

[Kim Coles]

Yeah.

[Stacey Abrams]

We don't have to do the fake. You don't have to find me to decide you like me or don't like me. I'm gonna present myself, and you can tell me what you want.

[Kim Coles]

And that's saying, like, the pushback is your authenticity.

[Stacey Abrams]

It causes some people consternation. Yes.

[Kim Coles]

Ooh. Come on. And that's real. How do you decide when to speak up and when to hold back? In a world that's constantly demanding more.

[Stacey Abrams]

Of you, the decision about whether to fight or not is a question of what's on the other side of the fight. If you're fighting simply for the sake of being right, that's not enough. Because what are you willing to lose just to have that momentary victory and sometimes that Pyrrhic victory, because you've destroyed opportunity just so you can have a moment of saying, look at Me. But when there are consequences to silence, when there are consequences to capitulation, when there is harm that can be met on someone else, if you don't do what's right, if there's a loss to who you are, if you are diminished because you decided to hide who you are, that's the moment where fighting makes the most sense. The reality, though, and I think this is part of the joy of that episode, was if you fight and you lose, it could cost you. And so the question is, what are you willing to risk? What are you willing to lose? And if you do lose, do you have the resilience to make it to the next moment?

[Erica Alexander]

And I'll just ask a little follow up question here. Where do you find the resilience from? If it's, it's not coming from within, is there a way that you can find it? You know, maybe it's in your sisterhood, your community, your friendship, like your accountability.

[Stacey Abrams]

And it's all of the above. One of the novels I wrote, it's the book Never Tell. And Aaron in the book is hiding from something herself. She recognizes that sometimes we have to borrow someone else's courage. And so sometimes we borrow power, we borrow strength, we borrow resilience. But it only works if you are willing then to share it and to loan it to someone else. And no matter how diminished or how weak you might feel, you can always do something for someone else. You can always lift someone else up. You can always offer a kind word or a smile or just a moment of sympathetic silence. But in that moment, you are replenishing yourself because you're giving to someone else.

[Erica Alexander]

Is that a method of self care.

[Stacey Abrams]

For Stacy, I'm the second of six children. It is a learned experience.

[Kim Coles]

I'm fourth of six. You gotta, yeah, you gotta get it where you get it. You know, I'm one of two.

[Erica Alexander]

I have no understanding of the.

[Kim Coles]

No, that's what's up.

[Erica Alexander]

So I'm digging into the self care piece. Cause how does Stacey take such good care of herself?

[Stacey Abrams]

Well, I appreciate the fact that you're telling folks. I do, I tell you do. Well, look, I watch a lot of television. I believe television is important. And when I'm giving speeches or when I'm talking to folks, they're like, well, you know, what do you read? I read voraciously. I love books, I write them. But television is one of those places where you can curate the world you wanna be in. You can find the mood you need to find. And sometimes you can borrow the mood you Need. I love television. I don't believe in guilty pleasure. I feel no guilt about being happy.

[Kim Coles]

I know that's right.

[Stacey Abrams]

Television is it for me. And that's one of the reasons living single was always so important to me. It remains one of those shows that if I'm in a certain place, that's a show I can go to. I'm going to find friendship, I'm going to find levity, I'm going to find snarkiness, and I'm going to find these representations of all of the people I knew and I know who sometimes we are told do not exist. And that's magic. So, hey, I just go to the magic of self care and television.

[Kim Coles]

Yeah, that makes. Maybe that's what makes you such an authentic storyteller, because you've got it in your DNA, obviously, because you know, that's who you are. But you also are training your mind in all the different ways, whether it's through reading or through, you know, watching stories.

[Stacey Abrams]

Yeah, absolutely.

[Kim Coles]

I think it's one of the ways we see ourselves. Obviously, I've met a lot of different versions of me inside of Maxine Shaw, and then all the while maintaining that there is an Erika Alexander here that, you know, that animates that, you know, fictional character. But we are both informing each other, and I love it.

[Stacey Abrams]

The beauty of television is also how it can stay with you after you've left that moment. I know we're reliving episode seven. I'm gonna fast forward. There's an episode when you get into a fight with Obi and he chastises you and you guys are fighting and you jump on the table and, oh, it's when he gets you kicked out of your apartment. And, like, you just have this rant where you're jumping on the coffee table and you're like, calling him everything but a child of God. A couple of scenes later, when you reconcile, there are moments where you both are willing to say, oh, I was wrong, I made a mistake. Maybe I overreacted. And there is something in that moment that I carry with me. Like, yes, sometimes you just have to call somebody out on what you think they shouldn't have done. And I love the fact that Maximum got to be she was litigating her case with him, but she also had to admit at the end, well, maybe I didn't do something I should have, and I'm gonna find a way to make amends. And what I loved about living single is that in every episode, it wasn't the same narrative, but it was always about a human arc. And where television can stick with you, where living single sticks with me, and Max in particular, is that she had fault. She made mistakes. She did things. Even in the case when she was helping Khadijah, she would make mistakes, but she learned from those mistakes, and she never let those mistakes define the truth of her friendships. She was gonna. She could separate those two things out. And that's hard to do because sometimes you just want people to let you be who you are and forget that you maybe shouldn't have said that the way you said it.

[Kim Coles]

I love that. Never let it define the truth of your friendship.

[Erica Alexander]

That's it.

[Kim Coles]

Which you gotta hold on to. Your fiction work explores justice in ways that feel cinematic. So we want to know. You ask her.

[Erica Alexander]

So let me ask you this.

[Stacey Abrams]

Yes, Stacey.

[Erica Alexander]

If you were to write a legal thriller with Maxine Shaw as the lead.

[Kim Coles]

What would the plot be?

[Stacey Abrams]

Okay, so Maxine Shaw would be defending a politician who is accused of misusing their office. And in the plot, he's accused of having misused his office for his own personal gain. And there are going to be signs that he did. So she is going to recognize that whatever he's accused of doing is actually a mask for something that no one else has seen. She's going to have to go through the investigatory space to find out what it was he did that he doesn't want anyone to know about why he did it and who he's trying to hide the truth from. And so she's going to use her legal skills to keep him out of trouble, but she's going to use her sleuthing skills to find out what else he's hiding. And because of her past as a politician, she's going to know that sometimes in politics, you do the wrong thing to get the right thing done. That never justifies doing the wrong thing, but it can at least explain why that action was taken. And she's going to have to face at the end a decision of whether to turn him in or find justice in her own way.

[Kim Coles]

Ooh. Come on.

[Erica Alexander]

Write that book.

[Kim Coles]

What?

[Erica Alexander]

I just made him.

[Kim Coles]

Make that movie.

[Erica Alexander]

Write that book.

[Kim Coles]

I'm writing that movie. Make that movie.

[Stacey Abrams]

Look, I just made that up.

[Kim Coles]

So she's genius.

[Stacey Abrams]

I'm glad we're recording this so we can see what that looks like.

[Kim Coles]

I know. That was brilliant. Because what I love is that there's. I know that's right. There's a mystery underneath the truth, but the truth thriller that shows that there's always more than meets the eye. The other thing is defining him differently as not somebody who's necessarily just flaunted. You say done that, but is actually protecting something else. Oh, I love it. My God.

[Erica Alexander]

I want my popcorn right now.

[Kim Coles]

This lady is so speaking of creators, and you know her, and you know. And she's the creator of the show, the great Yvette Leigh Bowser, the creator of Living Single. She was the first black woman showrunner in primetime and television. She laid the groundwork for creating stories that were inclusive of cultural landscapes. And as someone who's written political thrillers and romance novels, how do you approach weaving DEI principles into your narratives? And what responsibility do storytellers have in forming worlds that represent all people? And I'm talking about her APR network. If y' all don't know about it, look it up. She's always in the forward, front fight in the Marines, the avant garde of justice.

[Erica Alexander]

And saying that must use that term. We must use it.

[Kim Coles]

You must use it. But how would you approach weaving DEI principles into your narratives? And what responsibilities storytellers have in forming worlds that represent all people?

[Stacey Abrams]

So I've written eight romance novels, three children's books. My third legal thriller, Political Thriller, comes out in July. And I've written three nonfiction, so one called Lead from the Outside, that is about power and politics, basically the power that we have as outsiders to find power and to use it. Our Time is Now, which has been banned by the US Naval Academy libraries.

[Kim Coles]

Congratulations.

[Stacey Abrams]

About how democracy can work for all of us, including how identity politics is good politics.

[Kim Coles]

Amazing.

[Stacey Abrams]

And Lead from and then Level up, which was a business book I wrote with a friend of mine about, particularly about women in entrepreneurship. But across all of my work, I embed DEI in the frame of how I tell my story. So if you read my romance novels, my characters are people of color, but they're never so culturally specific that someone can say they can't find themselves in it.

[Kim Coles]

Come on.

[Stacey Abrams]

And that's part of the beauty of dei. DEI doesn't diminish someone else. It doesn't. Doesn't require exclusion to be good. It says that diversity works, that equity is possible, and that inclusion can be effortless. It can be hard, but it can be effortless. Meaning that. Just let it happen.

[Kim Coles]

Come on.

[Stacey Abrams]

You might have to get out with what it feels like, but you can let it happen.

[Kim Coles]

Yes.

[Stacey Abrams]

And one of the highest compliments that I get from my writing is that I never shy away from racial or gender identity, but I recognize that it is part of the whole and that's what DEI demands. DEI demands that we recognize that we are a stronger nation, that our foundational values are grounded and believing that diversity means all people, that equity is about fair access to opportunity, and that inclusion means everyone can come along and everyone should have a place. And through the work we do with APR Network. APRNetwork.org yes, as a writer, as an activist, as a politician, my through line is that my work has to reflect that truth. When we let people tell us that we are one thing, when we let them reduce us to their single stereotype, their single narrative, then we are losing the ability to be great. This nation is great already because we have DEI because we've had it for 249 years. And we will not allow one man and one party.

[Kim Coles]

Come on.

[Stacey Abrams]

And a raft of fiction known as Executive Order tell us that our history isn't real and our stories can't be told.

[Erica Alexander]

Drop the mic.

[Stacey Abrams]

What?

[Kim Coles]

Oh, the mic to dress up a raft of fiction. Now, even inside of her answer is storytelling.

[Erica Alexander]

All of it.

[Kim Coles]

And clarity and the beauty. You know, and that just shows you that you have to train your mind, folks. I hope y' all looking at that, because this didn't just come out of nowhere. This is a refined and custom work in regards to this individual. And the reason I have to speak about that, because that is real. That's a beautiful thing. My gosh. And APR means America. America's pride rising, right?

[Stacey Abrams]

Exactly.

[Kim Coles]

Yes.

[Stacey Abrams]

American pride rises.

[Kim Coles]

American pride rises.

[Stacey Abrams]

They don't get to take our pride from us. DEI is the epitome of American pride. Because when you can build a nation that is brought together by intention rather than accident, that weaves together diversity and that demand that everyone can compete because we believe that the American dream can be realized by anyone, that should be the thing we are the proudest of. That is our superpower. And why would we let anyone claim to be a leader who tells us that our only pathway to success is uniformity, unfairness, and exclusion?

[Kim Coles]

Ooh.

[Erica Alexander]

That doesn't even feel right.

[Stacey Abrams]

Exactly. Terrible.

[Kim Coles]

Stacey for president by law and Wave. You know I'm ready. You know I've been ready. That's what's up. When is your book? You said July. What's the name of the book? Come on.

[Erica Alexander]

Oh.

[Stacey Abrams]

So Code of Justice, which actually does explore themes of artificial intelligence. We spend a little time on dei, we talk about veterans. It's a fun. It's a legal thriller. It comes out July 15th. It's available for pre order right now. Code of justice coming to a Bookstore near you, you gotta go to.

[Kim Coles]

Yeah, yeah. Everybody, let's pre order that. That's what's up.

[Erica Alexander]

I just wanna ask one. Might be a final question. I don't know. We want to keep you here forever, Keep you close forever. You mentioned intention and I can tell that you are a woman of intention. All of your work feels so, so intentional. What would you say to a young Stacey Abrams right now in order to get her or him or them aligned with their intention so that they can live a life of meaningfulness and purpose that you have made happen?

[Stacey Abrams]

Thank you for the question. In my book, Lead from the Outside, I wrote it as sort of a lean in for the rest of us.

[Kim Coles]

Come on.

[Stacey Abrams]

And the idea is that when you're from the outside, whether it's based on race or gender or geography or sexual orientation or poverty, whatever put you outside of the places of power, there's a way in. And that's ambition. That's accepting that fear is real. It's being willing to find friends and allies. And as a young person, what I benefited from most often were people who were willing to open doors that I didn't know existed and then walked in with me. They didn't just say, go find and go figure it out. They came in with me. I have a podcast, not as good as this one, but it's called Assembly Required.

[Kim Coles]

Assembly Required. Yes, of course.

[Stacey Abrams]

And the reason I do Assembly Required, it's because sometimes the world feels so big and so broken and so overwhelming that we've got to understand the scope of things, but then we've got to break it down and rebuild what we need. And as a young person, if I understood even more just that I don't have to do everything everywhere all at once, I could do something somewhere soon. But the reason I named the show Assembly Required is that no matter how broken things are, you can fix it and make it better. But there will be some assembly required.

[Kim Coles]

Whoo.

[Erica Alexander]

I want every one of those phrases on a quote card, something, somewhere, on an affirmation card, on a T shirt.

[Kim Coles]

You have no doubt. Put my underwear on my feet and seared and taped on the back of my neck.

[Erica Alexander]

On a barrette, on a barrette in my soul.

[Kim Coles]

Stacy, do you know how much I love you? I will always adore you. I will love you for your brilliant mind. It is truly platinum. It's diamond. It's really what it really is. But just cause your giving nature and the fact that you happen to be in human form to help us all come to some kind of higher ground is one of the. It's one of the most fascinating things I've witnessed on earth, is. And I really value you so much, and I'm always impressed. And that's just. I just will never not adore the fact that she's here with us, honored.

[Erica Alexander]

And gobsmacked and delighted. And you talked about the higher ground. You make us want to not only see where the higher ground is, but to continue reaching and reaching and then bringing others with us. So thank you. Thank you.

[Kim Coles]

But I usually think that they're gonna drag me down like an anchor. But you know what? You right. Let's. We could fly together.

[Erica Alexander]

Let's fly together in the door. Yeah.

[Kim Coles]

Go in with us. Thank you. I mean, is there anything you want to ask us?

[Stacey Abrams]

I want to come play with you guys in person one day, because as you can tell, I've watched every. Every single episode. Just to put too fine a point on it, I own the DVDs because I don't trust streaming.

[Erica Alexander]

Come on.

[Stacey Abrams]

Because. Because I. I appreciate streaming, but things change. They change their minds. And Living Single is so important to me that I ordered the entire DVD collection and I have a backup DVD player for when something goes horribly wrong, because there are certain things that have to be in your life, and I can always have a book by my side and living single DVDs on my shelf. And so one day, let me play with you, and if we can do some performance together where I just sit there and smile and clap for you guys, I'm there.

[Kim Coles]

Come on, now, Stacey, listen. Done. It's gonna happen, girl. That's gonna happen. Come on, Kim.

[Erica Alexander]

Come on now. Come on now.

[Kim Coles]

Well, that's a dates. Not a date, a dates. And, my darling, we let you know that we are at your service.

[Erica Alexander]

Indeed. Indeed.

[Stacey Abrams]

It is an honor. Thank you so much, Erica, for always being there. Kim, it is a delight and an honor to meet you, and thank you both for just adding joy to the world every time.

[Kim Coles]

Oh, joy to the world. Thank you. Thank you.

[Stacey Abrams]

Thank you.

[Erica Alexander]

Stacey Abrams.

[Kim Coles]

Thank you, Stacey.

[Stacey Abrams]

Thank you, guys. This was delightful. It truly was.

[Kim Coles]

I love you.

[Erica Alexander]

Erica, are you ready for this week's True Blue question?

[Kim Coles]

Yes.

[Erica Alexander]

All right, then, Amber.

[Kim Coles]

Yes. Let's do what I am. All right. This one's actually for Erica. Okay, so it says, hi, I'm Dominique from Columbia, South Carolina, and I have a question for Erica. Okay. When you did certain lines for Max, was the bulging of an eye or two on or you didn't know you were doing that when you did that personally, it made your character funnier. And that's one of the reasons why you were one of my favorite characters on the show.

[Stacey Abrams]

Thanks, Dominique from Columbia, South Carolina.

[Kim Coles]

Thank you, Dominique from Columbia, South Carolina. Did I know I was bulging my eye? Yes, I did. I'm actually very aware of all my physical movements. I think you do a lot of things for emphasis, and you could put the emphasis on the wrong syllable if you'd like, or you can change the pronunciation and take out the punctuation. And you can also play with your body and also play with time. And we talked about that staggering time with, you know, silence to, you know, make something stand out. So. Yeah, and I just happen to have big eyes. I can't help it. These suckers are huge. You know, Kim talks about how she's influenced by cartoons and. And all sorts of things, and I certainly am, and that I watched a ton of Bugs Bunny. And the thing about animation is there's something they call. That's called stretch and squash. And that's what makes animation fun, because you get to go. And human beings do that, too. And frankly, the thing that I learned the most about acting is that you should be well aware of what your body can do, and you should push it, too. So we are encouraged to work out. We're encouraged to look in the mirror and mirror ourselves and do things with our mouths so we can get ready to perform. Not only to just say the words and, you know, and keep in practice, but to also be able to know that you could just go.

[Erica Alexander]

And that's all you need in order to get the reaction.

[Kim Coles]

Thank you, Dominique, for asking your question. But, Kim, I want to add to that question. Kim, you're also great when it comes to physical comedy as well. Um, Erica has mentioned, you know, animation, Bugs Bunny as some of her influences. But who specifically were you mimicking when you. When it. When you was getting physical?

[Erica Alexander]

It's always going to be a combination of Carol Burnett, Lucille Ball, Ruth, Buzzy, all of the people on laughing, and. And. And a lot of great guys, too, the way they say. And in fact, in this episode, the actor's name is Marcus Giamatti. And I loved watching his physicality. If you noticed when he said things, he said it with his head. And so you add that emphasis, you add that aooga, aooga, and it lets an audience know that this is a moment that they can. That you're playful and that they can play into. So sort of that. But Carol Burnett, no doubt, was just beautiful and elegant on stage. And Lucille Ball and just unaware of how funny looking they could be in their elegance. And it's a powerful place, especially. You know, you've said this before, too, as a woman and a feminine woman, to be willing to do all the things that you would not be so pretty.

[Kim Coles]

I will do anything to get the laugh, 100%. But beg for it. Because there's a difference. It's one thing to work for it, then to beg for it or interrupt or again to. To pull focus or try to, you know, step on other people's. In other people's space. I always said that this is the house that Fox built, literally. Red Fox, Michael J. Fox. I adore them. And also Jack Lemmon. If you look at the great Jack Lemmon, the great race. If you want to see an ipop, go watch Jack Lemmon in the Great Race. Just brilliant.

[Erica Alexander]

I'm buzzing with remembrance and excitement for his quiet moments, for his big. The great race.

[Kim Coles]

I am Professor Fate.

[Erica Alexander]

That mustache.

[Kim Coles]

That mustache.

[Erica Alexander]

Come on.

[Kim Coles]

Hilarious.

[Erica Alexander]

It's so good.

[Kim Coles]

It's so good.

[Erica Alexander]

You know, what's another movie like that? For me, it's a Mad, Mad, Mad, Mad, Mad, Mad World.

[Kim Coles]

That is the Bomb Girl.

[Erica Alexander]

And I know they remade it, but it's nothing like the original.

[Kim Coles]

You see the original.

[Erica Alexander]

One of the great comedians of the day, Jonathan Winters. Winter.

[Kim Coles]

Yes.

[Erica Alexander]

Come on now.

[Kim Coles]

And he's playing it straight. Yes, yes. It's just that dude who was doing the. And then he stopped to go get his mother.

[Erica Alexander]

Mama, I'm coming to get her.

[Kim Coles]

I'm coming get him. Mama.

[Erica Alexander]

So Ethel Merman.

[Kim Coles]

Merman.

[Erica Alexander]

Oh, all the things. Yeah. So watch and watch all those old movies and all those old shows and see from whom we borrow.

[Kim Coles]

Yeah. I think if you want to be in this business, you have to study the craft. And the truth is, there are so many great ones that you don't get to see every day. Go check it out.

[Erica Alexander]

Yeah. And then you get to make it your own, because we get to borrow from them. But then we make it our own.

[Kim Coles]

I really. Do you believe that comedy is born. Is comedy nurture or nature?

[Erica Alexander]

I think that comedy is actually nature. I think that we have it accessible to us at all times. It's the way that we connect when we don't even know that it's a connection. The reason why I say that is, for me, I nurtured myself into becoming a comedian because in high school, I didn't want to be teased for being the fat girl. And I thought if I made them laugh with me instead of at me that it would garner connection and garner a new. So I think nature is around us all the time. Our parents, our uncles, our friends. You know, we learn what's funny by being in our lives, and then it can be nurtured by learning more, experiencing more. And I think some of the best comedians in the world and best performers in the world have both and have that magic and have the ability to then translate it to an audience in a way that they can understand it, feel it, and feel even more connection.

[Kim Coles]

And that's a tricky question in the biz. For a while, I used to think, oh, no, you can learn it. Now I say you can maybe learn a little bit understanding. But I think it is nature that is nurtured.

[Erica Alexander]

Well, that's what I'm. Okay.

[Kim Coles]

Boom.

[Erica Alexander]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Kim Coles]

That was a short version.

[Erica Alexander]

I'm giving the long. Well, I'm giving the boom.

[Kim Coles]

Yahoo. Okay. Don't forget to send your questions or comments to reliving single podcastartbeat.com well, another.

[Erica Alexander]

One in the can. Another one in the can. What a great show, this one. Yeah.

[Kim Coles]

Epic.

[Erica Alexander]

Epic.

[Kim Coles]

We can't say enough. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, Stacey.

[Erica Alexander]

Thank you, Stacey Abrams.

[Kim Coles]

Thank you, Stacey Abrams. This was so much fun.

[Erica Alexander]

So much fun.

[Kim Coles]

Ooh. Just to learn.

[Erica Alexander]

I learned a lot. We got to love on her and she loved on us. And we get to see why she must be the next president.

[Kim Coles]

That's right. And we're going to also go and support and pre order that book.

[Erica Alexander]

That's right.

[Kim Coles]

And she's going to come back, right?

[Erica Alexander]

She says she's coming back to hang out with us.

[Kim Coles]

She's going to hang out with us.

[Erica Alexander]

Or we're just going to fly to Atlanta, hang out with her.

[Kim Coles]

Maybe both. That would be cool. Do something in Atlanta. Bring Reliving Single to Atlanta.

[Erica Alexander]

Let's take this baby on the road. Okay, so maybe we'll be coming to a town near you. And in the meantime, follow us on all the socials at Reliving Single podcast and listen and Watch us on YouTube, Spotify, Apple Podcasts and everywhere. The places. All the places you get the podcast and we will see you next week with another one and make sure you.

[Kim Coles]

Like and comment and subscribe. Baby, come on. Yeah.

[Erica Alexander]

Yeah.

[Kim Coles]

That's really lifting all the boats. See y' all next week. Reliving Single is hosted by me, Erica Alexander and me, Kim Coles. Reliving Single is a production of Heartbeat in association with Color Farm Media, executive.

[Erica Alexander]

Produced by Kevin Hart, Jeff Clanagan, Eric Eddings, Leslie Guam, Erica Alexander and Ben Arnon.

[Kim Coles]

The show is produced by Kim Coles.

[Erica Alexander]

Amber Watson is our senior senior producer.

[Kim Coles]

Our associate producer is Kenny Jackson.

[Erica Alexander]

Our video editor is Nee Kirschman.

[Kim Coles]

Our sound engineer, Jay John.