← Restaurant Unstoppable with Eric Cacciatore
Restaurant Unstoppable with Eric Cacciatore
1260: Albert Sanchez, Co-Founder of Beto's Mexican Restaurant
01:57:02
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- [00:00]
A
A couple things before we get started today. First, thank you so much for showing up week after week making my vision for restaurants unstoppable come true. Your downloads are allowing me to do this show the way I've always wanted to do it. Boots on the ground, word of mouth, leaders, referring leaders, giving the industry an uncensored, no BS platform to share their perspectives and truth. That's on you. Thank you so much. And we're just getting started. So if you're enjoying what we're doing here and you want to help us do it even better, please subscribe to this podcast on your platform of choice. And if you do that, I promise to do everything in my power to continue to improve the show. I'll deliver the restaurant tours you want to hear from and we'll continue to make everything you love about this show better. Thank you. Welcome to restaurant unstoppable. For 10 years and over 1,000 episodes, I've been traveling the country chasing word of mouth leads and having in person only long form discussions with the industry's finest owners and operators. Our mission is to inspire, empower and transform the restaurant industry by bridging the gap between this generation's leaders and the next. Listen to today's guest and so many others and get one step closer to becoming unstoppable. This episode is in partnership with Giving Kitchen. The restaurant industry takes care of people. That's what we do. But historically we haven't always been great about taking care of our own. That's why I want you to know about Giving Kitchen. They're a national nonprofit supporting food service workers facing real crisis, medical issues, accidents, unexpected hardship. The kind of thing that can really derail a career. Since 2013, they've helped more than 35,000 restaurant workers across the country and awarded over 17 million in financial assistance and stability resources. If you're an operator, chef, or anyone food service, this resource is worth knowing. A lot of restaurants choose a rally around Giving Kitchen because at some point everyone in the business knows someone who needs it. Go to givingkitchen.org to learn more and see how you can be a part of it in your own way. This episode is brought to you by Restaurant Technologies, the leader in automated cooking oil management. Their total oil management solution is an end to end closed loop automated system that delivers, monitors, filters, collects and recycles your cooking oil, eliminating one of the dirtiest jobs in in the kitchen. Restaurant technologies services over 45,000 customers nationwide. Automate your oil and elevate your kitchen by visiting RTI Inc.com or call 888-779-5314 to get started. This episode is made possible by US Foods. Running a successful restaurant takes more than just great food. With US Foods, you can expect more high quality products, advanced tools and flexible deliveries to grow your business. Their industry leading moxy platform also just place your US Foods order. It uses AI to help you take control, save time and increase profitability. Visit usfoods.com expect more to learn how to become a US Foods customer one more time, I.e. us foods.com expect more this episode is made possible by Restaurant Systems Pro and beginning in January 2026, Restaurant Systems Pro is going to be doing a 30 day mastery program. This is valued at $4,000 and if you head over to go.restantsystemspro.netprofits you can for a limited time get this for only $97. But there's an even better deal if you sign up for a Restaurant Unstoppable network by heading to restaurantstoppable.com live. You can get this 30 day mastery program for free when you join the community. And you also get access to this in perpetuity because they're going to be popping it off every month. Go into 20 with all the knowledge and resources and tools you need to be unstoppable in partnership with Restaurant Unstoppable in Restaurant Systems Pro. Again RestaurantUnstoppable.com live join the community. Get access to this training with excitement. Allow me to introduce to you today's guest, co founder of Beto's Mexican Restaurant, Albert Sanchez. My man. Albert, are you feeling unstoppable?
- [04:26]
B
I am Eric. I'm excited to be here.
- [04:27]
A
I'm stoked to be here first and foremost man, thank you so much for being a listener of the show, for joining the community, for being active, reaching out to me, giving me a little inspiration man. Like I'm here because you reached out and you, you brought this topic of Vibe coding onto my radar. And I'm excited for the future because if restaurant owners can develop their own solutions with technology software that's really lowering the bar. So I can't wait to get into know your family history, how you scaled Betos to what it is today, a successful independent mom and pop owned operation and you're also developing your own technology. Like this is a, a a clue of what's to come. What I hope is to come for restaurants across America taking back control of how we do things. So with that being said, I can't wait to dive into your story, to dive into Vibe Coding but let's get that motivational inspirational ball rolling with a success quote or mantra. What do you got for us?
- [05:25]
B
It's simple, Eric. I mean, I've. We didn't share this, but I'm a Jiu Jitsu, Jiu jitsu practitioner of 20 years.
- [05:31]
A
Damn.
- [05:31]
B
And we say embrace the grind. And man, listen, we have a guy that I train with. His name is the hammer. He's about 270 pounds hairy. And when you're. We call it rolling when you're wrestling with somebody, right? And a 270 pound man sweats in your mouth. Everything else that happens in the day is not that bad. Really. Seriously?
- [05:54]
A
Yeah, it's humbling.
- [05:54]
B
It's humbling. Super humbling. So, man, embrace the grind.
- [05:58]
A
Yeah.
- [05:58]
B
Really?
- [05:59]
A
I used to wrestle, man.
- [06:00]
B
Did you really?
- [06:00]
A
Yeah.
- [06:01]
B
Nice.
- [06:01]
A
I actually did. Well wrestling. Yeah, I was. As a sophomore, I think I got second in state for my weight class.
- [06:08]
B
Really?
- [06:09]
A
Yeah.
- [06:09]
B
Well, what, What?
- [06:10]
A
Wait, I was wrestling at 215.
- [06:12]
B
Oh, really?
- [06:12]
A
Yeah.
- [06:13]
B
Dang.
- [06:13]
A
Wrestling's not that popular.
- [06:15]
B
Okay, well, it last back then in Texas. Yeah, it is now.
- [06:18]
A
But I wish I stuck with it, man, because it's such a great sport. You know, wrestling, Jiu Jitsu, very similar. Grappling, pulling, using like, you know, momentum and stuff like that.
- [06:28]
B
What do you weigh now?
- [06:29]
A
I'm at 2. Oh, probably around 200 right now. I got down to 185, but I was 190 when I was wrestling. 215. Yeah, I wrestled up because my coach said I had good hips.
- [06:40]
B
I love it. No, it's great. I love it. I love it. I use it. Not Jiu Jitsu, but the mentality, almost hourly. I can't even say daily, like what part of it.
- [06:51]
A
Like the mentality, man.
- [06:53]
B
Listen, it's a. It's super humbling. And anybody that's done combat sports, in Jiu Jitsu specifically, you'll train five years and you'll be the nail. And if you can overcome that and have that, stick to it. I guess we call it, you know, we make up words in Jiu Jitsu. It. If you can stick with something for five years and you're getting beat up for five years. Not in, you know, not in a mean way, man. That says a lot about your character.
- [07:20]
A
Yeah, you know, it's a fight against yourself. It really is to get better every day and you got to get knocked down a bunch to get better every day.
- [07:26]
B
A lot. Yeah, a lot. Yeah. So that's, that's, you know, I kind of use that universally in business. And in life.
- [07:32]
A
Awesome and great way to get this thing started. So before we dive into your family story and scaling Betos to what it is today, like, where. Where does it. Well, first, like, paint the picture. What is Betos? Mexican restaurant.
- [07:45]
B
So we're independent family, one unit. We've had our ups and downs. We were founded in 1993. Pop started, man. Pop came to Mexico from Mexico back in late 60s and met my mom. I consider myself like the true Tex Mex kid. Moms from the valley area. So the Rio Grande Valley.
- [08:09]
A
Where is that? In Texas.
- [08:10]
B
So anything along the border? Harlingen, McAllen.
- [08:13]
A
Which border? Mexico border?
- [08:14]
B
Yeah, the Texas Mexican border. And came up here probably when I was 3 or 4 years old. Dad was working at a legacy Mexican restaurant. I don't know if you've heard of it. El Chico maybe. Yeah. Really big legacy brand here in Texas. And we just kind of. We grew up in the business.
- [08:32]
A
Are you first generation?
- [08:33]
B
I am.
- [08:33]
A
Nice.
- [08:34]
B
I am so living that American dream. Literally. Literally. And of course, I'm biased when it comes to things. What could be considered political.
- [08:43]
A
I would love to talk about that later, man. Honestly, I think that. Dare I get more political on this podcast? I think we need to start talking politics.
- [08:51]
B
You have to. You can't separate it.
- [08:53]
A
Yeah.
- [08:53]
B
You know, you can't separate it from. From your employees, and you definitely can't separate it from the people walking in your door.
- [09:00]
A
Right.
- [09:00]
B
You know, especially when it comes down to either city politics. And what's funny is that, you know, when I interact with our guests, it's rarely about municipal politics. Right. When those people impact our days, I mean, they impact us every day.
- [09:15]
A
Right.
- [09:16]
B
You know, parks and rec, your police. But yet here we are talking about big government.
- [09:20]
A
Right.
- [09:21]
B
You know, so you can't separate it, especially when you're a mom and pop.
- [09:24]
A
And that's where the conversation should be. In our own backyard.
- [09:27]
B
100.
- [09:27]
A
But we don't have. We don't get together and talk to our neighbors anymore. We're not talking about what's happening in the neighborhood. We're talking about what's happening on a national level, which is also important. It is, but it starts at home.
- [09:38]
B
It does. It should start at home. Right. And unfortunately, I think the people walking in the doors that are your patrons are talking to you as the owner or the manager, but they're not talking to their neighbors.
- [09:49]
A
So it's kind of what's really scary, man. Just for fun, start asking people how many people live around you? Like, how many people live like you know, in your. Like, literally that border your home and then ask them if they know the names of those people.
- [10:05]
B
Oh, yeah.
- [10:05]
A
That's scary.
- [10:06]
B
That's scary. That's gonna be low.
- [10:07]
A
Yeah, man. Where are we going with this conversation?
- [10:10]
B
We already got sidetracked.
- [10:11]
A
But give me a snapshot of what Betos is in terms of how many seats do you guys have?
- [10:15]
B
About 200. No, about 180. I would save. With the full house open seven days a week. We shifted our hours. You were not a Chili's. We're not looking for. You know, people say, like to me specifically, like, hey, why don't you stay open later? Or why don't you open earlier to, you know, to bring in more revenue? Man, at this stage in my career, that's not the only goal. Right, right. I mean, the goal is, you know, not just for me, but for everybody that works for us to kind of have that, you know, it sounds cliche, man, to have that, you know, work life balance, man. Really? Seriously.
- [10:51]
A
Well, it's important. In terms of numbers, where you guys doing?
- [10:54]
B
You know, I really talk about just like top sales line, but I would. I will be vulnerable and tell you that, man, we're definitely underachieving 100.
- [11:02]
A
What is the. The. What would the achieving number be for you?
- [11:05]
B
What's this location? I mean, you should be around 3 million a year. I mean, that's what we should be. And we're definitely underachieving, not just from our own expectations, but from benchmarking, because we. We see what's going on in. In terms of aggregated data from toast, Right. I don't know if you know that, but if you subscribe to the benchmarking on toast, you can see aggregated where you fall in between. Now, I will say that the Dallas Fort Worth is a little unique, right? Yeah.
- [11:31]
A
So are you being compared national, like nationwide? In your market?
- [11:35]
B
In your market, yeah.
- [11:36]
A
But you don't see the other names of the restaurants.
- [11:38]
B
No. And it's an aggregate. Right. So you don't see it. But I mean, who are we around? Right. So if Uncle Julio's or one of these national or regional brands doing $7 million a year, that's who you're getting compared to. Right. So I don't say that as making an excuse, but, you know, when Covet hit one of our largest employers, which is Lockheed Martin, they didn't go back to work in the office. And probably not.
- [12:07]
A
When you're saying in this. In this neighborhood, you have Lockheed, is that your.
- [12:10]
B
Yeah. So on Pioneer Parkway I mean, I know you're not familiar with it, but just, you know, three miles down the road this way, south of us, they didn't go back to the office every day. You know, they're two days a week.
- [12:20]
A
Right.
- [12:21]
B
And they're 5,000 people in that plant.
- [12:24]
A
Yeah.
- [12:24]
B
So it's going to, it's going to impact your lunch sales.
- [12:28]
A
Yeah. Are you operating in the block?
- [12:29]
B
Oh, yeah. 100%. Yeah. We're fortunate.
- [12:31]
A
Yeah. So like, two. Two digits.
- [12:34]
B
Oh, yeah, easy.
- [12:35]
A
So like, 10% profit more. So 15% profit more. You're doing over 15 profits.
- [12:42]
B
Yes.
- [12:42]
A
And you're doing less than 3 million in revenue.
- [12:44]
B
Yes.
- [12:44]
A
More than 2.5 million.
- [12:46]
B
No, no, no, no, no, no. We are, we are probably around the. I would say half of where we need to be in terms of revenue.
- [12:56]
A
1.5. Yeah, 1.5. And you're making 20. Close to 20. Profit.
- [13:02]
B
Close. I would. So, yeah.
- [13:03]
A
You know, you're not doing well.
- [13:05]
B
We're unique too. Right. So, you know, I listen to a lot of people on your podcast and I hear these huge numbers, and you're like, okay, well, that's great. I don't think that's necessarily all restaurants. Right. I think that that's. They're kind of the purple cows, if you will.
- [13:22]
A
Or they, they have, you know, models that are super volume.
- [13:29]
B
Exactly.
- [13:30]
A
Well, to your point, man, there's more. I think part of what I'm trying to do with this podcast, like, I could go chase celebrity chefs and, you know, I could just subscribe to every industry magazine and upcycle what other people are saying. You know, I think generally speaking, journalism, media is lazy, and I'm, I'm trying to find people doing different things, but also, like, you're an old brand. You've been around for how long? 30 years?
- [13:57]
B
32 years.
- [13:58]
A
32 years. But even just walking around, like, you're staying updated, your technology is updated, you know, like, you're, you're, you're evolving with the times. But more importantly to your. Like, you're saying, like, what matters to me is work, life, balance.
- [14:10]
B
Sure.
- [14:11]
A
And I, you know, I think we need to redefine what is success? What is being the best? Is it maximizing revenue? Is it maximizing locations, or is it maximizing lifestyle? Community. You just said it, you know, like, what? Like, who are. Like, success is relative, and I recognize that. So I, I intentionally get different voices on the show. I just had Velvet Taco on the show, you know, like, one of the most recognized taco brands in the nation, scaling to I think they're at 56 locations right now. That's one perspective. You know, we can learn a lot from those people, but we can also learn a lot from, from the Betos of the world.
- [14:52]
B
Oh, yeah. You know, no, no, no, I'm not going in that direction. I promise you that.
- [14:55]
A
Yeah. And it's intentional. I want to make sure we hear all the perspectives, and I don't want
- [14:59]
B
to give the misconception of you like, hey, we're, we're 20% in the black. Yeah, yeah, we are. But we own this building.
- [15:06]
A
Right.
- [15:06]
B
We 25 years paying off this building. So if we had a landlord, I'm
- [15:11]
A
sure this is a seven figure building.
- [15:13]
B
It is. We, it was a seven figure building 25 years ago.
- [15:17]
A
Right.
- [15:17]
B
When we built it. Right, right. So I don't want the listeners like, oh, wow, they have this 5,400 square foot building off the highway. And yeah, we paid it off over 25, 22 and a half years or whatever the, the, the table was. But I don't, I don't think we could, I don't think I could say that if we had a landlord.
- [15:37]
A
Right. The only reason why I asked this question in the beginning, one, I want my listener to know who we're talking to. So when they're early in the interview, they know what kind of interview it's going to be in terms of is this person doing something similar to what I'm doing. But also, I think it's important to share the benchmarks. Yeah, we don't talk about numbers in this industry. I think that's what gets us in trouble.
- [15:54]
B
Yeah.
- [15:54]
A
So I'm trying to break that stigma. You know, we need to talk about numbers. We need to be open. We need to share, like, what is possible with different business models. So you know what you're getting into, you know what good targets are. You know, I think all that's really important.
- [16:07]
B
It is, it is. Like I shared with you earlier, I'm like, either you're embarrassed about your numbers, right. One of the best seminars that I went to and I think a lot of time, especially in the industry, right. It's like, how much do you sell? And when you walk into that room, that kind of puts your status. And, you know, in wrestling and jiu jitsu, man, if you walk in in shorts and a shirt, all that matters is when you're on the mat, right? And here I think with, in seminars and the, one of the best seminars that ever went to, there was no tag, so it didn't say I was from X Brand, so there was this. No, there wasn't a hierarchy, so nobody felt like there were stupid questions. And it was one of the best interview or seminars that I've ever gone to. It was a US Food. Like, they have a US Food show.
- [16:54]
A
Dude, I did not plant that, did I?
- [16:57]
B
No, I.
- [16:58]
A
US Foods is a sponsor.
- [16:59]
B
Okay, perfect. Yeah.
- [17:00]
A
And it's because I've. I've heard testimonials like this over and over again.
- [17:05]
B
Yeah.
- [17:05]
A
And I actively sought out US Foods. I was like, people are saying good things. If I wanted to have ads on my show, I wanted to be the company that's doing good work. So keep on going along that line.
- [17:14]
B
Yeah. And it was one of the best seminars that I've ever been to. And I didn't. Especially younger in my career. Right. And I just, you know, it's kind of hard to go in and let's just say I'm Albert at Betos with one unit.
- [17:24]
A
Yeah.
- [17:24]
B
And then next to me is Velvet taco with 100.
- [17:27]
A
Yeah.
- [17:28]
B
Well, then you're Autumn. Especially when you're younger in the industry. Right. You're like, well, whatever question that I say, it's gonna be dumb compared to what he says.
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A
Right.
- [17:36]
B
So then you just keep quiet.
- [17:37]
A
Yeah.
- [17:37]
B
Right. But if he's not wearing a name tag and I'm not wearing a name tag, then we're just two humans in a room trying to learn.
- [17:43]
A
Yeah.
- [17:44]
B
And it was just. It was literally one of the best seminars that I've ever. And it was intentional.
- [17:47]
A
Yeah.
- [17:48]
B
That's why they did that.
- [17:48]
A
And it was this. The seminar. What was it called? How long ago?
- [17:52]
B
It was a management seminar. And I don't exactly.
- [17:54]
A
Was it recently?
- [17:55]
B
No, you know, they don't really do as many of those. You know, they still do their food shows.
- [17:59]
A
Well there. So I. I asked. Because this. On this road trip, I'm making my way back to Washington, D.C. okay. To attend the U. S. Foods immersion event.
- [18:08]
B
I think it was in Vegas last year. Right.
- [18:09]
A
Well, that was the. The. Their big. I think they do that, like, every few years.
- [18:15]
B
Okay.
- [18:15]
A
Like, they're big. What the heck was it? What do they call that event? I should know. Sorry. U.S. foods. It was a great event. I was there. Yeah. U.S. foods fanatics. And that's like their big. Like. And that was a blast. I mean, that was a party. They throw a party, dude.
- [18:29]
B
Yeah.
- [18:29]
A
Like, that was fun. But this is a smaller immersion event.
- [18:32]
B
Okay. Days.
- [18:33]
A
And it's gonna be. And they do it, like, in different cities all across so I'm actually collaborating with you as and I'm going to be traveling to these immersion events and they're helping me connect with their like in their opinion, like some of their, their most influential, best operators.
- [18:49]
B
Okay. Yes.
- [18:50]
A
That's cool.
- [18:51]
B
They do a good job on that.
- [18:51]
A
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Super grateful to have those foods as a sponsor. So you were talking about this immersion event. People are sharing numbers and it was one of the best experiences. What was your train of thought from there?
- [19:04]
B
I don't know. What were we talking about?
- [19:05]
A
Sorry. We can go anywhere. So you started also tell me about your dad's story.
- [19:09]
B
Yeah.
- [19:09]
A
Before. And I kind of cut you short to kind of understand. Better get a picture of what Bedos is today. So kind of pick up there we left off.
- [19:16]
B
So, dad, none of the brands that anybody will probably know unless they're really owed. So there's a brand that just kind of went out of business during COVID called Palitos. Back in the late 70s, there was a really nice kind of upscale Mexican restaurant in Arlington, not too far from Jerry World. Right. And my dad started there kind of as a assistant manager and kind of moved his way up. Unfortunately, that one went out of business. The Paleto's family kind of hired my dad and then from then on, my brother and I, from the age of. And I'm not exaggerating, 8.
- [19:50]
A
That's when I started my parents, I
- [19:51]
B
mean, washing dishes, just whatever, it didn't matter, you know, whatever.
- [19:55]
A
Taking that school bus after work.
- [19:56]
B
Exactly. Whatever my dad needed. That's what we did. Right. And I look back on, I was having this conversation with somebody and I'm like, man, I look back on it and like my dad would put me in dishwasher, my dad would put me on the line. I'm like, I'm 14, you know, and I look back on it now and I think it was all with intent. What was that intention, man? One for sure. If you knew my dad, that intent was, man, listen, you got to work in life and you got to do everything else and you can't complain about it. Right? And I'm not saying that was the right way. I'm just saying that it was his way and I wouldn't change. Like looking back as a 52 year old man, father of three, I wouldn't change one thing. Yeah, not one. I mean there's literally not one thing in this restaurant that I can't do right now. I might not do it as well as my cook or my dishwasher, but I know how to do it.
- [20:50]
A
Yeah.
- [20:50]
B
Right. And without my dad just kind of doing that, I don't know if that would be the case.
- [20:55]
A
Right. And did you ever work anywhere else?
- [20:58]
B
No, I worked for my. Well, my dad was manager at Polito's.
- [21:01]
A
Yeah.
- [21:01]
B
And I worked there. I don't want to break any laws, but I think he was probably at. Honestly around 8, 7.
- [21:08]
A
There's no. Well, if it's your. If you're the owner.
- [21:11]
B
Okay. Well, he was. And he was just a manager.
- [21:13]
A
I don't know how it works with, like, your own kids working, but if you're the owner, there's no, like, you're allowed to have your kids working there.
- [21:18]
B
So until I graduated 19, and then that's when we started. My dad and I started Betos. So that wasn't the plan.
- [21:27]
A
So you started as a partner?
- [21:29]
B
Yeah. So no. Yeah, I did, but that was not the plan.
- [21:32]
A
What was the plan?
- [21:33]
B
The plan was my dad always wanted his own restaurant.
- [21:36]
A
Yeah.
- [21:38]
B
And when you're growing up, you're young, you don't know what you want to be. And if the restaurants all you've ever been, man, just being young, you want to do something different. So that was not my plan.
- [21:47]
A
What do you want to do,
- [21:51]
B
man? Probably something in computers, if I'm being honest.
- [21:53]
A
Well, that's the cool thing about this industry, dude. Is that, like, there is something to do with computers.
- [21:59]
B
Oh, absolutely. Yeah.
- [22:00]
A
You know, like, they, like, a restaurant encompasses so many unique skill set.
- [22:04]
B
But you didn't at 19 in 1993. No, no, that's. That's not. I mean, anybody would tell you, right? I'm going to merge the two in 2026.
- [22:13]
A
Yeah.
- [22:14]
B
No.
- [22:14]
A
Yeah. This episode is in partnership with Giving Kitchen. Restaurants run on tight margins and even tighter teams. Anyone who's been in the business long enough knows one injury, one diagnosis in one family emergency can take a great employee out overnight. That's where Giving Kitchen comes in. Giving Kitchen is a national nonprofit that supports food service workers in crisis. They provide emergency financial assistance and connect workers to resources like housing support, counseling, and physical and mental health appointments. Not someday, but when it's actually needed. Since 2013, they've helped more than 35,000 food service workers and awarded over 17 million in support nationwide. This isn't the. It's cooks, dishwashers, bartenders, and servers being able to keep their apartment, get access to mental health resources, or cover bills when recovering from an injury. Operators keep Giving Kitchen bookmarked, not just in case they ever need it, but because they want their staff to know it exists. If you're in the industry, this is an organization you should know about. Learn more, share it with your team and find a way your restaurant can stand alongside the work@givingkitchen.org this episode is brought to you by Restaurant Technologies, the leader in automated cooking oil management. Unstoppable restaurant ownership owners know which services to keep in house and which services to outsource. And oil management is one of those things you should outsource. Their total oil management solution is an end to end closed loop automated system that delivers, monitors, filters, collects and recycles your cooking oil, eliminating one of the dirtiest jobs in the kitchen. Create a more efficient food service operation and ensure consistent food quality with a safer, smarter and sustainable cooking oil solution. Restaurant technology services over 45,000 thousand customers nationwide, including countless past guests on the show. Automate your oil and elevate your kitchen by visiting RTI hyphen inc.com or call 888-779-5314 to get started at that point. When you're 19, are you just all in the business? Is this.
- [24:20]
B
Yeah. You know, just because my mom had a government job and just, you know, with the benefits and the retirement, there's just, there was no way that she could leave that. My brother was off in unt doing his thing and, and I was planning to join him. Literally. The story that you read on the website, it's 100% true and accurate. I even registered to go and I was gonna, and we had put a deposit down on an apartment together, my brother and I, and then just, I'm like, man, I can't leave pops. I can't, you know, stay for a semester, help them out. And then it led to two and then a year and then two years and then, hey, we got a little, we got a little traction. Yeah. You're like, hey, what was it like
- [25:02]
A
in the early years when it was tough? So you were 19. 19 when he opened in Betos.
- [25:06]
B
Yeah.
- [25:07]
A
And just out of high school, hadn't gone to college yet. You're working here, the family's working here. Or is it just you and your dad?
- [25:14]
B
No, just me and my dad.
- [25:16]
A
Did you like it?
- [25:17]
B
No, no, no. Yeah, I like the restaurant. I love the restaurant industry. It's not fun being 19 and your friends are in either college and going out to the bars.
- [25:29]
A
Yeah.
- [25:30]
B
And you're man, there was one time, Eric, we were open from 7am to 9pm and we sold $50. Wow. That's not fun at any age. No. Much less at 19. And then you just don't have the maturity level to, to kind of see beyond 20, 21, 22, 23. Yeah, man, I'm telling you, my pops, man, just, there's, there's no quit in that, man. Really. And to say he was inspirational is, you know, not doing it. Service.
- [25:59]
A
Dive more into the character of your pops, man.
- [26:01]
B
Listen, I was having a conversation. So there is. And not to get too political, right. I'm. I pick up my son, my wife takes to my, takes my son to school, my high schooler, every day. She picks them up on Monday, Grandma. My mom picks them up through Thursday and I pick him up on Friday, Right. So I'm picking up from school from Friday and there's a protest right there at the corner and it's abolished ice. And I intentionally came back the way that I saw those young adults, right. They're 15 to what, 18 and whatever. And I just wanted to get his thoughts. And of course I said earlier that I'm biased and I. Whether he knew it or not, I know we've talked about it. I don't know if he remembered it, but my dad came to this country at the age of 14 by himself. And if that doesn't say enough about a man's character, I don't know what else could and would. So you got a man that came to this.
- [27:03]
A
I'm just trying to wrap my mind around 14 years old. What the hell was I doing at 14 years old? I was a freshman in high school.
- [27:09]
B
I've just picked up a 16 year old sophomore that's still not driving.
- [27:12]
A
Yeah.
- [27:12]
B
And this man came to America and he didn't speak the language at the age of 14. Yeah. And the conversation was way wider than just, you know, let's pet grandpa in the back. But that is the definition of, of who he is. Yeah.
- [27:30]
A
So you drove by this, these, these folks.
- [27:35]
B
Young adults.
- [27:36]
A
Yeah, young adults. And what was, what were you trying
- [27:39]
B
to super proud here? And that really the, the reason that struck with me so what I tried to instill in him was like, listen. And I asked him this, I'm like, hey, it was a big thing around the city because they walked out of school during school to do this.
- [27:55]
A
Yeah.
- [27:57]
B
And I'm like, do you think that that little protest is going to make a difference? Difference? And he said no. And I'm like, I agree. I said, but you know what will is that train of thought.
- [28:07]
A
What difference are you trying to say? Like what a difference in protecting people
- [28:11]
B
that are like, no, no. Like, so all Their signs said abolish ICE.
- [28:15]
A
Yeah.
- [28:16]
B
And I'm like, because, you know, 100 kids from, I'm not going to say the school out loud, but 100 kids from this school have signs saying Abolish ICE. And that's the goal for them. Right. Is that gonna work? And he said, no. And I'm like, what do you do? You know that what will work if you take that same philosophy and you, you protest respectfully and you vote and then you can make change in the world. And that's what I was trying to make him understand. And I was super proud of those kids. I wouldn't have walked out of school. Right. But super proud of them for, for expressing themselves and trying to make a change in the world.
- [28:53]
A
Yeah, yeah. You know, it's, it's, it's really exciting. You know, like, I wasn't doing protests when I was 14, 15, 16, 17 years old. I'm really excited for the future of this country because of the next generation coming in.
- [29:06]
B
Yeah. I think it make a difference.
- [29:07]
A
It's always the, the, that generation, the, the teenagers that they literally are our future. But in terms of the, the culture, you know, like, they were the first to adopt social media and to really get that going. And, but now what's going on is that generation is the really starting to unplug. They're choosing to not be on social media. They're choosing to do analog things because we're, it's just a really, like the fact that that's cool. The fact that getting involved in politics as a teenager is a thing like
- [29:38]
B
that's, you know what the irony is there?
- [29:40]
A
What's that?
- [29:42]
B
That, that protest, if you will, for a lack of a better term, was organized on social media. That's the irony.
- [29:50]
A
Yeah. So the ability to get organized into.
- [29:53]
B
The ability to get organized requires technology and social media. And in your age and my age and, you know, I didn't grow up with a cell phone, you know, can you, can you do that without today's technology? And, and I don't know if you can. Maybe you can, you can do it
- [30:08]
A
with a WhatsApp account, you know.
- [30:10]
B
Yeah.
- [30:10]
A
You know, or a text thread.
- [30:11]
B
There, there is in lies the irony.
- [30:13]
A
Right.
- [30:13]
B
You know, as they're unplugging, but they need to plug in to do what they just did.
- [30:18]
A
Yeah. And I think that there's, I mean, we're going way down a rabbit hole now, but I think there's one thing to use technology to communicate, it's another thing that we all use the Same platform. You know, if everyone's using the same platform to communicate, I think that that just gives way too much power to one platform. So like, to your point with, well,
- [30:40]
B
let's see, that's a segue to what
- [30:41]
A
we're going to be talking about today, which is, you know, we, we're getting to a point where the technology is advancing, where we can create our own thing. And I think we have to be intentional about fragmenting those platforms.
- [30:51]
B
I agree.
- [30:52]
A
And breaking up the power.
- [30:53]
B
100.
- [30:54]
A
But teaser before continue down your story. Dad, 14 years old, comes here. You guys open this restaurant. You're 19 years old. What was it like growing up in the family restaurant or like starting your young career in the family restaurant? Did, did you ever get over that resentment?
- [31:11]
B
It sounds like 100%. I tell everybody there was a lot of resentment. And I, it, it probably stayed with me into my early 20s. And I think you just got to be you. You just have to have some life experiences and especially when you start to have kids.
- [31:27]
A
When did it start to change for you?
- [31:29]
B
20. I mean, it's, it's going to sound superficial, but when, when we started experiencing some level of success.
- [31:38]
A
And how long did that take?
- [31:40]
B
Not very long. It felt like a long time. Early twenties, I'll give you. So I was nineteen. So that was 1993 when we opened. In 2002, we built our first 1.2 million dollar restaurant.
- [31:56]
A
Wow. So this isn't the original location.
- [31:59]
B
No, no, no, no.
- [32:00]
A
Yeah. So almost 10 years. Nine years. From 1993 to 2002 you said for this place.
- [32:07]
B
Right, right.
- [32:08]
A
But when did you start having that success?
- [32:10]
B
Early on. Yeah. You know, we, so this, we own other buildings too that we were at, and we're just landlords now. Right. But within three, like I said, we opened up in 1993. And I don't know if you saw that picture, but it was a hole in the wall.
- [32:23]
A
Yeah.
- [32:23]
B
I mean, literally 11 tables.
- [32:27]
A
Yeah.
- [32:27]
B
You know, and then within three years, we're building a $1.2 million building.
- [32:32]
A
Within three years?
- [32:33]
B
Within. So 1993, we built Pioneer, started Pioneer 1997. So five years.
- [32:39]
A
Wow. So what was the secret to that success?
- [32:42]
B
Ignorance. And I mean that in the most positive way. Listen, trying not to come off a certain way when you're young and you're, you're dumb, literally, and you don't know any better.
- [32:58]
A
Well, ignorant means you just don't.
- [33:00]
B
Literally dumb. You just don't. But people use it in different ways. So when I say it, I want it to be.
- [33:04]
A
I use the word ignorant all the time.
- [33:06]
B
I want it to be received.
- [33:07]
A
Define it like it's not stupid. Right.
- [33:09]
B
I want it to be received. You don't know. Right.
- [33:11]
A
Yeah.
- [33:12]
B
How was that guy? You know, full of drive. I think my definition of success was a little off.
- [33:21]
A
What was your definition of money?
- [33:22]
B
Yeah, it was, you know, nice car.
- [33:25]
A
Yep.
- [33:26]
B
You're not married. You don't have kids. Your compass is a little off. And of course, you see nice things and you want nice things and the only way to really sometimes. And superficial things, to be honest. But how do you get them? Money. Right, Right. So you just. You get super focused and you don't know. So you're not going to college. You're not in. You're an mba. You don't say, hey, you go to a bank and you do this, and you just find a way. And we found ways, and we found very unorth orthodox ways.
- [34:00]
A
Yeah. There's something about that frontal lobe. Ma', am, if you. I think that's. Ignorance is bliss if you don't know how hard it's going to be.
- [34:08]
B
But if you did know, you wouldn't try it.
- [34:10]
A
Right?
- [34:11]
B
Exactly. That's my point.
- [34:12]
A
And, like, you just figure it out. But if you. If you think it's possible, if you're ignorant enough to think it's possible, you will figure it out. You will find a way.
- [34:20]
B
100%.
- [34:21]
A
Because that frontal lobe just tries to look. It looks for opportunity. It looks to solve problems. And like you. If you say it's not possible, then your frontal lobe is, like, sick. I'm clocking out.
- [34:35]
B
And we can get into some of the unique deals that, that we did if you want to. But the, The, The. The gist of it is they weren't. They weren't conventional at all.
- [34:43]
A
Yeah. Let's get into some of those examples.
- [34:44]
B
Okay. I'll give you a perfect example. So when we bought Pioneer Parkway, so it's not too far from here. Right. We didn't have the money. Like, so you go buy a piece of land.
- [34:52]
A
Yeah.
- [34:52]
B
And at the time, I think it was just a little bit under an acre. I think it was like 0.9 of an acre. And it was about roughly a couple hundred grand, give or take. So then I go to a friend's mom, and I'm like, hey, are you willing to. Literally, I'm not. I'm 21. Are you willing to pull money out of your IRA and I'll pay the penalty and I'll end up paying you back more than what you took out in the penalty. And she says, yes.
- [35:21]
A
Wow.
- [35:21]
B
We buy the property. So now you have. You don't have. In other words, she became an investor. So it's not debt. So you can go to the bank. It's like, hey, we have this equity. You wait a year, property appreciates. Now you have that much more in equity and you can go to the bank and you can build your nice building. Yeah, we built up. We bought a property on. I know you know the area, but on Main Street. I'm 21. Maybe.
- [35:53]
A
Is your name on this property at this point?
- [35:55]
B
Yeah. Oh, yeah.
- [35:56]
A
So you're building wealth at a young age.
- [35:57]
B
Very.
- [35:58]
A
Yeah.
- [35:58]
B
But you don't listen. That's not the goal. At 21, you're not thinking about building wealth.
- [36:04]
A
Well, somebody was thinking about, I think your dad and your.
- [36:06]
B
No, no, no, no, no. So it was, it was just not to. I'm not doing anything other than just kind of being factual. Right. But I promise you, it was not about building wealth. It was about Monopoly money. That's what it was. When you're 21, 22. I own that. I own that. I own that. Yeah. And it, you know, I'd love to say that. Hey, Eric, I'm building general generational wealth and. No, it wasn't.
- [36:28]
A
How many properties all in is your three owned today?
- [36:30]
B
Three.
- [36:30]
A
Three. All valued over. Over seven figures.
- [36:33]
B
No. One, Two? No. Well, it depends on the market. Main Street? I don't think so. Yeah, no, I mean, three quarters maybe.
- [36:39]
A
Well, I think this is a big part of the game of the restaurant industry is. Is owning the real estate hunter.
- [36:45]
B
You know, they used to say that you shouldn't.
- [36:47]
A
They used to say that?
- [36:48]
B
Yeah.
- [36:49]
A
Why?
- [36:49]
B
Well, because if. Let's just say we spent. Let's just numbers, right? Let's say it costs two and a half million, three million to do this 20 years ago. Now take that three million. And how much equity do you have into a project that's 3 million. You could arguably have a half a million dollars into a three million dollar project. Well, how many end caps could you open with? $500,000. Now, again, we're going back 20 years ago. You could open maybe two end caps. Three end caps. So they would say that at least when I would read. Would read, hey, you're in the restaurant business. Stay in your lane and don't get into the real estate business. Yeah, but you're young. You don't listen.
- [37:31]
A
Right. That's another thing to keep in mind is like you're opening up a whole Nother can of worms, 100%. It's a whole other business.
- [37:37]
B
It is.
- [37:38]
A
So. But, you know, like, that's why you. That's one of the reasons why I take so many perspectives and I share so many different stories because you have to figure out which path makes sense for you. Are you somebody who would. Would be fantastic at managing a giant portfolio and you're just investing in real estate and you become like, that's your play. And you're using your restaurant business to just fill the void in those. Those properties and creating opportunity for other people. Some of the most successful, I think of Jay McSherry out of Portsmouth, New Hampshire. He started jumping Jays, has success, and then got into real estate. Doesn't really, like, he still is involved in the restaurants where, like, he'll talk to his partners and, like, strategize, but he's in the game of buying up great restaurant real estate and then using his restaurant machine, Jay's group, to find the next partner. People Cream rises to the top. He finds these people and he says, what do you want to do? I have a location.
- [38:35]
B
Yeah.
- [38:35]
A
And then that just grows. But he's managing properties. That. That's.
- [38:39]
B
That's his new.
- [38:40]
A
I had a guess.
- [38:40]
B
Yeah.
- [38:41]
A
That's his angle.
- [38:41]
B
Yeah.
- [38:42]
A
And that works.
- [38:43]
B
It does.
- [38:43]
A
That doesn't work for everybody. Maybe you're an amazing chef. You know, maybe your thing is creating food and you find that partner that has the real estate and then he doubled down and he helps. Like, you're just creating great concepts. That. That's your thing. There's a million and one different paths to take this industry. There is no one path. And it's infuriating when you're trying to figure out, like, what is the secret? There is no secret.
- [39:07]
B
There is no secret. Yeah.
- [39:08]
A
To your point, it's ignorance.
- [39:09]
B
It is. Yeah. You know, but when you get older, you get a little cynical. Right. You know, do you have kids?
- [39:15]
A
No.
- [39:15]
B
No. So when they're young listeners. I don't know, 5. Can I have a piece of candy? No. Have a piece of candy? No. And they just, they break you down. They don't know any better. Right. They just keep asking and asking. And I think when you're young in business, you kind of do the same thing. Yeah. And if you, you know, if you meet the right people, they can introduce you to the right people. And I think ultimately, though, Erica, it's going to come down to, like, if we're talking right now and like, if I'm holding the key to some level of Success. And I used it just as a kind of a term. Right. That person's reading your character. And I think that's a lot of it from just my dad and our family, them reading us and like, okay, listen, if it doesn't work out, this, this family is going to do the best they can to make sure to make it right. And I think that ultimately what it comes down to. Yeah.
- [40:05]
A
So take us along. Your. Your evolution. So in your time. How old are you today? 50.
- [40:10]
B
52.
- [40:11]
A
52. So we got 30 years to cover.
- [40:12]
B
Yeah.
- [40:13]
A
Take me through your growth as a restaurant tour.
- [40:15]
B
So in. Opened up in 1993, one unit. Then we opened up Main Street. We bought the property.
- [40:21]
A
All beos.
- [40:22]
B
All betos. Yeah.
- [40:24]
A
Sorry.
- [40:25]
B
Probably open that in 19.
- [40:26]
A
In my mind. I've been calling it that's okay. For the past like three months.
- [40:29]
B
So like opened up our second location in 1997, 1998. We had. So we were multi unit, two locations. And then the, you know, the Albert engine, you know, the gear started turning. So that's when we bought the property that I was just talking about the Albert engine. Early on in the career into to this date, it's. It's kind of the same. It just. The. The gears don't stop, man.
- [40:55]
A
Yeah.
- [40:56]
B
You know, like, I might not be here physically, but I'm. I'm thinking of something.
- [41:00]
A
Yeah.
- [41:01]
B
And it just, it doesn't stop.
- [41:02]
A
And when did this, when did this Albert engine get primed?
- [41:06]
B
Birth. Yeah. I think you just are who you are, man. You know?
- [41:09]
A
So at this point in your career, do you start building the layers between you and the work where you're trying to like remove yourself from the day to day and you're absolutely on the business.
- [41:17]
B
Yeah.
- [41:17]
A
So when did that happen for you?
- [41:19]
B
When did you start working on this, man? Probably when I met my wife. Okay.
- [41:23]
A
And how long ago is that?
- [41:24]
B
It's been about 20 years.
- [41:25]
A
Okay. You know, so the mid 2000s, give or take.
- [41:29]
B
Yeah. Yeah.
- [41:31]
A
And you would have been at this point a seven year seasoned veteran restaurant tour.
- [41:36]
B
Well, seven year veteran. Yeah. I don't know about the season part. Yeah.
- [41:39]
A
But so you're seven years in your family, owns two properties.
- [41:43]
B
Three.
- [41:43]
A
Three properties at this point. In three betos.
- [41:46]
B
Correct.
- [41:46]
A
And now you're. What's going on in your mind? Like, what are you. Like, what is your intention? What is your vision at this point in your life?
- [41:55]
B
So it's been a, it's been a work in progress. You know, as you start to have kids and especially with the younger Two. And, you know, you miss a lot of stuff. Any listener that owns their own mom and pop can. Can. Can relate. Right. You miss a lot of stuff. And as you get older and you're like, man, I gotta. I gotta do better. Yeah. In terms with doing that balance. Right. So, you know, I think a big part of it is. Is your internal ego. Like, sometimes we think we're too valuable, and then you don't want anybody else to run your store. You're so. You're so invested emotionally in your baby. Right. And you just got to start building people and trusting them, man. I mean, that's. That's the name of the game.
- [42:37]
A
Yeah.
- [42:37]
B
And that's where I am today.
- [42:38]
A
That's what we're in the business of, is developing people, creating opportunity for people,
- [42:41]
B
you know, and you got to develop people. And, you know, I've. I've listened to your podcast for a while, and, you know, if. Here's the way that I think of it, you know, I don't know if we will open up another unit. I don't think so. And yet people still need to be developed. They really do. So it's my goal now. And I tell them, like, if you're amazing, if Eric's my employee and you're amazing. I know that. And I don't want you with me forever. That's selfish. Right. But listen, let's.
- [43:11]
A
You're holding them back.
- [43:11]
B
I'm holding you back. Right. So here's what we're gonna do. I'm gonna give whatever I have into you, and then you're gonna take that, and you're gonna either do your own thing or you're gonna make somebody else a message. Amazing.
- [43:23]
A
Yeah.
- [43:23]
B
And I think if you're upfront with that conversation, you kind of. You have this level of transparency with. With your key employees, and then a
- [43:31]
A
percentage of those people go on to make you amazing.
- [43:35]
B
I hope so.
- [43:36]
A
Like, you can go on do your own thing, or you can go make somebody else amazing.
- [43:39]
B
Yeah.
- [43:39]
A
Or because we've started and established this relationship of, I'm here to serve you the law of. I always struggle. I always try to say this word, and I always suck. That saying this word reciprocity. The law will. It says that it will come back around. You can't track it, but you just have to have faith, feel it. That if you give out, if you give. If you give, give, give. If you exhale, the next thing that happens is an inhale.
- [44:05]
B
I think there's a selfish part of it, too, and I. It feels Good it feel, you know, you want to feel good about yourself. Right. And then there's a selfish part aspect of that too. But, man, if it benefits both parties, I don't think it can be that bad.
- [44:18]
A
Yeah.
- [44:19]
B
Honestly.
- [44:19]
A
Yeah. So one thing I am curious about and you know, these are the kind of questions I asked when I first started the podcast. I really wanted to get to, like, how did you grow? How did you evolve as an operator, go from 1 to 2, 2 to 3? I mean, opening a restaurant is one thing.
- [44:32]
B
Sure.
- [44:32]
A
Scaling to it seems like three units gets the point where that's like a firewall for a lot of people.
- [44:37]
B
Yeah.
- [44:38]
A
So you guys got to three units. Now you only have one.
- [44:43]
B
Correct.
- [44:44]
A
Betos, that is operating.
- [44:45]
B
Correct.
- [44:47]
A
Why didn't you continue?
- [44:48]
B
Well, you hit that wall. Right. And if you listen, when you're young, you're ignorant and that can play in your benefit and it can hurt you as well. Right. So I, you know, looking back, if you don't have SOPs, you're going to be in trouble. Yeah.
- [45:05]
A
Is that where you guys are at?
- [45:07]
B
Well, that's where we failed, I think. You know, if you're looking at, hey, Betos had three and you're just looking at numbers and now they have one
- [45:14]
A
still just you and your dad. As far as owners.
- [45:16]
B
No, no. By the time three. Oh, yeah, Owners. Yeah. But I'm talking if you have three locations, you got employees, managers, keys, all this stuff. But what we didn't have were a set of SOPs. Yeah.
- [45:26]
A
And this wasn't like mid 2000.
- [45:27]
B
This is mid 2000.
- [45:28]
A
This is still like, you know, this is around the time where information becomes abundant.
- [45:33]
B
Right.
- [45:34]
A
So not everybody had that information. Like restaurant owner.com was around at that point. Great resource. But there wasn't a lot of places to go to get.
- [45:43]
B
I can't honestly. Was restaurantowner.com around?
- [45:46]
A
I think they started in like the late 90s, early 2000s.
- [45:49]
B
Okay. When they started, it was, it was a very. In terms of technology and being things being cloud based, man. I can't think of a resource that I touched other than you're like, you're used food service rep and you're going to these seminars, but anything that was just like available out there, podcast or whatever, listening to other stories, they were around.
- [46:09]
A
But no restaurant podcast.
- [46:10]
B
Yeah. At this point. Yeah. And I just, I didn't find them.
- [46:12]
A
And I think they started as they started in like podcasts started in like the early 2000s, late 90s.
- [46:17]
B
Yeah.
- [46:17]
A
But it was like so small and it was just like. Like, it didn't. It didn't get popular until 2007.
- [46:24]
B
Okay.
- [46:24]
A
Because you needed a computer to listen to a podcast, and computers became mobile in 2007, and it wasn't then, until 2000, like, 9, 10, 11, that that started to build momentum, and it wasn't mainstream until, like, when I started my podcast, like 2012, 2013.
- [46:40]
B
Right.
- [46:40]
A
Yeah, but that. The point being, the resources weren't there. You couldn't go tap into the ether and just have this ocean of knowledge rain on you. That's possible today.
- [46:52]
B
And it's not just the knowledge. Right. It's. It's just. It's the feeling that you're part of a community, that other people are going through the same thing that you're going to. That gives you inspiration to some extent. That's big. You know, you can't quantify it. Right?
- [47:04]
A
Yeah.
- [47:04]
B
But like I told you, listening to your podcast, and there's obviously people with a great deal of knowledge, more than I will ever have. But when you talk about stories and you're like, man, I went through that, and I'm not the only one, XYZ either be success or failure. Yeah, man. There's a sense of community there, you know?
- [47:20]
A
Sure. So knowing what you know now, after having access to this abundance of knowledge and understanding, listening to the podcast and other resources, reflecting back at that time when you got the three units with this newfound knowledge, if you go back in time, would you do it differently, Hunter?
- [47:38]
B
So, you know, ignorance and ego. Let us, I think, if you want to call it, I don't know, failure at the time, a G, or like a regional manager would have probably cost you, I don't know, 70,000 a year. And I just. I wasn't willing to do it. And I was like, I'll do it. So seven days a week, I would go to Irving. That's 20 miles from here, give or take, spend the lunch there on the way back, stop at Pioneer, check on them, and then finish my day here seven days a week, every day. And that's just. It's not sustainable. No, it's just not, you know, so the biggest regret or mistake that I made was like, hey, not investing in people, or at least that one person. And then instead of me trying to put out these fires with three different people, I can go to one person. Okay, what's going on?
- [48:32]
A
Right.
- [48:32]
B
Let's fix it.
- [48:33]
A
So that mindset then was, I don't have. I don't want to give up. I want to put that 70,000 in my pocket, 100% work. But what happens when you delegate that? What potential earning do you have with that new bandwidth?
- [48:46]
B
Well, I think you could probably open up number four, Right.
- [48:49]
A
Yeah.
- [48:49]
B
If you're being honest. Right. You could. And five and six, or that time
- [48:53]
A
you spend driving around managing people. You can develop new skills.
- [48:56]
B
Yep.
- [48:56]
A
New. You can spend time learning.
- [48:58]
B
Yep.
- [48:58]
A
Going to seminars, surrounding yourself with people,
- [49:01]
B
but instead you're on the kitchen line or whatever it is. Right.
- [49:04]
A
Yeah.
- [49:04]
B
And putting out fires. And, you know, you're young.
- [49:07]
A
Yeah.
- [49:07]
B
You know, you make mistakes and you look back and you learn. You know, you learn from those mistakes. And there are benefits to mistakes. There are benefits to failure. Right. You realize like, hey, at least conceptually,
- [49:18]
A
the benefits of getting your ass thrown on a mat.
- [49:20]
B
Exactly. And we say that all the time in jiu jitsu.
- [49:22]
A
Yeah.
- [49:22]
B
Like, listen, at least conceptually you're like, okay, let's not make that mistake again. Yeah. You know, so there are benefits to it. You know, I wouldn't necessarily take that same route today, but we have learned, and there's been some successes from that experience. Yeah.
- [49:40]
A
So tell me where you want to go next in the timeline. You. You got the three locations. You decided that you could do it all yourself instead of hiring us.
- [49:50]
B
I thought, yeah.
- [49:52]
A
So what happens thereafter?
- [49:55]
B
So we're a tenant at one of the locations. They were widening the highway, and we're like, okay, when? Easy, Easy exit. You know, the timeline on them widening took a little longer, but that was an easy decision. And then we start to realize that at the time, this store was our flagship and doing. And doing numbers accordingly. And we're like, man, we're doing pretty decent at this location, the one that you're sitting at. Well, why do we have the little one? Why are we. I mean, this is doing five, six, seven times the revenue. And then we're just. It made sense to start closing them down and just leasing them out.
- [50:34]
A
Yeah. Why. Why did that appeal to you? I mean, obviously, the highway closing or widening, you knew that was going to mess up business. You were going to be probably dead for a while. Let's get out of this. But before it sucks, the small one, the amount of work. Same amount of work. Half the. Half the potential.
- [50:49]
B
Right.
- [50:50]
A
So let's just double down on this location.
- [50:52]
B
Correct. Triple down.
- [50:53]
A
Triple down. And what year was that when you were. When you got.
- [50:58]
B
So ultimately, when they. We scaled down to one would probably have been around 2008.
- [51:06]
A
Eight. Okay.
- [51:07]
B
Give or take.
- [51:07]
A
Cool. So almost 20 years ago. 18 years ago.
- [51:11]
B
Yeah. 18 years ago. Yeah.
- [51:12]
A
Was there a peak with one location?
- [51:15]
B
Yeah, with one. Yeah. Can you rephrase the question?
- [51:19]
A
So, like, when you, when you put all of your energy into one spot, you're not traveling up to Irving. You're not making three stops.
- [51:26]
B
Oh, okay.
- [51:27]
A
So did. When you were able to double down on one, how did, how did life change?
- [51:30]
B
2008?
- [51:31]
A
Yeah.
- [51:31]
B
Yeah.
- [51:32]
A
So, like, how did your life change at that point?
- [51:33]
B
And it didn't.
- [51:34]
A
Didn't.
- [51:35]
B
It really didn't, man. I. I think we just feel ours, you know, if you're just this type of person and your cup can hold this amount and you pour some out, you're just going to fill it with something else.
- [51:47]
A
Yeah.
- [51:47]
B
And that's. That's kind of who I am.
- [51:48]
A
So what did you start filling your cup with?
- [51:51]
B
Well, in a good way. Family.
- [51:53]
A
Yeah.
- [51:53]
B
You know, like if the cup didn't have room for. It sounds. It's almost embarrassing to sound. Right.
- [51:58]
A
In 2008, how many kids did you have? You're 40, man.
- [52:02]
B
Don't give me in trouble, Eric.
- [52:04]
A
40 years old.
- [52:05]
B
So Amelia was born in 2002. Xavier was born in 2006.
- [52:11]
A
So you got two kids.
- [52:12]
B
And then Mateo was born. I used one.
- [52:15]
A
Six and four and then six and two.
- [52:17]
B
Mateo was born in 2009.
- [52:19]
A
Okay, so you have three kids today.
- [52:20]
B
Three kids today.
- [52:21]
A
So now your, your priorities start to
- [52:23]
B
shift and they should. Yeah, yeah, 100.
- [52:27]
A
So your cup is being filled with more time with family.
- [52:32]
B
Correct.
- [52:33]
A
How many restaurateurs can say that?
- [52:36]
B
Man, I hope more listening to you right into anybody else says, man, it's so, you know, it's a special breed. I mean, you know this. Yeah, you know, we're just, we. We embrace the grind.
- [52:46]
A
So what did your day to day look like in 2008? How much. How many hours a week would you spend in the restaurant?
- [52:51]
B
2008, I was still spending. You know, we, we. Let me see, we opened up here in 2002. Our peak here was 2000. I would say 2008, before the financial crisis.
- [53:05]
A
So peak revenue.
- [53:06]
B
Peak revenue.
- [53:07]
A
3 million a year.
- [53:08]
B
Yeah. Where we're. We were happy.
- [53:10]
A
Yeah.
- [53:11]
B
You know.
- [53:11]
A
So were you doing the same margins then?
- [53:15]
B
No, probably not. Probably not doing the same margins. And we didn't. You don't have the same technology. Right. Either. Right, right. You don't have everything cloud based. Right. I mean, you had some cloud based. But here's the big difference, too. You have back in 2008, this is where it's frustrating. If you're an Independent. And there's a new app and I get it. They're building those apps for units of 10, 15, 20 plus. So as the betos of the worlds are calling on this XYZ app and like, hey, we don't deal with independence
- [53:46]
A
because there's no money.
- [53:47]
B
There's no money in it because the
- [53:48]
A
same amount of work it takes for me to sell you is probably twice as much work as attending an operator who has somebody that their job is to make these decisions. And they already sold it by the time we start talking.
- [54:00]
B
And I can't tell you how frustrating I'm like, I'd go somewhere like, oh, that's amazing. And I'd find somewhere like, hey, what app is that? And you'd call them. You're like, hey, listen, you know, our minimum span per month is 5,000. Thousand what? And it only makes sense if you have 10 units.
- [54:15]
A
It's, it's unit economics.
- [54:17]
B
Yeah. And I get, I get it. Listen. But it's frustrating. Yeah. It's frustrating for the little guy.
- [54:21]
A
Yeah.
- [54:21]
B
You know.
- [54:21]
A
Yeah. It's already hard enough. And then you can't compete.
- [54:23]
B
Then you can't compete. Yeah.
- [54:25]
A
And that bar has been way lowered, you know.
- [54:27]
B
Oh yeah.
- [54:27]
A
Think of the, the micro aloha days, you know, where.
- [54:32]
B
Yeah.
- [54:32]
A
Like where it was really hard to operate the same efficiencies as some of these bigger brands. And then things started to change a little post pandemic with new. The, you know, the, the business model of a POS becoming a credit card processor upheaved all the legacies and like, like there was a huge disruption. Disruption. But now even those platforms are really starting to say, well we just want to like again, units, Unit economics. We're going to the big boys because there's way more potential earning in that. In that world.
- [55:01]
B
100 and you know, we talked about absent. Listen some. And I'm not going to use names because they do a good job. I mean think of any scheduling platform or any inventory platform or any reputation management platform and everybody that's listening to this is already a name popped into their head. Right. There's a place for them.
- [55:18]
A
Right.
- [55:18]
B
I just think that that place is now going to be enterprise versus the betos of the world. That's what I think.
- [55:26]
A
That's absolutely happening. And you know, I'm, I'm putting myself at risk at agreeing with you because the conversations I'm having with future and potential sponsors is they want. And I'll be honest, I'm, I am intentionally trying to get more 10 to 30 unit operators. On my show, when I say my mission is to inspire, empower and transform the industry, you pointed it out. Inspire through stories. The power of stories. So inspiring. And once we get inspired, we can do anything, right? Empowerment, sharing knowledge, sharing benchmarks, getting into the numbers, getting into how you did it. Like where are you today? What does your business look like? Teach me how you're doing it and then transform. I want to see fewer 100 plus unit operators and more 20 to 30 unit operators locally. I want to bridge that. I want to give the power back to the independent. I want more two, three unit operators to become 10 unit operators because you can make a good living with 10 restaurants.
- [56:26]
B
You can, you can do really well.
- [56:27]
A
You can keep that money local. You can have work life, balance with the knowledge. But we seem to be obsessed, the system, the machine seems to be obsessed with serving the 100 unit plus operators because that's where the money, that's where the money's at. What the fuck are we willing to sacrifice for money? And I get me, listen, like I, I'm pro capitalist.
- [56:49]
B
Right? Right.
- [56:49]
A
For the record, I was going to
- [56:50]
B
say, I mean you get it, right?
- [56:51]
A
I'm a capitalist, I believe in capitalism. But I do think that we're sacrificing so much for maximizing.
- [57:00]
B
Well, that's why I'm here. I mean that's why we're talking about what we're about to hopefully segue into. I agree.
- [57:04]
A
Yeah.
- [57:05]
B
And my entire career has kind of been like that.
- [57:07]
A
Yeah. And it scares me because a lot of the conversations I'm having with sponsors is that they want, they're like, well like who's your target audience? Well guess What? There's fewer 100 plus unit operators in the world to talk to than there are independence. You know, I'm here to go to work.
- [57:23]
B
And there's the irony, right? Like yeah, what's the ratio from independence versus chains in terms of total units?
- [57:29]
A
There are far more, far more independence.
- [57:32]
B
Right. But yet what are all, what is everything built for the, the big dudes.
- [57:36]
A
So here's the thing man. And this is what I full heartedly believe. What gets me excited these days is that I think if there's gun there we are about, there's about to be a change. I think, I hope that the pendulum has swung far left where we are about, you know the. Right now the, the top 01% of like all money is with like or sorry the, the 01% control like 99. Right. And I think the only way to Break through that is to wake up the masses and say how you spend your money every day will change that. Because the world we live in is driven by money. So if consumer behavior change, if that happens, if the consumer behavior changes and we start putting our money in different places, the, the system will change to support that. Because the system follows the money.
- [58:27]
B
I agree.
- [58:28]
A
So anyway, I'm talking too much.
- [58:29]
B
No, no, no, I agree. 100. But I mean, it's, it's, it's the reason that I reached out to you.
- [58:35]
A
Yeah.
- [58:35]
B
You know, if here we are as independents and the system or the app, and I'm not, not bad mouthing the apps. I'm not.
- [58:43]
A
They're just trying to make it, and I get it.
- [58:44]
B
Right.
- [58:45]
A
They're trying to make a living. They're trying to scale, they're trying to.
- [58:48]
B
But if you're asking me as an independent to keep up with whatever national chain because they can spend $10,000 on an app and it looks fancy and it looks fun, it's gamified and all this other stuff, man, that's automatically putting me at a disadvantage. And I'm like, man, and then going my entire career of them telling you like, hey, we don't, we don't play with small guys like you, man. Part of me is like, listen, man, it can be done. You don't need them. Right. And you are at risk. Really, Honestly, I mean, if, if you're talking about some of the major brands that could pony up some money, man, kudos to you. Because they, you know, if what we share, hopefully some of your listeners like, I mean, I can do that and they're not doing.
- [59:33]
A
I don't know if I'm picking up what you're putting down right now. I think I might be missing, can
- [59:36]
B
I say some brands? I mean, I don't know.
- [59:38]
A
Yeah.
- [59:38]
B
Actually, what I'm curious about, I'm scared to say brands.
- [59:40]
A
No. Or I love getting recommendations and brands or whatever maybe this is. I want you to be unfiltered. I think there's something in your story that starts to happen around 2008 and going forward is like, now you have bandwidth and I think you start pivoting. And another thing, your passion, technology becomes omnipresent within the restaurant industry. So there's something happening in your story where like, you're, you're doubling down on one location, you're getting more bandwidth to have work life balance, and you're also removing yourself from the day to day to work on the business. I think that's what's happening around this time. Is that safe?
- [60:12]
B
Safe.
- [60:12]
A
So I don't necessarily need to know what how your tech stack has evolved over time, but after now, since 2008, we are 18 years thereafter. Have you. You know, this is a tech heavy. I mean restaurant. I mean it's not like you're taking advantage of technology. I can see just from walking around.
- [60:30]
B
Sure.
- [60:31]
A
What is your tech stack today?
- [60:33]
B
Toast pos.
- [60:33]
A
What was your tech stack? I should say two years ago.
- [60:36]
B
Two years ago was toast pos. Yeah. We pretty much use their entire suite of packages. Extra Chef. What else is we use their pay. Well that. You know what? Listen, I know get on Reddit. There's a lot of toast haters. That was a godsend for us. Toast payroll. Honestly. Toast payroll. Extra chef. The tip management was another big one.
- [61:07]
A
I was curious about that too.
- [61:08]
B
Yeah, tip management, it's another big one.
- [61:10]
A
You guys pull your tips.
- [61:12]
B
We don't pull our tips, but it separates the tips.
- [61:14]
A
So you can now take advantage of the FICA tip credits.
- [61:17]
B
We always have. Yeah, but you know, you just. Easier makes it easier. Right. I think the only thing that we don't use is their scheduling.
- [61:29]
A
What do you use for scheduling?
- [61:30]
B
Hot shift.
- [61:31]
A
Hot shift.
- [61:32]
B
Yeah, the one I sent you. Okay.
- [61:35]
A
But everything else we use that was what you bit.
- [61:37]
B
Oh wait, that's what I built. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [61:39]
A
But what were you using before you built that?
- [61:41]
B
Google. Google sheets.
- [61:43]
A
Okay.
- [61:43]
B
Which worked fine.
- [61:44]
A
Yep. You know what else? Like what about website websites?
- [61:48]
B
Wix, we're about to. You know Wix I think is $34 a month or give or take. We're about to.
- [61:55]
A
And did you build that website?
- [61:56]
B
I did on wix? Yeah.
- [61:57]
A
Yeah. Did you use a restaurant specific form like, like template template. So they.
- [62:01]
B
And they're good.
- [62:03]
A
This episode is made possible by US Foods. It takes more than great food to run a kitchen these days with US Foods. More than means consistently high quality products, industry leading tools, inflexible deliveries that let you grow your business on your schedule. Whatever your goals, US Foods helps you turn them into reality. As a US Foods customer, you'll gain access to their industry leading moxy platform. Which doesn't just make it easy to place your US Foods order, but it uses AI powered technology to help you take more control of your business and increase profitability. You can also explore the latest issues of Food Fanatics magazine from US Foods. In each issue you'll find real world success stories, bold culinary inspiration and practical profit boosting ideas you can put to work immediately. Visit usfoods.com expect more to learn how to become a US Foods customer again. That's usfoods.com expect more. Everyone thinks marketing is the answer to increasing profitability in your restaurant. But the reality? Nothing drives profit more than rock solid operations. And that is precisely why I partnered with the best in the biz. Restaurant Systems Pro. It's time to plan for the new year now. Beginning January 5th, Restaurant Systems Pro will be launching its 30 day Restaurant Mastery Program. You'll get in depth, step by step, proven systems to get the money you deserve and create the freedom you want in your life. Here are the systems that they'll be covering. Scheduling, menu engineering, purchasing, inventory, AI, invoice processing, bookkeeping, restaurant budgeting, digital checklists, recipe costing and POS integrations. Plus a library of video tutorials and recordings, operational playbooks, flowcharts, swipe files, checklist and a personalized action plan. This makes it 100% ready to be delegated. This 30 day restaurant mastery program is valued at nearly $4,000. But Restaurant Unstoppable listeners can get it for only $97 by going to go.restantassistanspro. net profits. Or you could sign up for Restaurant Unstoppable Community and get access to this training absolutely free as part of your membership. Plus it repeats every month, so you get access in perpetuity. Not to mention you get access to everything that we offer in Restaurant Unstoppable Community like the live events, the recordings of those live events. Ad free Restaurant Unstoppable podcast the unstoppable custom AI agent in more exclusive deals with strategic Restaurant Stoppable Partners. Head over to Restaurant Unstoppable.com live for this exclusive Restaurant Systems Pro deal. People get in trouble building their own websites in restaurants. There's some key things you need, you know like you just, you can tell when people build like when I don't see an address or the hours or like like obvious things like on like it's just like yo, get a template, go through the checklist. So WIX is pretty good about covering all those bases.
- [64:55]
B
100 especially they have the built in SEO optimization but a lot of people don't know it's about, you know, LLM optimization. Yeah, you can build that into now with schema markup.
- [65:04]
A
Yeah, yeah. I mean I don't encourage people to build their own websites. I'm definitely somebody who should not build a website.
- [65:09]
B
It's so easy now Eric, that literally
- [65:11]
A
anybody surprised how bad I am? I literally the other day I was trying to upload an image on A form and I couldn't find the image anywhere on my computer. Like, that's how bad.
- [65:23]
B
Well, most people.
- [65:23]
A
There's a reason why I drive around the country and don't do zoom calls. Dude, I. Anything I can do to say awful computer.
- [65:30]
B
Easy's relative, we'll put it that way. But it is easy.
- [65:33]
A
Yeah. So you're, you're. And I think, for the record, I think Toast is a great platform in terms of their technology is fantastic. And they were a huge supporter of mine during the pandemic. They like, they gave, gave me a great deal where I. When everybody was trying to evolve their platforms because they were forced to, like, I think I ended up earning close to $20,000 worth of affiliate marketing.
- [65:55]
B
Oh, nice.
- [65:55]
A
You know, like, and I'm super grateful for that support from Toast. But I think also my, my priority, my loyalty is to the listener. And I think we need to create a platform where people can speak about the good, the bad, the ugly. So why Toast for you? What? Why did you learn with those?
- [66:09]
B
So when we were with Aloha, the legacy brand.
- [66:11]
A
Yeah.
- [66:12]
B
God, Lee, man, I hate to just. When you. Legacy can mean good and bad. Everything was third party. They weren't really innovating.
- [66:22]
A
Got a little fat, dumb and happy. The legacy.
- [66:24]
B
Yeah. With Micros and Aloha kind of the same. The two major legacy brands. Toast kind of was a new player. What. How long they've been around? 10 years, give or take.
- [66:30]
A
I want to say they were 20, 17, 16, around that time.
- [66:33]
B
Not even 10 years. Right.
- [66:34]
A
Well, the founder, I want to say was with Breadcrumb.
- [66:36]
B
Okay.
- [66:37]
A
Upserve Breadcrumb. And I think that they left. I think Upserve was really innovative with what the technology model.
- [66:44]
B
That.
- [66:44]
A
And then I think, and don't correct or correct me if I'm wrong, I don't know exactly. But I think the big difference with what Toast was doing is that they saw an opportunity to be the credit card processor.
- [66:53]
B
Yeah.
- [66:54]
A
And that they like, they changed the model. And then the cloud base was also a big part of that.
- [66:57]
B
The cloud get base, the credit card model. I mean, they're kind of double dipping. Right. I mean. Well, yeah, their fees are not any cheaper than. I think if you were to go with a process with a POS that wasn't your processor in open source. Right, right.
- [67:12]
A
Where you can now bargain and negotiate.
- [67:14]
B
Exactly. I mean, be fair, their, their rates are normal. Right. You know, so.
- [67:22]
A
But the fact that those rates are normal is.
- [67:25]
B
Well, that could be changing. You know what I'm saying legislation hopefully
- [67:28]
A
going to be passed, but like, we've acclimated to. What is it, 2%?
- [67:32]
B
Oh, more than that, yeah.
- [67:33]
A
2.5. Like what. What are you paying?
- [67:35]
B
It's like 2 point. Well, you know that it's all different, right? Every credit card type is different. Right. So one could. A debit card obviously, is super cheap, and then your corporate card is more, and then there's a transaction fee. So your, your, your credit card statement is, is a bible. I mean, literally, it's ridiculous. Right. So nobody can truly understand it, but if you average it all out, probably 2.3 and then. Plus the transaction fee.
- [67:57]
A
Yeah, yeah.
- [67:57]
B
Which is not bad.
- [67:58]
A
So when did you start taking. I mean, when did you. Where did you get your tech stack before you started taking control and engineering your own solutions?
- [68:06]
B
What do you mean?
- [68:07]
A
Like, like you, you are using Vibe coding to write your own software.
- [68:12]
B
Correct.
- [68:13]
A
When did that start happening?
- [68:15]
B
When Toast opened up their API.
- [68:17]
A
Okay, so Toast started with the kind of. That was their model too. That made them a little unique because they had an open API.
- [68:24]
B
No, no, this is recent.
- [68:25]
A
Okay.
- [68:26]
B
At least you might know something I don't know.
- [68:28]
A
Well, here's my understanding. Feel free to correct me because you're the, you're the techner. Right. Like, you probably know more than I do, which is why I'm here. What made Toast appealing is what the. Was the amount of companies that integrated with Toast. Okay, so they had this giant Toast marketplace.
- [68:46]
B
Great, great point.
- [68:47]
A
So just.
- [68:48]
B
So there's a difference between open API and API.
- [68:51]
A
Yeah.
- [68:52]
B
So what you're referring to that the bigger brands can partner, integrate with Toast. Right. And that's through approval process.
- [68:58]
A
It's the same thing to apply, and
- [69:00]
B
then you have to apply.
- [69:01]
A
We'll play with you.
- [69:01]
B
We'll play with you. And typically you have to pay.
- [69:04]
A
Yeah.
- [69:04]
B
You know, same thing with ncr. I mean, what I heard in the was that it was $10,000 to apply with NCR back in the day. Right. So now, hey, I'll give you the key. Literally they called API keys. I'll give you a key to my house, but I'm your landlord and this is how much you got to pay. So that's the difference between API and then open API. And open API is like, listen, here's the key. Have fun.
- [69:25]
A
Yeah.
- [69:26]
B
You know, just follow the rules, but have fun. And that's within the last 12, 18 months.
- [69:30]
A
Okay. And when that happened is when you started playing 100%.
- [69:34]
B
I'm like, man, I'm curious.
- [69:35]
A
Yeah. What were you doing with computers prior to this? Because you said that you wanted to get into that field. Were you?
- [69:40]
B
Yeah, I was already building websites and I was already, you know, I'd already made a couple apps, and I wouldn't say hard coding is what you see is what you get, but I'd already built.
- [69:49]
A
You knew the language.
- [69:50]
B
I knew that I could speak the language. How about that?
- [69:53]
A
And that's all you have to be able to do today.
- [69:55]
B
That's it. To vibe code, you don't even need that.
- [69:57]
A
Eric, what do you need?
- [69:59]
B
Can you speak English?
- [70:01]
A
I. I try.
- [70:02]
B
That's it. Literally, when you say vibe coding, it's just a fancy way of saying natural language coding.
- [70:08]
A
I want.
- [70:09]
B
I want a blue button that takes me to Restaurant Unstoppable.
- [70:12]
A
Yeah.
- [70:12]
B
Now write me the back end.
- [70:14]
A
And then you. Now, I think there's still some level of, like, you need to know where to drop that code. You know, like, you need, like. But that's rudimentary. Like, you don't need to spend hours figuring out what that code is.
- [70:27]
B
Correct. Replit base 44. Claude. Chat GPT. There's difference, right? There's just kind of the all in one. It'll build it for you. And then there's, hey, like, just two years ago, I was using Claude to give me snippets of code.
- [70:47]
A
Claude was out two years ago?
- [70:49]
B
Yeah. 18 months.
- [70:50]
A
Wow.
- [70:50]
B
Yeah.
- [70:50]
A
Has it been that long?
- [70:51]
B
Yeah. ChatGPT is what, two, three, four years?
- [70:54]
A
Damn. I know the early versions. Like. Like, I think I started using CHAT GPT about a year ago.
- [70:59]
B
Yeah. It's been around longer now. Yeah.
- [71:01]
A
But I was. I'm not an early adopter when it
- [71:03]
B
comes to technology, and it just evolved so fast. But this is vibe coding versus even going to Chat GPT and getting snippets of code where. Vibe coding, literally, I want a blue button that takes me to Restaurant Unstoppable. And it's going to build you the code to get you a blue button. Right. To go to restaurants.
- [71:20]
A
So if we're listening to this and we're like, we want to do this kind of like, what's the first step? Like, where do we go? What do you recommend?
- [71:27]
B
Start small. Start really small.
- [71:29]
A
What does that look like?
- [71:30]
B
I want a blue button to take me to Restaurant Unstoppable.
- [71:33]
A
Okay.
- [71:33]
B
And kind of see the back, how it works. Start with something very specific and just kind of grow your own confidence because it can seem intimidating when you talk about code. And you'll literally see, like, the Matrix. You'll see the Matrix of code coming through. Right? And that can be intimidating. Start really small and you'd be surprised what you can build.
- [71:57]
A
Okay, so today, what have you built? Paint that picture of what you've built so far.
- [72:01]
B
So it started. We have our own SMS wait list management. Think, think. Yelp waitlist. Think Waitlist. Me. You walk in, Eric, party of two. We put your phone number down and it uses a Twilio integration and it sends you a text that your table's ready. You walk in, host takes you off the list and you go on to the next.
- [72:23]
A
What else do you have?
- [72:25]
B
We built our own SMS text marketing, same Twilio integration. We have over 6,000 contacts.
- [72:33]
A
How do you spell Twilio?
- [72:35]
B
Tw I L I O.
- [72:40]
A
So you're using Twilio. What is Twilio?
- [72:42]
B
So Twilio is the back end of almost any SMS that's sent. It's the, you know, here in Texas, it's Encore. You might have different energy providers, but the energy's coming from Encore. Well, Twilio is the backbone of almost all SMSes that are sent through the carriers. Right. So you're just bypassing the front end and you're going straight to them, but you got to build your own front end.
- [73:06]
A
You got to build the road, you
- [73:07]
B
got to build the roads. You can use what they have, but you're going to have to develop your own.
- [73:11]
A
Twilio is the highway and you're building the back roads to get to get
- [73:15]
B
to wherever you need to get. And it's substantially, I mean substantially cheaper.
- [73:19]
A
Got it. So SMS waitlist management built through Twilio.
- [73:23]
B
Yep. Reputation management.
- [73:25]
A
Yep, Reputation management.
- [73:26]
B
You see that right now, right there?
- [73:28]
A
We, we value your feedback, share your.
- [73:31]
B
I'm just gonna grab it, so check it. So not. Well, we kind of messed them up, but inside that, inside that QR code is. You probably can't see it, but there's a number in there. So every QR code is dynamic. So every QR code is dynamic. So we know exactly where that feedback is coming from. So let's say you're sitting at table 303, right? I know which, I'm not sure which one you pulled, but if you give us a positive feedback, it's going to do exactly what you know another big brand is going to do. It's going to send you out to Google. It's going to send you out to Google and you give us a five star review. If it's negative, we hopefully can take care of it in house. It's going to Send the manager a text immediately and it's going to tell you, hey, Eric had a bad experience at 301.
- [74:19]
A
Yeah. So SMS weightless management, SMS text marketing. So basically like, hey, we have a limited time offer coming today.
- [74:26]
B
Correct.
- [74:27]
A
Using it like that, you have your reputation, management, what else?
- [74:30]
B
And then Hot Shift is the last one which is kind of encompasses everything.
- [74:35]
A
And with all these different things that you've built up to four now, is there any we've missed?
- [74:39]
B
I don't, I don't think so.
- [74:41]
A
Are you developing your own brand around these things?
- [74:44]
B
No, no, not, not up until Shift is not up until. So SaaS, right. So software as a service, up until Hot Shift, it was just built for us. There's no landing pages like login and that's it.
- [74:57]
A
So Hot Shift is something that, if, if you're listening to this right now,
- [75:00]
B
like, yeah, we'd love to talk to you 100%. Yeah. Hot shift Pro.
- [75:03]
A
And we have reached the point that I'm trying to make, okay. Is that if we're going to make a difference, if we're going to do something for the independent restaurant industry, we can't expect it to come from the inside out. Sorry, we can't expect to come. We can't expect it to come from the outside. In these Companies that are SaaS, providers care more about serving the larger companies because that's where the opportunity is. Right. But if, if we're going to create solutions for independence, I think we, we're at this point right now where the, the ability to develop solutions is. The bar has gotten so low that there's enough people like you, Albert, in this industry that are passionate about technology, that also own restaurants, that can start building solutions and we can start sharing it with each other, you know, and we can. This is a. We need to take control of our industry.
- [75:57]
B
I agree.
- [75:58]
A
Restaurant owners are not the beneficiary of their restaurants. We help real estate moguls get rich and we help tech companies get rich and we are like scraping and scrapping to survive and they need us. We can take. We. There is literally this opportunity right now and the window is small. You know what I'm saying? There's a. And it will all. It all depends on how we start living differently now. Who do we start giving our money to now? We can support and make a such a strong. The masses are in the independent. We have the numbers.
- [76:35]
B
We do.
- [76:35]
A
Second largest industry in the world, dude, behind the government.
- [76:39]
B
Yes.
- [76:40]
A
We just outpaced healthcare, which I like to call sick care. Because that's really what it is. Like the restaurant industry is gonna change the world. I've been saying this, dude, and it's like I get, this is real excitement, love it. You know what I'm saying? And like, so like what is like knowing what, you know, like with this, this energy that I'm bringing, like, how do we make this shift?
- [77:02]
B
I think you got a shift mentality of restaurant owners.
- [77:04]
A
Yeah.
- [77:05]
B
We tend to be kind of a. And if you look at you, you've talked to more restaurant owners than maybe anybody in with. Without a hidden agenda, right. You're just, you're just trying to learn, man. Sometimes we can be hard headed, right? We can look at, hey, this guy that I don't know is telling me to build my own app. I don't have time for that. Right? But it's not that hard. That's it. That's all I'm really right now. All I'm trying to tell our listeners or your listeners, it's not that hard. So if you're paying. I told you, we. Oh, we were paying $34 for SurveyMonkey. We were paying $242.50 for Send Hub 99 for Reputation Management.
- [77:46]
A
Why won't you say which one it is?
- [77:47]
B
Because I don't want to offend it. I don't want, you know, I don't
- [77:49]
A
think it's a matter of offending.
- [77:50]
B
Okay.
- [77:51]
A
I think it's just, I don't know
- [77:52]
B
if you're a sponsor any. I'll tell you right now. Right? So if you're.
- [77:55]
A
Was it Ovation up?
- [77:56]
B
Yeah. I mean it's 150 to start, 99amonth. And I love the concept.
- [78:00]
A
I love. Zach is a great dude, you know, but like, listen, but if I can
- [78:05]
B
build it myself, right, for free, and it might take me some time and people could argue that you're taking away from your core business. Okay, but if I can save $100 a month here and $250 a month here, I mean, I told you, I mean we're saving roughly 400amonth by building our own stuff. Yeah, why not?
- [78:24]
A
Yeah. And you know, to your point, like all these companies that we mentioned, Toast has been a sponsor, I've worked with them. Ovation has been a sponsor, I've worked with them. Love Zach. I love these companies. I. They have made what I do possible. And I have no hate or shade towards these, these companies. But the world is changing and I know for a fact that these companies are changing their whole business model to serve the 30 unit plus operators, they want 10 plus, they want 20 plus operators. And I understand that because that's what makes sense. That's a good business move. But what we have to do as independents is a good business move, which means we need to start creating our own solutions. And the cool thing is when you fragment, when you have diversity, when you have a lot of different people doing things, and if it doesn't become a like Ovation wants to be marquee in Sunday app, it's three companies. Right. They all want to win. And that mindset means we all lose. When one winner wins, we all lose.
- [79:23]
B
Yeah.
- [79:24]
A
So we can choose to go forward and say like, let's not make this about getting rich, let's make this about making it better. How can we all start creating our own solutions? How do we create a marketplace where we start lifting each other up as these, these vibe coding people like, oh, this is what you're doing, this is what. Let's all just throw this thing into a big pot because we're not going to be able to compete with the Ovations and the Marquees. And you know, like they're doing their own thing. They have budget, but we don't need that them anymore.
- [79:54]
B
I don't think so.
- [79:55]
A
Yeah. And that's what's really exciting. So like what if we just all got together?
- [80:00]
B
The one thing that we haven't talked about, Eric too, is like, you know those, those are built for the masses. Right. So we, you know, just, I'm not pointing out or anybody, but like Ovation up.
- [80:07]
A
Yeah.
- [80:07]
B
They're thinking about the 30, 50 unit operators. Right. But you as Eric's diner might need something just a little quirky.
- [80:14]
A
Yeah. Like look at schedule fly.
- [80:15]
B
Yeah.
- [80:15]
A
You know what they've created.
- [80:17]
B
Yeah.
- [80:17]
A
Like Will Bradley, like they chose to
- [80:20]
B
keep it simple, to keep it super
- [80:21]
A
simple because they're, they are one company that is like. No, the 30 plus unit operators, not them. Like we will if they want to use.
- [80:28]
B
And I listen to that podcast.
- [80:29]
A
Yeah. Like, but they, they know that they built a solution for independence.
- [80:33]
B
Right.
- [80:33]
A
And that's why they've kept it simple.
- [80:36]
B
So when I look at this, back to that train of thought is that if in simple, maybe not be. Might not be the right word. Right. Be Eric specific. Eric's Diner specific. Betos specific. There's some quirky things in here that we use. So we previously. My staff doesn't even know this though, and I will share it with you. So when you're doing tip outs and you're getting that number from toast. We put, we used to put it into a spreadsheet and one typo we might be underpaying or overpaying the server or not paying at all just based on one human putting in something into a spreadsheet. And now we're bringing in that data. They're still typing it in, but we're just double checking their numbers because it's coming directly from toast. Then it doesn't cost me anything.
- [81:21]
A
Yeah.
- [81:21]
B
Because I built it myself.
- [81:23]
A
Yeah. What more, man? Like, what more can you teach me? Because I'm getting. I'm realizing that I'm getting really excited right now and I'm like, trying to solve the world's problems, but like, relative to this subject, Avide coding. Where to start, how to do it, what to consider. Like, what haven't you shared? Now this is totally foreign for me. This is not my area of expertise. Clearly.
- [81:46]
B
Be specific.
- [81:47]
A
I don't even. Like I'm ignorant right now. I'm ignorance.
- [81:51]
B
The main thing is that it's super simple. It can sound. Does it help, does it help if you knew a little bit about coding before? Yeah. Because you can guide. They're called agents. Okay, so you're having a conversation with an agent and you're asking this agent to go out and build you whatever that you want to build.
- [82:10]
A
I'm listening to this right now. I want to know where's the starting point? Where do I go? Who teaches me the basics to start being able to have the conversation?
- [82:17]
B
YouTube. Okay, I'd go to YouTube.
- [82:19]
A
Give me a search, a search queue.
- [82:21]
B
Vibe coding.
- [82:22]
A
Vibe coding. How to vibe code.
- [82:23]
B
How to vibe code. Vibe code for beginners, whatever it is. Yeah, but I would even argue, Eric, that you don't even need that.
- [82:30]
A
Yeah.
- [82:31]
B
Sign up for an account.
- [82:31]
A
Yeah. Ask Chat GPT.
- [82:33]
B
Ask chat GPT. And listen, I'll be honest by step. So when you first type it in, it's. It's just literally a prompt.
- [82:38]
A
Yeah.
- [82:39]
B
What do you want to build? That's what it says. What do you want to build? Well, the more specific and the more you know what you want to build, the better the outcome is going to be. So a lot of times what I'll do, you'll go to whatever it is that you want to build. I'll take screenshots. I'll go through, like flow management. Like, hey, what's the process of, of what we're doing? Right? How do you trade shifts? How do you request off all those type of things? The more you know about the process of what you want to build and then you go to chat GPT. So do a deep dive on Ovation up and tell me what you've learned about it. And then, then, hey, you Chat GPT Europe expert coder, Write me an AI engineered prompt to put into repl it. And then you read it over and if it makes sense now, you copy that, then you put it into replit and then you're going to have an mvp, a minimal viable product. And then you can start building out the back end. That's the way that I would do it and I would always build. Here's the one thing that I was having a conversation with another fellow Vibe coder. Always build everything as a SaaS first. And all the mistakes that you build and you, you hard code it just for yourself, it kind of limits you. So always build it as a SaaS. Just start from that aspect. Okay. As a SaaS.
- [84:00]
A
Okay. So I just for fun wrote into chat gbt. I want to start Vibe coding. My goal is to create SaaS solutions for my restaurant. Where do I start? Let's see what it tells me. Love this goal. The Vibe coding plus restaurants is a great combo. First number one first. Don't start coat. Don't start with coding, Start with restaurant problems. Literally what you just kind of explained to us. Ask yourself, what do I check every single day? What do I track in spreadsheets? WhatsApp in my head, what mistakes cost me Money stress typically gold mines in restaurants, inventory waste, tracking, staff scheduling, time attendance, supplier ordering, price changes, daily sales, profit, snapshots, recipe costing, margin, multi location reports, blah, blah, blah. So it's literally telling you where to
- [84:47]
B
focus and it's telling you to stay specific.
- [84:49]
A
Yeah, yeah. Pick one tiny product idea anyway. So yeah, it's giving you, honestly, it's giving me a ton of stuff. So literally it will walk you step by step through the process and just
- [84:59]
B
pick one of those. What is your biggest problem? Like for us, it's going to sound silly, but any operator is going to tell you side work was a, just a, just a pain. Yeah. And specifically closing people and their opener counterparts. And then there's a few choice words said in the kitchen because it wasn't done right.
- [85:16]
A
Yeah. Do you get pushback from your team? Because I'm, I'm assuming that you don't just like have a conversation with an LLM and it just pops out a perfect solution. No, no, there's probably. How many iterations has it taken to get to each one of these things?
- [85:33]
B
Hundreds.
- [85:34]
A
And like, does it ever stop?
- [85:35]
B
Never.
- [85:36]
A
Yeah, but how long did it get?
- [85:37]
B
Not. Not for any, Any coder. Now, I'm not saying I'm a coder. Right, Right. But anybody that's developed anything in code, it's a constant iteration. Right. You're always finding bugs or you're. I mean, think about your favorite app. You're getting pushed, you know, updates all the time. Yeah. Right. So it's just, it's a constant iteration.
- [85:54]
A
Right. What's. What's the future? What do you think? Like, we're like, in the perfect world. What does this look like?
- [86:02]
B
Like, I think the Betos of the world makes every app for themselves. And it. And it's even easier in two years than it is today.
- [86:10]
A
What if there was a solution that was crowdsourced?
- [86:15]
B
Could be.
- [86:15]
A
And like a bunch, a bunch of owners get together and they just all like. I mean, but here's the thing. No two restaurants are. Exactly.
- [86:23]
B
That's my point is like, you want it specific to you. Like, for us, the side work, it was a huge.
- [86:27]
A
But what if you got something that was like big a base that's like, here's like, what all.
- [86:32]
B
You already have it. I think you already have that. You have that in the, in the big brands. You already have that. Yeah. I think what's going to make it even more special is one, it's not going to cost as much, and then two, you're going to make it very specific to you.
- [86:44]
A
How much are you saving a month, easy?
- [86:47]
B
450.
- [86:47]
A
450amonth?
- [86:48]
B
A month, easy.
- [86:50]
A
When do you think that this starts to reach into the world of POS systems?
- [86:56]
B
As soon as, well, you know how the, the Amazon business model, right. You super successful as Amazon seller, they just, they start their own. So as soon as. It's scary even for me. Right. As soon as Toast see this happening, they're going to start building their own. And so you're super successful with your app. Toast is going to come right back and either buy somebody up and put it on the marketplace.
- [87:17]
A
Yeah. What do you. Do you have any concerns about companies, like, getting too big?
- [87:23]
B
Of course. They already are because they, they dictate what you can and can't do. It's not fair to the little guy. I can't afford it. You know, I don't know the, the breakdown of your listeners, but if I'm. I'm a single unit doing, I don't know, $500,000 a year, margins are tight at 10%. And you're asking me to spend, what, four or $500 a month that somebody with 1.5. I can't do it.
- [87:47]
A
Right. I mean, for a single unit operator that's doing that, you know, 3 million
- [87:51]
B
a year, that's different.
- [87:52]
A
They have, you know, three locations doing 2 million a year. That's what's 450?
- [87:57]
B
Nothing. Right, but, but I'm not talking to them.
- [87:59]
A
Right. But for that single unit operator doing
- [88:02]
B
750 a year, every dollar counts.
- [88:04]
A
Every dollar counts.
- [88:04]
B
And hey, listen, even, I mean, think about the bankruptcy bankruptcies that we've had. I mean, just because you're doing these big numbers doesn't mean that you're profitable. Right? Right. So, you know, leave the cells out of it is like, hey, what's left? What's in the black? Right? And then that's going to dictate how much you need to either build or, or you can pay a hundred dollars a month for another.
- [88:26]
A
Yeah, my mind tends to go to like, bigger things like the, like, you know, I think we can't think of the restaurant industry without thinking about the world. It's all connected, right? Like, we feed people, like, we touch so many different lives in the restaurant industry industry. And to me it's like the, the, the exciting part of this is that it fragments a lot of the dis. What's the word I'm trying to say? Distribution of wealth, you know, so if, if the restaurant industry starts creating its own solutions and we say, you know, we don't need the corporations to create something, solutions, we can do this on our own. My fear is, okay, what if we all get on CHAT GPT to create these solutions now Chat GPT is going to become super ultra powerful, right? So like, as we're using AI, how do we stay mindful of, like, how do we fragment and distribute? Like, what's stopping, like, if we can take this mindset. Because eventually I think anybody will be able to create their own AI, right? As the technology becomes more universal. So like, how do we intentionally start distribution? Like, like break up those different LLM solution or options? Like, should we all be using Chat gbt? Should we, some of us be using Claude? Should some of us be using Perplexity? Like, like how do we intentionally mindfully keep that fragmented? So there's no clear front runner in that?
- [89:51]
B
I don't think. Well, I don't, I don't think there's a clear. I think it's going to, the market's going to take care of itself, honestly, you know, well, you have to have anthropic Claude, you have Chat GPT you have Google, Gemini, you have X and Gronk. So I just think the companies will kind of keep themselves hopefully. Right, right. Keep themselves honest. As long as there's competition I don't think there's going to be this one evil overlord.
- [90:13]
A
So what is the. The like I'm afraid to ask an LLM this question because they're, they're probably going to be biased like which if I ask Chat GPT what's the number
- [90:21]
B
one LLM I would assume they would say open AI.
- [90:24]
A
Yeah right.
- [90:25]
B
That's the most, that's the most well known Google.
- [90:27]
A
What's the number one LLM they'll be.
- [90:28]
B
I don't know, I'm curious. Let's just find out, you know,
- [90:33]
A
because I mean I wonder if Zif's law comes into effect here and I'll explain what that is in a little bit. What so I'm asking Google right now what's the number one LLM relative to users?
- [90:50]
B
I would say compute time.
- [90:51]
A
Compute time, that's queries.
- [90:54]
B
Well it's no, because one query could only take a minute.
- [90:58]
A
Okay.
- [90:59]
B
Another query could take 20 minutes.
- [91:02]
A
So what's the number 1llm relative to compute time?
- [91:05]
B
Yeah, that's what I would say and even then that's probably not going to give you who's the biggest. I mean there's probably a combination of.
- [91:14]
A
There is no single number one LLM for compute time as spend a speed spends what as speed depends heavily on factors like model size optimization techniques, hardware in this in the specific task. So I mean I still just want to know like is there a clear runner LLM?
- [91:35]
B
You can make the easy argument just from being known Chat GPT.
- [91:44]
A
Is there? No, there isn't one single clear leading LLM that's like, you know that like, like this is, this is, this is why it's bad that these companies control this because they will.
- [91:56]
B
Well, we're not the only ones having this conversation, right? I mean this is, this is an ongoing conversation of, of people being scared of, of LLMs.
- [92:09]
A
Yeah and there's different types of LMS too which is, you know, you got to point that out But Zip's law basically states that in any given market the number one in a specific niche, you know, so if you're a burger restaurant, the number one burger restaurant in a market does twice as much business as the number two. Three times as much business as number three. Mathematical according to zips law. Okay so it's basically there's always this law states that there's always a disproportionate amount of resources spread out between the people that are doing that thing in a given market.
- [92:42]
B
Yeah.
- [92:43]
A
And this was fine 200, 150 years ago.
- [92:47]
B
Sure.
- [92:47]
A
When the country was fragmented up into a bunch of different markets that were called towns and cities. And then there could be a number one in each one of those markets, you know, but post the, the second industrial age, or like the. I think it was the second industrial age, basically, when railroads. And basically with the railroads in the telegraph, we went from hyper fragmented markets to a national market in like 50 years. So now these marketplaces, now we're in a global marketplace, and that law still applies. So the number one burger joint, what is it?
- [93:20]
B
McDonald's.
- [93:21]
A
Right. And it probably does twice as much business as what's number two?
- [93:24]
B
Burger King. Right.
- [93:26]
A
I mean, I don't know. We could probably look that up.
- [93:28]
B
Look that up. Is that true?
- [93:29]
A
How do we ask that question? Total volume, what restaurant or what burger chains?
- [93:37]
B
Not just. I think McDonald's is number one. Just period.
- [93:40]
A
Right. Well, I think Subway might in terms of like, location. Subway.
- [93:43]
B
Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [93:43]
A
So it's. How are you measuring, number one, what burger chains do the most revenue in America? I kind of should be asking ChatGPTs. It'll be able to give me better McDonald's.
- [94:02]
B
How many billions?
- [94:04]
A
McDonald's is the undisputed leader in revenue in the US food chain. Blah, blah, significant margins following Wendy's. Burger King with chains. Sonic Jack. I want to know. Okay, I'm gonna ask Chat gp This is fun. Hopefully my listeners don't mind. I need a Jamie, right? Somebody to do this for me.
- [94:21]
B
Jamie, look that up for me.
- [94:22]
A
Okay, so McDonald's is number one with 50 billion plus in U.S. system sales. Wendy's is number two at 12 billion.
- [94:30]
B
Oh, my God.
- [94:30]
A
So it's more than double.
- [94:33]
B
So, yeah, quadruple.
- [94:35]
A
And if you look at like, you know, search engines, Google does twice as much.
- [94:39]
B
You know, that's changing. Right. So 5% of all CBT is coming back. Well, 5% of all searches are now done on LLM. And that's.
- [94:45]
A
That's up until recently.
- [94:46]
B
Up until recently. Right.
- [94:47]
A
So, like, this is an example of this law. So we, I think what I, I believe it's just human nature that we, we evolved hundreds of thousands of years to exist in groups of 30 to 50 people. We were in hunter gatherer bands and tribes, and occasionally we would get together with our like, extended tribe for like a wedding or like a seasonal event, like a solstice. And there might be 150 people.
- [95:12]
B
Right.
- [95:13]
A
You know, or maybe it would be like the extended tribe and that would be like 500 people. And that was like, holy, there's so many people here now. 500 people live on a road.
- [95:21]
B
Yeah.
- [95:22]
A
You know, like up until, I want to say two. Was it 4,000 years ago, the biggest cities were 10,000 people. And now that's a town. Yeah, you know, that's, that's a, that's a small town. So my point is we are hardwired to go off of word of mouth. So like if we're in a market, a small market, like we go back 70, 100 years ago, we live in a town of 2, 000 people, we're gonna like, where do you go to get a haircut? Johnny? Everybody knows Johnny's the place to go. And if you weren't Johnny and you want to cut hair, you'd go west, find a new town that doesn't have a barber yet, and you'd be the number one Bar Harbor. Right. But in a national marketplace, like we are hardwired, we all go to word of mouth, but we don't listen to each other anymore. We listen to third party people. Aggregates. Uber is going to tell you where the number one place to get a burger is. Some influencer is going to tell you.
- [96:20]
B
That's the sad part right there.
- [96:22]
A
Exactly.
- [96:22]
B
The influence, the influencer thing so gets me.
- [96:27]
A
That's what determines number one today. It's not word of mouth. It's not how well you do it, it's how you, how well you can manipulate the system to market to yourself to increase the illusion of being number one.
- [96:39]
B
A little sad.
- [96:40]
A
That's the kind of stuff that I go crazy over every day. And because I'm always looking at big picture, I'm trying to figure it out. And I think that we're just so the. It's a magic. It's smoke and mirrors. We have no control over our success. You know that's not true. But it's moving more in that direction.
- [96:55]
B
Correct, I agree.
- [96:56]
A
So we have to do something about it now. We have to take the power back. And I think that that's why I got so excited when I was listening to you talk. I'm like, this is a pivotal moment right now. But it has to take consciousness. It has to take intentionally knowing how it works and not playing the game.
- [97:12]
B
Right. You know, you had, I can't, man, I can't remember who you had on. And I think it was a barbecue joint. And maybe they were Michelin recognized. Truth Barbecue, maybe. And they were appreciative of the recognition, but prior to that recognition, and I think they would say that, you know, things were okay at best. And then after the. And it might not have been your podcast, but after the recognition, they took off, you know, and it's just like, man, really, I mean, you're not doing anything different other than you got put into publication, you know?
- [97:40]
A
Right.
- [97:43]
B
And I would be appreciative too, but you're not necessarily just going based on the merits. Right, right. And you could be to say the same thing for apps. I mean, is it really fair that you have this app and that app and.
- [97:54]
A
Well, part of it's first to market restaurant. Like, if you're first to market. Like, was Ovation first to market or. I know that there was like, I don't think that.
- [98:01]
B
Well, are you talking about in apps? Are you talking about in restaurants?
- [98:04]
A
Well, is it. What were you talking about? Naps?
- [98:06]
B
I'm talking specifically about restaurants. Oh. But yeah, first to market in. In apps definitely does help. And, And I don't. I don't think it necessarily matters in restaurants and first to market. But man, just for a publication to kind of turn you just. Somebody wrote an article about you, and all of a sudden, or an influencer comes in and all of a sudden,
- [98:25]
A
I mean, that's part of my, My pushback with our current relationship with a word culture. Because these platforms do carry so much influence.
- [98:38]
B
Oh, they do.
- [98:40]
A
So like, I beat up on James Beard. I beat up a Michelin star. And I don't think that they're even evil people. I just think that, that our culture, we. We just put so much emphasis. Like James Beard. Right. They. They give out. How many regions is it? That's northeast. It's like south, Southeast.
- [98:56]
B
We're not in that. I have no idea.
- [98:57]
A
South Texas. It's like, how many different market. I mean, they have like the whole country broken up into like six different markets. Okay, Right. And they say this restaurant's the number one restaurant in this massive market where there's millions of people and tens of thousands of restaurants. This one's number one. Who the fuck do you think you are to like, even if it's like the system is a bunch of people get together and vote, there are like, it's such an uneven distribution. Distribution of attention. Correct, for one. And then once you get. You get your one year run and then you get to say, you know, a few years ago we were number one, but by then the Consumer is already moving on to the next concept because they're more loyal to James Beard's recommendation than to the actual restaurant.
- [99:45]
B
I'm with you.
- [99:46]
A
You know, like, and it. I just think that that's a distribution. It's not. We. It's not. Right. You know, are they evil? No, I just think.
- [99:54]
B
I don't know. Conceptually, it's the same thing with apps, right? I mean, same same conversation, right? Are they evil? No, they're not evil.
- [100:01]
A
They're just trying to make it.
- [100:02]
B
They're trying to make it and they're playing the game. They're playing the game and that, you know. And does it help the bigger guy?
- [100:06]
A
Yeah, yeah.
- [100:07]
B
And, man, what can the little guys. To do to. Kind of all you're trying to do is level the playing field, right? That's. Yeah, that's why I'm here.
- [100:16]
A
So instead of bitching, like I'm doing right now, I don't. I want to be optimistic. I want to be hopeful. I want to. You know, I think I love the definition of a leader as somebody who's. Who is a dealer of hope. You know, what do we do going forward? In your eyes, how do we move the industry in the right direction? What's the solution?
- [100:34]
B
Oh, it's a loaded question, really. Mud, if you're trying to move it forward, if that's the goal, right, you have to define where you're at. And I think if you want to
- [100:47]
A
go forward,
- [100:49]
B
are you unhappy where you're at? I mean, I think you have to define that first, right? I'm happy where I'm at. Somebody outside like, oh, Albert only wants one store. He doesn't want four. No, man, I'm happy where I'm at. So if you're talking about go forward, what is. What does that look like? What to you specifically? All the listeners, like, are you okay with the work life balance with your kids? Are you going to. To the. To the play? Okay, you don't have three stores, or you're not getting a call from three different locations. You're only getting a call from one. And if you're okay, I think it's okay to be there and not necessarily looking for the next location. And I don't know if that resonates with other people, but that's where I'm at, and I think that's okay. So when I hear the question, like, hey, where does this industry go forward? I think it's. It goes forward by literally looking at where you're at today, present day, and either you're not okay with what's going on. And that could. That could literally mean, Eric, that you leave the industry. That makes me unhappy. I'm stressed out.
- [101:51]
A
Yeah.
- [101:51]
B
Or, yeah, I'm cool with it. OR ALBERT At 25, I want 8, 10, $12 million. But it starts with, hey, where are you at right now? And are you happy? Yeah, that's my answer. That's the truth. That's my honest answer.
- [102:07]
A
Yeah. I would love to have you join us in the network for a conversation around this. If you're listening to this right now and you're interested in the subject. I mean, you're a member of the network.
- [102:18]
B
Yeah.
- [102:19]
A
We would love. I'd love to have you lead a conversation on.
- [102:21]
B
Love it.
- [102:22]
A
Yeah.
- [102:22]
B
In terms of vibe coding.
- [102:23]
A
Yeah.
- [102:24]
B
Or anything. Yeah. I don't know about. I think life lessons or anything.
- [102:28]
A
In this moment, my vision for the network is to create this space where independent restaurant owners can just come and share. I honestly don't want it to be the Eric Cator show.
- [102:39]
B
Right.
- [102:39]
A
I'm the host of the Independent of the Independent Restaurant Industries podcast. You know what I'm saying? Like, I'm just the person that's going around like, the. The. The operators are the show, and I. And that's where I'm trying to get with the community, where the operators are the community. I'm just hosting the space.
- [102:58]
B
I think you've already done that.
- [102:59]
A
I think we could do it better.
- [103:00]
B
Okay.
- [103:01]
A
Well, I'll be honest. It's a struggle. Like, I'm struggling with the network. I believe in what I'm doing, but just like any owner trying to start a restaurant, it takes years of.
- [103:09]
B
Hey, I told you. I listened to the quesadilla that gentleman, and there was two people, man. I thought that was awesome.
- [103:15]
A
Yeah. Kyle Gordon.
- [103:17]
B
Yes.
- [103:17]
A
We do a QSR power hour, man. And that's my vision is to. I want to create space to invite the best operators I've had on the show. So Kyle is a QSR operator.
- [103:31]
B
Successful. Yeah.
- [103:32]
A
Successful and local, too.
- [103:34]
B
Right? Dallas.
- [103:34]
A
He's Dallas. Why not just get five or six of these people to be our leaders, our mentors for the QSR 12 to 20 unit, or, you know, the way I break it up in my mind, 1 to 3 units, 4 to 10 units, 11 to 20 units, 20 more. So why not have four or five people to represent all the different markets? And then we have a place where you can come to get together and find people like you across the country.
- [103:58]
B
I love it.
- [103:58]
A
Where we just come and we share best Practices. And we're recording all that information. We upload that information to an LLM where you can ask that. That LLM based off of the thousands of conversations that have happened, including all the recordings of this podcast. What is the answer to this?
- [104:14]
B
Right.
- [104:15]
A
So we just decentralize and democratize knowledge, but more importantly, we're helping all the vibe coders across the country in the restaurant space come together and say, what are you doing? What are you doing? What are you doing? We have to decentralize and democratize the power. We have to. We have to create a space where people can come with no ulterior motive.
- [104:36]
B
Right.
- [104:36]
A
Other than to say, you can learn this. I want. I have information I want to share. And if I add to this pool, I can withdraw from the pool. We don't need to be spending thirty, fifty, a hundred thousand dollars on restaurant consultants. And no offense to the hundreds of restaurant consultants since I've had on the show that have contributed to this pool. But the fact of the matter is the world is changing and we can do it a different way that just. That spreads out the resources and that distributes wealth better. And if you're holding knowledge, I think if we know something, I think that we should share that. That makes us all better.
- [105:15]
B
I agree.
- [105:16]
A
You know, so anyway, I'm not mean
- [105:20]
B
for this to be a pitch for
- [105:21]
A
restaurant stoppable network, but that's what I'm trying to build and I'm struggling building.
- [105:24]
B
The same thing that you just said is exactly the reason that I love that one seminar so much is like, listen, we're all going in just as operators. Nobody has a tag, nobody's taking a piss and seeing who's is bigger.
- [105:33]
A
Yeah.
- [105:33]
B
Let's just learn.
- [105:34]
A
Yeah.
- [105:34]
B
You know, and if you have Kyle from what's it, what's Quesadillas Diaz, man, obviously super successful. Or somebody else that whether it be leadership or somebody with vibe code.
- [105:47]
A
Fine dining.
- [105:47]
B
Fine dining. Whatever it is, whoever is.
- [105:49]
A
What's working today?
- [105:50]
B
What's working for you, You've obviously implemented it. And then us, 4, 5, 6, 7, without name tags or a pissing contest.
- [105:58]
A
Right.
- [105:58]
B
Can learn.
- [106:00]
A
But what if we democrat or we democratize technology?
- [106:03]
B
I don't think. Well,
- [106:07]
A
why couldn't we?
- [106:08]
B
You already are.
- [106:09]
A
Well, yeah, but in a. I mean, just look.
- [106:12]
B
Look at the history of technology. Right? When did you get your first personal computer?
- [106:17]
A
Me personally? College.
- [106:18]
B
Okay. What year Was that?
- [106:20]
A
Like 2003.
- [106:22]
B
Okay.
- [106:22]
A
I have my own personal.
- [106:23]
B
And before that, I'm talking about people in general, just the general population.
- [106:28]
A
When did people have their own.
- [106:29]
B
Yeah. When did it hit the masses? Probably around that same time.
- [106:32]
A
Right?
- [106:32]
B
Yeah.
- [106:33]
A
And, but I'm saying I got it because of college.
- [106:35]
B
I needed but five, six years, seven years, it was maybe you could argue, just the elite, people with money. Right. Okay. What about TVs, what about radios? Right.
- [106:42]
A
And eventually it comes down.
- [106:43]
B
Exactly.
- [106:44]
A
But I think the cool thing, Moore's Law. Exponential, right. Technology evolves exponentially and as it evolves, more and more people can get access to that. And the cool thing about AI is that like, we're for the first time, I think, very collectively conscious of there. The. When the dot com boom happened, a bunch of people got rich. You know, then social media was like the next boom, right? A bunch, A bunch of people got rich. And this is, this next thing is going to make a bunch of people or a very few amount of people get very rich.
- [107:13]
B
There was an article.
- [107:15]
A
A bunch of people get rich.
- [107:16]
B
There was an article. Not. I, I should have saved it. That the first trillionaire, if it's not Elon Musk, is probably eight, nine years old today.
- [107:27]
A
Oh, wow.
- [107:29]
B
And then he's going to build something with AI that's going to make him the next trillionaire. Yeah, I believe that.
- [107:35]
A
Yeah.
- [107:36]
B
And listen, I think it's, I think, I think it's already done that. I think AI has already done that. Where before, if you wanted, even today. Look at you. You said I can't do technology. I mean, rewind. Twenty years ago, it was even more difficult.
- [107:51]
A
I can, I just prefer to not
- [107:53]
B
look at it, but it's the same thing. I have my son like everybody has. You know, you can go out and buy a lawnmower or you can hire your own gardener. Right? Yeah, it's the same thing.
- [108:00]
A
Right. I think the world is going to go in like two directions real soon. Like, you're either going to be somebody who loves to get immersed in technology and you leverage technology, or you're somebody who loves to immerse themselves in people and relationships. I think you're. That's left, right, brain, Right. I tend to lean in the direction of people in relationships. That's what gets me going. I love connecting with people. I love meeting people. I love learning from people. And I'm just going to lean into that. I'm going to surround myself with the people that love the technology because that just doesn't fill me up. At the end of the day, that's what we're doing at restaurants. Like I, I this year or as of this month, I Have a director of operations.
- [108:36]
B
Okay.
- [108:36]
A
I just brought on. Jared's still going strong. He's our editor. We. We brought on a intern marketer, and we just had one of our community members, Daniel Ham, who's been a part of the network for, like, since I started. He's going to start helping do community management. So I'm actually getting to the point in my evolution where I'm like, I need to. I can't do it alone. I have big dreams, big ideas. But, like, I need to focus on what I do, which is to find the badasses, to go find those people across America that are off the right. The radar. But the industry knows, the operators in that city know that this person exists because they're not looking for the attention. Like, they're just badass operators. Like, who are those people?
- [109:18]
B
Right.
- [109:19]
A
And like, how do we bring them in? That's what. That's my job.
- [109:21]
B
Love it.
- [109:22]
A
You know, so I'm excited, man. Any final thoughts before we wrap it up?
- [109:25]
B
No, man, I know my. When I say my people, this industry people, sometimes we can kind of get stuck on pen and paper, you know, I mean, still talking to this day, talking to operators. Literally still have their schedule taped to the wall.
- [109:41]
A
Yeah.
- [109:42]
B
You know, and I just. I think that's part of who we are as operators sometimes just. Just hesitant to change. Yeah, man. Just keep an open mind. I mean, that. That would be my final thought. Yeah. And use technology instead of being scared of technology. And I think that's why so many businesses went out of business during COVID that it did require just an app, an adaptation to technology faster than what they were willing or able to move at. Right. So I talk to all my operate men. Embrace it, learn it. You know, I think we grow as it.
- [110:16]
A
Yeah. This has been a lot of fun, man. I got a couple questions we asked all of our guests, and the first one I have for you is what is one thing about your business? A value, a process, a system that makes you truly unstoppable, man.
- [110:30]
B
I like to talk to my people. You know, there's a young lady right here, and I. I came up to her and I was like, hey, what makes you amazing? And it threw her off guard. And she couldn't answer, whether it be because she's humble or whatever. And I'm like, well, we're going to come back to that. Yeah. You're going to tell me tomorrow what makes you freaking amazing. I didn't use freaking. You know, I was trying to pump her up. Right. And I've been doing the drop an F bomb. Yeah. It was like, hey, but it's okay. And we have a relationship where every F bomb every once in a while is acceptable. Right. What makes you amazing? That you look in the mirror like, I'm fucking badass. Right. That goes back to my point, man. Listen, you got to build these people up, and if I'm not going to bring the opportunity to them in five years, man, I'm going to help them get that opportunity outside of here. And part of that is realizing your own value.
- [111:17]
A
Yeah, man. We need more like you in the industry.
- [111:19]
B
That's for sure.
- [111:20]
A
We have plenty of them. Don't get me wrong. But that's the game. That's the game right there.
- [111:23]
B
She might be here today. I don't know.
- [111:26]
A
The mission statement is to change the world through inspiring, empowering, and transforming the industry. We're going to do that by transforming one owner at a time. How have you personally transformed that as an owner?
- [111:36]
B
I hope I'm doing it now.
- [111:37]
A
Yeah.
- [111:37]
B
You know, part of me, you know, just kind of being humble and kind of being under the radar, man, but. And I'm not any brighter than any other operator out there, but if I can learn vibe coding that anybody else can too.
- [111:49]
A
Yeah.
- [111:49]
B
And if my contribution to this industry that's given so much to me, I mean, listen, I'm married with three kids. I'm a homeowner and have been since I'm 23 or whatever it is. And you can argue all from the success of the restaurant industry, man. Why wouldn't you want to give back to this industry? Yeah. Right. Seriously.
- [112:07]
A
Yeah, man. The last question. If you got the news you'd be leaving this world tomorrow, all the memories of you, your work in your restaurants will be lost with your departure. With the exception of three pieces of wisdom that you could leave for the good of humanity and your legacy. What were those three pieces?
- [112:19]
B
That's such a loaded question, man. That is. I mean, that's.
- [112:22]
A
It's not like you've never heard it before.
- [112:23]
B
I mean, I. I asked my wife, I. I saw, and I'm like, man, and it's not sexy. I'm like, man, be kind. 1. Literally, be kind. Yeah. Share.
- [112:36]
A
2.
- [112:39]
B
Oh, man, there's so many, right? And unite. Yeah. I think. I don't want to get political, man,
- [112:46]
A
but I think the super bowl, that was pretty great.
- [112:50]
B
It was. I thought it was great.
- [112:51]
A
I thought it was a great show.
- [112:52]
B
And I'm not a fan.
- [112:52]
A
I don't speak Spanish, and I had no idea I do, but it was a good show.
- [112:56]
B
Listen, I speak Spanish.
- [112:57]
A
Yeah.
- [112:58]
B
And I didn't know what he was saying. Right. Just because the dialect in the difference. Right. But the message. Yeah, listen man, we're all in the same boat.
- [113:06]
A
I think we needed that right now.
- [113:07]
B
I really do.
- [113:08]
A
You know, we're. At the end of the day, we're, we are. I believe that we are literally all the, the same person 100%. You know, we, we, if we all come into this world, we intake the world through a different perspective. We all have this, this compiling series of, of experiences that make us into who we are. But we all start as the same person 100%, you know, and when we remember that that person that I don't agree with is just me with a different perspective and like, who cares who's right? Like try to understand that person's perspective, you'll learn that you probably have more in common, you know. And I thought it was cool that they did that.
- [113:48]
B
I'm a fan of Ban Bunny now, just for the record.
- [113:50]
A
Yeah, it was, it was cool.
- [113:51]
B
It was.
- [113:52]
A
Man, this is a lot of fun. If we are interested in connecting with you. I don't even know, like do you have these three solutions or force.
- [114:01]
B
Just, just Hot Shift Pro. That's the only one. Everything else is just built for me.
- [114:05]
A
How many people are using that right.
- [114:06]
B
Right now? So we got four operators using it. Four paid operators. I only count if you're paying. Yeah. And hopefully we can kind of grow it. And I'm listening to operators and so far they've are experienced the same challenges and simple challenges like side work. Right. And hopefully we can grow it a little bit and help. Help people along the way. And you don't have to sign up to Hot Shift. You know, if you just want to learn and build your own, let's do it.
- [114:33]
A
Yeah.
- [114:33]
B
Yeah. You know, that's why I'm here.
- [114:35]
A
Yeah. I love that, man. And how do we connect?
- [114:38]
B
Alberthot Shift Pro?
- [114:40]
A
Okay. And we'll have links to the Show Notes. If you're listening to this on any platform, just go to the Show Notes. We'll have links to connect and I would love to have you again come into the network and lead conversation about this. I think it would be really cool to create a community of people creating solutions or at least coming together to create solutions for the independent minutes and making it affordable.
- [115:00]
B
Love to.
- [115:00]
A
You know, that'd be really cool. So stick around for the closing thoughts. I'll have a date when Albert will be live in the network. To engage in conversation.
- [115:09]
B
Look forward, man.
- [115:10]
A
This is when I say thank you so much for reaching out and inviting me into your restaurant and teaching me more about vibe coding and helping me understand that there's a real opportunity here, a renaissance, you know, I don't know if you call it renaissance or revolution.
- [115:23]
B
Revolution.
- [115:24]
A
Revolution is probably a better word. Just thank you so much, man. There is no questioning. You are unstoppable.
- [115:29]
B
Thank you.
- [115:30]
A
Cheers. There's another episode wrapped up here at Restaurant Unstoppable. Special thanks to our guest today, Albert Sanchez, for coming on. Man, what you're doing with vibe coding is so cool. I'm excited for the future of the industry. I have this vision of independent restaurant owners solving their own problems, developing their own software, using tools like AI to vibe code in to help us become a little more independent. I think that's what the independent restaurant industry needs is, is, you know, to be able to solve our own problems, to support each other with creating solutions, passing things around. And that's what my vision for Restaurant Stoppable Network is, is independent restaurant owners coming together, sharing knowledge, sharing wisdom, perspective, but also sharing resources, sharing tools. We do go further together. Albert is in the network. He's going to be live on the 6th, April 6th, with, I believe he's going to be joining Chris Schultz. If you want to join Chris Schultz in Albert Sanchez Live for coffee with Eric. If you want to connect with the people I'm getting on the show, learn, go deeper, ask the questions you wish I asked, head over to restaurantstoppable.com c w e and if you want to join this conversation and all future conversations and support this mission to inspire, empower and transform and support the independent restaurant industry, then we would love to have you join our community. Head over to restaurantstoppable.com live and if you just want to support this show and you don't want to join the community, those reviews go so far. And just share this thing with anybody and everyone you know, subscribe. That helps too. Thank you in advance. We'll see you next time.