1267: Ron Cardwell, Director of Commodity Strategy at Restaurant Technologies

Summary

Restaurant Unstoppable Podcast – Episode 1267

Guest: Ron Cardwell, Director of Commodity Strategy at Restaurant Technologies
Host: Eric Cacciatore
Date: April 6, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode features a deep-dive conversation with Ron Cardwell, Director of Commodity Strategy at Restaurant Technologies, Inc. (RTI). Eric and Ron explore the world of commodity oils in the restaurant industry, touching on procurement, trends (like the debate between seed oils and tallow), sustainability, and the critical role oil management plays in both efficiency and food quality. Practical insights are shared for both large and independent restaurant operators, with special attention to how RTI helps streamline oil usage, disposal, and recycling into renewable fuels — making kitchen operations safer, more sustainable, and more cost-effective.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Ron Cardwell’s Background & Role at RTI

• Ron’s Journey in Food Oils

  • Started career in agricultural processing, worked with farmers and manufacturers (corn, soybeans, wheat, canola).
  • Eventually specialized in food oils, working closely with large food manufacturers and learning about the subtle nuances and functionalities of different oils.
  • Joined RTI in 2022 as Director of Commodity Strategy, a role he feels was “written for” him.
    (09:01–19:11, 18:54)

• What Does a Commodity Strategist Do?

  • Oversees purchasing and disposition strategies for vegetable oils as commodities.
  • Helps customers optimize oil selection for price, functionality, and sustainability.
  • Key Quote:
    “My job is to look at oils, vegetable oils, food oils… and there’s a strategy behind how you handle them on the purchasing side and the disposition side.” — Ron Cardwell (06:05)

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2. Understanding Oil as a Commodity

• Definition of Commodity
  • Something produced in strict standardized grades (e.g., soybean oil), interchangeable between suppliers.
  • Key Quote:
    “Commodities are the ingredient baseline that everybody needs or wants, but you don’t differentiate anything on them until you turn them into something.” — Ron Cardwell (08:56)
• Oil’s Pervasiveness in Food & Beyond
  • Oil is present in a vast array of products and processed foods.
  • Parallels drawn between crude petroleum and vegetable oil in terms of extraction, refining, and use of byproducts (lecithin, vitamin E).
    (11:16–13:50)

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3. RTI’s Business Model & Services

• Automated Oil Management System
  • Installs two tanks (approx. 1,400 lbs, or 600 gallons): one for fresh oil distribution, one for used oil collection.
  • Closed-loop system delivers, monitors, filters, collects, and recycles oil, eliminating hazardous manual oil handling.
  • Greatly enhances kitchen safety and operational efficiency.
  • Key Quote:
    “The biggest safety risk in a kitchen is emptying hot oil out of a fryer and trying to carry it out back to dispose of it. We eliminate that.” — Ron Cardwell (24:16)
• Oil Sourcing & Customization
  • RTI does not manufacture oil but sources it to customer specifications, leveraging purchasing power for independents.
  • Can consult and help restaurants determine the best oil for their needs.
  • “We are oil agnostic… we don’t make an oil that we’re pushing on you. We really want to get you the one you want.” — Ron Cardwell (31:24)
• Bulk Delivery Logistics
  • Trucks can deliver multiple oil specifications simultaneously (e.g., McDonald’s, KFC, independents).
  • Supports both large chains and hundreds of independents, who make up more than half of RTI’s business.
    (32:27–34:43)
• Used Oil Recycling
  • 100% of used cooking oil collected is sent to renewable diesel or biodiesel producers.
  • “We send it to fuel manufacturers for them to make renewable diesel out of. So it’s diesel fuel that goes into any vehicle that runs diesel.” — Ron Cardwell (25:42)
  • Restaurants receive credit on their invoice for the value of their used oil.
    (57:12, 57:53)

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4. Seed Oils vs. Tallow: Trends, Science & Supply

• Industry Shifts
  • Historical context: restaurants moved from beef tallow to vegetable oils in the 1980s–90s due to concerns on saturated fat and health.
  • Recent consumer trends: Increased interest in returning to animal fats (tallow) for perceived health and flavor reasons (e.g., cleaner label, keto appeal, less processed).
  • Key Quote:
    “Before the seed oil versus tallow discussion, we were already exploring carrying tallow for a couple of customers... we worked with the manufacturer to procure a product that’s liquid at room temperature.” — Ron Cardwell (42:18)
• Handling Tallow
  • Technically challenging: tallow is solid at room temperature, but can be processed (fractionated) to stay liquid for RTI’s system.
  • Involves modifications (heated, insulated tanks and lines).
  • Tallow is more expensive and limited in supply; restaurant operators are cautioned it will significantly change menu flavor profiles and cost structure.
  • “You can’t cook everything in tallow because there literally isn’t enough tallow on earth.” — Eric (47:20)
• Health & Skepticism
  • Host and guest acknowledge ongoing debates around seed oils’ health impacts; RTI remains neutral, serving customer preferences.
  • “We’re not here to champion whether you should use [one oil over another]... If you want it, we can get it.” — Ron Cardwell (38:00, 44:28)
• Market Realities
  • Supply of tallow is constrained by the limits of beef production; most tallow is used in non-food sectors like cosmetics, fuel, and industrial uses.
    (48:27–50:43)

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5. Sustainability & the Circular Economy

• Impact of Oil Disposal
  • RTI’s system eliminates “nasty” and dangerous back-of-house oil handling.
  • Used oil is collected in a way that it’s clean enough for top-value renewable fuel production.
  • “Every restaurant that we service contributes to that renewable economy in a way that they should be proud of.” — Ron Cardwell (55:46)
• Carbon Footprint
  • By partnering with RTI, restaurants take a substantial step towards a lower carbon footprint and waste reduction.
  • Closed system means less contamination and higher byproduct value for renewable fuel conversion.

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6. Supporting the Independent Restaurant Community

• RTI leverages its scale to offer independents purchasing power, safety, and technical expertise otherwise reserved for large chains.
• “Independent restaurant owners make up about 60 to 65% of the total market... if we don’t band together, then we’re so much—we are the majority together.” — Eric (33:02)
• RTI sees independents as core and amplifies their cost savings and operational efficiencies.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “Don’t panic. Like whatever’s thrown at you, there’s no reason to panic. You’ll never solve anything by panicking.” — Ron Cardwell, on his life mantra (04:08)
• “My job is to look at strategy of how vegetable oil affects a business.” — Ron Cardwell (06:05)
• “Tallow’s very nature is... a big brick of fat. It didn’t really fit the nature of how our system [worked]… but we procured a product that’s liquid at room temperature.” (42:39)
• “You know your business better than we do, but we will know how to handle the oil for you better than anybody else.” — Ron Cardwell (65:35)
• "If you designed your menu to say, I'm going to serve things that really are good for you... is that going to be serving your customers and their demand? Maybe, or maybe not..." — Ron Cardwell on balancing health, demand & economics (61:46)
• “We want you to forget about it. [With RTI] you forget to order your oil, you forget to have them empty it out… because you’ve dialed in that part of the business.” — Ron Cardwell (65:35)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• Intro & Ron's Arrival (02:33)
• What is a Commodity Strategist? (06:05)
• Commodities in Food & Oil (09:00)
• Sourcing, Processing, Byproducts (11:16, 12:18)
• How RTI Works for Restaurants (20:07, 23:46)
• Independent Restaurateurs & Buying Power (33:02)
• Oil Trends: Seed Oils vs. Tallow (36:46, 41:09, 42:18)
• Handling Tallow — Tech & Supply Issues (42:39, 51:01)
• Sustainability & Used Oil as Fuel (55:46)
• Closed-Loop Advantages & Cost Savings (57:53)
• Health, Food Economics, and the Industry’s Role (59:28, 61:09)
• RTI’s Call to Action & Industry Impact (71:31)

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Episode Takeaways

• RTI streamlines oil procurement, management, and recycling for both independents and large chains, eliminating labor, cost, and safety headaches.
• The choice of oil in a restaurant affects cost, sustainability, and customer experience. RTI helps operators balance those variables.
• Current industry trends are seeing a “back to basics” with interest in tallow, but significant supply, cost, and operational challenges remain.
• Used oil is a valuable input to the renewable fuel market, providing both an additional revenue stream and green credibility for participating restaurants.
• RTI’s value proposition goes beyond product — they actively empower independents with scale and expertise, making the technology accessible industry-wide.

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Call to Action

• Learn more at rti-inc.com
• For more resources and information, join the Restaurant Unstoppable community for ongoing conversations, tools, and network access.

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For a thorough breakdown of this discussion, actionable advice, and further industry resources, visit restaurantunstoppable.com and check out the show notes.

Transcript

[A]

A couple things before we get started today. First, thank you so much for showing up week after week making my vision for restaurants unstoppable come true. Your downloads are allowing me to do this show the way I've always wanted to do it. Boots on the ground, word of mouth, leaders, referring leaders giving the industry an uncensored, no BS platform to share their perspectives and truth. That's on you. Thank you so much. And we're just getting started. So if you're enjoying what we're doing here and you want to help us do it even better, please subscribe to this podcast on your platform of choice. And if you do that, I promise to do everything in my power to continue to improve the show. I'll deliver the restaurant tours you want to hear from and we'll continue to make everything you love about this show better. Thank you. Welcome to restaurant unstoppable. For 10 years and over 1,000 episodes, I've been traveling the country chasing word of mouth leads and having in person only long form discussions with the industry's finest owners and operators. Our mission is to inspire, empower and transform the restaurant industry by bridging the gap between this generation's leaders and the next. Listen to today's guest and so many others and get one step closer to becoming unstoppable. This episode is brought to you by Restaurant Technologies, the leader in automated cooking oil management. Their total oil management solution is an end to end closed loop automated system that delivers, monitors, filters, collects and recycles your cooking oil, eliminating one of the dirtiest jobs in the kitchen. Restaurant technologies services over 45, 000 customers nationwide. Automate your oil and elevate your kitchen by visiting RTI Inc.com or call 888-779-5314 to get started. This episode is made possible by US Foods. Running a successful restaurant takes more than just great food. With US Foods, you can expect more high quality products, advanced tools and flexible deliveries to grow your business. Their industry leading moxy platform also does more than just place your US Foods order. It uses AI to help you take control, save time and increase profitability. Visit usfoods.com expect more to learn how to become a US Foods customer one more time, that is usfoods.com expect more with excitement.

[B]

Allow me to introduce to you today's guest Director of Commodity Strategy at Restaurant Technologies, Inc. Ron Cardwell. Ron, my man, are you feeling unstoppable today?

[C]

I feel more excited about my title than I've ever felt before. The way you introduce me as energy and it, it's, it's a welcome energy.

[B]

I'm excited for today's conversation, man. And it's never, not every day I get to talk to a director of Commodity strategy.

[C]

Yeah, you know, it's. Look, I'm excited. It's not every day everybody wants to kind of hear what our business is. And believe me, I'm not the most popular guy to cocktail party. So it's so nice to talk to people in the industry who get it.

[B]

I love it. I had to do a little research to even find out what the heck a director of Commodity strategy is. I had a great conversation with Chat GBT this morning and it's a really

[A]

valuable role and we're gonna, we're gonna

[B]

unpackage what that is and what you do and some of the trends that are happening across the the nation relative to oil and moving towards tallow and the things that RTI is doing behind the scenes to make sure their customers are getting a maximum ROI on their

[A]

investment, which is where you come in.

[C]

Right.

[B]

And I can't wait to get into that. But before we dive in, let's get that. Actually, I want to let the listeners know this is my second interview with RTI. The first one was episode 1051 with Ryan Bolds. In that episode, we kind of introduced Restaurant Technologies Inc. Deep into like, what is RTI and the services you provide. If you're interested in learning more, I would say go back to that episode 1051. Today we're going to pick up where we left off. But.

[A]

But before we pick up where we

[B]

left off, let's get that motivational inspirational

[A]

ball rolling with the success quote or mantra.

[B]

What do you got for us?

[C]

One that I live by and I think I tell my kids all the time and it seems like an abstract thing. If you're familiar with Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy, I love the rules in there. And primarily number one rule is don't panic. Like whatever's thrown at you, there's no reason to panic. You'll never solve anything by panicking. Look through and try to find a logical solution or deal with it. So that's kind of my first that

[B]

I really live by such an easy time to panic right now. So easy.

[A]

There's so much going on in the

[B]

world and like we're just being like thrown all this information and we know when like, like anything in the world happens at any given point, we have this information.

[A]

So there's never a downtime.

[B]

There's just always like this fear from all angles.

[C]

And you know, Eric, we talked a little bit earlier, you know, casually, about there being such a wealth of information out there right now. We're in a great time to find out all the information you can, but you get so much thrown at you. You get this sense that you're not doing something right. What am I missing? What am I doing wrong? What, where are the holes? And it's great to have that access to information, but it's easy to over listen and feel like you're not doing it right. So just don't panic. Yeah, you'll get it and you walk through it and it's no obstacle is too big.

[B]

Exactly. Not only do we have access to all this information, but we, the way we are consuming it too, with these little clips of burst of like fear and like it's like it's a weird time, but it is.

[C]

But I love it. I mean, I love it because then it's a choice.

[B]

Yeah, it is.

[C]

It is a choice.

[A]

We can choose to feed into that

[B]

or we can choose to recognize that at the end of the day, the world's not crumbling around us. It's just an illusion.

[C]

You got it.

[B]

And just keep showing up. I like to say, great way to get this.

[C]

You got.

[B]

So before we dive in, like really, just real quick, like, what is a director of Commodity strategy? And how did you find yourself in this role? Is this something you were doing before for rti or is this your first time in the role?

[C]

Fair question. So the, the title itself, I don't know. It's probably a difficult thing to describe what I'm doing. And we kind of crafted something to say essentially what My job is to look at oils, vegetable oils, food oils. Right. And, and they are a commodity. And within the restaurant industry or the food production industry, oil, vegetable oils, it's commodity. And there's a strategy behind how you handle them on the purchasing side and the disposition side. So what my job title really conveys is that I look at the strategy of how vegetable oil affects a business.

[B]

What is the definition of a commodity?

[C]

Yeah, so the baseline definition is something that you can't produce, like you can't manufacture it. It's just something that exists either because it's grown or mined from the ground, or it's something that is, is just in limited supply, I guess is the best way to put it. Yeah. And. But the other thing about it is one is just like the other.

[B]

I'm. I'm surprised. Seed oils are considered a commodity because they actually have to be manufactured don't they?

[C]

Well, they're. They're grown, they're extracted out of natural things like soybeans and canola, beef, tallow. Those are existing things that are either grown out of the ground and they are in limited supply, and so they have to be extracted from that. But the other part of commodity that makes it important to understand is one is just like the other. So if you think of soybean oil, soybean oil from this manufacturer is exactly the same as another. So there's. It doesn't matter which one you use. They're the same.

[B]

Maybe the only thing that will change that is the source of the soybean is that organic or whatever. Little things like that, the terroir of the soybean.

[C]

It's little things like that that make differences in commodity markets. But when somebody's looking at sourcing an input for, for food production or for manufacturing of any kind, just say steel, steel, steel. It just has. It has a grade it meets, but doesn't matter where you get it, as long as everything meets that grade. One's not different than the other. Now what you do with it, that's where the value comes in, right? And that's. So when you talk about food commodities, when you're out there sourcing menu ingredients, right? You. You want. You want lettuce? Just use something as simple as lettuce. If you're just looking for Boston lettuce, you just make. You just want to make sure, is it fresh and is it local enough that I can get a hold of it when I need it? Other than that, you don't really care much where it's from. Right. What you turn that lettuce into makes that commodity turn into something of value. Your. Your energy, your. Your good. Yes, exactly. And so you turn that commodity into something. So commodities are the ingredient baseline that everybody needs or wants, but you don't differentiate anything on them until you turn them into something. Yeah. Got it.

[B]

So what were you doing before RTI that set you up to be a commodity strategist?

[C]

So my career started out at a very large agricultural processing company. Basically took farm goods, farm inputs, or I should say farm outputs and processed commodity foods. Commodities. You got it. So I worked for a company that processed corn and soybeans and wheat and flour and canola, and they turned all those into food ingredient products.

[B]

Right.

[C]

So I did that for 23 years, and I focused squarely in the. In the food oil business.

[B]

So did you choose that or did it.

[C]

No, it shows me. I. I mean, I Grew up in the suburbs of Dallas. I didn't go anywhere near a farm. I couldn't have identified a farm product. But I went to school in. In central Illinois, So the middle of

[B]

farm country, I was going to guess. You went to. You're an Aggie territory.

[C]

Yeah. No, no, man. I left and went to the Midwest because it was 800 miles from. From home. And that's what every kid wants, right?

[B]

Most kids want to go south for college.

[C]

Definitely bucked that trend. So I. But I graduated a business degree, and I didn't really know where to go. It was a local company that hired me, and it was curiosity, I guess, is the best way to put it. And I just found myself in this business where I'm like, what is this? I know. I mean, I have kind of a proclivity for food. And I see the products that these farmers are growing and they're turning into food ingredients. And so it led me down the road of curiosity. And that got me to the world of vegetable oils. And I spent 22 years just doing things with vegetable oils. And for no reason other than I just found it fast. What was so fascinating, it was going into the grocery store and looking at a grocery aisle. And it's in so many things, right? Your potato chips or any of the snack foods that you have, your bakeries. Every bakery does it. You're frying things in oil. You have oil ingredients in just about every food that you're going into. Every time I go to a restaurant, the oil is present. And what that oil did to food just made it important. And it was just the hidden things. And it kind of not unlike what restaurant technologies is. Is we operate in the background, but we make things happen. Well, oil makes things happen in food. And it just fascinated me. And I don't know why.

[B]

And just generally, not even just like cooking oil, but like, oil, like, period, is fascinating. Like, you think about, like, the oil that we extract from the earth, like, for like. Like literally it goes into everything. Like, when you really look at, like, the different layers of just like crude oil. Is it crude oil?

[C]

Is that technical Petroleum?

[B]

Petroleum, Right. That's right. It's just like, you know, from like jet fuel to car fuel to propane to, you know, diesel for trucks, diesels, you know, for ships. Then there's like the really. I think the really, really thick stuff is the ships. Like, it looks like molasses Bunker oil, right?

[C]

Yeah, you got it.

[B]

And then from there, it's like everything that's left over either goes into. Or asphalt to like plastic goods. Like, it's like there is barely any waste when you look at oil, it's fat. I never knew that until like the like recently I was like, holy cow. Like, and like, what's the negative byproduct? Like carbon, like CO2 and like it's a little like, what else? You know?

[C]

Yeah, I mean, that's kind, that, that's kind of. It is the leftovers. And I love that you drew that parallel because it is a parallel to food oils.

[B]

Right.

[C]

And I. When in the, in the food processing industry, when you, when you pull oil, the oil out of a soybean, it's ugly, it's gross, it's. It's crude. Much like crude petroleum, it's crude vegetable oil.

[B]

I mean that oil, is it any different than the oil that would become the oil that goes in our car if it just was able to get into the earth and pull into it's. It really, it's organic, it's bio.

[C]

You got it. Essentially it performs the same thing and you have to, you have to clean it up to make it edible. But everything you take out of it, like to the impurities, if you will, to make it edible, all those become things, they become lecithin, which is an ingredient in a food products. They spit it out for vitamin E, which go into vitamins. There's all these byproducts that come out of it that. To where you have almost no waste. It's very similar in how crude petroleum works and makes all these products out of, out of the process. Vegetable oil does the same thing. And that very thing is exactly what fascinated me about the market is to look and say, oh, you think it's just this bottle of Crisco that's. Or cooking oil that's in your grocery store. When you look into the process of it and what it creates across the spectrum in the food industry and, and petrochemicals, you know, soy processes or soy byproducts are used in a lot of things like candles and used in coatings for pharmaceuticals and things.

[B]

Yeah, it's truly an abundant resource. It really is.

[C]

It really is. So although I think encapsulating all of that is when I got exposed to it as a guy who really had no knowledge about it and no, no proclivities to how it should be, it just kind of just fascinated me and I just wanted to know more and more.

[B]

So before getting to rti, what exactly was your life like with this relationship?

[C]

Yeah, so it started out very, very basic. I worked with farmers in Iowa. And I bought their soybeans, right. And brought it into our plant where, you know, you process it and you pull that oil out. And then the next stage of my career, I went into the food oil side of it where they cleaned that oil up. And I started working with big food manufacturers. Think of your snack chip manufacturers, your bread manufacturers, your big bakery type places, right. I started working with them on supplying them the oil they needed for their production. And it became a balance between customer service and getting them what they need and also a trading. So the baseline of here's the value of it and having to watch things like global prices for oils and making sure they're paying the right price and we're competitive as well as getting them the exact specifications they needed. And so it led me down that, that road with the food side to say what? Each one of these oils, I thought they were all the same.

[B]

Right? So you're.

[C]

But they're different. Yeah.

[B]

So you're basically working with these producers, manufacturers of goods, and you're, you're basically making sure that they're, that you're engineering the exact type of oil they need for their recipes. They're making sure it's consistent and you're paying attention to the greater macroeconomic situations so that you're maximizing the value of the product.

[C]

Exactly, exactly. And, and along the way is when I started learning about the functionality of things like oils. And you know, when you're making things like a croissant or you're making something like any kind of layered baked good, it's a completely different type of fat or oil that you need there versus when you're putting it in a deep fryer. And so I learned that, oh, these actually have function beyond those properties there. And, and, and then you go into layers, like, well, wait, one tastes different than another, right. And, and how that tastes with. It's just the oil versus included in a food.

[B]

What happens when you heat it up

[C]

and fry it at high temperature? Yeah, yeah, right. So all of those things, I think every year I could, I was in there, like every year I could look at something else and say, wow, this is an amazing, amazing to me. And that's where I can nerd out, is that it's amazing to me. And then we crossed into the early 2000s into the trans fat change and shift in the marketplace. Right. Getting rid of trans fats.

[B]

So I thought, what is a trans fat?

[C]

Yeah, that's a great point. A trans fat is really just a way of adjusting the molecules in a fat or oil to make it function like something else. And the, the most simple explanation is saturated fats were used throughout the food industry for hundreds of years.

[B]

What are saturated fats?

[C]

It's a great inroads. Things like beef tallow, beef tallow, lard. You got to think about when, you know, what if that oil or grease, you see that at room temperature is kind of solid. Yeah. The molecular structure of that make is a saturated. And that's, you know, bad for your heart. And all those things we've heard forever. So the industry created these things called trans fats, which were not saturated, but through some manufacturing, you could change the structure of those molecules to make it appear solid and make it function like it's solid. So it's that functionality without having the nutritional impact of being a saturated fat. Or so a stock. Good science comes around and we realized, oh, those, those trans fats are actually way worse for you. Right. And. And so you had an entire industry built on those trans fats that now had to change out of it.

[B]

Yeah, I think we're going to get more into that as we. Because part of what I want to talk about today, you know, is how RTI is evolving to consumer demand. And I think that's a big part of what conversation and I think what we're talking about now is kind of leading to that.

[C]

Right.

[B]

So how did you find yourself at rti?

[C]

Okay, I. I left the company. I was at, you know, normal downsizing type thing and kind of stepped away from the business. I, when I look back, I call it a sabbatical.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

I thought, I'm going to do something a little different. And you know, I spent 23 years in this, this fats and oils business. Let's try something.

[B]

So much for that, right?

[C]

So much for that. This opportunity came up with Restaurant Technologies and I was familiar with the company.

[B]

I was going to say. You must have been.

[C]

Yeah, absolutely.

[B]

It's a brilliant business model.

[C]

It's so brilliant. And I had enormous respect for the company when I wasn't with the company. And so this position came open and I have to tell you, Eric, it looked like to me, they wrote the job based on my resume.

[B]

That's what I'm thinking as you're sharing your story.

[C]

It was. It really felt that way. And so I was so excited to talk to them. And so they, you know, they put me through the paces, which they should have, and, and I was just lucky enough that they thought there was some value for me coming in. So that was back in 2022. So I spent the last three years, three and a half years with restaurant technology.

[B]

So now that we know what you were doing, how does that world of what you were doing look within the four walls or the confines of RTI and what you're doing for them?

[C]

So, yeah, this is the part that I love is that I get to now work with our sales staff and work with our customers and trying to solve these problems or issues that they may be falling and get them to points where they can have what they need in a better, more efficient way, perhaps in a way that saves money for sure and help walk through any of those changes also with the added benefit of knowing you're doing it in a very sustainable way, because the sustainability side is important to us as a company, and me personally, to know you're going to solve all your needs in a restaurant and you're going to do it with. And us as a company, as rti, we're going to help you do that and we're going to make sure any of your, your output waste is going to be sustainably.

[B]

You know, if people didn't heed my advice and go Back to episode 1051 to fully comprehend what RTI is, I don't think you necessarily have to. But if, if people aren't familiar with RTI get into like that life cycle, like so from. I think it would start with, you know, sourcing oil or lard from men or, you know, I guess commodity producers, farms or whatever. Right? Or I guess, where would you, where does it start for you?

[C]

So it.

[B]

Not the farm.

[C]

We don't manufacture the oil. Right. So we, we get our, we get the oils that we use from a

[B]

company that you formerly worked with.

[C]

Like, that would be one of them, right? That would be supplier. So the large, large agribusiness companies who make huge amounts of the cooking oil. The same stuff, the same oil that would go into a jug, that's me.

[B]

They would work with RTI to. And you would work with the manufacturer to create specifics for like, say one of your customers. Am I allowed to say this? Like McDonald's, am I sure. Public knowledge?

[C]

Yeah, yeah, it's absolutely public knowledge.

[B]

So you would say, okay, what is, what are the specs of frying oil that McDonald's wants? And then you say, okay, these are our specs. And then you would go to the manufacturer and you would say, we need, we're going to, we need to develop this oil. These are the specs manufactured this. We are going to then distribute it throughout the network of McDonald's that is like franchise.

[C]

Okay, that is certainly a way that it can be done. A lot of times what it is is someone, a company that large, they're working with those MC manufacturers.

[B]

I was gonna say that's one thing I learned recently is, yeah, they. How you get the bulk savings.

[C]

You got it. They work with those manufacturers and then we go to those manufacturers, say, this is the specification this customer is, is asking for. Can you supply it to us? So we just kind of get. I don't want to say we're the middle per. Middleman, but we are little distribution. But there are definitely companies much smaller than, than say, McDonald's who don't really have the buying power that McDonald's does. And for sure, we'll go to those companies, say, okay, these are oils that we have. Will they work for what you need or are there specific needs you. And then we work with them to find, okay, let's find the one that you do need. And then, yes, we'll go to those manufacturers and say, we need this oil. Can you supply it for us? And so we'll help the people in the middle for sure who don't have the buying power of say, McDonald's and they don't have the resources necessarily to, to spend on doing all the research and what oils are here or there. So we'll work with them, develop, help them develop what they need and then we can go into the manufacturers.

[B]

Right. You guys don't touch with the, the group purchasing like any of that. Kind of like you're not negotiating on the behalf of your clients.

[C]

Oh, no, no, for sure, for sure. We can, we, we, we certainly can. If you, if you're a restaurant operator and you have, I don't know, 15 or 20 locations, let's just say you feel like you have some buying power, but in the grand scheme of things, you might not.

[B]

Right.

[C]

It's just a small amount, but we have 45,000 customers.

[B]

Yeah. So you can use that.

[C]

So we can use that leverage and do the purchasing on your behalf. Absolutely. Now, same time, if you feel like you have a relationship with a supplier of oil, we're not going to get in between that either. We'll say, great, you develop with them and you can develop your pricing. We'll handle the delivery. Delivery to use. So, so circling back to the, you know, what do we do? We essentially take that oil, whether it's something we've sourced from the supplier or, or you have as a company, we deliver it to you in bulk format instead of those jugs in a box, jibs, as we call them. We're going to put a tank into your restaurant, a small tank.

[B]

How many gallons approximately?

[C]

Approximately. Well, about 1400 pounds is roughly the size of it. So you're talking, you know, 600 gallons or something like that. So it doesn't sound like a small tank. Well, yeah, but it's about the size

[B]

of a water heater.

[C]

It's in your house. That's generally what it is. And we have all kinds of varieties depending on the footprint.

[B]

But you're filling this, this water heater size tank with oil that then you use to fill your fry lighters.

[C]

Yeah, we, we run a line from that tank. We run it to your fryer.

[B]

Yeah. So you are there two tanks or one tank?

[C]

There's actually two tanks. Because the important, or it's equally important for supplying the oil is getting rid of that oil. Right. And so when we put those tanks in, we put two. We put one that has all that fresh oil to feed to your, your, your fryer and we put another one to take the old oil from your fryer and put it into the tank so you don't have to handle it. It really eliminates the risk involved. And we know I won't go down it, but the biggest safety risk has. The biggest safety risk in a kitchen is emptying hot oil out of a fryer and trying to carry it out back to dispose of it. We, we eliminate that.

[B]

It's a nasty job. If you worked in a kitchen that has a fry litter, you know that when it's time to clean the fryer, it's like everyone's like, oh, nobody wants to do it. And we've all been there where like the filter that we're using to filter, you know, the oil like gets bumped and we're not paying attention and you have like this sheet of oil across the ground and then you have to spend time cleaning that. And it's a nasty job. And it can be dangerous. It's hot.

[C]

It's the most dangerous.

[B]

And you have high school kids trying

[C]

to do this most of the time.

[B]

Yeah. So it's a really. So I mean, you're solving a huge problem with the restaurant industry. You're also then pulling that oil, you're taking it and then you're. That's not the end of what you guys do.

[C]

Not at all.

[B]

After it leaves the restaurant. It's not like you're just dumping it into a landfill.

[C]

Never, never, never.

[B]

You're. And now you have a, you have Your own commodity that you're then taking and selling to.

[C]

That's, that's the commodity director. Part of what I do. Right. Is that then becomes this used cooking oil. You hear it referred to colloquially as uco. UCO used cooking oil that's collected. We send it to fuel manufacturers for them to make renewable diesel out of. So it's diesel fuel that goes into any vehicle that runs diesel. So 100% of the of the used cooking oil that we collect from restaurants goes directly to a fuel producer, either biodiesel or renewable diesel.

[B]

So back to this idea of like crude oil that we pull. Like they think of like the oil rigs in Texas and like the South. Right. Like the chemical like compound or the chemical build of that byproduct is the same exact stuff that gets pulled out of the, the, the oil that we think of. When we think of like the oil that comes out of the earth, it. But when you kind of extract all the bits, it's the same. I guess I want to say like chemical, I don't know the word to use, but the same making of the same oil that goes inside of diesel engines. Like it's, it's. But it's just coming from a different source.

[C]

Yeah, it's chemically, chemically, chemically, it's slightly different that it can perform the same way. So while you have. And we don't. I hate going through chemistry, but it is chemistry.

[B]

My restaurant owner is these. I know, like, we don't care.

[C]

It's fatty acid chains, but, but essentially you can run it through a process. It's very, it's not difficult. And turn that into the same diesel fuel that crude petroleum would turn into. And I, when I say the same, I mean it's the same. So. Yeah, so it doesn't look exactly the same, but once it goes through the process, it comes out looking the same.

[B]

Got it. Right. So I have a note here to talk about what oil to use with what and how it relative. Like, I mean, thinking of our end listener, restaurant owners and operators, what should they know relative to rti? And maybe, maybe they're doing chicken fingers or maybe they're. I don't know. What's another thing that gets fried all the time? Maybe it's fried fish. Right. Maybe it's donuts. Right. Like totally different. So like what oil to use with what. So when you get a new client, are you also educating them on like, what is the product that you're creating and what is the optimal oil for that?

[A]

This episode is brought to you by Restaurant Technologies, the leader in automated cooking oil management. Unstoppable restaurant owners know which services to keep in house and which services to

[B]

outsource and oil management is one of those things you should outsource.

[A]

Their Total Oil Management Solution is an end to end closed loop automated system that delivers, monitors, filters, collects and recycles your cooking oil, eliminating one of the dirtiest jobs in the kitchen. Create a more efficient food service operation and ensure consistent food quality with a safer, smarter and sustainable cooking oil solution. Restaurant technology services over 45,000 customers nationwide, including countless past guests on the show. Automate your oil and elevate your kitchen by visiting RTI Inc.com or call 888-779-5314 to get started. This episode is made possible by US Foods. It takes more than great food to run a kitchen these days with US Foods, more means consistently high quality products, industry leading tools, inflexible deliveries that let you grow your business on your schedule. Whatever your goals, US Foods helps you turn them into reality. As a US Foods customer, you'll gain access to their industry leading moxy platform which doesn't just make it easy to place your US Foods order but but it uses AI powered technology to help you take more control of your business and increase profitability. You can also explore the latest issues of Food Fanatics magazine from US Foods. In each issue you'll find real world success stories, bold culinary inspiration and practical profit boosting ideas you can put to work immediately. Visit usfoods.com expectmore to learn how to become a US Foods customer again. That's usfoods.com expect more yeah, I think

[C]

that's a great way to a great way to start at it. I think the our starting point always is you know your menu and what you're trying to get out of it. So we don't want to change that. We want to get out of the menu what you need. So that's I think that's the best point for us to start with a restaurant because we're not going to pretend that we know your kitchen or what or your customers or anything. But what matters when it comes to an oil is you want to know the functionality you're going to need out of it. You want to know the flavor profile you're going to get out of it and you want to know the price impact. I mean those are the three main things that we help look at. Is okay if you're frying a donut versus frying a chicken chicken finger, it's Totally different functionality of the oil. Right. So that we have to dial in on what food are you getting in there. And then the second part of that is what's the flavor you're trying to get? Because every oil will have a different finish flavor. And so we don't want to tell you the right or wrong. We want to get the one that you want. Right. And a lot of restaurants already know they've. Look, we've used this type of oil for years. This is what we like. This is what our customers like. This is the thing.

[B]

Great.

[C]

Because if we have that type, then maybe we can figure out the best way to source it and get you the best price. And we can show you all sorts of cost savings with our system. The system we use. That's an easy thing.

[B]

So you're not necessarily consulting on the type of oil to use. You're basically saying what kind of oil do you want? And how do we procure that?

[C]

Yeah, and sometimes. Yeah, exactly. And sometimes they don't know. And when they don't know, we can help guide them procure it at scale, at volume. Yeah, we sure can. Yep, that's right. That's right. And. And I think the overriding factor is that we are oil agnostic. Okay. We're not. We don't make an oil that we're pushing on you. We really want to get you the one you want. We want to help dial in with what the, what the one you want is if you don't know the one you want. This is just what you always used. Hey, we can ask some questions and figure things out even. Yeah. Maybe trial some stuff and find.

[B]

I've seen the facility and it's really cool. Like you. So you have this truck that drives around, has a big tank on it, but it's not just one oil that's in that tank. Like I saw the back of this, this truck and there was like all different types of valves coming out of it. It. So like you, you carry, you know, maybe you get a McDonald's oil. You carry KFC's oil. And each one of these customers has a different product that they have specifications for. How many different specifications are you carrying at any one time? And in.

[C]

So each truck in theory can carry four different, four different specs. We have some trucks that maybe can carry up to six, but I'm assuming

[B]

McDonald's is on every one of those trucks. Maybe KFC too.

[C]

It's the same safe assumption. Safe assumption.

[B]

And then like what percentage of the oil is going to say your like mom and pop five unit operator.

[C]

Oh. I mean it's more than half of our businesses is still that. I mean McDonald's as, as we know, McDonald's is a customer and they're a huge part of a business. But are by no means are they the majority of our business. Right. We, we have a lot of mom and pops, a lot of mid majors, a lot of small regional players.

[B]

Fun fact, restaurant Independent restaurant owners make up about 60 to 65% of the total market of all restaurants. Which I like to point out because I think when we think there's no hope against, there's no control or there's no. No. Not trying to talk crap about corporations, but I am worried about the independent where it's getting harder and harder for the independence to so, to make it just, it's just, it's a. The world we live in is continuingly better optimized for large corporations. But we have to remember that 65% of restaurants are still owned by independent. So we have to communicate, we have to talk, we have to share information if we want to have a chance to keep the, the scale balanced.

[C]

Right.

[B]

Because if we don't band together, then we're so much. We are the majority together. We have to remember that. Anyway, I digress.

[C]

No, you didn't digress. In fact, you, you hit on something that we think is incredibly important. We concentrate on the small restaurant just as much as we concentrate on the large restaurants. Right. And what we can bring to that small restaurant is all the same things. We can bring that buying power that maybe they don't have kind of like, you know, the buying co ops sometimes that form in restaurants, we can bring that power to them. We can bring knowledge and expertise in helping make those decisions. At least around oil, we can help bring that in. When they don't have a research group or somebody to lean on, we can help. We can add that to there and we can do things like eliminate your safety risk, which we should lower your insurance.

[B]

Lower your cost.

[C]

Yeah, your insurance cost.

[B]

Well, you're purchasing your cost in your insurance. And, and also you guys, we didn't mention you do hood cleaning too. Also lowers your insurance.

[C]

That's something. We don't do that anymore. Just recently closed that segment of our business down and we sure did.

[B]

I thought that was a really cool feature.

[C]

It's a great feature. It. We, we just, we couldn't, we couldn't service it the way it needed to be serviced.

[A]

There's a lesson here.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Do one thing really well.

[C]

Well, yeah.

[B]

And I was curious. No, no. You know, not trying to beat up RTI or anything like that, but when I, when I learned about those features, I was wondering if it's like, at what point is diversification good or should you just stay in your lane?

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

So you guys decided you should stay in your lane?

[C]

I think so. I think, I think. And I can't speak on the business because I didn't get that part of it, but what I, what I know is we were trying to do to solve some problems for the restaurant, which were our real problems. We're hood cleaning, things like that. We were trying to help solve that problem. And I thought we had a really good system that was developed, and I think, I really do.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

It just didn't, it just didn't catch. And the time that we had to concentrate on that, to your point, took away from our time and energy.

[B]

Did you guys sell that portion of the business to another company?

[C]

We did.

[B]

So now there's still that solution still operating.

[C]

It's still operating and I think it's going to operate brilliantly. But I can't. I mean, I don't know enough about how it spun off there. But. But in any case, the small restaurants we think are just as valuable because we want to service them the exact same way. And, you know, I think the cost savings, they amplify more for the independent. Right. You can't afford to lose, have employees injured. You might not have to hire as many people. If you can, can eliminate things like worrying about ordering oil in it and showing up and emptying and things like that. You can dedicate that high school worker to doing something else in the restaurant that will add value besides that. So. So I don't want to lose those independent restaurants. I want all of them to succeed because on a personal note, it makes my dining experience better. I sure love going to these places for dinner, for sure.

[B]

So at what point in this journey, this seed oil tallow journey, do the. Do you kind of come in and do you ever work directly with the restaurants or.

[C]

Absolutely.

[B]

So what's that relationship with. For you and the restaurant?

[C]

So between myself and the restaurant, it always starts with our, Our representative for the restaurant. I say ours. I mean, RTI's representative who.

[B]

Sales rep.

[C]

Sales rep who's handling that restaurant. They're the point of contact for everything with the restaurant. And they reach out. They'll reach out to me recently with the tallow versus seed oil discussion that's come in, I mean, sparked a lot of conversations. There's a Point, the early part of 2025, where at least once a week I was having a conversation with somebody about. About that tallow versus seed oil thing. Right. But it came to be because you have a. Restaurants are concerned about getting their customers what they want and be concerned about providing something nobody else is doing it. Yeah, right. And so that's the first thing that happens. But this is where I'm so happy with the, with the, the work of our sales force and our entire team is. We didn't shy away. We didn't. We didn't handle any type of tallow product for a couple of years.

[B]

When was RTI established as a company? Do you know the year they were formed?

[C]

In the 90s, late 90s, late 90s.

[B]

So after the trans fat movement had kind of cemented itself, started rolling.

[C]

And then the early 2000s was really when it got. Got its footing.

[B]

Well, we kind of alluded to it and I got some notes here and I just want to emphasize RTI is oil, trans fat, saturated fat, agnostic. They will get you what you want. So you're not here to champion whether you should use trans oils?

[C]

Well, I'll say you shouldn't use trans oils for sure.

[B]

Right, Sorry.

[C]

Those are, those aren't. Those aren't available. But.

[B]

But unsaturated. Thank you very much. I am not an oil expert. That's okay.

[C]

Clearly.

[B]

Okay, so, so basically you're, you're just. You're here to get the, the customer, the restaurant, whatever they decide. You know, you're not advocating for one or the other. But there are, you know, was, you know, I think it's. It was around the 90s where, you know, that's when McDonald's went from using tallow to seed oils. And it was probably largely due to the, the economic efficiencies, the costs, the distribution of.

[C]

Yeah, there was kind of twofold. And so just a way. Let's turn on our way back machine and kind of look is really the. When you get into the 80s is when McDonald's. McDonald's based all their fries, all the fried off of beef tallow. That was very common in the restaurant industry, as beef tallow was kind of the, the baseline. Right. It was really the movement to get away from saturated fats which drove McDonald's to using vegetable oil.

[B]

And again, saturated fats are things like. Like that we traditionally butter all those things. The natural.

[C]

You got it. All those naturally occurring things. So it was based on, you know, scientific evidence showing that saturated fats are bad for your heart. You know, they deteriorate cardiovascular health. So the movement was started with saturated fats and that's what made McDonald's move to a vegetable oil based frying oil. Now the beauty of tallow, and I'll save this till the end of the world, is it tastes fabulous.

[B]

I recently got tallow for Christmas.

[C]

Thank you.

[B]

My lovely girlfriend Courtney and I made homemade french fries and I'm like, I'm never going back. This is like, like it tastes so much better.

[C]

Absolutely does.

[B]

I think a lot of the resistance that people and I try to find some research to see if there's anything online at least. Chachi was telling me that there's a lot of this. Like there isn't a ton of evidence to support the claims relative to like whether or not there's, you know, what are the things I wrote down here? The big reasons why people move away from seed oils to tallow is because of inflammation. Ultra processed nature of seed oils. Some people just don't like that the seed oils are unstable when heated and oxidized easily and forming harmful compounds. Adahytes. I'm not good with saying aldehydes. Oh, thank you very much. Aldehydes and lipid peroxide. I don't know. Yeah, I mean that's. Those are the claims. And I and I, we're not here to talk about those claims necessarily. But you do have to be skeptical of this industrial world we live in. And like America is about profit. You know, if there's an, a more profitable model with, with trans fats. Right.

[C]

Yeah. That's what, that's what drove towards the trans fat side.

[B]

So is. Yeah. Is it about profit and is it not necessarily so much about. Yeah. Is it healthier? Was that just a story that they wrote to make it.

[C]

That's right.

[B]

More appealing and easier to sell to America.

[C]

I, I appreciate a healthy bit of skepticism.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

I, I really do. I think there's a good reason to be skeptical when something's being pushed towards you. Right.

[B]

We're just talking about the reason why right now. Again, RTI is agnostic. They will get you whatever you want. But this is. There is a clear trend happening. There is where people are moving away from seed oils towards trans fats. Sorry. Saturated.

[C]

Saturated.

[B]

Thank you. Tallow. This is tallow. Makes me want to say transit tallow. So I think that's just kind of worth bringing to the conversation. It is a lot of health reasons and then a lot of it has to do with just people's values of moving away from ultra processed foods to More natural, actual source foods. It's also keto friendly, which is a huge thing. These are some of the reasons why there's a, this, this move is happening. And one of the things I wanted to come out of today's conversation is that like that really kind of, I was thinking is throwing a wrench in RTI's business model. But that's not true.

[C]

Not true? No, no, not true. We really, before the seed oil versus Tallow, you know, discussion happened, we were already exploring carrying tallow for a couple of customers who've always used tallow. And we couldn't get in there. We couldn't do it. But tallow's very nature is. It's solid. It's. It's a big brick of, of. Of fat.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Anybody who's handled it knows you, you got to peel a wax paper off and dump it into there. And when you take it out, once it cools down, it's going to solidify again. So it didn't really fit the nature of how our system pumping it, pumping it hoses and pumping it through tanks and hoses and disposing of it. It didn't really work. But we worked with the manufacturer of, of tallow and we procured a product that's liquid at room temperature. It's still tallow. The science behind is it's fractionated. Essentially, you kind of spin out the solid parts versus the liquid parts. And so, so we're still, it's still tallow. It's just a, the liquefied version of that tallow. So we were working on that beforehand. So we were, we were in position to say, hey, it's there. So it didn't fit us beforehand, but we weren't against it. It was just a matter of handling the demand. You got it right and then it was by fate. The discussion all of a sudden came to the forefront and we were carrying tallow. And it gets to where you said, but we weren't championing anything. We weren't saying, no, don't do this or don't do that. Just, hey, here's the real limitations and the facts about talent versus cetl. And, and the truth is when the, when society is running towards a trend, we all know everybody's chasing the trends. People lose sight of why. Yeah.

[B]

I think it's also important to point out that saturated fats aren't necessarily healthy for you.

[C]

I think it's, it's good.

[B]

It's less processed. It might be more, I don't know, less heart like har or what's what I'm trying to say, like, easier on your knees and inflammation, like, like that kind of stuff. But like, at the end of the day, you shouldn't be eating everything in saturated fats.

[C]

That's right.

[B]

It's just maybe not as processed and there might not be as chemical byproducts involved.

[C]

And, and I think that's where we, we can come in is just to lay out again, because we're diagnostic what we, we handle. We have tallow, so it's something we can supply, but we want to go in and make sure. Hey, what, what are you chasing again? What's the functionality you're after? What is the flavor you're after? Because those things matter in your restaurant. And we want to be able to say, all right, do you want to change the flavor of your food? This is a theoretical somebody coming to me and saying, hey, we're thinking about maybe getting away from canola oil or soybean oil and using tallow. Can you do that? First of all, yes, we can.

[B]

In how much more expensive is it?

[C]

Sorry, no, that's, that's that again. The second question is it's significantly more expensive.

[B]

Right.

[C]

Or it can be because the commodity, the very nature is it changes all the time. But nine times out of 10, you're going to be paying more for it, for sure. Sometimes in the order of two to three times expensive. It's very expensive because it's in limited supply. So we'll, but we'll address that to the customer ask. We'll say, well, number one, what's your price and sensitivity? I guess it's going to be more expensive. But secondarily, if you're going from using say, a soybean oil or canola, and you go to Italo, your entire flavor profile of your menu will change. Could be, could change for better. Yeah, it could. You know, but sometimes most people don't want to change the flavor of their minion. They like, they developed it because of how it is.

[B]

Right.

[C]

But it will have a change. So we, you know, we try to lay that out and say, if you're ready for all these and you have a, have a higher price sensitivity, you're fine. The flavor is okay, and you like the added flavor and your customers are asking for it. Great. Yeah. But you need to consider all those things.

[B]

It is interesting that we, I think part of the, the challenge with the world we live in, the, the current ecosystem of restaurants is that, like, they're just so unsustainable in terms of, like, everybody wants to eat fajitas, but the cow isn't all fajita, you know, and it's just like we, we as consumers are just. I really do think the consumers are up so bad. It's just like, God, like, can we wake up? Like, we all just want, like food trends are so bad for I think the restaurant industry and just for society generally. Because the world doesn't work like that.

[A]

That's right.

[B]

I think the way that the world like the, if you look at like, like how food is naturally produced in nature, the percentages of like say beef tallow, the food that we should be eating should be the percentage of the animal that is tallow. You know, like, we shouldn't be frying. All of our, all the food we eat shouldn't be fried. Like, we should probably look at like if we like 10,000 years ago, like, what, how would we have been? Like, what would our diet, what would the balance of our diet look like? We should probably try to mimic that.

[C]

Yeah, I think that's a very great way to look at it.

[B]

Yeah. To your point, like, tallow is a limited resource.

[C]

It is.

[B]

We can't cook everything in towel because there literally isn't enough tallow on earth to cook all the food that's on earth.

[C]

Spot on.

[B]

So, like, spot on. Let's kind of look at that and maybe balance our, our like food system off of what's of like supply and demand. But I think as costs go up, that kind of is a natural governor.

[C]

It is. And that's where we find ourselves today. Is that for whatever reason there was a ton of people asking the taller versus seed oil question and we'd walk through. Like I said, I've had hundreds of conversations. Walk through. All right, let's, let's explore what you really want, what you're after and price. And it's definitely one of those supplies. Another one. Do you really want to face a point where you could just not have any oil to run? So as we walk through all of that, those decisions start being made kind of on their own. Is like there's not enough out there. It's not there. And really it's not really achieving what I want or I don't really need that, but, well, it's about guiding through that decision making process. And one of the, one of the things I tell you because, you know, people say, well, can't you just get more tallow? Can't you just get more tallow? And I'll remind them, I'll say, well, cows.

[B]

But then there's a whole argument.

[C]

Like, the only reason tallow industry exists is because that fat is just kind of scraps left over from the beef processing. Nobody's feeding a cow just for the tallow, right? Just for the fat it's producing. So you're really, it's. You're going to have a limited supply period.

[B]

But is all of the tallow that is grown in America utilized?

[C]

Yeah, it's. Oh, it's utilized. It's utilized. There's not a drop that's wasted. Now how it's utilized is a different story. You know, we talked earlier about how, you know, oils are kind of like petroleum and like. Well, guess what? Beef tallow goes into a lot of industrial uses. It goes into a lot of cosmetic usage. It goes into a lot of machinery and manufacturing usages. It turns into fuel. It turns.

[B]

It turns it like, it's like. Yeah, like food safe. Like, I don't know. There's oils that you can use in, like, food equipment. Right?

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Where it's like, food safe.

[C]

You should. Yeah, exactly, exactly. So there's lots of other avenues besides just, you know, wanting us.

[B]

I don't put it on their hands.

[C]

You got the cosmetic industry. Cosmetic industry uses it. There's a lot of uses. And in fact, when you look at the, the usda, you know, grading system for tallow, food grade is at the very top, and it's just a very small percentage of the tallow that's actually graded as food. You have below that, what's called technical tallow, which is it's all cleaned up and ready for some sort of manufacturing or possibly even pharmaceutical use, but it's being used. Right. And so to get more of it into that upper echelon of making sure it's safe for human consumption and cleaned up and all that stuff, it's. It's a lot. There's a lot that has to change. And even if you do that, you'll. You'll increase the supply. But by no means is it going to be something that's just plentiful.

[B]

Right, right.

[C]

So it has its own natural limitations. And it's funny how the market figures this stuff out. Right? Because if you look at charts showing what food oils are used in restaurants by, you know, it's. It's no coincidence that most of the oils used are the ones that are most widely available. So. Right. Soybean oil and canola oil are there and some corn oil. And then you go into the beef tallows and those kind of. You look at the production of those Oils. And that's the same list of volumes that are produced.

[B]

Right.

[C]

It kind of finds its way in there on its own. And it's just a matter of industry finding what it needs to operate efficiently, profitably, and in a way that gets them the food that they want. Whether nutritionally or flavor profile or any of that. It has to matter too.

[B]

So with the tallow delivery, you figured out a solution that keeps it in liquidity form. Is there any heating that's involved with it?

[C]

Yeah, we. We do. We slight changes to some of our. Our equipment which is running kind of heat tracing line through lines. We put an insulation on the tank. Our trucks that operate have to have a little bit more insulation and heating. Not. We're not talking about putting it up to 100 degrees or anything like that. Just to keep it somewhere around 60 degrees Fahrenheit just to make sure it flows there.

[B]

Yeah, there is room temperature. It's literally liquid. But when you're driving around the northeast this time.

[C]

You got it.

[B]

Or the north in general when it's like negative five degrees out. I'm sure it's not liquid.

[C]

No. So we do some heat tracing and things like that in the equipment to make sure it could do this. It's not a drop in replacement, if you will, but it's a. It's one that we can work with. It's one that we can figure out a way to do.

[B]

Are you allowed to get into the. The like.

[C]

I guess the.

[B]

How you guys engineer that or is that like.

[C]

Yeah, it's not. I mean again, wasn't us engineering. It was the. The supplier of tallow who does it. A company in Chicago. They're very well known. The biggest supplier of beef tallow in the country. They just. In their manufacturing. I think if you think of, you know what a centrifuge is, right. You just respin it. The heavier stuff comes out goes the bottom and the lighter stuff to the top. In a very broad sense, that's kind of how it's done. Right.

[B]

You. So there's your centrifuge the. In the truck.

[C]

No, no, no. It's. It's done before it makes it to our depot.

[B]

Right.

[C]

So the, the. The company that makes the tallow and cleans it up, they kind of just do that separation there. And then they send us the part that's liquid. Got it. And the, the solid parts they use for other.

[B]

Did you have to modify your trucks like to be able.

[C]

A little bit of modification. But mostly it's heat tracing, mostly heat tracing. So you, you know, you run these little coils along the lines, hoses and stuff.

[B]

So it's just basically all pulling off the alternator. It's electrical.

[C]

Yes. And trucks. So they'll circulate the heat in the. In the box to make sure the inside of the tank stays warm. When you go to the. The store level, it's running kind of like heat tape that you.

[B]

So around the hoses so that the hose is warm.

[C]

You got it. So. So when it's anything that's sitting in any of the lines, they. They maintain a certain temperature and putting an insulating blanket around the tank to make sure we're. It maintains.

[B]

So when it's in the truck, is it. Is the tank itself being heated? Yeah. Are those just like.

[C]

Like we have in. It's in transit heat in the truck so much like you said, it runs out of the radiator and just kind of goes through the truck and comes back in.

[B]

So it's all electrical heated?

[C]

Yeah, it's all heated.

[B]

I'm thinking, like, my. My days as a commercial pilot, like, a lot of the heat that we would get was from the exhaust.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Yeah. So it's like CO2 is running over these coils, and it's just like the exhaust and like, that heats the air up. And you have to. To be careful because if there's a crack.

[C]

Yeah. It's not CO2.

[B]

In this one, I was like. I want.

[C]

It's more like. More. Think of it like the antifreeze that's in your radiator.

[B]

Got it.

[C]

Just. It's additional. You run longer lines, so that warm fluid just kind of goes through and through the engine. It's the engine heat that generates that heat in the trucks. When it gets to the store level, then, yeah, it's just electric heat. Cool.

[B]

I mean, what else do we need to discuss that we haven't discussed today? I mean.

[C]

Yeah, well, I. The equal side of my passion comes with what we do with the oil when it leaves your restaurant. And I think that's something that's become more and more important. And. And quite honestly, it's driving a lot of the supply and pricing issues that you're seeing with food oil on the front side. And I don't think it's as widely known as it should be, but it's probably no secret that renewable fuels are an important part of our fuel economy. And in particular, renewable and biodiesel are fuels that have grown in demand. And we have federal mandates that say how much we need to include all in the effort of reducing carbon output for vehicles. Well, that's where vegetable oils come into place. And I mentioned earlier on my career had been in the food side. The back half of my career has been in the fuel side as well too. So what we do is we take those that used oil that you co and we send it to these renewable fuel producers. They're mandated by the federal government, by the EPA to create a certain amount of fuel from renewable sources every year. And so we put that into the fuel supply. And the reason it matters is we're taking waste product from a restaurant, putting it into fuel production, which essentially has a. Almost zero carbon intake intensity effect. Right. It's minimal carbon intensity factor for making fuel that the trucks run on. You know, any diesel truck runs on, on the highway. So every restaurant that we service contributes to that renewable economy in a way that they should be proud of. Yeah.

[B]

And there's, that's another variable. I know there's a lot of talk about being a zero carbon footprint restaurant. If you sign up with rti, does that help you get one success step closer?

[C]

It certainly would because we can definitely show you where your waste oil goes to.

[B]

And you also don't have that nasty. Oh gosh, that like is just gross.

[C]

Yeah. I think we all, we all know, we've number. We've probably seen it, but we've definitely smelled it. Yeah.

[B]

I mean, I just, I don't know how like in my years of working in restaurants, that's the one thing it was. It's always my job to take the oil. Oh yeah, dump it. And it was always like.

[C]

That's right. That's right. Yeah. And so when we, when we deliver all those oils, we find the right thing for you to use and make you run, help you run your restaurant effectively. When we're delivering that oil, at the same time our trucks are pumping out that old stuff and taking it away for you and you never have to touch it or smell it or.

[B]

So what's funny is the person who is going to be the first person to hear this conversation after we recorded it, my editor Jared and I used to work together and we were always, the two of us would always take the oil out. And there were, there were so many times where the oil would either splash up and hit my wrist or splash up and hit his wrist and we would drop that thing. Like I'm just now starting to like these like traumatic experiences come back how much I hated taking oil out. And it was always the two of us. I seemed like we Always were the two that had to take it out.

[C]

Yeah, it's so it is something that's near and dear to my heart. I don't like to discount the idea that it is a fully sustainable process. We're taking all the oil, delivering all the oil you want, whatever you don't need, we're going to make sure it goes to a renewable fuel production side. And the cherry on top of that is we share that value with the restaurant. So you'll get a credit on your bill for the used cooking oil we took away from you. That's cool. So not only are we alleviating you of, of having to handle it and you don't see those nasty dumpsters out back and all that stuff, you're just going to get a line item on your invoice that says, hey, we're reducing your prices because based on the value of this.

[B]

So, so does that all, does the money that you, you get from selling the like the used oil go straight back to savings or is there like a split there? Do you take.

[C]

Oh, there's a split. We have costs involved in that obviously. And so we have to do it to mark according to market values. And of course we, we have, you know, our own, our own profit margin that's on there. But we were clear with the restaurants and what that share is. But you're getting a share that's, that's a better share than anybody else. Any who's collecting it'll give you, that's for sure. So we do we. But we share that. And so when, when you see the price of your cooking oil start rising, which happens and I think right now we're probably in that cycle where cooking oil is going to start climbing again. It's being driven by the demand for renewable fuels because they want that virgin soybean oil or canola oil to produce diesel fuel out of. So it's raising your cost as a restaurant. But the good news is it's also raising the value of that used oil and so you're getting some backside.

[B]

So this is where I'm gonna get all conspiracy theory. At what point do you think the government's getting involved influencing the diets? I've heard in the past that America banks on unhealthy like we, we. This country makes sense so much money on unhealthy behaviors from to the things we're discussing right now to like, you know, there's, there's profit in byproduct food oils that the government capitalizes on. And then also people just Being sick. We don't have a health care system. We have a sick care system and we make a lot of money off of unhealthy people. I mean, am I getting way too, like, I don't know, like, is this area we should back away from right now?

[C]

No, let me start this, Let me start my answer by saying that the following answer is Ron Cardwell's opinion, not that of restaurant technologies. But what I'll say to that is feeding 350, 400 million people is difficult. And there's only three components.

[B]

When you industrialize it and centralize it, it becomes easier. Right, right. But is it necessarily.

[C]

That's the balance. I think that's the point is, is. Look, I think you and I could agree if we sat down and said this is the ideal menu that you and I should eat every day. Some of us are very privileged to where we can afford to do that. And we can, we can afford to spend the money on organic produce, on sustainably raised meat, on all those things that we, I think, as in general agree, are probably better for you, but as your ability to pay for those drops, you, you sacrifice a lot of things. And I think it's, it's cost per calorie really comes into effect.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

And that's what's driven us probably towards an unhealthy diet is we've had, we've, as a country, we've had the cheapest food in the world forever. And it doesn't mean it's been nutritionally proper. What do you.

[B]

Yeah, like you're paying for it different ways.

[C]

You are.

[B]

And I think that's what we have to start to wake up to. I think that's what my mission statement is, to inspire, empower and transform. Transform the industry.

[A]

Really.

[B]

My mission is to change the world. And I think there's no better positioned industry than the restaurant industry to do it because. Couldn't agree more. We second largest industry behind the government used to be third behind healthcare. We just recently surpassed healthcare. And we, I think we are more to healthcare than healthcare. Is the healthcare. Yeah, we are healthcare. Their sick care.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

You know, what you put into your body, like, we're not just health care for the, your physical body, we're healthcare for your community. If you're choosing to source, you know, your products, you know, a certain way, you know, like this industry can have massive impact.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

If we start sharing information and we start educating people on, you know, that, that is a lot of what drives me going forward isn't just what are the Four walls of the economics of how to make your restaurant successful. But what are the macroeconomic variables that we need to consider to have a better future for America? Right. And to make it more possible for independent restaurant operators to have a chance?

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Because we're not going in that direction right now. We're going in the opposite direction.

[C]

You're right. And it's, it's a sad realization when you have to realize you have to sacrifice something that, you know, health wise for something else.

[B]

Right.

[C]

That can do it. But I think your, your audience and restaurant operators in particular see a frontline view to that. Right, Right. And you have to balance your ability to survive as a, as a business with your ability to provide what's better for the customer and what they want. And it's such a fine line to balance. If you designed your menu to say, I'm going to go into serve things that really are good for you, that are the healthiest that you could get, is that going to be serving your customers and their demand? Maybe, or maybe not. Some for sure. But sometimes you have to make those sacrifices to fit what people want or to fit the profitability that you need to survive because you have a family to support. You have people that are depending on you. So. And I think that's a very micro view of the food system in general, is finding the balance between what people want and what, what's really healthy and also not eliminating someone's choice. I, I love eating deep fat fried french fries as much. I don't want anybody telling twice fried

[B]

first you've cooked in. I think it's like 100, like 40 or I can't remember the temperatures. And then you do the flash fry afterwards. 170, like.

[C]

But we know, we know they're not good for you. So good every meal of the day. Right. But I want to be able to choose that one. I can. Yeah. And, and so all those things come together to make the right choices. And, and I think that again, gets to where restaurant technologies comes in is we don't want to take that choice away from you, the restaurant operator. You know your customers better than we do.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

And we'll listen to you and get you what you need and help you make decisions when you're ready to make changes or you know what you need to accomplish. Yeah.

[B]

There's one other question I had. I don't know if it came out. Your RTI is really good about, you know, what do we do with the byproduct this, the spent oil? What do you do with the spent tallow. Where does that go?

[C]

Same place. It goes in the same.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

Yeah. Whether. The great thing about used cooking oil is it's just that if you cooked it and it's oil, it's the same. So the tallow and so everyone's clear. We handle blends of oil and soybean oil, canola oil, corn oil, composteed oil, sunflower seed oil, peanut oil, tallow and blends thereof.

[B]

It all goes to the same place.

[C]

All goes to the same place. So when I say we're agnostic on the oil you want, we really mean it. We really are. We just want to give you one.

[B]

Does one of those oils or tallows do better in producing bio or like diesel fuel?

[C]

No, no. What does better to produce diesel fuel is clean oil where there's just not a lot of stuff in it. Right.

[B]

Food byproduct. You got it. So that's filtered.

[C]

Exactly. But again, shameless plug. That's why we're better than anywhere else is our system. When it empties from the fryer from that point to the time it goes to back to our depot and gets loaded out and goes to the fuel producer. We filter that oil. It's as clean as it gets.

[B]

What happens with the stuff that gets filtered out?

[C]

It gets disposed of. But there's. There's not much because the system is closed.

[B]

Closed?

[C]

Yeah. It's not that open. Dumpster in the back where people throw

[B]

a shoe and your mind a whole chicken finger.

[C]

You got it. It's before it leaves the fryer.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

It's catching. And when I say we're filtering, it's very small, very small particle type stuff that we're getting out there. So. So that. But that's what makes it more valuable to the fuel producer is the cleanliness of it.

[B]

Anything that has not come out of today's conversation that you want to get out.

[A]

Boy.

[C]

Not offhand really. If I'm leaving with a broad topic, it's you know your business better than we do, but we will know how to handle the oil for you better than anybody else. And that's our goal. Our goal is to get you what you need. We want you to forget about it. It's going so well. You forget to order your oil, you forget to call, have them empty it out. You forget that there anything about it because you've dialed in that part of the business and RTI can just. We'll get it to you or oil to you in the middle of the night. You don't have to Worry about it. It's always there and always full. It's emptied. And your food tastes exactly what you want to taste like nutritionally, you're satisfying. So we want to take that really off your, your table of worries. Right. And get back to running your restaurant. Yeah.

[B]

I do want to say before we wrap up that, you know, RTI or rt, I don't know. You guys are rebranding rti.

[C]

We've been RTI for many years and we tried to dial in the rt, but really we're rti.

[B]

So I do want to say that you guys are kind of like a Goldilocks partner for me. I really, I want to believe in the companies that I partner with and promote. And these are one of the companies. When I find out that RTI is interested in working with me again, I'm like, heck yeah. Because I do believe in what you guys are doing. I think it's a great service. It. There's just, it just, there's so many benefits to it. And I think when we talked to Ryan Boyles. Am I saying that Ryan Boltz bolts. Thank you so much. I think we proved that like you actually at the end of the day with all the savings and efficiencies, it's like a no brainer choice.

[C]

You know, I think I'm always up for anybody showing me why it doesn't make sense, but I've never found it.

[B]

And it's just a great company that, to your point, like, it just like, it's just connected to like, like from like the procurement of the, the, the good to finding ways to add value to different companies to the full circle of taking that and creating fuel out of it. Like, it's just, it seems like just. I can't think of a reason why I wouldn't want to promote a company like this. And that just makes me feel good. And I am not an actor.

[C]

I appreciate that.

[B]

Fake it. And I want to be able to talk transparently about the better options that are out there.

[A]

Out there.

[B]

And when we talk about rti, I just feel like I'm actually spreading good. So thank you. Thank you for support and for, you know, seeing my mission and wanting to be a part of it. And before we say goodbye, who do you respect and admire in industry? Is there a company you've worked with, people that are just doing it right that have really just kind of blown you away that you think we should make an example of?

[C]

Boy, I, I just, right off the bat, I can't think of anything.

[B]

I do think I Blindside you with this question.

[C]

This one's, this one's kind of new. I, I, I guess I'll say this in general that the American farmer is somebody you can rely on. Okay. And when I started in my, my business and we talked about commodities and what are commodities, farm grown commodities are really the backbone of all of our diets. And farmers will respond to what people want. So if you want my opinion is talk to the people in your area who, who grow the food. Yeah.

[B]

And is there a farm out there that we need to profile and that is doing something different or special?

[C]

That's a great question. Not none that come to mind.

[B]

You can have a rain check.

[C]

Give me some thoughts on that. But, but I trust the farmers and I really trust what they're doing. Doing. They react to what the industry wants, but it takes time.

[B]

Right.

[C]

It's not instant.

[B]

Let me throw this out there. If you're listening to this and there's a farm doing some really cool stuff out there, put that on my radar. I do want to get more farms on the show. I just recently had Dean and Peeler on the show. They're based out of San Antonio, just outside of San Antonio. I think there's a lot of cool things happening. Like as the world evolves and progresses and technology gets better, our ability to create food is getting better.

[C]

Better.

[B]

And I think what they're doing with vertically integrating the whole process of growing beef from, you know, sperm selection to insemination to creating, they vertically integrated the, they create their own feed that's super healthy and their whole thing is just trying to create a consistent product that is done sustainably. They own the processing plant, they own the manufacturing plant that they then will, will create beef that is to your specs, to your cuts, with your marinades.

[C]

Like it's a great store. Those are the one, those are the ones where you want to do business with. Yeah, yeah.

[B]

And it's independent. You know, I love that.

[A]

And they're working with my sponsor, US

[B]

Foods to distribute and like, this is the kind of stuff that I love because it's like I don't have to people I can just say like, look how cool this is.

[C]

You know, you also don't just have to take it. You, the, what you're talking about happens as a reaction to people's desire for it.

[B]

Right.

[C]

So nobody's a better steward for the food industry or for the environment than these people who grow the food.

[B]

Right.

[C]

But they have to hear. Yeah. That you have a desire for it and a demand for it. And I promise you, they'll react. And these companies like you mentioned, these farms like you mentioned, well, we had

[B]

to create awareness that they're out there. You have options.

[C]

Create awareness. You're out there. They have to know that there's demand on the. On the backside to it, too. They'll. They'll do it.

[B]

And they are being carried by Main street mainstream distributors. You bet. U.S. foods that are out there. Yeah.

[C]

U.S. foods is a good example. They'll. They'll carry anything that you want to

[B]

supply if you want it, and there's a demand for it.

[C]

Yeah. Show the demand. But.

[B]

But this is how the restaurant industry can change the world.

[C]

It sure can.

[B]

Like in. In a. In a capitalistic market. Supply and demand. Right. But what the question is, what are we demanding?

[C]

Yep. Yep.

[B]

And I think that's where we can start to really influence our futures. What do we want?

[C]

Make it known. Make it known.

[B]

Great way to wrap.

[C]

You know better about your. What your business and your customers want than. Than anybody else does. Let us know it.

[B]

If we're interested in RTI. What's the call to action?

[C]

Rti-inc.com Just give us a. Just check us out. We are located everywhere in the country. I mean, 41 depots. If there's a city near you, probably there. We're sparsely populated locations. Maybe we don't go in. But if you want to know more, you get on our website and look at it. We have phone number, Survey Depot. Contact a salesperson. I promise you there's one in your area. Yeah.

[B]

And you don't even have to. Sorry.

[C]

No, no, no. And, and, and don't hesitate to ask the questions because our guys get to you guys and gals get to you fast.

[B]

Clearly they have a network of experts on their team. You were very insightful today. Thank you.

[C]

My pleasure, Ron.

[B]

And you don't have to go to that website because if you just scroll down on your player, we have that link in our show notes because you are a sponsor. So you can use that link. Please let them know restaurants or sorry, Restaurant Unstoppable sent you their way because it helps prove that this. This podcast has weight.

[C]

Yep.

[B]

So thanks in advance. And this is where I say, Ron, there is no questioning that you and RTI I are unstoppable.

[C]

Thank you very much. It's been. Been a lot of fun.

[B]

Cheers.

[A]

There is another episode wrapped up here at Restaurant Unstoppable. Ron Cardwell.

[B]

This was fun.

[A]

I think this will probably be the first and last time I ever get

[B]

a director of Commodity Strategy on the podcast.

[A]

And it's not because I didn't enjoy the episode.

[B]

I love today's conversation. I find this stuff fascinating. I never knew the world of vegetable oil was so deep and so complex and it's just fascinating to know where the products we work with every day come from. And I found this really interesting and I hope you did too.

[A]

If you enjoyed today's conversation and you want to follow up with Ron Cardwell, I'm happy to reach out to him

[B]

to see if he wants to join us for a live chat in restaurant Unstoppable Network. As of now, there's nothing scheduled, but

[A]

if there's demand, I will line it up. And on that note, if there's anybody I've ever had on the show that you want to hear from, let me know. I'll set it up. Join our community. Head over to restaurantstoppable.com live. I am here to go to work for you. I'm here to connect you with the people you need to be connected to to become unstopp. And we're having a blast just right now. Our standing weekly event, Coffee with Eric. Last week I had a restaurate tour who was negotiating taking over the the

[B]

property their restaurant is located in from the the current land owner.

[A]

And we had a restaurant broker join that conversation today. Literally an hour ago somebody got hit with a lawsuit for not having a a handicap accessible website and within five

[B]

minutes I had David Denny, attorney at

[A]

law, specialist in the hospitality industry, helping that person out. Every time I get a guest on the show, my goal is to get them to give time to you, my listeners. We're connecting people, we're, we're going further. We're getting access to the specialists and it's only $47 a month to get access to this support network and to get access to my entire network of

[B]

specialists who are always happy to hop on a call. Head over to restaurantstoppable.com live.

[A]

Be a part of this mission to inspire, empower and transform the industry. We transform the industry together. And if you just want to sample one of these Coffee with Eric sessions out, be sure to listen to the end of every episode to find out when that guest is live for Coffee with Eric. Then head over to restaurantstoppable.com CWE to

[B]

get the link and we'll see you there.

[A]

Until next time.

[B]

Peace out.