N/A (1:53)

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N/A (4:12)

Let us be lovers. We'll marry our fortunes together. I've got some real estate here in.

Kevin Allison (4:23)

My bag, so we've got a pack.

N/A (4:29)

Of cigarettes and this is where my.

Alex (4:33)

Pies and walked off to look for America.

Kevin Allison (4:43)

Hello, folks, this is Risk, the show where people tell true stories they never thought they dare to share. I'm Kevin Allison. This is Simon and Garfunkel behind me now. And we're calling this week's episode Immigrant Stories Number two, part of an ongoing series of episodes where we're highlighting one of the more vulnerable populations in our country right now, immigrants. Today we have two stories from immigrants, both of whom have come our way. Thanks again to Lisa Cantrell and Capital Storytelling, folks. For the past seven years, I've been thinking of moving from New York City, where I've lived for the past 37 years, to Bangkok, Thailand. My current plan is to finally make the move in the latter half of this year. But in these past seven years, I have leisurely and sporadically gotten advice from dozens and dozens of people about this idea. I've done various kinds of research into the process in my spare time. And almost like Hamlet, you know, I have taken all the time in the world to weigh the pros and cons to move or not to move. And let me be frank, I am really scared about this move. There's a lot that could go wrong. There's a lot that I know I can't even prepare for or predict. There's a lot of sacrifices that I'll have to make, some of which might be irreversible. However, when I hear the sorts of stories that we're featuring in These Immigrant Stories episodes we're doing, I am so humbled and so in awe. These are stories about people who didn't have anywhere near as much luxury and privilege as I have had in considering a move. For the folks in most of these stories, it wasn't so much a matter of, should I move? Do the pros outweigh the cons? For most of these folks, it was more a matter of, oh, my God, I've got to move to survive, and I'm just gonna have to troubleshoot and problem solve my way through a system of obstacles that's fighting to deter my progress. Talk about taking risks. So I'm very proud, and I know other members of our staff are very proud, too, of these special series that we do that highlight the stories of folks from marginalized groups. But I'm also pretty fucking horrified that some of these series were first inspired by outrageous spikes in bigotry and discrimination in America. So now, here we are in early 2025. We're in this era where there's a federally mandated witch hunt against immigrants or even people who just look like they might be immigrants. And I know a lot of us are feeling overwhelmed and wondering, oh, what can we do? But we do know that the very least we can do is listen to immigrants and help immigrants to be heard. So now, today in these hosting segments of the show, I am joined by our guest Alex, who has a remarkable immigrant story of her own. In fact, her own immigration experience inspired her to do the work she does as an immigration lawyer. I should note that even the name Alex is a pseudonym because of where we're at in today's political environment. So we are so grateful to have her here. Hello, Alex.

Alex (9:12)

Hi, Kevin. Thank you so much for having me. I'm so excited to be here and share with you all of what has transpired. And maybe, I don't know, save the notes for me, because I feel a lot of us are feeling the same way that you are about maybe traveling somewhere else at this point.

Kevin Allison (9:33)

Yes, you'll be welcome over in Bangkok anytime now. You and I have never met before today. So first of all, the first thing I would be wondering is what was your life like before you came to.

Alex (9:49)

The U.S. so, you know, I was very young. I was a child when I came to the United States. And so I don't remember much of, you know, my time before the U.S. the U.S. is all I remember, really. But growing up, I always knew that I was an immigrant and what that meant to me, you know, being five years Old. It just really meant I couldn't travel back to where I was born. I knew I was born where I was born. I knew I was born in Mexico, and I was really proud of that. Actually. I would kind of tell everyone that I was born in Mexico. And my parents were like, no, no, no, you can't tell people that because then they'll start questioning, you know, things. And so I always knew. But, you know, as I got older, I didn't really know what that meant before until, you know, it was time to get a job. And I was fairly young. And so my life as I know it started in the U.S. wow.

Kevin Allison (10:49)

And I guess you progressively came around understanding what your parents went through in there, what was their story?

Alex (11:01)

Yeah, so my parents were from a really small town. My mom, she was from an extremely rural town in Mexico where they only had elementary school. And if you wanted to, you know, progress after elementary school, you actually had to go about an hour away to go, you know, to continue with your studies. And they were really poor. My dad, we liked joke that he's like, from the city, but it's also a really small town. It goes as much as, like having a high school. We were always very cognizant of what their story was and the reason they came to the United States. I had a sister who unfortunately died when she was four months old. There was no medical treatment. I believe she died from pneumonia or, you know, something that's very preventable and treatable. And so she would have been older than me. You know, as a parent, you just take that and you decide that that's never going to happen to you again and that you're not going to lose a child because of your. The lack of services or, you know, whatever it might have been. I don't know if that's the reason, but that's enough to where I would have taken anything to for that not to happen ever again.

Kevin Allison (12:21)

Right, of course. And are you still close with your parents today?

Alex (12:28)

Yes, we are very close. I'm not going to say this is with all immigrant families, but because of the things that we've gone through, I am very protective over my parents. Extremely protective. And it was just the other day, with everything that's going on even now at this age, I kind of had a night terror where I woke up and my heart was pounding. And in my dream that I woke up from immigration came to my door. This was, you know, last week, the door was slightly open in my dream, and I rushed to push it because my dad was Home. They stormed in, they grabbed me, and I was just yelling, I do not consent to a search. I do not consent to a search. And my dad was in the room. And, you know, my. My dad now has status, so there's. You know, he does have protection. But it's this trauma that growing up, you knew not to answer the door. You knew what was going on very similar to what's going on now with, you know, ICE and everything. But because of that, I think I'm extremely protective over my parents.

Kevin Allison (13:40)

Gosh. Yeah. To think what a psychological effect that has on so many people to put that anxiety and that sort of, like, traumatic trigger in on people, even people who are of legal status and all. I mean, it feels like a sort of terrorism, you know?

Alex (14:07)

Yeah, it definitely feels like a witch hunt from this side. So I think you were right on when you said that.

Kevin Allison (14:15)

Yeah, it's crazy. And what are some memories you have about then growing up and getting a feel for your status, your family status and all that?

Alex (14:29)

I mean, we were always very afraid. I was undocumented until maybe the age of 23. I was about 23 years old when DACA came around. So, you know, anytime that a phone would ring at work or something like that, I was always very scared somebody would come in through the door. I was very scared, like, for two years. I think I was just, like, petrified that something would happen. And I think even now, it's just this. Like, I don't want to throw out words, but ptsd, like it does. That's what it seems like to me. And, yeah, like I said, growing up, I was undocumented until I was 23. Then DACA rolled around. That does not give you status, per se, but it gives you some sort of protection, and it does also give you a work permit. So up Until I was 23, you know, I didn't really have anything. I was always really afraid. I was afraid of the police. And it wasn't until that time, and at that point, you're still considered undocumented because you don't have legal status. And it wasn't until I was 27 that I became. I started my immigration process. And, you know, I want to be very clear, it is not just a line that you get into because, you know, a lot of people say, well, why don't you just apply for your citizenship? That's not how it works.

Kevin Allison (15:49)

Right, right.

Alex (15:51)

You have to be admissible. There's just. It's. It's very complex. And some people think just because you're Married to US Citizen, or you have children that are US Citizens, like that's going to give you status. That's not how it works at all. It's very complex. But I did become a permanent resident. I think maybe 27, 29. You know, I mentioned that I was really afraid of the police. Not because I was, you know, I wasn't doing anything wrong, but it's just. It's law enforcement. It's, you know, you grow up being afraid of these authorities. And because of what I mentioned, you know, I remember being maybe five, six years old, and people knocking on the doors in our apartment complex and people saying, don't open the door. So I've always had this big fear. And so when I became a permanent resident, I actually enlisted in the military right away. And so here you have somebody who is extremely afraid of somebody in uniform.

Kevin Allison (16:51)

Oh, my God.

Alex (16:53)

Is sent going into the wolves den. And I was very jumpy, you know, because nobody knew my story. My parents were still undocumented at the time. And I remember one of the instructors said my last name, and I. And I jumped. And he wasn't yelling at me or anything, but it was just like being around so many uniforms was. And I just remember him saying, like, why are you so jumpy? And in my head, I was just like, you know, if you only knew.

Kevin Allison (17:24)

Oh, right. Wow. Wow. Holy cow.

Alex (17:28)

Yeah. So that's kind of how it's been.

Kevin Allison (17:30)

And was part of the thinking of going into the military that that would help with this process of, you know, getting to a legal status?

Alex (17:41)

Yes. So at the time, I was already a legal permanent resident. You know, the cards fell where they had to fall, and I was eventually able to adjust my status and become a legal permanent resident. And the reason that I did, you know, I joined the military. It does expedite citizenship. Citizenship is not automatic for our service members, which is, you know, a different story. But it was really because this was the only way that there would be a potential chance for my parents to become lawful residents. And so, you know, again, that in and of itself is not automatic, but it was really an only option that I had at the moment. So, you know, of course, you know, you. You coming full circle to. Are you really close with your parents? I really would do anything for my parents. They are the reason I'm here, figuratively and physically. And, yeah, I would do anything to protect them.

Kevin Allison (18:41)

Yeah. And to think of all that they've been through.

Alex (18:44)

Yeah.

Kevin Allison (18:46)

Yeah. And. And so at what point in the process did this kind of start to Become a vocation for you. Did you start to think, oh, I want to help other people through this process?

Alex (18:57)

Yeah, exactly. So it's actually very funny. You know, as a immigrant, you know, you go to school, you obviously your parents want the best for you. That's why they came to this country. I was the first person to graduate high school from my family. First person to go to college, you know, obviously first person to go to law school. But, you know, I think with some people, these expectations are placed in my family. And I think for most of my friends who are undocumented, I don't think we have these expectations, like from our parents. They just want us to do good, to be good people, to do what we can. They've always emphasized, you got to respect this country, do good. And it wasn't until they ask you, what do you want to be when you grow up? And I actually would always respond, I want to be a secretary. Because, no, I. My parents. My father's a construction worker. My mother worked in the restaurant industry for her entire life. And so it wasn't that I wanted to have prestige or be something very important, a secretary. At my elementary school, she would take it upon herself to enroll all the undocumented students. And I said, I want to be her. That's what I want to do. Wow.

Kevin Allison (20:19)

Holy cow.

Alex (20:20)

Yeah. And she was a secretary. And, you know, you don't. You know the big names, you know attorneys, you know doctors, but you don't really know what else is out there. And so that's how it started. I wanted to be a secretary so that I could do exactly what she did for my family and all the other undocumented families. And then from there, and, you know, from there, it went on to, I want to be a teacher. Because again, in the school system, right, they are the first responders for a lot of our families. And I said, I want to help in this way. I mean, it was always about helping the undocumented community. So I said, I want to be an immigration attorney. And, you know, being undocumented and going to college is a different beast. I was in community college for a long time because there, you know, I didn't have a work permit. I didn't have a Social Security number. How am I going to work out? You know, this is something that we all deal with. How are we going to work even with a degree when we don't have a work permit? My mom would always say, worry about that later. Figure out, follow your heart and do what you need to do. And so that's what I did. It took me a long time to get my bachelor's because I was always working. There was a time where I was working two full time jobs because at the time, you know, you couldn't get a loan. It was. It's very difficult. Now. There are certain things that help you along the way. When DACA came around, that's where I was able to transfer to a uc. So I did. And then that really, I worked for a little bit after that. And then I decided with the Trump administration, the first Trump administration, that's where I was already working as a paralegal. And I decided I need to do more and I'm going to law school. And that's how. Yeah.

Kevin Allison (22:18)

Holy cow. Do you have any memories of, like, times that that was especially. That you were especially, like proud and happy that you did make that change, that you did go into immigration law?

Alex (22:33)

I think every day, I think especially true with the Trump administration. 1.0 and 2.0, you know.

Kevin Allison (22:43)

Yeah.

Alex (22:44)

You know, obviously we're exhausted, we're overstimulated. But I've read a lot of things that say that is the point. And of course, it is a battle every day. But I will say that this time around, I thought I was gonna feel, don't get me wrong, I do feel tired. I am taking more naps than usual. But it has been really uplifting to see, number one, like your peers and people who never maybe were even aware of these spaces really rally behind the immigrant community. And I feel like that's what has really, you know, you know, I'm done taking the high road. I'm. I think a lot of times we would not address things or we'd say, you know, I'm an attorney, but you wouldn't specify what kind of attorney you were. And now I'm kind of, you know, I'm ready for a little bit of a fight. I. I look straight at them and I say, yeah, I'm an immigration attorney. And I just wait. I just really wait for them to tell me something. Yeah. And, you know, the other thing is my clients, something as small as a work permit, I don't really think that people understand what a big difference that makes. The fact that, you know, you don't have to be looking over your shoulder to see if somebody walks in the door when you have that work permit. It really is life changing. Something as small as that is really uplifting and it kind of gives me the motivation to keep going because I see the emotions just being very grateful. For even that small piece of, I would say, like just peace of mind.

Kevin Allison (24:28)

Yeah. Is there anything that pieces of advice that you might give to immigrants out there today?

Alex (24:38)

Yes, there is a big movement right now, I think being undocumented at the time, I didn't know about nonprofits. I didn't know about these resources that are out there. And, you know, I was. I spoke English, I went to school, and I still didn't know about these things that were out there, these resources. And right now there is a big movement to know your rights. To know your rights are making it very difficult for ICE to meet these quotas because they do have to meet quotas at this point. And my message out there for people who are undocumented is, I know what it's like. I know how afraid you are, but you have rights. And obviously that's easier said than done. When you're nervous, you're not going to remember to say, I want to remain silent. I have a Fifth Amendment right. I have a Fourth Amendment right. But you do have rights. It does not matter your legal status. You have rights. You have the right to remain silent. I would recommend looking up your local organization and see what they have going on on their social media. They post Know youw Rights presentation information. They post actual, you know, Know youw Rights. They post printable things. They call them the little red cards. And we give those to our clients. And if they are stopped by ice, it says what their rights are. And so they can just give those cards to ICE if they're too afraid to speak.

Kevin Allison (26:11)

Yeah, that's great. And how about other. Other Americans, people who want to be allies. Any advice that you would give to people like me, for example?

Alex (26:23)

Yeah, of course. You know, I think people are really afraid to just even go get groceries. There's a lot of also, like panic posting that's going on, that immigration is here or they're doing ICE raids here. And obviously it's important to be cautious. But number one, I would say don't panic post. There's something called a rapid response network, and I would highly recommend looking up those networks in your areas. They many times have volunteers who will go and confirm whether there is ICE activity in these locations. That's a big thing, because they are too afraid to go even drive by that street if you want to volunteer. You know, there's a lot of organizations at this point that need that just to go verify these ICE sightings.

Kevin Allison (27:18)

Wow.

Alex (27:19)

Yeah. And the other thing is just giving someone a ride that you know is undocumented. Not necessarily saying, hey, I know you're undocumented, but just saying like, hey, you know, do you need a ride to the store? Do you need me to get groceries for you? I mean, we've done that with many of our friends just because, you know, it is a really scary time just to go outside of your house to pick up the kids from school.

Kevin Allison (27:46)

Oh my goodness. Well, I am so glad. I'm so grateful that we had you on today and we'll come back after the next story. But yeah, it's, it's. You were just the person to be talking to today.

Alex (28:01)

Thanks, Kevin. Like I said, I am overstimulated, so hopefully that all is coherent.

Kevin Allison (28:09)

Oh yeah, absolutely.

Kristen (28:14)

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N/A (29:14)

Whether you're a true crime junkie or just getting into it, you're gonna love Crime House True Crime Stories, a Crime House original podcast. Every Monday, you'll go on an in depth journey through two of the most notorious true crime cases from that week in history, all connected by a common theme. From notorious serial killers to chilling disappearances and tragic murders, we're bringing you the defining events that shaped true crime both past and present. Crime House True Crime Stories dives into the full stories behind the headlines covering high profile cases like the murder of Gabby Petito, the kidnapping of Elizabeth Smart, the Heaven's Gate cult tragedy, and plenty of other cases you may not know, but won't forget. Follow and listen to Crime House True Crime Stories and Odyssey Podcast in partnership with Crime House Studios. Available now on the free Odyssey app and wherever you get your podcasts.

Anmol Pavade (30:13)

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Dax (30:43)

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Kevin Allison (32:53)

This is risk. This is Natalia Laforqueaday behind me now with a song Alex recommended. Those opening lyrics translate roughly to Little hummingbird, don't be afraid to come out today the world wants you to wake and be happy Little hummingbird, don't be afraid to live May the night dark and mysterious dance for you. All right, next up, we're going to listen to a story from another immigrant to the US Anmol Pavade Amo first shared this at a Capitol storytelling show in Sacramento in 2023. And it's a story she calls a grand farewell.

Anmol Pavade (34:03)

So today's story is a story from my 13 year old self. And I know when I was thinking about this story and y'all might be thinking, wow, like 13, like that's a time that I really don't want to remember. And trust me, I really tried to push it deep down, deep down inside. But the reason why I kind of really wanted to highlight the story is because 13 was a really pivotal time in my life. 13 was when I started to form opinions and started to get really Pissed at the world and ask questions, much to my parents disappointment. Child of immigrant. Hey, eldest daughter. Hey. Yep. So I'm going to take you guys on a journey. It is the summer of 2011. I am 13 years old. It's my summer break in between middle school and high school. Yeah, I'm feeling a lot of things, A lot of things are going on, a lot of hormonal changes, all that good stuff. And I am so excited to go on our, like, annual family vacation. My dadima, my dad's mom, is visiting from India on her, like, biannual trip. She'll always like, come and visit every couple of years. And you know, we're getting ready to show her the coast. We're getting ready to show her California what we're really known for. And to give you guys a little bit of context within my identity of being Indian Indian. I am north and South Indian. My mom is a Punjabi Sikh and my dad is a Hindu Tamil from Tamil Nadu. Unless you're really from India and you know what India is like and how incredibly vast and huge India is, that might not mean much to you, but like, when I say it's the north and the south, like, it's really the north and the south, like two completely different places, two completely different religions, languages, the food is completely different, the way they dress is different. Like, everything is so different to the point where my parents were basically like my family's own Romeo and Juliet because there was that much drama involved with them getting together. And yes, they had a love marriage, not an arranged marriage. So super dramatic. So, you know, we're getting ready to go on our family vacation and. And maybe like a couple days before the vacation, we get a call from my mommy, my aunt, letting me know that my bg, my great grandmother from my mom's side is on her DeathBed now. My BG, she's Punjabi. She's the one from my mom's side of the family. She was quite a force of nature. Later on, in doing some reflecting, I see so much of myself in her. She was an eldest daughter, you know, she got married at 19, grew up in colonial British India, had to escape her village during the partition when Britain decided to overnight draw a line and tell people where to go and displace so many individuals. She, you know, even though she was able to mobilize her own family after that time and was doing well, she made sure that she always, you know, invested in the community. Something that is so important to me. She was an artist, a fiber artist who was really into knitting and crocheting, who would always make my sweaters. Growing up she would take me to Joann's and let me pick out my own fabric for my pajamas. And you know, it's these little memories that like reflecting back now, I'm like wow, times were tough. But I never felt that, you know, I felt so much abundance in her sweaters, in my handmade hand knit clothes. And she was the one who moved first to California in the 70s, brought our family here, which you know, later on in the 90s when I decided to be born, you know, it was a little bit of a disruption because my mom happened to be visiting, but I was like, just kidding. I'm gonna be born three weeks early. I don't want to be a Scorpio. For any astrology nerds out there, sorry. Love you guys. But you know I was born here, America, living the dream. And her son, my Mamu, my uncle was one of the people in my family that just couldn't accept my parents marriage. Now there is some context to that. You know, there was a lot of political strife and nuance in between Hindus and Sikhs post the 80s. There was a, you know, huge riot that happened that was anti Sikh after the assassination of Indira Gandhi and that that's a whole other historical moment that I highly recommend folks to look up. It's quite sad but my mom just never really accepted my family. And so finding out that my BG is on our deathbed, we decided to all of a sudden scrap our plans, be like, okay, we're not going up the coast anymore. No, we're going to go to Colorado. We're going to make a crazy trip across from California to Colorado and, and that's exactly what happened. So overnight, you know, I'm seeing my two grandmothers, my North Indian Punjabi grandmother on one side of the stove cooking chai and parante and pakoras, like all these North Indian delicacies. And then seeing my other grandma, my dadima from the south, making filter coffee, making vada, all these like South Indian delights and then just packing up the chest full. I know we all like children of immigrants. We all have that chest that our parents packed up where it's like we're not going to go and get fast food. No, we have enough food on this trip. We're eating good, we're eating this. So they're packing up this stuff and we're packing up our 1998 clunker of a van. It was a Chevy that my dad bought off of a old Co worker that we used to call Barney that we would take all over the States. But you know, we're packing that up and we're overnight, we make our trip to Colorado. Now on the trip over there, being the disruptor that I am, being the pissed off 13 year old that I am, I'm asking questions and questions that no one really wanted to answer. You know, I'm this again, pissed off, very hormonal. I'm someone who wasn't feeling Indian enough at a lot of times, who didn't feel American enough, who didn't feel Tamil enough, who didn't feel Punjabi enough. I spoke Hindi, but I didn't speak speak Tamil or Punjabi. And I was just confused and I didn't understand why it was so normal for someone who was such a big part of my family to openly not acknowledge my family and the fact that we had to go across States to go see my great grandma on her deathbed. So, you know, fast forward through the trip, we show up and I find out that, you know, my great grandmother, obviously because of morphine, had been super out of it the entire time before we were coming. But that day she just so happened to be super coherent. And we spent two days with her drinking chai, eating Matai sweets. We listened to her stories, we laughed. And in between, obviously, I got up into my old like 13 year old shenanigans, you know, playing with my cousins, sneaking off to the 711 that my uncle owned and stealing Slurpees from him. Because I was like, this is enough like reparations for me at this time. Thank you for all those Slurpees. Not enough. Obviously I'm still pissed. But you know, there is a point where we're watching she's the man and I'm like watching Amanda Bynes pretend to be a boy living out like her dream of playing soccer for this school. And I'm like, wow, I'm not necessarily playing soccer, but like I'm definitely in disguise here. I'm masking a lot, you know, and it was, you know, multiple moments throughout that trip where I realized that like I wasn't able to, to fully feel my grief because I didn't really know what exactly it was in that moment, but I knew that there was something there and that there was something that I was just confused by. And so, you know, fast forward. It's the last day of the trip, I'm talking to my bg, my sister is there, we're saying goodbye, which of course is going to take like five hours longer. Than we expected, because why would it go on time? But, you know, my sister is there crying, telling my bg, like, don't worry. I'm gonna make you proud. I'm gonna be a doctor. And I'm like, well, dang, that's a lot of pressure. Like, I don't think I'm gonna be a doctor, but, like, I'm gonna be me, so. Hope you like that in the afterlife. Yeah, but, you know, it's moments where in sitting down and kind of talking to her and hearing her stories, I realized that's honestly the most I really ever talked to to my bg. Oftentimes, she was this strong, stoic, silent woman who I never really heard her say, I love you, But I felt her love through different things, like knitting my sweaters or cooking me food, you know? And I'll never forget we went through the, like, classic dance, the money dance, where, like, elders are trying to give you money when you're leaving, and you're like, I'm not supposed to accept this. My parents are glaring daggers through my back, but it's disrespectful if I don't. And eventually she's like, just take the money. And I'm like, okay, I'll take the money. And, you know, I take this $20 from my BG and I give her a kiss, and I tell her I love her, and she tells me that she loves me. And, you know, eventually, we make our way out of the house and back on to California. And on our way back, we stop by the Grand Canyon, which is my first time at the Grand Canyon. And I stopped in the gift store, and, you know, jewelry is really important to women in my family. Gold was the way that you protected yourself. And so something that I wanted to do was honor my grandma. I actually bought this turquoise ring that's on my middle finger here today, that day, with that $20 that she gave me. And I've had it ever since. And, yeah, I share this story because there's so many women and people in my lineage who were never able to share their stories, who weren't able to speak up. And it's such a privilege that I'm able to take up space on this stage here today. And for my BG and for all those people, I'm here to disrupt and to tell those stories. And so I'm so thankful that I got to spend that time with her that day. And she's around me all the time. But that's a story for another time. So thank you.

Kevin Allison (44:27)

It.

N/A (45:07)

Prospective immigrants, please note, either you will go through this door or you will not go through. If you go through, there is always the risk of remembering your name. Things look at you doubly and you must look back and let them happen. If you do not go through. It is possible to live worthily, to maintain your attitudes, to hold your position, to die bravely. But much will blind you, much will evade you. At what cost? Who knows? The door itself makes no promises. It is only adore.

Kevin Allison (46:22)

This is risk. This is Los Incas behind me now. And we just heard a poem by the great Adrian Rich called Prospective immigrants. Please take note. And before that, we heard from Anmol Pavade. Alex, any thoughts about Anmol's story?

Alex (46:48)

Yes, I saw a lot of parallels. The, you know, taking forever to say goodbye. You gotta bake that in at least an hour.

Kevin Allison (47:00)

Yeah, that's so funny.

Alex (47:02)

A lot of similarities and some differences. I was listening to her story and when she mentioned, you know, taking a family vacation, I was like, oh, that's interesting. I never took a family vacation. It was too many of us. We were too poor.

Kevin Allison (47:18)

Right, right. That's interesting.

Anmol Pavade (47:21)

Yeah.

Alex (47:22)

But, you know, she mentions, you know, she's feeling the love of her grandma through. Not necessarily I love you. It's a very immigrant thing. You know, they, my parents now do say it, but my grandmother never. But it is these acts of service that really convey the love.

Kevin Allison (47:44)

Oh, yeah, that's amazing. Yeah. And it really struck me how in that story, it really highlighted how families are so affected by. By big moves and families themselves are so complex in certain ways that where you're moving to or what's going on in the world can add so much more complication to everything going on.

Anmol Pavade (48:17)

Yeah.

Alex (48:17)

She did say one thing that really struck and I think this really hits a lot of. A lot of immigrants or first generations, even second generations. She said that she never felt like she was enough. She wasn't Indian enough. And I think that's very much so. You know, I am Mexican and I'm very light skinned. I am white passing, you know, so I am aware that I do have that white passing privilege. I don't think that because of the way that I look, I have had opportunities that many don't. But that is very even true for Mexicans is, you know, I was born in Mexico and I would say I'm Mexican, but they're like, no, you're not, actually.

Kevin Allison (49:03)

Wow.

Alex (49:03)

So that really stuck out for me.

Kevin Allison (49:06)

Yeah. And then within her own family, little bits of fighting over who really belongs in the family. Oh, my goodness gracious. Well, thanks again to Anmol Pavade for sharing her story with us. You can find her on Instagram nmalpavadi. And thanks again to Capital Storytelling for sharing Amal's story and many other immigrant stories through their live shows. They're really wonderful. Look them up@capitalstorytelling.com Alex, thank you so much for joining me for this episode and giving us your perspective on the changing status of immigrants in the US right now in 2025. Before you want to go, I wanted to ask you, what about the work you've been doing with immigrants gives you some hope nowadays?

Alex (50:09)

You know, I think going back to Amnal's story is that she said something about being able to speak up for those who really can't and tell those stories for those who don't have that voice. I think that is really what I'm holding on to because I think if, you know, I'm going to be an immigration attorney for the next four years, I really have to hone in on, you know, it's not about me. It's about my clients. And, you know, I see my family in my clients, and I feel like that is the fuel that I'm going to be using. Like I said, I'm, I'm a little bit more spicy this time around. I am. I look people, you know, in the eye and I. And I'm ready for the fight. And I think that's. I think that's what I'm gonna hold on to.

Kevin Allison (50:51)

That's beautiful. That. Yeah. And, you know, like, they say that when enough people are speaking up, when enough people are sharing their stories and being heard, you just almost can't calculate what a difference that can eventually make.

Alex (51:08)

Yeah, absolutely.

Kevin Allison (51:21)

I want to point everyone to a couple of places that immigrants and allies can go online and find resources, including the know your rights little red cards that Alex mentioned. Those are at the Immigrant Legal Resource center site or you can just Google little red cards. Know your rights. Of course, you can always find the ACLU at aclu.org or the National Immigrant Justice center at immigrantjustice.org and we'll have links to more resources in the show notes. So that'll just about do it for immigrant stories. Number two, if you are an immigrant and have a story about your experiences or if you know someone who is with a story to share, reach out to us. Pitch us your story@risk-show.com submissions. And if you want to help Risk continue this kind of work and share stories from folks of all walks of life. Join our Patreon there's all kinds of bonus stories and other content, plus an ad free feed of the podcast that you can plug right into your regular podcast app. That's all@patreon.com risk Meanwhile, folks, today's the day take a risk they've all come to for America Come to America all come to America.

Alex (53:23)

SA.