The Best of Father's Day Stories #3 - RISK!

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[00:00]
Kevin Allison
Meet Natural Cycles, the only FDA cleared and CE marked birth control app that's 100% natural hormone free and side effect free. Here's how it works. The app analyzes daily changes in your body temperature to find your fertile window so you can plan or prevent pregnancy naturally. Natural Cycles is a clinically proven non hormonal birth control option that's 93% effective with typical use and 98% effective with perfect use. No synthetic hormones, just science. And if you're ready to start family planning, switching from preventing to planning a pregnancy is as easy as tapping a button. Plus, the Natural Cycles app makes tracking fertility easy. You can measure your temperature trends using an Oura Ring, Apple Watch or our Bluetooth thermometer, which is free when you sign up for an annual subscription. Join over 4 million registered users who are taking control of their fertility naturally. Save 15% when you sign up with code radio15@natural cycles.com that's radio15 for 15% off today 5am I'm up with a crisp Celsius energy drink running 12 miles today. Grab a green juice, quick change and head to work. Meetings, workshops One more Celsius. No slowing down. Working late but obviously still meeting the girls for a little dancing. Celsius Live Fit. Go grab a cold refreshing Celsius at your local retailer or locate now@celsius.com this.
[01:26]
Paul Gilmartin
Episode is brought to you by State Farm.
[01:28]
Kevin Allison
Knowing you could be saving money for the things you really want is a great feeling. Talk to a State Farm agent today to learn how you can choose to bundle and save with a personal price plan. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. Prices are based on rating plans that vary by state. Coverage options are selected by the customer. Availability, amount of discounts and savings and eligibility vary by state. This episode is brought to you by Amazon Prime. From streaming to shopping, prime helps you get more out of your passions. So whether you're a fan of true crime or prefer a nail biting novel from time to time, with services like Prime Video, Amazon Music and fast free delivery, prime makes it easy to get more out of whatever you're into or getting into. Visit Amazon.comprime to learn more. Hey folks, this is Risk, the show where people tell true stories they never thought they'd dare to share. I'm Kevin Allison and every Thursday we release these special episodes where we look back at content from our earlier years. This week it's the Best of Father's Day Stories Number three. Fatherhood is discuss in interesting and maybe surprising complex ways in this episode. Now in a Little bit. We're gonna hear from Mali Mason. But first, a story from Paul Gilmartin. Paul is the host of the Mental Illness Happy Hour podcast, an extraordinary podcast. And you will hear in this story what a thoughtful and really fascinating guy Paul is. And here he is now with a story we call After Dad. I want to talk about my dad. My dad was always a mystery to me. There was something about him that I couldn't ever really put my finger on. And he was a really quiet guy. He was really difficult to get to know. And I remember being, like, 6 or 7 years old and feeling like he is battling something, and I don't know what it is. He was just always kind of trapped in his head. He wasn't a loud person. He was never a violent person. My friends would come over and they would say, why is your dad mad at me? And I would say, that's just his face. There was just a. There was an intensity to him that I didn't understand. Not that I didn't have good moments with him when I was little. One of my favorite moments was he would carry me to bed every night, and we had this ritual. He would carry me up the stairs, and when the ceiling got low at one point, I would always touch the ceiling. And we did it so much that there was, like, handprints on it. And years later, I remember looking at those handprints and thinking, God, there aren't many memories that I have of my dad that are warm. He loved to swim. People said, you have to eulogize your dad. It would be like he wrote a good check and he liked to swim. My dad had such trouble being present. And, you know, there's nothing kids want more than their parents undivided attention. You can give them gifts and all that other shit, but I don't know, there's just something. The more people I talk to, the moments that people remember from childhood, the most are the ones where they have their parents undivided attention or they feel seen in some way. And there was always just kind of a feeling that I didn't feel seen. But swimming. My dad loved the water. He taught us, my brother and I, how to dive. And it seemed like the one place in the world where he would kind of let loose and be present. And the other thing where I felt seen was when I played sports. The only time I ever in my life saw him express joy was when I pitched a winning game in Little League against an undefeated team. And he came leaping out of the dugout like. Like a leprechaun I don't even know how to describe it, but it was. His knees were going, like, abnormally high, and he was. And he has no sense of rhythm, and his arms were flapping up and down. And I remember going from, like, sheer joy at winning to sheer embarrassment and my dad running towards me, but he picked me up and he held me. And it was such a bizarre weekend because then we got in the car almost immediately and we went to our family vacation, which that year was at the Ozarks. And I remember my brother and I were at the pool. My dad comes up and he seems angry, but then again, that's my dad's face. And he says, I need to talk to you. And I'm like, oh, fuck, what did I do? And he sits me down and he says, paul, when a man loves a woman, he puts his penis inside her vagina. And I remember thinking, what did I do? And after about a minute, I realized, oh, my God, he's giving me the talk. But he didn't. He didn't. He just. If he could have typed it up and gave it to me, he would have done that. And then he would have signed it. Dad, you know, had his secretary type. He was kind of like Don Draper. He was an insurance executive. He was very successful. He had a big corner office with a bar and a couch, and I thought the bar was so cool. I didn't know he was an alcoholic, but I never saw him slur. But he was probably the most high functioning alcoholic I've ever known. Help is on the way. You're at that cute stage where it's funny. I was at that stage. But, like, my dad's favorite thing to do was to have people around him, but leaving him alone. And that's kind of who I turned into. As much as I hate to admit it. But I didn't know my dad was an alcoholic till he was 18. I was 18 years old and I was leaving for college, and my mom said, you should keep an eye on your drinking. Alcoholism runs in the family. I was like, what? Who? Yeah. Turns out every male in my family tree is an alcoholic. And it explained a little bit of why he was so trapped in his head and so distant. And then in 1993, I was still living back in Chicago, living on my own, but back in the same town as my family. And I got a phone call that my dad had attempted suicide. He was in New York on business, and he hadn't shown up for a meeting, and they broke down his hotel room door. And he was in the bathtub drunk, and he had opened his wrists. And I remember being surprised, but not being surprised and finally going, oh, that explains it. That's what he was battling. He doesn't want to be here. He doesn't want to be alive anymore. And he has been trying to find a way to survive all his life. He's been trying to find something to enable him to feel. He had a terrible childhood. His father was also an alcoholic. The gift that keeps on giving. And his father was emotionally sadistic, just a straight up asshole. And I know my dad had demons in his head. And he was committed to Bellevue, which I'm sure you all know is like the casting central version of a psych unit in New York. And we weren't able to get a hold of. Of him, even though we would call. They said, well, the only phone is a payphone in the hallway. So for three days, crazy people are answering the phone. We're trying to say, is William Gilmartin there? And you know the government is spying on you. And not to minimize people's mental health experiences, but fuck them anyway. Trying to talk to my dad. Finally, after three days, I get him on the phone and I say, dad, it's Paul, how are you? And he goes, oh, fine. That made me more sad than him trying to take his life because I thought, what's it going to take for him to ask for help? You know, he's the type of person who. He fell and broke his ribs one time and laid in his bed. He was living alone for three days rather than pick up the phone and ask somebody for help. But thankfully, the psychiatrist at that psych hospital said, I will only release you if you get directly on a plane, fly directly to Chicago. Your family meets you at the airport and they drive you to rehab. And so we did on Christmas Eve. And I didn't really feel much. I battled numbness most of my life, I suppose, as a way to. To deal with things that aren't fun. But we didn't talk about it. We didn't talk about it in the car. We didn't talk about it after we dropped him off. And my dad stayed sober for a while. And before he passed away from cancer, I began to try to meet him where he was, as they say, instead of trying to. To get him to be the dad that I needed. I had an epiphany one day. I was trying to get some praise from him. I had started doing a radio show and I was producing sketches every week. And it involved elaborate Recordings and editing. And I played it for him, and he didn't say anything. And I said, so, what did you think? And he was silent. He said, I didn't think it was your best work. And I remember feeling crushed, and then looking out the window and thinking, what the fuck am I doing? This guy is not capable of giving you what you need. He's been disappointing you in some way or another your whole life. But I wanted to believe that. When I was 16 years old, I got busted before the first day of school my sophomore year for smoking weed. And my dad said he was very forgiving. He said, this is the saddest day of my life, except for the day my father died. His father, who he hated. But I said, okay, I'll make you a deal. You quit smoking cigarettes, and I'll quit smoking pot. And he thought about it, and he said, okay. And we were about six months into it, and I was going to a UFO concert with my friends, and they passed me a joint, and I said, no. And they said, oh, you're still doing that thing with your dad? I said, yeah. And my neighbor laughed. I go, what? He goes, dude, your dad's been on the side of the house smoking cigarettes every night after dinner. And I was like, give me that joint. Give me that beer. And it was on, man. It was like something in me almost kind of broke in that moment of, like, trusting, trusting people. And I got so drunk at that concert that I apparently blacked out after peeing in the aisle behind me. And when I came to, the band still wasn't on yet. And I was like, when the fuck are they gonna come on? And my friend goes, dude, they just got off the stage. So I missed the entire concert. And that was sadly, kind of the path that I was beginning to head down when I got sober. But fortunately, it was a couple of years before my dad passed away, and I got to have some nice moments with. When his cancer was terminal, I got a moment alone with him in the hospital, and I'd begun to accept who he was. And I said, I just want to thank you for the things that you gave me in life. You modeled how to live below your means to be financially responsible. I think there was something else, but I can't remember what it was. And he said, I used to worry about you, but I don't worry about you anymore. And we told each other that, you know, I love you. But when my dad passed away shortly after, I didn't cry. And they say that, you know, grief kind of has its own schedule. And it was about three months after he died. I was driving in my car and I went to call him to ask him who he thought was going to win the NCAA basketball championship, which I would do every year because sports was one of the things we could connect through. And I picked up the phone and I realized I will never be able to call him and talk about that again. And that's when I broke down and I cried. And I got to a place where I'm okay with the fact that our relationship was what it was. Because I realized his father tortured him mentally and emotionally. And what my dad was doing in his head was he was probably trying to save me from the demons that he had in his head. And I was grateful for that because I. I feel like that's the best that he could do. And I'm okay with that. Thank you. We'll be right back. This Father's Day at Lowe's. Score free gifts for the greatest dad. Right now get a free select Dewalt Craftsman or cobalt tool with purchase of a select battery kit. Plus get a free Werner 2 foot aluminum ladder when you buy an 8 foot fiberglass ladder. Shop these deals and more this Father's Day at Lowe's. We help you Save valid through615.
[16:46]
Paul Gilmartin
Wall supplies. Last selection mirrors by location.
[16:51]
Kevin Allison
Hey there. My name is Jody Avergan. Have you noticed the present day, it feels pretty rocky. Well, I think history can help. What's more, this little country of ours, the United States is it's turning 250 soon. So how did we get here? On this day, historians Nicole Hemmer and Kelly Carter Jackson and I sit down to look at stories from the past. Silly, surprising, deeply relevant that feel like they have something to teach us about today. This day three times a week. You can find it wherever you're listening right now. Ryan Reynolds here from Mint Mobile. With the price of just about everything going up, we thought we'd bring our prices down. So to help us we brought in a reverse auctioneer which is apparently a.
[17:31]
Paul Gilmartin
Thing Mint Mobile Unlimited premium wireless. Everybody get 30. 30.
[17:35]
Kevin Allison
Better get 30. Better to get 20. 20. 20. Better get 20. 20. Everybody get 15.
[17:38]
Paul Gilmartin
15.
[17:38]
Kevin Allison
15. 15.
[17:39]
Paul Gilmartin
Just 15 bucks a month.
[17:40]
Kevin Allison
Sold. Give it a try@mintmobile.com Switch upfront payment of 45 dollars for 3 month plan equivalent to 15 dollars per month required new customer offer for first 3 months only. Speed slow after 35 gigabytes of network's busy taxes and fees extra See mintmobile.com Are you still quoting 30 year old movies have you said cool beans in the do you think Discover isn't widely accepted? If this sounds like you, you're stuck in the past. Discover is accepted at 99% of places that take credit cards nationwide, and every time you make a purchase with your card, you automatically earn cash back. Welcome to the now it pays to Discover. Learn more@discover.com credit card based on the February 2024 Nielsen report we.
[18:31]
Paul Gilmartin
After long nights of scorpion hunting with a black light, my dad would grill for us while teaching me baseball next to our super classy above ground pool in the desert of Phoenix, Arizona. And at this point my parents are divorced. Like they've been divorced for a while and they definitely do not get along. And me and my dad's relationship just kind of consisted of us not really knowing each other but just being complete assholes to each other all the time in like a loving, pranky way. Like, to this day, there's still things that I realized that were just things that my dad told me to scare me. Like I was walking down the street and I was like, oh, be careful of that cactus because their thorns actually shoot out at you. I remember my dad used to take us up to Sedona, me and my sister, and we would catch fish and frogs, and I climbed a tree with a porcupine pine once. Those were the few times that we actually connected. And those were one of the few times where I actually felt free. Because there is something achingly lonely about being in the desert. I don't know if it's the dry heat or the nothingness or what, but I remember always feeling super lonely out there. For the longest time I just thought that I was just the token weird Jewish girl in my school that just associated the smell of gasoline with this shitty amusement park my dad used to take us to called Fiddlesticks. What I didn't know was that my dad was living a secret life. Dun dun dun. So When I was 18, my sister had a huge art installation called the Candy Shop in San Francisco that just consisted of an entire store made of candy filled with hair and nails and pig's eyes. I would send her bags of hair and nails for like two months and my friends were like, literally, are you a serial killer? Because we don't know who you are. My dad is a construction worker at this time and he was helping her set up for the installation. My dad just looks at her and goes, so Leah, I kind of want to get a pair of pink overalls. And she's like, yeah, go ahead. You should totally do that. I also want to get a vagina because I'm a woman and I've been living as a woman for the past 10 years. Right after that conversation happened, I walked in and they were like, oh, hi. Hello. Hi. And my dad lost, like, £100 before we met. I'm gonna refer to her as she now. We're on the same page. Cool. Cool, great. So I was like, dad, you look super skinny. Are you okay? And she's like, oh, thank you. I was like, that was a weird response. And my sister is an artist and she's constantly, like, a lot of her friends are trans. She's surrounded by LGBT community all the time. When she found out, she was just like, cool. So my dad said, please do not tell me until I'm ready. And she's like, of course. I will honor that. And so, yeah, she told me immediately. And it was the perfect setting to tell me. It was a spring day in San Francisco. There was just, like, beautiful rainbow flags waving everywhere. And it was beta breakers. And if you're not familiar with beta breakers, it's just a marathon where people wear, like, superhero outfits and tutus. So it was just like, woo. Like, everywhere we were going. And she's like, well, now's the best time. What would you do if someone you know's dad became a woman? And I was like, hm, I don't know. That'd be pretty cool. Why? Who is it? Is it Will? I knew it was Will. His dad is. I knew it. And she's like, no, it's Dad. I mean, obviously I was just like, holy shit. Like, at first, then I just was, like, racking my mind, being just like, am I that clueless? Like, my dad's closet was filled with wigs and women's clothing, but I remember just being like, my dad is so funny. Like, she is a crazy galaxy. I remember my dad used to collect these little gold coins, and I would pretend that I was a pirate and go in her closet and search for these gold coins. I remember being like, bra? No. Pantyhose? No. Size 13 pantsuit? No. Oh, here are the coins. I'm a pirate. I need friends. When my dad finally told me, I had a whole speech prepared. But when my dad finally told me, like, three months later, I was just, like, so angry and full of resentment and hate. I did not expect to feel that way because I was angry that we had more abusive childhood than we needed to have. I was angry for the thousands and thousands of lies upon lies. And I was also super angry at myself for being so selfish, because I'm like, this isn't about you, bitch. This isn't about. This is about her. I didn't really cry until she told me not to call her dad anymore and that Max Mason is dead. I've had, like, a lot of father figures growing up, and I feel like the one solid father figure was now dead in a bizarre way. And then she said, I don't care what I need to lie about or do, but if I don't get a vagina, I'm going to kill myself. If I had a dollar, right, for every person that said that to me. Just kidding. Flash forward eight months later Eight months later and my sister is graduating from Parsons University in New York City. I have been keeping this secret this entire time. And keeping a secret from your mom is, like, fucking impossible. Your mom is like a scanner, truth getter outer. Like, especially my mom, who's like, the most flowy hippie person who runs organizations called the Vagina Warrior Condors. She's like, yes, tell me. I'm gonna look into your soul and your eyes. I'm like, I'm lying to you. And so I say, hey, dad, all the family's going to New York. How are you gonna tell them that you are, like, a legit woman? And she was like, I think I'm just gonna show up. I'm like, no, you can't just show up and be like, hey, ex wife, I now have bigger tits than you do. Like, that's not how it works. So if you don't tell mom, then I have to tell her because, like, that's just super fucked up. So my dad wrote my mom an email saying, like, I love you. I've always loved you, but this is who I am. Here's a picture of me. See you in New York, bitch. Love ya. XOXO Gossip Girl. So my mom calls me, just bawling. She's like, I always knew it. I always knew. I'm like, okay, no, no, you didn't. But she's like, I know everything. So my dad asks us, please do not tell my side of the family, because all the Jewish side knows already, like, the cool side. But my dad's farmer, Republican side probably won't be super chill with this. So we're like, totally. They're not gonna be in New York. We're fine. So we all go to New York. We're having a blast. I have never experienced my mom and my dad have a conversation, both as women, obviously, and both getting along, which was weirder. Than my dad even being a woman. And so we're all chilling at my sister's apartment, and my Aunt Pam calls me and she says, surprise, I'm here in New York. I'm at Leah's apartment. Come let me in. I'm like, fuck, dad, your sister's here. And she goes, mm, send her in. And I'm like, dripping with fucking sweat. My heart's beating. I'm like, am I gonna have to, like, punch my aunt or, like, me, Like, I will punch her. Like, I have already decided. And so I'm, like, running down. I'm, like, titting down the stairs just like. And I open the door, I'm like, hey, Aunt Pam. Uncle Dave, funny thing. Let's talk and walk. Okay, so your brother Max now, not Max now. She's a woman. She's a woman. She's wearing a super cute polka dot wrap dress. So, like, just like, yeah. This is all the information I can give you at this point. Here we are, just silence. It was just like. It was like a western standoff. Like tumbleweed going by. And finally, my Aunt Pam just goes, hey, Max, nice dress. And I'm like, if I could just interject really quick, it's actually Marnie now. And actually, it is a really nice dress. It's actually vintage Donna Karan. That sounded really sarcastic, but she actually has really, really good fashion sense. And then, of course, the American way, my dad just goes, let's just go to dinner. So we all had a super quiet dinner until all the martinis kicked in. My aunt did end up accepting my dad, but my grandpa did not accept. My dad cannot wrap his head around transgender. It's sad because I feel like all that entire generation is just gonna die soon. So my dad did get a vagina. Woo. Woo. Go, girl. You don't have to kill yourself. Drama. Okay. I was like, I. Oh, my God. We got her matched for makeup. She now knows exactly what to wear. I'm like, daddy, put down the blue eyeshadow. I don't want you to make the same mistakes I did. Keep the glitter acid wash capris. Where the fuck did you get those? Those are, like, 90 bucks at wasteland right now. Like, good finds. All good finds. Since my dad got a vagina, she has been, like, so happy. It also is weird to think that my dad's vagina is younger than I am. But I've gotten through that milestone, and it's true. And I think that, like, if more people accepted this entire LGBTQ community and trans rights, then we would have people who transition at an early age and we wouldn't have people being abusive to themselves or their loved ones or animal friends. And even though it would be awesome for people to transition earlier, I'm really glad that she's transitioned now because she has all the wisdom and experience of a 65 year old person. But like a fresh out of the box vagine, like, that's great. Brand new, mint condition. Like, no headphone, jack, Bluetooth only. Anyway. Anyway. I think that overall, the best part about having a dad that's a woman is anytime someone's like, excuse me, Ms. Mason. I'm like, oh, please, no, Ms. Mason is my father's name. Thank y' all. Thank you.
[29:25]
Kevin Allison
I'm sick of my penis so it's gotta go. I want a new vagina My panty.
[29:31]
Paul Gilmartin
Line looks awful with this penile bulge I want a new vagina Just put me in the or turn my junk inside out Hurry, hurry, hurry before I scream and shout Inside me is a woman I've gotta let her out oh.
[29:46]
Kevin Allison
No.
[29:48]
Paul Gilmartin
Till then I'm tired Sad, sad, sad, sad, sad, sad, sad, sad, sad I want a new vagina Sad, sad, sad, sad so sad, sad, sad, sad I want a new vagina no, I'm.
[30:00]
Kevin Allison
A dad, dad, dad, dad a dad.
[30:02]
Paul Gilmartin
Dad, dad, dad I want a new vagina Sad, sad, sad, sad A sad, sad, sad dad I need my own vagina.
[30:27]
Kevin Allison
This is Risk. This is Neil diamond with a song called Dear Father behind me now. And we just heard an interstitial by Jeff Barr and the Ramones called Sad dad. But before that, Mally Mason with a story called Transparent. Well, that is all for the best of Father's Day stories number three. If you've got a story about a father, pitch it to us and maybe you can be on the next episode in this series. Everything you need to know about how to pitch us is at risk-show.com submissions. Folks, today's the day. Take a risk.
[31:07]
Paul Gilmartin
Sam.

Summary4 min read

Podcast Title: RISK!
Episode: The Best of Father's Day Stories #3
Release Date: June 12, 2025
Host: Kevin Allison

Introduction

In this poignant and revealing episode of RISK!, host Kevin Allison curates a selection of heartfelt Father's Day stories that delve into the complex, multifaceted relationships individuals have with their fathers. Titled "The Best of Father's Day Stories #3," the episode features two main narratives that explore themes of mental health, addiction, identity, and acceptance. Both stories offer deep personal insights, evoking a range of emotions from vulnerability to resilience.

Story 1: "After Dad" by Paul Gilmartin

Timestamp: [01:27] – [16:45]

Narrator: Paul Gilmartin, host of the Mental Illness Happy Hour podcast.

Summary:

Paul Gilmartin opens up about his tumultuous relationship with his father, painting a vivid picture of a man he perceived as a quiet mystery. From an early age, Paul sensed an underlying struggle within his father, who remained largely emotionally unavailable. Despite some cherished childhood memories, such as nightly bedtime rituals and shared moments swimming, Paul felt a persistent sense of not being "seen" by his father.

As Paul grows older, the complexities of his father's life become clearer. He reveals that his father was a high-functioning alcoholic who battled internal demons, a legacy of a similarly troubled father. This revelation sheds light on his father's distant behavior and emotional unavailability. The turning point in Paul's narrative occurs in 1993 when his father attempts suicide. Paul describes the harrowing experience of trying to reach out, culminating in his father's eventual rehabilitation and sober period.

Throughout the story, Paul grapples with mixed emotions—resentment, confusion, and ultimately, acceptance. He reflects on the difficulty of meeting his father "where he was" and the bittersweet moments of connection, especially towards the end of his father's life. Paul's journey culminates in a profound understanding of his father's struggles and a sense of peace with their imperfect relationship.

Notable Quotes:

[04:35] "The more people I talk to, the moments that people remember from childhood, the most are the ones where they have their parents undivided attention or they feel seen in some way."
[10:20] "When I realized, oh, my God, he's giving me the talk. But he didn't. He just..."
[14:50] "I got to a place where I'm okay with the fact that our relationship was what it was. Because I realized his father tortured him mentally and emotionally."

Story 2: "Transparent" by Jody Avergan

Timestamp: [16:50] – [30:27]

Narrator: Jody Avergan, daughter navigating her father's transition.

Summary:

Jody Avergan shares her intimate and transformative journey as her father, Max Mason, transitions to live as a woman, Marnie. Growing up in Phoenix, Arizona, Jody describes a relationship with her father marked by playful pranks and rare moments of genuine connection, often overshadowed by her parents' divorce and her father's secretive behavior.

The revelation of her father's transgender identity serves as a catalyst for intense emotional turmoil. Jody recounts the initial shock and anger upon learning that Max is transitioning, juxtaposed with her sister Leah's supportive stance. The family dynamics shift dramatically as they navigate acceptance, societal perceptions, and internal conflicts. Jody emphasizes the loneliness and misunderstandings often faced by transgender individuals and those close to them.

Despite initial resistance, Jody illustrates a gradual path towards acceptance, highlighting meaningful family interactions and the redefinition of her father's role within the family. She reflects on the broader implications for LGBTQ+ acceptance and the importance of supportive environments for individuals undergoing similar transitions.

Notable Quotes:

[22:10] "I was angry for the thousands and thousands of lies upon lies. And I was also super angry at myself for being so selfish."
[25:45] "It's kinda sad because I feel like all that entire generation is just gonna die soon."
[29:25] "But I've gotten through that milestone, and it's true. And I think that, like, if more people accepted this entire LGBTQ community and trans rights, then we would have people who transition at an early age and we wouldn't have people being abusive to themselves or their loved ones or animal friends."

Conclusion

"The Best of Father's Day Stories #3" offers a profound exploration of father-child relationships fraught with challenges yet underscored by moments of understanding and acceptance. Through Paul Gilmartin’s candid recounting of his father's battle with alcoholism and mental health, and Jody Avergan’s heartfelt narrative of her father's gender transition, the episode underscores the resilience of familial bonds amidst personal struggles. These stories not only honor the complexity of fatherhood but also highlight the universal pursuit of connection and acceptance within families.

Listeners are invited to reflect on their own relationships and consider the courage required to share and embrace deeply personal stories. The episode epitomizes the essence of RISK!—embracing vulnerability to foster genuine human connections.

Join the Conversation:

If you have a story about a father that you'd like to share, consider pitching it to RISK! for a chance to be featured in future episodes. Visit risk-show.com submissions for more information.

Thank you for tuning into RISK! Stay brave and keep sharing your stories.

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Transcript20 lines

[00:00]
Kevin Allison
Meet Natural Cycles, the only FDA cleared and CE marked birth control app that's 100% natural hormone free and side effect free. Here's how it works. The app analyzes daily changes in your body temperature to find your fertile window so you can plan or prevent pregnancy naturally. Natural Cycles is a clinically proven non hormonal birth control option that's 93% effective with typical use and 98% effective with perfect use. No synthetic hormones, just science. And if you're ready to start family planning, switching from preventing to planning a pregnancy is as easy as tapping a button. Plus, the Natural Cycles app makes tracking fertility easy. You can measure your temperature trends using an Oura Ring, Apple Watch or our Bluetooth thermometer, which is free when you sign up for an annual subscription. Join over 4 million registered users who are taking control of their fertility naturally. Save 15% when you sign up with code radio15@natural cycles.com that's radio15 for 15% off today 5am I'm up with a crisp Celsius energy drink running 12 miles today. Grab a green juice, quick change and head to work. Meetings, workshops One more Celsius. No slowing down. Working late but obviously still meeting the girls for a little dancing. Celsius Live Fit. Go grab a cold refreshing Celsius at your local retailer or locate now@celsius.com this.
[01:26]
Paul Gilmartin
Episode is brought to you by State Farm.
[01:28]
Kevin Allison
Knowing you could be saving money for the things you really want is a great feeling. Talk to a State Farm agent today to learn how you can choose to bundle and save with a personal price plan. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. Prices are based on rating plans that vary by state. Coverage options are selected by the customer. Availability, amount of discounts and savings and eligibility vary by state. This episode is brought to you by Amazon Prime. From streaming to shopping, prime helps you get more out of your passions. So whether you're a fan of true crime or prefer a nail biting novel from time to time, with services like Prime Video, Amazon Music and fast free delivery, prime makes it easy to get more out of whatever you're into or getting into. Visit Amazon.comprime to learn more. Hey folks, this is Risk, the show where people tell true stories they never thought they'd dare to share. I'm Kevin Allison and every Thursday we release these special episodes where we look back at content from our earlier years. This week it's the Best of Father's Day Stories Number three. Fatherhood is discuss in interesting and maybe surprising complex ways in this episode. Now in a Little bit. We're gonna hear from Mali Mason. But first, a story from Paul Gilmartin. Paul is the host of the Mental Illness Happy Hour podcast, an extraordinary podcast. And you will hear in this story what a thoughtful and really fascinating guy Paul is. And here he is now with a story we call After Dad. I want to talk about my dad. My dad was always a mystery to me. There was something about him that I couldn't ever really put my finger on. And he was a really quiet guy. He was really difficult to get to know. And I remember being, like, 6 or 7 years old and feeling like he is battling something, and I don't know what it is. He was just always kind of trapped in his head. He wasn't a loud person. He was never a violent person. My friends would come over and they would say, why is your dad mad at me? And I would say, that's just his face. There was just a. There was an intensity to him that I didn't understand. Not that I didn't have good moments with him when I was little. One of my favorite moments was he would carry me to bed every night, and we had this ritual. He would carry me up the stairs, and when the ceiling got low at one point, I would always touch the ceiling. And we did it so much that there was, like, handprints on it. And years later, I remember looking at those handprints and thinking, God, there aren't many memories that I have of my dad that are warm. He loved to swim. People said, you have to eulogize your dad. It would be like he wrote a good check and he liked to swim. My dad had such trouble being present. And, you know, there's nothing kids want more than their parents undivided attention. You can give them gifts and all that other shit, but I don't know, there's just something. The more people I talk to, the moments that people remember from childhood, the most are the ones where they have their parents undivided attention or they feel seen in some way. And there was always just kind of a feeling that I didn't feel seen. But swimming. My dad loved the water. He taught us, my brother and I, how to dive. And it seemed like the one place in the world where he would kind of let loose and be present. And the other thing where I felt seen was when I played sports. The only time I ever in my life saw him express joy was when I pitched a winning game in Little League against an undefeated team. And he came leaping out of the dugout like. Like a leprechaun I don't even know how to describe it, but it was. His knees were going, like, abnormally high, and he was. And he has no sense of rhythm, and his arms were flapping up and down. And I remember going from, like, sheer joy at winning to sheer embarrassment and my dad running towards me, but he picked me up and he held me. And it was such a bizarre weekend because then we got in the car almost immediately and we went to our family vacation, which that year was at the Ozarks. And I remember my brother and I were at the pool. My dad comes up and he seems angry, but then again, that's my dad's face. And he says, I need to talk to you. And I'm like, oh, fuck, what did I do? And he sits me down and he says, paul, when a man loves a woman, he puts his penis inside her vagina. And I remember thinking, what did I do? And after about a minute, I realized, oh, my God, he's giving me the talk. But he didn't. He didn't. He just. If he could have typed it up and gave it to me, he would have done that. And then he would have signed it. Dad, you know, had his secretary type. He was kind of like Don Draper. He was an insurance executive. He was very successful. He had a big corner office with a bar and a couch, and I thought the bar was so cool. I didn't know he was an alcoholic, but I never saw him slur. But he was probably the most high functioning alcoholic I've ever known. Help is on the way. You're at that cute stage where it's funny. I was at that stage. But, like, my dad's favorite thing to do was to have people around him, but leaving him alone. And that's kind of who I turned into. As much as I hate to admit it. But I didn't know my dad was an alcoholic till he was 18. I was 18 years old and I was leaving for college, and my mom said, you should keep an eye on your drinking. Alcoholism runs in the family. I was like, what? Who? Yeah. Turns out every male in my family tree is an alcoholic. And it explained a little bit of why he was so trapped in his head and so distant. And then in 1993, I was still living back in Chicago, living on my own, but back in the same town as my family. And I got a phone call that my dad had attempted suicide. He was in New York on business, and he hadn't shown up for a meeting, and they broke down his hotel room door. And he was in the bathtub drunk, and he had opened his wrists. And I remember being surprised, but not being surprised and finally going, oh, that explains it. That's what he was battling. He doesn't want to be here. He doesn't want to be alive anymore. And he has been trying to find a way to survive all his life. He's been trying to find something to enable him to feel. He had a terrible childhood. His father was also an alcoholic. The gift that keeps on giving. And his father was emotionally sadistic, just a straight up asshole. And I know my dad had demons in his head. And he was committed to Bellevue, which I'm sure you all know is like the casting central version of a psych unit in New York. And we weren't able to get a hold of. Of him, even though we would call. They said, well, the only phone is a payphone in the hallway. So for three days, crazy people are answering the phone. We're trying to say, is William Gilmartin there? And you know the government is spying on you. And not to minimize people's mental health experiences, but fuck them anyway. Trying to talk to my dad. Finally, after three days, I get him on the phone and I say, dad, it's Paul, how are you? And he goes, oh, fine. That made me more sad than him trying to take his life because I thought, what's it going to take for him to ask for help? You know, he's the type of person who. He fell and broke his ribs one time and laid in his bed. He was living alone for three days rather than pick up the phone and ask somebody for help. But thankfully, the psychiatrist at that psych hospital said, I will only release you if you get directly on a plane, fly directly to Chicago. Your family meets you at the airport and they drive you to rehab. And so we did on Christmas Eve. And I didn't really feel much. I battled numbness most of my life, I suppose, as a way to. To deal with things that aren't fun. But we didn't talk about it. We didn't talk about it in the car. We didn't talk about it after we dropped him off. And my dad stayed sober for a while. And before he passed away from cancer, I began to try to meet him where he was, as they say, instead of trying to. To get him to be the dad that I needed. I had an epiphany one day. I was trying to get some praise from him. I had started doing a radio show and I was producing sketches every week. And it involved elaborate Recordings and editing. And I played it for him, and he didn't say anything. And I said, so, what did you think? And he was silent. He said, I didn't think it was your best work. And I remember feeling crushed, and then looking out the window and thinking, what the fuck am I doing? This guy is not capable of giving you what you need. He's been disappointing you in some way or another your whole life. But I wanted to believe that. When I was 16 years old, I got busted before the first day of school my sophomore year for smoking weed. And my dad said he was very forgiving. He said, this is the saddest day of my life, except for the day my father died. His father, who he hated. But I said, okay, I'll make you a deal. You quit smoking cigarettes, and I'll quit smoking pot. And he thought about it, and he said, okay. And we were about six months into it, and I was going to a UFO concert with my friends, and they passed me a joint, and I said, no. And they said, oh, you're still doing that thing with your dad? I said, yeah. And my neighbor laughed. I go, what? He goes, dude, your dad's been on the side of the house smoking cigarettes every night after dinner. And I was like, give me that joint. Give me that beer. And it was on, man. It was like something in me almost kind of broke in that moment of, like, trusting, trusting people. And I got so drunk at that concert that I apparently blacked out after peeing in the aisle behind me. And when I came to, the band still wasn't on yet. And I was like, when the fuck are they gonna come on? And my friend goes, dude, they just got off the stage. So I missed the entire concert. And that was sadly, kind of the path that I was beginning to head down when I got sober. But fortunately, it was a couple of years before my dad passed away, and I got to have some nice moments with. When his cancer was terminal, I got a moment alone with him in the hospital, and I'd begun to accept who he was. And I said, I just want to thank you for the things that you gave me in life. You modeled how to live below your means to be financially responsible. I think there was something else, but I can't remember what it was. And he said, I used to worry about you, but I don't worry about you anymore. And we told each other that, you know, I love you. But when my dad passed away shortly after, I didn't cry. And they say that, you know, grief kind of has its own schedule. And it was about three months after he died. I was driving in my car and I went to call him to ask him who he thought was going to win the NCAA basketball championship, which I would do every year because sports was one of the things we could connect through. And I picked up the phone and I realized I will never be able to call him and talk about that again. And that's when I broke down and I cried. And I got to a place where I'm okay with the fact that our relationship was what it was. Because I realized his father tortured him mentally and emotionally. And what my dad was doing in his head was he was probably trying to save me from the demons that he had in his head. And I was grateful for that because I. I feel like that's the best that he could do. And I'm okay with that. Thank you. We'll be right back. This Father's Day at Lowe's. Score free gifts for the greatest dad. Right now get a free select Dewalt Craftsman or cobalt tool with purchase of a select battery kit. Plus get a free Werner 2 foot aluminum ladder when you buy an 8 foot fiberglass ladder. Shop these deals and more this Father's Day at Lowe's. We help you Save valid through615.
[16:46]
Paul Gilmartin
Wall supplies. Last selection mirrors by location.
[16:51]
Kevin Allison
Hey there. My name is Jody Avergan. Have you noticed the present day, it feels pretty rocky. Well, I think history can help. What's more, this little country of ours, the United States is it's turning 250 soon. So how did we get here? On this day, historians Nicole Hemmer and Kelly Carter Jackson and I sit down to look at stories from the past. Silly, surprising, deeply relevant that feel like they have something to teach us about today. This day three times a week. You can find it wherever you're listening right now. Ryan Reynolds here from Mint Mobile. With the price of just about everything going up, we thought we'd bring our prices down. So to help us we brought in a reverse auctioneer which is apparently a.
[17:31]
Paul Gilmartin
Thing Mint Mobile Unlimited premium wireless. Everybody get 30. 30.
[17:35]
Kevin Allison
Better get 30. Better to get 20. 20. 20. Better get 20. 20. Everybody get 15.
[17:38]
Paul Gilmartin
15.
[17:38]
Kevin Allison
15. 15.
[17:39]
Paul Gilmartin
Just 15 bucks a month.
[17:40]
Kevin Allison
Sold. Give it a try@mintmobile.com Switch upfront payment of 45 dollars for 3 month plan equivalent to 15 dollars per month required new customer offer for first 3 months only. Speed slow after 35 gigabytes of network's busy taxes and fees extra See mintmobile.com Are you still quoting 30 year old movies have you said cool beans in the do you think Discover isn't widely accepted? If this sounds like you, you're stuck in the past. Discover is accepted at 99% of places that take credit cards nationwide, and every time you make a purchase with your card, you automatically earn cash back. Welcome to the now it pays to Discover. Learn more@discover.com credit card based on the February 2024 Nielsen report we.
[18:31]
Paul Gilmartin
After long nights of scorpion hunting with a black light, my dad would grill for us while teaching me baseball next to our super classy above ground pool in the desert of Phoenix, Arizona. And at this point my parents are divorced. Like they've been divorced for a while and they definitely do not get along. And me and my dad's relationship just kind of consisted of us not really knowing each other but just being complete assholes to each other all the time in like a loving, pranky way. Like, to this day, there's still things that I realized that were just things that my dad told me to scare me. Like I was walking down the street and I was like, oh, be careful of that cactus because their thorns actually shoot out at you. I remember my dad used to take us up to Sedona, me and my sister, and we would catch fish and frogs, and I climbed a tree with a porcupine pine once. Those were the few times that we actually connected. And those were one of the few times where I actually felt free. Because there is something achingly lonely about being in the desert. I don't know if it's the dry heat or the nothingness or what, but I remember always feeling super lonely out there. For the longest time I just thought that I was just the token weird Jewish girl in my school that just associated the smell of gasoline with this shitty amusement park my dad used to take us to called Fiddlesticks. What I didn't know was that my dad was living a secret life. Dun dun dun. So When I was 18, my sister had a huge art installation called the Candy Shop in San Francisco that just consisted of an entire store made of candy filled with hair and nails and pig's eyes. I would send her bags of hair and nails for like two months and my friends were like, literally, are you a serial killer? Because we don't know who you are. My dad is a construction worker at this time and he was helping her set up for the installation. My dad just looks at her and goes, so Leah, I kind of want to get a pair of pink overalls. And she's like, yeah, go ahead. You should totally do that. I also want to get a vagina because I'm a woman and I've been living as a woman for the past 10 years. Right after that conversation happened, I walked in and they were like, oh, hi. Hello. Hi. And my dad lost, like, £100 before we met. I'm gonna refer to her as she now. We're on the same page. Cool. Cool, great. So I was like, dad, you look super skinny. Are you okay? And she's like, oh, thank you. I was like, that was a weird response. And my sister is an artist and she's constantly, like, a lot of her friends are trans. She's surrounded by LGBT community all the time. When she found out, she was just like, cool. So my dad said, please do not tell me until I'm ready. And she's like, of course. I will honor that. And so, yeah, she told me immediately. And it was the perfect setting to tell me. It was a spring day in San Francisco. There was just, like, beautiful rainbow flags waving everywhere. And it was beta breakers. And if you're not familiar with beta breakers, it's just a marathon where people wear, like, superhero outfits and tutus. So it was just like, woo. Like, everywhere we were going. And she's like, well, now's the best time. What would you do if someone you know's dad became a woman? And I was like, hm, I don't know. That'd be pretty cool. Why? Who is it? Is it Will? I knew it was Will. His dad is. I knew it. And she's like, no, it's Dad. I mean, obviously I was just like, holy shit. Like, at first, then I just was, like, racking my mind, being just like, am I that clueless? Like, my dad's closet was filled with wigs and women's clothing, but I remember just being like, my dad is so funny. Like, she is a crazy galaxy. I remember my dad used to collect these little gold coins, and I would pretend that I was a pirate and go in her closet and search for these gold coins. I remember being like, bra? No. Pantyhose? No. Size 13 pantsuit? No. Oh, here are the coins. I'm a pirate. I need friends. When my dad finally told me, I had a whole speech prepared. But when my dad finally told me, like, three months later, I was just, like, so angry and full of resentment and hate. I did not expect to feel that way because I was angry that we had more abusive childhood than we needed to have. I was angry for the thousands and thousands of lies upon lies. And I was also super angry at myself for being so selfish, because I'm like, this isn't about you, bitch. This isn't about. This is about her. I didn't really cry until she told me not to call her dad anymore and that Max Mason is dead. I've had, like, a lot of father figures growing up, and I feel like the one solid father figure was now dead in a bizarre way. And then she said, I don't care what I need to lie about or do, but if I don't get a vagina, I'm going to kill myself. If I had a dollar, right, for every person that said that to me. Just kidding. Flash forward eight months later Eight months later and my sister is graduating from Parsons University in New York City. I have been keeping this secret this entire time. And keeping a secret from your mom is, like, fucking impossible. Your mom is like a scanner, truth getter outer. Like, especially my mom, who's like, the most flowy hippie person who runs organizations called the Vagina Warrior Condors. She's like, yes, tell me. I'm gonna look into your soul and your eyes. I'm like, I'm lying to you. And so I say, hey, dad, all the family's going to New York. How are you gonna tell them that you are, like, a legit woman? And she was like, I think I'm just gonna show up. I'm like, no, you can't just show up and be like, hey, ex wife, I now have bigger tits than you do. Like, that's not how it works. So if you don't tell mom, then I have to tell her because, like, that's just super fucked up. So my dad wrote my mom an email saying, like, I love you. I've always loved you, but this is who I am. Here's a picture of me. See you in New York, bitch. Love ya. XOXO Gossip Girl. So my mom calls me, just bawling. She's like, I always knew it. I always knew. I'm like, okay, no, no, you didn't. But she's like, I know everything. So my dad asks us, please do not tell my side of the family, because all the Jewish side knows already, like, the cool side. But my dad's farmer, Republican side probably won't be super chill with this. So we're like, totally. They're not gonna be in New York. We're fine. So we all go to New York. We're having a blast. I have never experienced my mom and my dad have a conversation, both as women, obviously, and both getting along, which was weirder. Than my dad even being a woman. And so we're all chilling at my sister's apartment, and my Aunt Pam calls me and she says, surprise, I'm here in New York. I'm at Leah's apartment. Come let me in. I'm like, fuck, dad, your sister's here. And she goes, mm, send her in. And I'm like, dripping with fucking sweat. My heart's beating. I'm like, am I gonna have to, like, punch my aunt or, like, me, Like, I will punch her. Like, I have already decided. And so I'm, like, running down. I'm, like, titting down the stairs just like. And I open the door, I'm like, hey, Aunt Pam. Uncle Dave, funny thing. Let's talk and walk. Okay, so your brother Max now, not Max now. She's a woman. She's a woman. She's wearing a super cute polka dot wrap dress. So, like, just like, yeah. This is all the information I can give you at this point. Here we are, just silence. It was just like. It was like a western standoff. Like tumbleweed going by. And finally, my Aunt Pam just goes, hey, Max, nice dress. And I'm like, if I could just interject really quick, it's actually Marnie now. And actually, it is a really nice dress. It's actually vintage Donna Karan. That sounded really sarcastic, but she actually has really, really good fashion sense. And then, of course, the American way, my dad just goes, let's just go to dinner. So we all had a super quiet dinner until all the martinis kicked in. My aunt did end up accepting my dad, but my grandpa did not accept. My dad cannot wrap his head around transgender. It's sad because I feel like all that entire generation is just gonna die soon. So my dad did get a vagina. Woo. Woo. Go, girl. You don't have to kill yourself. Drama. Okay. I was like, I. Oh, my God. We got her matched for makeup. She now knows exactly what to wear. I'm like, daddy, put down the blue eyeshadow. I don't want you to make the same mistakes I did. Keep the glitter acid wash capris. Where the fuck did you get those? Those are, like, 90 bucks at wasteland right now. Like, good finds. All good finds. Since my dad got a vagina, she has been, like, so happy. It also is weird to think that my dad's vagina is younger than I am. But I've gotten through that milestone, and it's true. And I think that, like, if more people accepted this entire LGBTQ community and trans rights, then we would have people who transition at an early age and we wouldn't have people being abusive to themselves or their loved ones or animal friends. And even though it would be awesome for people to transition earlier, I'm really glad that she's transitioned now because she has all the wisdom and experience of a 65 year old person. But like a fresh out of the box vagine, like, that's great. Brand new, mint condition. Like, no headphone, jack, Bluetooth only. Anyway. Anyway. I think that overall, the best part about having a dad that's a woman is anytime someone's like, excuse me, Ms. Mason. I'm like, oh, please, no, Ms. Mason is my father's name. Thank y' all. Thank you.
[29:25]
Kevin Allison
I'm sick of my penis so it's gotta go. I want a new vagina My panty.
[29:31]
Paul Gilmartin
Line looks awful with this penile bulge I want a new vagina Just put me in the or turn my junk inside out Hurry, hurry, hurry before I scream and shout Inside me is a woman I've gotta let her out oh.
[29:46]
Kevin Allison
No.
[29:48]
Paul Gilmartin
Till then I'm tired Sad, sad, sad, sad, sad, sad, sad, sad, sad I want a new vagina Sad, sad, sad, sad so sad, sad, sad, sad I want a new vagina no, I'm.
[30:00]
Kevin Allison
A dad, dad, dad, dad a dad.
[30:02]
Paul Gilmartin
Dad, dad, dad I want a new vagina Sad, sad, sad, sad A sad, sad, sad dad I need my own vagina.
[30:27]
Kevin Allison
This is Risk. This is Neil diamond with a song called Dear Father behind me now. And we just heard an interstitial by Jeff Barr and the Ramones called Sad dad. But before that, Mally Mason with a story called Transparent. Well, that is all for the best of Father's Day stories number three. If you've got a story about a father, pitch it to us and maybe you can be on the next episode in this series. Everything you need to know about how to pitch us is at risk-show.com submissions. Folks, today's the day. Take a risk.
[31:07]
Paul Gilmartin
Sam.