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Risk Never Sleeps Podcast
Episode #200. AI Isn’t the Hard Part. Security Is, with Steven Ramirez, Chief Information Security & Technology Officer for Renown Health
00:26:06
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A
Foreign.
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B
Welcome to Risk Never Sleeps, where we meet and get to know the people delivering patient care and protecting patient safety. I'm your host, Ed Gaudet.
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A
Welcome to the Risk Never Sleeps podcast in which we learn about the people that are on the front lines protecting patient safety and delivering patient care. I'm Ed Gaudette, the host of the program, and I'm live at Vive 2026 in Los Angeles with the one, the only, the 200th episode. Stephen Ramirez, renown Health.
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C
Great to be here.
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A
You are number 200, my man.
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C
Yeah. The special milestone. So. Yeah. This is incredible. This is exciting. Yeah, no, glad to be here with you guys.
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A
Yeah. A lot to cover. A lot to cover. So for folks that don't know, you, share a little bit about yourself, your role, your organization.
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C
Steven Ramirez, And I'm the CISO and cto, but the T is starting to dwindle. We have a great leader that we've hired, so I'm over all security functions, but I'm strictly over service desk and Microsoft right now, as well as IT governance. We just recently rolled out ServiceNow, so, you know, all of those components we feel have, you know, some strong security ties in. So I've kept those, at least for the foreseeable future.
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A
We were at the ServiceNow reception last night.
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C
I was not.
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A
Oh, so where'd you go?
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C
I was at Joey's. So what's that downtown somewhere? It's like a steak and sushi place. I went with my friends from Rubric, so. Oh, catching up. Nice. Catching up with them. And then went to the jw. Yeah, it's all the rest of the world, since that seems to be the.
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A
Are you staying there?
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C
I am not walking distance. You know, a good steward is a. Is a ciso, so. That's right.
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A
Well, we went to the Chubby Cattle Company or something. It was incredible. It was in Little Tokyo.
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C
Oh, nice.
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Which is about five miles from here.
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C
It was some good, like, Asian fusion. Have you ever had that? No.
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A
It was incredible. Yeah.
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C
Food here has been amazing.
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A
It has been, isn't it?
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C
Yeah. Yeah. I love la. That's okay. Here often. Yeah. My family's actually from Ventura County. I'm originally from California.
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B
You are?
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C
Yeah.
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A
I didn't know that.
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C
Where? Yeah, up in Camarillo. Thousand Oaks.
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Thousand Oaks. Nice, Jeff.
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C
Which is about four hours from here in traffic, but, you know, really, in a normal world, about 20 minutes. Yeah. So. But no, yeah, it's great to be back here. It's like you said, been great food. That's where had to get an extra large shirt just to make room for the conference schedule between now and now and hims.
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A
So yeah, we'll put on like 20 pounds after this show, right?
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C
Yeah.
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A
Oh my gosh. So what have you heard that's been surprising?
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C
Last couple days a lot on AI, which isn't shocking. Yeah. I'm actually speaking in an AI panel later, but I think people are getting more into the schematics of what AI really means. You know, it's been, I think the past three years we've been talking about AI is coming, AI is coming. Now people are starting to get into the nuts and bolts of what makes up AI Governance controls, how you can be successful in it. So I mean there's hundreds of booths out here with people always claiming they have the silver bullet. So it's just about really what fits your organization. But always good to kind of see a lot of these startups, a lot of different pieces. I know security is still a big theme. Pop health, just a lot of add ons to that. But AI, just by a landslide.
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A
You've been doing it for a while. Renown. What are some of the early use cases you prioritized?
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C
We were an early adopter of Microsoft Copilot. So being the Microsoft owner or this year doing an engagement with Microsoft and CDW to really look at our adoption now I think people are just scratching the surface on how we do that because that's a great use case that if we can't even do something simple like Copilot and use it just for like make my email sound nicer or help me, you know, pretty up this PowerPoint, really that adoption will help drive success throughout the organization. We have a new date data and analytics leader as well. She's amazing. They're working on a ton of different stuff and she's really helping set our AI strategy as well.
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A
Okay.
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C
We already had some great guardrails and components stood up from a security perspective. You know, we really hit that on early. I know we worked with you guys on like assessing what's coming in, really understanding what the how that fits into our ecosystem. But Chuck's, you know, always been a big guy of not chasing shiny bright objects. So we're looking more at platform AI. So what does EPIC look like? What does Microsoft look like? Just went with Dax.
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A
You have ambient listening in place.
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C
Yes. So doing an expansion of that and even looking at it for our nurses. So that's. Yeah. From a security perspective we had to start to put. Because we have bolt phones, it doesn't have access to anything but the network. So if they leave, there's no street value. I always tell everyone so don't steal our phones. So we're rolling out CrowdStrike on all of our phones just because it seems like the use cases and necessity of the mobile device driving and supporting that we're needing to make sure we're better securing those devices. So a lot of cool stuff from that but yeah, really just staying on core to our roots on Microsoft and Epic.
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A
When you look out over the next couple years, what are your top strategic initiatives?
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C
Well, this year for us, I'm a big identity guy. I've talked about that for a long time. We just partnered with Clear, so we're doing identity verification enhancements at the service desk. Nice. As well as some of our key technology partners are going to require that people are who they say they are. We already have processes in place with that and we've already had a lot of close calls which is great to be able to really share on that deep fake. Well, people that are like listening to these recordings, people are very just cool, calm and collected and it's crazy the amount of information they have on people and people still don't get that till they start to hear some of these recordings. So we had somebody call. We have like an HR specific service desk that somebody had called to try to get information and then in turn called our service desk. But we have processes that are able to to catch that. So it's like they're getting creative. They're knowing organizations now are doing identity verifications and stuff. So now they're starting to call personal cell phones and say that they're it. And the whole Shiny Hunter thing that came out a few weeks ago.
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Yeah.
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C
So I work scary continuing to focus on identity. It's 80% of everything that happens. So that's, you know, about what I scored in all my college classes. So if we can get 80% right on that and you know, everything else should fit in place. So we're looking at, you know, all in on identity this year. A lot more enhancements on DLP and the term zero trust is starting to come back now. So we're doing a big expansion with netscope and looking at more targeted access to go into those various layers and obviously be able to support where the organization's going. So our other big key initiative that you spoke to is we just partnered with databricks. We're building that out in Azure. That's going to be our data warehouse. Really what's going to feed all of our analytics data across, you know, the organization. So of course huge security play into that. So just hired a security architect yesterday. Cloud architect. Wow. Yeah, accepted his role.
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A
So congrats.
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C
Him working with our managed service partner, getting Netscope and CrowdStrike up there. So it's going to be, you know,
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A
spend more time on the beach. Right.
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C
That's my job. If, if I do everything right and keep us out of the paper, that's a well deserved beach trip. But we're kind of a little slow in going to the cloud for some reasons because we've seen a lot of cloud disruption. The cloud's not always cheaper, it's not always more reliable. But we're going all in on Azure for databricks. So again making sure that that security ecosystems there, making sure we're supporting our new analytic leader, that team really the outcomes are very, very promising. We're excited about that as an organization.
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A
One of the big areas in Agentic is now people realizing that we need the same type of processes and architecture from an identity perspective. Have you been thinking about Agenic and identity and access management in the intersection of those two things?
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C
Yeah. And that's where we're starting to look more into identity proofing, looking at things like service accounts for a long time that people couldn't touch in those kind of non human accounts. So we feel that we have some tools and processes that were well ahead of the game that we're going to be able to start to address that as we're getting more into these fancy things. So it's like we're again doing the basics very well. So now it's like we get to start doing the fun stuff. Starting to get a little bit more advanced. We've had great investment and great support from our organization, not only in the security but technology front. A lot of cool stuff. We're going through our data center migration, going through our databricks, EDW and yeah, just a lot of different stuff that we're looking at. We just did our partnership with Kaiser for KP Nevada for our health plan. So going through those. That. Not an acquisition, not a division. Yeah, yeah. Because we're, you know, partners in, you know, expanding that footprint. So just a lot of work on that as well. We're going to Beaker so you know that's going to be another big initiative. I know there's whispers of looking at a new ERP partner, so a lot of cool ways and you know we're.
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You're busy, you're a busy man.
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We are. So it's, you know, we have a great team, great support of the organization, and they really understand the importance of technology and of course, security.
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Security. So how'd you get into healthcare?
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C
Well, my. Both parents are providers. My dad's a. Still a practicing primary care doc. My mom's a respiratory therapist. So I like to say since the start of Stephen, I've been in healthcare, but really just started a internship at Georgetown Hospital and then got a job at Chi. So it's kind of. So you've been from the beginning, just been in healthcare? I didn't know. It's been a great calling. It's been a great noble cause on what we're able to do and what we wake up and do every day. But it's been kind of just by luck. But all of my. Even on the vendor side, it was by luck, though.
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A
Your fan. It's a family pursuit, isn't it? It's a family mission.
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C
Yeah. I wasn't good at biology, so I was the computer science side. So. Sorry, dad, for couldn't go into the family business.
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A
Sorry. Yeah. But you're enabling physicians, right?
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C
Yes. So that's always back in mind. What would my dad do? And really just thinking to have that dynamic of, you know, asking him questions before would. How bad would this piss you off, dad? So. So it's really good to hear that. And he's actually. He says he's retiring. He's retired two times. But he's very technology savvy.
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A
Really?
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C
Yeah, he's got like, the meta glasses. I have to, like, make sure his Facebook's not getting hacked. Like, he's big time on, you know, the glasses. Yes. Going through on his vacations and doing all that.
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Really?
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C
Yeah. So he's. It's great to see that, you know, some of our older providers can embrace technology.
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I'm sure you wouldn't be happy with
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C
you considering him an older provider or more seasoned providers. So. Sorry, dad.
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A
Does he work at Renown Louisville, Kentucky? Louisville?
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C
Yes.
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You know who else is from Louisville? Well, not Louisville, but Kentucky in general.
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C
You know, from Kentucky. Who's that?
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George Clooney.
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Oh, yes.
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Did you know that?
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C
Yeah.
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Is he from Louisville?
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C
I think he's Louisville. And I always call him Jack Sparrow. But the guy that played Jack Sparrow's family's from Lexington too.
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Really?
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C
Yeah. Who's that?
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A
Johnny Depp.
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C
Johnny Depp. So, yeah, I remember because I live in Kentucky. I know my whole sister is out in Reno, but I remember as high school kid that people are like of Johnny Depp's at his mom's house across the street. So outside of Bourbon and Horses, we have a few. Wow. Big names.
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A
So I wrote a poem about George Clooney recently. Running through the streets of Tijuana with George Clooney. Oh, no, I'll just send it to you.
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C
I can't wait for that.
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I wish you could see his face. People, it's like, what the hell's going on? Welcome to my world, Steve.
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C
Love it.
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A
All right, you go back in time and tell your 20 year old self something, what would it be?
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C
Continue to have fun. And I mean, I think especially this world is. It's crazy world right now. I think that's something that we're seeing and trying to. We have a people first initiative at Renown that we, you know, we're really making sure that we can't do what we want to do without our people. So making sure that everybody understands our mission and what we're doing, while that's important. But to take care of yourself and to have fun. And I try to do that every day with my team. Like it's, let's have fun. That's if you're talking to me, go take a walk with your dog. Like, go, go out and do stuff. Like it's like if we're talking the business and other stuff, that's fine. But like we need to make sure we're taking care of ourselves, that we're having fun. And I think that's always important that while work serious, it's still okay to kind of have that balance, have fun. It'll make you stay young longer and be able to keep working. So.
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A
Amen. What do you do when you're not working? Like, what are you most passionate about? What would you be doing if you weren't doing this job?
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C
Well, my. I have a recent little girl, she's four months old today. So today, Happy birthday, Mary Ryan.
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Happy birthday, Mary Ryan.
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C
So she's getting all the shots. So mom's obviously the evil person taking her today. Oh yeah. But she's our life and everything we're doing right now, but still trying to get better at golf. I've been talking about that every time I'm here. And you know, what do you like about golf? It's just, I mean, you're outside.
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Yeah.
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It's a sport you really need to focus at and it takes a while too.
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But it's a conversation with yourself too. For 18 holes, isn't it?
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C
It's just you and the ball. So it's all on you. It's not on anyone else.
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A
Are you an angry golfer?
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C
No, I mean, it's good. If I was, I'd be mad all the time. So. Yeah.
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A
Do you sort of push your ball along? Are you maniacal about points and make sure that very.
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C
Yeah, that's a higher handicap. I've got to make sure that I'm, you know.
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Oh, by the book.
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C
Eighteen, like 20. Really? Yeah.
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Okay.
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C
That's not bad. It used to be worse. So it's trending.
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A
It's getting better. Well, the more you play, the better you get, right?
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C
Yeah.
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A
Off the tee or on the green, what do you prefer to be?
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C
I'm a great putter.
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A
Nice.
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C
Yeah.
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A
Yeah.
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C
So off the team if I'm able to fix that. Yeah, yeah.
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Usually it's psychological.
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C
Yeah. Well, it's because all my friends are like one and two handicaps because they're lawyers. You're trying to kill.
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A
You're trying to kill the ball. So you're shaking and you're losing balls, right?
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C
Yeah, they don't work, I always say. So you're in the jobs that can, you know, the more social job. So I get maybe once or twice a week and they get multiple. I know, it's practice makes perfect.
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A
Yeah.
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C
I didn't grow up around golf.
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A
So how's your short game?
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C
It's getting better.
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120 yards out, that's sort of your sweet spot.
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C
Yeah. But 120 to like 150, I can be problematic, but. Oh, really? I'll get the. We love to call it the Texas wedge. So. Yeah, I, the other day actually put an 85 foot. Almost went in too. So it's like I have friends that go inside 100 that we get the old Texas wedge out. So it's kind of cool because they're always like a bad putts better than a bad chip, so.
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A
Yeah, that's so true.
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C
Yeah.
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A
I can't get off the te. So what I typically will do when I play is I'll just play irons. You ever try that?
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C
Yeah, I've done that before. I was a four iron, three iron guy. Yeah. But it's getting a little bit better on that. So you have a big bera. I have a Callaway QI35.
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A
Look at that. I think you need a driver's license for that, don't you?
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C
Well, anytime I go rent clubs somewhere, I'm like, oh, this thing's great. So then I have to add this in, and then. Then it's mine at home and I'm like, What the heck did I buy?
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A
I just bought a 900 club. Literally.
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C
Yeah, yeah. It doesn't make the golfer any better.
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B
How much is that?
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A
I don't even know how much.
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C
I think it's 900, is it not?
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A
Yeah, right.
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C
I was Happy birthday to myself.
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A
Happy birthday.
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C
There you go.
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A
All right. What's the riskiest thing you've ever done?
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C
That is always the toughest question that you. I know that you ask. It's always the toughest one. I should have known you were going to ask me that question.
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A
You didn't prepare. Here we are with the 200th episode guest Steven Ramirez. He's quickly thinking about the riskiest thing he's ever done.
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C
Well, I do recall that I was. Why I don't like to do a lot of things in the ocean anymore. We were in Hawaii once doing a snorkeling venture.
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A
Yeah.
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And you know, like the Mori eels saw one of those and changed my life forever. I think I've jumped on my dad's back and tried to surf them back to the boat. So. Yeah. Yeah. To me that was the.
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More.
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Heels are pretty scary.
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C
Yeah.
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A
That's a good one. Yeah. Do you ever dream about the Morio Sometimes. Do you really?
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C
That's why I don't. My little girl's not gonna watch the Little Mermaid.
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A
Don't worry.
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C
But it's. Yeah, that was. That was a life changing experience for me. So. And now I'm like Reuben Pfeffer. I'm like. I'm very calculated. I'm like skydiving. I'm not going to do that. Too risky. But between now and my next episode with you, I'll have to get a little risky.
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A
I see a T shirt in your future. Consider the moray.
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C
Right, right.
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A
Just like. That's it. Consider the moray. That's sort of your. That could be your spirit animal. The more it is.
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C
Must embrace it. But it scared the crap out of me.
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A
Well, I was swimming with a shark a couple years ago, so that was pretty sc.
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C
Scary. Yeah. Yeah.
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A
Anything in the water seems to be
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C
scary because you're really. It's almost like golf. It's just you and the. Yeah, it was something. Yeah. I think there's not a lot you can do. You're in their world.
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A
That's right.
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C
You're on an island.
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A
You could bring five records with you. What would it be? You're a music guy or. Yeah.
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C
I love. Love country music right now. So I think that that's very calming. So I wouldn't pull all my Hair out.
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A
Not really. Some country music is not calming.
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C
They've had a little Morgan Wallen.
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A
That's throws chairs off the roof.
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C
Yeah, well, that's. You got to have your various moods. You know, you said five different ones.
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A
Okay, so Morgan Wall.
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C
When you're playing golf, I. I love like the Eagles. Oh, yeah. Boys like a very. That's very calming. So I'd probably have that as well.
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A
God only knows. It's such a great song.
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C
Yes. Secretly, I'd probably have Taylor Swift. We all say that because. Whoa. My wife will be playing a song like that. And I'm like, you know, snapped in on this on. I'm like, man, that's a little catchy.
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A
So Taylor Swift is a true artist. I've become a real admirer of her work as a writer, as a lyricist, as a performer. I caught some of the eras tour on tv. She had showed it on, I don't know, one of the channels recently. I was blown away.
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C
And then I would have Nelly. I love him. That was my generation in high school. Yeah, him too. Yeah. Maybe like some Biggie or Tupac too. Like I love that whole era of stuff. I just watched the. I love documentary Big Papa. Yeah. Now I am big papa, you know.
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A
Yeah. If you look.
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C
Okay. So yeah, I'd probably have a, you know, wide variety of.
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A
I like that.
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C
I'd be on here. I'd be on your.
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A
Your desert island.
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C
Yeah.
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A
Nice, nice. How about movies?
- [19:15]
C
Cast Away, obviously, since on the island. So maybe pick up some tips. I'm a love force.
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A
Like if you're living Cast Away, why would you want to have the movie? Well, you know, tips.
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C
What tips?
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A
How to start a fire.
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C
Right. Or Wilson the Ball. But I would definitely do Forrest Gump's. One of my all time favorites. I love the movie the Patriot.
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A
Yeah. Okay.
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C
That's Gladiator. Like all those.
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A
I love Gladiator. Yeah.
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C
Old schools like that. I was recently sick and I watched all the Pirates of the Caribbean. Love those. Because it kills time. You have to watch all of them. Yeah, Yeah. I would put that whole.
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A
I've never seen those.
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C
Yeah, they're great.
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A
Johnny Depp movie.
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C
Yeah. You know, that's where I had Jack Sparrow stuck.
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A
Okay. Yeah, yeah.
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C
So love those. Just because the pirate stuff's super cool and I'm a Star wars fan, so I'd probably get that. And that kills a lot of time too.
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A
Yeah, the Star wars is the best.
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C
Yeah. So that probably be my mixtape for that as well.
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A
So what books are you reading?
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C
Not a big I'm more like podcast guy.
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A
Okay. What podcast you listening to?
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C
I listen to Joe Rogan, obviously. You?
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A
The wrist never sleeps.
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C
Never sleeps. Come on. There's some great ones. I can't remember. I'll have to look at my phone. There's some great ones on, like, AI and I love murder and like murder mystery.
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A
Jokey.
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C
So, yeah, kinds of things on, like road trips or traveling out to, you know, Reno. I'm more of like current events, like podcasts, things like that than the good old fashioned book. But I'm going to be into books. It's probably going to be reading level 0 to 6 months, but going to Night Moon. Yeah. Goodnight Moon and other stuff for Thanksgiving Tree.
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A
Yeah, that's a great book.
- [20:52]
C
She's, you know, really starting to get a lot of personality, so I'm going to be able to start reading all those four months. Four months, yeah.
- [20:58]
A
Yeah. Our grandson will be a year in March, and it's incredible just to watch him grow. And he's been with us while my daughter has been building, while renovating a new house. So they've left recently, but he comes back every four days a week, so let's see. But it's incredible to watch because I completely missed that through my journey, I was traveling so much.
- [21:22]
C
It's nice with FaceTime, she could actually recognize who I am and smile now because her vision's getting better and in
- [21:28]
A
the older she gets, you'll start to see her really taking to the FaceTime. Because that's what Rory does.
- [21:33]
C
He. He.
- [21:34]
A
Yeah, I FaceTime him as often as I can. That's pretty cool.
- [21:37]
C
I know. My wife's like anti too much FaceTime, her and her. I know, but. I know, but it's like daddy's face. Of course you got to do that. But remember to protect your identity, Mary Ryan, because. Yeah.
- [21:48]
A
Is it really you, Mary Ryan?
- [21:50]
C
Yeah. So Daddy is gonna have all her accounts locked down, so.
- [21:54]
A
Yeah. No phone either. Right. Until she's 21.
- [21:57]
C
Yeah.
- [21:57]
A
Right.
- [21:57]
C
Yeah.
- [21:58]
A
Seriously.
- [21:59]
C
Well, as long as I can do it. I know there's some crazy stuff on deep fakes and stuff like that, so I'm gonna. Yeah. Yeah. It's a good thing her daddy's in cyber security. Yeah.
- [22:12]
A
Greatest lesson in your life, leadership or otherwise.
- [22:16]
C
Well, I've learned a ton, you know, over my journey. I've had some great mentors. Chuck's easily been the best boss.
- [22:23]
A
He's an amazing guy, isn't he?
- [22:25]
C
And we call it wisdom instead of calling it that. He's, you know, older, so he's always said that, you know, we call it wisdom. So I think that he's done an amazing job on giving us just wisdom on different things and life lessons. And I think the people side is always one of the biggest dynamic, especially the post Covid era, because times are tough. There's a lot of stress on people with just what we've talked about from what we're doing at work, but just a lot on what's going on in the world. So I think that him and I were just having a discussion recently about just having more questions because I was having some team members I was just talking to. I think some of them were just having a tough time with workload and all that. Yeah. It's like, ask him this question, ask him that question. And then one of the responses. There's just a lot of weird things going on. So he's like, see? Bingo. See, you need to just dig in next time on what those weird things are. So he's just very good about, like, being very surgical, using some great words and going into that. So he's been a great.
- [23:24]
A
Uncover what's really going on.
- [23:26]
C
Yeah. So I think the people side, especially with AI that we talked about and, you know, just the stressors of work, personal again, as we had talked about, it's really important to just keep a pulse on your staff. That's why the people first component really resonates with us. And, you know, as a leader, try to have as much fun as you can. Let your team members know that you love them, that you're there for them, and just be there to support them. We have great engagement scores and a lot of that other stuff, but it's really. Yeah. Just building those relationships with your team because you're not. I couldn't be as successful as I am without my team. And I make sure that anytime I get a pat on the back, I make sure to peel some of those fingers off. They're for my team as well, because I'm. It's really the work that they do, and it's really important to me that they're in a good state and. Yeah, they're successful.
- [24:14]
A
Yeah. You can't go far alone, can you?
- [24:16]
C
No. So it's. Yeah. You know, always learn something new. And I'm. It's great to be able to go to, you know, a leader like that that I'm like, what would you do in this situation? So I don't need any Yoda. Yeah. I have a truck. So, yeah, he's great. It's his cowboy.
- [24:29]
A
I hope he's not listening to this. I just called him Yoda. Sorry, Chuck.
- [24:33]
C
It's his cowboy wisdom, Remember?
- [24:34]
A
It is cowboy wisdom.
- [24:36]
C
So he gives some great stuff across the board and it's great to have leaders like him.
- [24:40]
A
And he's like the Clint Eastwood of healthcare.
- [24:43]
C
It. Yeah.
- [24:44]
A
Isn't he?
- [24:45]
C
Yeah.
- [24:45]
A
Well, Steven, right? It's about the people.
- [24:50]
C
Yeah. I love corporate. Chucked cowboy hat for dinner. So it's like. Yeah. So if our CEO allowed hats in the boardroom, I'm sure Chuck would take advantage of that.
- [25:00]
A
Chuck would take advantage of it.
- [25:01]
C
Yeah.
- [25:01]
A
Stephen, thank you so much for joining the Risk Never Sleeps podcast on the 200th episode.
- [25:06]
C
It's a no. Great stuff you guys do. It's been awesome to see the journey. I know we had, I think it was 100th episode we had not too long ago.
- [25:14]
A
Yeah.
- [25:14]
C
T shirts. It's great to hear the voices and what's going on in the industry and love your show. Love what you.
- [25:19]
A
Thank you. Thank you very much.
- [25:21]
C
Good to see you guys.
- [25:22]
A
Yeah. Good to see you. Ed Gaudette from the Risk Never Sleeps podcast. If you're on the front lines protecting patient safety and delivering patient care, remember to stay vigilant because Risk never sleeps.
- [25:38]
B
Thanks for listening to Risk Never Sleeps. For the show, notes, resources and more information and how to transform the protection of patient safety, Visit us@SenseInet.com that's C E N S I N E T Com. I'm your host, Ed Gaudette. And until next time, stay vigilant because Risk never Sleeps.