Fraud Friday: The Impostrous Influencer w/ Jameela Jamil

Summary

Scam Friday: The Impostrous Influencer with Jameela Jamil

Episode Release Date: March 28, 2025

Introduction

In this episode of Scam Goddess, host Laci Mosley welcomes the charismatic and outspoken actress and activist, Jameela Jamil, for an engaging discussion on modern and historical scams. Titled "Fraud Friday: The Impostrous Influencer," the episode delves into personal anecdotes, notorious scams in the influencer world, and a detailed exposé on the infamous Caroline Calloway. Throughout the conversation, Mosley and Jamil blend humor with insightful commentary, offering listeners both laughs and valuable lessons on the art of deception.

Guest Introduction and Personal Scam Origins

The episode kicks off with Laci Mosley introducing Jameela Jamil, praising her vibrant energy and engaging personality.

• [02:42] Laci Mosley: "I am so excited for our guest today. She is a queen."
• [04:24] Jameela Jamil: "I was 19 when I pulled my first scam."

Jamil shares her early foray into scamming, recounting how she posed as an English teacher despite lacking formal education, ultimately landing a job on television. This revelation sets the stage for a candid exploration of the motivations and nuances behind personal scams.

Scam Stories and Shared Experiences

Mosley then transitions into sharing a listener's letter, introducing a scam involving Tinder where a man uses a friend's attractive profile to garner matches and manipulate unsuspecting women.

• [08:18] Laci Mosley: "So he swipes right on every single person on Tinder to maximize matches and increase his chances of hooking up."

Jamil contributes by discussing the psychological tactics scammers employ, emphasizing the emotional manipulation involved.

• [12:28] Jameela Jamil: "Dating scams are so scary. And this nudity is so scary."

The conversation highlights the ease with which digital platforms can be exploited, shedding light on the sophisticated methods scammers use to deceive and extort victims.

Historic Hoodwinks: The Caroline Calloway Scam

One of the episode's focal points is the detailed story of Caroline Calloway, an Instagram influencer whose series of scams made headlines. Mosley outlines Calloway's deceptive journey, highlighting her false claims, fraudulent activities, and the eventual fallout.

• [21:20] Laci Mosley: "Caroline is always dreamed of being a writer and saw Instagram as a good platform to share her life story."

Jamil offers her perspective, critiquing Calloway's lack of genuine effort and the superficial nature of her scams.

• [26:35] Jameela Jamil: "I've heard a lot of guys do that."

Mosley narrates Calloway's elaborate scams, including fraudulent book deals and overpriced creativity workshops, illustrating how she manipulated followers and participants alike.

• [33:04] Laci Mosley: "Caroline took out 1200 mason jars to fulfill her promises, demonstrating her lack of planning and execution."

Jamil and Mosley critique the ethical and moral failings inherent in such scams, underscoring the emotional and financial toll on victims.

Scammer of the Week: Racy Milanovic

Concluding the main segments, Mosley introduces "Scammer of the Week," spotlighting Racy Milanovic, a psychic palm reader arrested for defrauding clients by exploiting their fears.

• [51:48] Laci Mosley: "Milanovic stole approximately $71,000 from the victim by convincing her that her daughter was possessed by a demon."

Jamil shares her disdain for Milanovic's manipulative tactics, emphasizing the severe emotional impact on the victims.

• [54:32] Jameela Jamil: "She is a scammer again. Sociopath all the way."

The segment serves as a cautionary tale, illustrating the devastating consequences of such deceitful practices.

Personal Reflections and Closing Remarks

Towards the end of the episode, Mosley and Jamil reflect on their own experiences with scams, offering humorous yet insightful takes on the nature of deception in personal and professional realms.

• [57:46] Jameela Jamil: "I scammed myself."

They discuss the importance of self-awareness and vigilance in avoiding falling prey to scams, while also acknowledging the sometimes-unavoidable nature of human vulnerability.

Notable Quotes

• Jameela Jamil: "I didn’t know that I was, but I think that I was." [04:24]
• Laci Mosley: "If you're gonna be a scammer, you gotta have a great personality." [23:09]
• Jameela Jamil: "They use the scariest thing that could possibly happen to you to threaten you into it." [57:54]

Conclusion

Fraud Friday: The Impostrous Influencer with Jameela Jamil offers a riveting exploration of deception in the modern age, blending personal narratives with broader insights into the mechanics of scams. Through candid conversations and sharp wit, Mosley and Jamil illuminate the intricate dance between trust and betrayal, leaving listeners both entertained and enlightened. As always, the episode underscores the importance of staying informed and cautious in an increasingly digital and deceptive world.

Stay Connected

For more insights and stories on scams and fraud, follow Scam Goddess on Instagram and Twitter. Share your scam experiences by emailing [e-mail], and join the "Con-gregation" to explore the humorous side of fraud.

Upcoming Content

Don’t miss out on the Scam Goddess TV show, premiering on Freeform and Hulu on January 15th, 2025, bringing the podcast’s captivating stories and sharp humor to the screen.

Stay Scheming!

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Note: Advertisements and non-content segments have been omitted to focus solely on the episode's substantive discussions.

Transcript

[Lacey Mosley]

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[Jameela Jamil]

Hi. I'm all Right. How are you? Thanks for having me.

[Lacey Mosley]

Thank you for being here. Yes, sis. And looking all cute, too, honey. Y'all can't hear how cute. Can y'all hear how cute she look? Y'all can.

[Jameela Jamil]

No one can.

[Lacey Mosley]

You can't. You already got the accent. I love. I love an accent as a scammer.

[Jameela Jamil]

I love your accent.

[Lacey Mosley]

What part of the UK are you from?

[Jameela Jamil]

I'm from London.

[Lacey Mosley]

Ah, yeah. Wait, where in London?

[Jameela Jamil]

Notting Hill. The most London part of London. She cute.

[Lacey Mosley]

Okay. I live there.

[Jameela Jamil]

I moved there because of the film.

[Lacey Mosley]

Really?

[Jameela Jamil]

No, literally, I moved there because of the film.

[Lacey Mosley]

It's so cute there.

[Jameela Jamil]

So cute.

[Lacey Mosley]

I love the. They have that market, right? Like that Portobello. Yes, I love the Portobello market. I lived there for a few months. Not Notting Hill. I lived in Ealing, which is, like, outside. But we would train into London every day and, like, work and shit.

[Jameela Jamil]

Why were you there?

[Lacey Mosley]

You know, honestly, probably scams, now that I think about it. I went as a study abroad for, like, four months, but it turned into scams.

[Jameela Jamil]

Oh, great.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yeah, I ran a theater there.

[Jameela Jamil]

Oh, my God, I love this. You'll catch me if you can.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yeah. I was 19.

[Jameela Jamil]

Is that your favorite film?

[Lacey Mosley]

No, but it is up there. You know what I mean? Like, I found some scammers a little more impressive than Leonardo, but in that movie. But I did enjoy that one. Yeah. But no. So I lived there and I operated a theater because I was 19 at the time. And the woman who ran the theater was, like, really obsessed with marrying her boyfriend, who I guess was, like in a class above her or something like that. And eventually she just stopped coming to work and she just gave me the keys. It just would not come.

[Jameela Jamil]

So as a teenager, you were running a theater?

[Lacey Mosley]

Yes.

[Jameela Jamil]

Jesus.

[Lacey Mosley]

It was very fun.

[Jameela Jamil]

Yeah.

[Lacey Mosley]

A little stressful. You know, sometimes people come calling for bill payment and things, and I was like, I don't know how to.

[Jameela Jamil]

Were you genuinely scamming at that time?

[Lacey Mosley]

I didn't know that I was, but I think that I was.

[Jameela Jamil]

I was 19 when I pulled my first scam.

[Lacey Mosley]

Oh, what was that?

[Jameela Jamil]

I. Oh, I got. I lied about becoming. Well, no, I wanted to become an English teacher and I lied that I had an education, but I didn't. I left school at 16. I got hit by a car and, like, broke in. I got hit by one car into another car, broke my back and didn't have any education. But I have this accent that makes me sound like I have an education.

[Lacey Mosley]

You do sound.

[Jameela Jamil]

And you are very smart. No, I'm not. I'm really not. It's just the accent. And so I used that accent and lied about which university I'd been to, lied about my age and became an English teacher. A fucking English teacher. I was responsible with other people's minds and education.

[Lacey Mosley]

Now, was this in America? In England, yes.

[Jameela Jamil]

On Beverage Street.

[Lacey Mosley]

Oh, that's fancy.

[Jameela Jamil]

It was wild. And so it kicked off my career. And it was there that I was, like, hanging out with all these other teachers who were all in their 30s and 40s who were twice my age. I was in a pub, and that's where a producer discovered me. And I ended up getting a job on television. But I, like, totally, like, illegal. I think what I did.

[Lacey Mosley]

I don't know. I don't know about.

[Jameela Jamil]

You should have done a background check on me. That's not my fault. That's their fault.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yeah, but you weren't a criminal. You just didn't have the degree. And if the kids.

[Jameela Jamil]

I did a little lie.

[Lacey Mosley]

Were the kids learning some things?

[Jameela Jamil]

Maybe they didn't come there to learn. But you know, everyone. There's a lot of foul language that I think a lot of people have inherited from me. But, yeah, no, I was about 19 when I started my sort of pathological lying.

[Lacey Mosley]

I love that. I love a scam origin story. And also that means that you were supposed to be there. That all was a hustle, kismet. Hell, yeah. And that's all we do in. In this industry, especially as husbands. And I'm sure every kid who got blessed to learn English from you is like, oh, my God, Jamila. Jamil was my English teacher. They're probably so happy about that.

[Jameela Jamil]

I don't know. We'll see. I would give you. I don't think their parents are thrilled now.

[Lacey Mosley]

Can they read? I don't know.

[Jameela Jamil]

I don't know. I. I shouldn't have done it. I don't know what the fuck I was doing. I just knew that I didn't want to go back to school. I would have done anything. I would have lied.

[Lacey Mosley]

You went back to school, though?

[Jameela Jamil]

No.

[Lacey Mosley]

Didn't you teach at school?

[Jameela Jamil]

Well, I went back to school to teach, but I've never learned anything. I don't know. I don't read. I don't know anything. I just have this acc.

[Lacey Mosley]

I find this so hard to believe. Jamila is a good scammer. I've read things that you posted online. You definitely read, and you are definitely.

[Jameela Jamil]

I don't read. I read essays sometimes, but I Can't read a book. I have no attention span. I'm a scumbag. I'm a trash fueled scumbag. It actually feels really good to just say this out loud and get this off my des. I'm so tired of pretending that I know anything. It's good to be here with you. Thank you for this moment.

[Lacey Mosley]

This is a safe space. Yes, sis. Well, speaking of. Speaking of scams, was that a bad segue? Y'all don't tell me. Okay, I'm tired of y'all tweeting me notes about this show. You hear me? All right, so, guys, what's hot and fried? I'm gonna tell Jamila. Actually, we have a listener letter, and I'm gonna call her Light Skin Keisha. And for those of you who know who Light Skin Keisha is, you're welcome. It's a band. But Light Skin Keisha says, dear Goddess, love the show. It's the highlight of my week. Okay, I'm not gonna read all that, but thank you. Okay, so this is a story that I swore I would never tell anyone. Oh, but you already tell it, sis. Okay, spill it. But I think you'll appreciate. And I'm gonna break my promise. And I don't think the person listens to your show anyway, and that's his loss. Well, damn, sis. Read. Okay, so I used to work with this guy whose sole purpose in life seemed to be to try to get attention from girls on Tinder at bars so then he could brag about his exploits at work. Ooh. O. To compensate for the fact that he was a dead ringer from Stinky from. Hey, Arnold. Damn. Oh, you don't like this, man. He had a method where he would swipe right on every single person on Tinder because in his mind, this would allow him the maximum number of matches and thus have the best chance of getting someone. Okay, I've heard a lot of guys do that.

[Jameela Jamil]

Yeah.

[Lacey Mosley]

Like, they'll just swipe right on every.

[Jameela Jamil]

They don't even look at the screens. My friends don't even look at the screens. They're just throwing out a wide net.

[Lacey Mosley]

I mean, honestly, love is a numbers game.

[Jameela Jamil]

Yeah, I agree.

[Lacey Mosley]

I treat it like the casino. I'm like, okay, I only need to be at the table for an hour, and in 15 minutes, I'm gonna get hot. I used to not date at all. I didn't date for seven years. And my mom was like, you should probably start dating people.

[Jameela Jamil]

How old are you?

[Lacey Mosley]

I'm 28.

[Jameela Jamil]

No, how old were you?

[Lacey Mosley]

Oh, where was I when you weren't dating till now? So 21 to 28?

[Jameela Jamil]

Yeah.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yeah.

[Jameela Jamil]

I mean, I didn't have my first kiss till I was 21, so I feel like it's okay to just move at your own pace. Yeah. Why did you not date?

[Lacey Mosley]

I was busy. Fair. I was trying to get to the money.

[Jameela Jamil]

Well, look at where you are now. That's it. You were dating the money.

[Lacey Mosley]

But now I'm like, I need someone that I can love. And also maybe would be my assistant.

[Jameela Jamil]

Oh, God, you know what? You're so hot. I actually think you could find this in this town. Truly, it's outrageous.

[Lacey Mosley]

Wait. Oh, Jamal, you don't have to tell us, but are you dating around?

[Jameela Jamil]

I'm dating. I'm dating. But I've been with the same person for five years.

[Lacey Mosley]

Oh, okay.

[Jameela Jamil]

We are happy.

[Lacey Mosley]

Oh, that's nice.

[Jameela Jamil]

I'm off the market. Thank God. Cuz I have, like.

[Lacey Mosley]

Oh, the market is bad, honey.

[Jameela Jamil]

I just, like. I don't have the skills sexually, romantically. I just can't be out there.

[Lacey Mosley]

It's a lot, honestly, Truly. And, like, this guy is the main reason I'm concerned. Like, he's swiping right on everybody.

[Jameela Jamil]

So what does she do?

[Lacey Mosley]

So she says, an important thing to note is that I seem to have earned a reputation, probably from all the shady shit I did in my past. Okay, sis, read yourself that. I'm the person you call for advice if you happen to find yourself wrapped up in some shady shit or need a shady favorite. Okay, so you're the better Call Saul about your friends. I love it. Fair. Okay. So she says, I had a reputation for not being a snitch and I'm ruining it right now. Okay. Says, let's get to the story. I'm skipping a lot of this. He was texting with a girl he met on Tinder, and they got to sexting naturally. You know, A plus B equals D. And eventually she sent nudes. So he sent some nudes in return because that's the hospitable thing to do, right? And every guy is sending nudes. I feel like you don't even have to take a fresh nude if you're a man. You just out here got him, right? I hope y'all taking better nudes than you used to. Okay, no dirty bathroom. You know, maybe no.

[Jameela Jamil]

Under, underneath, angle with the veins. We don't want to see that.

[Lacey Mosley]

No. And add a pin cap for scales. Yeah. I just don't want.

[Jameela Jamil]

I don't want it.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yeah. No. Oh, no. Yeah, you got to make sure it's manscaped. Y'all don't be sending the rough stuff or at least going to editing app. It's too many airbrushes out here. Throw a little filter on your balls.

[Jameela Jamil]

Okay, well, face tune. Dick tune. We should invent dick tune.

[Lacey Mosley]

We need to make Dicktune. We could make so much money.

[Jameela Jamil]

We would make so much money also. Everyone would benefit from that. Obviously, I'm against Photoshop, but not in this instance.

[Lacey Mosley]

But only, like, it would only enhance. Like, I don't know. See, because I'm. Now I worry. Like, you. You send it in hand stick, and then you get there and you see the real one, and it's not.

[Jameela Jamil]

It's false advertising. Okay, all right. So. Okay, so what does she do?

[Lacey Mosley]

So they're sending notes. A few exchanges. After this, he gets a text from the girl's father or stepfather. Oh, my God, guys, I have talked about this scam before it came back. I should have skimmed this further. Okay, guys, this is the scam where you send nudes to a woman. Guys, we've talked about this. And then the father, in quotes, responds to the nudes and says, you're sending these to an underage girl, and then extorts money from you so that they don't go to the police.

[Jameela Jamil]

I've heard about this sort of thing. A friend of mine recently went through something like this where he. He got a message on Facebook messenger from a woman, and she looked really hot in her profile picture, and she was just like, hi, I'm friends with a friend of yours. I think you're really cute. I really would love to connect with you. And so they start messaging with each other, and things heat up very quickly. And then she's like, I really want to do a FaceTime phone call with you.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yeah.

[Jameela Jamil]

So he's like, okay. So he agrees to the FaceTime phone call. He opens up the window when the call goes through, and she's there, like, furiously masturbating on camera, like, right at the. Like, legs akimbo, open, masturbating at the camera, almost about to orgasm.

[Lacey Mosley]

Did she answer where he was?

[Jameela Jamil]

No. And she was just like, exactly. No. And so he was like, well, shit, I guess. Yes. It would be rude to just leave her hanging. So he, you know, starts masturbating back at her. Okay, yeah, this is someone I know, by the way. I was masturbating back at her. And then suddenly, the camera swerves from her onto this guy, and he's like, that's it, we have a video of you masturbating, and we're going to send this video to all of your people in your contact list unless you go to the bank and wire $1,000 to me right now.

[Lacey Mosley]

So even on FaceTime, they're getting people.

[Jameela Jamil]

FaceTime and Facebook is where they come in and they like, you know, because you can reach anyone on Facebook.

[Lacey Mosley]

That's so true.

[Jameela Jamil]

Yeah. Dating scams are so scary. And this nudity is so scary. I don't have pictures of my tits on my Internet. I don't, because I. I just worried that it would just get out there. Anything I had taken back in the past, I stand by those photographs. Like, I sent those pictures because my tits look good, damn it. You know?

[Lacey Mosley]

Yeah, that's a blessing. Honestly, like, nudes of me younger will always be like, I won't mind if a tit pig. But I actually don't take nudes. I've always been really weird about it because I've been nervous about them being shared. A guy asked some guy on tv, the TV actors, I'm one of them and I'm still like, God. He was like, send me news and he's like semi famous. And I sent him a picture of my face and I drew a stick sexy body on the bottom and the body was sexy. I was like, man, you go ahead, have you some fun with this stick figure body, but I ain't sending you my titties. I don't know what you think this is, sir.

[Jameela Jamil]

No, I. Well, yeah, I've been in long term relationships.

[Lacey Mosley]

That's different.

[Jameela Jamil]

20S? No, no. But also, therefore, like, they're gonna see you later, right? What are you doing?

[Lacey Mosley]

Exactly.

[Jameela Jamil]

There's no point.

[Lacey Mosley]

And also, this is casual. Like, come on, dude, I like it.

[Jameela Jamil]

A good dating scam. I got one other dating scam. I know.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yeah.

[Jameela Jamil]

Can I tell you about it?

[Lacey Mosley]

Yes.

[Jameela Jamil]

So this is again, someone I know. I know because I am a scumbag. I know other scumbags. So there's this guy that I am friends with for some reason, loosely friends with. And he has a friend who's a male model, but who's married with a wife. And so he was like, listen, I need a Facebook account to tie my Tinder account to. You are handsome and taken. So it's a waste of your fucking face. So can I use your profile to attach to my Tinder so I can at least engage women in conversations because they won't even swipe right on me ever. So his friend agreed.

[Lacey Mosley]

Wow.

[Jameela Jamil]

He started using this Guy's face. And the friend never thought it would go anywhere. And he starts to suddenly get loads of matches. So he starts to charm and get to know these women. Because this guy is funny and he's smart. As often the people who are the most rejected can be because they do the work. They can't rely on their face. Listen, they have great personalities. They're often very good at cunnilingus. You know, you never know.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yeah, you gotta put in the work.

[Jameela Jamil]

Exactly.

[Lacey Mosley]

I once dated a man who looked like a pit bull. And boy, he had other skills.

[Jameela Jamil]

Yeah. Some of the best kisses I've ever kissed with the people who didn't look like they'd be good kisses. Wonderful. So what he does is he gets to know women very well and they develop these amazing comrades, like, back and forth. And they start to develop kind of a relationship over the Internet. And what he does is he arranges to meet them. He does this again and again and again. He arranges to meet them at the same bar. And he sits at the bar while they sit at a table. And they're waiting for the male model to turn up.

[Lacey Mosley]

Okay.

[Jameela Jamil]

And after about 25 minutes, obviously he's not showing this is starting to feel.

[Lacey Mosley]

Like he's with his kids.

[Jameela Jamil]

I know. And so he waits until they feel completely stood up because obviously his friend isn't coming. His friend's away with his wife, they feel stood up. So their self esteem is dropping with every minute that goes by that they're being stood up. And so what he'll do is after about 20 minutes, when it looks like she's about to leave, he'll approach her and be like, hey, sorry, are you sitting on your own? Do you mind if I join you? And then sits down and already knows everything about them and charms the shit out of them. So then they are kind of falling for him because this is what this. You've been rejected by this one man. This other man turns up who's in awe of you because he's less attractive than you, I guess. And he seems to have so much in common with you.

[Lacey Mosley]

It's like a film pickup artist.

[Jameela Jamil]

Yeah.

[Lacey Mosley]

Oh, my God.

[Jameela Jamil]

And it works. And he gets sex that way. I haven't seen him in years, but I heard that he was doing that. And I was like, it's disgraceful. But there's a tiny part of me that respects the hustle. It's a lot of legwork.

[Lacey Mosley]

That is a lot of work. The only thing that gets me about that is it does feel a little stalkery.

[Jameela Jamil]

It's disgusting. Yeah, it's disgusting. He's a pig.

[Lacey Mosley]

He's playing on people and I want to think he's a nice guy and he's just like. But I don't know if he is. That seems like a bad guy move.

[Jameela Jamil]

Maybe this is why I don't see him anymore.

[Lacey Mosley]

But it's one of the best things.

[Jameela Jamil]

Creepy fucking thing to do, isn't it? Why are people doing this to each other all the time?

[Lacey Mosley]

Hell yeah.

[Jameela Jamil]

How genius to wait till someone self.

[Lacey Mosley]

Esteem has dropped, swoop in, get sadder and sadder. You watch them on the Cosmo and they on the fourth sip.

[Jameela Jamil]

Yeah. Oh so awful.

[Lacey Mosley]

That's tragic.

[Jameela Jamil]

Anyway, sorry.

[Lacey Mosley]

Wow, that's a real scam. That's an even better scam than what was called in cuz we've actually already talked about that. Damn girl. So listen, the next time you get stood up, if a gentleman comes around and he seems too familiar, he has.

[Jameela Jamil]

The same favorite movie as you.

[Lacey Mosley]

Run, run, run away cuz he set you up. Sc y'all already know. I'm about to talk about my favorite fashion brand and I'm not even playing. I feel like they scam me because I can't stop going over there and buying things. And yes, I'm talking about Quince. While luxury is enjoyable, it's not always affordable. That's where Quince comes in. In these times where the eggs are $11, we need quince. Quince offers a range of high quality items at prices within reach. And the best part is Quince. All their Items are priced 50 to 80% less than similar brands. I recently went back on because I wanted to get some more of that. What is it called, like quiet luxury. Yes. And the organic cotton cropped cable crew sweaters that I got when I tell you I wear them and I feel like I'm Diane Keaton and I'm walking on a beach in Martha's Vineyard like just thinking about my life wistfully. I love it. Give yourself the luxury you deserve with Quint. Go to quint.com Goddess for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns. That's Q-U-I-N-C-E.com/ Goddess to get free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince.com Goddess okay, we've gotten past January New Year, new me, a lot of us have gone back to old me New Year. That's okay. There's still time to optimize your nutrition with factor Factor Has Chef made Gourmet meals that make eating well super easy and ready to heat and eat in two minutes so you can feel right and feel great no matter what life throws at you. And life has been throwing hands at me and I do not have time to cook and I definitely don't have time to wash a pot or a pan. Personally, I love the chicken with the zoodles. I love a zoodle. I love zoodles so much that I went out and bought a Zoodler peeler, you know, to do it. And then I was like, I'm tired. I'll just get factor meals and then I can still have them. Okay? Reach your goals this year. Okay? Eat smart with factor. Get [e-mail] FactorPodcast and use code FactorPodcast to get 50% off your first box plus free shipping. That's Code [e-mail] Factor Podcast to get 50% off plus free shipping on your first box. Guys. And we're back. And it's time for my favorite segment of this show, guys, Historic Hoodwinks. So this is where I will regale Jameela with a very historic hoodwink and I'll get her opinions. And guys, you have been tweeting me about this for a long time and I know I took a long time to give it to you, but sometimes good things, you just have to wait. Caroline Calloway. So I asked Jamila earlier if she knew who Caroline was and she said no, she doesn't know who Caroline is. So this is going to be fun. So Caroline is a 28 year old Instagram influencer with over 700,000 followers. She is a self described writer, art historian and teacher. She first became Internet famous for long captions chronicling misadventures as an American undergrad at Cambridge University and was later known for mysterious dissolution of her big book deal. Last January she created a creativity workshop which was billed as a tutorial to architect a life that feels full, genuine, rich and beautiful. But the event ended up being compared to a one woman fyre fest. So Caroline made a friend in creative nonfiction workshops at. Her name is Natalie. So Natalie is the friend who wrote this article about her in the Cut and this was a really popular article and this is when I first started hearing about this scam and her name is Natalie Beach. I think Natalie is obsessed with Caroline and kind of just willingly Natalie wants.

[Jameela Jamil]

To wear Caroline as a lamb skin.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yes. So I don't think she got scammed. But you can decide for yourself and the listeners can too.

[Jameela Jamil]

Did I just Say she wants to wear her as a lamp.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yeah, and it worked for me.

[Jameela Jamil]

Okay, well, no, I appreciate your rolled with it.

[Lacey Mosley]

I did. I was like, okay, then maybe that's okay.

[Jameela Jamil]

I really haven't slept. Go on.

[Lacey Mosley]

In Madden Hill.

[Jameela Jamil]

Okay, so Natalie's a freak. Caroline's an asshole. Keep going.

[Lacey Mosley]

That's a perfect summer section. So Caroline's always dreamed of being a writer and saw Instagram as a good platform to share her life story. Cause, you know, Instagram, Instagram captions, that's basically like writing a book, right?

[Jameela Jamil]

Yes.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yeah, we've all written a book by now.

[Jameela Jamil]

Oh, God. I've done some terrible end of the decade ones last year that I just want to delete.

[Lacey Mosley]

Woo. I mean, I think my book is mostly comprised of Drake lyrics, but I'm gonna still call it an Instagram book. I'm gonna make a coffee table for you hoes. I got y'all. So Caroline's account was called Adventure Grams, and the tag was, you can have an adventure anywhere if you're curious. Okay, sis. I like the branding. So the girls became very close friends. And that December, for her 21st birthday, Natalie gave Caroline a gift. Three dinner plates. Plates stamped with the Yale crest. When Caroline unwrapped them, she broke into tears, which I was like, huh? Why, sis? You didn't go to Yale. But later that winter, Caroline nonchalantly informed Natalie that the Yale plates had been stolen out of her apartment, along with her graduation ring. Okay, so Natalie says she thought the girl was lying to her, but didn't call her out on it. And then a few weeks later, she saw her wearing her graduation ring, but didn't mention it. Okay, this is a weird lie.

[Jameela Jamil]

This is very strange.

[Lacey Mosley]

The gifts you gave me were stolen from my apartment. Like, this seems like somebody who just enjoys lying. But I guess if you're a liar, you got to start warming up. You got to practice like everything else.

[Jameela Jamil]

Start slow. Yeah. Start small.

[Lacey Mosley]

Little lies.

[Jameela Jamil]

Yeah, yeah.

[Lacey Mosley]

If you're used to me lying, how do you know when I'm telling the truth?

[Jameela Jamil]

Exactly.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yes. So Caroline's Instagram, they go on this, like, Italian vacation, and that summer they leave their hotel in the morning, and Caroline would pack several outfits so that she could pose for days worth of photos in one afternoon, which I've heard of Instagram influence doing this because, like, if you wear the same outfit, even if you go to a bunch of different places, like, bitch, we already saw that outfit, so we need some new fashion.

[Jameela Jamil]

God.

[Lacey Mosley]

Okay, so she's traveling around. Okay, that's why I don't get mad at Instagram influencers, because people get mad at them and they're like, you know, you don't have a real job. But I'm like, do you know how much work it takes to pretend a life?

[Jameela Jamil]

Oh, it's amazing. It's an amazing amount that they are their own publicist. They are their own agent, their own manager. It's wild.

[Lacey Mosley]

Their own assistant, their own writer. Yes. So Natalie was instructed to find Caroline's best angles and keep the shadow out of the frame, which. That's real photography. Like, if you got a real good Instagram friend, like, I should never see they shadow in your photos.

[Jameela Jamil]

Okay. Yes.

[Lacey Mosley]

And every Instagram friend, like, if your friend is not taking 50 photos on rapid flash and different angles, like, get you a new friend.

[Jameela Jamil]

I've never done any of this.

[Lacey Mosley]

Really?

[Jameela Jamil]

Yeah.

[Lacey Mosley]

I am shocked. You always be looking so cute in your photos.

[Jameela Jamil]

I don't think I do normally. I'm just swearing at someone on my Instagram. That's it. It's just I photograph tweets in which I'm being belligerent. Someone else. I need to up my Instagram game.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yeah. I feel like I've seen it because.

[Jameela Jamil]

My boyfriend takes genuinely horrendous photographs of me. I feel like that's every man six foot six. Like, I just. It's just the top of my head and nothing else. And the top of my head looks specifically like a cat's anus. I don't know what it is. I don't know what it is.

[Lacey Mosley]

You've seen the top of your head a lot?

[Jameela Jamil]

Yeah, because he fucking photographs it all the time. It's the only. It's the angle that I see. Anyway. Go on, go on. Okay, so Caroline, the asshole. What's she doing?

[Lacey Mosley]

Yes. So Caroline is satisfied. So she takes all these photos until Caroline's satisfied with the shot. Then they hurry back to the hotel, connect with the wifi, and they brainstorm the caption together. So this is what they're doing for a whole summer in Italy.

[Jameela Jamil]

Ugh. So dope, right? But I guess, what a dry holiday for Natalie.

[Lacey Mosley]

Natalie was soaking this shit up. And that's how you know Caroline was a charismatic bitch. I told y'all, if you're gonna be a scammer, you gotta have a great personality. You know what I mean? Something to distract the people with so they end up missing their flight back to the U.S. but Caroline saved the day because she spoke a little Italian and she pretty cried in front of the airport staff. And then she sat cross legged on the floor, Milan with her parents, credit card fanned in front of her. So basically she had all the credit cards out and they put a little on the capital and put a little on the Discover and put it on the MasterCard. So Natalie offered to spend the summer editing Caroline's Instagram post to pay her back because Caroline, like paid for their flights back. So when the summer ended, Natalie returned to NYU for her final semester and Caroline flew to Cambridge University to restart her first semester. In 2015, Natalie began receiving texts from friends along the lines of, hey, have you seen this Caroline story? Is your Caroline friend? Is she famous now? Caroline got an agent. So this is like the earlier days of Instagram, right? So like when 90,000 followers was considered to be like, probably a lot, you know what I mean? Like 90,000 now is like a medium level, like influencer, which, like now brands are targeting micro influencers. So if you have like 30k or.

[Jameela Jamil]

Up, they'll like story about Caroline that's going around.

[Lacey Mosley]

So the story is, is that. But they know like basically everyone who follows Natalie on Instagram maybe also follows Caroline. And now they're seeing like her followers are growing. Now she's around ninety thousand, a hundred thousand followers, which at the time was like a lot.

[Jameela Jamil]

Yeah.

[Lacey Mosley]

So they're texting Natalie and they're like, oh, your friend, she's famous. So now Caroline got an agent who has the same agent who represents fat Jewish Kat Marnell. And we didn't know at the time, but also Donald Trump.

[Jameela Jamil]

Lovely.

[Lacey Mosley]

Donald Trump has an Instagram agent.

[Jameela Jamil]

That's great. Oh, this man, he's a Twitter agent.

[Lacey Mosley]

Oh, God. Truly true. He needs a filter.

[Jameela Jamil]

Take that man's phone away.

[Lacey Mosley]

So it's been ages since they last spoke at this point. And Natalie reached out to Caroline via email and she says, you must be so happy with that. 90,000 followers and counting. I feel strange being an onlooker. No response from Caroline. Then she emails her again. Want to bounce ideas off me? Let me know, I'm here for you.

[Jameela Jamil]

Thirsty?

[Lacey Mosley]

Ooh, very. And then the third email, yo, get back to me, girl. I just want to check in and be your ally and do some planning.

[Jameela Jamil]

She wants to fuck Natalie. I think she does. Natalie wants to fuck Caroline.

[Lacey Mosley]

Natalie wants to fuck Caroline. Cause the first one is like kind of cute. Like, oh, girl, I see you out here popping what's good? No response. The second one's like, hey, girl, you know, I could really help you out if you need some help or anything. Would you need something for me? No response. Next one. Hey. I mean, I'm not trying to be thirsty or nothing, but, you know, I could help you out, though. I could really be your ally. Do you need anybody to clean your house?

[Jameela Jamil]

Oh, bless her.

[Lacey Mosley]

So eventually, Caroline called her back, and she said she was back in New York and her book was due after the weekend and she needed Natalie's help.

[Jameela Jamil]

No.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yes. So they wrote dozens of pages through the night. They wrote about Caroline's New York, Sweden, love triangle and European adventures. They were also high on Adderall. So they got high on Adderall and wrote a book. Do you think that would be a good book?

[Jameela Jamil]

No. Maybe. I don't know. I've had friends who've left with a double first from university. On Adderall.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yeah, I mean, like, that was a big college drive.

[Jameela Jamil]

It really depends on how talented Natalie is, because it just makes you. It's the same talent at speed, Right?

[Lacey Mosley]

Exactly. And then you're probably excited.

[Jameela Jamil]

She writes this book for her.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yes. So. And Caroline also got this Adderall from a doctor that she paid cash for in Washington Square park, just to note. So around hour 35, Caroline officially asked Natalie to come on as a paid editor. Editor. And she asked what a fair percentage. Natalie suggested 35% of the fee. Or, you know, I guess, like the advance. So Caroline agreed to this. Natalie's involvement is uncredited still to this day, so she never credited her. Duh. I mean, y'all made a deal on Aderall in the living room at probably, like, 2:00am she was like, hey, girl. Okay, so it's really fun. We're really writing this book. It's really good. Okay, girl. I think you should actually come on and be an editor, girl. Yeah, no, I think that'd be a great idea, girl. How much money you want? I don't know, 25%, 35%? Is that a lot? Is that half? That's not half. All right. Ah, come on. Like, what kind of deal is this, y'all? This is a crackhead deal. Don't sign crackhead deals. So the book publisher agreed to pay Caroline $375,000 in advance.

[Jameela Jamil]

Damn.

[Lacey Mosley]

For this book. So when Caroline went back to Cambridge, she told her friends that she was having a tough time and wasn't sure if she was going to be able to finish the book at all. So Natalie comes in and tries to help her and finishes, like, two thirds of the book, but Caroline don't like the book. Book anyway. Caroline does not finish this book, which is not Shocking at all. And so she goes to Instagram and tries to make a statement out of this, saying that she didn't want to make a book that was all about men and sexual exploitations. And that as a feminist, she. She didn't stand by the publishers of this book.

[Jameela Jamil]

Oh, my God, What a bullshitting nightmare, right?

[Lacey Mosley]

So she basically turned her skating away and not making this book into feminism. You gotta love it. So her publisher asked her to return over $100,000. I don't know if Caroline had it. She seems like she got an Adderall problem. She really likes furniture, I guess. So after this falls apart, I guess she has to pay the publisher back, like, $100,000. She decides to come up with something called the Creativity Workshop. Do we think this is going to be a legitimate workshop?

[Jameela Jamil]

Not judging by everything else she's done. This absolute bullshitter. Oh, God.

[Lacey Mosley]

So Caroline temporarily gave up on the book. Okay, we know that. And focused on a new project, a creativity workshop.

[Jameela Jamil]

I met someone the other day who told me that they were a creative catalyst as their job.

[Lacey Mosley]

Sad.

[Jameela Jamil]

That's just a fucking social worker. Not social worker, that. You're a social climber. You're just a fucking social climber. That's all that that is is.

[Lacey Mosley]

Now. Can that be a profession? Anything can be money.

[Jameela Jamil]

Anything can. In Los Angeles, anything can be a profession, a creative fucking catalyst. That's just someone who introduces other famous people to other famous people.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yo, but that's a. Like, the branding is strong there. Were they good at creative catalysts?

[Jameela Jamil]

I don't fucking know. But this is just madness.

[Lacey Mosley]

Did you have explosion with.

[Jameela Jamil]

I mean, I was a fake teacher, wasn't I? So.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yeah, but that's.

[Jameela Jamil]

That's better. Even getting the part on the Good Place, like, they were like, have you ever acted before? And I was like, but you have.

[Lacey Mosley]

You acted like a teacher?

[Jameela Jamil]

Well, yes. I'd also done some theatre in England when I was six, at my school. So I didn't tell them the details of that. I just said I'd been on stage in England, technically. True. When Mike Scher asked me, he was like, can you improv? I was like, mm.

[Lacey Mosley]

See what I just made me?

[Jameela Jamil]

Yep, yep. I'd improv right there. I began my improv career with him in that moment.

[Lacey Mosley]

You said yes and no.

[Jameela Jamil]

So I can't really judge this woman. But, oh, my God, she also takes ages to do a scam. So where are we at now with these creators Creative workshops?

[Lacey Mosley]

So she got Instagram followers, but, yeah, no, she didn't finish that book. Now she's doing the creative workshops. Yeah. She says that the girls are supposed to come over, eat homemade salads together on the floor of a venue and learn the secret to flower crowns and have inspiring creative camaraderie. I wanna know this.

[Jameela Jamil]

There's no attack on white people. But is this a white person?

[Lacey Mosley]

You know, this is a white woman.

[Jameela Jamil]

Okay, fine.

[Lacey Mosley]

This is dripping in caucasity.

[Jameela Jamil]

Yeah, this is.

[Lacey Mosley]

This is a black woman. Any woman of color would have never gotten this far. Are you kidding me? I wish we could.

[Jameela Jamil]

Flower crown.

[Lacey Mosley]

The secret to flower crown. Do you notice it?

[Jameela Jamil]

Someone would have shoved a flower crown up my asshole if I tried to do this. Okay, keep going.

[Lacey Mosley]

I would have been taken to jail immediately.

[Jameela Jamil]

Yeah. Flower crown. Okay, so flower crown.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yes. So the secret to flower crowns, which we will find out in a moment. So she's charging. How much do you think she's charging for this workshop?

[Jameela Jamil]

Oh, God. $15, 165. Jesus Christ. Oh, my God, this is so stressful. I'm sweating.

[Lacey Mosley]

So she hadn't booked any venues or planned any logistics for how to provide the food, but she's already advertised this on her gram honey because she's visualized she's a manifester. Okay? So she promised homemade care packages for each attendee that would include a Mason jar. Come on, now. If you're living your best Instagram life and you ain't got no mason jars, like, what are you doing?

[Jameela Jamil]

Who even are you? What kind of animal you are?

[Lacey Mosley]

Nasty bitch. Get a Mason jar with a packet of wildflower seeds, a notebook, and a personal letter in response to an email that attendees could opt to send her. So she ordered 1200 mason jars. And Jordan, can we get a photo? So Caroline took a photo of the 1200 mason jars she ordered because she didn't understand how much 1200 Mason jars was. So the photo on the right there that says, no, I've made a terrible error. Is a huge crate plate of mason jars.

[Jameela Jamil]

Oh, my God.

[Lacey Mosley]

That she said she was gonna put salads in. And this is like a huge. Like, I'm trying to think of what, sis? Okay, first of all, Caroline, I don't know what, you thought 1200 Mason jars was gonna come in a tampon box, sis. Like, that's a lot of jars. Like, this is, like, I'm trying to give y'all. It's, like, the size of, like, a love seat, but, like, a box, like, several boxes also says you could have saved the money that you spent on these Mason jars. And Just catered the food like, I've just gotten somewhere.

[Jameela Jamil]

Write your fucking book, okay? Go on.

[Lacey Mosley]

So days before the first event in New York City, she told fans that she couldn't write the personal letters as promised because she got too many letters. So instead. Instead, she offered to make time to talk to each attendee at the event and take pictures in a photo booth together. And she offered to respond to each email with an emoji that let you know she read it.

[Jameela Jamil]

Oh, my God.

[Lacey Mosley]

Imagine you're sending a letter to Caroline, and you're like, hey, Caroline, I've been so inspired by your Instagram recently. My mother was hit by a bus, and we've been underground and lots of medical bills. And, you know, you inspire me every day. And then the response is, like, smiley with my tongue out. Yeah, it's an eggplant. She sends you back a peach, you're like, I don't know what to make of this.

[Jameela Jamil]

Who buys into this stuff?

[Lacey Mosley]

The girls? The 53% are lovely white women out there who. This is a safe space to probably talk about how they voted for Trump. Over, over, over. Oat milk and flour crowns.

[Jameela Jamil]

Jesus Christ. Okay. Also, don't. Hey, hey, hey. Oat milk is wonderful.

[Lacey Mosley]

See, Caroline might have got you.

[Jameela Jamil]

Yep. She found her way in a flower crown there. Okay, go on.

[Lacey Mosley]

So instead of giving everyone a flower crown as a favor, now, remember, she built the whole workshop on what did she give them?

[Jameela Jamil]

A used tampon. Like, where are we at now?

[Lacey Mosley]

So she clipped a few flowers into their hair, and they posed for a photo. Then she would snatch them out and put them on the next guest.

[Jameela Jamil]

Oh, wow. Who's playing this woman in the movie of her stupid fucking life?

[Lacey Mosley]

Hopefully me.

[Jameela Jamil]

Okay.

[Lacey Mosley]

Which would make zero sense, but I want to be involved. No. So she. She would clip it in the hair and be like, all right, 1, 2, 3, smile. All right, bitch, give me that back. And then when they took the photos, she would whisper into each guest's ear, the secret to flower crown is there is no secret.

[Jameela Jamil]

Oh, my God. Oh, my God.

[Lacey Mosley]

You came in for the secret. And the secret is she used the fight club.

[Jameela Jamil]

Yeah. This is ridiculous.

[Lacey Mosley]

Also, like, she must just have energy. You know how some people just have vibes?

[Jameela Jamil]

Because I'm like, yo, she's a idiot, so it must be something. She must be really beautiful. Or she's like.

[Lacey Mosley]

She's like an average, average white woman. She's like, wait, so how did this happen?

[Jameela Jamil]

I don't understand how this has happened.

[Lacey Mosley]

Now this is what I do understand. About this scam. It's like, she's like, but these are stupid replacements.

[Jameela Jamil]

She's a fucking idiot. Look how much. Look how many jars she ordered.

[Lacey Mosley]

So I'm gonna get a picture of Caroline up for you, Julie, so you can see her. She's a cute girl. So she's like, to me, attainable. Because, you know, if you look at, like, Kylie Jenner on Instagram, you might be like, oh, you're out Lambo to match your everyday outfit. Like, that's not a life that I may be able to achieve. You know what I mean? Like, I'm not gonna be able to.

[Jameela Jamil]

Go get micro influence.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yeah. I'm not gonna be able to go get the ass that. That, you know, you got shot up in your booty. But this girl, I could be Caroline Calloway. And I feel like that's what women think, because look at her.

[Jameela Jamil]

Girl next.

[Lacey Mosley]

Girl next door.

[Jameela Jamil]

Yeah.

[Lacey Mosley]

So girl next door. But then living.

[Jameela Jamil]

She does have a butter wouldn't melt kind of face, doesn't she as well?

[Lacey Mosley]

Yeah. And it looks like, if this girl can live this fabulous life, then why can't I? So let me follow her and let me go to her workshop so I can also be like. Like, she's like the supreme of the basic bitches.

[Jameela Jamil]

I was gonna say the basic bitch boss. Yeah, the queen bee.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yeah, she is the queen. Basic. That's what it is. I get it. So Andrea park was an attendee, and she says she went half ironically bitch. You know, you went. Cause you wanted that flower crown and that secret and that oat milk. Don't lie.

[Jameela Jamil]

And no one's spending $160 for irony in their 20s.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yeah, no, that's expensive. You know, listen to Atlantis Morissette. That's free irony. Like, bitch, it's like, nobody going to do this. So she says she went and Calloway clipped the flower in her hair and whispered the secret thing. And then she said that the rest of the event was pretty okay. She said they didn't get everything that they paid for, but she was fine with it. And so the events got worse. The event in Washington, D.C. caroline had her mother, who lives nearby, make salads for everyone after she realized how unpleasant it was to saute vegetables for 50 people. But, girl.

[Jameela Jamil]

I hate this woman. If I ever see her, I'm gonna beat her ass.

[Lacey Mosley]

She was like, I was gonna cook. And then I started cooking, and I was like, oh, you gotta cook to cook. I thought I was just gonna manifest cooked vegetables. What? She also planned events in Boston And Philadelphia. But after booking an event space in Brooklyn, New York, which I'm guessing was probably very expensive.

[Jameela Jamil]

Very expensive.

[Lacey Mosley]

She posted a poll on Instagram asking if BO Philly fans would be okay with coming to the Brooklyn space instead. Okay, so she was like, hey, y'all, I know you bought a ticket for Boston and also for Philly as well, but would y'all mind actually buying a bus ticket and coming to New York for your event?

[Jameela Jamil]

Jesus.

[Lacey Mosley]

And the crazy thing is, is that.

[Jameela Jamil]

This, that's what, 200?

[Lacey Mosley]

Hey, you had 165 for creativity. You probably got another 200 for the budget. Us also maybe someplace throw up.

[Jameela Jamil]

Gone.

[Lacey Mosley]

So the response to the poll had people saying, like, this is our space or yes, people were down for this scam. I love it. The New York event showed a room full of seemingly young white women. No shock there. And the first hour was coffee hour where Caroline was not present. No shock there either. In response to the online scrutiny, she started to refund some of the tickets. She said, I wanted to create an experience that would be my perfect weekend day with cozy acoustic music and a plant filled space. If I had known how hard it was, I never would have tried. How can you be mad at this woman?

[Jameela Jamil]

I'm so mad at this woman. I've worked so hard my whole life. Yeah, I've lied, but I've turned up and fucking delivered. I didn't say I could act. And then, I mean, was I great? I don't know. You were great. You know, I remembered my fucking lines, didn't I? I showed up every day.

[Lacey Mosley]

You were fantastic, Jamila. And that's the difference is like, everybody does a little scheming and scamming sometimes in life to get to the place that they want, especially in our industry, because there's no clear. It's not like we become doctors where we like go do residency and then we go, like, that's a lie to.

[Jameela Jamil]

Get in because, like, it's just not built for us.

[Lacey Mosley]

You gotta come in, you gotta put your pussy on the table and act like you don't want anything from anybody and lie. It's just a part of it. But this the difference is like, we, we still came afterwards and maybe we.

[Jameela Jamil]

Brought at least some of the guys.

[Lacey Mosley]

The talent and, you know, the things that they wanted anyway. Whereas Caroline was like, look, guys, I didn't know that when I said I was gonna do things, I actually had to do them. And that has been very stressful for me.

[Jameela Jamil]

Was she wealthy?

[Lacey Mosley]

No, she's like a middle class. Woman, But I love that.

[Jameela Jamil]

Does she have, like, some sort of dysphoria, you know, like Rachel Doziel, like, the sort of, like, dysphoria where she thinks. Thinks she's like Ivanka Trump. Do you know what I mean? Like, born into an amazing lineage, has no work ethic. Like, what was her life? I mean, how do you end up like that? What kind of fucking terrible parenting?

[Lacey Mosley]

Honestly, I want to say that this is when. Because if I was a white woman, I would be doing my fair share of scams off of just white womanhood. It's just there's so much out there to get.

[Jameela Jamil]

What would be your favorite white woman scam?

[Lacey Mosley]

So I would definitely be doing, like, the trip and fall damsel, you know, trying to get some trip and fall suits going wherever I could. I would definitely be doing, like, the. I don't know, scam where you just, like, skip everybody in line because you're like, what? There was a line. I don't know.

[Jameela Jamil]

My whiteness has blinded me.

[Lacey Mosley]

What? Which I do that one sometimes anyway. And I did it in Mexico and some very angry white people got mad at me, but I held my place. Okay, look, Trump is president. I skip everybody in line. So. But, you know, like, just lie tight. Little. Little white women. This whimsy scared.

[Jameela Jamil]

How long did this go on for?

[Lacey Mosley]

It sounds like, oh, honey, it's still going on.

[Jameela Jamil]

So this was like, she's still out.

[Lacey Mosley]

2015 when it started, honey. And I ain't even got to Caroline today because this.

[Jameela Jamil]

Oh, my God, please.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yeah, we're pretty much at the end of her. But I will say that I think that this comes from, like, white women and other white women aspiring to live these carefree lives. And she took advantage of that. And I think the thing I love about her most is, like, she's never pretending or blaming it on anybody else. She's just simply being like, I don't know. I didn't know when you did things, you had to work. What?

[Jameela Jamil]

So where is she? Not she not in jail.

[Lacey Mosley]

Oh, no, honey. She is out in these streets. And on these. You can follow her on Instagram. Caroline now posts prolific stories, dozens per day, with long blocks of text documenting her life in New York City. She posted a meme on Instagram December with the caption, for many years, the number one one reason I was still in my book deal is that I hadn't checked my email since 2015.

[Jameela Jamil]

Oh, wow. So she is kind of a creative genius, isn't she?

[Lacey Mosley]

Yes, she's brilliant. She said so. I never signed the cancellation contract. Now, my reason is that all the bad press has made my life story more valuable than ever. Life is weird.

[Jameela Jamil]

She has 719,000 followers and count hunting. And it's called. Her book is called Scammer.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yes. So now she's coming out with two books. One is called. And we were like. And the other one is titled Scammer. And the caption reads, the antidote to shame is exposure going on pre sale on my scamiversary this January.

[Jameela Jamil]

Oh, she is kind of brilliant.

[Lacey Mosley]

She's a Jamie.

[Jameela Jamil]

Yes.

[Lacey Mosley]

And honestly, like, just being, like, a kind of cute, whimsical white woman. Like, why not let that be your lifestyle?

[Jameela Jamil]

Oh, my God.

[Lacey Mosley]

Like, the Kardashians are just.

[Jameela Jamil]

What in the name of Kardashians?

[Lacey Mosley]

Kardashians. They get paid to be Kardashians. Why can't she get paid to be a basic whimsical white woman?

[Jameela Jamil]

Well, because she's a thief. They at least turn up with all the basic shit that they promised. You know what I mean? I mean, I mean, no. Then again, there was Kylie's lip kit.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yeah. And then they also do steal their stuff from people.

[Jameela Jamil]

That's true. I've only just started hearing about this. That young black designers, they. They rip off their designs, and then. Then they accuse other people of ripping off their designs.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yes.

[Jameela Jamil]

And it's, like, lawsuits against them. Right.

[Lacey Mosley]

Kardashians. It wasn't enough that y'all stole our faces and our asses and our hairstyles? Like, come on, now you got to steal. You got to actually steal the design from the little black girl, too. Like, damn. And they have, like, Chloe's, like, good American. There's tons of scandals of, like, where they've been in litigation, where smaller designers, like, they're taking it stitch by stitch. Like, Chloe would order it and be like, oh, that's cute, sis. Send me 12 of those to my house. And then she'd be like, y'all rip these apart and make them.

[Jameela Jamil]

Holy. I didn't know that.

[Lacey Mosley]

Ordering them directly from the designer obviously.

[Jameela Jamil]

Have the very public dispute with them over diet Detox teas, where they're just, like laxatives that don't make you lose weight. That in itself, like, that product is just insane.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yeah. Any fit tea, guys? It's. It's a tea. Okay.

[Jameela Jamil]

You'll just fire for three days, and then you won't again, and then you'll need more because you've got some more fire to do. And that's just it. And Then eventually your falls out of your body.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yeah, keep your booty holes, y'all. There's better.

[Jameela Jamil]

Don't give it to the Kardashians. Don't give your booty ho to the Kardashians.

[Lacey Mosley]

You know what? I will give my booty ho to the Kardashians. I actually sold my booty holder Kim K. Last week. You know, you don't need a booty hole to live that. That's a myth. It's a sc. No. Guys, shout out to Caroline Calloway. I don't think I dislike her.

[Jameela Jamil]

I dislike her. I just like her because her scams are boring and annoying. I think she's fucking uncreative and she.

[Lacey Mosley]

Might be a little boring.

[Jameela Jamil]

I mean, I don't even know if she's really gonna finish these two books. Even I think this is just another scam.

[Lacey Mosley]

She's gotta finish one of them.

[Jameela Jamil]

She's not gonna finish anything. How she didn't get sued by. By the first publisher, I have no idea.

[Lacey Mosley]

Because she's whimsical.

[Jameela Jamil]

She's going straight to the Bad Place. To hell. She goes.

[Lacey Mosley]

Oh, no, she going to the Bad Place now.

[Jameela Jamil]

Adios, Caroline.

[Lacey Mosley]

You heard it here first.

[Jameela Jamil]

Go and rot. She's following me.

[Lacey Mosley]

Oh, my God. She's following me on Instagram. I'm leaving. Meanwhile, you over here giving inspiration to Caroline.

[Jameela Jamil]

I've said terrible things on this podcast, but I stand by them. I don't like any of this, mate. I think you're. You know what, Caroline, if you're listening, because you follow me, I think you're a bad guy. I don't like what you did. I don't like what you did to Natalie. Although Natalie, you know, Natalie would give her booty hole to you.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yeah, Natalie gave her booty hole to Caroline a long time ago.

[Jameela Jamil]

What a bellend.

[Lacey Mosley]

Oh, God. Oh, wow. We've never had a rule.

[Jameela Jamil]

Doesn't seem that bad anymore.

[Lacey Mosley]

Ja. Rule was fun. Fun. You know, where would I be without you?

[Jameela Jamil]

Very fun for Fire Festival. At least you got sandwiches. That's more than Caroline.

[Lacey Mosley]

Sandwich was.

[Jameela Jamil]

No. Okay, fair enough.

[Lacey Mosley]

You know, at least, Caroline, you only got to go to Brooklyn. You don't got to go to the Bahamas and live in a FEMA tent.

[Jameela Jamil]

I definitely feel better about all of my scams.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yeah, no, your scams are.

[Jameela Jamil]

I delivered.

[Lacey Mosley]

They're not even scams. You were just opening doors for yourself. That's called creating opportunity. That's called opportunity.

[Jameela Jamil]

Oh, thank you. An opportunity catalyst. Is that what we're calling ourselves?

[Lacey Mosley]

Yes. Just like you had a social catalyst.

[Jameela Jamil]

You and me, we're gonna start dicktune.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yes.

[Jameela Jamil]

That's what's gonna happen. That's our scam. Let's do it together.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yes. Robbery.

[C]

Brought to you by Hularius Stand up comedy now on Hulu. Hey, everybody. Hulu has a bunch of new stand up specials that are not just funny, they're hilarious. Very funny. Hool. Anyway, they're launching new exclusive stand up specials from awesome comedians like Jim Gaffigan, Ilana glaser, Roy Wood Jr. Bill Burr and tons more. A new special drops every month and they've got a huge library of stand up specials to check out. Go to Hulu and get your stand up fix now.

[Lacey Mosley]

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[Jameela Jamil]

All right, guys.

[Lacey Mosley]

And we're back. And I'm here with Caroline Calloway's number one fan, Jamila.

[Jameela Jamil]

Jesus. It's so stressful that she follows me. What does that say about me? That says bad things about me.

[Lacey Mosley]

Jamila, Caroline's inspiration.

[Jameela Jamil]

Oh, fuck off. That's the rudest thing anyone's ever said to me.

[Lacey Mosley]

Y'all tweet at me and tell me if Jamila's careless inspiration. Jesus.

[Jameela Jamil]

Jesus Christ.

[Lacey Mosley]

I'm sorry.

[Jameela Jamil]

I'm weak.

[Lacey Mosley]

Oh, that made me weak.

[Jameela Jamil]

I wonder who else is following me. You know what? I just. I need to change my ways. I take the. I take the blame.

[Lacey Mosley]

Keep it up. Keep it up.

[Jameela Jamil]

I take the blame.

[Lacey Mosley]

So, guys, we're Back with our last segment, Scammer of the Week. It's always the saddest part, because after this, I have to let Jamila go. But, guys, Scammer, I've had a lovely time with you, man. Police arrest a palm reader for stealing over $70,000 from a client on December 17th. Somerset Police. And this is December 17th, 2019. Somerset Police launched into an investigation over a person named Racy Milanovic. Now, my name is Lacey. This person's name is Racy. Now, I feel like if your name is Racy, like, I would already be on high alert. Yeah, that's. That's a scammer name. She was 37, seasoned. I love it. Probably didn't do in the scam for a little bit after a resident reported that she was tricked into giving her large sums of money. Milanovich. Sorry, sis. Let me put some respect on your name. Milanovic operated Tracy's psychic palm reader. That's the name of the place. So her name is Racy. The psychic place she running is called Tracy's Psychic Palm Reader.

[Jameela Jamil]

Okay.

[Lacey Mosley]

You gotta have a alias if you're gonna be a good scammer. Oh, which Caroline, by the way? Her real name was Caroline Got Shaw, not Caroline Calloway. Just in case y'all want to Google her government. So she also had a scammer back to Tracy. So she's running this palm reader place out of Somerset, Massachusetts. I can't imagine that there's many palm reader places in Somerset, Massachusetts. I feel like you probably got the market share.

[Jameela Jamil]

You cornered the market.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yeah, yeah, because in la, I can literally walk down the street.

[Jameela Jamil]

You can't walk five minutes without seeing.

[Lacey Mosley]

And it's like $20 palm reed. And, like, have you ever gone into the psychic and got one done?

[Jameela Jamil]

Yeah, once. And then they do the whole thing of, like. Oh. Cause, you know, they prey on predominantly women who aren't happy with their love life or their family life or with the way that they look. And they're like, o. Oh, you see? You could be so happy. But the problem is there's a curse on you, and it would cost $1,000 to $12,000 to lift it. Now, I mean, I'm not even charging you for my time. This is just the stones I would have to buy. But, you know, if you don't lift this curse, then you're gonna die alone and look bad, and your family's all gonna die.

[Lacey Mosley]

Cobwebs will probably scam.

[Jameela Jamil]

It's a fucking lie. I walked straight out of there. But, Christ, it's so scary.

[Lacey Mosley]

So someone has propositioned you with the we gotta get this hex off your pussy.

[Jameela Jamil]

Yeah.

[Lacey Mosley]

Wow. Yeah, that's a. That's a good one. Because I feel like they look at your hand, like, oh, yeah, I'm looking at your lifeline. Okay. I'm seeing a lot of cobwebs. That is definitely on your vagina.

[Jameela Jamil]

I took my hexed pussy right out of there and made peace with her.

[Lacey Mosley]

Hey, you did it for free.

[Jameela Jamil]

Got a boyfriend. She was wrong.

[Lacey Mosley]

She was absolutely wrong. It's interesting that you say that, because that's pretty much what Tracy is doing over here.

[Jameela Jamil]

Oh, that's the scam. That's what everyone does. Go on. On.

[Lacey Mosley]

So Milanovic stole approximately $71,000 from the victim. And the reason that she did this was because she convinced the victim that her daughter was possessed by a demon and that cash and household items were needed in order to banish the spirit from her daughter.

[Jameela Jamil]

How did these people sleep at night? Okay, go on.

[Lacey Mosley]

So she said, hey, sis, we figured it out. Your daughter. There's a demon Beelzebub all up in your daughter. Okay, what I need is an Ikea rug. You know the one that's like, tesselated. I need that rug.

[Jameela Jamil]

Oh, my God. So she decorated her house lowest of key.

[Lacey Mosley]

Like she was. She was asking for.

[Jameela Jamil]

Oh, Caroline's not that bad.

[Lacey Mosley]

Like, literally. Towels, bedding. She said, if I'm going to get rid of this demon, I need a th.000 thread count.

[Jameela Jamil]

How the did she buy for $71,000? A sofa. Sofa, a bed, a new house.

[Lacey Mosley]

I feel like she must have got a deposit on her.

[Jameela Jamil]

She must have got a condo. The whole apartment. Yeah.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yeah. So she used this family to furnish and buy a condo. I love the audacity of, like, I'm gonna get money from you, and I can't just buy a condo. I also am gonna have you furnish it.

[Jameela Jamil]

See, I like this woman. Cause she's thorough.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yeah.

[Jameela Jamil]

Do you know what I mean? Caroline half assed it.

[Lacey Mosley]

She truly did. I'm like, where is she?

[Jameela Jamil]

Like, it wasn't just like, just. How dare she? What a waste of fucking time. She's a scammer again.

[Lacey Mosley]

I think you're right about that. Caroline doesn't even have ambition as a scam.

[Jameela Jamil]

She doesn't really have a plan. Like, she just. She doesn't even have work ethic in the scam. This woman knows what she fucking wants. She's going after it. She's abusing a mother's love for her child.

[Lacey Mosley]

Like she's doing it well.

[Jameela Jamil]

Sociopath all the way. Okay, so how did it end?

[Lacey Mosley]

She was like, the demon is almost out of your daughter. But you know, I am gonna need a dish rack. Yeah, like that's really gonna get the demon out.

[Jameela Jamil]

Yep. Some Cristal, some really expensive foods. I'm gonna need rack. A one year supply of whole foods.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yes. To furnish this. This is how we keep the demon away.

[Jameela Jamil]

A really good dildo. The good one? Yeah.

[Lacey Mosley]

You not the one with the batteries, honey.

[Jameela Jamil]

Yeah, the Bluetooth one.

[Lacey Mosley]

I need to be able to listen to Maxwell while I.

[Jameela Jamil]

Exactly. Yeah.

[Lacey Mosley]

I want sound. Surround sound under waterproof dildo. That's what's going to take. Otherwise your daughter, she got she out here. So she ends up getting property over $250 by trick and then larceny for $1,200. Intimidation of a witness. Which racy did you. Did you go try to shake them down after they reported you? It seems like she might have been like, the demon is coming back. She was like, if you take this to court, then the demon definitely going to take your daughter.

[Jameela Jamil]

Oh my God.

[Lacey Mosley]

So anyone who believes that they may have been victimized by Milanovic is asked to contact the somerse officer Donald Comeier guys. And that number is 508-679-2138. Yeah, you could call the cops on Racy or did you have a good time? Think about if you had a good time.

[Jameela Jamil]

No one had a good time. Nobody had a good time. Are you sure? I haven't had a good time listening about this woman. It's such a regular scam. But $71,000, that's a lot.

[Lacey Mosley]

So her daughter must have at least been bad. She must have been a bad kid.

[Jameela Jamil]

She probably just had too much sugar.

[Lacey Mosley]

Something was wrong with her daughter. Because what otherwise why would you believe this? Also like, you and your daughter need to go to therapy. If you think.

[Jameela Jamil]

Can you imagine how pissed you'd be with your daughter that she cost you $71,000 because of her bad behavior?

[Lacey Mosley]

I mean, but I feel like y'all didn't try no other methods. He was just like, nah, we we really working on this demon thing. I was like, no one was like a child behavior psychologist or, you know, exercise.

[Jameela Jamil]

This woman with me was like, your mother's gonna die if you don't give me this $12,000 or something like that. And I was like, no, no, she's not. And then the next day, my mother had like a heart issue and had to Go to hospital. And I was like. For a split second, I was a bit like, oh, no. Because I was like, 20. I was like, what if this is real? But I just was too cheap.

[Lacey Mosley]

You think she was over there throwing them chicken balls?

[Jameela Jamil]

I was like, she'll be fine. My mother will be fine. She was, yeah, yeah.

[Lacey Mosley]

But also, like, this is sad, but, like, all of us have mortality. Like, what do you mean? Like, somebody's gonna die. Everybody's gonna die.

[Jameela Jamil]

I know.

[Lacey Mosley]

Oh, I didn't know psychics were doing this. I thought they were just selling you crystals and putting yonis in your. I didn't know they was doing all this.

[Jameela Jamil]

No, they. And they use the scariest thing that could possibly happen to you to. To threaten you into it. It's really amazing.

[Lacey Mosley]

I thought that this. I thought more psychic work was just fun scams.

[Jameela Jamil]

No, this has gone dark.

[Lacey Mosley]

It has.

[Jameela Jamil]

This is. This is.

[Lacey Mosley]

This is not normally what happens.

[Jameela Jamil]

I feel sad.

[Lacey Mosley]

I don't know if I feel sad.

[Jameela Jamil]

I need a hug.

[Lacey Mosley]

I'll give you a hug. But I don't know if I quite feel sad. But I do feel like, guys, if you're going to see a psychic, which I'm not going to tell you not to, because I personally love being scammed sometimes. I called the psychic, the psychic high line the other day. California psychics.

[Jameela Jamil]

Yeah.

[Lacey Mosley]

Because I just wanted to have a good time. And they. I just wanted to see if they could tell me anything that I felt like was interesting by me giving as little information as possible. So she was like, oh, what's your life like? I was like, it's good. She was like, okay, how's home? And I was like, it's a home. Like, I literally was trying to give her the least amount of information to see if, like, anything, because I don't know. I don't know if I believe in this stuff. I believe in whatever makes you feel good. You know what I mean? If you got to put a crystal in your booty hole every day to feel good, do it.

[Jameela Jamil]

Should I say something embarrassing?

[Lacey Mosley]

Yeah.

[Jameela Jamil]

I was very sick with pneumonia for like a year pretty much when I was about 26. And I was also having a complete nervous breakdown. And so I was given codeine all the time, which in England is much easier to get hold of.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yeah, Cough syrup.

[Jameela Jamil]

Cough syrup.

[Lacey Mosley]

Wrapper juice.

[Jameela Jamil]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Lean.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yes, lean as.

[Jameela Jamil]

So the children cough. Yeah, exactly. So I. So I would take it and I would. It would completely change my personality. I would completely black out. I would be awake, but I would Never remember it in the morning. So at the end of this year, I got this phone bill for, like, $17,000. I was like, how the fuck do I have a phone bill? So I called up the company and I was like, you have been scamming me. This is an outrage. No one has a $17,000.

[Lacey Mosley]

Are you calling God, yeah.

[Jameela Jamil]

And then they told me I've been calling these X directory numbers. So I'd been calling, like, hookers and psychics in the middle of the night just because I wanted to chat. And I knew that they would talk to me because. Because it was, you know, by the minute. So they would just listen to me ramble on about my fucking life. And I just. I was just lonely in the middle of the night. Codeine makes me really chatty. And I spent $17,000 on sex workers and psychics. $17,000 worth of $17,000 on. I think it was predominantly, probably psychics, but there are people, There are sex workers and psychics out there who have really intimate knowledge of my life that I don't remember telling them. Them. Isn't that embarrassing?

[Lacey Mosley]

Don't come out.

[Jameela Jamil]

17,000. I was in so much debt at the end of that.

[Lacey Mosley]

Honestly, that is less embarrassing.

[Jameela Jamil]

I scammed my self.

[Lacey Mosley]

It's more awestruck. Like, I'm like, wow, what a way to spend money.

[Jameela Jamil]

No, I've never touched codeine ever again now. Still paying off that bill.

[Lacey Mosley]

It's good to know that. Damn. Now I'm thinking about all the time I spent on the phone with my friends for free. I need to get into the phone business.

[Jameela Jamil]

Oh, you do?

[Lacey Mosley]

I'm gonna start taking a credit card. When my friends call me.

[Jameela Jamil]

Do it. You'll make so much. You make $17,000 in a year.

[Lacey Mosley]

So it was like, over the course of a full year. Yeah, okay, that's. That's still not reasonable. I'm like. I would have maybe, like.

[Jameela Jamil]

My phone bill now is $60 a month. Like, that's. It's insane. Yeah.

[Lacey Mosley]

That's like a lifetime of phone bill jam.

[Jameela Jamil]

I scammed myself.

[Lacey Mosley]

Listen, I'm proud of you. And shout out. Shout out to those workers who know everything about Jamila Mila now. Christ, make them sign an NDA. You gotta call all the hotlines.

[Jameela Jamil]

Too late. Everyone can blackmail me. They record those things as well?

[Lacey Mosley]

No, they record them.

[Jameela Jamil]

Well, then.

[Lacey Mosley]

I did not know that, y'all.

[Jameela Jamil]

Someone has a video of me being like. And so, yeah, I feel. I. I don't know.

[Lacey Mosley]

It's probably all like that. They're probably we can't do anything with this.

[Jameela Jamil]

It. Damn it is what it is.

[Lacey Mosley]

Y'all stop confessing y'all murders to Ms. Cleo because they recording that shit. Yeah, that's. That's the scam of the week right there. Don't confess y murders no more on these highlights because they are recording. Guys, that has been an episode of Scam Goddess. As always, you can email your scams into us if they're retired, please. If they're not retired, I don't want to fuck up your bag. Scamgoddesspod. Gmail.com also can find us at Scam Goddess Pod on the Instagrams and the Twitter. And as always, you can find me at D I V A L A C I Diva Lacey on all platforms. And Jamila, where would you like to be found? That's what I ask people.

[Jameela Jamil]

Well, I have a podcast. It's called the I Wave podcast with Jamila Jamil. It's on this very network. Yes, it will your sister. And it's a podcast about my I Weigh movement. It's about mental health. It's about shame. It's funny, it's stupid, it's sad. It's me.

[Lacey Mosley]

Oh, I love it. Yes, yes, yes. So listen to that, guys. And then anywhere else you'd like to.

[Jameela Jamil]

Be found, you can find me on on Instagram. Caroline Calloway is following me, so I must be pretty good. It's Amiliachamil official and I'm on Twitter. I'm very rowdy, I'm annoying, I get shit wrong. I'm make mistakes, but I always say sorry.

[Lacey Mosley]

Yes, listen, we all do. I love it. All right, guys, stay scheming. With the Venmo debit card, you can turn the spa day that your friends paid you back for into concert tickets that you can earn up to 5% cash back on where a spa day with the girls becomes concert tickets. Visit Fed Venmo Me Debit to learn more. The Venmo MasterCard is issued by the Bancorp Bank N.A. pursuant to license by MasterCard International, Inc. Term Supply. Dosh Cashback. Term Supply.

[C]

Brought to you by Hoolarious Stand Up Comedy. Now on Hulu. Hey, everybody. Hulu has a bunch of new stand up specials that are not just funny, they're hoolarious. Very funny, Hulu. Anyway, they're launching new exclusive stand up specials from awesome comedians like Jim Gaffer, Elana glaser, Roy Wood Jr. Bill Burr and tons more. A new special drops every month and they've got a huge library of stand up specials to check out. Go to Hulu and get your stand up fix now.