The E-Book Evil Twins w/ Mano Agapion & Oscar Montoya

Summary

Scam Goddess: The E-Book Evil Twins

Host: Laci Mosley
Guests: Mano Agapion & Oscar Montoya
Release Date: April 14, 2026

---

Episode Overview

This Scam Goddess episode dives into the world of e-book and audiobook publishing scams, focusing on the notorious Michelson twins (Christian and Rasmus), who built a multimillion-dollar grift flooding Amazon with low-quality, AI-generated books — and then teaching others how to do the same. Laci Mosley is joined by comedians Mano Agapion and Oscar Montoya for a raucous, in-depth breakdown of the Kindle hustlers, the shadowy “AI publishing” industry, and the sometimes hilarious, sometimes shameful culture of internet scamming.

Throughout, the hosts swap personal stories of getting scammed (and sometimes scamming), critique the logic of these “get rich online” schemes, and roast the questionable characters running these rackets — all while keeping true to the show’s signature tone: irreverent, sharp, yet always empathetic.

---

Key Discussion Points & Segments

1. Scam Stories & Culture Check-In

[03:41 – 13:00]

• Scams Everywhere: Laci asks guests to reflect on their current relationship to scams, noting they seem “bigger and more innovative” than ever.
• Shoplifting Confessions: Oscar admits to recently getting caught stealing vitamins from Target and describes the surreal, almost sitcom-like experience of being busted by store security — in front of a former improv student.
  • Memorable Quote (Oscar, 06:44): “She made me sign all this paperwork, and then they took pictures of me… And then she was like, ‘for private prison…’ They might! And then they said they were like, ‘you're banned from Target all targets for a year.’ And I was like. I chuckled because I was like, ‘a year.’”
• Scamming the System: Laci and Mano riff on the “class” aspects of self-checkout and “boop to steal” methods.
• Phone Nostalgia: Tangential riff on pre-smartphone mobile culture and gay cruising spots, before segueing back to scams.

2. “Seattle Scam” – The Smelly Rave

[13:03 – 19:23]

• Mono’s Scammy Adventure: Mano details a recent experience in Seattle: he accepted an invite to an underground gay rave (“Jiz Nasium”) and was “scammed” by cultural expectations around unwashed bodies (“musk”).
  • Memorable Quote (Mano, 16:46): “[There’s] like a moment happening in the queer community where some people are really into musk… And I’m not saying one or two days post-shower. I’m saying a week or more. No shower… I felt scammed.”
• Queer Community Trends: Laci, Oscar, and Mano hash out their feelings about new “musk” subcultures and how personal hygiene can itself become a kind of scam or imposed norm.

3. Second Rave Scam: "Grunger" the Pup Mask

[22:42 – 25:46]

• Unexpected “Pup Play”: Mano describes meeting a kind, seemingly “normal” man at the rave, who suddenly puts on a “pup mask” and declares, “Now I’m Grunger.”
  • Memorable Quote (Mano, 24:00): “It’s a pup mask. And he says to me, ‘now I’m Grunger.’ And that’s when I said, okay, I have to go to Taco Bell...”
• Boundaries in Queer Spaces: Mano riffs on the increasingly visible “pup” subculture, joking that “maybe there should be a moratorium on pup masks… until we have more rights.”

4. Main Scam Deep Dive: The E-Book Evil Twins

[25:57 – 71:17]

Introduction to the Scam

[25:57 – 29:52]

• Rise of Scam E-books: Laci introduces the epidemic of junk ebooks on Amazon, often AI-generated, and the Michelson twins who “literally wrote the book on publishing scams.”
• Absurd Book Titles: Discussion of nonsensical, keyword-heavy titles (“If You Love Me” with a seagull on the cover), and riffing on who these books could possibly be for.
  • Memorable Quote (Laci, 29:13): “It’s a picture of a dove looking at me… or maybe it’s a seagull. Sorry.”

How the Scam Works

[33:07 – 45:22]

• History of the Scheme: Pre-AI, self-published “white hat” and “black hat” publishing tricks were common. Then, Luca “Big Luca” De Stephani creates a book crime ring through a secret Facebook group for fake reviews and sales.
• The Michelson Twins Enter: Christian Michelson enrolls, exploits the method, brings brother Rasmus aboard, and they start pumping out hundreds of barely-coherent “how-to” guides on trending keywords, later hiring ghostwriters and translators to scale up production.
• The Thailand Connection: The twins relocate to Thailand for cheap living while exploiting lax international tax rules.

The Grift Evolves

[47:14 – 58:03]

• Platform & Pitch: After being banned from Amazon, twins launch YouTube courses promising “publishing riches” to anyone, feeding on pandemic-era “make money from home” desperation.
  • Memorable Quote (Laci, 48:13): “They sold it at a 50% discount for $500 the day it launched… No, they made $48,000 overnight.”
• Pay-to-Play: Students are lured in with promises of passive income if they purchase add-ons: ghostwriting, keyword software, review networks, cover art, and of course the “premium” $7800 course.
• Cycle of Scamming: The core of the scam is recursive: sell the scam to other scammers, profit off their efforts, and upsell indefinitely.

AI & Marketplace Flood

[54:32 – 59:57]

• Exponential Growth: Michelsons’ business model perfected flooding the market with AI-written, low effort garbage. Revenue soars from $300k (2019) to almost $50 million (2022), partly thanks to COVID and the new “AI gold rush.”
• No Legal Recourse: The scam is “not illegal yet.” They provide a technically functional product, skirting the letter of the law (like MLMs).
  • Notable Quote (Laci, 59:37): "That’s how you get away with it. ...If I sell a friendship bracelet that cost $0.30 to make, but I sell it for $30,000? Isn’t that a scam? Yes, but technically, if somebody is willing to purchase that shitty-ass bracelet... it’s not."

5. The Aftermath – Where are They Now?

[61:32 – 65:23]

• Influencer Lifestyles: Christian and Rasmus project luxury lifestyles on social, despite their “scam” being well-known in publishing circles. They even buy “publishing.com” and control the narrative with SEO—if you google their scam, you get their own rebuttal page and funnel.

  • Memorable Quote (Laci, 65:04): “If you look up Michelson twin scam, it takes you right to publishing dot com. …They even make it look like they're reviewing themselves.”

• Big Luca’s Fate: Original scam teacher “Big Luca” tries to threaten legal action for “stealing his con,” then rebrands as “Big Luca International”—an even more audacious marketing grift.

  • Notable Quote (Laci, 67:20): “What makes you international? …He went to Mexico City one time.”

6. The Broader Problem: AI & Scam Culture

[67:35 – 70:41]

• AI Makes It Worse: AI-generated content has made these problems exponentially worse, poisoning marketplaces with garbage, and the hosts lament a world where “everything we love is getting destroyed.”
• Lack of Sympathy for Victims: Laci and guests note that while early-pandemic victims of the scam might earn some empathy, anyone falling for these grifts post-2023 is “choosing to get robbed” in the era of endless red flags.
  • Memorable Quote (Laci, 70:19): “If you want to pay $2,000 to let a long-neck Denmark man talk to you from the dark of his home, then you deserve to get robbed.”

---

Notable Quotes, Jokes & Moments

• On scammers’ shifting names:
  Oscar [50:49]: “Oh, there’s a new name every month. Oh, that’s totally normal and fine.”
• On ghostwriters:
  Laci [55:05]: “Their ghostwriters get hired on a freelance basis and they’re kept anonymous. So they’re not gonna go down with this. ...That don’t even look like a real lady. That looks like an AI lady to me.”
• On legal gray areas:
  Laci [59:09]: “It’s unethical, sure, but technically they’re giving a product. It’s the reason why MLMs can exist… because even though in their structure and design, they are a Ponzi scheme, because they technically do have a product…”

---

Takeaways & Final Thoughts

• The Michelson twins built a multi-layered scam empire: selling AI-generated junk on Amazon, then selling overpriced “get rich” courses to would-be scammers.
• They clean up online searches about their scam, funneling traffic right back into their pitch.
• AI has turbocharged this kind of grift, swamping platforms like Amazon with “garbage for profit.”
• The episode satirizes both the scammers and their victims, ultimately arguing that “buyer beware” has never been more relevant.
• Mano and Oscar also gently implicate themselves and the audience in small-time scamming, underscoring the blurred line between gaming the system and getting gamed.

---

Important Timestamps

• [03:41] – Shoplifting confession at Target
• [13:03] – Mano’s “musk scam” rave story
• [24:00] – “Grunger” the pup mask at the rave
• [26:33] – Introduction to the Michelson twins and “AI e-book scam”
• [33:07] – Scams before and after the AI boom; “Big Luca” origins
• [47:14] – Online course, YouTube, and monetization pivot
• [54:32] – Profit models and scaling to millions
• [59:09] – Why the scam skirts the law
• [65:04] – The twins’ SEO “scam rebuttal” funnel
• [67:35] – AI’s impact; social commentary
• [70:19] – “No pity” for late-stage scam victims

---

Final Plugs & Where to Find the Hosts

[71:39]

• Drag Her Podcast: Mano & Oscar’s own show about RuPaul’s Drag Race, available anywhere podcasts stream.
• Bad Drag Race: Their live comedy drag show.
• Laci Mosley:
  • All socials: @divalaci
  • Book: “Scam Goddess” (now available)
  • Upcoming tour dates (April, Texas, NYC, San Francisco)
  • Scam Goddess TikTok: Show clips and scam content

As always:

“Stay schemin’!”

Transcript

[A]

This episode is brought to you by 20th Century Studios. The Devil Wears Prada 2 only in theaters May 1st. 20 years after the generation defining classic, Meryl Streep, Anne Hathaway, Emily Blunt, and Stanley Tucci return to the heeled streets of New York and the halls of Runway magazine in its next chapter. The industry has changed. Scandal dominates, and power always comes at a price. Don't miss the Devil Wears Prada too. Only in theaters May 1st. Get tickets now. What would you do if your online store converted 36% more shoppers? You could take 36% more vacation.

[B]

Another pina colada?

[A]

Yes, please. Open a new retail location with 36% more square feet.

[C]

Fantastic.

[A]

Hire 36% more help.

[B]

You're hired and you're hired.

[A]

Shopify has the world's best converting checkout up to 36% better than other e commerce platforms. What you do with those extra sales is up to you. Switch to Shopify [e-mail] setup and get a $1 trial. Shopify.com set scams C. Robbery and frauds. Scam. CA robbery and fraud. Scam Goddess. What is poppin? Congregation, It's YA girl, Lacey Mosley, AKA Scam Goddess, Back with a comedy podcast all about robbery, fraud, and those who practice it. Sometimes we love them, sometimes we hate them. We will see along the way all of. And today we have not one, but two of the besties of the show on the show. You've seen them and you've certainly heard them. One is a TV writer, comedian, and actor. The other is as well, the same. Okay, come on. Besties. Except for the twist of also being a hip hop dancer. Yes. Together they host the hilarious and fun podcast Drag Her, a podcast that breaks down episodes of RuPaul's Drag Race as our drag Race. Her historians. And they really do know their shit. It's crazy. You've seen their work on the Chicken Sisters. Pretty Smart Minx Dimension 20, Wizards, Beyond Waverly Place, and so much more. Congregation, please welcome back Mono. And I'm about to fuck up your last name and I don't know why.

[B]

I don't care. Just do mono. No, no, I don't care. Just go for it. Yeah, that's correct.

[A]

You said it correct. I got insecure.

[B]

There's too many vowels in it.

[A]

And it even is phonetically here, and I didn't trust it.

[B]

No, there's too many vowels in it.

[C]

And that's how you say it.

[B]

That was a great intro. Thank you.

[A]

That would have been.

[C]

Yeah, I want to clip that intro and Then use it for everything. Everything that we host. My morning, literally.

[A]

I love a good intro. Cause I feel like it's like, we get to hear our own eulogies, and that's really cute.

[B]

And we should be present at them.

[A]

We should.

[B]

I'm gonna do a funeral party one pretty soon, honestly.

[A]

Yeah. Cause funeral for the living just doesn't seem fair. Like, I want to be there. I want to see y' all sad. I want to see.

[C]

I know, right? You sitting on a giant, like, throne, watching everyone just cry.

[A]

That might have to be. My next scam is just fake. My own death got to be real. I got to know how people really come in.

[C]

That's true. That's the ultimate scam. You faking your own death.

[B]

Who would come.

[A]

Who's trying to steal my. My ass, you know?

[B]

Like, who would come and be like, guess what? I'm glad she's gone.

[A]

And then, like. Like. And then you get to look at

[B]

them in the face and be like, guess what? I'm back.

[A]

No one would do that.

[C]

You fly down from the chandelier.

[B]

Surprise.

[A]

I might have to do it. Like, have a plant person there to do that, just so my entrance can be that more dramatic. What you say about me?

[B]

Yeah, that would be good.

[A]

Oh, well, you know, we always ask on this podcast, what is your relationship with scams? I haven't had you guys in a while, so, I mean, I feel like the scams have just gotten bigger and bigger, and people are getting more and more innovative. So. Yeah. What's your relationship now? Have you seen any run. Any. Any that you particularly admired or hated? Anything?

[B]

Well, we both just recently on our podcast on the Patreon. Sorry, the Patreon. We gave a lot of shoplifting tips to our listeners.

[C]

Well, yes.

[B]

Well, yes.

[C]

Well, yes. I got caught shoplifting.

[B]

I didn't know if she was an out or something.

[C]

Well, I'm gonna do. Hey, listen, I don't shop at Target. I steal from Target. Yes, I stole from Target.

[A]

Okay, but that's a place where you

[B]

should steal, and that's the place where everyone steals.

[C]

Listen, I'm not like, ground. It's not groundbreaking news, but, you know, they dangerous, though. Well, now, I didn't know that until

[A]

they got snipes like the Handmaid's tail under his eye.

[C]

Literally.

[A]

Look what the bullseye is.

[B]

Oh, my God. It's his eye.

[A]

It's his eye.

[C]

It's his eye.

[A]

The bullseye.

[C]

They was trying to tell him the snipe was ready for me, so I went in there And I was like, I was like, oh, I need some vitamins. I just recently moved and the only thing nearby was a target. And I was like, I'm gonna go in there, I'm just gonna steal some vitamins. Like, it's not a big deal, honestly.

[B]

Great. It's a great steal because it's expensive and small.

[C]

It's so expensive and it's super tiny. And I, and I brought a little bag. I'm like, it's going to be fine. I walk in there and I run into an old student of mine and we're like talking. That's the problem. I'm literally chatting away with him. And you know, blah, blah, blah, blah.

[B]

You know, because they also think teaching improv makes you rich. Like they're, of course.

[C]

They're like, oh, clearly they have money.

[B]

Teach at ucb.

[C]

Now that's a scam, baby. Now that's a scam. Um, and so, you know, I, I, I had the vitamins in my bag. I was like talking to my old student and I'm like, okay, all right, bye, I gotta go. And I walk out the door and this manager steps right in front of me.

[A]

Did the student see?

[C]

Oh, of course. Well, of course everyone saw it.

[B]

I didn't know that part of the story. Ow.

[C]

She was like, stop. And I said, what? And I knew immediately. I was like, fucking hell. And I was like, I'm sorry, what? And then I tried to leave. Being like all. And then.

[B]

Because you had your headphones on. Yes. And at first you were like, what?

[C]

Yeah, I was like, this can't be real.

[B]

No, thank you.

[C]

And then two cops show up, or security officers, whatever. And they're like, come with us. And I said, me, I get to see the back of the store.

[A]

I would be a little curious.

[C]

Like an 11 year old child that did a naughty thing. I said, okay, this is going to be fun. So I walk because I'm like, I stole, I stole like $40 worth of. It's not a big deal. So I walk, I'm like, I feel my student's eyes on me as I walk towards the back. And I was like, this is so embarrassing. I go to the back and then they're like, show us your bag. And I was like, what?

[B]

What do you mean?

[C]

They're like, show us your bag. Show us your bag. And then one of the security guards just grabs my bag and opens it up. And I was like, I don't think that's a lot. And he takes the vitamins. And I was like, oh, my Gosh, did I put the. I'm sorry. I'll pay for them. It's okay. Don't worry. And they were like, it's too late. And I could tell the manager was feeling a little zesty with. Really was like, I'm still in the store. She was having a blast with me.

[A]

Accidentally put something. I know that was not your intention, but it's like this. You haven't been there before. You haven't stolen from this place before. Usually Target likes to build a case.

[C]

Well, actually, I have.

[A]

Okay, well, then they might have been building a case.

[B]

They were building a case.

[A]

They might have been building a case,

[C]

which I didn't know.

[B]

But apparent building a mystery.

[A]

Unless you get away with it for a little bit, you got to switch stores.

[B]

And that's the actual scam stores.

[C]

But no, there's like a. It's a whole database. It's a whole database. So listen, for all.

[B]

You hit 750, like, then, yeah, they're looking for misdemeanors.

[A]

They're looking for. Yeah.

[C]

And so they were like, oh, yeah, blah, blah, blah. You stole these vitamins. And then she got really, like, what are you going to do with these vitamins? Were you selling them? Were you trying to sell them? Were you selling them illegally? You were going to sell them illegally?

[B]

What?

[A]

And I was like, vitamins on their.

[C]

What are you talking.

[A]

Is that how. That's how bad American healthcare is that? I kind of understand what she's saying. Literally, I got them one a day. I got them one day.

[B]

How much do you think B12 is worth on the streets?

[C]

Right? That is a black market vitamin vitality.

[A]

Or at all?

[C]

Seriously.

[A]

Okay, dollar a bean vitality.

[C]

So she. Yeah, they were grilling me. I was like, I didn't know this was happening. Like, I didn't know I could make a. I said, maybe, actually, but I was like, no, no, no. And then she's like. She made me sign all this paperwork, and then they took pictures of me. They took six pictures of me from all angles. And I said, oh, gosh. And then she was like, for private

[A]

prison, they got people locked up back then.

[C]

They might. And then they said they were like, you're banned from Target all targets for a year. And I was like. I chuckled because I was like, a year. And my whole attitude was like, this is so silly. I was like, okay, fine, whatever that is, for the price. I did this deep. But she was not happy with that. She wanted me stressed. She wanted me sh. Shaking. She wanted me pleading. She's like, you know, I could arrest you right now if I wanted to. And I was like, no, you can't. And she's like, yes, I can.

[A]

She was citizen school.

[C]

She was so mad that I wasn't like, pleading for my life. I was like, okay, girl, whatever. And then she just let me go and I walked out. And I was like, lord, not me.

[B]

Being a cunty little thief is really funny.

[A]

I do think that's amazing.

[C]

But it wasn't even being cunty. I was just like, okay, you caught me, girl.

[A]

Bye.

[C]

Can I go now? I want to go.

[B]

Do you know the country I'm living in?

[A]

You want me to be in physical distress about this?

[C]

Literally.

[B]

Also, like, come back in a year is so funny. Of like, okay, so we're still doing capitalism. It's like, we want your money.

[C]

Yes, exactly.

[B]

In 365 days, you did a bad thing. Yeah.

[C]

Time out for a year. But then come back to that.

[B]

Give us all your stupid money.

[C]

Come back with money.

[B]

Yeah, hate that. And I was saying Target's great and easy to steal from because when you go to the self checkout, you can, like, you, like, boop your card. And then after you boop your card, it's like, oh, do you want to do check or cash or do you want a bag? Like, they make you do these other steps after you've already booped your card. So I tell everyone, if you're going to steal from Target, go boop your card and hit it. Because then the sale doesn't finish because you've done it.

[C]

It's worked on you before. Yeah.

[B]

And it's plausible deniability. You can be like, I booped my card. I heard the card go boop. I didn't know it didn't charge me. And it works.

[C]

The boopage of it all.

[B]

The boopage. And Target, if you're hearing this, fuck you.

[C]

Fuck you, Target. You fuck you, Target.

[B]

Are you sponsored by Target?

[A]

No. No, I am not. But it is kind of like a class thing too. Of like, if you're paying with cash and you don't got booping on your phone, then, like, you're like, left out of that. That's why I don't like places that are only card because I'm like, that's really classes. Because what if I only have cash? Like, what if I don't have the boop situation?

[B]

Yep.

[A]

You know, I can't boop a flip.

[B]

You want me to boop my.

[C]

But if you cash on my Nokia,

[A]

my Sidekick, I'm gonna just do the boop. Myself.

[C]

What did I have?

[A]

Keep walking.

[B]

What was my lg?

[C]

You being your own Foley artist?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

What was my LG called that had the chocolate? It was not a chocolate Sidekick. It wasn't the Sidekick.

[C]

How did it. Okay, so this is the phone.

[B]

So it was vertical on this.

[C]

Did it go like this?

[B]

And then when you opened it, there was a physical keyboard that went sideways.

[C]

It's not the Sidekick.

[B]

I don't think Sidekick. Cause that's Nokia.

[C]

Okay.

[B]

On the phone, it looked vertical.

[A]

Here.

[B]

Yeah, you're the phone. Okay.

[A]

Boop, boop, boop.

[B]

Oh, I got a call. Oh, no, not right now, Mom. I'll text you. Then you go. And the keyboard's here.

[C]

The keyboard's like this.

[A]

Okay. What kind of mobile situation is this? Hey, I never heard of this. I was in.

[B]

I was in college in the before time. I didn't. When I was in college, there were no iPhones. Oh. Oh, my God. Isn't that fucked?

[A]

Wow.

[C]

Oh, she's ancient.

[B]

I'm ancient. There was no Grinder.

[A]

Oh, my God.

[B]

Oh, wow. Isn't that crazy? I don't know how I got sick, but I found it.

[A]

I was like. Were you, like, Pokemon going in? Or like, you just gotta use a Master Ball? Y' all had to get on missed connections and be like, I saw you by the water fountain.

[B]

Had to go to the gay club, and you had to be using that fishing line. Like, you had to go for it.

[C]

Were you around in LA when Circus of Books was a thing? Because that was a cruisy spot.

[B]

I didn't do that.

[C]

Okay.

[B]

I. I wasn't.

[A]

Was it a library?

[B]

Circus of Books is like a video and, like, bookstore that's known to be a gay institution because it's like a cruising hotspot for yes all the way, going back to the 60s.

[A]

Wow.

[C]

But now it doesn't. It doesn't exist anymore. Yeah.

[B]

I don't know.

[C]

Maybe by the time I moved, there were no Circus of Books.

[A]

I feel like Grindr killed Circus of Books.

[C]

Yeah, Grindr killed a lot of things did.

[B]

Including romance.

[C]

It's dead.

[A]

Yeah, it's dead. But mono. What is your relationship with scam?

[B]

Okay, I just got scammed.

[C]

Oh, no.

[B]

This is. You'll see. This is a light scam. It's not a real scam. It's a light scam. I was in Seattle, which is so insane, I accidentally booked a part playing the gay. The gay in a Christmas rom com.

[A]

Okay, you accidentally booked.

[B]

I'm not even joking with you.

[A]

I did a Table reads passed somewhere, and we're like, you're gay.

[C]

Be in this movie.

[A]

You are gay, and you look Christmas. You look like a yuletide gay.

[B]

I did my friend's table read for her movie, and they were just like, I don't know. You are funny. You should do it, period.

[C]

That's called being talented.

[B]

Yes. Yeah, that's true. That's true. I accidentally killed it. But. So I went to Seattle to film this movie, and I was like, okay, cool. I'm in Seattle. I'm gonna go be adventurous and meet the gays. And I went to one insane gay night at the Eagle called Jiz Nasium.

[A]

Okay, we're getting to the point. You know what's happening, where you have

[B]

to take your clothes off. And you have.

[A]

I heard, like, Kit Katy.

[B]

Kit Katty.

[C]

What's that?

[A]

So Kit Kat clubs where, like, you go in and, like, there's, like, a lady, like, with her titties out, and she's like, get yours out.

[B]

Ooh.

[A]

I was like, how about that?

[C]

I'm just picturing a woman in front of the door with her titties out. Being. Now it's your turn. Now you do it.

[A]

I was like, okay, how about I give y' all my shirt? He was like, yeah, we'll take the shirt.

[C]

That's enough.

[A]

I was just. I didn't even see what was going on. I was in Berlin. I wanted to know what was going on. Bergheim was closed at night. Yeah, exactly. I went to Wink.

[B]

I was like.

[A]

So you were saying what was going on?

[C]

Wait, Lacey, were you mugged? Take it off.

[B]

Take it off.

[C]

You're like, okay, I'll give you my top. She's like, okay, great.

[A]

She first took my jacket, which made sense. Cause it was cold out. So I was like, oh, yeah, coat check. And then as I was trying to keep going, she was like, uh, that, too.

[B]

And I was like, wait, you want my purse?

[A]

Kinky.

[C]

And your credit card.

[A]

They take your car Cash on me. So I was just like. I tipped her a little extra and was like, hey, make sure don't nothing happened to my stuff. And she was like, I got you. I got you.

[B]

And I was like, that's really good. Thank you.

[A]

Thank you. Booby labor. But no. So you go, okay. So I go to.

[B]

Cause I've been saying yes to life. I'm like. I'm like, I wasn't really totally myself, you know? I mean, you know when you go to a city and you're like, I'm not really myself here. I'm gonna experiment and try some choices. So I go to Gyznasium, and I wear a towel, and I meet some new friends.

[C]

Wait, just a towel? Nothing underneath?

[B]

Nothing underneath.

[A]

Ooh. It was fun.

[B]

It was flirty. Ha ha ha. Cute. Cute. And I meet some very nice goofy friends. They're sweet, they're nice, they're intelligent, They're Seattle gays, right? They, like. They're cerebral, they're funny.

[A]

I was like, oh, you guys talking current events in the nude? Yeah, okay. Okay, great.

[B]

Seattle. That's Seattle.

[C]

That's just Seattle.

[B]

So whatever. I'm having a great time with them. And they're like, come to this rave tomorrow night.

[A]

And I'm like, hey, second location.

[B]

Okay. They're like, don't worry. We're gonna have, like, a pre party before. Come to the pre party before. Okay, I go to the pre party. Point is, these educated, sweet, fun, nice men that I met the night before I now realize are the stinkiest people I've ever met. And these men.

[C]

You're gonna get in trouble with Seattle.

[B]

I don't give a shit. Oh, these men smell like barnyard animals. Because there's, like, a moment happening in the queer community where some people are really into musk. Really into musk and body odor and letting it ride. And I'm not saying. I'm not saying one or two days post shower. I'm saying a week or more. No shower or no armpit rehab.

[A]

Why?

[B]

And I felt scammed.

[A]

I was just. The way they smelled normal when you met them.

[B]

I guess they were. All the clothes were off or maybe just nasium. Smelled so bad I didn't realize it.

[A]

Okay. Because I'm like, doesn't the body make the smell? Not the clothes or the clothes can make the smell. But if the body's smelling, then the body.

[C]

Well, the clothes is like a barrier for the smell. It, like, prevents a lot of smell.

[A]

Then it starts to absorb the smell, and it's also a smell.

[C]

Then you're drunk.

[B]

I don't know what happened, but the

[A]

next day, I could call it gymnasium. I don't know. I know what you used to say to this, Paul. We compare the people with their children.

[B]

Listen.

[A]

No, no, no. We're explicit. I just don't want to say it anymore.

[B]

Jim's beeps are funny, though, to be fair.

[A]

Jim smell bad, though. So maybe they were trying to be like, this is a place of funk.

[B]

I don't know.

[A]

I don't know.

[B]

But I felt scammed because I was like, oh, man. I Thought we were going to be friends. Now I can't stand. I can't stand the way you smell. I can't be making.

[A]

So you associate sophistication with Smith.

[B]

Uh huh. Oh, am I colonized?

[C]

That's your prejudice. That's your prejudice. Ass mind.

[A]

I'm the same way. I'm sorry.

[C]

Decolonize your brain.

[A]

No. Smell is deeply connected to memory. And if you smell bad, I will. There are some people that I really enjoy in the comedy community, people that I really like that are geniuses that I've worked with afterwards. I'm not gonna say cause they've been on this podcast. No, But I'll never forget going into a green room for a show and this person, and I know they were depressed, but this person smells so bad. So bad that I remember it. This was five years ago.

[B]

Depression coming out of the world and

[C]

it's a trace memory for you.

[A]

That's what I'm saying. I'm saying like I understand where you're coming from. Model. You were scammed. They were supposed to be your fun, sophisticated friends and then they hit your nose like that. And I just happened to them.

[B]

Queer community, if you're listening, I feel scammed by y' all who are like, we're doing this now because you're taking up too much space.

[C]

What the hell? I'm silencing voices now?

[A]

I said, who said that? Who said we doing this now?

[B]

Who said that?

[A]

And you definitely are taking up too much space because an odor does take up space. Now you're not just to yourself, you

[C]

all out here, the stink lines do take space.

[B]

Your choice is taking up. Is taking away my freedom to not smell you.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

What do you think about my stinky gays?

[C]

I thought, I don't care.

[B]

You don't care?

[C]

I mean, it's bad. Like if you smell bad, back off. But I'm not going to those spaces. Do you know what I mean?

[A]

I think they can have a safe stinky space. I just need to know. I just need to know.

[B]

Honestly, I was encroaching on their safe space.

[A]

Exactly. Think you scammed yourself, mama, I think you scammed yourself.

[C]

You wanted to get scammed. Some people want to get scammed.

[A]

You said you were being a different person in a different city and there you were.

[B]

There I was trying to be a stink boy and I'm not scammed.

[A]

This podcast is supported by Ring with ring. It's protected. Keep track of packages and see more at the front door with battery. Doorbell. Make sure your yard is safe. At night with their outdoor cam plus that delivers a wide field of view and enhanced video clarity with retinal 2K and upgrade to 4K cameras and doorbells featuring retinal vision that give you ultra clear footage and let you zoom in without losing important details. I love to order a package. I love the the, the feeling in my stomach when something new arrives in the mail. But we all know that it's scamming season four times a year. Yes. That's all year round. So having a ring protector doorbell keeps your packages safe because now the scammers do see the ring and they will let go of that thing and move on to the next house. Okay. And also what I love about it personally, sometimes I get a food delivery driver who's not followed the instructions. They don't knock, they don't ring the doorbell. But you know, it does always ring. Ring your door, your yard, your home. With ring it's protected shop cameras, doorbells and more right [e-mail] Spring is one of my favorite times of the year. It's when the weather has decided to stop scamming us. It's not too hot, it's not too cold. And it's the perfect time to wear all of your favorite pieces. Which is why I love quince. Quince has quality pieces that work all throughout every single season. They're versatile and y' all know the things that I'm obsessed with. I was in Paris and nobody side eyed me once because I looked amazing in my quints. And their spring pieces are lightweight, breathable and effortless. The kind of things you can throw on and instantly look put together in. Which is my favorite scam. Okay. Because I can always be a fashionista. Which is why I need quintessential quints for me. Refresh your spring wardrobe with quints. Go to quinte.com Goddess for free shipping and 365 day returns. Now available in Canada too. Go to quince.com Goddess for free shipping and 360 five day returns. Quince.com Goddess that was a collective side for all of us because I know we are all tired of spending hundreds on crazy high wireless bills. Bog and free. Heavy on those air quotes. I'm breaking my fingers. Free perks that end up costing you more in the long run. If that is how you feel, then a premium wireless plan from mint mobile for 15 bucks a month might be right for you. Now you can bring your own phone and phone number. Activate with ESIM in minutes and start saving immediately. No long term contracts, no Hassle. I will say, before I started using Mint Mobile, I was a little skeptical because wireless could have always been this simple. Like, why did they not want to tell us? Now that I know that it can be with a reliable network, coverage and service, there's no going back. If you like your money, Mint Mobile is for you. Shop [e-mail] goddess that's mintmobile.com goddess upfront payment of $45 for three month. Five gigabyte plan required equivalent to $15 per month. New customer offer for first three months only. Then full price plan options available, taxes. And see Mint Mobile for details.

[C]

C. I thought you were gonna talk about the pup story.

[B]

That, too.

[C]

Cause that's when you were truly scammed.

[B]

Here's another scam.

[A]

Oh, my goodness.

[B]

So I'm at this rave.

[C]

It's the same rave.

[A]

Same rave.

[B]

Okay, Goddamn, same rave. Whatever. And I'm like, I meet someone who does not smell, and they're funny and cool. I'm like, oh, you took a shower.

[A]

I've been chatting so much during a damn rave. They loud. That's actually true.

[B]

Also, the music here was, hell, climate

[A]

change is crazy right now. Yeah. Where do you been? Like, how do y' all have this conversation?

[B]

I'm not even kidding. This was the song playing during the rave for 20 minutes. The chemicals, the chemicals, the chemicals, the chemicals. And I was like, y' all are crazy. So I find one guy. I'm like, oh. Like, he's just like, a nice, good time, friendly, having a nice time, talking about love.

[C]

Finally.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

I was just like, finally, someone I can relate to.

[B]

Engaging. Also, a lot of people were on the drugs, the chemicals. I wasn't on the chemicals. And I was like, okay, this guy's, like, here right now. You know what I mean? So I was like, I can talk to him. We're having a nice time. And then in the middle of our nice conversation, I think he smells good. I think he's one of. He's one. He's one of us. Pulls out a mask from his back pocket.

[A]

Chemicals.

[B]

It's a pup mat. I don't know if you know what this is, Lacy. It's a pup mask. And he says to me, now I'm grunger. And that's when I said, okay, I have to go to Taco Bell.

[C]

I've been scammed.

[A]

I have been scammed. Now, that one. You were scammed. Because he presented. He presented. Like, he was just chilling, right? Y' all was talking over the chemicals. And it was, hey, y'. All. Was having a great time, and then now he's like. Like, no, you can't just whip that out.

[B]

I wanted to be like, no.

[C]

To be a totally different person too. Grunger.

[B]

Grunger. I was like, no, you're a nice white man named Tyler. You're not Grunger.

[A]

And also Grunger feels like you. Grunger. Why do you need to be Grunger? I don't know.

[C]

The name you chose for yourself a

[A]

pup mask and be like, this is something I like to do.

[C]

Yeah, exactly.

[A]

Why you got to be Grunger? What do you do in this alter ego? No, Grunger been killing people.

[C]

What do you do with this alter ego?

[A]

No, you have to get.

[B]

And here's my one. One more cancel opinion. I have gays. I think we gotta hold off on the pup.

[C]

You hate pups.

[B]

I think once we have more rights, you can bring out the pup masks. But right now we gotta get our rights. And you're pulling out the pup masks and you're scaring them. You're scaring the bad people who already don't want to give us stuff. You gotta put away the pup masks.

[A]

Okay. But they did it at the place with the chemicals. So, like, that was kind of, like, safe, right? It wasn't like they were at Target.

[B]

I'm the villain of the story.

[A]

I could see your points. I could see your points. You were definitely duped the second time around.

[B]

This is my fault, though.

[A]

I'm gonna give it to the jizz people. But. But the second round I'm gonna give to you. Yes. You didn't know that Grunger was coming.

[C]

Grunger didn't present himself until.

[A]

Thank you. So you were, like, saying, the man Grunger showed up to the scene.

[C]

That wasn't right.

[A]

That wasn't right.

[B]

Thank you. Thank you.

[A]

Well, let's move out of this messy ass session. It's my favorite part of the show. I don't know. Today this might be my favorite part of the show.

[B]

We derailed you.

[A]

Oh, no. Y' all really came in with the things. Y' all were ready. So I feel a little dragged. You know, drag her in the podcast. I'm like, so I'm gonna have the chemicals stuck in my head all day. But let's get to historic hoodwinks. This is where I will with Gail Mono and Oscar with a famous con caper group of criminals. Maybe we love them, maybe we hate them. Maybe they're silly as hell. We'll see. So Amazon is full of useless ebooks and audiobooks that were clearly generated by ChatGPT and have no reason to exist. Not my book. Y' all go pick up my book scam. Got it. It's very real.

[B]

Everywhere you find fine literature.

[A]

The reason they exist is because of the Michelson twins, who literally wrote the book on publishing scams.

[C]

Michelson twins. I've never heard of these.

[A]

And so ebooks and audiobooks. I've never heard of them either, but now we. Now we know about them. I hope they dress alike.

[B]

They're the kind of twins who talk in unison.

[A]

Love it. So, ebooks and audiobooks. There's a huge underground world dedicated to producing and distributing very cheap, very low quality ebooks on Amazon. From nonfiction to romance books. Like when the three attacks.

[B]

The three.

[C]

The three.

[A]

I don't know, but three is a scary number. I feel like if three. Like, if the two attack. I'm not. That's like.

[C]

That's fine. Three.

[A]

The four. I know there's some interpersonal fighting between y'. All.

[B]

You can turn them on each other. Yeah.

[A]

But the three feels very evil. And like, y' all been. Y' all are witches.

[B]

It's like the Powerpuff Girls. You don't want to fight all three of them?

[A]

No. They was beating Mojo Jojo ass. He would be down on the ground bleeding and shit. And they were like little girls.

[B]

He's already.

[A]

He's already dead, y'. All. So other books that like. Apricot, Barcode architecture, Girl.

[B]

What now?

[C]

That's not in English.

[A]

That's so many things that don't mean anything, but it does get the people going. Like, I'm alert. Apricot sounds fancy. Barcode architecture. Like, look at this. Wait. If you love me.

[B]

Whoa.

[A]

And it's a picture of a dove looking at me, but also, maybe it's

[C]

like, that's a seagull. Oh, Lacy. Sorry.

[B]

Oscar's a bird expert.

[A]

I know. I was up in the eighth year.

[B]

I'm just saying.

[A]

Excuse me.

[C]

Once wartime is over, Lacy's releasing a seagull to symbolize the war is over.

[A]

It's immediately pecking me to death. But, yeah. Wait, wait. You love me? That's the title of the book. And then it's a seagull looking at us, saying, you love me.

[B]

I hate birds.

[A]

I don't know if it's about birds. I don't know if it's about seagull rehabilitation of their image.

[B]

I think it's about a seagull who falls in love with a human, and the human falls in Love back.

[A]

And the author of this book is Guth.

[B]

No. No.

[A]

Nope.

[C]

It's unpronounceable.

[B]

Honestly, it seems like I would guess it was Quinty is my guess, but I'm not an expert on pronunciation.

[A]

Quintia, Quinty. Thee.

[B]

It seems like it might be. It might be a Vietnamese name maybe.

[A]

I don't want to make fun of nobody name. Obviously this is an AI name, but

[B]

it's an AI name name, so they're

[A]

not real books written by real authors. They're made up nonsense using trending keywords to try to get real readers to click on and buy a fake or really, really bad book by mistake. I don't know. Wait, if. Wait, you love me with a seagull is gonna get me. It's not real.

[C]

You aren't entranced by the COVID and the font of the letters?

[A]

No.

[B]

No. Do you think it's for people? Because, you know, sometimes people fall in love with objects. Have you heard of this? What people like? It's called objectum sexuality.

[A]

Yeah, like, people, like, fall in love with, like, a P or the Eiffel

[B]

Tower and then they go and, like, try to marry it. There's a documentary called, like, I love you, Eiffel Tower or I marry the Eiffel Tower. Statues, fences, bridges. I know. This is what I'm saying, guys. Put away the putt masks.

[C]

Put away human fence, nose bounds.

[A]

No.

[C]

Wow. Crazy.

[A]

I'm sorry. I ain't falling in love with no building. That's crazy. I know.

[C]

And you've seen the Eiffel Tower and you haven't fallen in love with it?

[B]

On it. Yeah, I was on Cover your ears. Building can't make you nut.

[C]

Cover your ears. Cover your ears.

[B]

Whoever's listening, building can't make you cover

[C]

your ears to immediately say. No time to cover any ears at all.

[A]

Not even time to turn down the radio. Skip nothing.

[C]

Cover yours. Building can't make you nut.

[A]

So so many of these books include misinformation or repackage basic facts from wiki, how some of them steal the names from well established, exist and pretend to be new releases from those writers. Y', all. I ain't made no Scam Goddess 2. Okay? If you see Scam Goddess 2 Electric Boogaloo, that ain't me. That ain't me. That's chat.

[B]

That is not a Berry Gordy property.

[A]

Okay? We ain't make that so. With generative AI, anyone can create cover images, outlines, and even the text of a really bad book with almost no time and effort and sell it for 99 cents. But even before AI, fake ebooks were a thriving scam. Will say like 99 cents for like a horrible garbage AI book. I might be curious a little bit, like, what y' all got going on. You said.

[C]

And I was like, but what? 99 cents is not that expensive. I want to see what kind of garbage this AI slop is.

[B]

Do the sentences. Sentence, right.

[C]

That's the thing. Are there. Are they just letters put together or are they actual sentences?

[A]

Because I love a good hate watch. I think I would love a good hate read.

[B]

Yeah, I don't want to encourage this, though.

[A]

We cannot encourage AI. It's literally killing people in Memphis. You can literally get all our water.

[B]

There's already bad books you can hate read. Like Jessica Simpsons autobiography.

[A]

Oh, you had that one locked in. Oh, my God. I cover our ears.

[C]

Jessica Simpson. I'm coming for that.

[B]

It's as if it was written by a toddler. It's like me got scared.

[C]

Oh, my God.

[B]

Me get married like it is.

[C]

Me made shoes.

[B]

And then I recommend the audiobook because she can barely read her own audiobook.

[A]

I love that I said it. Her shoes were good, okay?

[C]

Oh, they were good.

[A]

Yeah. Honestly, you wouldn't have got caught up in Target if you had on some Justice Simpsons. Cause I ran from the cops in her shoes, okay? Sturdy as fuck. Prima fits. I'm not playing. Okay, Jessica, if you still making them sponsor the show, give me them chunky ass shoes and you could wear a heel all night at the club. It was basically a pleaser, but it

[C]

was comfortable as hell.

[B]

I love a pleaser.

[A]

You know what I mean? Now the bitches want to have a high ass pitch with thin ass, little fashiony heel. I'm like, where can I go in these? I take a picture on the carpet or where whatever event I'm at, and

[C]

then I thought, I'm gonna take them off.

[A]

I get em to my public, I throw em in my purse, I put some flats on, bitch, Are you kidding me? No, no, no. I'm an adult. I'm not doing that. But Miles got a book locked and loaded for you guys if you don't want to spend money on AI.

[B]

Sorry, it's a fact.

[A]

So in the early 2010s, lots of people wrote real blogs about how to quickly and easily publish a nonsense book to Amazon's ebook platform. They distinguished between schemes that were white hat, where you technically followed Amazon's rules, and black hat, where you actually violated Amazon's term of service. But it still worked. I Don't like this. White hat, black hat.

[C]

It's not sounding good to me.

[B]

Microaggress.

[A]

And I know they used to say the white hat on scandal. And Olivia Pope was like, I wear the white hat.

[B]

I'm like, what does it mean? I've never heard that before.

[A]

It's like, you're supposed to be, like, good. Like, you're a symbol for good. So you can, like, wear the white hat in quotes. Yeah, it's propaganda. You could wear the white hat or the negro hat and do the bad thing.

[B]

We all know white hat is the worst hat that's ever been made. Right behind red hat.

[C]

You're gonna commit some crimes with a white hat.

[A]

That's that full face, white hat.

[B]

Do you know what I'm saying?

[C]

Saying that's what.

[B]

When I hear white hat. That's what I hear.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah. So this one more like a cowboyish type hat, but it's the same hat.

[B]

I don't like it.

[A]

But basically, you're massaging the rules versus completely just violating them. And one of the most infamous teachers was a man who went by Luca De Stephani or Big Luca. Now I. Big Luca.

[C]

Not actually I.

[A]

Big Book Luca. I don't know.

[B]

It's a shame. His name is hotter than his face. Oh, why did I just say that?

[A]

Why didn't you see this? The viewers will see this.

[B]

But why did I just.

[A]

That just came.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

You fly.

[C]

You are messy today, sis.

[A]

I am?

[C]

Yes.

[A]

So he claimed to hold the world record for making the most money using Kindle Publishing. Like, money. The most money using Kindle Publishing in one single day. What set Big Luca's method apart was that he gave his students access to a secret Facebook group where self publishers organized, and they would do, like, review stuff, swaps and buys. So Big Luca basically set up a book crime ring.

[C]

But he's a. Okay, so he's a teacher. I mean, a professor.

[A]

He's kind of like a cult.

[C]

Students call him Big Luca.

[A]

Yeah, he called himself Big Luca. And I think everybody else just had to join in.

[C]

That's a call.

[A]

He was like, you can't join a Facebook group unless you know the password, which is Big Luca. Y' all will call me this.

[B]

That's culty. That's okay.

[A]

And it's really. This is kind of smart because it's like, okay, we're all making these fake books, and in order to boost all of our books, because people do do this on Amazon, they'll do fake, fake reviews, or they'll mail you a fake Package that you didn't order. Like, there's all types of ways to make your sales go up and your reviews look more inflated, and then the website automatically puts you higher up in the algorithm. So if I were to look up romance book this shit. What was that? Single book might slide if it's got me. Wait, you love me.

[B]

You know, Wait, you love me.

[A]

It might pop up if people have reviewed it.

[B]

You love me. Also, this should have punctuation. I'm sorry, Grammar punishment police. It should be waiting.

[C]

Creativity. You decide what those words are.

[B]

Wait, love me. I hate it.

[C]

Wait, you love me. Wait, you love me.

[A]

Wait, you love me.

[C]

But it's written as love me.

[A]

Okay. Yeah.

[B]

Come on, UTA Hagen. I didn't. I forgot I was in the company of actors.

[A]

No, we need it now. We need to know because I need to know what it's about. So review swaps were the key, right, to making the self publishing scam actually profitable when it first began. The more 5 star reviews you have, just like I said, it's more likely the Amazon algorithm's gonna push it forward to the readers. If you're mostly publishing bad books, you're not gonna get a ton of five star reviews organically. But Big Lucas Facebook group gave people running the scam a place to offer swaps, right? And they were selling these five star reviews for 99 cents each.

[C]

I'm just looking at Big Lucas face and I'm like, this man is a homosexual. Oh, there's no way that.

[A]

This man is not how his house is decorated.

[C]

Look at his eyebrows for one. It's that. It's the. It's the. It's the mouth shape. It's the. It's the eyebrows.

[A]

It's the decor for me in the back. It's the decor. Like, you look at that. Yeah, he got a feather plant back there.

[C]

It's giving. Homosexual or like closeted? Like closeted.

[B]

That's why he went for Big Luca. He truly.

[C]

How do you go by Big Luca and not be gay?

[B]

Yeah, and close your ears. He has a glory hole set up for sure.

[A]

No. Oh, my gosh.

[B]

You can beat me as much as you want.

[A]

No, I mean, his name is not great. Glory hole set up.

[B]

He has one. Close yours, close yours, close yours.

[C]

The front door, baby.

[A]

Big Luca was first. Y' all need to be stopped. I forgot.

[B]

I forgot this pop. This is a popular huge podcast.

[C]

Yeah, Mano. We are guests.

[B]

We have a small audience, so we don't know what it's like to have like.

[C]

We don't know how to behave properly. We don't know how to.

[B]

Okay, sorry.

[C]

Sorry, Lacey.

[A]

Oh, my God. So Big Luca was on top of the world, right? Selling his scheme as the self publishing revolution. Then in 2016, a man named Christian Michaelson enrolled in Big Luca's course, and the world of scam publishing would never be the same.

[C]

Ooh, he looked like Mr. Beast.

[B]

He does.

[A]

Oh, he kind of does.

[B]

This is AI. This is not a real man, is it?

[A]

And just so y' all know, in the future, it's Christian Mickelson.

[B]

Like, Phil Mickels.

[A]

Okay, we got the twins. The Mickelson twins. Look at them now, huh?

[B]

They look fake.

[A]

They look like what I thought like a romance novel man would look like. Drawn from memory.

[B]

That part.

[A]

Like, if Fabio got on Ozemping and I drew him from memory.

[B]

That part. It's like when the Beast becomes man. And then he had a gay twin.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's accurate. Y' all see we're not wrong. We're not wrong.

[C]

I'm just saying, Prince and the Pauper. There's something about, like, one of them is poor, one of them is rich. They switch places. One of them gets a hair.

[A]

I feel like we should both have long hair. Like, the other guy's making a mistake.

[B]

Oh, I like the short hair one.

[C]

Oh, no, I think long hair.

[B]

I like short.

[C]

Huh?

[B]

They're both gonna hurt us. Like, they're both gonna kill us.

[C]

Of course.

[A]

Yeah. They look like murderers. Murderers or models. They got long necks. They could do some modeling.

[B]

I hate to say that I would, but I would.

[C]

I love this game. Murderers or models?

[A]

Murderers or models? Game goddess. Murderers or Models edition. So the. The Mickelson twins who are named Christian and Rasmus?

[C]

No, no, ma'.

[B]

Am.

[A]

Who? Why? Somebody gave Christian and the other one get.

[C]

Rasmus is the long haired one.

[B]

Rasmus has to be Rasmus.

[A]

But they might as well be interchangeable and are terrifyingly well groomed white men from Denver.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Christian found Big Luca's course by googling how to make money online. He used the method to publish his first ebook called how to be a 4.0 student in college. Like me. Ooh.

[C]

Okay.

[B]

Oh, okay, okay.

[A]

See, we might be models, not murderers. Now, opinions.

[C]

This is a trick question. Cause they're both.

[A]

We could be murderers.

[B]

It is both right now for me. Damn.

[C]

It's giving. Talented Mr. Ripley.

[A]

Okay. Yeah, you can be in the middle, dance all night.

[B]

Damn. I'm sick, though. I have a thing for, like, when boys look like Ken dolls like that.

[A]

Oh, really?

[B]

They're sick.

[A]

It scares me.

[C]

Deprogrammed, that brain. I know.

[B]

But the brain is colonized. I'm sorry.

[A]

So this book that he has, that's like how to be a 4.0 student in college, just like me. It was 24 pages long. And the secret in his case was that he was taking an associate's degree course in exercise science at County College of Morris in Randolph, New Jersey. So 4.0 wasn't a huge accomplishment.

[C]

I'm sorry, was that a AI? Was that census that you read AI? Because that was crazy.

[A]

People be having exercise science degrees. They do.

[B]

But it does make me laugh because it's like in New Jersey, there's like

[A]

a famous Louisiana football player who plays for the Eagles who has an exercise science degree. He'd be putting it to use.

[C]

What is that? What is that? Is that like, to be a P.E. teacher?

[A]

Well, like.

[B]

Like, it's like your body's physiology.

[A]

Yeah. And working out. And like, if you, like, if you bruise, like, you know, you shouldn't probably use a thorough gun on that because you're making the bruise words lymphatic drainage.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

It's like you're not, but, you know, you personal trainer.

[C]

I would love to see you as an exercise science teacher.

[A]

I don't want to disrespect the exercise scientists out there, okay. Because they disrespect y', all, and that's not me. I just want y' all to know, separate me from that. Remember me different.

[B]

Yeah, come fucking DM me.

[A]

But he's saying that what's the science?

[B]

Run more. Sweat more. What's the science?

[A]

Same. So I'm also saying here that, like, his whole tip was just go to a very easy school and you'll be a 4.0 student like me. Hehehe. You already bought the book Robbery. Hey, weirdos. I'm Elena. And I'm Ash. And we are the hosts of Morbid Podcast. Each week, we dive into the dark and fascinating world of true crime, spooky history, and the unexplained. From infamous killers and unsolved mysteries to haunted places and strange legends, we cover it all with research, empathy, humor, and a few creative expletives. It's smart, it's spooky, and it's just the right amount of weird. Two new episodes drop every week, and there's even a bonus once a month. Find us wherever you listen to podcasts.

[C]

Yay.

[A]

Woo.

[C]

This message is brought to you by Apple Card. Apple Card members can earn unlimited daily cash back on Everyday purchases wherever they shop. This means you could be earning daily cash on just about anything, like a slice of pizza from your local pizza place or a latte from the corner coffee shop. Apply for Apple Card in the Wallet app to see your credit limit offer in minutes. Subject to credit approval. Apple card issued by Goldman Sachs Bank USA, Salt Lake City branch terms and

[A]

[e-mail] Sometimes I become a creature of habit because I don't want to be scammed by trying new things. But you know what? It's finally time for me to say goodbye to dry with hellofresh. With Hellofresh, savoring new flavors from around the world isn't just delicious. It's simple and wholesome. You can choose from more than 80 global recipes every single month, including Vietnamese, Moroccan, Caribbean, and more. More cravings shouldn't just wait for takeout. Get international ingredients straight to you. I love it so much because I feel like I'm impressing my friends. Like, I don't typically have, like, cream of chowder Mushroom with couscous. When's the last time you just made couscous at your house? And eating at home is just so much better. I know what's inside of it. I can pronounce all the ingredients. And that's why I love HelloFresh. Go to hellofresh.com goddess10fm to get 10 free meals plus a free NutriBullet Ultra plus two in one compact kitchen system. A 189.99 value on your third box. Free meals applied as a discount on the first box. New subscribers only. Varies by plan. Must order the third box by May 31, 2026. Six and fraud. So Christian brought Rasmus, his brother, into the business and he published a cross training manual. Together they published all kinds of ebooks, guides to keto and sex and crystals, picking the topics and titles based on trending keywords, of course. So we have two beautiful men from Denmark. They. They got sex books. They got.

[C]

And they wrote this together. Together. They wrote the sex book together.

[B]

That is creepy.

[A]

How you write the sex book with your brother.

[C]

With your twin brother.

[A]

Maybe they did it. Maybe they submitted chapters.

[C]

Like, they took turns.

[A]

Every page, they took turns. So to go faster, they hired ghost writers.

[C]

Ah, yeah.

[A]

And once their combined earnings grew to around 3,000amonth, they quit school and moved to Thailand in September of 2017, where the Internet was fast and the cost of living was nearly zero. So they could work, you know, technically, illegally, because you're working, working out of the country, you're not probably Paying Thailand's taxes. And I know a lot of people during 2020 had moved to Thailand and were like, hey, y', all, if you work from home, just move on over to Thailand.

[B]

Go to Phuket, like, because you could. It was a tax loophole of some kind.

[A]

I don't think it is. I think that they were just doing it illegally. And, like, the cost of living is so cheap. They were living, like, in these palatial houses, but, like, working online, right?

[C]

They were criminals.

[A]

Yeah, they were criminals. The Thailand government did start getting wind of it, because the thing is, like, y' all can't gatekeep no more. Every time y' all find something good, y' all gotta hop your asses on for some motherfucking likes. And now y' all can't be over defrauding Thailand's government no more. We could have all been defrauding the government. All you have to do is hit your group chat. We can keep spreading it alone. This is why we need chain mail back, okay? We need to start threatening that you gonna die in 60 days if you don't send this mail into 10 of your friends.

[B]

Oh, I thought you meant medieval kind.

[A]

No.

[C]

What?

[A]

I was like, I want to hear where this is going. Okay? That mask really did something to you in the club that traumatized you. I'm telling you, I have a my chain mail right now. Now I'm here. Scam goddess is gone. You're having flashbacks. You have ptsd. Oh, my God.

[B]

Where are the deodorant?

[A]

They ran their manuscripts through Google Translate and started selling foreign language editions, which bumped their income up to six figures. Now I know how good Google Translate is. And by good, I mean bad. So who knows what they were reading? Cause scammers still try to use this in the emails that they send to Fish. Right now. It's one of the easiest indicators that it's not from Amazon, you know, with a oh, it's from AM with a zero. Is that there's tons of misspellings and the etiquette is incorrect. They'll be like, have a blessed day. It's like, Amazon ain't never told me to have no blessed day.

[B]

That's true. That's true. It's so funny when you also look at the email or it's like it says Amazon, but then if you click on what is the email address? It's always like, love 28 dB.

[C]

Exactly.

[A]

And you're like, okay, so shortly after that, right, Amazon blocked their publishing account, and that could have been the end for the twins. But they. No, no, no, no. They doubled. Doubled down. So Amazon said y' all out here faking a fun. Y', all, y' all playing on our names and we're gonna block your accounts. So those who can't do, teach. Oh, they started a YouTube channel so that they could teach the business of self publishing to anyone who wanted to learn. With a new focus on audiobooks.

[B]

Audiobooks.

[C]

I want to hear what they sound like.

[A]

Three seven hour sessions to record my audiobook. So I'm like, how are y' all doing this business? So after posting a new. I feel like you just got to make up the audiobook as you go and just be talking on the mic like don't have no.

[B]

But like they don't let you. Aren't they like these. Your words have to be as close as possible to the book.

[A]

Actually publishing something that's like being published legitimately. But if you're doing self published, no, you can get in there and do whatever you want.

[B]

Yeah, that makes sense.

[A]

So after posting a new YouTube video every other day for about six months feeding that algorithm, they had a thousand subscribers and they launched their first paywalled online course. Course. They sold it at a 50% discount for $500 the day it launched. No, they made $48,000 overnight.

[C]

Who?

[A]

People want to make money online.

[C]

Oh my God.

[B]

And people, people were so convinced that this would make money.

[C]

Yeah. I mean they had video now and

[A]

we're seeing a little clip of the, the education right now that says like 55 minutes. But no, we're not gonna watch out like that.

[B]

No, no, no. But we see official video. This is going to be an all in one crash course to publishing your first book. So if you're looking to publish one or two books and make a few extra hundred dollars per month, this video will be your holy bible and replace your full time income.

[C]

Be able to quit your job and

[A]

just live off of your publishing business.

[B]

This video is a great start. And I recommend watching entire video to the end.

[C]

I'm sorry people.

[A]

I'm looking at the back of the video.

[C]

Thank you.

[A]

And it's not giving. Making extra money.

[C]

People gave him money despite the background looking like that.

[A]

Uh huh.

[C]

No. People want to be scammed.

[A]

Yeah. Cause I'm like, he got clothes everywhere. But it's not giving.

[C]

Is that a bed?

[A]

It's not giving success.

[C]

That's a bed.

[B]

I can smell him through the video.

[C]

And what do you smell like?

[A]

We know what mono Lucy smells like.

[B]

Grub. Your ears. Cover your ears.

[A]

That's all I'll say. That was him.

[B]

It's giving Grunger. Maybe he is Grunger.

[C]

That was Grunger.

[B]

That was Grunger.

[A]

So first the course was called Audiobook Impact Academy. I'm gonna say that again. Audiobook Impact Academy. He didn't put a lot of words in there that sound like impact and academy. That sounds like a place where you're gonna learn stuff. Then he changed it to Publishing Life. Now that sounds like a Ponzi scheme.

[B]

Yes, that sounds like herbalife.

[A]

Publishing Life. Cause what do you mean publishing? Publishing Life?

[B]

Promise for life.

[A]

Everybody said they got you got one good book in you. Everybody got one good book in them. I don't know if we got a lifetime of publishing in us, otherwise you might be living like mono in Seattle. Then he changed it to AI Publishing Academy.

[C]

Huh.

[A]

But the overall structure stayed the same. So now we're just shifting the goalpost. And I can't imagine being someone who was like, okay, I'm gonna join the Audio Impact Academy. And then, oh, he's got a new one. AI Publishing Academy. And I signed up for both this.

[C]

Nothing wrong there. Oh, there's a new name every month. Oh, that's. Oh, yeah. That's totally normal and fine.

[B]

How do you do your. Well, I guess you do. You do your tax. If you have a new name every month, how do you do your taxes?

[A]

You think they do a tax?

[C]

You simply can't.

[B]

That's. Yeah, I answered my question.

[A]

Yeah. Also, just like the shell company could still be the same. Let's say they do try to be legit. They're just putting a different name online. And that's just to get the algorithm going. It's like, okay, people getting tired of clicking on this. We're going to give them something new to click on. So Today it costs 2000 dol to take this course. And it starts with a mandatory two hour webinar, which is just Christian sitting in a dark room, drinking from a water bottle as he shows you screencaps of his students royalty checks and says over and over again that he's already rich. He doesn't need more money. But you, the viewer, do. Now, Christian, you did something smart here. You're sitting in a dark room, so we can't see your dirty ass room no more. So trust me, I'm very rich. I can only see the whites of his eyes and his teeth. Trust me, behind me right now is

[B]

my PO and anyone who's like, why do you want to teach me this?

[C]

Right?

[B]

If you're making thousands a month. Why do you want me to have a piece of your market?

[A]

Yeah. And I also don't trust people who say, I don't need money, baby. Then why are you taking my money if you don't need the money?

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

I think ultimately people just want to be scammed. I don't know if I'm click paying so much money and watching a video of someone in the dark telling me that he doesn't need the money. You do. I would be like, something's not right here.

[A]

This is giving cult of personality to me.

[B]

Of course.

[A]

Like, I think people are liking Christians vibes somehow. And rasmus. And so they're, like, just hanging out with these people. They're paying $2,000 to feel like they're doing something with their life, and even though they're not really. And they get to also hang out with this bro who seems cooler than them.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

It also does give me, like, man. And what people are willing to believe when a tall white guy says it.

[A]

Oh, yeah.

[B]

You know what I mean? It's just like, well, look at him. He's successful.

[C]

Exactly.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Look at how tall and white he is. He's got teeth.

[B]

So I can be tall and white. If I do this.

[A]

If I keep working hard, I can be.

[C]

If I publish all my novels, then I'll be tall and white.

[A]

I don't know if y' all haven't noticed. As soon as I published that first book, I got whiter. I definitely got taller. I don't know if you noticed. I'm well on my way. Okay, well, on my. Y' all gotta catch up. Catch up.

[C]

That hat's turning a little wide.

[B]

Well, okay.

[A]

We don't do that malarkey over here, okay?

[C]

Oh, malarkey. Oh, she said malarkey.

[A]

Yes. So, you know, he gets you in the dark for two hours. Then he promises to show you how to produce a book without having to write it. AI will write your outline for you. The twins will pick your top, giving you access to keywords, keyword scrapers that have pulled trending topics from Kindle and Audible. So basically, they're saying, we're gonna help you make your AI book. Like, you write that AI outline. Then the twins, we're gonna pick just any topic for you, and then we're gonna put it into the thingamajig that's killing all the black people in Memphis, and we gonna pull some trendy topics. Then you send your AI outline to a ghostwriter to turn it into a book for just 500 do so for 30,000 word of book. Right? So that works out to a fee of like.01666667 per word, which is very cheap.

[C]

Yes.

[A]

I remember Sex and the City when Carrie would be like, I'm at Vogue and they're giving me $4 per word. And I was like, I don't know what this means, but she can have $700 shoes every other day.

[B]

Right.

[C]

And before that charge, Charles Dickens, they're giving me six tuppence for words.

[B]

That's why I'm wearing these Louboutins.

[C]

Do you like my tutu?

[A]

So after that, you, like. The Michaelsons, work with a ghostwriting company. They're called the Urban Writers, and they were developed by two former students. Their ghostwriters get hired on a freelance basis and they're kept anonymous. So they're not gonna go down with this. So that don't even look like a real lady. That looks like an AI lady to me. And. And they're like, we write, you win, fast track your bestseller success. Okay?

[C]

And they got people with glasses on. So, you know, they're like, oh, clearly

[A]

they're nerds for sure.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And look, the website has a little bit of design to it. Like, look at them circles behind the nerd with the computer. He got the computer in the photo. He. Like, I'm typing right now.

[C]

This is how people type. This is how writers type with their. With their freaking laptop in their hands.

[B]

It sounds too good to be true. Which means it is. We write, you win. Okay. I just can't. It's too much.

[A]

But they gotta. The website looks legit.

[C]

It does.

[B]

It does.

[A]

So let's say you wanted to do this right, and you have your manuscript done. The twins will show you how to hire an audiobook narrator for a flat $20 fee by haggling their prices down. They introduce you to a network of people who are generous with their five star ratings, and they'll push your book up the Amazon rankings for you. All you have to do is sit back and collect your royalty checks as you rake in month after month of passive income. And it's all. Technically, it just floods the ebook marketplace with garbage. Because that's what AI does is flood our lives with garbage.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

They were like, y' all want to live sadder lives?

[C]

AI, wait, you love me?

[A]

So. So, wait. Wait, you love me.

[B]

Wait, you love me. Wait, you love me.

[A]

It's a song now. Mano's made it a song.

[B]

Wait, you love me. The chemicals.

[A]

The chemicals.

[B]

Honestly, I think I saw the seagull at the rave.

[A]

The seagull was definitely at the rave before it put on its mout. Definitely at the rain. Okay, so what makes the Michelson twins special is that they're operating on several levels of grifting here. They're selling their scam method to other scammers, but also scamming them. And to get that free topic for your book, you have to pay for access to the software that analyzes Amazon keywords to tell you what's trending. Right. So to create the perfect outline, you have to pay for access to the AI outlines and that drafts your book for you. Right.

[B]

How do you make money?

[A]

Don't worry about it.

[C]

Where's the money part? Where's the money part?

[A]

You have to pay for the COVID design and for the reviewers. The $2,000 fee to the Michelsons for the course.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Is supposed to, it's supposed to guarantee that you frequent one on one calls with a publishing coach. But the coaching calls were mostly about upselling the premium to get the premium $7,800 course. So you get these courses with the $2,000 and they get on this course and they're like, you know, it would be great if you bought because then that's really, really gonna start making the books like that's, you know. Have you heard of John Grisham? Yeah, we work with him.

[B]

We work with him.

[C]

You heard of Dan Brown? Yeah, we're the Da Vinci Code.

[A]

We're the Da Vinci Code. Well, you think he came up with all that stuff? Definitely. AI, Ain't nobody reading books like that about Christian history no more. Twilight. That was also a us. I remember, remember I had said sparkly and vampire and then, and then that's what we got.

[C]

They said spider and monkey. Uh huh. Where you been, loca? That's us.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So with that much investment, the 99 cent ebook publishing scheme is probably not gonna make you any money. Yeah. Cause your passive income is 99 cents a book.

[B]

No.

[A]

In 2018, the twins bought the domain publishing.com. which is where the scam still lives. Offering a course they say can help students make a lifetime of easy cash off of revenue from books they don't even have to bother to write themselves.

[B]

But what they've done is not illegal yet.

[A]

It's unethical, sure, but technically they're giving a product. It's the reason why MLMs can exist and aren't prosecuted as Ponzi schemes. Because even though in their structure and design, they are a Ponzi Scheme because they technically do have a product that they're giving you. Whether it be moldy leggings that you can't sell, that you mortgaged your house for, or it be classes where there is a man from Denmark in the dark telling you he's rich and upselling you. They still provided the product.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

Yeah. And that's how you get away with it. Because think about it, there's so many products. If we were to say, like, oh, this product is a scam, then the nuance of that legally becomes really difficult to navigate. Because what if I sell like a friendship bracelet that cost me 30 cents to make, but I sell it for $30,000? Isn't that a scam? Yes, but technically, if somebody is willing to purchase that shitty ass bracelet. It's not.

[C]

And you got the bracelet.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

It's worth whatever the consumer is willing to pay for it.

[A]

Yes, I know. Which is bad also.

[B]

Twins are bad.

[C]

I'm saying, like, where's the other twin in this? I feel like one twin is doing a lot of the work and the other twin is where maybe the other

[A]

twin on the computer a lot.

[C]

So that's crazy to be identical twins. And for what of them to be the face of the scam? I would feel.

[A]

Well, I think that's a personality thing. It's like one of them got. Got that gift of gab and the other one's like, all right for the AI stuff. And then the other one is Rasmus. Yeah, Rasmus gotta stay in the dark corner. Yeah, don't nobody look up to Rasmus.

[C]

Rasmus is in the dark, behind the sun.

[B]

Can't touch the sun. You think it's a pool?

[C]

It's just Rasmus going, touchm.

[B]

He's got to eat his fish head.

[A]

Oh, my gosh. That's all he do. Rasmas get on the laptop, do the AI and you know, they throw some fish heads at him. Yeah. I feel like Rasmus eats like. Have you ever seen those gourmet dog tiktoks where the person makes the like, dog, like a charcuterie board?

[B]

No.

[A]

No.

[B]

You haven't seen these.

[A]

Like, the base is like rabbit fur that's been like dehydrated. Then they do like chicken necks and goosenecks and liver and it's like all raw, like salmon and fruits and vegetables and stuff. And then they'll be like, eat. And then the dog will just start tearing it up, bones and all. And I feel like that's what Rasmuss is. I'll put a reference.

[C]

How Is that. How's the algorithm Found you?

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

I don't think you have pets.

[A]

Do you have an animal? No. Yeah, it's just peaceful to watch the dog eat it.

[B]

Yeah, he gets like, a nice dog

[C]

the way you described it. You said tear into. There's nothing peaceful about.

[A]

I can't explain it. So their revenue went from around. This is the twins went from around $300,000 in 2019 to just shy of 50 million in 2022.

[B]

That's crazy.

[C]

Damn the power we give these people.

[B]

I'm so jealous.

[A]

I am. A scam. That was my first thought, too, was jealousy.

[B]

In 2022.

[A]

Let's all start a scam together. Um. Okay. Yeah, we can do this. We can.

[B]

A shark tank thing.

[A]

Maybe the COVID lockdown helped turbocharge the sales. So from about $20,000 a month to blips of $500,000 a month since a lot of people were stuck at home. And we're also Googling how to make money online.

[C]

The timing. The timing of this timing.

[A]

The big boom. 50 millie in a dirty room at home in the dark.

[C]

Exactly. That doesn't read 50 miles. Yeah.

[A]

That's so much money.

[C]

That's probably their mom's house.

[B]

Did they. Did anyone make money like, did?

[A]

Well, the twins say that they earned their first million dollars at age 25. Their second million came four days later. Today, they project a luxury lifestyle by always posting to Instagram from private pools and. Or exotic beaches.

[C]

The freedom shortcut.

[A]

There are no shortcuts in life, y'. All. Well, you know what? Be white. Is that what the book says?

[B]

I mean, honestly, a great shortc.

[A]

Cause, like, look, if you're poor and white or if, you know, you're dealing with health problems and you're white, it's still bad, but it's not bad. But you might have a little bit of a head start at least with your GoFundMe.

[B]

Yeah, you least get a chute. You know, in terms of chutes and ladders. You get a chute.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Not a ladder.

[A]

No, we getting automatic ladders.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I came out the womb, and it, like, gave me the rungs.

[C]

Ladder.

[A]

Get the climbing. Get the climbing, baby boo. Oh, so. So, yeah, they trying to keep up their Instagram influence, which I think is. They're doing a pretty good job of it. Like, look at. Look at either Christian.

[C]

I mean, it all looks good.

[A]

It has to be Christian. That has to be Christian.

[B]

What do you mean?

[A]

With his girl.

[C]

Oh, yeah, Rasmus is.

[A]

Oh, no, they got a Forbes. If that's the first 30 under 30. Then you already know where they going? To jail. You know how many people on the Forbes 30 under 30 must have gone to jail. It's a pipeline.

[B]

That's amazing. I didn't know that. Yeah, that's amazing.

[A]

It's a people to pipeline system.

[B]

What's her name? Elizabeth.

[C]

Elizabeth Holmes.

[A]

Yeah, Elizabeth Holmes.

[B]

She was probably on that list, right?

[A]

She might have been the tiny thing. She was definitely on Forbes with the tiny thing. I don't know if it was 30 under 30, though. But just look up Forbes 30 under 30 prison, and you'll see what I'm talking about.

[C]

That's its own article.

[A]

So one of the first few results of Googling the Mickelson twins scam leads to a post on publishing.com itself, where they trap people who are looking for information about their scamry into listening to their pitch again. So if you look up Mickelson twin scam, it takes you right to publishing dot com. They're like, hey, it's this. The Mickelson twins. And look, they even make it look like they're reviewing themselves.

[C]

Absolutely legit.

[A]

Cause look at that post, that YouTube post. Like, this is always how you see a post come up when you have a blogger who's about to, like, ruin some social media star's life with a bunch of tea that they have on them. It always looks like that.

[B]

So they post.

[A]

Yeah, they put that title card for them to put out their own propaganda.

[B]

That's smart.

[A]

Genius. Honestly.

[C]

They said no press is bad press.

[A]

Yeah, right? I mean, y' all Googling us. We might as well get involved.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

So Big Luca. Check it. Don't forget Big Luca was around.

[C]

What about Big Luca?

[B]

What about Big Luca? I forgot about Luca.

[A]

Everybody forgot about Big Luca.

[B]

All y' all forgot about Luca.

[C]

He's building that glory hole.

[A]

I am not. So first big it's after. Now you're saying it after, Master.

[C]

He's building that massive glory hole. Cover your ears.

[A]

So at first, Big Luca threatened to take the Mickelson to court for stealing his grift. Now, I don't know how you gonna be like, you stole my crime, and I'm taking you to court, buddy.

[C]

I'm the bigger criminal.

[B]

That's a video online when someone's like, calls the cops, being like, they took my meth. You know what I mean? Someone's like, they stole my meth. You're like, bitch.

[A]

Well, you guys must have meth.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

There's no honor among thieves. Yeah, that's Like I get to the bank to rob if somebody there before I was gonna rob this one. I'm taking you to court. So eventually, right? He just, he. By saying this, he's proving that his own brand is a grift. Because he's like, you stole my shit. So now he runs Big Luca internationally, or more informally, school for the rich. This is a self described school as the world leading company in online marketing training. It's supposed to teach you how to monetize any online business. The self publishing black tricks used for every other industry on the Internet. So on their website it says the world's best company in monetization and online marketing is ready to help you scale your business or create a new one from zero. I'm sorry, when I see the best, I'm instantly triggered to that orange man. The best. Best company. That's the best that ever did it. According to who?

[B]

I know, it's. It's. Yeah.

[C]

I can't take a company called Big Luca International seriously. There's no freaking way.

[A]

And what makes you international? Because it's not giving that you are.

[C]

Well, he went to Mexico City one time.

[A]

Okay, technically, international.

[B]

Technically, yes.

[A]

So now that AI is around, it's easier than ever to flood the whole digital ecosystem with trash in the pursuit of passive income, which we know to be true. And it's such a bummer that AI is destroying everything that we love because it's like, it's not helping. I know people are like, oh, I have an AI assistant and it helps me. I'm like, no, you're poisoning the planet. Just go hire a real person having

[C]

AI assistants or AI therapist or. It's all really scary to me.

[A]

It's.

[B]

So I just had this account follow me that was like 25 different AI pictures of like a 10 year old.

[C]

Yeesh.

[B]

Like, and the 10 year old was just, you know, being a dorky kid. But I was like, gross. Like, what the. What the hell is this? What the hell is the. Perfect.

[C]

So the kid doesn't exist.

[B]

The kid does not exist. But it was just like 25 pictures of a AI kid being a kid. And I was like, fucking, ew. Excuse my language. But like what is this? What is this for?

[A]

No, it's disgusting. They're doing it to everything and everyone. Like Timberland even had that fake AI Asian woman who was putting on a black scent and doing music with timber. Yeah, what was that artist named? She went for so many egregious things here. I don't know what that artist's Name was.

[C]

What was her name? Yes, Timbaland.

[A]

Because it was something crazy.

[C]

I know, I know.

[B]

Timbaland, Please. We stuck with you.

[A]

Well, we just thought you were unproblematic and chilling. We didn't think you were out here doing anything.

[B]

We were with you when you were making fun of people.

[A]

Wait, can you call them piano man Timbaland? AI artist? Because I can't.

[B]

I think he called Dr. Dre a piano man. Timbaland was, like, saying, like, I'm the better producer and you're just. Just a piano man.

[C]

Oh.

[A]

Oh. Cuz I'm thinking. I don't know why I went to Elton John.

[C]

Elton John?

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

And not Billy Joel with Jim talking.

[A]

Yeah, I should have went to Billy Joel.

[B]

Was starting to sh.

[C]

With Billy Joel.

[A]

Her name is Tata.

[C]

Yes, Tata.

[A]

She got pink hair, real eyes, red jacket. What do you mean, real eyes? What does that mean? But her named Tata. And she rapped just like you think she would.

[C]

Mm.

[A]

What? Yeah. So that's the world we live in now. But what do you guys think of the scam? Do you like these scammers? Do you dislike them?

[B]

I don't like this scam. This is not a fun crime.

[A]

Okay? Yeah, I think with the AI involved, it makes it less fun. Other than that, I find it to be deeply unserious. And I don't feel as much sympathy for the victims here because maybe in 2020, I'll feel a little more sympathy because everybody was trying to get a job from home and your job house was shutting down. I can understand the sympathize a little bit more. But before and after that, I'm like,

[B]

AI, you're saying their hustle is fair? No. Okay, okay.

[A]

I'm saying the victims, I take pity on them during 2020. But after that, when we started learning about AI and how harmful it was, like, yeah, I don't pity y'. All. If you want to pay $2,000 to let a long neck Denmark man talk to you from the dark of his home, then you deserve to get robbed.

[C]

That's the thing. It's like the red flags were everywhere. Red flags asunder. I don't know why people were, like, falling into this scam when there were so many signs to turn back. The dark room, the bed in the background, all of those. It's like, at least Luca had big.

[A]

Luca had a clean background when he was telling people about getting on.

[C]

Exactly.

[B]

Okay, wait. What is this? Okay, well, this is another scammy video of them on YouTube. Okay.

[C]

See, they look AI to me.

[B]

Like, creepy.

[C]

It's like I can't trust anything anymore.

[A]

And they got, now they got tech bro haircuts. Like, yeah, it's so gross.

[C]

One's eating a banana. Rude.

[B]

And you know, a lot of Rasmus is trying to. That's Rasmus trying to beat the fish head rumors.

[C]

He's like, look, look, I eat bananas anyways.

[A]

I eat bananas. Well, on that note, we always ask on this podcast, where would you like to be found? Anything you want to plug, social medias, anything coming out, all that good stuff.

[B]

Yes. Oh, well, listen to our podcast, Drag Her Podcast. It's available anywhere you find podcasts. It's a fun dumb time. We're on Patreon as well, because for the die hard Drag Race fans. But a reminder, the podcast is for everybody. It's for anyone who just likes to hear friends.

[C]

I recently had a conversation with someone who has never watched Drag Race listens to our podcast.

[A]

Oh, I love that.

[B]

We have so much fun together and we fight like siblings.

[C]

We do.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

It's a great time. Go listen to that.

[C]

And you can follow Mono Monogapion on Instagram. You can follow me at Ozzy Mo Ozzy Mo on instagram as well. Patreon.com drag rapper podcast for the Patreon. That's it. I also want to shout out to Tyra Banks.

[B]

Can we plug our drag show instead of Tyra Banks?

[C]

No. No. And we are. We do a show called Bad Drag Race where we take Drag Race and we condense it to a three month run at the Dynasty typewriter.

[A]

That's right.

[C]

With comedians who are trying drag for the first time. It's really fun, really crunchy.

[B]

We are crunchy drag.

[C]

And it's very crunchy, very crunchy, funny drag. So stay tuned for that Tyra and Tyra. I mean, you know Santa Smize, right?

[A]

You know that whole thing.

[C]

Yes.

[A]

Oh, my goodness. Which, I mean, it got her attention. I know about her hot ice cream last year.

[C]

Listen, and the thing that I have to say is like, you know, we talked about Timbaland's like, AI generated artist, but Santa Smize should have been AI. But Tyra said no. I have an intelligent that's in my alter ego that I have. I'm gonna wear a piss yellow cover your ears, piss yellow wig and a Santa hat. And I'm a completely different person.

[A]

And I'm gonna be sweaty and I'm gonna be doing stand up. That makes no sense. I'm making everyone uncomfortable and it's gonna be amazing. And honestly, I Love it. Because people forget OG Tyra. Tyra used to have her own television show, and she would, like, walk out and, like, have guests on, and she would trick them and put, like, foam in her mouth, and it's like she was having rabies. This woman has never been serious. Y' all just forgot who she was at this point.

[B]

I bet the documentary's out. The ANTM documentary might be out now.

[C]

Yes. And in the trailer, it's like, yeah, you know, I'm ready to talk now. And then she blames us for her being so extra on the show.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

She's like, you guys wanted more. It's your fault that I became this way.

[A]

Sorry. We love girls to switch races. I know.

[B]

Exactly.

[A]

Nobody hits you up and said, put that as lady in blackpink. We did not tell you to do that.

[B]

No one told you to scream at Tiffany the way you screamed at Tiffany, which.

[A]

I mean, it is iconic now.

[C]

It's iconic.

[A]

But at the moment, we weren't like, yell at her. Get her. We weren't like, cut that girl hair off and then send her home immediately. We didn't tell you to do that, Tyra. But as always, guys, you can find me at D I V A L A C I Divalacy on all platforms. Y' all. Come see me live.

[C]

Ooh.

[A]

April 9th, Irving, Texas, at the Punchline Comedy Theater. I'll be in New York April 18th at the Grand Mercy Theater. And April 30th, I'll be in San Francisco reprising our Cobbs comedy moment. Y' all know we had a good time out there, so y' all can come pull up on me live and enjoy my special guests and the scams that we're going through. And I can't wait to see y'. All. Yeah, you can pick up my book anywhere you get. Books are sold. Scam goddess. And you can find me at D I V A L A C I D Belacy on all platforms. And if you want to see the pictures of these creepy scamming twins, go ahead and get on Scam Goddess Pod and get on the Scam Goddess TikTok. It's new, and we've got some little videos and reprises up there for y' all who see some peoples and some faces. So, yeah, and I'll put the link to the scapegoddess TikTok in the bio congregation. I want y' all to get out there and wait, you love me.

[C]

Tell me. I. I was like, I can't wait to say, wait, you love me one more time.

[A]

Genius Incredible Lacey Scam got is Scamp got his stars and is hosted by me, Lacey Mo, AKA Scam Goddess. Our producer is Jessica Cisneros and our audio engineer is Rich Garcia. Research for the show is conducted by Kate Doyle. Stay scheming.

[C]

This is Comedy Bang Bang the Podcast, the promo and in 30 seconds I'm gonna tell you why. You should check out the show. I the host, Scott Aukerman have a light hearted conversation with famous celebrities like Jon Hammond, Allison Williams, Phoebe Bridgers, Jason Alexander, Natasha Lyonne, Bob Odenkirk, just to name a few things. Go a little off the rails when different eccentric characters and oddballs drop by to be interviewed as well. Each week is a blend of conversations and character work from your favorite comedians as well as some new hilarious voices. Comedy Bang Bang the Podcast. Listen every Monday wherever you get your podcasts.

[A]

Oh no, my coffee. Brawny here. New brawny 3 ply is now more absorbent. Wow. Got a clean shirt. Do you wear plaid?

[B]

Some of the strongest.