Scam Goddess: The E-Book Evil Twins

Host: Laci Mosley
Guests: Mano Agapion & Oscar Montoya
Release Date: April 14, 2026

Episode Overview

This Scam Goddess episode dives into the world of e-book and audiobook publishing scams, focusing on the notorious Michelson twins (Christian and Rasmus), who built a multimillion-dollar grift flooding Amazon with low-quality, AI-generated books — and then teaching others how to do the same. Laci Mosley is joined by comedians Mano Agapion and Oscar Montoya for a raucous, in-depth breakdown of the Kindle hustlers, the shadowy “AI publishing” industry, and the sometimes hilarious, sometimes shameful culture of internet scamming.

Throughout, the hosts swap personal stories of getting scammed (and sometimes scamming), critique the logic of these “get rich online” schemes, and roast the questionable characters running these rackets — all while keeping true to the show’s signature tone: irreverent, sharp, yet always empathetic.

Key Discussion Points & Segments

1. Scam Stories & Culture Check-In

[03:41 – 13:00]

• Scams Everywhere: Laci asks guests to reflect on their current relationship to scams, noting they seem “bigger and more innovative” than ever.
• Shoplifting Confessions: Oscar admits to recently getting caught stealing vitamins from Target and describes the surreal, almost sitcom-like experience of being busted by store security — in front of a former improv student.
  • Memorable Quote (Oscar, 06:44): “She made me sign all this paperwork, and then they took pictures of me… And then she was like, ‘for private prison…’ They might! And then they said they were like, ‘you're banned from Target all targets for a year.’ And I was like. I chuckled because I was like, ‘a year.’”
• Scamming the System: Laci and Mano riff on the “class” aspects of self-checkout and “boop to steal” methods.
• Phone Nostalgia: Tangential riff on pre-smartphone mobile culture and gay cruising spots, before segueing back to scams.

2. “Seattle Scam” – The Smelly Rave

[13:03 – 19:23]

• Mono’s Scammy Adventure: Mano details a recent experience in Seattle: he accepted an invite to an underground gay rave (“Jiz Nasium”) and was “scammed” by cultural expectations around unwashed bodies (“musk”).
  • Memorable Quote (Mano, 16:46): “[There’s] like a moment happening in the queer community where some people are really into musk… And I’m not saying one or two days post-shower. I’m saying a week or more. No shower… I felt scammed.”
• Queer Community Trends: Laci, Oscar, and Mano hash out their feelings about new “musk” subcultures and how personal hygiene can itself become a kind of scam or imposed norm.

3. Second Rave Scam: "Grunger" the Pup Mask

[22:42 – 25:46]

• Unexpected “Pup Play”: Mano describes meeting a kind, seemingly “normal” man at the rave, who suddenly puts on a “pup mask” and declares, “Now I’m Grunger.”
  • Memorable Quote (Mano, 24:00): “It’s a pup mask. And he says to me, ‘now I’m Grunger.’ And that’s when I said, okay, I have to go to Taco Bell...”
• Boundaries in Queer Spaces: Mano riffs on the increasingly visible “pup” subculture, joking that “maybe there should be a moratorium on pup masks… until we have more rights.”

4. Main Scam Deep Dive: The E-Book Evil Twins

[25:57 – 71:17]

Introduction to the Scam

[25:57 – 29:52]

• Rise of Scam E-books: Laci introduces the epidemic of junk ebooks on Amazon, often AI-generated, and the Michelson twins who “literally wrote the book on publishing scams.”
• Absurd Book Titles: Discussion of nonsensical, keyword-heavy titles (“If You Love Me” with a seagull on the cover), and riffing on who these books could possibly be for.
  • Memorable Quote (Laci, 29:13): “It’s a picture of a dove looking at me… or maybe it’s a seagull. Sorry.”

How the Scam Works

[33:07 – 45:22]

• History of the Scheme: Pre-AI, self-published “white hat” and “black hat” publishing tricks were common. Then, Luca “Big Luca” De Stephani creates a book crime ring through a secret Facebook group for fake reviews and sales.
• The Michelson Twins Enter: Christian Michelson enrolls, exploits the method, brings brother Rasmus aboard, and they start pumping out hundreds of barely-coherent “how-to” guides on trending keywords, later hiring ghostwriters and translators to scale up production.
• The Thailand Connection: The twins relocate to Thailand for cheap living while exploiting lax international tax rules.

The Grift Evolves

[47:14 – 58:03]

• Platform & Pitch: After being banned from Amazon, twins launch YouTube courses promising “publishing riches” to anyone, feeding on pandemic-era “make money from home” desperation.
  • Memorable Quote (Laci, 48:13): “They sold it at a 50% discount for $500 the day it launched… No, they made $48,000 overnight.”
• Pay-to-Play: Students are lured in with promises of passive income if they purchase add-ons: ghostwriting, keyword software, review networks, cover art, and of course the “premium” $7800 course.
• Cycle of Scamming: The core of the scam is recursive: sell the scam to other scammers, profit off their efforts, and upsell indefinitely.

AI & Marketplace Flood

[54:32 – 59:57]

• Exponential Growth: Michelsons’ business model perfected flooding the market with AI-written, low effort garbage. Revenue soars from $300k (2019) to almost $50 million (2022), partly thanks to COVID and the new “AI gold rush.”
• No Legal Recourse: The scam is “not illegal yet.” They provide a technically functional product, skirting the letter of the law (like MLMs).
  • Notable Quote (Laci, 59:37): "That’s how you get away with it. ...If I sell a friendship bracelet that cost $0.30 to make, but I sell it for $30,000? Isn’t that a scam? Yes, but technically, if somebody is willing to purchase that shitty-ass bracelet... it’s not."

5. The Aftermath – Where are They Now?

[61:32 – 65:23]

• Influencer Lifestyles: Christian and Rasmus project luxury lifestyles on social, despite their “scam” being well-known in publishing circles. They even buy “publishing.com” and control the narrative with SEO—if you google their scam, you get their own rebuttal page and funnel.

  • Memorable Quote (Laci, 65:04): “If you look up Michelson twin scam, it takes you right to publishing dot com. …They even make it look like they're reviewing themselves.”

• Big Luca’s Fate: Original scam teacher “Big Luca” tries to threaten legal action for “stealing his con,” then rebrands as “Big Luca International”—an even more audacious marketing grift.

  • Notable Quote (Laci, 67:20): “What makes you international? …He went to Mexico City one time.”

6. The Broader Problem: AI & Scam Culture

[67:35 – 70:41]

• AI Makes It Worse: AI-generated content has made these problems exponentially worse, poisoning marketplaces with garbage, and the hosts lament a world where “everything we love is getting destroyed.”
• Lack of Sympathy for Victims: Laci and guests note that while early-pandemic victims of the scam might earn some empathy, anyone falling for these grifts post-2023 is “choosing to get robbed” in the era of endless red flags.
  • Memorable Quote (Laci, 70:19): “If you want to pay $2,000 to let a long-neck Denmark man talk to you from the dark of his home, then you deserve to get robbed.”

Notable Quotes, Jokes & Moments

• On scammers’ shifting names:
  Oscar [50:49]: “Oh, there’s a new name every month. Oh, that’s totally normal and fine.”
• On ghostwriters:
  Laci [55:05]: “Their ghostwriters get hired on a freelance basis and they’re kept anonymous. So they’re not gonna go down with this. ...That don’t even look like a real lady. That looks like an AI lady to me.”
• On legal gray areas:
  Laci [59:09]: “It’s unethical, sure, but technically they’re giving a product. It’s the reason why MLMs can exist… because even though in their structure and design, they are a Ponzi scheme, because they technically do have a product…”

Takeaways & Final Thoughts

• The Michelson twins built a multi-layered scam empire: selling AI-generated junk on Amazon, then selling overpriced “get rich” courses to would-be scammers.
• They clean up online searches about their scam, funneling traffic right back into their pitch.
• AI has turbocharged this kind of grift, swamping platforms like Amazon with “garbage for profit.”
• The episode satirizes both the scammers and their victims, ultimately arguing that “buyer beware” has never been more relevant.
• Mano and Oscar also gently implicate themselves and the audience in small-time scamming, underscoring the blurred line between gaming the system and getting gamed.

Important Timestamps

• [03:41] – Shoplifting confession at Target
• [13:03] – Mano’s “musk scam” rave story
• [24:00] – “Grunger” the pup mask at the rave
• [26:33] – Introduction to the Michelson twins and “AI e-book scam”
• [33:07] – Scams before and after the AI boom; “Big Luca” origins
• [47:14] – Online course, YouTube, and monetization pivot
• [54:32] – Profit models and scaling to millions
• [59:09] – Why the scam skirts the law
• [65:04] – The twins’ SEO “scam rebuttal” funnel
• [67:35] – AI’s impact; social commentary
• [70:19] – “No pity” for late-stage scam victims

Final Plugs & Where to Find the Hosts

[71:39]

• Drag Her Podcast: Mano & Oscar’s own show about RuPaul’s Drag Race, available anywhere podcasts stream.
• Bad Drag Race: Their live comedy drag show.
• Laci Mosley:
  • All socials: @divalaci
  • Book: “Scam Goddess” (now available)
  • Upcoming tour dates (April, Texas, NYC, San Francisco)
  • Scam Goddess TikTok: Show clips and scam content

As always:

“Stay schemin’!”