Catching The Codfather | 6. It’s Your Job to Catch Me - The Big Dig Presents: Catching The Codfather

Transcript

Christopher Kimball (0:01)

Hey, it's Christopher Kimball from Milk Street Radio. Sounds like I'm bragging, and I am. We're the number one most downloaded food podcast in America. You know. Milk Street Radio travels the world in search of the very best food stories. You'll hear about smuggling eels on the black market, the secret intelligence of plants, and insider tips to eating in Paris. And every week, listeners call in with their toughest culinary mysteries. Discover a world of food stories by searching your podcast app for Mill Street Radio.

Ian Coss (0:30)

Support for Catching the Codfather comes from Rogers Fish Company, founded by Roger Berkowitz, Offering an array of New England seafood and entrees shippable anywhere in the US more@rogersfishco.com this show is supported by Odoo.

Susan Dudley (0:47)

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Ian Coss (1:17)

Let's recap the investigation into Carlos Rafael so far. In January of 2015, Carlos announced his business was for sale. In May, the IRS agents reached out, pretending to be potential buyers. And in June, they met twice to discuss the details of the business. By the end of the summer, it's clear that there's a case that Carlos is doing something illegal involving fish. What's not so clear is where all that fish is going and. And where all the money is going. So in the fall of 2015, case agent Ron Mullet instructed his undercovers to go back to Carlos once again, this time with a specific purpose.

Ron Mullet (2:01)

This money's gotta be somewhere else. I need you to get me the show me the money moment. Like, if there's nothing else that you talk to him about, he's gotta show you the money.

Ian Coss (2:10)

This meeting was in a more casual setting, a seafood restaurant just up the coast from New Bedford. Carlos had been wanting to give his buyers a real taste of what they are getting. And this would be the perfect place to do that. So everyone piled into the agent's BMW 5 Series, the sport version with the V8 engine, and went for lunch. One agent told me, I made sure to drive like a crazy Russian mobster, you know, to keep character

Paul Valent (2:37)

doing.

Summary

The Big Dig Presents: Catching The Codfather

Episode 6: “It’s Your Job to Catch Me”

Date: March 18, 2026
Host: Ian Coss (GBH News)
Key Voices: Carlos “The Codfather” Rafael, Andrew Lelling, Ron Mullet, Paul Valent, Maggie Raymond, John Bullard, others

Episode Overview

This episode is the climactic finale of season three, chronicling the elaborate federal investigation, arrest, and consequences of fishing magnate Carlos Rafael—known as “The Codfather”—as well as the ripple effects on New Bedford’s fishing port and regulatory landscape. The story unfolds from the ingenious IRS sting operation to Rafael’s conviction and its aftermath, raising profound questions: Was Carlos Rafael a folk hero battle-hardened by an unjust system, or simply a conman exploiting it? And did taking him down fix a broken industry, or merely remove its loudest rulebreaker?

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Operation “Show Me the Money”: The Sting That Broke the Codfather

The Telltale Lunch (02:01 - 06:42):
Undercover agents meet Carlos in a private room at a local seafood restaurant, with Carlos visibly comfortable and boasting about his lifestyle. When pressed about the money trail, he reveals he smuggles up to $60,000 cash per trip to Portugal—with an inside man at Logan Airport helping bypass customs.
- “He had his own wine at the restaurant. Nobody else could buy it. They only had it for him.” — Ron Mullet (02:49)
- “I got a friend at Logan Airport that can get money through.” — Carlos Rafael (04:50)
- “There was a crooked agent working inside the very same airport where the 9/11 hijackers took off from.” — Ian Coss (06:16)
The revelation of an inside job at a secure national airport creates urgency for the investigation to wrap quickly.

2. Carlos’s Business Empire: Hiding in Plain Sight

Rafael’s fraud wasn’t just simple smuggling; his operations peppered legitimate business with illegal activities—“painting” fish (mislabeling species), handing off duffel bags of cash, and leveraging a vast coast-to-coast network, including mafia-linked Fulton Fish Market buyers.
“That duffel bag of cash was the bag of jingles.” — Lenny, Undercover Agent (18:04)
Undercover agents meticulously gather evidence, including photographing falsified documents and repeatedly having Carlos explain how the system works.
“Just pretend I’m a fucking retard...explain to me word by word.” — Lenny, Undercover Agent (25:45, paraphrasing conversation with Carlos)
“We bought...so he showed us the dealer reports, he showed us the fishing vessel trip report...” — Ron Mullet (26:30)

3. The Fall: Arrest and Aftermath

The arrest (28:28 - 30:07): New Bedford is abuzz as federal agents descend in mob movie fashion. Fishermen like Paul Valent recall sudden insecurity about jobs, livelihoods, and whether the “feds” would turn on smaller players next.
“I think they had more police presence to arrest a fish buyer than when they took down El Chapo.” — Paul Valent (29:24)
Prosecutorial discretion: U.S. Attorney Andrew Lelling opts to focus on Carlos as the ringleader, not sweeping up captains or the auction house, despite evidence suggesting broader complicity.
- “Do you want every single scalp, or do you just want the key scalps? ...Carlos Rafael...they are secondary. And so the captains as a category, we just let them go.” — Andrew Lelling (30:51)
Debate over accountability: Carlos insists auction house owners were complicit. Documents and affidavits suggest they may have facilitated the fraud, but no charges ever filed.
- “If you come after me, the guy that participated with me in a scam should get nailed, too.” — Carlos Rafael (31:35)
- “They think they solved the problem. They haven’t solved shit.” — Carlos Rafael (35:27)

4. Justice or Scapegoating: Was Carlos a Lone Wolf?

Some, including John Bullard (mayor and NOAA administrator), insist Rafael was an outlier—corrupt by choice, not by circumstance.
- “There are thousands of people who earn their living in the fishing industry. ...They didn’t all turn into crooks. Only Carlos turned into the biggest crook in America.” — John Bullard (37:35)
Others, including many in the community, view Carlos’s defiance as symptomatic of a system both unjust and impossible to navigate honestly.

5. Sentencing and The Business After Carlos

In 2017, Carlos Rafael pleads guilty to multiple counts including conspiracy, tax evasion, and bulk cash smuggling.
- “He knew the consequences were going to be dire. It was the more muted Carlos Rafael.” — Andrew Lelling (40:08)
The judge denounces Rafael’s actions as self-serving, not altruistic.
- “This was a corrupt course of action from start to finish. It’s a course of action designed to benefit you, to line your pockets. That’s what it is.” — Judge, as relayed by Ian Coss (43:01)
The punishment: 46 months in prison, a lifetime ban from the industry, and a controversial decision NOT to seize his entire fleet—allowing Carlos to sell his boats and permits for ~$100 million.
- “They let him sell everything and make millions of dollars…And I’ll never forgive them for that.” — Maggie Raymond (48:47; 49:06)
- “And I walk away with over $100 million...all those assholes...will have a dream to see in a lifetime.” — Carlos Rafael (50:47)

6. Systemic Change…Or Not?

Was the “rot” truly excised? Many claim illegal fishing persists, with permits and quota consolidating under new owners—sometimes the same auction house allegedly involved in Carlos’s scams.
- “In the 10 years since his arrest, there have been other documented cases of illegal fishing out of New Bedford…” — Ian Coss (35:31)
- “If he could make out like Carlos did, ‘I would do that time standing on my hands.’” — Anonymous fisherman (61:21)
Supreme Court Angle (52:21):
The regulatory framework faces a shakeup with the Supreme Court overturning the Chevron deference doctrine, a decision spurred in part by fishermen challenging NOAA’s regulatory powers.
- “Chevron is overruled. That means agencies like NOAA and EPA will no longer enjoy the wide deference they had in the past to interpret the law and write the rules of life.” — Ian Coss (56:29)

7. Legacy: Tradition, Suspicion, and the Next Generation

The next generation: Will they fish, or is the system too broken? Paul Valent seems doubtful his grandson will follow him.
- “The way the business is today, I’d rather have him do something else.” — Paul Valent (60:08)
Carlos today hangs around the docks, unable to fish but ever-present, refusing the label “loser.”
- “Carlos is not a loser. I’ll tell you that right now…even the government...put about a business, he’s a loser. He’s not a loser, you know.” — Rodney Avila (64:35)
Rafael prefers telling his story to “the little guy” rather than big media, seeing himself as the underdog.
- “If somebody can get something out of the deal, then you give it to one person.” — Carlos Rafael (65:39)

Notable Quotes & Moments (with Timestamps)

On smuggling:
“He had one of the guys in Boston, one of those fucking agents with my friend and give him the money before I go through security.” — Carlos Rafael (04:57) “This was a turning point in the investigation.” — Ian Coss (05:46)
On regulatory enforcement:
“It is very, very rare to have an individual prosecuted by the federal government three times and in the same place…And all of his cases were related to his fishing business.” — Andrew Lelling (10:42)
On business partners and complicity:
“The auction was just as involved as I was in this deal. I’ve paid them over a million dollars in cash…That operation could have not been done if they were not part of this scam.” — Carlos Rafael (33:10) “I know there were people who wanted him to have more punishment…But the main thing is that he’s never going to be part of the fishing industry again, and that his boats will continue to fish and create jobs, but this time, they’ll do it following the law.” — John Bullard (49:26)
On legacy and system failure:
“They think they solved the problem. They haven’t solved shit.” — Carlos Rafael (35:27) “If you are someone who believes in expertise, who believes in science, who believes in procedure and rules and regulation as a force to make the world more just, then you should also look long and close at the friction points where those things actually touch people’s lives.” — Ian Coss (60:59)

Timestamps for Key Segments

Sting operation and money laundering details: 01:17 – 06:42
Cash handoffs, Michael the buyer, “bag of jingles”: 13:07 – 19:12
Surveillance and airport smuggling: 21:32 – 24:39
Gathering physical evidence, the dance sheets: 25:02 – 27:46
Dramatic arrest: 28:25 – 29:41
Prosecutorial decisions & auction house controversy: 30:51 – 33:50
Sympathy and skepticism from the fishing community: 35:27 – 37:35
Sentencing & aftermath: 40:08 – 43:54
Debate over fleet and permit forfeiture: 45:18 – 49:03
$100M windfall from asset sale: 50:09 – 50:47
Supreme Court and Chevron doctrine: 52:21 – 56:29
Legacy and the next generation: 59:40 – 60:08
Carlos’s enduring presence on the docks: 63:48 – 64:35
Carlos on why he shared his story: 65:39 – 67:02

Closing Reflections

The episode closes by underscoring the ambiguity left behind—on the one hand, a system that allowed Carlos Rafael to profit handsomely even in disgrace; on the other, a community wrestling with systemic failures that one man’s downfall did not fix. With new legal battles on the horizon, shifting regulatory powers, and the boats that once defined New Bedford sold, scrapped, or acquired by familiar names, the fishing port’s fate remains as contested as ever. The question lingers: Did they catch the Codfather, or just the most audacious symptom of a much bigger problem?