← Scrolling 2 Death
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Foreign.
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Welcome to Scrolling to Death, everybody. We are very lucky to be joined today by a child protection and advocacy expert, also executive director of World Childhood Foundation USA, Dr. Mary Polito. Hi, Mary.
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Hi. Thank you, Nikki. It's a pleasure to be here today. I'm really thrilled.
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B
Me too. You know, let's learn about the World Childhood foundation first, which I was lucky enough to partner with for a spring luncheon a couple months ago. Time flies. But tell me about World Childhood foundation and what you guys focus on.
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A
Absolutely. World Childhood foundation is one of the few foundations in the world whose sole focus is to eliminate or prevent child sexual abuse and exploitation, both in person and online. We just hit our 25th year anniversary, funded by Her Majesty Queen Sylvia of Sweden and now Princess Madeleine. Her daughter and Queen Sylvia work throughout the world on this issue, advocating for change, for laws, for programs that will stop child sex abuse and exploitation, and programs that will help survivors of it heal. And we really are looking at sort of three main areas. One is online protections for children, which we'll talk more about today. And then the other is we're looking at all types of. Of prevention programs for children. And we're not just focused on sort of what people think of when they think of prevention as the traditional prevention program geared towards children and parents and teachers, but we are also funding initiatives for perpetrator prevention for adults and initiatives for children with problematic sexual behaviors. Because we're looking at this as a public health crisis. Child sexual abuse has reached epidemic proportions. It's a crisis. So we are looking at also not just funding the need for children to be protected from it and learn the red flags and learn what grooming looks like and help the teachers and the parents and concerned family members and adults help protect children. But we need to stop the influx of perpetrators.
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Okay.
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So we also fund research in those two areas, which I think is critically important to increasing the knowledge in the field as to what works, what doesn't work, so that we can try to stop the problem on protecting children, but at the same way stopping the offenders from offending. Yeah.
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B
Thank you. That's incredible. And you know, to back up even further, you also served as executive director for the first child protection agency in the world called the New York Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Children. So you've been in this a while, and I often think about how drastically the harms to children have, have changed, the threats, the spaces, the addition of online harms. So can you talk a little bit about what stands out to you about the evolution of these Threats to our kids?
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Absolutely. First, I just wanna reiterate some very basic facts, but child abuse affects every age, gender, background of children. No one is sort of immune from sadly being subjected to child sexual abuse or exploitation. You know, infants, toddlers to teenagers, boys and girls, every gender. Certain populations are at higher risk. LBG plus children, children that are homeless, children that are in foster care, children with disabilities are considered at higher risk, but sort of across the board, sadly, you know, it's reached epidemic proportions. I think another thing that I would just like people to understand is that when I grew up I could go home and if I was safe at home, you know, it was mainly perpetration was happen in person. There was no such thing as cell phones and iPads. And yes, there were computers, but it wasn't something that children had. So children were considered safe. You played board games, you played with, you rode your bikes, you played with other children in the neighborhood. And now the threats to children are very different. They're online, they're constant. They're on the cell phone, they're through the iPad, they're through games, they're on the compute. And the types of child sexual abuse have also changed. We're looking at extortion now, sexual extortion, financial extortion, we're looking at child sex trafficking. All of the AI, the deep fake nude problems, the images that are being circulated by children, we're looking at children innocently, you know, not even understanding that they're being groomed online. And then the worst happens to them. So the explosion of child sex abuse online has grown exponentially. I just read a study from the University of Edinburgh in Scotland where they said more than 300 million children a year are going to experience some type of online child sexual abuse and exploitation. Oh my God. So, and the, you know, and just another fact that I think is important to realize is that the FBI has also said that in any given day there are 500,000 offenders online. And that's any given day.
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B
Yeah.
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So in the past, how things have changed is you had your child inside, your child was, you know, you considered your child safe, and now your child's inside, but they're on their phone or their iPad or gaming. But the realization is that there are 500,000 offenders trying to get to children every single day.
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B
Right. How often are those online predatory, you know, experiences turning into real world threats? I just read this morning, you know, a Snapchat predator targeted a 15 year old on Snapchat and they met at the park and it turned into like an in person sexual encounter. And so are you seeing a high percentage of that or is it, are they staying online?
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When I started really looking into this issue maybe 10, 12 years ago, what they were reporting was a lower percentage of offenders who were actually making sort of the switch to, from going online to, to going in person. And now what some of the research is saying is that it's as high as like 40% to 60% of offenders that are online are actually trying to make contact with children in person. And there's one study that I found, really, I think it's important for your parents to sort of understand what's being the research on offenders. And there was a major study published last year from a group in Finland. Okay. It was called the Redirection Project, that was the name of the study. But they obtained survey data anonymously online on the darknet from 30,000 offenders. Oh my.
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B
Okay.
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They were able to get this data and it, to me, it sort of made a light bulb go off on. Okay. So there. If they're saying this is what happened to them, these are more steps we can try to figure out how to protect children. Like 50% of the people that answered the survey said that they were first exposed to sexual abuse materials accidentally online. They weren't searching for them, they simply popped up in their feed. And the majority of them, 70% said they were under the age of 18 when they first experienced child sex abuse material. Wow.
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B
All right. So these algorithms are grooming them into becoming child predators.
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That's, I think that's one way you have to look at it. Wow. Because they were not searching for it. It came up and then they continued to search for it and they then took part of, took part of the survey. They were also searching primarily for girls, CSAM between the girls, the ages of 4 to 13. And they wanted to, many of them, 50% said they wish they could stop, but they only, only it was a small percentage. I think 25 to 28% said they, they wanted to, they were going to seek help. And then 40% said they sought contact with a child after viewing CSAM. It's changed. But parents, you know, what it comes down to is that parents really need to understand that these offenders are grooming children and they want to see these children, they want to get their hands on these children. So we have to take more steps to be involved in what the parents knowledge is. When I was at that former agency that you were talking about, the New York Society for Prevention of Cruelty to Children, I helped design a Nationwide poll. This is probably back in around 21, 22. And the poll was on parents perception of online child sex abuse and exploitation. And the majority of parents said, we do not feel equipped to figure out and protect our children online. You know, help. I mean, basically what they were saying was help. It's, it's. The children know more than we do. I don't have time. You know, they don't have time that they don't understand the programs, that they think their children are safe, but they're not sure. And then another point out of that survey that I remember was that they really wish the schools would take a bigger role in like, mandating online education for children because they didn't feel equipped to do it.
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Yeah, I wish that every day because it feels like, you know, with my school I had to request an online safety training. And then half the time the man that presented talked about how great chat GBT was and showed us how to use it. And I was like, this is not online safety training. So there's a definite gap there. And parents do need help. I mean, this is overwhelming what we're talking about so far. And parents might be like, how do I even deal with this? Or they might be like, that's not going to happen to my child and my child is smarter than that. They'll notice it.
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We.
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Or I'm going to protect them. They're not on those platforms. But those platforms where kids are getting targeted are the ones our kids are spending time on, right? The, the Roblox, the social media platforms.
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If you, you look at the national center for Missing and Exploited Children, that's a great website for parents. First of all, they have like a whole parent guide on breaking down all the different types of exploitation. They also have sort of like, tip. This is how you start to talk to your children about this if you're stuck and you don't have the language. So I like that. But, but the other thing that they do do is they break down, where are all the cyber TIP reports coming from and what platforms are they coming from so that parents can, you know, go online and just say, oh, look at all the ones that are coming in from Facebook, or look at the ones that are coming in from different places. Sadly, there was a decline in 24 of like 6, I think it went. It dropped from like 36 million cybertips down to 29 million. And we didn't think we would see that drop because the reported act was put into place. But it's still an alarming number. And Parents need to be aware that it's through the gaming systems, it's through, you know, the TikTok and the Snapchat and the Facebook and all of the platforms that, that you wouldn't necessarily think. I think parents still think it's all on the dark net and sadly it's not. So they have to sort of be aware of that and go on Thorne's website. They've got a great website too. They have an amazing parent guide.
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B
Okay, okay. For children and I'll include those resources in the episode notes. But for some tips today, obviously parents first step would be don't let your children on the platforms where kids are getting targeted. But kids are smart, they find their way around it. They go on, on their school issued device or they use their friend's device. And so I think one of the most important things, and you probably agree, is the conversations and educating your children on what to look out for and how to handle it. And so what tips do you have for parents today that they can take away regarding those conversations?
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You know, I think the most important thing is talking to your children is to keep the communication going, keep the communication open. You know, what are they doing online? Who are they playing with? Who are their friends? How did they make these friends? Do they, you know, the other thing too is that, you know, children really believe that people that they've never met in person now are their friends. And I think parents need to understand and stay away from sort of the stranger danger in a way regarding who they're playing the games with. Because for the children rather than, I think frame it as these are strangers, they can be harmful to you. It's probably better to say who are your online friends and what, you know, tell, tell me about your conversations and then to talk to them more about like the red flag behaviors.
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Yeah.
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That they should be looking for. Right. Because you know, when you, when you. Again when you look, I'm, I'm, I'm reading the research all the time. A lot of children really feel that these online friends are their close friends. We don't see them as being strangers. So yeah, parents are in the mentality, you don't know them, they're a stranger. But the children are more like, no, I do know them, they're my friends, I play with them online. So you have to sort of get, get that language sort of together.
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Okay.
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I think you need to talk about what grooming looks like and how it can happen and that they, you know, keep that again, let, let them know if someone is all of a sudden offering them gifts or wants them to go to a chat them from being online to offline, that those are behaviors that are dangerous or risky and that the parents want to know about them right away. So I would say teaching them about the whole grooming issue I think is really important. Setting boundaries with your children. There has to be a time when they're not on their phones, when the phones aren't allowed in the bedroom. When you're going to sleep, you're going to sleep. You do not have your iPad and your phone in your bed with you when you go to sleep. You had said this very clearly in the luncheon that it's really important to say it's okay to say no.
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Yeah.
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That no, you don't need your phone all the time or your iPad or. I really admire what you are doing by having. No, this is not what we do in this home. And this is why.
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Yeah. And it's to protect you. And I know it's hard sometimes, especially when they get a little older and all their friends are on social media and you've just, maybe you've decided not to let them on until 16. And you, you can acknowledge that and tell your child, I know that it's hard to not be or not be on Roblox at 8 like all your friends are, but we're trying to keep you safe. And I will help you connect with your. With your friends in other ways. But it's okay to be confident in telling them no and sticking to that, but like explaining to them why. And they may not be happy about it, but they'll thank you one day. Because that's what I keep hearing is these, these Gen Z kids who they're either like, I wish I wasn't on there so early, or I'm so glad my parents had parental controls and limits.
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Your messages were heard loud and clear at the luncheon. I did speak with someone after the luncheon who immediately went home and went onto Roblox. And she's. Her children will, I don't think, be on Roadblocks for a long time to come. Oh, good. Because she actually saw all of the horrific dangers that you were. That you were referencing.
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Yeah. And that's the thing. Once you go on and check, just go on and use it yourself for 10, 20 minutes.
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Right.
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And you'll be like, wait a minute. I didn't realize. I didn't realize. And that's okay. That's understandable because it's marketed to children, so why would there be that type of thing on there. But it is, unfortunately, and that's the hard truth that we have to cut it out at, at these young ages and have these conversations. And I'm so glad you talked about the signs of grooming. Moving kids to another platform is a huge one, you know, telling them to keep. If anyone tells you a secret that you have to keep from your parents. I had an interview with a grooming expert, Anna Sonoda, and she has a book called Duck Duck Groom that I, that I really recommend. And for you too, Mary. It breaks it down really clearly for parents. What do you think about the parental monitoring services? Because I know there's a new one called Game Safe that parents can put on the gaming platforms that can send alerts if there's grooming type conversations going on or cyberbullying. Do you think that we can rely on some parental controls to help us?
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If you're very tech savvy and this is what you're comfortable doing, that that might be helpful. But I have to go back on what I saw in that national poll that parents were just saying, I'm overwhelmed. It's too much. And the other thing that for parents that aren't extremely tech savvy is things change so quickly that what they're learning one day they may have to alter a little bit, you know, in the next month or so. So there's. I think for some people it might, they might be good resources. But I think for many parents who are coming home from work or, you know, busy with more than one child or trying to juggle, you know, a million things at once, as many par. I would say they should probably look at them and see if they could keep them on, keep them, you know, put them on and use some type of parental monitoring. But I really think that keeping the children off the phone and talking to them is important. And one other point that I think is really critical for parents to understand is that it is never the child's fault.
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B
Yes, good.
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And I never. A child is never responsible for their own abuse. There is manipulation and coercion that children are unable to understand and process going on. And that parents also have to understand. I mean, you know, they're children. And that's why I think parents have to also protect the children and keep them off these devices as long as humanly possible. When they're young, the little ones, they just can't possibly comprehend what's going on. When children are, you know, under the age of 10, their brains are not even, you know, your brain isn't fully developed till you're in your mid-20s.
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Right.
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And even when they're. They're the teenage years, you're. You're programmed to sort of push back and take risks and say, oh, this won't happen to me, or I've got this.
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Yeah, yeah.
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And that's not necessarily so, but I think sometimes parents will say, well, I told them, don't do that, so we've got this covered. And then the parents are upset, which then adds to the child's guilt. So if there was another message I could send out to parents is it doesn't mean what you're telling your children to be safe is not getting through. It's that they're children.
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Yeah, yeah. And the impulse control is not there.
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That's right. That's right. But that it's never their fault. And I think another really key message is that. That we'll get through this together. That, okay, mistakes were made, but we're gonna get through this together. And thank you for telling me. I'm here for you. When you look at the. All the families that you were talking. We were talking about earlier and the survivor families, very often when a child commits suicide or something horrific like that happens to a child after being online, they probably. We were thinking, there's no way out, there's no way out. And so parents, I think if they can just reinforce there is a way out. We're in this together. We're going to get through this. That's probably the best way to go about handling a disclosure from your child or however you find out about it after something happens online.
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B
Yeah. And this is so relevant because you shared, you know, 300 million children every year are encountering some type of online sexual. Child sexual abuse encounter. And it's something that the kids are going to be really scared to tell you about or may not even know that it was wrong, may be convinced that it was okay. And that's something that I hear over and over again, is to. For parents to take a deep breath, no matter what, the kids are going to encounter something online that is scary to you and alarming to you, but taking that deep breath and not reacting out of anger at the child, no matter what they may have shared or said, that is so important, because then when something worse happens, they'll come to you and tell you. And a lot of this is on parents right now because there's kind of a lack of laws and legislation to help protect our kids online. Can you give us some advice on what support we have as Parents. And we talked about some of the parent guides already, but anything else related to mental health support, law enforcement, any, any legislation that can help us out through this, this struggle.
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A
Ryan Ellis was on the panel with you. So he gave us some, you know, just, I think, good tips overall. But there was one thing that he said that really resonated with me was about parents having the talk about keeping children safe the same way they do about drugs, the same way they do about everything from crossing the street when you're a child all the way up to drugs and alcohol and firearms safety. So I think that that was. Is really important for parents to understand. The other thing too, appearance can get involved legislatively.
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B
Yeah. Thank you.
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Should they, should they choose to. You know, there, there are websites. In fact, I did write down a few. Hold on a minute, let me just grab this. Oh, wait, there's a few things I wrote down. First of all, what parents should be doing is watching your podcasts.
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B
Okay, thank you, Mary.
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That's. That's number one. Because they will learn a lot. And everyone likes to listen to podcasts. So I have down on Nikki's podcast should be listening to them. And then the, you know, NCMEC national center for Missing Exploited Children, Thorne has an amazing parent guide. The FBI also has a great parent guide.
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B
Okay.
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A
But legislatively, there was a website called enoughabuse.org where they actually have a map of the United States that's interactive. So you can put in your state and you can look at some of the state laws and what they are criminalizing AI and CSAM and what are the states doing or not doing. So I think that's really important. The Kids Online Safety Act, I think, is another one that would really require much more of the social media platforms and other online services to take, really take charge of protecting children that are online. They should find out more about that. It's called KOSA K O S A Kids Online Safety Act. Another item that Childhood is funding, and we're going to have the full research up on our website in September, is called out of the Shadows Index.
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B
Okay.
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And the out of the Shadows Index Index, we're funding the Economist IMPACT in London to look at all 50 states in the United States and look at their laws on protecting children from child sex abuse and exploitation, both online and in person. They are ranking every state. We've already done 28 states. We've just finished the 50 we're going to announce and have all the results up September. Sadly, the majority of the states received a grade of F. Oh, God. They looked at 170 indicators, but parents will be able to go to their state and click on it and look at all the legislation that's protecting children or not protecting children that their state has and then be able to talk. We're also going to have an interactive piece where they can find their, who they need to talk to in the legislature so that they can then say, what's going on here? Why, you know, why wasn't this bill passed? Why aren't teachers in schools receiving training on child sex abuse identification and reporting? So it's really, in my mind that's going to be a key tool for parents, for advocates, for lawmakers. And then the other thing that, you know, we're meeting with legislators as we put out this information, but we're also giving them model legislation. Legislation from other states.
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B
Yeah.
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We're not just saying here's the problem. We're saying, well, here's a problem, but here's how Delaware solved that problem. So maybe you can now take this model legislation and try to do more with it.
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B
Okay.
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But I, I do think again, sometimes parents want to be part of something bigger and these, these movements to try to draw attention and change legisl and protest in front of social media companies there. It's all making a difference.
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B
Yes.
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Ten years ago this wouldn't have happened. Five years ago this wouldn't have happened.
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B
Yeah, agree.
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A
So we're sort of reaching a point now where again, I think everyone should be talking about this to, you know, as it was said at the spring lunch and that you were participant, go home and talk to one person about this. I say go home and talk to 10 people about it.
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B
Yeah, yeah.
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A
Right. Because that is what will make change. You know, we're reaching that tipping point where we've got to do more to protect our children.
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B
Yeah. And parents reach out all the time. Like, what more can I do? And there is so much that you can do, whether it is just talk to someone at the school, pickup line about this and get on the same page, make a pact with them that you're all not going to give your kids access to certain things until a certain age or if at all. But then that next step of contacting your elected officials and asking them what they're doing related to this topic, and you're making it so easy. I was. You answered all my questions and kind of made that through line of what's the, what's the problem in their state specifically? What are the gaps? Here's who to contact here's what to send them. Here's a bill that they could propose that could solve the problem. That's incredible resources for parents and making it really easy because it's overwhelming. Even me coming into this a year and a half, two years ago with very, very little knowledge of the legislative process. Like it can be overwhelming. And there's words used that you don't know. Thank you for creating and investing in all of that for parents. I do want to ask lastly related to legal action, law enforcement, if this something happens to your child, if your child is contacted by some a predator online, at what point should the parents let law enforcement know and how important is it to do that?
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A
It's very one, it's, it's very important to let law enforcement know to. The other thing that they should do is make sure they try to save every child thing.
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B
Yes. Screenshots.
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A
Sometimes children are, you know, they, they just say okay, let me, let me get rid of this before my, my parents see it or whatever. I, I want it gone. And, and we.
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B
You.
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A
You want them to save everything. Another thing I was, as I said, I had a meeting with the National Children's alliance yesterday and the. They oversee all the child advocacy centers in the United States. Well the ch. Many of those child advocacy compacts with the FBI. So that when the FBI when these cases are reported and I would say they should report them through the cyber tip line.
- [31:29]
B
Yeah. At ncmec. So that'll be.
- [31:32]
A
That definitely should be done. They can call lock, they can call, you know, their local law enforcement, but they should also report through NCMEC and then they should. I would contact their local child advocacy center. There's over. There's like 960 of them in the United States right now. So you will find one in your state and many of them have the relationship with the FBI. So that you know, and you need to do that because you, you want to protect your children. There's images or videos you want to use Take it Down by NCMEC to try to get those things offline. You want to try to hold the offenders and accountable so that they're not out there doing this to more children. And you know, you want to protect your child and stop this victimization from reoccurring.
- [32:28]
B
Yeah. And I think it's important it's all anonymous. Right. So your child as a minor, you're not blasting them, you know, out in the public on this. And then also, even if it didn't end up being, you know, traumatizing or something for Your child it a big deal. You may be like, oh, I caught it early. That predator is targeting dozens of other kids. So it's really important to report them and do take these steps to protect other children too. And so I know a lot of parents will hesitate because they don't want to re. Traumatize their child. Maybe their child has to have a conversation with law enforcement about it. And that's scary. But remind your family members that we're doing this to protect your child and other children. And it's really important.
- [33:14]
A
And that. And again, the message to parents, you know, the children are not alone in this. You're in this together. It's never the child's fault.
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B
Yes, exactly.
- [33:25]
A
I think that that will help calm the child's anxiety if they have it, or their guilt. But also just knowing that they have the support of the parents and that the parents are doing something to stop. Stop the exploitation from occurring to other children is also, I think, empowering in a way too. So we definitely encourage that as soon as possible. But again, it's sort of like. And another message that I think put out to tell your children is very often this extortion could turn into financial extortion. Do not pay. You know, tell your children, if somebody wants money, you come to me. You do not pay. I mean, there's just, you know, messages like that, that if you keep reinforcing those things with your children, they will, they will understand them.
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B
Yeah.
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A
And, and they will say, okay, wait, this is, this is something mom or dad told me I should look out for. I think I better tell them and keep that communication going. It's not just, you know, I, I say teachable moments. If you have the, the news on and something comes up, up. What would you do if this happened? Do you know anyone that has happened to. You know, I think that that's one of the safety. You know, if parents are just approaching this in not a scary or threatening way, but in a safety way. My job is to protect you and take care of you. My role is to keep you safe now. And I think sending out those safety messages will one bring children comfort. But we'll also say, oh, that's not safe. I better go talk to mom or d. Dad. And that's what they want.
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B
Yeah. Say it so much that they're like, oh, Mom, I know. You know, then you know, you're saying it enough. That's right. Right.
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A
Okay.
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B
Is there anything that we didn't cover? There's so many resources I have to include in this episode. But anything you wanted to make sure parents take away today, the other thing
- [35:29]
A
that, that is important for parents to understand is that if they're concerned, you know, going back to the other end of the. Of the scale about their children's behavior, there are supports. And I would say also call the local child advocacy center, because sometimes they may not be. Their children may have problematic sexual behavior. And as a nation, we're still not really wanting to talk about that end of the spectrum. And we really need to, because we need to stop. Stop the behavior and get the children support they need. And when you look at the research and Elizabeth Le Tourneau, who's a colleague of mine, and we've actually funded some of her programs, she works extensively with youth with problematic sexual behavior. And if you can get children the support they need early on, the vast majority of these behaviors can be excluded. Pushed.
- [36:33]
B
Yeah. And problematic sexual behavior. I mean, I've had teachers tell me, like, in class, like, boys, young boys will make, like, grunting, moaning noises, and they got it from some pornographic material they were served. And then everyone's copying them, but don't know what they're doing. And so it's things like as innocent as that, but. And then it, you know, gets worse from there. But this is something that's pretty common.
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A
Yeah. And. And again, if you go back to that study I referenced, the majority of people that were offenders innocently came across child sex abuse material when they were not looking for it.
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B
Right.
- [37:11]
A
And then you have to think, what. What impact did that have on the child? And the other, you know, sad thing is that as we know, pornography has become increasingly more and more sadistic and violent.
- [37:24]
B
Yeah.
- [37:25]
A
And children are seeing that and being shocked by that. And we really just need to find ways to keep them as safe as possible, keep them offline, talk to them about coming to them, to parents if they see something like this.
- [37:43]
B
Yeah. A lot of times I'll hear, especially dads, be like, the kids are gonna watch the porn. Boys are gonna watch porn. At some point, it's fine. Like, it's just part of, you know, life. And I just wanna say, you know, try to explain to them them the violence and incestual stuff that's getting served to children and what that does to their brain development and dulling that prefrontal cortex so that they constantly need more and more heightened experiences. And that's what can lead them down a path to becoming a child predator, is their brain is so dulled to the content that they're seeing that they need More and more and more. So this makes sense from the conversations that I've had had with neuroscientists and people that understand the brain development side of it.
- [38:30]
A
That's right. You're, you're, you've hit the nail on the head, Nikki. Absolutely. You know what, what we're seeing is one, it's the images or videos or whatever it is, they're more graphic, they're more violent, they're sadistic. But they're also giving children a very unreal sort of mindset said of what healthy sex is that they think, oh, this is. This is what sex is and it's not.
- [38:58]
B
Yeah.
- [38:59]
A
It's the exact opposite of what healthy sexual relationships should be.
- [39:04]
B
Yes.
- [39:05]
A
So. So it goes back again with keep them off children.
- [39:10]
B
I mean, I was. And just to close out that convo, I was just reading a book called the Tech Exit by Claire Morell. It's a new book. And she was talking about a study or survey of young teens. And the girls were asked what they think is normal about a sexual encounter. And they said they think it's normal to be choked and to be controlled and all of these kind of violent things. And that's a teenager talking about what they think is normal about a sexual encounter. And so these exposures to pornography, whether it be a porn site or just literally all of the porn that is on social media right now, it is not safe. It's not good for their brain development and for setting them up for success at a healthy relationship one day.
- [39:51]
A
So.
- [39:52]
B
So we have to right back to keeping them off of it, but also having the conversations and make sure they know, they know what's safe and what's normal. And we have to have those sex. Sex talks that maybe our parents didn't have with us. Cause we were able to figure it out without all of this bad stuff coming at us.
- [40:09]
A
That's right. And there's another website that I was on recently, looking through. It was called Internet matters.org but they had an interesting sort of quick read for parents on how to talk to your kids about porn pornography. Okay, good. And what to do.
- [40:26]
B
Yeah.
- [40:26]
A
Because back to your point, there's been two research studies that I read recently on college age women. And sadly it was the, the percentages were outrageous. It was something like over 40% said that during sex they had recently been choked, you know, or hit or in or some other type of violence done to them. And that that was just. And going back to your point, people repeat what they see, what they think is normal. And we've, we've got to stop it. You know, it's, it's, it's just reached a sort of, in my mind, a break point where we have to say this. We have to protect our children. This is unacceptable. We have to hold platforms accountable. We have to try to stop the public health crisis with adults who are perpetrating with, with youth who are developing behaviors. And we have to teach children and, and teachers and parents and concerned adults how to surround the, the children with, with love and care and, you know, so that, that they feel safe and coming forward if something happens to them. Yeah, but it's, it's child sexual abuses. Prevent. Preventable. Now that's the thought I'd like, I think, to leave you with. It is. It is preventable. And we all have to take part of the solution to stop it, whether that's working with your children all the way up to contacting the local politicians or the federal, federal legislators saying, enough is enough. This has got to stop. But we can, we can all do something to change this. It is preventable.
- [42:10]
B
Thank you. And I hope that parents feel heavily resourced after this episode. I'm going to include a million links in the episode notes. But also knowing that it's not all on us. There is lots of work being done to put pressure on the companies and on lawmakers to help support us, but that we also need parents voices in that fight. And that, I think, is what's making a difference in the last year or two in pushing through legislation is parent voices and sharing our stories and our struggles. And so to Mary, thank you and your team for your tireless advocacy and your work protecting children. There's really nothing more important to me. And parents everywhere I know are grateful to you. So thank you so much for this conversation.
- [42:50]
A
It's my pleasure. One, it's an honor to work for childhood. This foundation will stop at nothing to try to find new, innovative ways to protect children. But I also want to thank you for your podcast and for putting, putting so much information out there in such an easily digestible way that parents and others that are just concerned about children and their lives can access it. So thank you, Nikki.
- [43:15]
B
Thank you, Mary. I appreciate that.