60. The Authenticity of Elphaba (with Laurel Harris)

Summary

Podcast Summary: Sentimental Men – Episode 60: The Authenticity of Elphaba (with Laurel Harris)

Podcast Information:

• Title: Sentimental Men
• Host/Author: Broadway Podcast Network
• Description: Quincy Brown and Kevin Bianchi discuss and passionately celebrate their favorite women in musical theatre.
• Episode: 60. The Authenticity of Elphaba (with Laurel Harris)
• Release Date: September 1, 2024

---

Introduction

In the 60th episode of Sentimental Men, hosts Quincy Brown and Kevin Bianchi delve deep into the multifaceted portrayal of Elphaba from the iconic musical Wicked. Joining them is the esteemed actress Laurel Harris, a seasoned Elphaba who has graced both national tours and Broadway productions of the show. The conversation navigates through Laurel's extensive career, her personal connection to the role, and her interpretations that bring a fresh authenticity to Elphaba.

Guest Introduction: Laurel Harris

Timestamp: [16:45]

Quincy and Kevin warmly welcome Laurel Harris, highlighting her extensive history with Wicked. They recount Laurel's journey from her debut in the second national tour in 2011 to her current role as an Alphabet standby and fill-in lead on Broadway. Her impressive resume includes stints in Broadway productions like Evita, In Transit, and Jagged Little Pill, showcasing her versatility and dedication to her craft.

Notable Quote:

Quincy Brown: "Laurel Harris is like one of these Elphabas who've been around reliably forever. She's just one of those names."

Laurel's Personal Connection to Wicked

Timestamp: [18:35]

Laurel shares a heartfelt story about her first encounter with Wicked. As a young performer, she attended the show during her Christmas visits to New York, which left a profound impact on her. Witnessing Idina Menzel's performance of Elphaba inspired her to pursue a career in musical theatre.

Notable Quote:

Laurel Harris: "I saw Wicked in that moment because I really do believe that it was the final indicator for me that this was the path that I was meant to take... Elphaba's lyric, 'Until I try, I'll never know,' is something that I live by."

Navigating Career Choices and Family Support

Timestamp: [22:14]

Laurel discusses the challenges of choosing between a career in medicine—a path supported by her family—and her passion for performing arts. Her family's initial hesitations eventually turned into unwavering support as they witnessed her dedication and success on stage.

Notable Quote:

Laurel Harris: "They have always been so incredibly supportive of me... They're the biggest Wicked fans. They know all the cues."

Balancing Parenthood and Performing

Timestamp: [28:29]

Laurel opens up about balancing her demanding role as Elphaba with motherhood. Discussing the logistical challenges of touring with a toddler, she emphasizes the importance of support systems, such as her husband's role and the assistance of fellow cast members.

Notable Quote:

Laurel Harris: "I have a toddler with me on the road, and he got to know the cast as his friends. He practices his cackle daily. It's pretty cool."

Evolving Interpretation of Elphaba

Timestamp: [46:42]

A significant portion of the discussion centers on how Laurel’s portrayal of Elphaba has evolved over the years. She reflects on the depth and humanity she brings to the character, moving beyond the stereotypical portrayal to infuse Elphaba with wit, humor, and vulnerability.

Notable Quotes:

Laurel Harris: "The thing that has always drawn me to Elphaba is her activism and her fight for marginalized communities... Through the years, her humanity has grown, making her more relatable."

Laurel Harris: "Elphaba has such a wit and dry humor. A lot of times people assume Glinda is the funny one, but Elphaba has a lot of humor, which humanizes her and makes her relatable."

Challenges and Growth in Performing Elphaba

Timestamp: [25:15]

Laurel recounts her initial struggles during auditions for Wicked, including a botched audition that nearly deterred her from pursuing the role. However, through perseverance and mentorship from fellow cast members like Janine Tesoris, she overcame these challenges and successfully secured her place in the production.

Notable Quote:

Laurel Harris: "I was so nervous that I completely bombed the audition... But through support and continued effort, I was able to release all that anxiety and secure the role."

Insights on the Production and Community

Timestamp: [54:00]

Laurel emphasizes the strong community within Wicked, noting how the production thrives on the fresh perspectives each actress brings to the role. She praises the show's management for encouraging individuality, ensuring that each portrayal remains vibrant and authentic.

Notable Quote:

Laurel Harris: "It's important because then it doesn't ever become stale. Wicked continues to make it alive and real because they're not expecting you to be a carbon copy of anyone else."

Laurel’s Reflections on Performance

Timestamp: [46:56]

The conversation delves into Laurel's favorite songs from Wicked, both vocally and in terms of character connection. She highlights "Defying Gravity" as a moment of vulnerability and connection, and while she finds "No Good Deed" vocally challenging, it remains a personal favorite for its emotional depth.

Notable Quotes:

Laurel Harris: "'Defying Gravity' is such a joyful moment to sing. It connects me to the youth of the world, channeling the next generation of artists through that song."

Laurel Harris: "Out of 'Wizard and I,' 'No Good Deed,' and 'Defying Gravity,' 'Wizard and I' is the easiest song for me to sing vocally."

Conclusion and Final Thoughts

As the episode wraps up, Laurel expresses her gratitude for the enduring relationship she has with Wicked. Her ability to continuously grow within the role of Elphaba, coupled with the support from her family and the Wicked community, underscores the authenticity she brings to the character.

Notable Quote:

Laurel Harris: "It feels like coming home. Elphaba is such a part of me, and I'm a part of her. I'm so grateful for this role and the opportunities I've been given over the years."

---

Key Takeaways:

• Laurel Harris’s Journey: From her first encounter with Wicked as a young fan to becoming a principal Elphaba on Broadway, Laurel’s journey is a testament to passion and perseverance.
• Evolving Character Portrayal: Laurel emphasizes the importance of infusing Elphaba with layers of humanity, humor, and activism, moving beyond one-dimensional portrayals.
• Community and Support: The strong sense of community within Wicked, coupled with familial support, plays a crucial role in Laurel’s sustaining career.
• Balancing Roles and Parenthood: Laurel adeptly balances her demanding role with motherhood, highlighting the significance of a supportive network.

---

Additional Notable Quotes with Timestamps:

• Dealing with Anxiety:

  Laurel Harris [30:27]: "I will never want to say easier because Elphaba is an incredibly difficult and challenging role... some of the pressure is taken off because I've done the show so many times."

• Impact of Life Experiences:

  Laurel Harris [27:08]: "After having my child, everything changes. My perspective shifts, making my connection to Elphaba deeper and more grounded."

• Authenticity in Performance:

  Laurel Harris [52:43]: "Elphaba has so many layers. Finding that balance between staying true to the character and bringing my own experiences into the role is what makes each performance unique."

---

Recommendations for Listeners:

If you’re passionate about musical theatre and intrigued by the behind-the-scenes journeys of iconic roles, this episode is a must-listen. Laurel Harris’s insights provide a nuanced understanding of portraying Elphaba with authenticity and emotional depth, making it invaluable for aspiring actors and theatre enthusiasts alike.

Transcript

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Hi, y'all. This is Kristin Chenoweth. Hi, I'm Gloria Stefan. This is Sara Bareilles. Hi, I'm Patti LuPone. This is Lin Manuel Miranda.

[Gloria Estefan]

You're listening to the Broadway Podcast Network. This episode is brought to you by Allstate. Some people just know they could save hundreds on car insurance by checking Allstate First.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

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[Gloria Estefan]

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[Kristin Chenoweth]

So you're getting hungry. Really hungry. Head to Jack in the Box and pick up a Smash Jack. It's a juicy, delicious smashed burger topped with cheese, pickles, grilled onions, and boss sauce. And it's now available on Sourdough. The Smash Jack. Only a Jack in the Box. Order one on the Jack app today. It's so funny to say this. Cause I have a. You know, I have a 2 year old now and I'm like, oh, my God, I get to Wicked. And I'm like, oh, I just have to play Elphaba. Oh, thank God. This is so much easier.

[Sara Bareilles]

I'm Quincy.

[Gloria Estefan]

And I'm Kevin.

[Sara Bareilles]

And this is Sentimental Men.

[Gloria Estefan]

We're here to talk and maybe scream about our favorite women in musical theater.

[Sara Bareilles]

Hi, Kevin.

[Gloria Estefan]

Hi, Quincy.

[Sara Bareilles]

Do you think I have a nice voice?

[Gloria Estefan]

Do I think you have a nice voice? Yeah, I do, bud. Did someone say you didn't have a nice voice? Do I need to speak to somebody?

[Sara Bareilles]

I got called on stage recently.

[Gloria Estefan]

What'd you say?

[Sara Bareilles]

I got called up on stage recently at like a cabaret and was forced to sing in front of a bunch of actual performers. And it caused a little bit of.

[Gloria Estefan]

A spiral for me. Yeah, sure. It would cause a spiral for me too. Don't worry.

[Sara Bareilles]

Anyways, how are you? How's the new day?

[Gloria Estefan]

Oh, God, Quincy, it's so good, but I'm so tired all the time.

[Sara Bareilles]

What? Tell the listeners what you're doing.

[Gloria Estefan]

My new job is I am a middle school theater teacher at a non. To be disclosed on pod location. But yeah, it's.

[Sara Bareilles]

Which is the perfect job for you.

[Gloria Estefan]

It is the perfect job for me. It's so funny. I can already tell.

[Sara Bareilles]

Are you solo or do you have like a helper?

[Gloria Estefan]

I have a co teacher. Yeah, her name is Corbin. She's very nice. We get along. We're about to do the Outsiders with the kids.

[Sara Bareilles]

What do you mean you're about to do the Outsiders?

[Gloria Estefan]

We're doing the Outsiders for the fall play.

[Sara Bareilles]

Is that legal?

[Gloria Estefan]

Not like the Broadway Outsiders.

[Sara Bareilles]

This is Tulsa, 1957.

[Gloria Estefan]

We're doing a play adaptation from Gotcha.

[Sara Bareilles]

Are you gonna take your kids to see the Outsiders?

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Broadway? Maybe.

[Gloria Estefan]

I'm not gonna do it, but if they're gonna pay for it, maybe. Wait. You know what I learned about the Outsiders, Quincy? Is that the Outsiders was written by a high school student. This girl was, like, in high school and wrote the Outsiders. Yeah, wrote the Outsiders.

[Sara Bareilles]

S.L.

[Gloria Estefan]

Hinton for her English class.

[Sara Bareilles]

L.S. hinton.

[Gloria Estefan]

S E. Hinton.

[Sara Bareilles]

S E Hinton?

[Gloria Estefan]

Yeah. She was, like, 17. How did I.

[Sara Bareilles]

And she was, like, from that world or something.

[Gloria Estefan]

I actually from Tulsa, Oklahoma. It's a firsthand account of the Soc.

[Sara Bareilles]

The Socias and the Greasers.

[Gloria Estefan]

Greases, Greases, Greases.

[Sara Bareilles]

I enjoyed the Outsiders on Broadway.

[Gloria Estefan]

I love the Outsiders. It's such a good story. I want to go back and watch the old movie again.

[Sara Bareilles]

See the Outsiders on Broadway was the first time the Outsiders IP came into my life.

[Gloria Estefan]

Are you going to come see my production of the Outsiders?

[Sara Bareilles]

If you invite me. Does that mean you're directing it? Is that what you're doing now?

[Gloria Estefan]

Yeah.

[Sara Bareilles]

Oh, my God. That's amazing.

[Gloria Estefan]

It's very exciting. How are you? How's your.

[Sara Bareilles]

I will definitely come.

[Gloria Estefan]

New job title.

[Sara Bareilles]

Oh, my new job title is fun. There's been a lot of Wicked movie content that has dropped since we last were on mic together.

[Gloria Estefan]

I know, Quincy. It's a little overwhelming. Cause I'm like, we still have 90 days left.

[Sara Bareilles]

So I'm choosing to be of the mind that while it does feel like we are seeing a lot of the movie and they seemingly reveal more with every new piece of marketing that they put out, there's still going to be so much in the actual movie that is new and fresh. I'm not of the mind of complaining about them revealing too much in these marketing materials that they're putting out, which.

[Gloria Estefan]

I would just love to say, roll the clip. What growth for you, Quincy? Because I believe. Roll the clip. I believe, like, a year and a half ago, you were like, I need Wicked to slow down. It's too much. There's gonna be nothing left for me to see.

[Sara Bareilles]

Look what a year will do.

[Gloria Estefan]

Look what a year will do. A year in an existential crisis.

[Sara Bareilles]

We got a Jonathan Bailey Fiero featurette. I'm really happy about the British accent.

[Gloria Estefan]

I'm very happy about the British accent. I'm also very interested. Like, why did he get to keep his.

[Sara Bareilles]

It just adds to the mystique.

[Gloria Estefan]

Yeah, no, I'm not complaining. I'm just interested. I'm just interested. I also, we do not have the white riding pants, but we do have the navy riding pants confirmed, which I do think are a fair trade off.

[Sara Bareilles]

Sure. Really excellent, the navy pants. I'm hoping for some sort of an homage to the white pants as a send up for the fans. What could be cool is if there's a picture frame on his dresser or something of him riding a horse and he's in that classic Fiero look. Just a nice little moment like that, I think would satisfy me.

[Gloria Estefan]

I would like that too. I love that shot of him and the horse walking in unison because it looks like.

[Sara Bareilles]

Oh, is that what that is?

[Gloria Estefan]

Yeah. And I.

[Sara Bareilles]

Can I tell you what I thought that was randomly.

[Gloria Estefan]

Yeah.

[Sara Bareilles]

I thought it was Dilimond. Like, we were just getting a look at that Dilliman strut that you did.

[Gloria Estefan]

That is so funny. No, I think it.

[Sara Bareilles]

I literally think of you whenever I.

[Gloria Estefan]

See that, and I think that means a lot to me. Thank you. I think that Fiero's horse is also blue, I think, which then is a throwback to the wizard of Oz. That's a horse of a different color. And the horse changes color.

[Sara Bareilles]

Oh.

[Gloria Estefan]

Which maybe that has something to do with that. But I do love the gayness of, like, Fiero showing up matching his horse. Like, that feels. That feels like a layer of wealth.

[Sara Bareilles]

There is also something beautiful. I feel like Fiero is pretty gay coded on Broadway and it feels the same in the movie, which is Right. I don't think I would love a not gay coded Fiero.

[Gloria Estefan]

No. I don't need anything wicked related that isn't gay coded in some way or another. Because it's like, yeah, sure. Like, are Elphaba and Fierro the ultimate, like, lavender marriage maybe? You know what I mean? Because it's like Elphaba's not exactly straight coded herself.

[Sara Bareilles]

Those boots.

[Gloria Estefan]

Those boots. And also with Cynthia and Jonathan in the roles, it's just like, gay, gay, gay, gay, gay, gay, gay, gay, gay. It makes me so happy.

[Sara Bareilles]

We also got the Ariana and Cynthia friendship featurette. Okay, can we talk about the forehead wave? Did you see the thing that I reposted on Instagram that someone was referencing this Dorothy moment in the wizard of Oz, which, sure.

[Gloria Estefan]

Reach feels like a reach to me because it's in that moment of the wizard of Oz. She's, like, fainting. Like, she's not waving goodbye to somebody. She's like. She's literally, like, about to pass out at the hands of Elphaba. So I don't know if maybe that's the reference, but side by side by side.

[Sara Bareilles]

It was a very cute reference.

[Gloria Estefan]

Side by side by side. It's very cute. But I do love that they are going to have seemingly, like, their own signature, because you would imagine then that's going to show up several times.

[Sara Bareilles]

Right. And I would hope that we see the origin of the forehead wave.

[Gloria Estefan]

Yeah. And I'm also imagining Elphaba not to, like, rip everyone's hearts out. But I'm imagining now, like, when she's about to melt at the end and she pulls the big thing across, she does a little wave goodbye.

[Sara Bareilles]

Oof.

[Gloria Estefan]

Like, maybe she's like, I'm melting and she does it on the way down.

[Sara Bareilles]

Oh, interesting, Kevin. Yeah, I like that. For context, for the listeners, if you don't know what we're talking about. In the Ariana and Cynthia friendship featurette that Wicked movie put out, there's a scene where you see they clearly have some sort of inside hand wave moment where they put their hand to their.

[Gloria Estefan]

Foreheads and wave at each other.

[Sara Bareilles]

Yeah, yeah.

[Gloria Estefan]

I also noticed. And this was so cute. Well, number one, it was like the friendship featurette really drove home, like, oh, there's gonna be scenes, like, hearing those, like, conversations that we know so well happening at a pace other than, like, you think goes good with green this and that, like.

[Sara Bareilles]

Cause you know what? There's weirdly not a lot of in Wicked book scenes. Book scenes.

[Gloria Estefan]

It's three hours of the most beautiful music you've ever heard with a little bit of boop, boop, boop, boop, boop in between. Settle down, class. We got 30 seconds to get through three pages of dialogue. And all of it's important later, so pay attention.

[Sara Bareilles]

Oh, I love seeing the, like when they're at the Wizard. Say something. Say something. That little back and forth was very cute to see.

[Gloria Estefan]

Yes. I just, like, love to see. I think you're gonna know what I mean when I say this is that it's like both of their performances feel they're not like musical theater characters. Like, they feel like they're just playing people as, like, dumb as it sounds like. It just feels like this is like a regular movie performance. There's not, because there's, like, so much camp around them that it's like they don't need that musical.

[Sara Bareilles]

Which I will say is jarring. It's like jarring for me to see and feel that as I watch all of this.

[Gloria Estefan]

Yeah, agreed.

[Sara Bareilles]

I'm excited to see how it lands as a full length movie film.

[Gloria Estefan]

Especially with Cynthia. With Elphaba, it's like we're so used to no, I'm not seasick. Yes, I've always been green. No, I didn't eat grass when I was a little girl. Da da da da da da. And now to see it where she's like, right, do I have something in my teeth? Like so paced and like, yeah. Oof. I can't wait.

[Sara Bareilles]

Kevin, who are we talking to today?

[Gloria Estefan]

Quincy. Today our guest is the one and only, honestly, a staple of capital W, Wicked. The one, the only Laurel Harris.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Woo.

[Gloria Estefan]

Laurel Harris is like one of these Elphaba's Quincy who's been around reliably forever. Like I feel like it's. She's just one of those names. Yeah. 2010, 2011. Well let's look at our our notes that we have here. Back in 2011, Laurel made her wicked debut in the second national tour as the Elphaba understudy replacing Christine Dwyer. In 2012 she was in the ensemble of the Evita revival on Broadway. We love an Elpha vita. Then in 2014 she was back in Wicked, second national tour replacing Jenny De Noia as principal Elphaba. After that, in 2016 she was in In Transit on Broadway. I loved that show. Also in 2016 she was in Beautiful on Broadway as the understudy for Carol, Jeannie and Cynthia. In 2018 she made her Wicked Broadway debut as the Elphaba standby, popping in and out all year because that's the kind of girl she is. In 2019 she was in Jagged Little Pill on Broadway as Jill and the Mary Jane healy understudy. In 2023 she was back out on the second national tour as the Elphaba standby replacing friend of the pod Emily Kristen Morris. Then In September of 2023 she was an emergency Elphaba cover on Broadway and now she is back on Broadway with Wicked as an Alphabet standby and a fill in lead. So she's definitely I want to say, I want to say it's giving Jenny De Noia. It's giving Jenny De Noia. It's like Jenny De Noia retired from Wicked. She Goodbye Yellow Brick Road. Edited and then Laurel Harris was like, hey, what's up Wicked? I'm around. I got the chops. What do you need I will also.

[Sara Bareilles]

Say I saw Laurel last September by surprise that we interviewed MacKenzie Kurtz, who filled us in that Laurel was going on that day as a surprise. She was, like, hot off the press. Laurel's.

[Gloria Estefan]

She, like, got the text while she was talking to us.

[Sara Bareilles]

Mm.

[Gloria Estefan]

Oh, my God. That's right.

[Sara Bareilles]

And she was sensational.

[Gloria Estefan]

Oh, my God.

[Sara Bareilles]

The Sentimental Men universe.

[Gloria Estefan]

I totally forgot that that happened to you. Quincy, do you have a stuck on SJB for me?

[Sara Bareilles]

I do. Stuck on sjb. I'm sure we all have the video of SJB singing so in Love from Kiss Me Kate in this gorgeous outdoor indoor London venue with tropical trees and a piano behind her. It was actually very beautifully shot and composed. I thought.

[Gloria Estefan]

I do, too.

[Sara Bareilles]

Yeah, she sounds delicious. It was, like, so nice to see her locked in. In a role again, I guess, since my most recent touch point with her is the concert we went to at 92nd Street Y.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Right.

[Gloria Estefan]

Where she was just. Just Steph. She's just Stephanie.

[Sara Bareilles]

She's just Steph's mother.

[Gloria Estefan]

So.

[Sara Bareilles]

Yeah. And just, like, seeing, like, actress Stephanie was very, very, very nice. When does Kiss Me Kate close?

[Gloria Estefan]

I don't know. I'm such a fan of her voice on this music, though. It fits her like a glove. Because it's like, I always feel like this role in Kiss Me Kate is, like, surprisingly rangy. Like, you really need to be, like, a soprano and a lolo alto comfortably in this role. And she has it.

[Sara Bareilles]

To me, she is such a different voice than I feel like has been professionally cast in this role in recent memory. And so it's very nice to hear a fresh take on how to sing this role.

[Gloria Estefan]

You mean as opposed to Kelly O'Hara and, like, Marin Mazie?

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Yeah.

[Sara Bareilles]

I think, like, a Kelly interpretation of this song versus a Stephanie interpretation of this song are two beautiful but very different interpretations.

[Gloria Estefan]

Totally, totally.

[Sara Bareilles]

Kiss Me Kate runs until September 14th.

[Gloria Estefan]

On the West End TikTok.

[Sara Bareilles]

Plenty of time. Actually, not really plenty of time.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Wow.

[Sara Bareilles]

This year is really zooming by.

[Gloria Estefan]

I know, I know. We're going to blink. We're going to vote. We're going to watch the Wicked movie. And then it's going to be 2025.

[Sara Bareilles]

We're going to go home for Christmas.

[Gloria Estefan]

In between, we're gonna come see the Outsiders.

[Sara Bareilles]

Oh, yeah.

[Gloria Estefan]

You know what we're doing in the.

[Sara Bareilles]

Let's do a bootleg version of the Broadway.

[Gloria Estefan]

Of the Broadway. You know what we're doing for the spring musical.

[Sara Bareilles]

Can I guess?

[Gloria Estefan]

Yeah. I didn't pick it.

[Sara Bareilles]

I feel like this is gonna be such a fun segment on the podcast. Is the school updates from diaries now? Yeah. What's like. Give me a hint.

[Gloria Estefan]

It is not. Not related to Wicked.

[Sara Bareilles]

The wizard of Oz?

[Gloria Estefan]

No.

[Sara Bareilles]

Are you doing the Wiz?

[Gloria Estefan]

No.

[Sara Bareilles]

Not. Not related to Wicked.

[Gloria Estefan]

That was maybe a shitty clue. It's not in the Oz multiverse. But.

[Sara Bareilles]

But it's not. Not related to Wicked. Like Pippin.

[Gloria Estefan]

No. I'll just tell you, we can't put this on the podcast anyway, because if the kids listen, they'll know.

[Sara Bareilles]

Uh.

[Gloria Estefan]

Oh, but we're doing.

[Sara Bareilles]

Do the kids know about this? Yeah, bleep it out.

[Gloria Estefan]

We're doing.

[Sara Bareilles]

That's a good kids show.

[Gloria Estefan]

It's a good middle school show. Yeah, it'll be fun.

[Sara Bareilles]

Wait, so are you in charge of, like, directing, choreography, casting, all the things? Yeah, you can't, like, bring in some of the.

[Gloria Estefan]

Oh, you can. And there's, like, a dance teacher at the school. Like, they have dance as an elective, so we can use them for help.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Wow.

[Sara Bareilles]

All right, let's get into the interview with Laurel Harris.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

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[Sara Bareilles]

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[Kristin Chenoweth]

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[Gloria Estefan]

Singular sensation. The triumph of Broadway. Plenty of dramas unfold on stage, but the best dramas unfold backstage.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

And there were no bigger dramas than.

[Gloria Estefan]

Behind the scenes of Sunset Boulevard. So you were being crucified over here, but not there? No, no, because I was turning in.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

A performance that would get standing of Asians. Excuse me.

[Gloria Estefan]

So check out my podcast, Singular Sensation.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

For all the juicy details of Sunset Boulevard.

[Sara Bareilles]

Laurel Harris, thank you so much for joining us on Sentimental Men today.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

I'm so happy to be here. Thank you.

[Sara Bareilles]

Wait, we have to. So Kevin and I were just talking in our intro that you are one of those iconic legacy Elphabas who is just in and out of the show. You're currently in the show on Broadway.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Currently here in room 10. The standby dressing room. Yeah.

[Sara Bareilles]

How long have you been there?

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Well, in this current time, it's been six days. So sometimes I come for like a day or a show or a week or a month. We just, you know, we never know. But you always say yes. You always say yes to Wicked. Yeah.

[Sara Bareilles]

Okay, so let's go back. How did Wicked, the musical come into your life as a person?

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Well, originally I saw the show when it first opened in 2003. I was lucky enough that my, my parents used to take me to New York every Christmas and we would see shows and of course I wanted to see Wicked because that was a hot ticket. And of course they were completely sold out. And I liter went back to the box office and I begged them, I said, is there anything at all? I'll sit on the floor, I don't care. And they miraculously found one ticket in the balcony. And my parents were so sweet and they said, go, take it, go. And. And so, yeah, I saw Dina fly and I saw Kristen Yodel and it was incredible. And. And I remember, you know, when the curtain came down after act one, I was just in complete tears and amazement. And yeah, I get emotional just thinking about it because that was a really pivotal moment for me in my journey in this career. And I remember I called my mom and I said, I have to do this one day. I have to try. I have to try. And to this day, Elphaba's lyric, until I try I'll never know is something that I live by. It means so much to me. And every time I sing that lyric, I'm thinking about, you know, 20 year old, younger me up in the balcony watching Idina. And I certainly never thought I would get to be in Wicked and I certainly didn't think I would get to be playing Elphaba in her shoes on the Gershwin. And wow, it's just been an incredible, incredible journey. So yeah, that was my introduction to Wicked was 20 years ago, almost 21 years ago now.

[Sara Bareilles]

So when you first saw it, you were already on the I'm going to be a performer path.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

I was, I knew that it was something that I was passionate about and I, I wanted to pursue, but I still was a little bit uncertain. I was actually juggling between going into performing arts and going into medicine and I come from a family of medical professionals and it's something I'm still very passionate about. And then I saw Wicked and I was like, no, I gotta, I gotta do this, I gotta do this first. I gotta at least try, you know. So I'm very grateful for that experience. I'm very grateful that I got to see that show, I got to see Wicked in that moment because I really do believe that it was the final indicator for me that this was the path that I was meant to take. And it really has meant such an enormous. It's just been such an enormous part of my life, and it means so much that I have been able to play this role so many times and come back to it over the years, because every time I get to a moment in Defying Gravity, I literally look up to where I sat 20 years ago, and I'm thinking about that. I'm thinking about whoever is sitting in that chair in that moment and hoping that I'm somehow able to inspire them to pursue whatever dream they may have, you know, and it's just such an opportunity to be able to play this role. And not to mention the incredible women who have played this role and that I've looked up to and, you know, the iconic, just powerhouse women, the company that you. Absolutely amazing. Yeah, it is. It is. It's really.

[Sara Bareilles]

So was your family supportive of your decision to pursue performing, given the medicine context?

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Yes, they really were. They were a little upset when I declined. I got into Duke University, and they were a little upset that I turned them down. I was like, no, I'm going to theater. Theater school. I'm going to University of Michigan. They're like, I can't believe you turned down Duke. Who are you? I had something to prove, you know, I was like, okay, I'm, like, really committing to this. No, but they. They have always been so incredibly supportive of me, and my parents have seen the show literally over 100 times. They've lost count.

[Sara Bareilles]

God.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

One of the last times they came.

[Sara Bareilles]

So they're the biggest wicked fans.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

They're the biggest wicked fans. They were here last month. They came. They flew up on a whim from North Carolina and still brought me flowers. And it's just so sweet. There was one of the last times they came, my mom was like. So I notice in the Governor's Mansion scene, the chandelier seemed a little bit lower than usual. And then there's like, Mom. Wait a minute. Are you kidding me right now? But she is. Yeah, they know all the cues.

[Sara Bareilles]

We have to have your mom.

[Gloria Estefan]

Parents could co host the podcast like.

[Sara Bareilles]

Mom on to chart your Elphaba and how it's progressed over the years.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Oh, it's true.

[Gloria Estefan]

Yes.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

No, they will tell me acting choices. Oh, I really liked how you change this little nuanced moment. And I'm like, oh, wow. I'm floored. Yeah.

[Gloria Estefan]

That's amazing, though, because it's like, in what other? Like, thinking about having a career as an actress. Like, there's no other show that you could be in for that they could come see a hundred times, nothing else. There's no other opportunity for you, an actress, to be in a show your parents like enough to come to it a hundred times.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

I know. It's wild. I know. And that's.

[Gloria Estefan]

That's crazy.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

That's why I feel so grateful for this show and this role and the opportunities that I've been given, because it really is such a. A special and unique opportunity, like you're saying, to be able to grow in a role for all these, you know, throughout these years. And also that Wicked is. I mean, it is never. It will always be running. I'm like, it's going to outlive all of us. You know what I mean? So for it to always. To always be here, but always having these iconic characters and the women playing them and getting to really morph and evolve with them as you age and as you grow older and. Yeah, so it's. Yeah, it's wild. I'm just really happy to still be doing this 14 years later, 13 years later.

[Sara Bareilles]

On that note, I want to dive into your first ever audition for Wicked. But before we do that, we want to challenge you to try and document your journey from the first ever contract to now as best as you can. Because we tried it in the intro.

[Gloria Estefan]

We tried. I don't think we did it.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

We've lost track a few times along the way. Same.

[Gloria Estefan]

And if you can't do it, we're calling Mom.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Oh, yeah, she probably has it all written down. She's like, actually, it was 2010. Well, you know what's funny is I had a feeling y'all were gonna ask me this. So, literally, I was going through old emails today to find my first initial contract with Wicked. And it was in 2010. It was. It was 2010 when I auditioned and when I signed my first contract, but I didn't actually begin rehearsals till 2011.

[Sara Bareilles]

Okay.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

So. So yes, I initially joined tour two in 2011 as the Alphabet under. As the Elphaba and Nessa rose under study. And then that's back when there was.

[Sara Bareilles]

Still a tour one.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Yeah. Yes, exactly. And then I. I was there for a year, and then I left to make my Broadway debut in Evita, and then I came back to Wicked Tour 1 in 2013 as the standby.

[Sara Bareilles]

Oh, okay, we missed that.

[Gloria Estefan]

That's wrong.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Okay. That's okay. I know. Listen, I had to go through. I was like, calendar.

[Sara Bareilles]

Okay.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

And then, yes, I did that for a year. And then in 2014, I went to play the role Full time on tour two 2014, did the role 20. Between 2015 and 2018, I did beautiful and In Transit and Jagged Little Pill. And then in 2018, I finally came to 20.

[Sara Bareilles]

And there was no wicked in those three years.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

No, no wicked in those three years. So 2018 is when I first joined Wicked at the Gershwin, Standing by Broadway. Yeah. And then 2019, I did more Standing by and then I left for Jagged and then the Pandemic, and then I came back to Wicked in 2023 last year.

[Sara Bareilles]

Gotcha. So you were not part of the Omicron Brigade?

[Kristin Chenoweth]

No, actually.

[Gloria Estefan]

Which feels surprising. Well, I feel like I probably would have guessed.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

I got a call. So.

[Gloria Estefan]

Not the Omicron Brigade.

[Sara Bareilles]

Gotcha.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

I did get a call about two months after my son was born when there was the Alpha Palooza going on with the ridiculous code it in the building. And I respectfully said I don't think I should enter that building right now with a two month old baby. But thank you so much.

[Sara Bareilles]

It sounds a little.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

I was terrible, you know. Yeah, it was a little intense. So I'm very glad they asked me back after that whole thing because of course I was like, oh, no, I don't want to upset anybody. But yeah, I was just too. I couldn't risk it, you know, with my newborn.

[Gloria Estefan]

It's not the moment.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

So. Yeah. And then this year it's been pretty cool because I came back to the Gershwin for a little bit, filling in here and there. And then I got to go back on tour, which was wild last year for nine months. And I hadn't been back on the road since I was there full time. So to go back a decade later, it was pretty cool because a lot of the cities I'd been to before and some of the dressers were the same that had been there 10 years ago. And that was really special to see them again. And I had my toddler with me on the road, and he got to.

[Gloria Estefan]

Know I was gonna ask.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

He still calls them his friends. Where are my friends? It's so sweet. And so. And he knows Wicked so well. Like, he'll tell the sitters, mommy's at Wicked. Mama's green. Mama's a witch. He knows all these things, which is really cool.

[Sara Bareilles]

Mama's a witch.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Mama's a witch. He practices his cackle daily. Oh, my gosh. It's pretty creole.

[Sara Bareilles]

Oh, my God.

[Gloria Estefan]

Having done tor as principal and then tour as standby, how is that different for you? Especially now you're at such a different stage in your life. I can't imagine principal with a toddler would have been a fun tour.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Yes, I know. Well, it's so funny cause I think there's definitely a way to do that. And it would be that my husband would have to be the nanny, but my husband's on the Mamma Mia tour right now. So honestly, the hardest part of last year was that we were on separate tours and like, you know, tossing a baby back and forth between who's got him in which city. But it's definitely possible I would, you know, I would have him come with me or try to find some full time nanny to come. I remember Jen Gambatiste did that with her baby and her mom was with her the whole time and that's how she was able to do it. But yeah, it's definitely, you know, it's wild because after playing the role and then coming back to Standing by, it's so much. I, I don't ever want to say easier because Elphaba is an incredibly difficult and challenging role. But I will say that some of the pressure is taken off because you know what it's like to do the show eight times a week. And now that I have had that experience, I've told so many people, gosh, I feel like the standby should always be someone who's played the role because I think it benefits the show, the full time Alphabet, the standby, if it's someone who has played the role because you just have a different perspective on what that job means of standing by.

[Sara Bareilles]

Well, so that's interesting. Are you still, because you've been with the show for so long, are you sitting backstage when you stand by with a little bit of anxiety on, like, oh God, I could have to go on. Or are you kind of just settled into it at this point?

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Oh, I'm settled. And it's really nice. It's really nice to have that peace about it and to really get to enjoy every time I go on now. I like, I truly enjoy getting to play this role now. And it's not that. Yes, there, the stakes are high, of course, and there's adrenaline will always be there. But I will say, you know, at this point in my career and with my history with this show, it really is so much fun and I just feel so grateful every time I get to play it now, which is really nice. I still feel like I've climbed Mount Everest afterwards.

[Gloria Estefan]

I just want to say, it's so nice to hear, it's so nice to hear somebody saying that they have fun playing Elphaba. It's so often it's like we hear, not in a completely negative way, but like you're saying there is so much pressure, especially when you're new to the role, new to the world machine that is Wicked, the organization that is Wicked. And so to be with it long enough and to have, I mean, you've had so many parts of your life happen through your journey with this show that now it's like the show probably feels in a way so much smaller than it did in 2010. And that's, I would imagine that's kind of what allows you to be like, yeah, I'm not that nervous. Great, I'll do the, I can do the show. I'll jump in.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Well, you know what it is, it's like the one constant that I've had in my career and in many ways in my life. And so I always equate coming to Wicked is coming home. And like it literally is. I mean, wow, it does feel. It, it feels like such a part of me and, and I, I feel like Elphaba is such a part of me and, and I'm a part of her and it's like she's just kind of always there. And so yeah, I, I always say it feels like coming home and, and it really does. So it's like, it's so funny to say this cause I have a, you know, I have a 2 year old now and I'm like, oh my God, I get to wick it. And I'm like, oh, I just have to play Elphaba. Oh, thank God. This is so much easier, you know, like, I know how to do this. I know how to do this. I'm good at it.

[Gloria Estefan]

This has been the same for 14 years.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Yeah, right, exactly. People trust me, I'm good at it. I don't have to ask any questions. I mean, yes, I'm still learning and growing, but I'm like, oh, wow, who knew? No, no. That being a parent would be so terrifying and wonderful. But you know, it's different and it's. Yeah, it's, it's wild because it really is like this place that I come to and I feel, I feel safe. I feel safe here. And I, and I. And the relationships that I've made and maintained, you know, for 13 years, that is so special to me too because I walk into this building or I go, you know, on tour and most of the crew is still the same. And you know, I've watched their kids grow up and now they're watching me become a mom. And some of my best friends come from this world. I mean, Cara Lindsey is literally, I move when she moves. We were neighbors in Washington Heights, then she moved to Jersey. So I was like, peace, we gotta go to Jersey Rob. You know, but it is, most of my community is from this show. So it's not just a show and it's not just a job. It's, it's, it really is, it's become part of my world, part of my, you know, reason for being in New York and remaining here for, for so long. Looking for a pickup truck to get just about anything done, look no further. The Chevy Silverado EV isn't just the most powerful Silverado ever with next level towing capability and technology. It also offers game changing versatility with the available multiflex midgate and tailgate. Which means Silverado EV helps you carry large, bulky and oddly shaped items up to nearly 11ft in length.

[Sara Bareilles]

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[Kristin Chenoweth]

Let's drive. Visit Chevrolet.com to learn more.

[Gloria Estefan]

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[Sara Bareilles]

Okay, so tell us about the first ever audition for wicked. Back in 2010, I'm assuming.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Okay, so this is a funny story. I initially went in for wicked probably in 09 or even 08 and I was so nervous that I completely bombed the audition and I was like, cool, never gonna go in for that again.

[Sara Bareilles]

And what were you going in for then?

[Kristin Chenoweth]

I was going in for the under the Alphabet understudy. Okay. Yeah. And I don't even remember where, like what capacity, but I remember I had to sing Defying Gravity and I got to the end and I was so nervous, I was like literally shaking and you know, it was just not a good situation. So I was really sad about that. Cut to this is so random. But I ended up becoming Janine Tesoris, the nanny for her child who has since become One of my closest and dearest friends. They were one of my bridesmaids in my wedding. And Janine played our processional. And she's become like a second mother to me. And so anyway, she took me under her wing. She asked me if I wanted to be her assistant on Shrek. So I was out of town with them in Seattle and kind of like taking notes for her during the show, but also watching her child. And it was just so cool. Something really amazing to do right out of college. And it was through her that I got another audition because she took me to the opening of last fall, the play. And Lisa Liguio happened to be sitting in front of us, who's the associate director of Wicked. And. And good old Lisa. We love Lisa. Lisa was also at my wedding. And Janine was like, lisa, you should see Laurel for Elphaba. And I, like, kicked her leg. Cause I was so embarrassed. And I didn't have an agent at the time. And so she was looking out for me. And Lisa's like, oh, yeah, sure, set up an appointment. Call Telsey. These are the days where you just like, call Telsey. And she's like, call Telsey. We'll see her Monday. And so I called Telsey. Cause I didn't have an agent. And it was so weird because I remember being like, hi, Lisa Laguio told me to call you and you would see me for Wicked somehow, some way, sometime. And so. And they. I guess it was just perfect.

[Sara Bareilles]

I was like, I've heard that before.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Yeah. It's like, what?

[Sara Bareilles]

Yeah, right.

[Gloria Estefan]

You and I. Yeah, exactly. Exactly.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Yeah. Said who? Janine Tsorrivet. And so, yeah, it was just like, random timing. And, you know, I feel like the stars were just all in alignment. Because I guess they happened to be having auditions the next week, and they happened to be looking for somebody. And so I went in that next week and I did the same material. And I was like, I'm never gonna get this. I bombed it last time. I'm just gonna go in and have fun. And people always say, like, try to have fun. And that's. You know, I'm like, yeah, really? Okay. It's a. It feels like you want to have fun, but ultimately it is. It is a job interview in a way, you know, and especially for something that you so deeply want. So it's. It's this weird dichotomy of having to, like, pretend you don't really want it, but really, you're like, oh, my God, I got it. So. But yeah, I really was Able to kind of remove myself and my, you know, the demons that we all have as artists and just allow myself to go in there and live it, you know, and, like, really try to bring myself to it. And I think. I don't know how or why, but I was just able to really release all of that. And I'll never forget, in the room, Lisa said, wow, you've been waiting to do that for a long time, haven't you? And. And I was like, yeah, I have.

[Sara Bareilles]

Booked it.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

I freaking got to do Wicked. Like, it's wild and. And it's pretty cool, too, because I've only had one other. I had to go in one more time before taking over for standby, because I remember I was in Evita, and then they wanted me to come in, like, for a work session before taking over for standby on tour. 1. I remember it just felt so big, and it still feels big, but there's a way that I'm able to kind of separate myself a little bit from it, and in terms of it being this, like, unreachable, huge, historic, you know, epic character, because I feel like if anyone kind of sits back before a show and thinks about the history of this and wake it, and they'd probably, like, freak themselves out. So you have to kind of be like, all right, I'm just gonna go play this role, like I know how to do, and I'm gonna be present, and I'm gonna listen to my scene partners on stage, and I'm really just. I'm just going to listen, you know, and be very, very present. I know I keep saying present, but really in the moment and allowing myself to breathe and feel this show, which is going to be different from the next show and different from the past show. So I'm really. I'm really grateful that I. I was able to slowly find my way into Elphaba. I will say that since becoming a mom, I feel everything changes. And your perspective changes. And there's a deeper connection that I have to Elphaba now that I couldn't have even thought about before I had a child. And I think part of it, too, is just doing other shows in between, having a perspective on the industry, having a perspective on our world and our politics and life and the pandemic, my God, you know, that shifted so much. And so I think all of those things play into how this role is really versatile in terms of how the actor can approach it and how really, you know, the more life experiences you have, the more, for me, grounded. It's become and real. And Lisa always says gravitas and deeper, but I know what she means now. It's like I didn't really get it before because I was still coming from this, like, very youthful place and like Wicked's my first thing and after, you know, my college experience and so it was different and now it. Now I can really understand, you know, what she means about that. And I do think too, you know, every. Like you were saying before in terms of your players, the show is always changing depending on who's around you. And I've learned so much, much from watching other Elphabas and from playing with so many different Glindas. And those women have also helped me find this character and this version of Elphaba, since we all get to have the liberty to play it so freely and obviously within parameters. But I really give credit to all the women who played Elphaba before me and. And all the Glindas that I've gotten to play opposite and even the Fieros. You know, it's like we all kind of help each other fine tune these really interesting and multi layered characters. So I think, you know, my history with the show has helped that evolve as well.

[Sara Bareilles]

Yeah. You know, your perspective on the role is really reminding me of Jackie Burns in the sense where she was another one who did a lot, a lot of contracts and by the end of it had really settled in and was just comfortable and playing in the role. She was able to pinpoint a specific contract where that switch happened and the role was just fun for her.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Cool.

[Sara Bareilles]

Do you have an era that you were like, oh, Elphaba is just Elphaba now. And it's not Elphaba.

[Gloria Estefan]

Elphaba. Yeah, totally.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

You know, I think there's two moments for me. I think when I took over the role full time, that was where I really, for the first time felt ownership because I was doing it eight times a week. And it was, you know, it was like the role was entrusted to me to make her come alive in a way that made sense obviously within the context of the show, but also within my body and my technique and being able to figure out how to do it eight times a week, not only acting wise, but emotion acting wise, but vocally as well, in a healthy way. So I would say that. And obviously that just like builds your confidence too. Like, oh, okay, I'm the one they want right now. Right. And so then you're able to really take that on and feel that, yes, pride, but also responsibility of leading the show, really committing to the character, making it your own and like I said, finding a way to make it honest and truthful and come to life every performance. So I would say that and then I would say, I know I keep saying this, but after having the child, like the. I will never forget the first time getting to play the role after having my son, once I did that and proved to myself that I could still do it and was able to access that part of myself that frankly, I had lost due to the pandemic, due to the isolation of motherhood, which is a real thing, the isolation of parenthood in general, but especially during a pandemic when you can't have a lot of people around. So I think after that performance, I was able to really celebrate. And yeah, I think since that show, it's just been like, ah, I'm so lucky I get to do this. And it really is like, it's an experience of gratitude and joy. It's an experience of gratitude and joy every performance. Yeah, it really is.

[Sara Bareilles]

Has there ever been a point in your Wicked journey where you thought maybe this should be my last contract?

[Kristin Chenoweth]

No. Wow. No. In fact, I'm still. I'm still waiting for my Gershwin. Full time contract.

[Gloria Estefan]

Is your hope. Like, would you like to be doing it full time at the gershwin?

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Yeah. Yes, 1,000%.

[Gloria Estefan]

Yeah, we would like that too.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Thank you. I would love that.

[Sara Bareilles]

Yeah, I did get to see you. We had Mackenzie Kurtz on last September.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Oh my gosh.

[Sara Bareilles]

And we were wrapping up and I was like, oh, I'm seeing the show tonight. And she was like, well, hot off the press. I just found out Laurel Harris is going on.

[Gloria Estefan]

I love that.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Oh my gosh. That might have been my first show back.

[Sara Bareilles]

I think it was. It was a very exciting.

[Gloria Estefan]

I think it was. Yeah.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

That was the pivotal moment.

[Gloria Estefan]

You were there for it, Quincy and.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

I could enjoy Elphaba.

[Gloria Estefan]

Wow.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Fear and yeah. Wow, that's really cool.

[Sara Bareilles]

It was so exciting to find out that you were going on that night because you are such a legacy, Elphaba, that I was like, God, I finally am getting my opportunity to see her so excited. But also, you sing the role so ferociously and you have such a witchy quality to the way that you sing this score that just really. It's very wizard of V's Wicked Witch in a way. That is a nice through line to see in Wicked.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Thank you. I really appreciate that. I can't believe you were there that night. That's wild. That's wild. Cause that is definitely a performance I will never forget.

[Sara Bareilles]

How would you say your interpretation of the character has changed from day one to where you're sitting now? What were you trying to bring to Elphaba when you did it full time the first time? And what would you say you're trying to bring out in the character now?

[Kristin Chenoweth]

You know, the thing that has always drawn me to Elphaba is her activism and her fight for the marginalized communities and animals and environment and, you know, whatever the underdog is and whatever that represents. And so I feel like that part of me I was able to really easily access through Elphaba, and I still am that. I think that's the part that draws me to her the most, is the, like, true fight for rights, something that I'm very passionate about. And I think that has continued. That's kind of like the core of Elphaba for me. And I will say that through the years, what has also continued to grow is just her humanity and her. The way that you can relate to her, the way you can relate to anyone. And just being true, good people of good people, good citizens of the world, seeing each other as real humans, seeing each other, seeing our. I mean, it's a lot of, like, every election that we're talking about. Right. But, like, seeing the commonalities, seeing the human qualities in people. And I feel like I've really been able to see just what makes her so compassionate and what makes her so relatable on multiple levels. And the thing I've also found is her humor. She has so. She has such wit and dry humor. And I've loved getting to explore that because I think that a lot of times people just assume, like, Glinda's the funny one. But Elphaba has a lot of humor and character. And so that's been really fun to find that too, which goes hand in hand with her, you know, humanizing her and making her personable and relatable because she's never trying to take anything to. Yeah, she takes things very seriously. But she uses humor as a way to juxtapose those really heavy moments, especially when it's personal to her.

[Gloria Estefan]

We were talking before you joined us about. We were talking about it in context of seeing all these trailers for the movie and seeing how Cynthia. Her deliveries are very like, do I have something right? No, I'm not. Like, they're very subtle, but it's like you're saying, we know that the way they like it to be on stage is like, no, I'm not seasick. Yes, I've always been Greed. No, I didn't. And it would be so easy for that to just be anger. But really, everything she's saying is funny.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Exactly.

[Gloria Estefan]

She's making jokes. They're just coming out at evolution.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Right, Exactly. Exactly. Right. No, I didn't eat grass as a child. Like, come on. Exactly. No, it's so true. It's so true. Because they're not, you know, one dimensional characters. They're real. They're. They're real people that have so much to offer and so many layers. Like. Like we all do. So that's what's been fun, I think, you know, finding all of those layers and not so one note. Because I think when I first learned Elphaba. Yes. I was thinking, like, angry screaming. Everything is at this, you know, and it's like, actually, no, like, they're. There's a lot of nuance there. And if you're screaming the whole time, you're not gonna have any. Like, Firo wouldn't even be interested in you. Cause he'd be like, okay, she needs to chill out a little bit. You know what I mean? So, yeah, it's finding that. And even it's so interesting that you brought up that first big, you know, the first few lines that she has in the show. Yeah. Because that's been something that I've been navigating, how to not just make that one note and one level. Because it's easy to just scream that. But I have actually been discovering, like, what. What would that be like if. If I really said it as I see Elphaba saying it now, you know, all these years later? For me personally, how someone who is really passionate about something and hurt, but also trying to not make everyone hate her, but try to find some sort of, you know, interest or wit about her, how she would say that. And so it's been fun to kind of play with that and not just be screaming at all the students, but doing it. Yes. In an aggressive way that's still true to who Elphaba is at her core. Which is like, I'm just trying to. I'm just trying to fit in here with all you guys.

[Gloria Estefan]

Right, right.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

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[Gloria Estefan]

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[Sara Bareilles]

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[Kristin Chenoweth]

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[Kristin Chenoweth]

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[Sara Bareilles]

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[Gloria Estefan]

Use code spotifyozyearth.com and save up to 4, 40%. That's cozy earth.com Spotify. And that feels. I mean, even just from, like, talking to you for an hour, it's like. That feels very in line with, like, who you are and, like, your energy as a person. And so it's like finding that balance, especially when you've been playing the role for so long, finding those places to insert yourself. And I would imagine, like, you probably are more comfortable bringing yourself to it now than you were.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Exactly, yeah. Because I will say, too, that in those moments, I think I was trying to be a version of this that I had seen or. And it's like what people tell you in auditions, too. Don't try to be what they're looking for. Right. But again, when you're like, all I've seen is Adina and, you know, these amazing women do this role, it's like.

[Sara Bareilles]

This is your first, like, professional gig.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Right? Exactly.

[Gloria Estefan]

Yeah.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

So, yeah, I think that. Yeah, that's such a good point. Kevin is. You know, it's been. It did take, like, having ownership over the role and really finding that confidence in myself to be able to insert myself into this character and, you know, but again, coming at it from a point of still within the world of Elphaba, but human. That's why I just keep saying, like, humanizing her and not. And not making her one level, because nobody is one level. Nobody is just, like, angry all the time. Right. So, yeah, it's been interesting to explore and play. And I'm so grateful that I've been given the freedom to play within this role. You know, that's something I give Wicked a lot of credit for. I'm so grateful that this, you know, epic, huge musical is allowing their actors to. Within the obviously, parameters of the show, but to really discover and play and find new things. And I'm also, you know, I've told Lisa this before. I've told David Stone this before. The fact that they are still so present 20 years later. They come to the show, they note us, they watch. I mean, it's amazing. And that is so.

[Sara Bareilles]

That's why it's held up so well when you look at other long runners on Broadway, as well, you know.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Exactly, exactly. It's so true. And like, Aremus was just here a few weeks ago and it's, it's, it's incredible. And that's why it's doing so well, because they are still fully invested, short still comes. He was in Philly on the road.

[Gloria Estefan]

Right.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

So, yeah, they. I mean, that is really cool too, that they're not expecting you to be a carbon copy of anyone else. And they really are allowing you to play within these roles and to bring them to life. And I think that's right. It's so important because then it doesn't ever become stale.

[Sara Bareilles]

And it's interesting to hear you say that because you do have. You sing the flight portion of Defying Gravity. You have options and riffs that aren't even like the standard options and riffs that you hear other women sing. Like, it is very unique and bespoke to you and it works, you know.

[Gloria Estefan]

Yeah.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Cool.

[Gloria Estefan]

Thank you. I was going to say, I feel like that kind of looseness within, especially the two lead roles is like a fairly recent thing too, because I feel like the shows, I mean, if we put on our historian hats, like the first, like what we call like the golden age, it's like you had all of these, like, legends, and it almost feels like the show was kind of trying to figure out what the blueprint was as it became clear that it needed to be duplicatable.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Totally.

[Gloria Estefan]

Then you had this middle section where it was like very by the book performances, I feel like. And I feel like you lived and worked through that era. And now I feel like in the last like five or so years, you're starting to see, like, oh, like, she's a very interesting choice to play Elphaba. Or like, or like, oh, she's bringing like, even like Alex Sca right now. It's like she is playing Glinda in a way that I've never seen. Seen Glinda played on stage once.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Totally.

[Sara Bareilles]

And I would argue it's not the type that you would think to cast Glinda as.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Right, Exactly. Yes, yes, exactly.

[Sara Bareilles]

But then is now giving inspired line readings that we who have seen the show a million times have never heard before.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Exactly. Oh, my God. There's something that she literally, today on the monitor, I was like, that is so good and it's hilarious. And I've never heard it that way before. And I, you know, thousands of times I've heard the show. Yeah, it's pretty cool. And it's remarkable because it just continues to bring A new life to the show. You know, so it's only servicing the show as a whole. It's only continuing to make it alive and real. And like we talk about present. Very, very present to the moment.

[Sara Bareilles]

All right, you gotta get out of here. But the final question. Are you a wizard and I defying gravity or no good deed? Elphaba. It can mean whatever you want it to mean. All we ask is that you explain what.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Okay. Wow. What I think I am or what other people think I am.

[Sara Bareilles]

It only matters what you think you are.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Okay. I think I'm a wizard in eye.

[Sara Bareilles]

Rare.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

I know.

[Gloria Estefan]

Rare. Tell us why.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Tell us why I know. Well, it's funny because most people say I'm a no good deed.

[Sara Bareilles]

Oh, interesting. And you're defying gravity in my head.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Oh, thank you. Oh, my God. That means a lot. Because I am so stressed every time I get, like, running to the levitator. Please, God, let me get in the levitator. Thank God I've never had a no fly show. Knock on wood. But that is. Yeah, I'm always so stressed about wow.

[Sara Bareilles]

After all this time. Wow.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

I know, right? It's a miracle.

[Sara Bareilles]

Okay, talk to us about wizarding knife.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

I. I just feel. I just feel so connected to her because it's the one moment that we. It's the first moment we really get to see her so vulnerable. And I feel like in that moment is when I'm connecting to when I was sitting in the balcony at the Gershwin. And so it just feels very full circle to me. And it also feels like. It feels like I'm able to communicate to the youth of the world, kind of like channel the next generation of artists through that song. Because that is when Elphaba is at her youngest and most vulnerable moment. It's also. It's also the only song where we really get to see her feel joy, true joy and the possibilities. And so for me, optimism. Yes, optimism. Hope. For me, personally, gosh, I just Talking about the joy of this role, that. That's such a joyful moment to get to sing that song. And I will say it has changed because I also used to be a no good deed Elphaba. Like, that was my. That was my jam. And it does feel good to really, like, put all of your angst and anger and despair and, you know, fuel into that moment. So I. I do think, like, singing wise, no Good deed is still my favorite song to. But I think acting wise, I would say wizard and I.

[Sara Bareilles]

How is wizard and I singing wise for you? Cause all the women say it's criminal that they have to sing that off the bat.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Yes. I have always heard that my whole life. And people will be like, God, don't you hate Wizard? I was. It's so hard to sing that. And I don't know why. It is like the. I don't want to say easiest song for me to sing, but say it.

[Gloria Estefan]

Say it, say it, say it.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

I will say out of the three, out of. Out of wizard and I, no Good Deed in Defying Gravity. Wizard and I is the easiest song for me to sing vocally.

[Sara Bareilles]

Wow.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Vocally, yes.

[Sara Bareilles]

What's crazy is our last episode was Seikon Sangblo, and she had a similar feeling about wizard and I. But that is so rare for everyone we've spoken to.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

I know. And I'm so curious.

[Gloria Estefan]

I'm like, yeah, we're like 50 girls in, and there are five people who've answered the wizard and I.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Like, I can't imagine. Imagine starting your first song as Defying Gravity or no Good Deed. You know, that's like. Yeah, but at least wizard and I. It's like, it's a nice.

[Sara Bareilles]

Works you up to it?

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Yeah.

[Sara Bareilles]

Yeah.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

It's, like, in a very, like, mixy place. And then you have some belt and then you're like, back to Mix World, and then you have it all a.

[Gloria Estefan]

Little warm up, you know?

[Kristin Chenoweth]

I don't know. I feel like I'm, like, singing.

[Sara Bareilles]

I'm loving this redemption era for the wizard and I on the podcast.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Yes. I'm upset, but I feel like clearly something must be wrong with me. I'm, like, singing it incorrectly. If I'm like, oh, it's the breeze, I must be doing something wrong. There's something definitely wrong with how I sing that song. Oh, my goodness. That's Laurel.

[Sara Bareilles]

This has been so much fun. Thank you for doing this.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

You all, too. Thank you so much. I love what y'all are doing. It's awesome. And just so you know, like. Like, you are so beloved in this community. Everybody talks about you all the time. No, it's true. So thanks for doing what you do, because, you know, it's important on every level, on all levels, every aspect.

[Sara Bareilles]

So fun. Well, thank you so much.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Thank you so much.

[Sara Bareilles]

You've been listening to Sentimental Men.

[Gloria Estefan]

We'd like to say a big thank you to our editor, Anthony Appetangelo, and.

[Sara Bareilles]

A special thanks to Mikaela Reynolds and Julia DeMarzo, our photographer and logo designer.

[Gloria Estefan]

And of course, thanks to everyone at the Broadway Podcast Network.

[Sara Bareilles]

You can find sentimental men on Instagram, TikTok and X @sentmenpod, or you can.

[Gloria Estefan]

Email [e-mail] till next time.

[Sara Bareilles]

I'm Quincy.

[Gloria Estefan]

And I'm Kevin. I don't know about you, but I personally feel like the world could use a lot more kindness right now. Hi, it's Robert Peter Paul, your friendly neighborhood VPN host of the Art of Kindness, a podcast that spotlights people in the arts who make the world, well, you guessed it, kinder. From iconic cons like Carol Burnett to Tony winners like Stephanie J. Block to Olympians like Lori Hernandez, we've featured so many wonderful guests from all corners of the biz to give you intimate conversations and kindness tips. I'm thrilled to say we're returning for a fourth season. Woop woop. This World Kindness Week with guests like Ian Armitage, Judith Light, Betty Hu, Corbin Blue, and more. So please join our kindness community over at VPN fmak, and I do hope you're doing as a okay as you can. Let's build a kinder world.

[Kristin Chenoweth]

Aww.

[Gloria Estefan]

Audio hug.