SEO 101 Ep 507 Summary

Podcast: SEO 101
Hosts: Ross Dunn & Scott Van Achte
Date: July 31, 2025
Main Topics: WordPress Vulnerabilities, ChatGPT Search Visibility, Generative Engine Optimization (GEO) vs. SEO, Google AI Search Trends, Query Fan-Out

Episode Overview

This episode is packed with discussion on evolving SEO realities in an AI-driven search landscape. Ross and Scott tackle recent WordPress security issues, surprising findings about ChatGPT search visibility, key tactics for optimizing for both search engines and generative engines, Google’s latest AI search features, and the technical “Query Fan-Out” approach. The tone is practical, slightly irreverent, and heavy on actionable advice, especially for small-to-medium businesses navigating the future of search.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Critical WordPress Vulnerabilities

[00:52 - 04:38]

• WordPress AI Engine Vulnerability:

  • Major exploit (remote code execution) affecting ~100,000 sites.
  • Four critical fixes in July 2025 alone; nine in 2024.
  • Scott: “If you're using this plugin, be very vigilant and keep it updated regularly.”

• General WordPress Security Tips:

  • Importance of timely updates—dedicated staff + third-party monitoring tools recommended.
  • Ross: “The clever/slash/scary part about being hacked is you don't really know about it until they decide to show you... you could have been hacked months ago and every single backup you have is totally useless.” [02:11]

• WooCommerce Customer Review Plugin:

  • XSS flaw impacting ~80,000 sites; attackers can inject and execute scripts.
  • Scott: “These hackers could do whatever they want. Keep it updated.”

2. ChatGPT Conversations Showing Up in Google Search

[04:43 - 08:19]

• Issue: Shared ChatGPT conversations are being indexed by Google and can appear in public search results.

• How to Check:

  • site:chat.openai.com/share + keyword in Google.
  • Brand-related searches may show surprisingly broad results if business names are composite words.

• Implications:

  • Sensitive business information, campaign ideas, or client details could be exposed if mistakenly “shared.”
  • Disabling public chats in TeamGPT recommended.
  • Scott (joking): “If you're having a love affair with your AI, well, your mom knows now...” [04:51]

• Ross: “Based on the current laws, everything you do type into ChatGPT is saved and is available for law enforcement... Never type anything in a search like that that's really private.” [07:51]

3. SEO vs. GEO: Optimizing for Generative Engines

[08:45 - 15:39]

• Generative Engine Optimization (GEO):

  • Focuses on AI platforms like Perplexity, ChatGPT, DeepSeek, etc.
  • Many best practices overlap with traditional SEO.

• Key Tactics:

  • Clear Headings reflecting actual content and structured hierarchy.
  • Compelling Data Points: At least one statistic or case study per section.
    • Ross: “Telling AI how to weave in stats is way harder than you might think. And...they still fake stuff all the time.” [10:07]
  • Authoritative References: Industry quotes/studies to support credibility.
  • Geo-Focused Edits: Shorter sentences, numbered steps, key takeaways boxes, and TL;DR summaries improve AI interpretability.
  • Quick Summary Recommendation: Use concise subheadings, real data, conversational Q&A, structured markup.

• AI Content Detection:

  • Google prioritizes value over “obvious AI traits.”
  • Ross: “It doesn't matter if Google...can detect that you've written something in AI, it's the quality.” [12:17]

4. Local SEO Note: Google Business Profile Reviews

[15:39 - 16:38]

• Issue with reviews not appearing for years was resolved immediately after contacting Google Support.
• Ross: “I swear there should be trumpets blaring somewhere. That's just amazing.” [16:02]
• Takeaway: Don’t give up—sometimes support works.

5. Should You Still Invest in SEO in an AI Search World?

[17:42 - 23:57]

• Answer: Yes, content remains essential despite AI overviews and new AI modes.

• Enterprise vs. Local: Most shakeups hit enterprise SEO first; SMB and local less affected—but must prepare.

• Dan Taylor Quote:

  • “In an AI first search world, visibility starts before the click. The brands that stay active will be the ones users see. And remember, this is no longer just about blue links... it’s about brand recognition and building visibility across the multiple faces of the modern search ecosystem.” [19:33]

• Ross: “Paid traffic dries up the second you stop paying. Organic builds on itself. It's one of the few channels that gives you more tomorrow for what you do today.” [21:38]

• SEO in 2025:

  • Even more important to produce versatile content that appeals to multiple intents (snippets, video, AI outputs).
  • Invest in cornerstone content, YouTube, and consolidating valuable resources.

6. Google AI Search Trends: Brands, Citations & Volatility

[23:57 - 25:24]

• BrightEdge Study:
  • In “AI Mode,” brands appear in 90% of responses; in “AI Overviews,” only 43%.
  • More source cards/citations in AI Overviews, but with volatile results.
• Strategy: Be comprehensive (for AI mode) and authoritative (for AI Overviews).

7. Query Fan-Out Technique in Google AI Mode

[25:24 - 31:23]

• Definition:

  • Google AI now “fans out” a query into multiple background searches (not just a single search intent).
  • Example: Search for “activities in Nashville” nets results for dining, family outings, etc., by running background searches.

• Robbie Stein (Google VP):

  • “The technique allows for related searches to be conducted in the background, utilizing large language models and real time data to generate comprehensive responses that can unmentioned topics.” [27:45]

• Implications:

  • Deep search can run “dozens or even hundreds of queries at a time.”
  • SEO attribution is increasingly difficult due to complex, multi-intent pathways.
  • Search is less about keywords, more about inferred topics and comprehensive context.
  • Google’s shopping catalog updates “about 2 billion times every hour.” [31:12]

8. ChatGPT Indexing Google; Bing AI Indexing Tips

[31:26 - 35:07]

• ChatGPT Scrapes Google:

  • Experiments show ChatGPT can rapidly pick up newly indexed (even nonsense) terms from Google, but not from Bing, DuckDuckGo, etc.
  • “Symbiotic relationship”—Google shows ChatGPT results, and ChatGPT uses Google's index.

• Tip for AI Search Indexing:

  • Bing recommends using the lastmod tag in XML sitemaps—this is the top signal for AI-driven indexing.
  • Most major plugins (like Yoast) automatically use this.
  • XML sitemap changefreq and priority tags are ignored by Bing.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Ross: “Paid traffic dries up the second you stop paying. Organic builds on itself. It's one of the few channels that gives you more tomorrow for what you do today.” [21:38]
• Scott: “If you're having a love affair with your AI, well, your mom knows now, so you gotta be careful, right?” [04:51]
• Ross: “It doesn't matter if Google...can detect that you've written something in AI, it's the quality. So don't obsess over obvious AI traits in your content.” [12:17]
• Ross: “I swear there should be trumpets blaring somewhere. That's just amazing. I've heard nothing but bad, negative experiences about it [Google support].” [16:02]
• Robbie Stein (Google): “There's 50 billion products in the shopping catalog and ... it's updated, I think about 2 billion times every hour or so. Geez, it's truly mind numbing how much change is happening right now.” [30:58]

Important Timestamps

• [00:52] — WordPress AI Engine vulnerability details
• [04:43] — ChatGPT conversations showing up in Google
• [08:45] — SEO vs. Generative Engine Optimization tactics
• [15:39] — Google Business Profile review problem solved
• [17:42] — Should you still invest in SEO? (AI search era)
• [23:57] — BrightEdge study on brands in Google AI features
• [25:24] — Query Fan-Out explained (Google AI search)
• [31:26] — ChatGPT scraping Google Index; Bing lastmod sitemap tip

Conclusion

This episode provides a practical and forward-looking perspective on the evolving search landscape, heavily influenced by generative AI and Google’s newest approaches. Key takeaways for marketers and website owners:

• Stay vigilant about website security and keep plugins updated.
• Understand the increasing public visibility of AI-shared content.
• Optimize for both search engines and AI-driven generative engines with well-structured, data-backed, and authoritative content.
• Recognize the value of ongoing SEO in an AI-first world, especially in building persistent visibility beyond just “blue links.”
• Adapt to changes in how Google and AI engines process, infer, and present results—move beyond traditional keyword focus.

Be proactive, emphasize quality, and be ready to adapt as AI continues to reshape SEO.