Podcast Summary: "From Podcasting To AI: Building Real Audiences That Convert"

The Best SEO Podcast: Defining the Future of Search with LLM Visibility™
Host: Matthew Bertram (matthewbertram.com)
Guest: Chris Krimitsos (Founder, PodFest)
Date: December 1, 2025

Episode Overview

In this episode, Matthew Bertram is joined by Chris Krimitsos, founder of PodFest and community builder for digital creators. The discussion centers on the evolution of content creation from podcasting to AI-driven strategies, with a focus on building real, converting audiences in an era increasingly dominated by large language models (LLMs) and answer engines. Together, they explore actionable strategies for creators and brands, discuss how AI is changing discoverability, and offer practical insights into influencer partnerships, multi-channel content syndication, and leveraging both human and synthetic content.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Evolution of Podcasting & Content Creation

[00:58–02:20]

• Chris recounts the rise of PodFest, which started 12 years ago, grew virtually during COVID, and set Guinness World Records for attendance.
• Podcasting has shifted from primarily audio to a strong emphasis on video, now spreading internationally.
• Chris describes his unique vantage point: "My perspective is literally thousands of creators. So I see what is possible on so many different levels from time to time." [01:46]

2. Human vs. AI Content – The Coming Deluge

[03:47–04:29]

• Matthew and Chris warn about the exponential growth of AI-created content. Video and audio (podcasts), while currently less spammed by AI, remain vital for authentic audience building.

• Chris: "With AI, it's going to get dicey because I don't think people understand the amount of content that AI could create on its own." [03:47]

• Matthew: "From a visibility standpoint, [LLMs] need a lot of human interaction to train their data sets so the synthetic data doesn't come in." [02:20]

• Recommendation: Start building and owning your audience now, as algorithms might prioritize human content over AI in future discoverability.

3. Personal Branding and Entity SEO

[04:29–06:57]

• Matthew shares the challenge of unifying digital identities across platforms due to variations in naming (“Matthew” vs. “Matt”), which confuses knowledge graphs.
• Introduces the "7-11-4" framework:
  • 7 hours of content.
  • 11 brand impressions.
  • Across 4 different channels.
• This is key for brand recognition and trust-building, especially when AI and search engines weigh different signals.
• Matthew: “If they binge, listen to your podcast… you have more content consumption by a decision maker than somebody else that doesn’t." [05:49]

4. Long-Form to Short-Form Content Strategy

[06:57–12:50]

• Chris advises content creators to structure long-form content with a strategy for extracting short, shareable clips:

  • “When you’re doing a long-form interview, you need to think to yourself: how many five-minute clips did I get that are clippable?” [07:12]
  • Shannon Sharp’s Club Shay Shay is cited as the gold standard: intentional clip creation, strategic viral questions, smart thumbnail planning.

• Platform economics matter:

  • YouTube is described as the best "home base" due to monetization structure and discoverability.
  • Shorts and other platforms can drive massive reach but don't always lead to revenue.

5. Building No-Like-Trust & The Power of Relatable Content

[12:50–15:27]

• Discussion on the importance of building trust and humanizing your brand through relatable, non-commercial content ("behind-the-scenes," food pics, casual moments).
• Matthew: “People got to know who you are. They got to, like, have some kind of association or like you before they care about what you say.” [13:16]
• Experiments with offbeat content (e.g., meditation snippet clips, food posts) can out-perform promotional messages in building audience rapport.

6. Brand & Creator Partnerships — Case Studies & Best Practices

[16:07–23:58]

• Chris stresses the inefficacy of controlling partnerships too tightly: "When you play scared with creators, it doesn't work well. Lean on them… and have them give you suggestions." [16:53]
• Case Studies:
  • Golf reviewer "Let's Play Through" & Play Better: Mutually beneficial, long-term partnership leading to millions in sales.
  • Horse Radio Network & Vibrating Pitchfork: Niche creator drove more sales from a tiny, targeted audience than any retail placement.
• Actionable Advice:
  • Look beyond CPMs (cost per thousand): "If you could create a true partner… that repetition, by that end of the year, you're going to see some movement." [20:10]
  • For B2B, influencer partnerships in niche markets can yield outsized returns due to scarcity of relevant creators.

7. LLMs & The SEO Disruption

[23:58–27:48]

• Traditional SEO and Google are losing ground to LLMs and social search behaviors.
• Visibility hinges on brand demand and authentic signals (shares, likes, follows, search volume for your brand).
• Matthew: “You need to build a unified strategy on multiple platforms with multiple creators, with multiple voices.” [26:36]
• Chris: “More content is going to get created… a year from now it's going to be like a billion [pieces an hour], because the AI could create a thousand angles on the same piece.” [27:48]
• Insight: Now is the time to invest in authentic creators; the value of real human influence will only increase as AI-generated noise grows.

8. Live Shopping, Accountability & Attribution

[31:59–36:23]

• Live shopping is emerging as a trustworthy, “real” format amidst AI-driven content chaos—especially powerful for both B2C and B2B.
• Influencer partnerships provide both direct response and long-term brand lift—but tracking attribution requires careful customer service processes.
• Chris: “What you're looking for right now is signs of life that things move the needle…. You're not counting the branding you're getting because they're talking many times to millions of people.” [42:50]
• The “back catalog” effect: Podcast and video episodes accrue value over time.

9. Getting Started — Practical Steps for Brands

[38:13–41:41]

• Start Ugly: Brands must overcome perfectionism and get into the creator/content space, even if imperfect at first.
• For B2B: Start with a YouTube channel (syndicate content to other socials), or partner with niche creators to seed content and brand messaging.
• Find creators that align with your values/style—don’t always chase the largest, but those with engaged audiences.
• Test partnerships for 90–180 days. Let creators propose content ideas—they’re likely to know what resonates.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Chris Krimitsos:
  "With AI, it's going to get dicey because I don't think people understand the amount of content that AI could create on its own." [03:47]

• “When you play scared with creators, it doesn't work well.” [16:53]

• “You could be a giant on TikTok and Instagram and barely make a couple grand a month. So it's like you really got to know where the levers of income come in.” [09:19]

• Matthew Bertram:
  "If they binge, listen to your podcast… you have more content consumption by a decision maker than somebody else that doesn’t." [05:49]

• "You need to build a unified strategy on multiple platforms with multiple creators, with multiple voices." [26:36]

• "You have to treat the creator with respect… there's only a few in every industry. So you want to be very good to all of them because they all talk as well, they compare notes." [22:55]

Recommended Actions for Brands & Marketers

• Start now: Secure your audience and digital identity before the AI-content flood intensifies.
• Invest in Human Connections: Prioritize creator partnerships for both branding and direct response.
• Multi-Channel Approach: Use frameworks like 7-11-4 to ensure broad and repeated exposure.
• Test, Learn, Iterate: Begin with short pilots, be open to unconventional content, and allow creators freedom to experiment.
• Track Intangibles: Go beyond clicks—listen for qualitative signals, brand mentions, direct inquiries.
• Private Label Opportunities: Once trust is established with creators, consider signature product lines.

How to Connect & Get Involved

• Chris Krimitsos:

  • Podfestexpo.com
  • Find Chris on social (@ChrisKrimitsos)
  • Attend PodFest to meet and learn from creators; next event: January 15–18, 2026

• Matthew Bertram:

  • MatthewBertram.com
  • EWR Digital for advisory and fractional CMO work, especially in B2B and LLM Visibility™

Timestamps for Key Segments

• 00:58–02:20: Introduction & PodFest story
• 03:47–04:29: The AI flood of content & urgency for authentic creators
• 04:29–06:57: Personal branding, digital identity & the 7-11-4 framework
• 06:57–12:50: Long-form/short-form content strategies & Shannon Sharpe case
• 16:07–23:58: Structuring brand/creator partnerships, CPMs, and key case studies
• 23:58–27:48: LLMs, entity SEO, and discoverability disruption
• 31:59–36:23: Live shopping, tracking impact, cross-channel attribution
• 38:13–41:41: How brands can practically start—YouTube, creator partnerships, timeframes
• 42:50–45:02: Attribution, brand lift, and the value of branding vs. direct clicks

Closing Thoughts

The era of AI-generated content is here, and standing out requires authentic, multi-channel human connection anchored by trusted creators. Brands should urgently adapt to this new landscape, leveraging both influencer relationships and their own content hubs, to build resilience against the coming content deluge. As Chris says: “You have to get in the game—start ugly, but start now.”