The Shawn Ryan Show – Episode #10: Marcus Capone – SEAL Team Six Explosive Breacher/Psychedelic Therapy Advocate

Date: June 24, 2021
Length: ~4 hours
Guests:

• Marcus Capone (former SEAL Team Six breacher, co-founder of VETS)
• Amber Capone (his wife, VETS co-founder)

Overview

In this candid and powerful episode, Shawn Ryan sits down with Marcus Capone, a former Navy SEAL Team Six breacher and co-founder of Veterans Exploring Treatment Solutions (VETS), alongside his wife Amber. The interview explores Marcus's decorated yet harrowing military career, the toll of years in special operations on his mind and family, and the groundbreaking journey that led him and Amber to become leading advocates for psychedelic-assisted therapy for veterans suffering from traumatic brain injury (TBI), PTSD, and CTE.

The conversation spans Marcus's deployments, particularly his experience with Red Wings, the aftermath of loss and trauma, his struggle to transition into civilian life, and ultimately his and Amber's deep involvement in pioneering alternative mental health support for struggling veterans.

Major Topics & Key Discussion Points

1. Military Career & The Cost of War

• Team Selection & Early Career

  • Marcus trained as a Navy SEAL, advanced to SEAL Team 10, and screened successfully for SEAL Team Six/DEVGRU.
  • He relates the randomness of fate in deployment assignments, describing a coin toss that sent his platoon to Germany—and spared them the losses suffered by their sister platoon in Operation Red Wings.

    “We flip a coin and we lost. So our platoon lost and we went to Germany and... the other platoon went to Afghanistan, you know, and the rest is kind of history there.” (22:00)

• Red Wings & the Reality of Loss

  • Marcus recounts the chaos of learning about the downed helicopter and the loss of close friends, the confusion and helplessness of being unable to support his teammates, and his realization that “we’re not Superman.”

    “This was actually the first time where I thought, like, we’re not Superman. Like, we’re really not. And I thought I was. ... It’s not real. This is real.” (27:30–28:21)

• DEVGRU Deployments and Trauma

  • Shifts to discussing tempo at SEAL Team Six and the accumulation of losses, especially the death of close friend Josh Harris.
  • Marcus describes how years of relentless deployments, loss, and trauma slowly eroded his identity and coping abilities.

2. Breaching Operations & Brain Injury

• Role as a Breacher

  • Describes in detail the work of a breacher: setting and detonating hundreds if not thousands of explosive charges, often inside minimum safe distances, and rarely under controlled conditions in combat.

    “Sub-concussive blows are actually worse than, you know, concussions... It’s the constant, you know, the charge goes off, blast wave goes through you... The end result is ... CTE.” (104:33)

• Physical and Mental Consequences

  • Details a litany of injuries: migraines, arthritis, nightmares, cognitive decline, audio and visual dysfunction, rage, and ultimately, a profound sense of being broken.
  • Marcus connects the dots from breaching to TBI, operator syndrome, and chronic traumatic encephalopathy (CTE), which is commonly found in NFL players.

• Medication Spiral

  • Outlines how military medicine offered only a cocktail of pills—antidepressants (SSRIs), benzos, sleeping pills, focus stimulants—with little hope and mounting side effects.

    “That was the SOP... That was a concoction of drugs. And so I stayed on those for seven years.” (94:34)

3. Family Perspective: Amber Capone

• Amber’s Story

  • Amber’s voice brings emotional gravity—she describes losing “the man I met” to the teams and war, years of separation, and progressively worsening symptoms at home.

    “The person I met, the larger than life person that I met was gone and he had been replaced by like a monster.” (166:15)

• Survival and Despair

  • The family lived in survival mode for years, with Amber considering leaving Marcus to protect their children from his self-destruction and rage.
  • She describes her desperate search for brain clinics, eventually learning about CTE and the profound risks of further decline (170:00+).

• Psychedelic Therapy as Last Hope

  • Their breakthrough came when, after all else failed, a fellow SEAL’s miraculous recovery through psychedelics inspired Amber to advocate for Marcus to try ibogaine-assisted therapy.

4. Psychedelic Therapy: The Journey to Healing

• The Ibogaine Experience

  • Marcus describes his journey to a retreat in Mexico, consuming ibogaine in a medically supervised, structured therapeutic environment, with pre/post-integration support.

    “You take a... handshake dose... If your body’s good, they give you the flood dose. And... within like an hour, two hours, you start hearing some buzzing...” (135:00+)

  • Reports a “13 hour” ordeal of intense visions, emotional catharsis, and physical purging, but ultimately a “reboot” of mind and mood.
  • Upon awakening, Amber saw a “light switch” moment—“That’s Marcus when I met him in college... the happy, go-lucky quarterback.” (143:17)
  • Marcus and Amber both stress: This isn’t a miracle fix, but for those ready and willing, it provides a dramatic and lasting transformation.

• Scientific Promise & Advocacy

  • The Capones organized the nonprofit VETS (Veterans Exploring Treatment Solutions) to fund psychedelic treatments for other operators—helping over 350 veterans by 2021.
  • Marcus spells out, in clear terms, the risk of continuing with the status quo: “We need to get in front of it... There’s nothing on the planet working better for mental health problems than psychedelic therapies.” (215:00)

• Against the Grain

  • The episode directly challenges the pharmaceutical industry and federal law:

    “Nobody who makes money wants to give somebody a pill one time that gets better and walks away…” (145:11)

  • The Capones discuss efforts to push bipartisan legislation in Texas and elsewhere (e.g., HB 1802) to promote research and legal access to psychedelics.

5. Exploring the Science

• Default Mode Network (DMN) and Brain Injury
  • Shawn details his research: Psychedelics disrupt the brain’s DMN—where anxiety, self-criticism and ego reside—allowing the “rest of the brain” to awaken, restore connectivity, and rewire entrenched trauma. (216:00+)
  • The Capones are collaborating on Stanford research to study whether ibogaine can promote neurogenesis/glial cell growth, potentially offering hope in TBI/CTE, dementia, ALS, and Alzheimer’s.

6. Living Proof & Spreading the Word

• Personal Transformation and Acceptance

  • Marcus speaks openly of depression, anger, and suicidal thoughts, and the relief and renewal that followed his ibogaine therapy.
  • Amber, for her part, expresses a journey from skepticism to gratitude and spiritual openness, and now leads VETS’ advocacy and fundraising, helping destigmatize and share this new path with the world.

• Current Impact and Future Goals

  • VETS is raising millions, expanding access, supporting research, and building a support network for therapy and reintegration.
  • The Capones field hundreds of requests, support spouses, educate legislators, and continue pushing for mainstream acceptance.

Memorable Quotes & Notable Moments

• On the Shock of Loss and Trauma

  “It was actually the first time where I thought, like, we’re not Superman. ... It’s real.” — Marcus (27:30)

• On the Role of a Breacher

  “We were well inside that minimum safe distance... that blast wave, it is really you up.” — Marcus (109:15)

• On Psychedelics

  “Nothing has this much of an effect as psychedelic assisted therapies. So the success rates are just off the charts.” — Amber (201:48)

• On Ibogaine’s Power

  “It is the most powerful psychedelic on the planet, hands down.” — Marcus (137:33)

• On the Transformation

  “It was like I saw him for the first time. ... His entire countenance and demeanor was 100% the guy that I met.” — Amber (189:44)

• On Living With TBI/PTSD

  “I was everywhere else, getting lost, taking your daughter to volleyball, drinking, forgetting to pick up kids from activities...” — Marcus (123:39)

• On Hope for Veterans

  “There's nothing on the planet that is working better for mental health problems than psychedelic therapies.” — Marcus (215:00)

Key Timestamps

• Red Wings & Loss – 21:40–34:30
• Breaching & Brain Injury – 103:50–113:15
• Brain Clinics, Medications, & Downward Spiral – 91:13–100:00
• Family Despair & Amber’s Perspective – 148:40–167:00
• Discovering CTE & Psychedelic Option – 168:10–173:30
• Marcus’s Psychedelic Experience – 135:00–143:52
• Scientific Discussion & DMN – 215:20–223:15
• VETS Organizational Mission & Legislation – 254:26–259:33
• Call to Action: VETS Website and How to Help – 259:58–262:12

Episode Flow & Tone

The interview is unflinchingly raw, humorous, and direct, with both Marcus and Shawn speaking as seasoned veterans who pull no punches about the struggles, the failures of conventional medicine, and the hard-won hope they’ve found in sometimes-misunderstood therapies. Amber offers a counterpoint of compassion and grit—detailing a family’s survival through trauma and her emergence as a formidable advocate for healing.

Links & Resources

• VETS (Veterans Exploring Treatment Solutions)
• Time Magazine article on Marcus Capone
• [Stanford research partnership with VETS]
• [Texas House Bill 1802 for psychedelic research]
• [Podcast episode description and show links]

Conclusion: For Those in Need

If you or a veteran you love is experiencing persistent symptoms of TBI, PTSD, CTE, or depression, and standard therapies failed, know there are new and powerful options—rooted in both thousands of years of traditional use and the latest Western neuroscience. The Capones’ story is both a clarion call for urgent change and a message of hope: profound healing is possible, and the community they’ve built is ready to help bring it to others.

For more information or to support/seek help: Visit vetsolutions.org

“We are here to help. There’s no ego. I don’t care how tough you were before... we love you, and we’re going to make sure you’re okay.” — Marcus Capone (262:03)