Shawn Ryan Show #246: Vanessa Marin — Sex Doctor Explains Why Bad Sex Destroys Marriages and How to Prevent It

Date: October 20, 2025
Host: Shawn Ryan
Guest: Vanessa Marin, Licensed Psychotherapist, Sex Therapist, Author

Episode Overview

Shawn Ryan hosts sex therapist Vanessa Marin for a candid conversation about the realities of intimacy in long-term relationships. The episode explores why sexual satisfaction often fades in marriage, how this decline contributes to marital problems or divorce, and—most importantly—practical strategies couples can use to reignite their passion and maintain healthy intimacy. Marin shares scientific insights, actionable tools, and honest, sometimes hilarious anecdotes to normalize open dialogue about sex and relationships. The tone is relatable, frank, and empowering.

Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Introduction and Episode Purpose

• Shawn wants to "lighten up" the show with an essential, often-taboo subject: sex in relationships.
• Vanessa Marin introduces herself, noting over 20 years of clinical experience and a passion for helping couples bridge the gap from disconnected to deeply intimate.

"So many of us are desperate for more from our relationships...more connection, more closeness, more intimacy. And so many of us are wondering, like, what happened to that couple who was madly in love?"
— Vanessa Marin (01:08)

2. Why Does Sexual Intimacy Decline in Long-Term Relationships?

Biological and Cultural Factors

• The "honeymoon phase" is chemically intense but temporary; our bodies can't sustain those neurotransmitter levels beyond 6–12 months.
• After commitment, couples often "take their foot off the gas" and stop doing the things that built connection.

"Our bodies are not capable of sustaining that level of intensity for longer than six to twelve months...It's the equivalent of being high on cocaine."
— Vanessa Marin (08:46)

Lifestyle and Emotional Factors

• Unhealthy habits (e.g., overeating, stress) lower sexual desire.
• Life's demands (work, kids, routines) cause partners to drift into being "roommates" or "business partners."

3. Barriers to Intimacy: Communication & Vulnerability

Initiation Dynamics

• Initiating sex is vulnerable and often falls disproportionately on one partner (usually men in heterosexual couples).
• "Annoying" or indirect initiations (e.g., jokes, quick gropes) can lead to misunderstanding and rejection.

"What our partner is really doing, even if he's doing it really immaturely, really unskillfully, what he's actually asking in that moment is, I want to feel close to you right now. Will you connect with me right now?"
— Vanessa Marin (16:39)

Solution: The Initiation Styles Model (19:00)

• Every partner has a preferred style, e.g.:
  • "Take Care of Me"—prefers emotional connection, gradual build-up.
  • "Play With Me"—enjoys playful, teasing approaches.
• Ask your partner directly about their preferences.

4. How Much Sex Should Couples Have? Frequency vs. Quality

• There's no universal "right" number—quality matters more than hitting a quota.
• Simply having more sex doesn't guarantee satisfaction; enjoying the experience is crucial.

"If you're pushing yourselves to have sex just to hit a quota, it's probably not gonna be very good sex. And there's a huge connection between our enjoyment of sex and our desire for it."
— Vanessa Marin (21:40)

Research Insights (84:14):

• Once a week is often cited as the minimum threshold for happiness, but even two to three times per month, if satisfying, can sustain contentment.
• "An object in motion stays in motion": having more sex makes it easier to keep being sexual together.

5. The Pleasure Gap: Why Are Women Less Satisfied?

• Only 9% of women report intercourse as their most pleasurable activity (23:36).
• The clitoris is the center of female pleasure, but most heteronormative sex prioritizes male enjoyment and overlooks clitoral stimulation.

"The most sensitive part of our body as women is the clitoris. It's the only organ in the entire human body that exists solely for the purpose of pleasure...compare that to the penis: 2 to 3,000 [nerve endings]."
— Vanessa Marin (24:50)

• Hands, mouths, and toys are more effective for female orgasms than intercourse alone.

6. Communication: Five Key Conversations for Relationship Success

Marin outlines five conversations every couple should have (30:38):

1. Acknowledgement: Get comfortable discussing sex.
   • Start with sharing positive memories (e.g., "What's your favorite sexual memory with me?").
2. Connection: Address emotional intimacy and how it intertwines with physical intimacy.
   • Understand if your partner feels emotionally connected through sex or needs emotion to precede sex.
3. Desire: What does each partner need to feel open to sex? Discuss initiation preferences and drive types ("spontaneous" vs. "responsive"—62:12).
4. Pleasure: How to ensure both partners are satisfied (focus on clitoral stimulation, feedback, positive reinforcement).
5. Exploration: Introduce novelty to avoid routine. Re-try things you enjoyed in the past, use tools like "the dream scheme" to propose new ideas.

7. Overcoming Ruts and Keeping Things Spicy

• Scheduling sex isn't unromantic—it's an act of respect and prioritization (99:16).

"We can schedule it in a way that it's more about the respect that we're showing for each other and for our connection of, I know that our life is busy, it's full...I want to make sure, no matter what, we have time to spend together."
— Vanessa Marin (101:29)

• Lingerie, role play, sex toys, dirty talk—all can be fun if authentically approached.
• Small adjustments (positions, angles, contexts) can reactivate novelty.

8. Emotional and Physical Maintenance

• Mutual attraction is maintained when both partners make an effort—appearance, compliments, small gestures matter.
• If a partner lets themselves "go" (59:29), approach the subject with empathy and focus on self-care and respect.

"I've just been noticing lately that you're not treating yourself with the same love and respect that I normally see...I just want to check in on you and see how you're doing."
— Vanessa Marin (60:08)

9. The Roommate Phase: Getting Closer Again

• Marin’s "GET Intimate" technique (106:18):
  • Gratitude: Voice appreciation for even small things.
  • Eye Contact: Demonstrates presence and attention.
  • Touch: Non-sexual physical affection (hugs, kisses, hand-holding) fosters security and bonding.

10. Woman's Perspective: What Men Need to Know (116:50)

1. Slow Down: Women want more teasing, gentle touch, and build-up (ideally 5–10 minutes of non-genital foreplay, more if possible).
2. Gentleness: The clitoris is extremely sensitive; use soft, light pressure ("think about how you'd touch your eyelid"—118:41).
3. Consistency: If a woman says "don't stop," keep doing exactly what you’re doing.

Notable Quotes & Moments

• “Sex is not just putting body parts in other body parts. Sex is the way we express love for each other, a way that we create intimacy... It's a journey that we take together.”
  (52:32)

• “If you're treating your body like crap, you're not gonna wanna be intimate with your partner...”
  (13:13)

• “Faking orgasms—why are women doing it? Because it feels easier.”
  (45:51)

• On communication:
  “We can't have a great sex life or a great relationship without communicating. But really, my goal is to help people not roll their eyes...It can actually be fun.”
  (138:35)

Important Timestamps

| Segment | Timestamp | |---------------------------------------|-------------| | Show intro, Marin bio | 00:42–03:24 | | Why desire fades | 06:13–08:48 | | The "fuck first" rule | 10:15 | | Initiation styles & vulnerability | 14:35–19:00 | | How much sex should we have? | 21:34–22:36, 84:14 | | The pleasure gap & clitoral focus | 23:33–25:50 | | Conversations for better sex | 30:38–38:33 | | Connection & aftercare | 38:33–43:09 | | Scheduling/planning sex | 99:16–106:10| | GET Intimate technique | 106:18–113:09 | | Tips women wish men knew | 116:50–119:20| | AIGFs and future risks | 134:11–137:39| | Summing up: Communication is key | 138:26–139:18 |

Useful Tools & Practices

• Initiate sex earlier in the evening ("fuck first")
• Share gratitude every day
• Hug for 30 seconds, kiss for at least six
• Talk openly about what feels good—use positive, specific, actionable feedback
• Make eye contact during and outside of sex
• Proactively plan time for intimacy

Memorable Moments

• Shawn’s honest confusion about “who doesn't enjoy sex!” and shock at the statistics (22:36–23:44).
• Vanessa’s scientific explanation of the clitoris, nerves, and why intercourse is insufficient for most women (24:50).
• The fun analogy of lingerie being like “wrapping a present” (77:05).
• Laughter over the “boob honk” and playful banter about initiation (14:35–16:39).

Final Takeaways

• Open, frequent communication—before, during, and after sex—is foundational.
• Sex is not just physical—it encompasses emotional, psychological, and playful elements that require ongoing attention and maintenance.
• Practical small changes—compliments, gratitude, intentional scheduling, touch, and novelty—make disproportionate improvements.
• Both partners need to make and receive effort to feel desirable and cared for.
• Bad sex, or no sex, is a leading cause of marital problems—but is highly addressable.
• Seek support (therapy, courses, books) and prioritize your connection; it’s never “too late” to reignite intimacy.

“With just a few practical tools and techniques, you can find that spark again. You can recreate that connection again. So we are here to support in any way that we can.”
— Vanessa Marin (139:18)

Resources & Follow-Up:

• Book: Sex: Five Conversations That Will Transform Your Love Life, by Vanessa & Xander Marin
• Online courses and couples’ membership
• IG: @vanessamarintherapy for more tips and conversation starters