#278 Ro Khanna - Why is Congress Afraid to Subpoena Every Name in the Epstein Files?

Summary

The Shawn Ryan Show - Episode #278: Ro Khanna
"Why is Congress Afraid to Subpoena Every Name in the Epstein Files?"
Published: February 9, 2026

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Overview

In this powerful and unfiltered episode, Shawn Ryan sits down with Congressman Ro Khanna (CA-17) to dissect the recent partial release of the Epstein files, scrutinize Congressional inaction, and debate the mechanisms upholding America’s “two-tier” justice system. With the conversation pivoting between political courage, child exploitation, elite impunity, and broader cultural rot, Khanna offers an insider’s perspective on why so many names remain hidden, why meaningful accountability is elusive, and what must change for justice to prevail. The episode maintains a raw and direct tone, with both host and guest exasperated at the apparent protection of pedophiles among America’s power elite.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

The Epstein Files: Partial Release, Redactions, and Obstacles to Justice

• Khanna's Return & Justice Department Release

  • Ro Khanna returns following his prior appearance, during which, coincidentally, the DOJ released 50% of the Epstein files.
  • “I came on your podcast and then two weeks later, the Justice Department decides to release 50% of the files. So I figured maybe if I come back, they'll release the other 50%.” (Khanna, 02:14)

• Hostility to Accountability

  • Congressional and societal reticence to subpoena every name; the biggest abuser names redacted.
  • "That's kind of weird, don't you think? We'd want to know who's ordering hits and burying bodies..." (Ryan, 10:03)

• Narrative Control

  • The establishment’s shifting narrative; media soundbites downplaying the severity ("It’s not a crime to party with Epstein") and channeling inquiries into dead ends.
  • “I'm sorry, it is a fucking crime if you're fucking minors. What the hell is that?” (Ryan, 12:53)

• Protecting the Powerful, Exposing the Survivors

  • Files reveal abuser names redacted while survivor identities and images have been left unprotected.
  • “They didn't redact the survivors…they had nude images for young girls that they released, but they blacked out names of people who've sent Epstein an email saying, I enjoyed the nine year old Brazil...” (Khanna, 13:35)
  • Khanna and Ryan question DOJ’s priorities: protecting the guilty, re-traumatizing the victims.

Who's in the Files? Why Aren’t They Hauled Before Congress?

• Elites’ Names & Denials

  • Numerous prominent figures named: politicians, tech CEOs, billionaires, and influencers (including Clinton, Gates, Musk, Thiel, Jay Z, Reed Hoffman).
  • “Every single person you mentioned, if they are in the files, which many of them are, they need to be hauled in front of Congress.” (Khanna, 21:33)
  • Host and guest note bipartisan nature of implicated names.

• Culture of Elite Impunity

  • Khanna describes peer pressure among elites: “You had to be part of this Epstein network to be in the club.” (Khanna, 26:14)
  • Survivors were told not to report abuse: “We were told you can't call the police, you can't call the FBI because they know too many powerful people.” (Khanna, 26:40)

• No Investigations, No Charges

  • DOJ and FBI have not subpoenaed, questioned, or indicted anyone except Epstein and Maxwell.
  • “Post episode, they said, oh, he's a dead guy, and let's move on. They have not released the names of the coconspirators who they should have indicted.” (Khanna, 64:48)

• Congressional Power and Inaction

  • Congress has subpoena power, as evidenced by Clinton agreeing to testify, but refuses to exercise it broadly.
  • “You don't think that we could exercise that same power with all of these people in the files?” (Khanna, 64:40)

The Broader Culture of Sexual Exploitation and Violence

• Roblox, School Shooting Games, & Online Grooming

  • Discussion of online platforms (Roblox, teen chats) replicating abusive and violent events, sometimes with real victim names.
  • “They have the victims names that were killed in some of these incidents is actual characters in the game that you shoot and kill.” (Ryan, 07:16)
  • Schlep (a previous guest/activist) and Ryan’s team demonstrate how easily predators make contact with minors online (75:17 onward).

• Pornography & Societal Decay

  • Shawn and Ro link mainstream pornographic trends, child abuse, and the normalization of depravity.
  • “Do you know what the number one search thing on porn is? … It's incest. It's brother, mother, really? … That's what the most searched shit is in porn.” (Ryan, 78:40)
  • Both agree on urgent need for regulation to protect children, noting unprecedented accessibility and influence.

Accountability, Political Reform, & Structural Corruption

• Two-Tier Justice System

  • Systemic protection for the rich and powerful versus everyday Americans.
  • “There are two Americas, there are two tiers of justice. If you're rich, if you're powerful, if you fund universities and nonprofits, you can do the most heinous things.” (Khanna, 25:44)

• Why Is Congress Afraid?

  • Donors: Both parties’ donors implicated, causing representatives to tiptoe.
  • Tribalism: Trump discourages focus on issue. Fear of political retaliation.
  • “It's not for the country, it's for themselves. If that's what's fucking happening, every one of these son of a bitches need to be fucking voted out because they're in it for themselves.” (Ryan, 46:44)

• What Should Happen Next?

  • Khanna’s three-step plan:
    1. Congressional Hearings: Subpoena everyone in the files for questioning under oath.
    2. Unredacted Release: Push DOJ for the unredacted files; refuse to protect abusers.
    3. Public Accountability: Shame and sideline implicated individuals from positions of social power.
  • Calls for a 9/11 Commission–style inquiry to examine Epstein as a national security threat.

Memorable Quotes & Moments

• On Masculinity & Courage:

  • “To me, being a man means standing up and respecting… what you believe in, no matter what the fucking consequences are. That's what being a man is. Being a man is not keeping your fucking mouth shut because daddy's got a thumb on you.” (Ryan, 04:43)

• On the Incestuous Elite Club:

  • “It's a club. And they don't want that club to be pierced, to be broken. People who have power in this country and people who don't.” (Khanna, 66:17)

• Societal Decay and Desensitization:

  • “They're desensit… They're taking real events… They're reenacting active shooter events…” (Ryan, 84:12)

• On Accountability and Reform:

  • “Get money out of politics and term limits… These things were never designed to be lifelong pursuits.” (Khanna, 94:31)

• On National Security & Epstein’s Mystery:

  • “There should probably be a commission. The president… should appoint a commission to understand who Jeffrey Epstein was and what his motives were and why he was operating. That's a national security question.” (Khanna, 43:59)

• On Fatigue, Anger & Hope for Change:

  • “I don't even fucking see left or right anymore. I just see good and evil and that is it.” (Ryan, 29:51)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• Epstein Files Released & Redactions — 03:18–16:42
• Political Failure & Donor Influence — 16:45–34:12
• Who’s in the Files; Specific Powerful Names — 21:18–23:36
• Why Elite Impunity Endures — 24:08–27:50
• Comparison to UK Accountability — 29:07–29:51
• National Security & Epstein as Potential Asset — 38:13–45:28
• Online Child Exploitation, Roblox, Pornography — 06:36–10:53, 75:17–87:00
• Psychology & Cycle of Abuse — 79:47–87:00
• Concrete Steps for Accountability — 34:12–37:25, 43:59–44:05
• Patreon Q&A: Accountability, Reforms, Nuclear Energy, Politics — 89:30–99:41

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Notable Quotes (with Attribution)

• Ryan (04:43):

  "Being a man is not keeping your fucking mouth shut because daddy's got a thumb on you. That's what's happening. And it's fucking pissing me off. And it's pissing all of the American people off."

• Khanna (13:35):

  "They didn't redact the survivors…they had nude images for young girls that they released, but they blacked out names of people who've sent Epstein an email saying, I enjoyed the nine year old Brazil..."

• Khanna (21:33):

  "Every single person you mentioned, if they are in the files, which many of them are, they need to be hauled in front of Congress."

• Ryan (25:36):

  "There is a two tier justice system. … The elites and political elites do not fall under same Justice Department that the rest of us do."

• Khanna (26:14):

  "You had to be part of this Epstein network to be in the club."

• Khanna (34:12):

  "Congress... should start a committee, a subcommittee… announce hearings… subpoena everyone."

• Khanna (43:59):

  "There should probably be a commission. The president… should appoint a commission to understand who Jeffrey Epstein was and what his motives were and why he was operating. That's a national security question."

• Ryan (46:44):

  "If anybody is against that because of going to their donors, they do not have what's best for the country in their heart… every one of these son of a bitches need to be fucking voted out because they're in it for themselves."

• Khanna (64:48):

  "They have not indicted a single person."

• Khanna (66:17):

  "It's a club. And they don't want that club to be pierced, to be broken."

• Ryan (84:12):

  "They're desensit… They're taking real events… They're reenacting active shooter events…"

• Khanna (94:31):

  "Get money out of politics and term limits… These things were never designed to be lifelong pursuits."

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Patreon Questions & Khanna’s Responses

• Accountability for Taxpayers (89:53):
  Biggest fraud is in the Defense Department. Federal and state governments must be audited for waste and fraud; homelessness in California is cited as an example of business, not charity.

• Restoring Congress’ Original Purpose (94:31):
  “Get money out of politics and term limits.”

• Nuclear Energy (93:54):
  Khanna and Ryan both support nuclear as part of the energy mix, challenging the left’s orthodoxy.

• Preferential Treatment in Prosecution (101:17):
  Solution: Remove big money from politics and rigorously prosecute interference in justice.

• Will this Fade into the Background? (102:59):
  Khanna is hopeful; the issue has entered popular culture and cannot be as easily buried as before.

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Final Thoughts / Calls to Action

• Accountability is Non-Negotiable:
  Without prosecutions and real investigations, trust in American justice is impossible to restore.

• Desensitization and Cultural Decline:
  Both Ryan and Khanna warn of a culture that glorifies violence and sexualizes children, with tech platforms exacerbating harm.

• Podcasts & Alternative Media as New Gatekeepers:
  Ryan’s platform seen as bypassing elite-controlled media and connecting with a broader audience.

• Next Steps:
  Potential for a roundtable with survivors, reformers, and courageous politicians as part of ongoing pressure for reform and public truth-telling.

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Conclusion

This episode is a scathing and heartfelt plea for justice, transparency, and moral clarity. Ro Khanna emerges as a rare Congressional voice for broad, bipartisan accountability and describes the structural mechanisms shielding America’s most powerful abusers. Shawn and Ro agree: the only way to rebuild trust is to end elite impunity, bring every name into the daylight, and rekindle the nation’s moral backbone—even if it means challenging the entire system.

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For a deeper dive, listeners are encouraged to watch the full episode or follow up on proposed initiatives and hearings discussed herein.

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[Major segment times are listed above for direct navigation]

Transcript

[A]

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[B]

Back in the hot seat.

[A]

Dude, I can't believe you're back already.

[B]

I mean, I didn't think that we'd get this much out this fast. I came on your podcast and then two weeks later, the Justice Department decides to release 50% of the files. So I figured maybe if I come back, they'll release the other 50%.

[A]

Hopefully. Wow. I mean, I'm going to be. You're my fourth interview this week. I've dug in as much as I can. Thank you for coming. I'm not an expert on this stuff. I'm trying to figure out what's real. What's not real, and sift through this shit. And I want to know, what do we do next? So thanks for coming, Ro. I really appreciate it. And the last episode was awesome. I mean, I took a lot of heat for it. You probably did, too. But I think this is, you know, it's what needs to happen. We have to.

[B]

I just want to say you're not a communist just because you have me on. We could talk to each other even if we don't agree, and we certainly can agree that pedophiles shouldn't be protected in America.

[A]

That's right.

[B]

I mean, the stuff has been worse than even I anticipated. I don't know what you thought.

[A]

I couldn't believe some of the shit that I was seeing in there. And we're going to go into as much of that as you want and as I want today. But I wanted to open it up with a quote. Let's see if you know who wrote this. Remember when we learned that our wealthiest and most powerful people were connected to a guy who ran a literal child sex trafficking ring? And then that guy died mysteriously in jail, and now we just don't talk about it? You know who wrote that?

[B]

Our vice president, J.D.

[A]

Vance. J.D. vance wrote that in 9-4-21, back when.

[B]

He used to be a populist. I knew him back then.

[A]

What happened?

[B]

I don't know. Look, I used to. I went to factory towns with JD Vance. He used to talk about why our jobs are going offshore, hollowing out of our factories. You know, Tim Ryan, me and JD Were across small town America and I thought, okay, I disagree with this guy, but he's got the same values, like stand up for ordinary Americans. And he sounded the alarm on the Epstein files, as did Donald Trump. I mean, they made this a huge thing. And I just. I tweeted at him yesterday, sometimes we go back and forth and I said, JD you talk about being a man. You talk about let's have not diminished masculinity in America. To me, being a man means standing up and respecting standing up for what.

[A]

You believe in, no matter what the fucking consequences are. That's what being a man is. Being a man is not keeping your fucking mouth shut because daddy's got a thumb on you. That's what this is. That's what's happening. And it's fucking pissing me off. And it's pissing all of the American people off.

[B]

And he looks emasculated to Trump. I mean, why can't he just get out there and say yeah. I'm going to stand up to these powerful men who are involved in the raping of American girls. Like anyone who has a sister, anyone who has a daughter, anyone who has a wife should be offended. And being a man, in my view means standing up for the respect and dignity of women. Not being abused and standing up to evil men like that. Like you went and fought wars against the bad guys, right? This, this is like are you on the good guy side or the bad guy side? And I still hope because I. I want what's right for survivors. I. I'm sure someone is going to show this to the. The Vice President. I hope he remembers what. What he was like before he got into this position. All he has got to do is put out a statement, release all the files. Let's hold these people accountable. And went to Epstein's Island. I don't know how hard it is.

[A]

Looks like maybe he's had a change of opinion unfortunately. But. And you know, before we get too much too far into this, I just. It was really cool to introduce. To get you and Schlepp to meet each other. We had a great episode with him yesterday about all about what he's doing with Roblox and to be able to show you all of the stuff that's not even all of the stuff. Some of the stuff that's going on there like the Epstein island game or recreating all of the mass shooter events. Sandy Hook Udalvi. What were some of the other ones, Jeremy? They're. They're columbines in there. I was grocery store in New York, 9 11.

[B]

I had no idea. Look, I. Schlep's a courageous guy and I'm glad you had him on. And he's taken on some of this abuse that is going on on Roblox. And I did a petition to support him because of that. But I had no idea just till five minutes ago that they have a game on Sandy Hook where you're the shooter and you kill your own mom like the Sandy Hook assassin did. And then you go into the school and they show you blowing up kids in a bathroom. I mean, it is sick.

[A]

Not only that the victim's names are over the characters.

[B]

The kids that were the actual victims.

[A]

Yes, the kids that were killed. We have screenshots of this shit. They have, they have the victims names that were killed in some of these incidents is actual characters in the game that you shoot and kill.

[B]

That makes you so angry. It's, it's. It's certainly illegal.

[A]

This is safe for kids, though, Ro, according to them.

[B]

And you wonder why. We've got a culture where you got school shootings. You're celebrating and teaching kids to celebrate school shootings where you can be the shooter and go kill these kids.

[A]

Not only that, you're building them a legacy that will live forever. You're, you're, you're. It's almost like they're memorializing this, you know? I mean, you've built. You've built a legacy where kids can go and reenact this, celebrate it. It's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's. There's, there's little kids on this game. Little kids.

[B]

It's, it's gotta. I mean, that whole thing needs to come down. And then Epstein island did. Schlepp was showing that to me. I was. That's chilling. I mean, they've recreated the island where young girls were raped. And you've got kids going and roaming around on their video games on these islands. I mean, what are we thinking in this country?

[A]

It's, it's like.

[B]

I don't know. We know. I grew up, I played Little League. You play. You go watch the Phillies or the Sixers. I mean, you don't. Any people played video games, but our.

[A]

Video games weren't like rbi, baseball and donkey.

[B]

Yeah, seriously, Madden, you know, go blow up young kids. I mean, there's something sick right there. The Epstein class, the Epstein file show how sick the elite are in our country. We could have a much longer conversation, but what we're doing with our kids is just going to replicate that and make it worse. It's disgusting. And I hope people watch that episode with Schlep, and I hope it triggers a serious reform on. On Roblox or the platform. And in general of this video junk that's out there.

[A]

Oh, a lot of people are going to watch it. I did one with Ryan Montgomery and they lost $6 billion in one week, starting on the day we released the episode.

[B]

On this stuff.

[A]

On this stuff, you can see the graph. It goes. You.

[B]

You have no fear of taking these powerful people on, huh?

[A]

I wouldn't say I have no fear. I just think this is why I'm here, because nobody else is doing this shit. No, I shouldn't say nobody else is doing this shit. People that are in positions with very large audiences are not doing anything to protect kids. And I'm the only fucking one that has.

[B]

They're afraid of getting sued. I know you face all that. They're afraid of having Billionaires and powerful people turn on them, and it's not easy to take on these.

[A]

I've never had a billionaire or a powerful person do a fucking thing for me in my life. I don't need them. I don't fucking need them anyways. Ro Khanna, representative for California's 17th congressional district in Silicon Valley. Co sponsor, along with Rep. Massey, the bill to fully release the Epstein files to the public. Huge drop of files on the DOJ website last week. So I want to dive in and see what's. What all this means, why so many names were redacted, abuser names redacted. That's kind of weird, don't you think? We'd want to know who's ordering hits and burying bodies and all this other shit. But as of today, Polymarket says There's only a 19% chance that anyone will be jailed over the Epstein disclosures. What do you think about that?

[B]

It's up from like 3 or 4%. So we're moving in the right direction. The. But look, there are obviously people who need to be prosecuted and investigated. They haven't released the names of the co conspirators. Still, even though they've released the indictments where we know that other people were involved, every single person who is in those files, who says, I went to Epstein's island or I went to this ranch in New Mexico, or I went to Epstein's home, and I know that there were young girls there at all of those places. Any one of those people need to be investigated. They need to be hold in front of Congress and they need to be held accountable and they need to be asked, what did you see? What did you do? What did. You know? Look, I've done a lot of fundraising. You don't have to go to some island to raise money from a rich guy. You don't have to go to some party where, you know, there are young girls being paraded around to raise money. You can have a coffee, you could have a dinner, you know, and so this idea that, oh, we just all went there to raise money, come on.

[A]

I mean, it's. You know what, you know what's really interesting is how fast the narrative is starting to change or this, this narrative they're trying to build. Like Todd Blanche we saw on Fox News the other day, Todd Blanche said in quotes, if any member of Congress wishes to review any portions of, of the. Of the responsive production in any Ember ad form, they're welcome to make arrangements with the department to do so. And we're happy to do that. Okay, here we go. Who was he sharing torture videos with? Who did he have killed? And who was talking about the foreign girls buried at his Zorro ranch? That would be a great fucking start. Todd Blanch. Who also said, it's not a party. It's not a crime to party with Epstein. I. I'm sorry, it is a fucking crime if you're fucking minors. What the hell is that? But, but I mean, how, how could you even say that it's not a crime to party?

[B]

And most offensive, one of the most dumbest and most offensive things I've heard. I mean, no one is talking about being a Playboy. No one's talking about, oh, you go to a party and there are women there and you're having affairs. Fine.

[A]

They're not at the Playboy mansion.

[B]

Yeah, exactly.

[A]

They're at an island with a bunch of miners. As, as young as I think we saw.

[B]

Nine.

[A]

Nine years old.

[B]

There was one email said a nine year old Brazilian.

[A]

Nine year old Brazilian kid. Girl.

[B]

Yeah, boy. Nine year old. And by the way, they've redacted the name of the person who sent that email.

[A]

Well, we got to protect all the friends.

[B]

I mean, that's the thing. They didn't redact the survivors. In certain cases. They had nude images for young girls that they released, but they blacked out names of people who've sent Epstein an email saying, I enjoyed the nine year old Brazil and I enjoyed your young girl who was naughty. I mean, it's sick. But the point is, you know, this is not some Epstein party. These are people who are going there. And at the very least, they know there are parties where young girls are being paraded naked. Paraded naked. 13 year old, 14 year old being paraded naked. They know that there are people who are raping and abusing girls on that island. They know that. They know that Epstein is on it. And anyone who thinks that it was just Epstein and Maxwell, when there are 1200 survivors, I mean, they're just total liars. And so, you know, I think Blanche should come here. I think he should, you know, I think he should sit down man to man with you, go through it. I mean, if he has nothing to hide, fine. He's. He wants members of Congress to, to go there. And I'm going to go with Massie and Nancy Mace. And we're arranging it. Our teams are arranging it. But why not have a real interview? The media that gets three minutes, he does a bunch of his song and dance. And you know that you don't get real Answers. Sit down for two hours.

[A]

Well, he's just going to sit here and lie to my face. We, we actually had an opportunity for him to be on the show and I just fucking got ghosted. He should come up from within the administration.

[B]

Well, if he doesn't want to come, Pam Bondi should come some.

[A]

But they're all just going to fucking lie, Ro.

[B]

They can't lie for two hours. They can't lie for two hours. I mean it's a, it's just sit here. They all wanted to come before the election. They all wanted to do the two hour, three hour podcast or have Vance come. Well, have some person come and explain why they've redacted what they've redacted.

[A]

These are also all the same people that told us all about the fake news for eight years and how they'll never go back on the fake news until you get elected and then there's no more hour long, two hour, three hour, four, four hour conversations. It's two second news hits on Fox News. They don't do podcasts anymore. Yeah, I mean it's back, hey, let me get my daughter in law a job at Fox News. I'll just fucking go on there and say fuck all the podcasts. Good job.

[B]

The fucking.

[A]

How they want to lie. Another fucking lie. But I just, I don't even know, I don't even know where to start with this stuff. But I do want to ask one thing. We made. This isn't a right versus a left thing and that's why you're here. And so I want to know why did you vote no to hold the Clintons in contempt for Congress. Right.

[B]

I voted yes on civil contempt. I voted no on criminal contempt and I voted no on criminal contempt because I said after the release of the files they should come testify. They've agreed to testify. So if they hadn't come and testified, I would have voted yes, ultimately on criminal contempt. But the vote then was yes on civil contempt, no on criminal contempt and they are testifying on February 26.

[A]

What is the difference? Can you just explain the difference for the audience?

[B]

Criminal contempt means you can go to jail. Civil contempt means that you could be fined. You have, you don't go to jail. It's a fine, it's a violation of Congress. But the point is I just thought it was premature when Colmer was already negotiating. And what I said is after the files get released, they should come. This was before the files were released. As soon as the files were released, there's their, their time I mean, it's 50% of the files, but it's enough. And if they hadn't come before Congress, which they're now coming, I would have voted for criminal contempt. And I said that at the time so, you know, people could criticize. Why didn't you vote for criminal contempt then? But, you know, the negotiation hadn't happened. I mean, you got to give someone a chance to. To come in and testify before Congress.

[A]

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[B]

Buffo. Clinton.

[A]

Oh, yeah.

[B]

Oh, he owes an explanation. I mean, he owes an explanation about how many times he saw him. Did he go to the island? Was he at any of the parties? Does he know? You know, the other thing is, does he know other people who were raping these underage girls? Does he know what Epstein's role was? Because, you know, there are pictures of Epstein at the CIA headquarters. I've never been to the CIA headquarters.

[A]

It's not that impressive.

[B]

You know, I've. You've been there. I've been on Armed Services 10 years. The senior person of the armed services committee. Senior person of China select committee. I'VE not met William Burns. He's the. Was the head of our CIA. And you got Epstein meeting him. So I'd want to know from President Clinton, like, who is this guy? How is it that he is corresponding with Modi or people like Modi? How is it that he has this relationship with Barack? How is it that he is at the CIA headquarters? How is it that Gordon Brown's government is tipping him off, Mendelsohn is tipping him off, that the UK is going to buy the euro currency and then Epstein is trading on it? Someone knows why this guy is networked in the way he's networked. And those are questions that we should ask President Clinton.

[A]

What are some of the things in the files that just you found? What, what are some of the big surprises that you saw?

[B]

How many people are involved?

[A]

Yeah, yeah. Like, I mean. I mean, we've got Jay Z, Bill Gates, Reed Hoffman, Elon Musk, Peter Thiel, Bill Clinton, Serge Brin.

[B]

Like, it's just like district. Prominent people in Silicon Valley and people who think I was political about this. Like, these are people who support Democrats. Many of them, Some of them are the biggest donors to Democrats. They're more arguably people who have on the left who have fallen than right now on the right. I mean, the head of Paul Weiss, big Democrat, he just resigned. You've got all of these names. And what I have said is, I don't care where the chips fall. Every single person you mentioned, if they are in the files, which many of them are, they need to be hauled in front of Congress. They need to be investigated, and they need to be asked questions. Did you go on the island? Why did you go under oath, by the way? What did you see? Who raped these underage girls? Were you ever at a party where there were underage girls? Were you ever at a party where underage girls were being paraded naked? And not just if you were on the island, if you're at his home, if you were on his ranch and look, I don't. There may be people who are innocent. I'm not saying there's due process in this country, but how do you not investigate it? How do you not sit them down under oath and ask them questions? Even Melinda Gates, Bill Gates's ex, is saying, you got to. She's got to answer questions. And then what?

[A]

Did they just see that? Yeah, he did. You see that email chain?

[B]

I did.

[A]

He was asking for some kind of secret, secret antibiotics to slip his wife because he, he gave her an STD or thought he gave her an STD and didn't want to.

[B]

Yeah, I mean, and then his explanation. His explanation is, oh, Epstein didn't send that email. He just drafted it to himself and actually didn't hit send. Well, I want to see if Bill Gates would say that under oath. I want to see if he would say that. Actually, if there is an investigation, what these guys do is they find a convenient journalist to ask them a softball question. They do a two minute hit, and then they're hoping, okay, we're done. We're going to go in hiding for two years and people will forget. And we've got so much money and we fund so many universities and nonprofits, they're going to still want our money. And then we'll rehabilitate ourselves.

[A]

Do you think that somebody that rapes kids. Do you think that. Do you think that somebody that rapes kids being. Does being under oath mean anything to them? Because I don't. I don't think it means a damn thing.

[B]

Well, here's the problem for that, for. For people, and I just want to be clear. I mean, we don't know which one of these people actually raped kids or were on islands where young girls were being paraded naked or knew that kids were being raped. Like, there are a lot of people who knew that either Epstein or others were being raped and were still showing up on this island.

[A]

People been calling this shit out. I mean, Nicki Minaj was it. Nicki Minaj just came out and said she knew about this shit. I mean, lots of people have been talking about this stuff, but they were always labeled conspiracy theorists.

[B]

But the guy, the guy that cut.

[A]

Your previews probably knows more about this stuff than anybody I've ever talked to on the planet. You know, and I thought he was fucking crazy.

[B]

Massie and I thought we were told we were conspiracy theorists, we were going to kill our reputations. We were pursuing a hoax. And now it turns out, you know, the most powerful people in this country and around the world were implicated. But here's why it matters if you have them under oath, because if you get enough of them and they're making statements, then there may be contradictions. Then if someone says, oh, yeah, I saw Gates on the island, and Gates says, no, I wasn't there. There are contradictions. As it. As it is, there are people who are conveniently remembering that they met Epstein more than they claimed. Right. And they're trying to correct the record. Lutnick and others are correcting the record. Why? Because there's emails that have come out There are other people who are testifying. So if you get 100 of these people under oath, you're going to find the contradictions. You're going to find out who's lying. So I'm not counting on their own conscience coming clean. I'm counting on the fact that there needs to be an investigation. There's been no investigation. It's not just that they haven't released the file. There's no investigation. And I don't know, what does it say about our country?

[A]

It says there's a. It's exactly what we talked about last time. There is a two tier justice system.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And the elites and political elites do not fall under same Justice Department that the rest of us do.

[B]

There are two Americas, there are two tiers of justice. If you're rich, if you're powerful, if you fund universities and nonprofits, you can do the most heinous things. Like you can show up to an island where young girls are being raped and have no consequence.

[A]

I mean, so many people are involved. It's almost like it's a requirement to do that to get to the places that they are. That's how many fucking names are of powerful elites are in that are in those damn files.

[B]

You know, I was in a call yesterday and someone said basically a version of that. They said, you don't understand, Ro. You had to be part of this Epstein network to be in the club. And he said, I didn't go. But I was tempted to go because everyone in my peer group was going. And if you weren't part of this club, then you weren't part of elite society. And so you have basically a peer pressure to go to an island where people know that this guy's been a convicted pedophile because they went after he was convicted and they know that young girls are being raped. I mean, and, and it's the elite in Hollywood, the elite in finance, the elite in Silicon Valley, the elite in politics. And you talk to the survivors and they say, we were told you can't call the police, you can't call the FBI because they know too many powerful people. So you've got an America where you've got two systems of justice and people resent that. People like you go and fight for the country's values, you risk your life, and yet these elite folks are basically saying, yeah, we can go to an island where young girls are being raped and no one can touch us. And they never thought anything that would come out. And we can make lewd jokes about it and laugh about it and fly to Davos and life goes on. That's how they were living. And at the same time, people have the same thing on the economic economy in this country. Like, okay, all the power is in the hands of this few folks. And, you know, I'm struggling to make ends meet for my family. It's the same sense of a rigged America that has led to the kind of anger that we see.

[A]

What do you think is going to happen now?

[B]

It depends on. I mean, it depends if people like you are going to continue to bang the drum. That's one of the reasons I'm here. What. What. I'll tell you what. These elite guys want to have happen. They want to do a kind of mea culpa. You know, have you seen their statements? I regret that I spent too much time with Epstein. I regret the judgment I showed to take a meeting with Epstein. I regret that I took his money. Not like I. I am ashamed and appalled that Epstein was raping young girls. And there were other people, part of my network, that were raping young girls. And let me just confess at what happened and who did this. Right? It's like this lawyerly statement. So here's what their game plan is. I mean, their game plan is, let's put these things out. Let's hope Massey and kind of go away. You know, let them bang the drum for a few more months, let this all fade, and then two years later, we're going to come back, we got too much money. They're going to want our money, they're going to want our scholarships, and we're going to be rehabilitated in society. That's. That's their game plan. And the question for the country is, are we going to get. Let them get away with it, or are we finally going to hold people accountable in Britain? They're holding people accountable. They.

[A]

What are they doing over there?

[B]

Well, Starmer's government.

[A]

Andrew's gone.

[B]

Andrew's gone. At least Prince. The prince gone. You know, he's got to. I. I think there's got to be more to Andrew than just, okay, now you're not a prince. That's. But at least. At least he's not a prince. But he's. He's probably got to have criminal investigation. From the stuff I've seen, I think there has to actually be an investigation into what he did. But. But at least they've stripped him of his titles. And then they've got Mendelssohn, who's resigned just today or yesterday. Resigned. Right. There's some consequence. Starmer, the prime minister. His government may fall. He's lost confidence. By the way, he's on the left. You know, this is a guy. And I said, good, good, good. There's accountability. This isn't left or right. The guy's on the left.

[A]

I don't even fucking see left or right anymore. I just see good and evil and that is it. I don't see any of this other shit. I think it's all. I think. You know, Jeremy told me a long time ago politics is WWF wrestling. I truly believe that.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Fucking see it. It's disgusting. It's disgusting.

[B]

Yeah. No, I mean they're good guys and bad guys.

[A]

I mean, how, how everybody's. You're saying the American people can't let this go. They can't. That we have to hold them. How do we hold them accountable? I mean, I'm. You're doing your part. I'm doing my part. But we're up against a huge system.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

That's coming unglued. I mean, they're. The country's in shambles. It just continues to go. I mean people, you know, people talk about revolution, civil war, all this. It's already happening. I mean, look at Minnesota. It's a war zone up there.

[B]

It was. There it is.

[A]

Yeah, it's a war zone up there. I mean, places down on the border, it's war zone. Down there are cities, which we were talking about, you know, last time. It's, it's. We're pretty damn close and we might be in the middle of it already. I mean, it's, it's, it's.

[B]

We got to turn it around.

[A]

That's what I'm saying. We got to turn it around.

[B]

But how? Well, I don't.

[A]

You can't turn it around with a fucking two tier justice system. You cannot turn it around while we have all these elites, powerful tech people, powerful Hollywood people, powerful politicians just raping kids and getting away with it in plain. In plain. It just, it's. It's right out in the open, right in front of everybody and they're just walking, walking around.

[B]

That's disgusting. And I see your anger. I mean, I see. I feel it right for people not here. I mean it's like it's makes me.

[A]

Want to look into fudgeing dual citizenship. It's that bad. It's that fudgeing bad.

[B]

And you wore the uniform. I mean, you gave.

[A]

I wore the uniform and I don't even believe in the fucking wars I fought for because I think Those were a lie. I know damn well Iraq was a lie. That was a ploy to get KPR into Iraq. Cuz Dick Cheney, I agree with you.

[B]

You know, I started my career, spent.

[A]

A long time there. Every logistics piece in the country was kbr, Halberdon, kbr, Halibur, everything. Food, like the shitters, the gasoline, the man, every piece of logistics there was KBR. Did we find WMDs? Fuck no. That war was bullshit and everybody fucking knows it.

[B]

Well, in 2003, I ran against the Iraq war against a Democrat in my own party. I got crushed 71 to 19. But I was against the war back in 2003. And the reality is that we've never held people accountable in this country. Right? Where was the accountability for the people who lied us into war in Iraq which led to thousands of Americans dying? Where was the accountability for Abu Ghraib and the people who committed torture in Iraq? Where was the accountability for the bankers who crashed the entire economy after the Great Recession in Wall Street? No accountability. Where is the accountability in this country? And now people are saying, okay, you got these elite who are raping young girls or showing up while young girls are being raped and not saying anything. And we just want to move on. Hell no. I mean, we will not restore democratic trust in this country if we don't have accountability for some of these people who committed these crimes. That's the reality. Like, I don't care. I want a democratic project that has health care for everyone, child care. You can't get there unless you first say, we're going to hold these people accountable, they're going to face justice. And, and we're going to try to restore trust that there's one tier of justice in America.

[A]

So seriously though, how do we do this? If it goes picture perfect, which it's not, but in your mind, what is the path to success? Who brings these people? Who brings these people in? Who presses charges on them? Is it the FBI? Do all the files need to be released? Do the names need to be redacted? I mean, how do we start charging people?

[B]

I think the process, I think there are three buckets. First, let's start the investigation with just the files that have been released, right? Like there's a lot that still needs to be released that was protected and redacted, but there are enough names in there that can be investigated. The FBI, the DOJ should start to interview under oath every single person who is in correspondence about going to the ranch or the home where there were parties with underage girls. Or the island and Congress simultaneously should start a committee, a subcommittee under the oversight and announce hearings. I don't know why Colmer doesn't do that. I mean, Comer is all into holding accountability. Fine. He wants to do the deposition with the Clintons, fine. Have Trump, fine. But what about the hundreds of other people? Why aren't we hauling them in this year in Congress under Colmer, I'll vote for every subpoena. Nancy May said subpoena Gates. I said yes, I will vote for every single subpoena. And I'll get Democrats to do it as well. For anyone who's in those files, Democratic donor, Republican donor, I don't care. I'll vote for a subpoena, bring them in and start to ask them under oath. Congress can do that even if the DOJ and FBI doesn't move. That's the first step. Second step is we have a meeting with Blanche Mace, me, Massie, Raskin, and the Judiciary F. Comer in there, too. And let's start to figure out how we get the unredacted versions that are not going to protect abusers. You want to protect young girls, of course. Don't have the nude pictures, don't have the survivors exposed. But give me a break. When you have an abuser sending Epstein an email about what they did with some young girl and you have the name of the abuser blacked out, come on. We need to get that information out as a second thing and push on the files. And then the third thing is simply the public shaming and the public accountability. Like, these people are still not just are they walking the streets, they're still giving speeches, they're still on corporate boards, they're still having their gifts accepted by nonprofits and universities. They still have buildings named after them. Like, when are we going to have more accountability? At least with Paul Weiss, where Brad Karp resigned. When are we going to have some of these people out of the positions of influence and honor that they're currently in, that doesn't require Trump's Justice Department, that doesn't require Congress, that requires all of us as Americans. And I guess the question is, are we going to be so blinded by their money, so blinded by what they can do for our universities, our nonprofits, our civil society, that we say, I'll just let him have a pass, or are we actually going to hold him accountable? It's easy to hold Larry Summers accountable because he doesn't have a lot of money and he's a professor. Okay, he's being held accountable. Or Brad Carr, he's a lawyer. Fine. He's being held accountable. But when you've got billions, when you're one of these people who has a lot of money, then it's a choice. Like, okay, money or young girls. Where are we going to stand?

[A]

Did you watch that interview with Epstein and Bannon by chance?

[B]

I watched some of it.

[A]

What'd you think of that?

[B]

I mean, I don't know why Bannon was doing that. Like, what the hell? To resuscitate and revive. Revive his reputation.

[A]

Did you see when he asked him if he thought he was the devil?

[B]

I, I, I saw that clip.

[A]

Is that crazy?

[B]

I mean, and it was kind of like laughing about it, right? I mean, that's the emails. It's sort of like they're laughing about his evil. Evilness. Not just Bannon, but like other powerful people. Hahaha. Like this. Hahaha. You're abusing young girls. How many people wrote like, bring the young girls. Bring your harem with you. Oh yeah, we know this is evil things. It's like they're celebrating his sickness.

[A]

They are celebrating his sickness. They're all part of this stuff. What do you think about. Has your opinion changed on where Epstein's from, who he's working with since our last interview? You asked me what I thought. I told you I think he's a Mossad agent for Israel.

[B]

Yeah. And I genuinely don't know the answer to that specific question. But what I will say is this. Why is he at the CIA? Why is he meeting Will Burns? Why is he talking to Mendelssohn at the highest levels of the British government was working for Gordon Brown? Why is he talking about Modi, the Prime Minister of India and going to Israel? Why is he talking about Palantir and Palantir's investments in our national security? Why is he affiliating with Barack so much that just today Prime Minister Netanyahu is making a statement?

[A]

What did he say? What did Netanyahu say today?

[B]

Netanyahu said that Barack was trying to undermine the Israeli government and that's why he was meeting with Jeffrey Epstein.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

I mean, that was like, how do you have one person. I guess this is what I want.

[A]

To really say that there. Did he, did he come to the White House to say that? Netanyahu into the White House quite a few times.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

No, it's kind of weird how much he's at the White House. Yeah.

[B]

I don't, I don't understand why, why any leader should be at the White House that much. I mean the United States should be driving our foreign policy with our interests. But the, the point is, and, and you know, I've been very outspoken that my view, I don't know yours, is that what Israel did in Gaza was a genocide. I do not believe that.

[A]

We should have been 100% with you, Ro. 100% with you. It's fucking disgusting. How many kids got killed?

[B]

There's thousands.

[A]

20,000 kids. 20,000 kids.

[B]

And you're in. My tax dollars went for that. You know, I voted no. I voted. I was one of 37 Democrats who voted no on the 14 billion.

[A]

That's why we don't want to raise taxes. Row can't be killing kids, can't be sending political elites to rape kids. But the getting pissed.

[B]

But you know, I mean, I, the, the question that has to be asked is why is this guy Epstein, why does he have so much access to the most powerful people in the world? Like what? You know, he's, he's operating at a level of power certainly beyond anyone in Congress, certainly beyond any senator. I mean he's operating literally at a level of power of a head of state over the President.

[A]

It's insane. It's in that interview he's talking about when the financial, the 2008 collapse happened. He's got, who did he have on the phone he had in jail? He's got, I think he said like Bear Stearns in one hand and J.P. morgan on the other, literally talking to them at the same time about what's going on.

[B]

Right?

[A]

I mean, why the fuck are the leaders of those financial institutions calling an inmate in prison to figure out what the hell is going on?

[B]

A pedophile.

[A]

Yeah, a pedophile that they were all hanging out with.

[B]

And then, and then Gordon Brown's Mendelssohn, his, his aide is giving Epstein tips before UK acts that they're going to bail out the euro. And Epstein is engaged in trading on, on that information. I mean it's, it's, it's, it's mind boggling that this guy had this kind of power. And your point about like, how did he accumulate that power? Is, is in my view the central question. There are two big questions. One, like, how do we have an elite that basically thinks it's okay to show up to an island where young girls are being raped? And how is it possible that everyone in all our society, from finance to arts to Hollywood to tech to real estate, is caught up in this mess? Like, it's disgusting. But then the second issue is who is this Guy Epstein. How does he have this kind of access? That's not conspiratorial. Now we have the.

[A]

You know how we install strawmen in foreign countries to control it?

[B]

Yeah, I mean, we have.

[A]

That's how this happens, Ro. That's how this happens.

[B]

What do you mean by that?

[A]

He was installed in the U.S.

[B]

I mean, look, I think we need to ask all the questions. I, I try to stick to what I know, but the, these files have made me.

[A]

Just giving you stuff to think about.

[B]

Yeah, I mean, these files have made me question why he has this kind of access to these many foreign leaders, why he has this kind of access to our CIA, why he's involved in some of the most critical investments in companies like Palantir or others that are now so enshrined in our national security. Why is he so connected to some of the enormous tech leaders like it. Why is, why is he connected to the most powerful people in finance and real estate? You can't just. Someone's like, oh, he's just collects rich and people and elites. No, this is not just a socialite, you know, you don't have A socialite, doesn't get to go speak to heads of state and get to talk to every billionaire and get to talk to the most powerful people and direct that kind of attention. And that's, that's an unanswered question. And that should be the investigation. There should probably be a commission. The president, next president or this president should appoint a commission to understand who Jeffrey Epstein was and what his motives were and why he was operating. That's a national security question.

[A]

That's. I think this is the biggest concern of national security that we have right now.

[B]

Well, it's a concern certainly, and it hurts us being compromised. Right. If you believe, as I do as the top Democrat on the China Committee, that China is our competition and that we need to win and that we need to be ahead of them on technology, we need to be ahead of them on AI. We need to be ahead of them when it comes to the economy. If we're compromised from the inside, and if it's possible to compromise us from the inside, then that's a real problem. If you have an elite that can be seen as going to an island that's so immature, reckless, self entitled, arrogant that they can go to a island where young girls are being raped, then you wonder, can that. What does that say about our ability to have the seriousness of moral purpose to compete with China? They've got a worse system. They've Got a communist system, an authoritarian system, but their leaders, from what I know, weren't showing up to Epstein's Island. Right. And so, you know, this is a question of, like, what kind of leadership are we producing to make sure America stays the great nation in the world? People were never perfect. Like FDR had affairs, Kennedy had affairs. But it's the pettiness, the immaturity, the total depravity of doing it with raping young girls and the frivolousness of it that really is a mirror on, like America's place, moral place in, in, in the world at this moment.

[A]

What is the, what is the, what's the pulse in Congress?

[B]

Most discussed, Genuine disgust, shock. Both sides, Both sides, both sides.

[A]

Anybody for it? Anybody for what's happening?

[B]

You know, honestly. And because I'm trying to make.

[A]

For protecting pedophiles. Is there anybody in Congress that is voting against releasing this shit or that's totally against it, that wants to protect pedophiles? Let's get their names out.

[B]

You know, there was one guy who voted against Massey and my bill, but I think he, in fairness, he just thought that it should have been done in a different way. I don't think he was actually for protecting pedophiles. And honesty. I think the reality is that most of the people in Congress have been pretty shaken by the release. Most of them are pretty disgusted by what took place. And the question is, are they going to have the guts to, to go after these people? What are the barriers? Well, you're going after donors, you're going after donors to both parties. You're going after Democratic donors and you're going after Republican donors. These are people who give a lot of money and you don't want to, you know, it's a, it's, it's not convenient to go after them. Secondly, you got Trump saying, move on, let me.

[A]

Hold on. I just want to, I would like to add something to that.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So any. So if anybody is against that because of going to their donors, they do not have what's best for the country in their heart, they have what's best for them and that is it. That's all they fucking care about is staying in Congress, staying in the Senate, saying wherever they're at, it's not for the country, it's for themselves. If that's what's fucking happening, every one of these son of a bitches need to be fucking voted out because they're in it for themselves.

[B]

Yeah, and that's the.

[A]

About your donors.

[B]

It's a Donors, it's their concern for themselves and their party. And they, they don't vote right. They just stay quiet or don't rock the boat. That's the secret in Washington. It's not that you cast bad votes. It's that you block stuff from even coming for a vote. So no one knows. No one knows that you're the one protecting these people. But, you know, why isn't every single person on the Oversight Committee doing what Nancy May said, which is telling. Comer, look, go, go, go start hearings on this subpoena, everyone. Comer, you could be a national hero. You could, you could take what Massey and I did with the release of the files and you could say, I'm going to hold. Starting tomorrow. Bill Gates in front of this committee, and we're going to have hearings. Not just the Clintons. Fine. Have everyone.

[A]

A lot of people could, could take the hero card right now.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Not J.D. vance. Vance could be great if he came out and said something. I pray anybody inside the administration fuck, just come out and say something like, holy shit, does he really have that much of a wrath over you? Like, fucking, hey, this. I thought it was a free country. Guess it's not.

[B]

And that's the second thing. So it's the fear of the donors and it's fear of Trump because Trump keeps saying, oh, let's just move on, let's move on. And they're afraid that if they really go after this Epstein stuff, that they can have Trump's wrath. And it's not theoretical. I mean, Trump takes a shot at Massie in every other speech, and he has now endorsed someone running against Massey. I think when Massey wins, that'll hopefully give courage to some of the. The other Republicans are afraid of Trump, and Trump's not going to be there that much longer. I mean, he's got three years. So what about thinking beyond Trump like Marjorie Taylor Greene was? But this is the reason that you don't have more action in Congress. It's the money, it's the fear of Trump. It's people saying, move on. And some people are saying, okay, if we move on in two years, I may want some of these people support. I don't want a billionaire super PAC coming against me. You know, there are three billionaire super PACs coming against Massey. By the way, we discussed the, the billionaire tax last time. We can. We had a good spirited conversation. But look at the people who are attacking me and look at the correlation between that and the Epstein files. I don't think it was about, you know, Some tax. I mean that. That they have legitimate arguments. This is about being exposed as utterly devoid of morality. And if someone just looks at the tweets and the people are tweeting against me, and you look at the people you mention in those files, suddenly there's a correlation. It didn't occur to me until I saw those files, because I didn't think that there were that many people in Silicon Valley in those files. I was naive. I thought that most people were from New York because Epstein was in New York. I knew there were real estate folks, I knew there were finance folks. I knew there were. Clinton was in it. I knew that Trump was in it. I knew there were. Barack was in it. I knew some of the politicians, but it shocked me, it stunned me. How many people from California are in it.

[A]

Might be onto something there. I will tell you, a lot of people are still pissed about the tax thing.

[B]

I know they are.

[A]

Me included.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

But like I said, get rid of the fucking waste, fraud and abuse. And when we start seeing our country flourish because of the taxes that we're paying, I'm all in. Ro. I'll pay. I'm all. I mean, I guess I have to be all in no matter what. Right? But, but seriously, I would be for it if I saw our country flourish because of higher taxes. Unfortunately, the country's going like this and the taxes are going, you know, and it just, it, it's, it's, it's. I'm just not seeing it. See it all go to Somalia, Israel, Ukraine, these stupid programs. It's all over the place. But it's not, it's not going to where it needs to go.

[B]

Well, I do agree with you. We need to show people like me who believe that the rich should pay more need to show accountability. Right? Like, because we got to show that, no, we're not just going to give this blank check to Netanyahu to kill kids. We've got to show that we're taking on the waste and the fraud and the abuse that's taking place. And I. And that's why I said we've got to restore the trust that starts with holding some of these elite people accountable. So then I can go to someone like you. I mean, I think you'd pay more taxes if I said is really going to cover someone who doesn't have health care. Your problem is that right now people feel like even if they're paying more tax, their money isn't going to actually help Americans who want education or health care, and that that is our challenge as a, as a country. And it's a bigger challenge for a Democrat like me who believes that we should have a strong safety net of health care and education. That's why I think the highest priority right now has to be holding these elites accountable. At least we start somewhere.

[A]

I guess we start right here, huh? This is, this is, this is. Hopefully more people start taking this shit seriously. We're seeing a real liver health crisis in this country and most people don't even realize how widespread it is. Nearly one in three Americans are being affected. Look around. High fat and sugar diets, processed foods, hidden ingredients everywhere. The hard truth is you can't really avoid it. Most products are filled with junk and filler and most of us don't have time to read every label. So what can you do? You can support the organ that helps process it all every single day. That's where Dose for your Liver comes in. Dose for your Liver is a clinically backed liver health supplement. It's a highly absorbable liquid taken as a daily 2 ounce shot that tastes like fresh orange juice. It's a plant forward formula designed to support liver function and cleanse the liver of unwanted stressors that may be slowing it down. Guys, I've become a huge fan of this stuff. Forget capsules, forget powders. Dose keeps it simple. Zero sugar, zero junk, zero calories. Your liver is your body's daily filter and performs over 500 functions every day, including energy production and digestion. When it's overworked, you can feel it. People who take Dose consistently report more energy, fewer midday crashes, better digestion and less bloating. And it's backed by real science with two double blind placebo controlled studies showing positive impact on liver function. New Customers can save 35% on your first month subscription by going to DoubleDaily Co SRS or entering SRS at checkout. That's Dose D A I L Y Co SRS for 35% off your first month subscription. Most people don't want to learn a language to memorize grammar. They want to actually speak it in real life. That's what Babbel is built for. Babbel focuses on real world conversation with bite sized lessons that fit easily into your day. Just ten minutes a day can help you start seeing real progress. Their courses are designed by over 200 language experts and teach words and phrases you'll actually use in everyday conversations. You'll be able to start speaking with confidence in as little as three weeks. My team and I have been using Babbel to prep for all of our international interviews. And I like how it helps you practice speaking with confidence step by step. They also offer podcasts that share language tips and cultural insights. Babel has over 25 million subscriptions sold worldwide, offers 14 languages, and every course comes with a 20 day money back guarantee. Here's a special limited time deal for our listeners right now. Get up to 55% off your Babel subscription at babel.com SRS get up to 55% off at babel.com SRS spelled B A B B E L.com SRS Rules and restrictions may apply. Visit babel.com for terms and details. I was talking about that VC woman, Masha Booker earlier and we had interviewed her here and I never released the interview because she didn't pass the sniff test. I just thought she was completely full of shit. We found something that said she was tied to Epstein and she got very uncomfortable in the interview and wanted it pulled out. And I said, we're not pulling it out. We're not pulling it out or we're not releasing anything at all.

[B]

I can't believe people asked you to withhold stuff. I've never.

[A]

We don't. The only time I do that is when I'm talking to somebody that was in Special Ops or the agency that says something that was on an operation that they're like, I don't think that's.

[B]

That'S to protect our troops or. Yeah.

[A]

And so that's the only time that I'll do it. But with her, she didn't. I just, me and Jeremy, me and the whole team had a long talk. It was like, I just, I think this whole thing's. And so we didn't release it. Well, turns out it was all. Because I can't even remember what she said in the interview was basically like, oh, no. What did she say? Do you remember?

[B]

Yeah. It said that she was working PR in New York and she was introduced to Jeffrey Epstein. It was totally innocent. Yeah.

[A]

Yeah. It turns out she was his PR agent. In fact, there was a big article that just came out right. Forbes this morning. It's in Forbes.

[B]

That was all in the files.

[A]

It's in Forbes. And you know, and so I want to ask you, you know, we looked at a lot of her emails because she was a former guest. We're probably going to release the interview now.

[B]

You should.

[A]

We're just going to have to do a little, a little dialogue at the beginning, kind of explaining what this all is. But there was a lot of, a lot of back and Forth emails with her and she wanted to do DNA tests and. Yeah, she wanted to do DNA tests from. What's that, what's that website? 23andMe. And she only wanted to work with people that are 98% Jewish or more. And then, I don't know, she thinks they're smarter. She says they're smarter than all the rest of us.

[B]

She said that on the. It really is in one of the emails.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

Well, that's, that's just.

[A]

We should. We'll put the email up right now so everybody can see it. I wish I had it. I'll show it to you after this. But, but in those emails, there's a lot of stuff. What are these? Goyum goy. Do you know what this is?

[B]

I mean, I've heard the term, but what, what does it mean? It's.

[A]

I think it means slaves. Right.

[B]

Nation cattle.

[A]

There's nation cattle.

[B]

It's a slur.

[A]

Yeah, it's. It's a racial slur to everybody that's not Jewish. This is in these files. Like. And she's saying everywhere, not just her Epstein. Epstein's talking to the former prime Minister of Israel. And what is that? What's going on? And then we see all these, these laws being passed here in the States for anti Semitism. What about the rest of us? Why aren't we protecting the rest of us? What is that?

[B]

Well, look, I think we've got to get back to the basic principles of this country. I'm of Hindu faith, Indian American, born in Philadelphia. You treat every person with equality and respect, whether you're Christian, whether you're Jewish, whether you're Hindu, whether you're Muslim. And are there cases of anti Semitism in America? Yes, there are.

[A]

Yeah, there are. I'm not going to argue that.

[B]

And, and have there been incidents? Yes. But is there an arrogance in Silicon Valley beyond just these emails of some people who think they're better than other human beings? That, to me is the fundamental construct. Right. That is that. That needs to be challenged, that you're not better just because you may be rich. You're not better just because you may have been a billionaire. You're not better just because you're part of the Epstein network. Like, I have so much more respect for people who wear the nation's uniform, who keep our country safe for firefighters, for law enforcement, for nurses, for EMT workers, for teachers, the people who built this country, steel workers, people on the factory floors. And we have lost that sense of respect for people who really, through hard work Built America. And I think about how I grew up in Bucks county, teachers, little league coaches, and they never had a shot, never dreamed of going and making millions of dollars. I don't have a problem with people going and becoming rich and starting companies. But this sense that you're better than folks, that the rules don't apply to you and the sense that the economy should just work for you. Some people say, like, yeah, they should get to call the shots, that they have some kind of God given right to rule or lead, that America will be better off with them in charge. And I fundamentally reject that. And that is the tale of two Americas is the problem. And I think in this country is why people voted for Bernie, is why people voted for Trump. They're sick of it. They want to be seen for the people who actually built America, the forgotten Americans. And Trump campaigned on that. And people are like, well, what, what now? Why aren't you going after these people? You said you were going to tear them down. You said, you said you were going to hold this corrupt system accountable, drain the swamp. What happened?

[A]

It was all bullshit. Why do you think, why do you think that? Why are they protecting the abusers? Why did they, why, why didn't those names come out? Why are the little black lines over all the real important what, honest, honestly, what do you think that is?

[B]

They're powerful. They're very powerful. One person talked about a name who is in the files, who hasn't gotten attention. I don't want to say the name, but who said that this guy is so powerful in New York that everyone fears them. And I think that the names that probably aren't in haven't been released yet or blacked out. They're probably people who are very, very powerful, who have financial interests, who have, who may, maybe they're saying, look, you come, you, you put our name out and we're going to talk about who else was involved. We're going to spill the beans about more of what, what, what is there. And so I think they were actually very clever. What they did is they put out enough and they put out a lot of bad stuff that people would say, well, that was a legitimate release. You asked me, is it a legitimate release? Yeah, they put out a lot of stuff. It was pretty bad. I didn't expect even that we'd get this far. But then they didn't put out the nuclear stuff. And so this is a way of saying, yeah, it's not B.S. i mean, if I go to a judge saying, oh, they didn't Release the files? No, we released the files and the judge will look at it, bro. They put out millions of documents. They've called out a lot of people or powerful folks, but what they do by that diversionary tactic is they can keep the. The worst of it secret. And now it's harder for Massey or me or the survivors to say, let's still get all the files. So someone is being very sophisticated in giving us just enough to pass the. The test, but keeping the most powerful people protected. And this is a question that we need answered. I mean, why are these people being protected? Who are they? What power do they have? What do they know? Because politically, it makes no sense. Why wouldn't you release this stuff?

[A]

You think there's people more powerful than the ones that are already in there?

[B]

I mean, yes, yes, I think there are people who are more powerful or have more information or are more connected into some of these networks that haven't been released. There's no other explanation. I mean, I'm willing to listen to Blanche because he's saying we can see the unredacted files, but there's no other explanation for having an email to Jeffrey Epstein with the abuser's name blacked out. And the email just says, I enjoyed the naughty girl you sent, or I enjoyed the Brazilian girl. Like, why are you blacking that out? Or, you know, you have my permission to kill. Blacked out. Why? Who you think that are going to kill? Yeah, you think it's survivors?

[A]

Did they kill?

[B]

You know, you think.

[A]

Are they saying there's bodies buried at the New Mexico ranch?

[B]

There were emails about that and they're. They're. This is that. And, and so there's.

[A]

I'll bet there's no excavators over there right now looking for anything.

[B]

How do you not investigate it? You know all. Blanche, as well. They're just men partying.

[A]

I wonder who owns that ranch now. Do you know?

[B]

I do not know.

[A]

I wonder if we could find that out, bring them in. Maybe they can do their own.

[B]

Maybe you do the investigation here. I mean, on this podcast. I mean, I. But. But the point is, you don't have. You can get people voluntarily, but you don't have the. You've done more than the DOJ has done. But you don't have the power to subpoena. Congress has the power to subpoena. We have such power to subpoena that Bill Clinton, a former president, caved and is now coming and testifying in Congress. You don't think that we could exercise that Same power with all of these people are in the files.

[A]

But why do you think the DOJ isn't doing anything? Because shouldn't they be the ones that are indicting people?

[B]

They should. They should. They should.

[A]

Who have they indicted?

[B]

They haven't indicted a single person.

[A]

Really?

[B]

Post episode, they said, oh, he's a dead guy, and let's move on. They have not released the names of the coconspirators who they should have indicted. They have not released the names of the people they should have prosecuted. And let alone, they've done nothing to investigate these people. And I, I don't know why. Like, they, they say, okay, there's no. They don't. It doesn't rise to a criminal level. Well, how do you know if you haven't investigated it? Have you called these people in and have you asked them questions about where they were? What did they do? What did they know? I don't think you have. I know you haven't, because these people would. Would be saying that they were already cooperated with law enforcement. So you have. I mean, just think about this rationally. You have all these files. You got rich people, powerful people talking about being on the island. You're investigating the case back in 2007 or in 2019, doesn't it say, okay, I'm going to send an FBI agent or someone to talk to these powerful people about Epstein just to understand what was going on. You don't have to. I mean, and they didn't do any of this why? Because they were intimidated. Because these people were at the Davos conferences together. They were financing the same politicians together. You got Donald Trump saying, oh, Bill Clinton shouldn't testify because he doesn't want to testify. You know, it's all the same club.

[A]

It's a good point. That's a good point.

[B]

It's a club. And they don't want that club to. To be pierced, to be broken. People who have power in this country and people who don't.

[A]

How long have you realized it's one club?

[B]

I've had a sense, but it's. It's become more and more obvious to me with these files. I was shocked at the extent of it in these files. I mean, I was like, how is every prominent person in some way connected? It's just absurd. I mean, I do. I think everyone in those files was a pedophile. No, but like you, none of you had the judgment after Epstein was a convicted pedophile to say, you know what? Like, yeah, I don't want to show up to his island. I don't want to show up to a party where I hear their young girls, like, how is it? It's your. Your membership in that club was so important to you that you didn't have a minute to pause and say, yeah, maybe I shouldn't be showing up to a pedophile's house. Right. It's, it's. It's almost. It's. It's not even. There's desire for gratification at the expense of young girls. It's almost like their desire to belong to this club, I call it the Epstein class, was so overriding that they were willing to overlook everything else. They were willing to overlook girls being raped. They were willing to overlook the heinous things that Epstein was doing. They were willing to overlook the fact that he had all these suspicious contacts with foreign leaders potentially selling out our country because God forbid they weren't invited to those parties. And God forbid they were not given membership into the Epstein class. And that's the two Americas we have. That's not what our founders wanted. That's not why you wore the uniform. That's not why kids died in Afghanistan or Iraq. That's not why people scale the cliffs of Normandy. And people need to wake up in this country and say, look, we got to get our country back. And it starts with elite accountability.

[A]

Have you been. Have you heard from the survivors?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

What are they saying?

[B]

One of them I call back to, she texted me yesterday. She said there's a man in the files who hasn't gotten enough attention. I want you to call that person out. I'm going to call her back today to say. Because he really was responsible for raping young girls and the media hasn't focused on him. So some of them are alerting me to things they're seeing in the files. You know, there's so many things.

[A]

Can I ask you who that is?

[B]

I don't. I can. I can give you. I'll give Jeremy the information after if I get her permission with the survivor. The survivor's permission. But I'll certainly. I was planning to call her on the airport back to California, but the. The reality is that there's so many people in this that some people are just hiding. Right. If it was just, let's say, Gates, it'd be like front page news. But there are hundreds of these people.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And so they're almost benefiting by the fact that there's so many. So we've. We've got to. Some of them want to make sure that they're. They're actually being held accountable. And then they're pissed that the files were. Were not released with their names redacted. I mean, that so many of these pictures were released of young girls naked. Like, I mean, how do you do that? How do you do that? So their identities were compromised. I've heard from some of them just in tears about that. And then they're upset that they're protecting pedophiles still and these abusers. So they, they are not happy. And they feel like, they feel there's some sense of accountability. They also want to know what's going to happen. Right. Because they feel exposed. All these people are out there, the files are out there, but, like, are we going to do anything? And they're disappointed in America because they see all these other countries, like, Prime Minister of Israel is making a statement. Starmer is almost going to fall. You've got Eastern European countries talking about bringing investigations about people in the files, and our President saying, let's move on. Right? I mean, Ludnik, who's in the files, doesn't even have to answer to the press. In other countries, they'd be gone, sacked.

[A]

Right.

[B]

And it's just kind of their senses, like, okay, do we not care? That's what they're asking, like, do we not. Is it just. Are we so immune that if people have money and power, that's all we care about?

[A]

The big rumor for years has been that if this gets released, the entire world's power structure will shit the bed. I think we're starting to see that.

[B]

We're starting to see it in England. We're starting to see it in other parts of the world. And I didn't believe that actually in the beginning. I thought, okay, maybe they're exaggerating. Maybe it's a conspiratorial. I thought, okay, yeah, there are going to be people in New York. And he was blocking the New York police. I didn't realize the extent of it until these files got released. And that makes me realize, okay, if this is what they've released, what are they holding and why are they holding it? And the only way. We can't. Massie and I, Congress can't force the release of the classified stuff. We just don't have the authority. We the Congress. It would be held unconstitutional for Congress to force the release of classifying material the President has the authority to declassify. So what we need is a president to appoint a commission of people who are trusted to be able to look at the intelligence and then to come up with some public report. Until we do that, the. There's not going to be a restoration of trust. We need in my view, a truth and reconciliation commission. Someone who's going to do a investigation of the people who are in these files and really have some public accountability and someone who's going to look at the intelligence, who has impeccable integrity. Maybe it's someone from the military, some, you know, not a politician, certainly not a politician. Someone who has incredible integrity to look at this and then do a report like we had the report after the Kennedy assassination or the King assassination. I mean we still debate that, but there's got to be some understanding of who this guy was.

[A]

I think we should do a panel with you, Massie. Some of these survivors and anybody else is fighting for, fighting for this to get released. I think that would be a very powerful piece of content. You want to put it together?

[B]

Yeah, I would love to. I mean I think having Massey, I think, I think getting Marjorie Taylor Greene, if she, she's open to it. I haven't talked to her, but Massey certainly survived.

[A]

D.C. will make it easy on you guys.

[B]

Yeah, I, I think Massey I can talk to and I, and certainly the survivors I can talk to. I'm having one of this. I know you were invited to the State of Union. I'm taking one of the survivors as my guest to the State of the Union to make a statement that you know, we, we need, we owe it to them to, to be fighting for them. And I, I can help get the survivors. I'll talk to Thomas. I mean he's got a primary challenge but you know, he's getting attacked anyway. The, they're billionaires coming after him. Some of them are coming after me. You know, we've, we've cast our lot. I think doing this is going to help actually get justice. To me, this is the highest priority.

[A]

Right there with you. What are we missing? We missing anything?

[B]

Patreon questions.

[A]

We can bring it. Oh, I do have a couple of Patreon from the stream. Okay. Yeah, I did. I, I forgot this, this is from Teddy Borgia. How do you take on the responsibility of being one of the main figures in the fight against roadblocks lackadaisical efforts to rid their app of child predators. This is actually from his 14 year old son.

[B]

Well, I first want to just compliment Schlepp for what he did. He had a lot of courage and what Roblox is doing is totally unacceptable. It's not just the child predators and the Fact that they're engaged in abuse online. It's also these games that they've created that are teaching kids that it's okay to celebrate school shootings or to roam Epstein's island, or to reenact 9 11. I mean, what are we doing allowing this to take place? We've got to have a new moral vision in this country. We've got to have some moral values. So Roblox is in Silicon Valley. I've met with their CEO. He assured me months ago that he was going to change things, but I'm going to approach him and hold him accountable. Especially after your episode comes out and some of the games that he has. My first question to him is going to be, what do you. What are you doing with Sandy Hook shooting on your platform?

[A]

It's. I don't even know if I told you about the chat place we got in these games. And I did this with this guy, Ryan Montgomery. Right. I didn't believe how. How widespread pedophilia and predators are in this country. And so that was my first time ever breaking into the subject. Brought him in here. He was a hacker. I said, hey, any social media platform. I don't care what you get in, just anything the kids are in, just get in. I want to see how long this shit takes. Five seconds.

[B]

Are you serious?

[A]

It took five seconds where someone targeted. Yeah, I'll put the clip up. Ryan, do you think you could demonstrate right here, right now, how fast these sexual predators. Predators will show up in a chat room?

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Fire your computer up.

[A]

Let's do it.

[C]

I'm recording. So now I'm just gonna say, hi, who wants to chat? I named myself Ashley. Female, New Jersey. 13. Female, New Jersey. Let's see how many private messages come in. 2. Already 3.

[A]

It's been like 10 seconds.

[C]

Yep. Hey, want a full round? Hey, how old are you? Let me just copy that and send that to everybody because we got other messages coming in.

[A]

What chat room are you in?

[C]

Just a teen chat. Hey, you want to cuddle a bit? I didn't. I mean, I'm taking. I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt right now that. That they didn't read the. Oh, he's 47.

[A]

47 years old in a teen chat room. You got him in, what, five seconds? He's already messaging in.

[C]

Oh, yeah, there's a ton of. I can't even keep up with them here because every time I click one, there's more on the list.

[A]

Then we bring schlep on, and I had him do the same thing with Roblox, said, pull it up. He's like, well, I'm banned. I can't do it. You gotta do it. So I created an account and I should have made the account. What Ryan did was he made the account. Ashley, 13, NJ. I put like Joe Blow. 47. 47 or something like that. I should have put, you know, Susie, 12, Virginia. But it didn't matter. We get in there and I'm like, I just want to see how long this takes. Boom. 20 seconds this time, 20 seconds. Want to get freaky? How old are you? This is what's then the next one. Hey, I'm bored. What are you doing? How old are you?

[B]

On chat?

[A]

On chat, then the next one. Hey, I'm 19. How old are you? Want to get freaky? There was no normal conversations and there was five times in probably four minutes maybe. First one happened within 20 seconds and it was back to back to back to back.

[B]

Why do you think there's a sickness in America on pedophilia? Like what? What is going on in the country?

[A]

I think it has to do. Do you know what I think this is? Causes shit. I don't know about the elites. I think the elites get everything they want and then they get bored with it and then they need to go after something forbidden.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Because it makes them feel powerful.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

It's a hurdle, I think. I think with normal population. I think it's the porn industry. Do you know what the number one search thing on porn is? No, it's incest. It's brother, mother, really? Brother, sister, daddy, daughter. That's what the most. That's what the most searched shit is in porn. And so when you introduce a kid to pornography and what kids are. Kids are fine. We have family friends whose kids have found it at fucking 8 years old. The most horrific shit. We're not talking like, you know, Top Gun sex scene back in the 80s that I wasn't allowed to watch. You know, we're talking full on fucking gang bangs, like disgusting ins. And so you get introduced to porn, watch that, then that's not enough. Then you move into the incest shit. Then you're into, I don't know, bestial shit with animals. Then the next thing you know, none of that stuff does, does it is rotted your fucking mind completely. And then you go to the pedophilia. That's what I think it is.

[B]

And you think it's increased from when we were growing up?

[A]

I think it has definitely increased since we were growing up. Although I don't know. I mean, a lot of the people I bring on this show, I'll bet 50% of them admittedly talk about their sexual abuse as a kid.

[B]

Yeah, I've been shocked how many people have told me about their sexual abuse since they've seen me leading on Epstein. It's crazy, you know, saying four to eight. And you know what? One of the things I get told a lot is, yeah, I was abused. I was abused by an uncle. I was abused by a babysitter. I was abused by a babysitter's husband. And I never told my parents. And I said, why didn't you tell your parents? He said, because my dad would have killed the guy. And I didn't want to put my father in that position where he would go to jail. And some of these people don't never told their parents till they were 30, 40. Some of them never told their parents. But the amount of people who've had this in their families has been just shocking to me.

[A]

It's almost, it's. It appears to be more have been victimized than not. And then let me go a little bit further with this porn shit. So on top of the porn, so you have all these teenage boys that are getting girls that are getting addicted to porn, and the. In the most disgusting shit you can imagine, because it's all out there. But then you also have the predators. And so the predators get in touch with the females, you know, the 10, 11 on up to whatever, 17, 18, and they lure them in with, I'm going to get you this Louis Vuitton bag. If you send me a picture of yourself, they do it. Then they're immediately extorted. But the other girls find out that this shit's happening and they want a fucking Louis Vuitton bag and they want a new iPhone and they want this and that and the other thing. And what may start off as, you know, just send me something of you in a bikini, and then it turns into a boob, and then it turns into the whole thing, and then they're inserting things in themselves and, and, and, and, and cutting. And it's you, I'm sure, you know about this. Anyways, these girls, they get it. They, they want that, they want the, you know, so they go for this older. They want the free shit now they want. Now those girls are no longer interested in teenage boys, so there's no connection there. There's no dating. And so now what the do the teenage boys do? They turn, they, they, they go back to porn. And then they get addicted to this stuff. And it gets worse.

[B]

It's a cycle.

[A]

And it gets worse and it gets worse and it gets worse. It's only fans. It's pornhub.

[B]

How do we turn it around?

[A]

You guys gotta, you gotta do something about the pornography in the country to regulate it. It's everywhere. I mean, I got on. I got on Brave. Do you know what Brave is? I don't supposedly like the new. It's like a secure Google. Kind of like Duck, Duck, Go. It was either Duck, Duck, Go or Brave. I can't. That's what I use. I don't use Google anymore. And I looked up one of the guests that was coming on the show. Well, that guest apparently also. There's also an only fans girl or a porn star that has the same name. I just did a, A, a search, just a regular search, like Sean Ryan. You know what I mean? And then it wasn't Sean Ryan, but it was a different Sean Ryan. It's just, it's. And it's everything. All of it, all of. On a simple search.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

That everybody.

[B]

I mean every. That's crazy.

[A]

This, this. But this is. I think that this is a big part of what's happening is it starts with that. Because I mean, these kids are finding the shit 6, 7, 8 years old and they're addicted to it in. And then to feed the, feed the addiction, you have to get. It gets weirder and weirder and weirder until it becomes illegal.

[B]

And then when they turn 19, 20, they're replicating it. They're the ones on Roblox and other things, trying to abuse.

[A]

Well, a lot of these kids that are abused, I mean it's, it's a lot of these kids that are abused wind up turning into abusers themselves because it's all, all they know.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You know, and I'll tell you another thing.

[B]

It's important that some of the abuse is online. Right? I mean, and that's scarring as well. I mean there's obviously the physical abuse, but if you're online for months or years in an abusive online interaction with an adult, I mean, that can be just as jarring to someone's psychology.

[A]

Well, the desensit. The, the desensitizing these kids is also a big part of me. When we're talking about roadblocks, I mean, they're desensit. They're taking real events real. I mean, I remember thinking this. Did you ever watch Walking Dead?

[B]

No, but I know what it is.

[A]

About six, seven years ago, I Remember, my wife was big into it. And I'm watching. There was a, I don't know his name, he's an Asian kid in the, in the series. And they have a guy with a baseball bat with nails or something on the end of it. And it shows him beating the kid's head in. This is, this is public tv.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And then it shows like the vantage point through his eyes.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I'm like, there's kids that watch this.

[B]

Yeah, that's gratuitous.

[A]

And then you go to robots and they're reenacting active shooter events that, that.

[B]

I was so disgusted and shocked by that, I couldn't believe it. I can't believe someone comes up with the idea of doing a video game where you're reenacting killing six year olds at Sandy Hook and you're reenacting the shooter killing his own mom. And then you're celebrating that. And then they have the victim's names.

[A]

I mean, eight year olds are doing this, probably younger than eight. And so, I mean, could you imagine the process of deep sense? I mean it's, it's just, it's introduced at such a young age that.

[B]

Right. And all it takes is a few of them to actually internalize it. Right. And you wonder why we have the kind of violence and the problems in our society.

[A]

It's not a few of them, it's millions.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

They said Roblox has 80 million users a day. A day.

[B]

I wonder how much that Sandy Hook game gets every day. I mean, that should be pulled today like that. I, they need to look at all these games that are reenacting.

[A]

I'll bet it gets pulled as soon as this episode comes out. But there's a lot more of those. And we got the screen recordings. And you motherfuckers are going down. You motherfuckers are going down. But what people need to realize is these fuck. That doesn't mean the evil goes away. It's just going to go to the next fucking platform.

[B]

Until we deal with the broader pornography, the broader desensitization on violence.

[A]

You have to do something about the porn industry.

[B]

There's got to be some values. I'm a, I'm a free speech guy and I may let people live, but, but it can't be at the point of degeneracy. It can't be at the point, it.

[A]

Cannot be that accessible to kids. I mean, when you and I grew up, it was in the back of the, the movie rental section with black fucking paper over the.

[B]

Or used to get the magazine right and people would be nervous about even getting the magazine. Used to be in a section that was restricted. Now it's all over.

[A]

It's everywhere. Let me tell you about my morning routine. I wake up, I have decisions I need to make. Am I going to train? Am I going to go to work? Am I going to be stressed out all day? And what kind of tea am I going to use? Usually I use a chai. Now, what I do every morning.

[B]

Is.

[A]

I put Bub's collagen peptides into my tea along with some MCT oil, and it gives me the best shit of my entire life. Yeah, you heard it. The best shit of my entire life. Let me tell you more about this stuff. You've heard me talk about their collagen peptides forever. But this stuff, the MCT oil, goes in my tea every single morning. It's real brain and body fuel backed by science, not vibes. It's made with grass fed butter and fast acting MCT oil from coconuts. Which sounds kind of weird until you try it and suddenly you're awake and not pissed off at everybody. And if butter isn't your thing, relax. They've got a vegan version, too. MCT oil gives your brain quick fuel, supports digestion and gut health, helps curb cravings, and keeps your energy steady all day. I dump it in my tea with my collagen, stir it around, and I'm set. I trust BUBS because they don't cut corners. Their products meet serious quality standards. And the MCT creamer is NSF certified for sport, which means it's clean, tested and not sketchy. And here's the part that I love the most. Bubs was founded in honor of Navy Seal Glenn Bubb Dougherty. 10% of all profits go to support veterans as they transition back to civilian life. The stuff we talk about all the time on the show. So when you buy Bubs, you're also supporting the guests that have been on this show. If you want to upgrade your morning routine and take literally the best shit of your entire life, then you need to go to Bubsnaturals.com SRS and use code SHAWN for 20% off your order. Clean fuel, no crash, and the best of your entire life. Bubsnaturals.com SRS we got some Patreon questions.

[B]

Exactly right.

[A]

All right, cool. All right, ro, just couple Q and A here. This is from Megan W. From Megan W. With all the corruption and fraud being exposed, will the American taxpayer ever see any accountability? And what would that Accountability even look like.

[B]

Well, Megan, look, we've got to have accountability both in the federal government and in state governments. Federal government. The biggest fraud, in my view and waste is in the Defense Department. They failed seven audits. And I'm all for paying our troops. I'm all for having national security. But you've got these defense contractors making millions of dollars for their executives ripping off the American people, where you're buying things that a commercial product would cost one tenth the amount. And so we need to have an actual audit of the Department of defense. It's 56% of our budget, by the way, Medicare Advantage is also ripping people off billing the American government by saying people are sicker than they actually are. Those are two places to look at fraud and waste on the state governments. I'm working actually on a bipartisan basis, partly after our conversation, to say we should have some kind of audit of all state governments so that there is accountability. You know, my state, there's been places of waste. Like you had a train that was supposed to be built in 2008, and every year, you know, they say, oh, the train's going to be built. The train's going to build. It was supposed to connect LA and San Francisco. It still hasn't connected Bakersfield to Merced. And we've been there 20, almost 20 years, you know, so that's a clear case. We've got a problem in my state of people who are homeless and unhoused. We've spent billions of dollars on that issue, but we still have a huge homeless population in Los Angeles.

[A]

It's become a business. Homeless stuff has become a business.

[B]

It is an issue in our state. We have not handled it well.

[A]

The rich have turned the homeless issue into a business.

[B]

Well, there's waste that's gone in terms of where that money is going, because it's certainly not getting people the treatment and the shelter that they need. We're not. We're not addressing that in our state. You know, our cost of living is so high that we have one of the highest poverty indexes in California. When you look at and adjust for cost of living, and we have one of the highest housing costs. So, yeah, we've done well as a state. When you look at the UCs and the colleges and when you look at Stanford and Berkeley and we look at the startups and the production of wealth, but when you look at the working class and the middle class and the high cost of housing, the high cost of energy, the fact that wages haven't kept up and you have all this waste. When it comes to the high speed rail or homelessness. We've got issues. So there needs to be accountability. And that's one of the big issues. There was like 10 people running for governor in my state. That's one of the big issues is who's going to turn around the mess. There's 10 people running for governor, 10 serious people. Because people are so upset. People are upset that, you know, they're upset with the homelessness, they're upset with the cost of living. They're upset that if you're working class in California, life is hard. They're upset with crime, crime, public safety. They're upset that we have not, we've had huge income inequality. And so there, you know, there are all these candidates running saying, I'm going to turn around, turn this around, and we'll see who wins.

[A]

Anybody good? Anybody good?

[B]

I've endorsed Tom Starr, but there are a bunch of people who are running who are thoughtful and, you know, I mean, there's Matt Mahan, Eric Swalwell, you know, Katie Porter. I mean, it'll be a, it's a good race. But they're all running unchanged. They're all running saying California is not working. Energy costs are too high, homelessness is too high. We have too much waste, fraud, abuse in Sacramento. PG&E is ripping us off in terms of our energy prices. The supplemental poverty rate is one of the highest in the nations when it comes to people who are working class and poor, when you factor in cost of living. Our education System, K through 12 has not been working in terms of 38th or 40th. So there's a lot that needs to change. It's a, it's a huge undertaking for whoever wins.

[A]

Where are you on nuclear?

[B]

I'm for, I'm for nuclear.

[A]

You're for nuclear?

[B]

For nuclear. Where are you on it?

[A]

I'm very pro nuclear.

[B]

It's got to be part of the mix. By the way, the left to disagree with me. I say, if you look at the Intergovernmental Panel of Climate Change that the UN did, they say that nuclear has to be part of the mix in terms of tackling climate and you need renewables, but you need nuclear as well.

[A]

From Lee Greathouse, in your opinion, what is the biggest change that we could make that would restore Congress to the original intent of the founding fathers, and would it even be possible?

[B]

Get money out of politics and term limits. So get rid of all of the super PACs, all of the PACs, all of the donors, you know, have public financing or say you can only get money for people in your district. Give everyone 100 bucks of money maybe they could give to any candidate they wanted, but get the big money out and then have term limits. You could say 12 years as a member of Congress, six terms, two terms as a senator. You could debate what the right is. You know, 18 years as a Supreme Court justice. These things were never designed to be lifelong pursuits. And if, and people may agree or disagree with Massie or me, but we are willing to take risk, to risk our own seats, right? Massey has a primary challenge. People upset at me or trying to do a primary challenge. And the reason we're willing to do it is because we don't have a view that this is a lifetime gig. Like, okay, you do there, you make an impact, then you do something else with your life. And some of these people, they've been there 40 years, 50 years. Chuck Schumer literally, I think, has been there before I was born, like in office. His first elective office. How is that?

[A]

Feinstein died in office.

[B]

I called on her to resign. She wasn't going to meetings for a year. Like, she wasn't, she was just Mitch.

[A]

McConnell stroking out on camera.

[B]

I mean, what.

[A]

On fucking camera multiple times? And it's, you know, fuck, is anybody even in there? What the fuck are we doing?

[B]

And you know, it's, it happens in sports, right? Like the athletes always stay a season or two long. But this isn't a sport, like, right, okay, you do that, you're your team. Maybe have a bad season. This is the United States of America. Well, like, you can't take that kind of a risk where we've got people in there in their 60s and 70s and 80s. I'm not saying I'm not ageist, just I'm saying have a, a, a, a elected officials that represent the demographics of the country. But what happens when you've been there 30 years? You build name ID, you build a donor network. So even if you're not doing the job, you can just go.

[A]

It really does just come down to the donors, doesn't it? The voters don't even matter. It's just the donors.

[B]

The donors have a huge influence. I mean, someone dislikes me. You're a billionaire, you say, okay, I'm Gonna put in $10 million tomorrow against Khanna. Okay, so someone is a no name person, can come in $10 million, you can be on TV. They'll get an equal name recognition right away. And then you find some vote. I've been there nine Years. I'm sure there's some votes people will be upset at you. Highlight that vote. Say Kana is selling you out because he voted for this. Vote for the new guy. And so one person, literally with money, can take someone out. So if you just want to keep your job, the way to keep your job is keep your head low. Don't call out anyone in power. Don't ruffle too many feathers. Just keep climbing up, and then you're part of the club. And one day, you'll chair the committee or get a big position or, you know, you'll. You'll get your shot. And that's. That's how our system works. And then once you're in there, as long as you're not ruffling any feathers, your name ID keeps getting higher, your donor base keeps getting bigger, and it's hard to beat you.

[A]

You know, there's a way around this, and I think you're starting to figure out. It's podcasts.

[B]

I think that's the. That's the. That's our shot. The independent media. I mean, you're. I. I said this. I go on Sunday shows all the time. And I. I'm not saying this to insult them, because I still want to be invited on, but I've had more people reach out to me the one time I came on than probably four or five of those Sunday appearances in a row because the same people are watching the Sunday shows. Whereas, you know, with. I. I had a guy, a janitor in the Capitol, say, congressman Conheise. He started yelling at me. So I saw you on Sean Ryan. I don't agree with half the stuff you do, but thank you for going on. He's a good guy, right? I mean, your demographic is not just the people who read the New York Times. You got working class folks who listen in. You've got Republicans, Democrats, Independents. So I think you can bypass the elites who have run this country for too long. I'm not saying they don't have a role, but that wasn't democracy, right? Like, and. And. And. And we've seen from this Epstein class and files that their values are out of sync. It doesn't matter how intelligent you are. Most of these people are brilliant. Most of these people, we want their intelligence. They've started great companies. They've done great things in finance. I'm all for intelligence. I'm all for people building wealth, but wealth and intelligence without values is meaningless. What built America is the values. And so I think what the democracy does, what podcasts do, is it sort of reminds people that the people in charge first matters. Having the right values, then we can have the intelligence and the ambition and everything else.

[A]

Sean Murphy. How can we trust any of our elected leaders, especially with how wide the scope of involvement with Epstein appears to be?

[B]

It's a big question. And it's not just our elected class, it's the entire leadership class. Business leaders, finance leaders, tech leaders, Hollywood. Like, how do we get a new moral beginning? How do we have a cleansing in this country? I think the first thing is we've got to have accountability. If we don't have accountability, people are just going to say, nothing changes. There's got to be accountability. There was no accountability after the Great Recession. You talk to young folks, they've seen the Great Recession, they've seen Covid, they've seen these wars. They think this elite class has totally let them down and no one gets held accountable. That's why I think there have to be prosecutions, there have to be investigations, there have to be investigations in Congress. And then people say, okay, there's something different. They're at least holding people accountable. And then we need a new generation. We need a new generation of people in Congress, in the Senate, in these positions, and we need a new moral beginning. I, I believe that the fundamental test of office should be character, should be values. Are you willing to stand for what you believe? Are you willing to do this and then go do something else?

[A]

I think that's what everybody wants.

[B]

What?

[A]

That's what it. So I won't talk to very many people anymore from Congress or the Senate or in the administration because they just come in here and lie right to my face every single time. It's crazy. That's why I appreciate what you're doing. Raphael Vieira. What reforms are needed so wealthy or well connected individuals can't receive preferential treatment in federal prosecutions?

[B]

Wow, that's a tough one, that. Well, first of all, it gets back to the money in politics. So why is it that they're shielded? Because they know politicians. Why is it that they know politicians? Because the politicians need them for campaign finance. Right? So a lot of it gets back to this fundamental original sin in America, which is our money and politics. It's, I think, why our elite are not being held accountable in the way that elite in Britain are. Because in Britain you don't need that kind of money to run for political office. So the, the root of it is, is the money. But the second thing is that we ought to make it a total crime and prosecute those crimes for interference in the justice system. I mean, the fact that Maria Farmer sent a note to the FBI in 1996 that Epstein was raping young girls and the FBI sat on this and didn't do anything and then for 30 years Maria Farmer was called a liar is appalling. And where is the accountability? Why aren't we investigating those people at the FBI who just sat on this, who didn't do anything? That's why when people say, oh, this is a Trump thing, I say, no, it's not. It's an America thing. This happened over successive presidents. This was, these survivors were ignored and abandoned in many different administrations. And yeah, you can lay it all on Clinton or Trump, but that's not what we're talking about. We're talking about a system that protected these rich and powerful people.

[A]

Last one from big country. With the short attention span of the American people. Do you see this gradually fading into the background of our two tiered justice system?

[B]

I don't because I think it's gotten into the popular culture. I mean, when you have a factory worker going in Michigan and yelling at the President, you're protecting pedophiles. That's when I knew this was breaking through. People are talking about this in, in, in bars. They're talking about it. I think, I'm sure they will at the super bowl parties on Sunday. People get this story. They don't understand all the complexity of Mendelsohn in Britain sending Epstein information about Britain trying to buy up the euro and Epstein trading on it. They may not understand the complexities of Epstein showing up at the CIA and talking about Modi and talking about to world leaders, but they understand the simple point that you don't rape American girls and you don't prey on American girls or from working class families and that they are disgusted by the fact that rich and powerful people, who by the way are often surrounded by women are taking such liberties and such arrogance that they're associating with a pedophile and being totally fine going to an island where pedophilia is taking place. That resonates, that broke through. And I think that is the turning point, that maybe this can be the turning point for a new moral beginning in our country. Like maybe this can be the, the, the final straw.

[A]

I think it's happening. I don't know if it's going to go, but I think it's happening because I am for the. Regardless of what the comments section says, the views, the, like, all this stuff, the phone calls, the emails the text that we're. I mean, this is. This is uniting people. And it's really cool to see people start to look beyond the party lines. I really. I think that's the most important thing, accountability. And we have to find a way to start talking to each other like, what we're doing right now.

[B]

I appreciate you, Ro.

[A]

Good to see you, man.

[B]

We'll do it. We'll do it in D.C. with Massey and the Survivors next.

[A]

Let's do it. Let's do it.

[B]

Thank you.

[A]

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