Short Wave – "What's Up With Nightmares?"

Host: Regina Barber (NPR)
Guest: Dr. Michelle Carr, Sleep Scientist at University of Montreal, author of Nightmare Obscura
Release Date: November 21, 2025
Episode Length: ~15 minutes

Episode Overview

This episode explores the science behind nightmares and dreams, focusing on why they occur, how they're connected to our emotions, and what tools and therapies might help people deal with distressing dreams. Host Regina Barber interviews Dr. Michelle Carr, whose new book Nightmare Obscura details the mechanisms of dreaming, the benefits (and potential harms) of nightmares, and cutting-edge research in dream engineering.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Common Nightmares and Dream Themes

• Regina Barber opens by sharing her recurring nightmare of losing control in a car, setting the tone for a personal and relatable discussion.
• Dr. Carr reassures Regina:

  “That is a very common dream theme. I have it all the time as well.” (Michelle Carr, 00:54)

• Other frequent dreams include teeth falling out, flying, falling, or discovering new rooms. (01:18)
• Insight: Such dreams may stem from the body's lack of sensation during sleep—manifesting as perceived loss of control.

2. The Mystery of Nightmares and Dreaming

• Despite extensive research, the exact reason we dream or have nightmares remains somewhat elusive.
• Dr. Carr highlights the importance of distinguishing the roles of sleep versus dreaming in mental health:

  “We're only just beginning to uncover whether dreaming and the way that we feel during sleep is significant in our health as well.” (Michelle Carr, 01:45)

• Purpose: The episode’s goal is to demystify why nightmares happen and how they might benefit or hamper us.

3. Sleep Stages and Dreaming

• Dr. Carr explains the four sleep stages (03:39):
  • Stage 1: Transition between awake and asleep; fleeting, strange images may appear.
  • Stage 2: Deeper, more stable; disconnected from external stimuli.
  • Stage 3: Deep, slow-wave sleep; minimal, brief, often forgotten dreams.
  • REM (Rapid Eye Movement): Most vivid, emotional, and sensory dreams—brain activity resembles wakefulness.

  “REM sleep is the stage when we also have the most vivid and emotional and sensory dream experiences.” (Michelle Carr, 04:34)

4. Sleep’s Role in Emotional Processing

• Referencing research in Nightmare Obscura, Dr. Carr discusses how sleep helps us process stressful experiences.
• Study example: Participants watched embarrassing videos, then felt shame; after sleep, their emotional response decreased. (05:04)

  “It's helping us let go of a lot of the distress that we accrue during the day.” (Michelle Carr, 05:26)

• Insight: Sleep helps dissociate emotional distress from the memory itself, promoting adaptation and readiness for new challenges.

5. Nightmares: Causes and Functions

• Nightmares are often linked to past trauma or periods of high stress.

  “It's almost like the memory is too intense and the emotion is so strong that it kind of disrupts sleep.” (Michelle Carr, 07:19)

• Occasional nightmares or bad dreams may actually represent healthy emotional processing; persistent, intense nightmares can be harmful.
• Analogy: Dr. Carr compares nightmares to a “mental autoimmune reaction”—your mind attacking itself with memories. (07:00)

6. Neuroscience of Nightmares

• Nightmares seldom occur in sleep labs; being observed may make people feel safe. (08:34–08:57)
• Brain regions active in dream-emotions mirror those in waking life.
• People with frequent nightmares exhibit less activation in the brain’s frontal (emotion-regulating) areas when distressed:

  “They’re less able to regulate and to control and to manage their emotion… this is occurring both during REM sleep... and wakefulness.” (Michelle Carr, 09:52)

• Implication: Poor dream-based emotion regulation can spill into daytime life.

7. Treating Nightmares

• Imagery Rehearsal Therapy (IRT):
  • Exposure to the nightmare script (write/talk about it without avoidance).
  • Then, rewrite the dream with a more positive or empowered outcome.
  • Visualize the new script before sleep each night.

  “Over time, this decreases nightmare frequency... and improves symptoms overall.” (Michelle Carr, 11:38)

• Key benefit: Greater sense of control over dreams and reduced distress.

8. Sleep Engineering & Lucid Dreaming

• Lucid Dreaming: Being aware that you’re dreaming and gaining control over the narrative.

  “Even if you just start to have more agency in your dreams, that can be beneficial... more awareness in your dream, even if you’re not fully lucid.” (Michelle Carr, 12:27–13:17)

• Dream Engineering: Using intention and visualization before bed to influence dreams.

9. Exciting New Technologies

• EEG Headbands: Wearable tech that detects sleep stages in real time, possibly enabling in-sleep interventions.
• App Innovations: Some devices deliver stimuli (e.g., gentle vibrations) when signs of arousal/nightmare are detected to disrupt distressing dreams.

  “They might present a vibration stimulus which awakens you a little bit and it interrupts the nightmare as it’s occurring.” (Michelle Carr, 14:31)

• Implication: Technologies could enable personalized, immediate responses to nightmares at home—not just in the lab.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On common nightmare themes:

  “Teeth falling out or flying or falling or finding new rooms in my house.”
  (Michelle Carr, 01:18)

• On sleep and emotional reset:

  “After a night of sleep, if you think about that same problem, it almost seems completely manageable.”
  (Michelle Carr, 05:26)

• On the adaptive value of (occasional) nightmares:

  “These are all reflecting what is an adaptive process of sleep and of dreaming, which is you’re trying to work through these stressful or negative experiences.”
  (Michelle Carr, 08:01)

• On the neuroscience of nightmares:

  “There’s actually less activation in their frontal areas of their brain when they are experiencing emotional distress.”
  (Michelle Carr, 09:57)

• On dream intervention tools:

  “It's a dream, so you can do whatever you want, really.”
  (Michelle Carr, 11:15)

Timestamps for Important Segments

• 00:54 — Common nightmare themes
• 03:39 — Walkthrough of sleep stages, dream-rich REM
• 05:04–05:26 — Sleep’s role in emotional processing, embarrassing video study
• 07:00–08:23 — Nightmares as self-attacks, mental autoimmune analogy
• 09:52 — Brain differences in people prone to nightmares
• 10:45–12:11 — Imagery Rehearsal Therapy explained
• 12:27–13:30 — Lucid dreaming and agency in dreams
• 13:41–14:58 — Dream tech: EEG headbands, wearable interventions

Takeaway

The science of nightmares is still evolving, but understanding when bad dreams become problematic—and the tools we can use to manage them—can make the world of sleep a little less frightening. Occasional nightmares may be part of healthy emotional processing, but persistent distress deserves attention. New research and technology are making it easier than ever to understand and even influence our dreams.

For deeper dives, check out Michelle Carr’s book Nightmare Obscura or previous Short Wave episodes on sleep and melatonin.**