I Schitt You Not…with Emily Hampshire

Summary

Episode Summary: "I Schitt You Not…with Emily Hampshire" on Sibling Revelry with Kate Hudson and Oliver Hudson

Release Date: March 3, 2025

In the episode titled "I Schitt You Not…with Emily Hampshire," hosts Kate Hudson and Oliver Hudson delve deep into the intricacies of the entertainment industry, personal growth, and the balancing act between career and personal life. Featuring guest Jamil Jamila, the conversation offers an authentic and engaging exploration of acting careers, producing challenges, creative processes, and the complexities of maintaining relationships amidst professional demands.

Welcome and Setting the Tone

The episode kicks off with Oliver Hudson sharing a relatable and humorous anecdote about managing household chores solo in Toronto. At [02:02], he narrates the chaos of cleaning up after tracking salt into the house and accidentally using dish soap in the dishwasher, setting a light-hearted and genuine tone for the conversation.

Navigating the Podcasting Landscape

At [04:32], Oliver reflects on the evolution of the podcasting world, highlighting its exponential growth from 600,000 podcasts a few years ago to an estimated 9 million today. Jamil Jamila acknowledges feeling late to the party but emphasizes the unique value of authentic and meaningful conversations amidst the saturation.

"It’s crazy to see how much it’s grown," Oliver remarks at [04:51], while Jamil adds, "It’s like the party is so over. I just walked in," underscoring the rapid expansion and competitive nature of the medium.

Early Career and Breakthroughs

Jamil shares her pivotal moment of inspiration after watching Les Misérables during her grade six graduation, which ignited her passion for acting. At [12:21], she recounts:

"I made a contract with myself that I would spend eight hours a day on learning acting."

This dedication led her to significant personal discipline and commitment to her craft, setting the foundation for her future endeavors.

Challenges in the Entertainment Industry

The discussion shifts to the hurdles faced in the acting and producing realms. Jamil elaborates on her experience pitching Mary Hartman, detailing the setbacks caused by network changes and industry strikes. At [23:30], she reflects:

"We wrote the pilot, but then TBS changed their programming focus, and everything fell apart. It was a harsh lesson in resilience."

Oliver relates this to his producing journey, mentioning the slow and often unrewarding nature of pitching projects despite personal achievements:

"It's molasses, you know, and you put so much work into it," he admits at [26:50].

Creative Processes and Overcoming Self-Doubt

A significant portion of the episode delves into the creative struggles and self-doubt that accompany artistic endeavors. Both Oliver and Jamil discuss their challenges with accepting compliments and overcoming the fear of inadequacy.

At [14:00], Jamil shares her perspective:

"I never saw it really as a compliment. It was just like someone believed I could do something."

Oliver echoes similar sentiments, acknowledging his tendency to deflect praise and the journey towards self-acceptance:

"I have to understand why I deflect compliments and learn to just say thank you," he explains.

Work-Life Balance and Personal Relationships

The conversation takes a personal turn as Jamil discusses the impact of her workaholic lifestyle on her relationships. She candidly talks about her eight-year marriage, attributing its dissolution to her overwhelming dedication to her career:

"I decided I don't want to say I'm going to be with somebody when at the end of the day, I'm gonna choose work," Jamil confesses at [51:03].

Oliver empathizes, reflecting on his responsibilities as a husband and father:

"Balancing family and career is a constant challenge," he states at [49:55].

Industry Insights and Memorable Experiences

The hosts and guest share intriguing insights and memorable experiences from their careers. Jamil recounts working with the acclaimed director David Cronenberg, highlighting his unique directing style and hands-on approach:

"He believes that he's cast you in the part that you know what you're doing," she notes at [39:35].

Oliver reminisces about his connection with Eugene Levy and the supportive environment fostered through long-standing industry friendships:

"Eugene is just the greatest person, always humble and kind," he remarks at [16:13].

Future Aspirations and Concluding Thoughts

As the episode winds down, both Oliver and Jamil discuss their aspirations beyond their current projects. Jamil expresses a desire to delve into writing and producing, inspired by Dan Levy's multifaceted involvement in Schitt's Creek. Oliver shares his excitement about having creative control through his producing deals, despite recognizing the perpetual hustle required in the industry.

The episode concludes with a heartwarming exchange about potential future collaborations and deepening friendships, encapsulating the essence of Sibling Revelry's mission to inspire and entertain through genuine and heartfelt conversations.

Notable Quotes

• Oliver Hudson [04:51]: "It’s crazy to see how much it’s grown."

• Jamil Jamila [12:21]: "I made a contract with myself that I would spend eight hours a day on learning acting."

• Jamil Jamila [23:30]: "We wrote the pilot, but then TBS changed their programming focus, and everything fell apart. It was a harsh lesson in resilience."

• Jamil Jamila [14:00]: "I never saw it really as a compliment. It was just like someone believed I could do something."

• Oliver Hudson [26:50]: "It's molasses, you know, and you put so much work into it."

• Jamil Jamila [51:03]: "I decided I don't want to say I'm going to be with somebody when at the end of the day, I'm gonna choose work."

Conclusion

"I Schitt You Not…with Emily Hampshire" is a testament to the power of authentic dialogue and the relentless pursuit of passion within the entertainment industry. Through shared experiences and honest reflections, Kate Hudson, Oliver Hudson, and Jamil Jamila offer listeners a nuanced understanding of the highs and lows that come with creative careers, the importance of personal growth, and the enduring strength of meaningful relationships.

Transcript

[Oliver Hudson]

Sister Wives returns at last. And while the Browns have gone their own separate ways, that doesn't mean they're done with each other. Mary and Janelle form an unlikely alliance. Christine is off living in newly married bliss, and Kody and Robin are left wondering, can they be happy in a monogamous relationship? And after all the joy and drama, they hit the hot seat and answer the questions everyone has been begging to know. Sister Wives return Sunday at 10, 9 Central on TLC with T Mobile.

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[Emily Hampshire]

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[Oliver Hudson]

We're leaving today and entering a world of Cinderella, Castle sightseeing, Tron Light cycling jungle cruise Punning Pirate swashbuckling Everest. Climbing Dapper Danning. Danning. Dunning. Soaring, soaring. Fireworks show of. I'm not crying. You're crying. World of favorites for whatever you love, infinite worlds await at the most magical place on earth. Walt Disney World Resort. Hi, I'm Kate Hudson and my name is Oliver Hudson.

[Emily Hampshire]

We wanted to do something that highlighted.

[Oliver Hudson]

Our relationship and what it's like to be siblings. We are a sibling rivalry. No, no sibling R for free.

[Emily Hampshire]

Don't do that with your mouth.

[Oliver Hudson]

Sibling revelry.

[Jamil Jamila]

That's good.

[Oliver Hudson]

Oliver Hudson here, reporting live from Toronto, Canada, where a couple days ago a plane flipped over at Pearson. Miraculously, 80 people survived. Pretty crazy shit. But that's not what I really want to talk about. I want to talk about my domesticity because I'm here in my house in Toronto. And yeah, you know, I know how to do my laundry, and I had to do all that. But today my wife is coming and so I had to clean. Clean. There's so much salt on the streets of Toronto right now that when you track it in, it's like white splotches everywhere. So I got the vacuum out, I got the thing mopping, I'm doing everything else. And then I go to do the dishes. And I guess for some reason, I don't know, I. I put, I put the wrong soap in. I think it was like dish soap, not detergent. So I go to unload the dishwasher and it's a sud, sud fest, like, pouring out. And now I don't know what the to do. I, I don't know how to get the suds out. You know, I wish there was. This is like a rinse button. I don't know. I'm trying to make it sexy. I'm trying to make it. I, I, I, you know, the sheets are in the dryer. I have to put the duvet on, which is like the worst part. Trying to, like, stuff the actual sort of comforter into the do in the duvet. But, yeah, making it sexy. Anyway, in the waiting room, and I was Emily Hampshire. And she's an actress, you probably know her from Schitt's Creek, but she's, I think, lives half in Toronto, half in la. I don't even know if she's in LA or in Toronto. Maybe we're even right next to each other and we have no fucking idea. But let's bring her in. Let's have it. Let's have a chat. You have the headphones and you have the mic because you have a podcast, correct? Yes.

[Jamil Jamila]

They're brand new.

[Oliver Hudson]

No, I know. It's, it's the new shit. Everyone's doing it.

[Jamil Jamila]

I mean, it's kind of old shit. Like people.

[Oliver Hudson]

No, no, that's. I'm naked. I'm joking. I mean, it's crazy. You know, it's funny when, when, when I started doing this, I think it was like four or five years ago, and I remember there were 600,000 podcasts, and my sister and I were like, holy fuck that. I mean, how, what, that's so many. And of course, now I think there's what, like 9 million or something?

[Jamil Jamila]

Oh, yeah. Because if you started. So I just, just literally started this. I'm very late to the party. I'm like, the party is so over. And I just walked in. But if you've been doing it for like, four. Was it before The Pandemic?

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah, yeah. It was before. It was before COVID Oh, wow.

[Jamil Jamila]

That's ahead of the game.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah, we were doing it in person and it was really fun. And then, you know, bang. Everything shuts down. Moved to Zoom and now everything stayed on Zoom. I mean, I'm in. Actually I'm in Toronto right now.

[Jamil Jamila]

Oh, I'm in Toronto right now.

[Oliver Hudson]

Are you in Toronto right now? This is what I wanted to discuss with you because I know you live between what, LA and Toronto.

[Jamil Jamila]

Yeah, yeah.

[Oliver Hudson]

Okay.

[Jamil Jamila]

Where are you in Toronto?

[Oliver Hudson]

I am. I'm doing a movie here. There's like four or five of these little kind of townhousey things, you know.

[Jamil Jamila]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. You know Jamila? Jamil? Do you know her?

[Oliver Hudson]

Because she, she, she's. I'm working with her. She's playing my girlfriend.

[Jamil Jamila]

Oh my God.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah.

[Jamil Jamila]

Oh my God. So, yeah, I love her. Just saw her in New York.

[Oliver Hudson]

She's the greatest.

[Jamil Jamila]

I mean, we, you know, she doesn't have food poisoning.

[Oliver Hudson]

No, I know. And I'm not sure it was even food poisoning because it was like an eight day situation. Only yesterday on set, she started to come back to life a little bit. But whatever it was, I think has finally gone through her system. I. I'm pretty sure she's good.

[Jamil Jamila]

Now in the movie, you guys are playing a couple. So. Did you kiss her?

[Oliver Hudson]

We did not.

[Jamil Jamila]

Oh, okay. Because I was gonna say it's you, obviously.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah, I mean it could. Yeah, it's exactly. I eliminated myself from that. No, we. We did not kiss. Because the idea is, is that I'm kind of merit or divorced, but she's my girlfriend who I kind of bring back to my small town and it all hell kind of breaks loose, you know.

[Jamil Jamila]

Okay.

[Oliver Hudson]

And then of course, you know, the married, the divorced couple, they get back together and so I'll live happily ever after, you know.

[Jamil Jamila]

Yeah.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah. So sweet and so cute.

[Jamil Jamila]

So you are in the snow.

[Oliver Hudson]

It's crazy. I mean, it is nutty. I mean it really, really is. I like it. You know, I mean, I grew up sort of in Colorado as well. I love the snow and the city snow too, is fun. Cause I don't excess experience it much. I don't mind bundling up and walking out in the cold and it, you know, hitting my face the other night, you know, My son's here with me, by the way, because he's actually in the, in the movie, which is a whole other story and it's awesome. That's so sweet and so fun. But the other night, I go to the Four Seasons, and I have dinner, you know, by myself and have a couple martinis. And then I go to this play, the Hazelton Bar, which was actually really fun. And it was kind of popping. It was going crazy, and everything was. And I end up talking to people and hanging out and having fun. And these, like, four Serbian dudes are like, let's go to this, like, club. And I'm like, oh, man, I don't want to go to, like, you know, and then. But this is my problem. I'm always getting myself into weird shit. And I get in their car and I go to, like, this weird club. And I'm. I get there, I'm like, all right, I'm gonna have one beer to be nice. I gotta get out of here. You know what I mean? And I. I get out of there, and now I don't know where I am. My phone has died. So now I'm walking the streets at, like, 1:30am and it is freezing and windy and snowy. And every car that I'm trying to flag down to ask where the I am, thinks I'm a crazy person, doesn't want to have anything to do with me.

[Jamil Jamila]

Yeah. Yeah. Which is rare in Canada because usually they'd stop, but.

[Oliver Hudson]

No, I know. And I finally made it home, only to realize later it was right above Mimi's, that Chinese restaurant. That's where I came out of. And I could have made a right and been home in three and a half minutes, but I made a left, and it was like an hour and a half.

[Jamil Jamila]

Oh, my God. Well, I'm surprised, though. When you said you got into their car, my reaction was like, oh, my God, are you crazy to get into someone's car? Then I realized I do this every day. I Uber all the time. I get into some stranger's car. It's not that, I guess.

[Oliver Hudson]

No, I know. I mean, in hindsight, I probably shouldn't have, but they seem nice enough, and I.

[Jamil Jamila]

And you're like a. I made it. You can help. You can, like, handle yourself.

[Oliver Hudson]

Well, not against four. You know, I mean, but it was. It all worked out, but I don't think I'm gonna do that again.

[Jamil Jamila]

Yeah. Yeah. Maybe less. Maybe not. When it's cold.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yes. Yes.

[Jamil Jamila]

But I, too, like this, too. I grew up in Montreal, and you did school. Like, literally, me too.

[Oliver Hudson]

So. To parfonsee.

[Jamil Jamila]

Embarrassing.

[Oliver Hudson]

So you grew up in Montreal, but you're between LA and Toronto. And then basically, you go where work takes you, or, why are you Split between the two.

[Jamil Jamila]

I go where work takes me. And recently work has been in the uk and so it's just a better flight and better time zone situation. And I'm feeling really grateful to be Canadian right now. So I've been spending a lot of time here. Yeah, yeah. Also I left like right when the fires happened. And so this has been. Feels nice to be in the snow.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah, no, I bet. I bet. And so you grew up in Montreal and you. How did you have siblings? Did you. Where did you grow up in Montreal? Was it a creative family? Is this something you've always wanted to do?

[Jamil Jamila]

So I do have a sibling. I have an older brother and grew up in Point Claire, which is in the west island of Montreal, which is a suburb of the suburb of the suburb. And so really small neighborhood. And nobody I knew was an actor. I just. When I. For my grade six graduation, my mom took me, got me tickets to see Les Mis. And time, I remember there was like, it was like, really cool. It wasn't cornato, it was some cool guy having a pool party from class. And I really wanted to go to a pool party. And I had to leave early, though, to go to Les Mis. And it changed my life. I watched it. I felt like I left the earth. I never. I wanted to be in musicals, which is why any show I do, I always kind of ask the showrunner. I'm like, we do a musical episode. Because I'm not, like, I'm not a good enough singer or dancer or anything to be in actual professional musicals. But when I can force people to make. Let me do it.

[Oliver Hudson]

No, I know. So you saw that and that changed. It was just like, I need to be up there.

[Jamil Jamila]

Oh, yeah. Well, from that point on, I was like, I'm going to be an actor. And I made a contract with myself that I believe my mother has in some drawer that said, like, I will only do non acting activities for one hour a day. Eight hours must be spent on learning. I would highlight entire acting books, like the On Audition, the Michael shirt. And when you highlight the entire book.

[Oliver Hudson]

I'll just read the book. Highlighted nothing.

[Jamil Jamila]

Highlighted nothing. So. And I would make these notes and so, yeah, I just really kind of went really myopic on it.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah.

[Jamil Jamila]

And I think the thing that really pushed it was I did my first play in high school and my high school vice principal came up to me after and I had like a really small part. I remember I was like a stoner and I just said like, whoa or something. I don't Know, my high school vice principal came up to me after and she was like, you were really good. You were really funny.

[Oliver Hudson]

And done like that affirmation was like, I have got it.

[Jamil Jamila]

Well, just like that. I was paid attention to for something and like, she unsolicited. She came up to me and said something and like, that's all it really takes when you're that sad.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah. Well, it's so funny because there are certain people who can take compliments and then certain people who deflect. And I am such a deflector of compliments that I have to, within my own sort of psychology and, you know, the journey of self have had to understand why and then learn how to take in a compliment and just say, hey, you know what, thank you. Because I just deflect it. I don't like the feeling. You feel sort of fraudulent in a way. You know, it's interesting.

[Jamil Jamila]

I totally get that though, because I actually, like. It's weird. I never. I didn't. I guess I never saw it really as a compliment. It was just like someone believed I could do something. But that thing about learning how to take a compliment, like if somebody, I like, have had many a therapy session being like, if you are giving the compliment, do you want the person to be like, oh, no, I don't. I like your hair. I like doing that. And it's a nightmare. Right. And so that's what got me to start thinking of, like, you just want someone to say thank you and like, take it, which is hard. Especially Canadian.

[Oliver Hudson]

It. No, Maybe I was Canadian in a past life. No, I know, I. It's weird, but it's important to try to, you know, take in those pot that positive energy and not just let it bounce off of you, you know?

[Jamil Jamila]

Yeah.

[Oliver Hudson]

It's fudgeing hard, man.

[Jamil Jamila]

And it is. The more anything that I find difficult like that, the more I try to think of, like, if I was the other person, what would I want in that? And that's the only way I can kind of trick my brain into being like, oh, I don't want you to not take that.

[Oliver Hudson]

No, I know. And my thing is, is like, it's like, oh, they're. They're just trying to make me feel good. They're not telling the truth.

[Jamil Jamila]

Yeah.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah. You know, when you're doing something funny, you can kind of feel it. You know what I mean? Like, you did shit's creek, right? Were you on the. For the whole. The whole run of it?

[Jamil Jamila]

Yeah.

[Oliver Hudson]

Okay. You know, and you're working with Eugene who's fucking amazing. I've known him for a long time because, you know, Marty Short has been best friends with our family. We had a place up in Muskoka for 20 years.

[Jamil Jamila]

Oh, yeah, the cottagers.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah, the cottage. And so we'd go to Marty's place and Eugene would be there and, and he's just, he's just the greatest person, first of all. And so funny.

[Jamil Jamila]

Yeah, all of them are.

[Oliver Hudson]

They're all amazing. Right. And Catherine, I mean. Oh, my gosh. So you're working with, like, man, this is the Empty, by the way, the improv. The improv royalty as well.

[Jamil Jamila]

Yeah, yeah.

[Oliver Hudson]

You know.

[Jamil Jamila]

Oh, yeah.

[Oliver Hudson]

And so, you know, when it's funny, you don't even have to have anyone tell you, you know, you're like, all right, I, I, I know that. I know that work. I know that was good.

[Jamil Jamila]

Yeah. Well, I would say there's something that maybe I've just heard this or something, but, like, I've heard people say, like, when it's really funny on set, it's not funny on the screen or something. Like when the. I don't know. Yeah, but like, yes. What I do love about comedy is it's a real truth teller. Like, you know, if somebody's fake laughing or not, like, you just know it's horrible. It's like the worst. But with Catherine and Eugene, what was so great about them? You know them. So, you know, they're just like the most humble, nicest, no ego people, if anything to a fault, like, if somebody offered us a coffee on set, if you didn't go and get that person who offered you a coffee and everyone else a coffee, you looked like an. Because Katherine and Eugene would do that.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yes.

[Jamil Jamila]

So it's like. But we actually didn't improv a lot on that show at all, though. And most people think, because, you know, they do that, but you did not. Not really. We'd add like a button here or there.

[Oliver Hudson]

That's. That. That's. Yeah, exactly, exactly. I mean, you're.

[Jamil Jamila]

It wasn't like Christopher Guest stuff, right?

[Oliver Hudson]

No, no. But you're playing within the structure of the scene. But then it always sort of happens as a button, right? Or maybe, maybe in the middle of the scene some shit comes out or whatever. But not that. Not the entire thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

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[Oliver Hudson]

California Psychics it's so funny because I ran into Eugene years ago and I had directed a pilot presentation and and I was then, you know, took that and was trying to Sell it. And actually ended up selling it to hbo. It didn't. Nothing happened with it. You know, it didn't go, but whatever. So still. Yeah. And I had done it with my dad, and he was in. He was in it. And just. Just for the presentation, I ran into Eugene, and he goes, that's so funny. You know, I was doing. I did the same thing with my son. You know, you do a good Eugene.

[Jamil Jamila]

Yeah.

[Oliver Hudson]

And he did it. And so he had done. Shot the presentation with his son. The same thing. Same thing. And I was like, that's crazy. And he goes, yeah, we've struck out at. We struck out everywhere. This and this and this. And meanwhile, I had just sold my show to hbo, and I'm like, oh, wow. I was like, oh, man. I'm feeling kind of cool, like, you know, that your.

[Jamil Jamila]

Your.

[Oliver Hudson]

Your ego takes over just a little bit. You're just like, oh, yeah. Like, you know, love you, buddy. And I'm like, yeah. And of course his fucking blows up into this middle massive show. But we had done it at the same exact time, and I think it was originally on Freeform, was.

[Jamil Jamila]

Was on something called Pop. So you heard a pop you had not heard of got Pop.

[Oliver Hudson]

Right.

[Jamil Jamila]

But this is so. This is such a great story because. And it's so present in my life right now. I'm constantly. Because I've started pitching my own stuff and doing my own show stuff. And I. I always kind of bring up that Schitt's Creek went out to Everybody with Catherine O'Hara and Eugene.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah.

[Jamil Jamila]

And no one wanted it. And then when they. They had to do it with the cbc, which is our Canadian broadcast, our government dollars. And had they not done that, we never would have gotten a second season, let alone a six, because no one was watching the show, like, until they were forced to in the pandemic. And then when we were over, we got nominated for awards.

[Oliver Hudson]

Isn't it unbelievable how shit happens?

[Jamil Jamila]

Yeah. But that thing about selling a. Like, I did this. I wanted to make this remake of this old show called Mary Hartman. Mary Hartman. And it was a Norman Lear show. Do you know Norman Leary's?

[Oliver Hudson]

Of course. Yeah. Yeah.

[Jamil Jamila]

And I got this meeting to pitch him my show. I'd never pitched anything in my life.

[Oliver Hudson]

And you were gonna pitch Norman.

[Jamil Jamila]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I went. Pitched Norman the show. It was one of the most traumatic things, I think.

[Oliver Hudson]

I bet that guy's an icon.

[Jamil Jamila]

Yeah. However, they ended up wanting to do it, and I thought, oh, my God, I've sold it. And then I had to pitch Sony to see if they wanted to do it, and they wanted to. I'm like, I sold it. And then I had to go out to networks, and this is all, like, new to me, this whole thing of, like, the steps. And then we sold it to tbs. I'm like, we sold it. And then TBS got rid of all their scripted and turned into Discovery. And that's Mary Hartman. Mary Hartman.

[Oliver Hudson]

And they. And they. And so they. They purchased it. So they. They hired a writer to write the script. But you never got to shoot the pilot.

[Jamil Jamila]

Well, no, I. I wrote the script.

[Oliver Hudson]

You wrote it. Got it.

[Jamil Jamila]

They did, yeah. Stuff. And we had the pilot, and a lot of people who were with TBS at that time, the only thing that made me feel better about it was that people had shows that were day one of production, and they shut down and, like. And then nobody wanted to buy those shows because they were already like, I don't know.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah.

[Jamil Jamila]

Peed off by somebody else.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, I know, I know. They kind of. You kind of burned. You know, it's like, burned around town. Yeah. Can you get that back, though, and turn around, or.

[Jamil Jamila]

No, we did get it back.

[Oliver Hudson]

You did. Okay.

[Jamil Jamila]

And then a series of things happened. Like, Norman passed away, and the. The strike happened. There was just a series of things that. It ran its course. But it was the greatest lesson to me. It got me another job. But it was that lesson of, like, I. As an actor, I always thought, you know, if anything, things move so fast because you get cast and you have to shoot, and there's no time to prep and. But on the other side of it, like, how slow and maybe never gonna happen it is, and how much work you put into it for no money.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah.

[Jamil Jamila]

The pitching process, then.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah, yeah, No, I know. We have. I have a deal. I have a producing deal at Fox, and so it's. I'm in the second year of the deal, and it's been so fun because as, you know, as just an actor, you're sort of limiting your creative experience, you know, because you're kind of at the mercy of other people. You know, a lot of the things that we get or have to audition for, they're not really what we want to do, but we have to make a living, so it's nice to have something that you are in control of. And it's been so much fun. We've sold a bunch of shows. But I understand what you're saying. The process is just molasses, you know, and you put so much work into it, you get the writers paid, which I'm very happy about. I love to, you know, provide work through an idea that I might have, but as a producer, you know, we don't get paid until that thing gets on. On the air, you know?

[Jamil Jamila]

Yeah, that's what I learned, too. That also made me feel better about the thing, because I started to feel really bad for writers who are just writers. You can work two years on a pitch and a thing, and if the show doesn't go, yeah, that's it. I have a side job. But, like, yeah, it's a real lesson in that also. I remember just them doing my contract. I got to do a whole other series while they did my.

[Oliver Hudson]

Like, it takes so long. I know. I know. It's crazy. It is crazy. Are you still creating and producing other than being an actor?

[Jamil Jamila]

Well, yeah, so, actually, fortunately, this Mary Hartman thing, this Elliot Page's company pageboy script, and hired me to do this thing for him, which I'm doing now and love so much. But it's. It is a lesson in how, for me, how spoiled we are as actors and how now I'm like, maybe I just want to. Because, like, really, you get treated so well. You get paid so well.

[Oliver Hudson]

I know.

[Jamil Jamila]

Way less work.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yes. No, I know. And now you're commissioned. You're hired to write a script, and you're like, oh, okay, here we go. Blank page. Page one. Here we go.

[Jamil Jamila]

Yeah. Except I do love the thing of, like. No, like, to me, writing is the best parts of acting without any of the bad stuff of, like, there's nobody watching. There's nobody. And you can do it. Like, you just can play all the parts, which. That's the greatest.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah. No, I see. I love writing, but I like writing when I have to fix. No, yes, of course. But I like writing when I have to fix. Fix something. Like, if I have a script in front of me and they're like, all right, cut it up. Do what you want to it. Make it your own. I'm like, okay, great. I'm very good at that. And I know I can be great, a great writer if I can just regurgitate, just vomit everything out and then go back and take a scalpel to it. I have issues. I mean, I have many issues that we can get into if you want. But my writing issue is that I get overwhelmed by the process and I just hit a brick wall, and then I don't know whether I have ADHD or not. I mean, probably do I. I don't know. I Think we all do. But like, you know, I think I cannot push past it. And I get frustrated, frustrated. And I stop, you know.

[Jamil Jamila]

Are you a perfectionist?

[Oliver Hudson]

Strangely, I didn't think I was. But, but, but after some self analysis, not even in therapy, just. Yes. Because if you're gonna break down, why I stop it is that it's like, oh, wait, it's not, it's not right. It's not right. Okay, you gotta go back. Rather than just barreling through it. And then I'm like, okay, I got the first act, but holy, here comes a big second act. Like now what?

[Jamil Jamila]

You know, I realized this thing that. And again, I'm so new to this, so it's not like advice. But this thing happened to me when I was pitching and you know, you say you're pilot in the pitch, but I hadn't written the pilot yet. And I was like, I need to just write this pilot to know how to pitch this better. And so I wrote the pilot not having to write. Like nobody was waiting for it. I, I did it over the holidays and I did the bad draft of it, like the whatever draft of it. And the fastest thing that's ever come, I think the best thing that because there was no expectations were just find out what this is. Find it out while you write it. And then the best like writing advice I ever read was this. Have you ever read Stephen King's book on writing?

[Oliver Hudson]

No.

[Jamil Jamila]

It's really great. But the best thing in it to me is write something and then put it away for like two weeks at least. And then you read it again and it's like reading some. It's like what you're talking about when you something else. You can edit it and you can, you know what the animal is, but when you're close to it, it's awesome.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah, yeah. No, it's so true. And then it's just about barreling through it, you know, saying, you know what, it's that no pressure. Who gives a draft, you know, which.

[Jamil Jamila]

Is easier to do when there's no pressure.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah, no, for sure. But. But the thing is that again for me, it's putting that pressure on myself. Yourself, rather than saying who gives a who? You're not showing this to anyone. It's just for you cares.

[Jamil Jamila]

You know, I used to have that with like auditions. I mean, I still have to fight with myself for it, but like just even putting myself on tape alone, whatever, starting, I couldn't start because I wasn't going to be great out of the gate. And I Was just like, if I didn't start, then I didn't fail.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah. And.

[Jamil Jamila]

But the minute I started, then it's like, oh, but I feel like this new thing of, like, do it badly, do the work, do the worst draft.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah.

[Jamil Jamila]

And. Yeah.

[Oliver Hudson]

Well, it's funny. I mean, coming back to Jamila, that's what I love about her so much is, you know, she just doesn't give a fuck. And that allows her to have, like, real freedom in. In her. In her. Her acting. She's just so free, you know?

[Jamil Jamila]

Oh. See, I've never worked with her. I admire her work. I think she's amazing. But I didn't know that about her, which is the dream. To just give a shit.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah.

[Jamil Jamila]

About what people think.

[Oliver Hudson]

Oh, I know. That's the goal. That is the. That's the true goal. Well, when did you sort of have that moment where it was, oh, okay, wait a minute, I. I can do this for a living. Like, I'm now making money and this is my job.

[Jamil Jamila]

I mean, it was when I. When I got my first job, I did my first audition for this show called are you afraid of the dark? And I was so excited to get an audition, which is something I try to remember today when. If my manager or agent calls, I love them, but I'm like, why are you calling? I don't want to. But back then, to get an audition, it was success already. And. And I knew I wanted it to be a job. Like, then when I got that part, like, in the audition, I looked right into the camera and didn't, like, you're not. But I got the job of girlfriend number one.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah. Yep.

[Jamil Jamila]

And in retrospect, I really look back and think I had it good. How my career did go, like, started out in that part, then I got like, an episode of something where I had five lines, and then I had. Because I wanted it to be like, by the time I was 16, if I hadn't worked with Leonardo DiCaprio, I was.

[Oliver Hudson]

You failed.

[Jamil Jamila]

Done.

[Oliver Hudson]

Right.

[Jamil Jamila]

Yeah. And I did feel like I'd failed, but now I look back and I'm like, God, that was so good. Because I had things, especially being in Canada. You can star in, like, 10 movies, they go to TIFF and all. No one knows about them. And so you have that experience. And, like, I remember I was in this Cronenberg movie with Rob Pattinson, and we went to Cannes and it was going to be the biggest thing ever. It wasn't. And. Which was kind of great when Schitt's Creek happened. I was signing on to a Show with Catherine O'Hara, Eugene Levy. I was like, this is going to be big.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah.

[Jamil Jamila]

And it wasn't. Yeah, it wasn't. And then when we were done, when me and Annie were to Annie plays Alexis on the show and each other like any offers, any audition, nothing, crickets and and then the Emmy, the SAG Awards happen and all that and crazy. It's just helps you know that yeah, this happens and then that won't happen.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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[Oliver Hudson]

I was working with Cronenberg. That's pretty cool, though. I mean, aside from maybe not blowing up. Blowing up, but, like, Pattinson.

[Jamil Jamila]

Well, that's what you realize.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah. I mean, Cronenberg. Holy shit. That's so rad. Yeah.

[Jamil Jamila]

Yeah. He's amazing. And for me, nothing like I would have thought, because he's just so nice. Yeah. And he doesn't give. Thankfully, my friend Jay Baruchell was in the same movie, and he was shooting before me, and I'm like, so what's he like? What's the direction like? And he's like, just be prepared that he doesn't. If he doesn't say anything. He likes it, like, if he doesn't give you direction. And thank God he said that to me, because me and Rob were in this limo, and so he was giving direction as, like, the voice of God. And all he would do was go, like, again, okay, thank you. And then moving on. And like. But then I got to know him, and I'm like, oh, if he. If he didn't like it, he would say something and whatever. But.

[Oliver Hudson]

So he would. When he. When he wanted something else, he would just say it.

[Jamil Jamila]

Yeah, totally. But his belief is that he. Casting is the big thing for him, and he believes that he's cast you in the part that you know what you're doing.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah. Like, you've got it wrong. I don't know what I'm doing.

[Jamil Jamila]

Even I remember. So Rob had to get. It was a Cronenberg movie, so this will make sense to you. He had to get a prostate exam in the limo. And Rob had never had a prostate exam. And so that was. He was like, ah, I'm not sure how you do. And David came in and bent over and showed. Demonstrated how one gets a prostate exam. And that's the kind of director he is.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah.

[Jamil Jamila]

Either go notes or he'll do it for you.

[Oliver Hudson]

Right. That is amazing. Oh, my God, that's so funny. Yeah.

[Jamil Jamila]

But, like, the nicest guy ever.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah. So that's the experience you take from. That's what you get from it. Maybe it didn't blow up the way that you wanted to, but you got to work with David Cronenberg. I mean, totally.

[Jamil Jamila]

And, you know, had that blown up. Like, I look back at where I was in my life, like, had that blown up, then it would not have been great for me. It would, like things happened and I remember like auditioning for things I really wanted and I didn't get it. And had I gotten that, I wouldn't have gotten Schitt's Creek and that. Like, it's just all these things kind of really work out, I think. I mean, they don't.

[Oliver Hudson]

And I know. Well, that is so true. I mean, I think every. There's, you know, there's always doors closing and other ones opening and who knows if there's a reason behind it or if it's just. I don't. That's a bigger question. But yes, you know, when you look back at it, it always kind of seems to work out. You know what I mean? You know, I don't know if that's just because we don't know the sliding door element of it. We don't know what would have happened. So it's just our reality. So it's well worked out because it's our reality. Exactly.

[Jamil Jamila]

There is that or something where it's like life is lived moving forward but understood backwards and like.

[Oliver Hudson]

Right.

[Jamil Jamila]

Understand it when I can connect these dots and.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So with your career, you know, were there hang ups? You know what I mean? Were there depressions? Were there devastations? Were there relationships that got in the way of things? You know, what about, what about the woman of Emily? You know what I'm saying?

[Jamil Jamila]

Oh, God, how long is this podcast? I mean, one of the most, I guess significant things was when I moved from Canada to la. In Canada, at that time, I knew the casting directors. I didn't necessarily have to audition all the time. People would. I'd work with the same people again. They write me stuff and then I go to LA and it's like very hard to get an audition and very. And if I did get an audition, it would be like those pre read things where you're in a casting director's office, there's no camera and no. And that was a real Joel to me. Like, I didn't know. I felt like I didn't know how to act in a room. And so like if I'm playing, I don't know, an alien in something, I feel like I could do that if there's like a camera or something. But if just in your office and you're just sitting there and I'm just at your desk, I don't know how to go full alien. And so I started breaking out in literal hives, like full body hives every time I went into an Audition. And so I told my agent at the time, my US agent, I was like, so I can't audition anymore. I'll just put myself on tape. And he was. And then he dropped me, which was totally fair. I'm friends with him to this day. Fair. But then the audition for Schitt's Creek came along, and my Canadian agent, who has been my agent since I was started, Since I was 13, I lived in her house, and. And so she was like, they're in la. Go in. They're Canadian. They're nice. And she, like, really pushed me to go in the room.

[Oliver Hudson]

So you actually kind of quit audition. You're like, I can't do this.

[Jamil Jamila]

Oh, yes, very much so. Actually, the Cronenberg thing came from a tape, which was quite fortunate because nothing else came from a tape. So. Yeah. But that Schitt's Creek audition, like, my Canadian agent really pushed, and I knew the casting director from Canada, and he'd come in and she was like, daniel de Santa was reading with you. She, like, set up the scene and I went in, and I didn't break out in hives. Dan has a story about what I did that I have no recollection of. But, like, I don't know anyways. But, like, I went in and had I not. I didn't change my life. And so. Yeah.

[Oliver Hudson]

Wow. Wow. And then. So through that. So after that, you know, Schitt's Creek ends, and then. Are you sort of on your way, or was there, like kind of a lull where you're like, wait a minute. What the.

[Jamil Jamila]

Yeah. Yeah. Not. Not just normal, because. So also, when I got Schitt's Creek, it was. There was no streaming at the time.

[Oliver Hudson]

Right.

[Jamil Jamila]

Like, that first year. So my Canadian agent was like, a. And I didn't. I thought I was just the girl in front giving David towels. Like, I didn't know where this part was gonna go, but I wanted to people. And my Canadian agent was like, if you're just gonna be giving towels on a show in Canada, that's not gonna go anywhere else if you get an American series. She put in my contract that if I got an American series that didn't conflict, I could do it. Lo and behold, I got this show called 12 Monkeys that was an American series at the same time as shits. And it didn't conflict at first. And then they went for a second season, and then it was. I was doing shits during the day and 12 monkeys at night, and it was the greatest time of my life, really.

[Oliver Hudson]

Just Work, work, work.

[Jamil Jamila]

Yeah. And everybody was so nice to me. Like, the ads would be like, you have 15 minutes, just I'll tuck you in, bring you some tea. And it's just like, what I love to do is like non stop work. But then they both ended.

[Oliver Hudson]

Oh, my God.

[Jamil Jamila]

So it was also. It wasn't just like that. It wasn't just that they both ended. They were both the greatest parts of all time in completely different ways. Like 12 monkeys. I don't know if you know the movie.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah, the movie. Yeah. I didn't see the. I didn't see your show, but I know the movie.

[Jamil Jamila]

That's okay. I played the Brad Pitt part, so it's a great part. Right.

[Oliver Hudson]

Oh, my God. Wow.

[Jamil Jamila]

I got to do everything. And it was time travel. So like, as an actor, everything. And then I got to do Stevie, who just the easiest job in the world.

[Oliver Hudson]

Right.

[Jamil Jamila]

So all at the same time. And then that ended. And not only did I not have a job, I didn't think I'd ever get as good a job. Like, I would never get both satisfying both those things ever. And that's actually when I started kind of creating my own stuff. And because what I saw Dan do, Dan Levy, who, you know, his hands were in everything. Like he. The. The size of the menus, the costumes, the. The creating a world of it was what I realized. Like, oh, when I do a part, what I love the most more than the acting is like, with the ideas and what I'm going to wear, what I'm going to look like, what. All that coming up with a character that I love. And I even sometimes, like, I love working with people I've worked with before. So like on 12 Monkeys, I get to have an idea and be like, oh, what if we did this? And then it happens. And so I was like, that is the only way I'm going to get everything I want.

[Oliver Hudson]

Right.

[Jamil Jamila]

And then I did that and I got nothing. Nothing. Absolutely nothing. And no money either.

[Oliver Hudson]

Not yet. I mean, you're. You're. That. That's the thing is it's all. It's just always a hustle. It's always a hustle at whatever level you get to. You're still hustling.

[Jamil Jamila]

So true.

[Oliver Hudson]

You know, Tom Cruise is still hustling to be Tom Cruise.

[Jamil Jamila]

Yeah. And I could see him working at it too, when he's being Tom Cruise.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Jamil Jamila]

It never hard.

[Oliver Hudson]

Right? It never ends. It never ends.

[Jamil Jamila]

But you're right about that. It's at every. Every level. Because I think back and, like, when I got my first audition, that was huge to me right now. Fuck, do I ever not want an audition?

[Oliver Hudson]

I know.

[Jamil Jamila]

Like, but then now I'm doing. Like, my manager just actually had this talk with me yesterday because I was like, oh, I didn't sell this thing. And I was sad. And he's like, but you did sell it. You just didn't sell it to the. Like, I did sell it, but I sold it in the first thing. And I wanted other things, you know, like, that was overlooked because I'm like, more. It has to be better and better. And it does. Yeah.

[Oliver Hudson]

Well, that's what drives us. But at the same time, we have to, you know, find that gratitude.

[Jamil Jamila]

Obviously, you know, that's what Jamila Jamil has. She knows what the fuck's up.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah, she looked quid. She's like, I don't want to be an actor. I don't hate it. And then now she wanted to spend.

[Jamil Jamila]

Time with her dogs.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah. No, now she's done this and she's having a blast because a couple gigs she was not having, you know, whatever it was, it wasn't great. And now she's kind of like, this is so fun. I think I want to be an actor again. You know, But I just love the conviction. She's like, it. I don't give a. It's so great.

[Jamil Jamila]

I aspire to be that way. And then I'm like, if I was like, I think I always say this. And they're like, that's not what it means. Independently wealthy or, like, just. Just not have to worry about money things ever again, then I could be that person. Yeah, no, I know, but maybe I couldn't, you know?

[Oliver Hudson]

I know, I know. I get that. I mean, there's practicalities in life, you know, there's certain things. I mean, I have three kids. I've got school, I've got this. I got my wife. She doesn't work, you know, she just wants to be a mom, which is I love. But now it's like, okay, you know, so there's a lot.

[Jamil Jamila]

And it's at every level, too, because, like, you know, I think people have this idea of actors and, like, even with the fires and stuff, you know, like, Levy lost her house and. And a lot of people are like, oh, these people are rich. They can afford their new. That's not like.

[Oliver Hudson]

It doesn't.

[Jamil Jamila]

I mean, it's. Yes, it's easier on certain levels to be able to start over and stuff, but, like, it comes with its different issues, and we you know, doing Schitt's Creek, people. I get these DMS all the time. Like, can you pay for my hospital treatment and stuff? Because I'm like, we. We need Canadian doll. The equivalent of seashells.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah, okay. That's right.

[Jamil Jamila]

Like under act drop, like.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah.

[Jamil Jamila]

No, but it's this idea that you're, you know, and. But the truth is, I'm fine. I'm not. I'm very happy. But it's this. You got to be good in your head if, you know, like.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah. You're not married right now, are you?

[Jamil Jamila]

No, I'm divorced.

[Oliver Hudson]

You're divorced. Okay. So I want to get into your love life for a second, but sort of how you balance or create space for someone or even if you want to. I don't know. But career, love, marriage, you know, is this. Has it affected your love life? Has your career affected your love life?

[Jamil Jamila]

Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. So I've done it all, and I'll try to get it in two minutes. A minute. So I was married for, like, eight years. It was great marriage and stuff, but I would go away for, like, a year, and then it wouldn't be. Then I would think it would just be three months, and then it would keep going. And, you know, I. If I was on the other side of that, I wouldn't want to be in a relationship with somebody like that. So it was very difficult. But then. Then I was engaged, and then I realized that all that. But then I realized, like, I am married to my work. I am. It's not lost on me that I'm a total workaholic. It is what. I will choose it over everything. And so I decided. I don't want to say I'm going to be with someone, somebody, when at the end of the day, I'm gonna choose work. And so I don't ever want. I don't want love or relationships or none of that. I have great friends and.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah.

[Jamil Jamila]

People and. Yeah.

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah. Oh, my God.

[Jamil Jamila]

I'm done with love.

[Oliver Hudson]

Not forever.

[Jamil Jamila]

Oh, yeah. No, but I'm. I love working. It feel. And even, like making something. It feels like that's your baby. I don't know.

[Oliver Hudson]

I get it. I get it. I. For sure. Sure. But, like, you can't. It's impossible to say you're done with love forever. That sounds. You know what I mean? It sounds like scorned in a way. You can't.

[Jamil Jamila]

Yeah, it does sound.

[Oliver Hudson]

Because you can't. You can't control. I mean, what if someone walks into your life and you're like, holy. Oh, my God. Wait a minute.

[Jamil Jamila]

See, I don't think I. I think I've got it. Like, I don't think I will see it because I'll be like, I'm writing my bad draft.

[Oliver Hudson]

I predict that. That it's not. That you are not going to be married to your work for the rest of your life.

[Jamil Jamila]

Well, I love people in my life.

[Oliver Hudson]

Oh, no, for sure. For sure. But you're fun and you're funny and you're pretty and you're all of these things. You have great energy, and you're gonna meet someone and all of a sudden you're gonna be friends, and then it's gonna be, oh, my God, this is cool. And then before you know it, it's like, oh, my God, you're kind of making out. And then it's like, oh, wait, you're like, wait a minute. This is more than just a night. Okay. Oh, okay. What's happening here? And then in five years, bang.

[Jamil Jamila]

Yeah. Are we working together?

[Oliver Hudson]

Yeah. Yes.

[Jamil Jamila]

Well. But watch me take that compliment. Thank you. Because you said nice things about me. I'm.

[Oliver Hudson]

That's right. That's right. So. Right. So take it. Yeah. You're so welcome. You're so welcome. Well, let's. Let's the three of us, like, go to dinner, get to get a drink or something. I mean, you're here.

[Jamil Jamila]

Yes, I want to get together.

[Oliver Hudson]

Let's. Let's figure that out. Let's figure that out. Well, this has been so fun. I appreciate it. I have. I'm here for another three weeks, so we'll hang. I think we should. I think that'll be fun. It's too much of a coincidence.

[Jamil Jamila]

Like, at 1 in the morning, I'll see you. Like, trying to flag down.

[Oliver Hudson]

Exactly. Knocking on the thing. I'm lost again.

[Jamil Jamila]

Amazing.

[Oliver Hudson]

All right. It was great talking to you. All right. See you soon.

[Jamil Jamila]

Bye.

[Oliver Hudson]

Bye. Cool. I made a new friend. She's so sweet. She's funny. God, I. I haven't watched Schitt's Creek. I'm, like, the only person who kind of hasn't, I guess. But I'm gonna check it out because she's so quirky and. Quirky? Not quirky. It's not corky, like C O R K Y. No, it's quirky. Quirky. Oliver. Q U, I R, K, Y. She's quirky and she's right. So funny. Yeah. Very cool. All right, we're going to hang out. I'm going to leave because I don't feel like talking anymore. Bye.

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When you haven't found love, it can feel like everyone else has. It's in every movie, every song and all the PDA Looking for love sucks. Thankfully, California Psychics can give you the guidance you need to find the one. We guarantee if your reading isn't life changing, it's free and new customers receive 20 minutes for just $20. Visit visit californiapsychics.com and experience the joy of certainty.

[Cleveland Clinic Ad]

California Psychics when it comes to your health and well being, the right care can change everything. That's why Cleveland Clinic has been elevating world class patient care for over a century. From the latest in heart neurology and cancer care to advanced diagnostics and beyond, Cleveland Clinic is here for every carer in the world. Explore a wide variety of health and wellness info by visiting clevelandclinic.org today.

[Merit Beauty Ad]

Let's be honest, our beauty routine should make life easier, not more complicated. Merit Beauty was created as the antidote to the overwhelming world of beauty. They simplify what it takes to get ready by creating high performing, impossible to mess up makeup and skincare products. Merit's best selling products include their Great Skin Instant Glow Serum which instantly hydrates and plumps for a fresh, dewy look, the Minimalist Perfecting Complexion. Stick a foundation and concealer in one for quick natural coverage and Flush Bomb, a sheer buildable cream blush that blends seamlessly for a healthy natural flush. Every product is designed to work together effortlessly so you can achieve that polished, put together look without the extra steps. Not sure where to start. Merit has developed a selection of curated sets like their five Minute Morning Set. It has everything you need to get ready in just five minutes or less. It's time to simplify your morning. Head to meritbeauty.com today and you'll also receive Merit's signature makeup bag free with your first order.