Health, Maintenance Required: “I didn’t think I’d live past 40.”

Summary

Silver Linings with The Old Gays: Episode Summary Title: Health, Maintenance Required: “I didn’t think I’d live past 40.”
Release Date: August 5, 2025
Hosts: Robert Reeves, Jessay Martin, Bill Lyons, and Michael "Mick" Peterson
Produced By: iHeartPodcasts

---

Introduction: Embracing Age with Wisdom and Humor

In this insightful episode of Silver Linings with The Old Gays, hosts Robert Reeves, Jessay Martin, Bill Lyons, and Mick Peterson delve into the multifaceted journey of aging, focusing on health, maintenance, and the unexpected silver linings that come with growing older. The conversation is rich with personal anecdotes, humor, and profound reflections, providing listeners with an engaging exploration of health and aging from the unique perspectives of seasoned queer men.

---

Redefining Health: A Shift in Priorities and Awareness

Jessay Martin initiates the discussion by prompting the hosts to reflect on their current understanding of health compared to their younger years ([01:01]). Robert Reeves shares his transformation, stating, “I thought about health a whole lot more than I did when I was in my 20s. I didn't even pay attention to my doctor's advice often” ([01:22]). Jessay echoes this sentiment, highlighting her comprehensive medical routine: “I have annual visits with my retina specialist, my vascular specialist, a dermatologist, my psychiatrist, and I have two physicals a year. Since I was 50, I've had five colonoscopies. I also do yoga” ([01:38]).

Bill Lyons provides a broader definition, referencing WHO’s definition of health: “a state of complete physical, mental, and social well-being beyond the absence of disease and infirmity” ([02:43]). He emphasizes the importance of self-sufficiency and establishing a baseline for personal well-being, incorporating activities like yoga to maintain both physical and mental health.

---

Navigating Medical Routines: From Infrequency to Routine Maintenance

The hosts discuss the transition from sporadic medical visits in their youth to regular, comprehensive check-ups in their older years. Jesse Martin notes the increasing complexity and frequency of medical appointments, which can sometimes interfere with personal plans: “The doctor's appointments just pop up everywhere” ([02:27]). Robert Reeves adds, “We’re much more conscious about our health than we were when we were younger and infallible” ([04:21]). This heightened awareness underscores the necessity of proactive health management as they age.

---

Incorporating Wellness Practices: Yoga, Massage, and Exercise

Robert Reeves highlights the role of physical activity in his life, specifically mentioning weekly massages: “I get a massage every week now, and I talk to the massage therapist about breaking up the granules that accumulate in your body...” ([04:06]). Bill Lyons shares his lifelong commitment to weightlifting: “I have been lifting weights since I was 15 years old, and it’s been my rock” ([05:35]). Jesse Martin balances this with yoga, underscoring the integration of various wellness practices to maintain overall health.

---

The Crucial Role of Sleep: From Partying to Prioritizing Rest

Robert Reeves reflects on his past habits of minimal sleep: “When I was young, I get by on three or four hours of sleep because I was out partying” ([06:18]). In contrast, he now prioritizes sleep as a pillar of his health regimen. Jessay Martin concurs, emphasizing that “if I don't have a good night's sleep, I'm not going to have a good next day” ([06:25]). Bill Lyons humorously contrasts younger generations’ party lifestyles with their own, showcasing a shift in how sleep is valued and managed ([07:01]).

---

Daily Maintenance: The Power of Lists and Structured Routines

The discussion transitions to daily health maintenance habits, with Robert Reeves confessing his reliance on meticulous list-making: “I truly keep on my computer a spreadsheet of my master to-do list...” ([08:12]). Bill Lyons and Jesse Martin share similar practices, underscoring the importance of organization in maintaining mental clarity and productivity. Jessay adds a strategic approach taught by her father: “Write down the six most important things you have to do and as you cross them off, you add the things you hadn't done to the next day” ([09:14]).

---

Trials with Health and Beauty Products: Lessons from the Past

The hosts reminisce about their attempts with various health and beauty products in their younger years. Robert Reeves recounts his experience with hair restoration products in the 1980s: “I went through a trial with minoxidil back in the 80s... the right formula” ([10:05]). Jessay Martin humorously describes using self-tanning gels in the late '60s, resulting in painfully orange hands: “They look great with your self-tan but your hands are completely orange” ([11:57]). These stories highlight the often humorous and sometimes futile quests for youth-related fixes.

---

Aging as a Gay Man: Increased Visibility and Changing Dynamics

Bill Lyons contrasts the aging experience of gay men in Western cultures with those in places like Japan: “As the older you get, the more invisible you become... in Japan they have 80-year-old porn stars” ([14:02]). This observation leads to a broader discussion on cultural perceptions of aging and beauty. Jessay Martin shares her revelation about being attracted to younger and middle-aged men, a shift that brought both surprise and enjoyment: “It's a total revelation to me now that we're not just old men, we're attracted by young and middle-aged men” ([14:52]).

---

Social Connections and Mental Health: The Pillars of Well-Being

The hosts emphasize the significance of social interactions and chosen family in maintaining mental health. Mick Peterson expresses a fear of being forgotten, underlining the necessity of meaningful relationships: “I never want to be forgotten, and I don't want to forget people” ([15:30]). Robert Reeves ties social well-being directly to physical health: “If we have positive interactions with the people around us, I think we're going to be healthier for it” ([16:32]). Jessay Martin reflects on increased compassion and reduced criticism as benefits of aging: “I try to be more compassionate about people and not being as critical” ([26:00]).

---

Shifting Perspectives: Redefining Love and Self

A major theme is the evolution of personal definitions and perspectives. Bill Lyons discusses how his understanding of love has deepened beyond the physical: “I used to think of love only in a physical sense... what it means to love and who's going to be deserving of your love” ([18:25]). This introspection is paired with discussions on mental strength and the importance of therapy in fostering a stable and fulfilling life.

---

Mental Health Challenges: Anxiety and Navigating the Medical System

Jessay Martin opens up about her struggle with anxiety, a condition that has intensified with age: “I have a very difficult time controlling my anxiety... But my anxiety has really, really increased as I'm aging” ([22:03]). The conversation highlights the importance of being proactive in managing mental health and effectively navigating the medical system. Bill Lyons advises persistence and firmness when dealing with healthcare providers: “You have to be very firm” ([23:55]).

---

Health Tips: Practical Wisdom from Experience

As the episode progresses, each host shares personal health tips rooted in their own experiences:

• Robert Reeves: “Your mind has a lot of power over your body... it is very self-healing” ([24:13]).
• Jesse Martin: “Don’t ignore feeling unwell... take action” ([24:33]).
• Bill Lyons: “Floss every day... bacteria can form in your mouth” ([24:57]).
• Mick Peterson: “Keep moving because when you stop, sometimes you won't get to start again” ([25:11]).

These tips offer practical advice for listeners seeking to enhance their own health and well-being.

---

Finding Silver Linings: Embracing the Positives of Aging

The hosts conclude the episode by sharing their individual silver linings related to aging:

• Mick Peterson: Highlights the importance of Social Security ([25:34]).
• Bill Lyons: Credits Medicare and the companionship of The Old Gays for his improved quality of life, especially after a near-death experience five years prior ([25:40]).
• Jesse Martin: Appreciates the increased compassion and reduced critical nature that comes with age, fostering better relationships and inner peace ([26:00]).
• Robert Reeves: Emphasizes the accumulation of knowledge and perspective, leading to a better understanding of others ([26:25]).

These reflections underscore the episode's central message: aging brings both challenges and profound rewards, enriched by community and personal growth.

---

Conclusion: Celebrating Lifelong Camaraderie and Growth

Silver Linings with The Old Gays wraps up with heartfelt acknowledgments among the hosts, celebrating their enduring friendship and shared journey. They express gratitude for each other's support and the positive impact they have on one another’s lives, reinforcing the theme that connection and camaraderie are vital components of a fulfilling life as they age.

---

Notable Quotes:

• Robert Reeves [00:08]: “When you're younger, you feel like you're invincible.”
• Mick Peterson [00:50]: “Age ain't nothing but a number.”
• Jessay Martin [01:38]: “I have two physicals a year. Since I was 50 years old, I've had five colonoscopies.”
• Bill Lyons [02:43]: “Health is a state of complete physical, mental, and social well-being.”
• Robert Reeves [04:21]: “We're much more conscious about our health than we were when we were younger and infallible.”
• Jessay Martin [14:52]: “We're not just old men, we're attracted by young and middle-aged men.”
• Jessay Martin [26:00]: “I try to be more compassionate about people and not being as critical.”

---

This episode of Silver Linings with The Old Gays offers a heartfelt and humorous exploration of aging, emphasizing the importance of health, social connections, and personal growth. Through candid conversations and shared experiences, the hosts provide valuable insights and relatable stories that resonate with listeners navigating their own journeys through life’s later stages.

Transcript

[Mick Peterson]

Ruby.

[Robert Reeves]

When you're younger, you feel like you're invincible.

[Mick Peterson]

I thought 18 was deaf.

[Bill Lyons]

You know, you're not the only Gemini in the room. And you're not the only one who makes lists.

[Mick Peterson]

From just beyond the lights of Los Angeles in steamy Palm Springs, California, it's Mick, Robert, Bill, Jesse, and this is.

[Jesse Martin]

Silver linings with the old gays.

[Bill Lyons]

Welcome back, kids. It has been said that with age.

[Robert Reeves]

Comes wisdom and joint pain. Don't forget the joint pain.

[Mick Peterson]

I think Aaliyah said it best. Age ain't nothing but a number.

[Bill Lyons]

We're here to talk health, age, aging, and taking care of ourselves and how.

[Robert Reeves]

We'Re still turning heads wherever we go.

[Jesse Martin]

Okay, boys, let's dive right in. What does the concept of health mean to you these days? How has it changed over the years?

[Robert Reeves]

Well, for me, I thought think about health a whole lot more than I did when I was in my 20s. I didn't even pay attention to my doctor's advice often.

[Jesse Martin]

Well, when I was in my 20s, the only doctors that I remember going to were my dentist and my eye doctor. But today I have annual visits with my retina specialist, my vascular specialist, a dermatologist. Dermatologist, My psychiatrist. And I have two physicals a year. And since I was 50 years old, I've had five colonoscopies. And I also do yoga.

[Mick Peterson]

Well, babies, boy, that's a mouthful for real. All we do is spend our lives at doctors. Now.

[Robert Reeves]

It's almost a trick taking medications or doctors.

[Jesse Martin]

Well, when we're trying to get together, it's turning out to be a real hassle because the doctor's appointments just pop up everywhere.

[Mick Peterson]

And they do come first.

[Jesse Martin]

Yes, they do, because it's hard to get an appointment with a lot of doctors.

[Bill Lyons]

Yeah, well, I looked up the word health, and this is based on who's definition. Health is a state of complete physical, medical, and social well being beyond the absence of disease and infirmity. You know, one of the things I wish I measured for self sufficiency is whether I can clean my bathroom and wash the dishes, shower and dress myself and make dinner. So what I have been taught is establish a baseline by which we can measure one. What is improvement from what is a stable state? And that that transition to thriving. You know, you pursued that success. You have a purpose in life. Bob often talks about having a passion for his work and also general feelings of well being. Bill likes to talk about his yoga in between his colonoscopies.

[Robert Reeves]

And I think we've all managed to incorporate our different health care routines into our lives in a way that enables us to all pursue our own individual interests.

[Mick Peterson]

Yeah.

[Jesse Martin]

I take particular attention now to when I go get a physical. I read all of the things that they have, and now I take my chart very seriously.

[Robert Reeves]

Yeah. I think it's pretty clear from all of our conversations that we're much more conscious about our health than we were when we were younger and infallible. But I know that for me, I have tried to incorporate activity very purposely into my life. And most recently, something I think that is terribly important is massage. I get a massage every week now, and I talk to the massage therapist about what he is doing in terms of breaking up the granules that accumulate in your body and different places due to the stresses that you face and how he moves it through my body. And I could just feel the bad stuff oozing out of my body.

[Bill Lyons]

I guess I have the same experience training.

[Robert Reeves]

Yeah.

[Bill Lyons]

Um, which is why it's so addictive for me. Also, the little endorphins. It's a great rush and a high. And I enjoy that at times when life is really hard and it's a struggle, you know, that you can put yourself in a position of discipline and strength and to actually accomplish something in like an hour. That has been my rock. Yeah. This is from the perspective of somebody who has been lifting weights since he was 15 years old. And. And I'm 69 now. And so it's a way for me to get through many, many, many trying days, even now.

[Robert Reeves]

And another thing that I have become very conscious of in my older years is how important sleep is.

[Jesse Martin]

Yeah. Because if I don't have a good night's sleep, I'm not going to have a good next day. That's for sure.

[Robert Reeves]

Yeah. And looking back on my young. When a lot of the time I get by on three or four hours of sleep because I was out partying the night before and I had to get to work early the next day. And I don't see how I did.

[Jesse Martin]

It or no sleep at all that has happened.

[Bill Lyons]

Our younger listeners are laughing and thinking, oh, fun. This is what I have to look forward to. Sleep.

[Mick Peterson]

You know, and that's great.

[Bill Lyons]

Yeah. I like. I knew guys when I first came out who used to go to New York and party for 48 hours straight. Dang. And then come home to Minneapolis and crash for the rest of the week.

[Mick Peterson]

For real?

[Jesse Martin]

Yeah, for the rest of the week.

[Bill Lyons]

For the rest of the week.

[Mick Peterson]

See, I always wanted to do that when I was younger, but I Would fall asleep. I'm not an all night person except on vacations and cruises. And I'm a walker. I actually walk, even in this weather twice a day. Oh yeah, I get out at 10 o' clock at night and then at 6 in the morning or 6:30, but then I go back to bed.

[Bill Lyons]

Yeah, we're already into daily maintenance, so.

[Robert Reeves]

Well, okay, go ahead, Meg, with your daily maintenance.

[Bill Lyons]

What's a daily habit that you swear by now you never cared about when you were younger?

[Robert Reeves]

For me, one of the things that I find very calming that will bring chaos to a controlled state is making lists. Mick makes fun of me and accuses me of being a Gemini about my list, but I truly keep on my computer a spreadsheet of my master to do list which is grouped by major categories. And the just to interrupt activities I need to do relative to each one are listed. And I love striking them out.

[Bill Lyons]

You know, you're not the only Gemini in the room. And you're not the only one who makes lists. I make lists too, but they're not as complex as yours.

[Jesse Martin]

My father, one of the best lessons he taught me was at the beginning of the day, write down the six most important things you have to do and as you cross them off, you add them the things that you hadn't done to the next day so that nothing ever gets overlooked.

[Robert Reeves]

And I do that.

[Mick Peterson]

Okay, that's wonderful.

[Bill Lyons]

That's what we call piling it on. Before you know it, you've got a list like that's 10 pages long and you go through and say to yourself, oh my gosh, how?

[Robert Reeves]

What?

[Bill Lyons]

Where should I start?

[Robert Reeves]

I know. And some have been my to do activities are like paint the house.

[Bill Lyons]

Such a specific task.

[Robert Reeves]

I know. And it goes on for more than just an hour.

[Mick Peterson]

That was six days ago. Well, in the heat we could move on. Yes.

[Robert Reeves]

Robert, what's the most ridiculous health or beauty product I've ever tried? And this would have to be going back to the 1980s when I was in my early 40s and my hair began to thin. And so I wanted to stop that and so I tried all kinds of hair restoration products.

[Mick Peterson]

Don't work.

[Robert Reeves]

Does it didn't work back then? I don't know. Are they working today?

[Bill Lyons]

I use Minoxidil and yeah, it's thickened my hair.

[Robert Reeves]

I went through a trial with minoxidil back in the 80s and I used to go to the doctor. I guess it was about once every two weeks I would go and he'd take a little eyedropper and he'd drop the stuff on my head and rub it in and then he'd peer with a little eyeglass looking for any hair back then, any hair growth they had yet just covered the right formula.

[Bill Lyons]

Yeah, I, I think so because I'm starting to show and it's thickening it.

[Mick Peterson]

Losing my hair, it was humbling. And the day I took everything off and was freedom.

[Robert Reeves]

Oh yeah.

[Jesse Martin]

Well, the most ridiculous product that I had ever used was in the late 60s. They came out with this self tanning gels and the first one of them that I tried and one of the best was called Braggy B R A G G I. And the only problem was, yes, you looked great with your self tan but you look at your hands and they're completely orange. You could tell when anyone use was using this tanning product.

[Mick Peterson]

Yeah, and one person still uses it I guess nowadays. Who's that orange?

[Bill Lyons]

Oh.

[Jesse Martin]

No, he uses Cheetos.

[Mick Peterson]

Oh, okay.

[Robert Reeves]

In a powdered form.

[Jesse Martin]

Well, he mashes them. He has someone mash him up.

[Mick Peterson]

Yes. Okay, moving right along, what are some of the greatest revelations you've had around getting older, especially as a gay man? I haven't been phased. I'm just me who happens to be a gay man. That's a small part of who I am.

[Robert Reeves]

Well, speaking for myself, I find the older I get, the greater are my ED problems, which is unfortunate but true. And so you have to find other ways of substituting for that. And I think probably this also relates back to ridiculous medical treatments that we've tried over the years. And I know I have tried many different online supplement combinations that are supposed to cure ed.

[Bill Lyons]

Like a lot of people who aren't just gay, but especially as a gay man, as the older you get, the more invisible you become, you know, as opposed to other cultures such as in Japan where as you got older you became more venerated. I mean in Japan they have 80 year old porn stars. Okay. So this is a culture that is completely different. And their concept of beauty and you know, well, religion and the soul, all of those kinds of concepts play into a very different kind of society and very different values.

[Robert Reeves]

Do you think ours are changing?

[Bill Lyons]

Yes, yes I do. Because there is a niche I have found, or I should say they have found me, you know, of younger men.

[Jesse Martin]

I totally concur. That was going to be my thing. It's total revelation to me now that we're not just old men, we're attracted by young and middle aged men, which is really a big surprise to me. Although I really enjoy it.

[Bill Lyons]

It's very flattering, you know, because I guess because I remember myself in my 20s, you would think at 20. Oh, I got 40. Oh, that's death. That's death.

[Mick Peterson]

I thought 18 was death.

[Jesse Martin]

No, I thought 40 was. When I was young. I didn't think I'd live beyond 40. I agree.

[Bill Lyons]

Yeah. I mean, because I counted the years. Oh, four. It'll be 2006 when I'm in. I thought, you know, it's 1968 or something like that. And you're thinking, I can't imagine what that world is going to be like.

[Mick Peterson]

And it's so different than. I mean, I see it differently than I look at it compared to mom and Dad's days and how they seemed old. And I guess it's the weather that keeps us young. It helps. We're truly blessed to have sunshine and a lot of places don't have it, thus causing you to go inside and sit in your house and people forget you. That's what I'm scared of. I don't want to be forgotten. I never want to be forgotten, and I don't want to forget people. That is so important to make us who we are and how we live.

[Robert Reeves]

And that's a part of health, is who we surround ourselves with in terms of social structure and the interactions we have. If we have positive interactions with the people that are around us, I think we're going to be healthier for it. But if we are constantly doing battle with people, it has got to have a detrimental effect on who you are in your health. I believe that very strongly.

[Bill Lyons]

Cool. Okay. In that same vein, what is something you see completely differently than you used to? A perspective shift that can only come with age.

[Jesse Martin]

For me, I mean, when I was younger, in middle age, sex was everything. And now it doesn't seem to be quite as important an urge that it used to be. Not that I enjoy it less, but it just doesn't have that drive that I used to have for it.

[Bill Lyons]

Yeah.

[Robert Reeves]

I think one of the biggest changes that I've gone through from my young self to who I am now is when you're younger, you feel like you're invincible. And over the years, you find out that it ain't true. That there are a lot of things that can get you down and you just have to be on guard for them and educate yourself so you know how to deal with it.

[Bill Lyons]

I think for me, what is different is my definition of what is love. I used to think of love only in a physical sense. And I began to question what it means to love and who's going to be deserving of your love and who you deserve. And those things kind of change. And I guess, you know, that's from living and learning, you know, and that's why you have to be mentally strong inside. I think that's one of the things all of us share in common, is that there's really this strong pillar that kind of anchors us. You know, there are so many people in life who go very fractured lives and due to circumstances beyond their control or, you know, that you just don't know or because your parents didn't raise you very well.

[Mick Peterson]

Yeah.

[Bill Lyons]

And that's a lot of what it comes down to. You know, we haven't talked about it, but that's the kind of stuff you do when you're on the couch. You know, you talk about your family, you talk about your parents, and how much you have been programmed in that early time in your life, and that, you know, it may have set you up for making a lot of mistakes.

[Mick Peterson]

Yeah.

[Robert Reeves]

You know, one thing that I miss that I hear other people talk about as being part of their lives, is I've never had the experience of talking to someone who is psychoanalyzing me consciously as a doctor. Patient relationship.

[Mick Peterson]

You should try it.

[Bill Lyons]

So.

[Robert Reeves]

But, you know, I hear, you know, some of you guys talk about your experiences.

[Mick Peterson]

Yeah. It used to be an embarrassing thing to do that, to go to doctors and, like, please, everybody's doing.

[Robert Reeves]

Yeah, you didn't talk about it.

[Mick Peterson]

Right. How was your measure of life quality and happiness changed over time? It's gotten better for me. And it's all because of the old gays. It really is.

[Jesse Martin]

Well, I have to say the same thing, because I moved to Palm Springs in 2003, and I moved into senior housing, and I was sort of just there for like 10 years. But then the old gays happened, and my entire life turned around. I was happy. Can be. And I enjoyed what I was doing. I never thought that I would come back that well. Thank you, old gay. Thank you, guys.

[Mick Peterson]

Thank you, young gay.

[Robert Reeves]

I think I'm gonna cry.

[Mick Peterson]

Kiss, kiss, kiss.

[Jesse Martin]

We'll be right back after a quick break.

[Mick Peterson]

Welcome back to Silver Linings with the old gays.

[Jesse Martin]

What's something that feels completely different in your body now compared to when you were younger?

[Robert Reeves]

My butt.

[Mick Peterson]

Cause it is less.

[Robert Reeves]

Oh, my Lord.

[Jesse Martin]

Mine is my anxiety. And I have a very difficult time controlling my anxiety. And I've taken quite a few different medications. I've tried some on an as needed basis. Some of them where you take it in the morning, you take it in the evening and somehow it just doesn't work for me. And when it does work for me, if it's a really a good one, I just fall asleep. And that's the only way that I can control it. But my anxiety is something that has really, really increased as I'm aging. But that's why I think it's very, very important that everyone realize that you are in control of your life and your health and your doctors.

[Mick Peterson]

Yes.

[Jesse Martin]

I mean that is a very, very important thing to do.

[Bill Lyons]

Yeah. I think about, you know, how the four of us have learned to deal not only with our own particular diagnoses, but also how you negotiate the medical system in America.

[Jesse Martin]

Yes, yes. Yeah, that's for sure.

[Bill Lyons]

You're going to encounter nurses and doctors in which you like are simpatico with. And then there are some that. It's like two ships passing in the night, you know, and you really have to. You just go with the flow.

[Robert Reeves]

And sometimes you disagree with the doctor.

[Jesse Martin]

Exactly, exactly. And when you disagree, you go around and you try to find an alternative way to do it. You have to be in control.

[Bill Lyons]

Yeah. And then there's the other thing about. Well, I'll just have to get a second opinion.

[Mick Peterson]

Okay.

[Bill Lyons]

And then by, by. You just have to be very firm.

[Mick Peterson]

You do?

[Robert Reeves]

Yeah.

[Mick Peterson]

Okay, time for health tips. Can each of us come up with one or two health tips or health wisdoms that we can offer our listeners?

[Robert Reeves]

I can think of one. Your mind has a lot of power over your body and it's a tool you'd have to, to learn how to use. But it is there and it is very self healing.

[Jesse Martin]

And my tip would be to anyone who isn't feeling well, not to ignore it, but there are so many places like urgent care that you can just drop in and find out what's going on with you. Don't procrastinate it. When you're feeling bad, take action.

[Bill Lyons]

Health tip. Floss every day. That's not a joke, that's a preventative. Because bacteria can form in your mouth and if you start swallowing that down, it gets into your gut. And that's not a good thing.

[Mick Peterson]

Yeah, mom told me, keep moving because when you stop, sometimes you won't get to start again.

[Robert Reeves]

Good advice.

[Jesse Martin]

And now the big question. What is your silver lining to aging? Navigating health and the body.

[Mick Peterson]

Social Security.

[Bill Lyons]

Two things. Medicare and the old gays. You know, the old gays helped to change my life. And that's the biggest thing about being alive, really, and experiencing that because, you know, it was five years ago where I almost didn't make it. And that's saying something.

[Jesse Martin]

Well, one of the unexpected things with growing older that's happened to me is I try to be more compassionate about people and not being as critical, you know, of everybody, because everyone has their own problems. And I believe that being critical of people only takes negative energy.

[Robert Reeves]

And I think that that's the benefit of growing older, accumulating knowledge and perspective and being able to understand people's issues.

[Jesse Martin]

Yeah.

[Bill Lyons]

And I would add, Bill, when you say you're less critical of people. Yeah, yeah, you're more compassionate. That's because you're less critical of yourself and that you've learned to let go. So therapy helps.

[Mick Peterson]

That is $300. Give it to him.

[Jesse Martin]

Charge it. That's a wrap for today. Silver Linings is a production of iHeart's Ruby Studios and the Outspoken Network. We're your hosts, Bill Lyons, Robert Reeves.

[Mick Peterson]

Mick Peterson and Jesse Martin.

[Jesse Martin]

Our executive producer is Sierra Kaiser. The episode was written by Ryan Amador with post production by Eric Zeiler. Our theme music was composed by Mats Hirschenau with audio, direction and design by Matt Stillo. And if you're having fun with us, please subscribe to follow along. And don't forget to rate and review the show whenever you get your podcast. Thanks for listening.

[Bill Lyons]

I'm just a greedy little pig Give.

[Mick Peterson]

It a battle cry on that dick.

[Jesse Martin]

I came out of the womb gay.

[Robert Reeves]

This is an I heart podcast.