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- [00:00]
A
Hey there and welcome back to another episode of the Simple Pin podcast. I have got such a fun episode for you today and there are some serious takeaways that you can use for Pinterest as we get towards the end of this podcast. Jeff C. Is someone who I have worked with in industry for years. Um, I'm pretty sure he was one of the first people in 2015 that I saw talking about Pinterest. And I reached out and we have just bumped into each other along the way over the years. He sent an email that said, did OpenAI just kill Canva? Which is what you saw in the title of this podcast. I told him I was going to steal it and I had to have him on the podcast because there's so much discussion around AI imagery and AI in general for Pinterest that I wanted to have this conversation about how fast AI is moving, what is moving into what the tools are that we can use and how we can really, I won't even say harness, but leverage this tool for our business. And Jeff kind of blew my mind when he gave some really practical examples and tools to use. And at the end I asked him about his favorite tools, what he uses them for, and how he sees AI moving in the future, specifically around AI imagery. So I hope that you will enjoy this podcast. I would love your feedback if you want to share that with me, either by emailing us helloimpleplepidia.com or if you're watching on YouTube, you can comment here on the video below. Before we dive in, I want to let you know that all the links for anything that we discuss are below in the podcast description, either in your podcast app or on YouTube. But I think for my E Commerce listeners, what you will take away from some of this conversation is how you can leverage these image tools in order to create great images of your products. But even before that, if you have not set up your Pinterest account, if you do not have the tech connections, your shop isn't, your catalog isn't connected, your verified merchant status isn't turned on, and you just kind of really have no idea where to go with the basics of setting up your Pinterest foundation for your shop. You can really get, you'd really get that set up with our E Commerce Kickstart package that we have. You can click down and below and you'll see E Commerce Kickstart. This is where we create custom templates for your account, we clean up your account, we build up your boards, and we tell you what connections you need to make. And if we can't help with those tech connections, we have someone that we can refer you to. So let your creative juices get flowing because this episode will definitely ignite them even more. And I hope you walk away. Well, I won't even say what I hope you walk away with. I will let you figure that out on your own. And I hope you enjoy this episode with Jeff C.
- [03:15]
B
You're listening to the Simple Pen Podcast, Pinterest for business advice that goes down smooth and easy. Here's your host, Kate All.
- [03:29]
A
Jeff C. Welcome back to the Simple Pen Podcast.
- [03:32]
B
Thank you for having me. It's been too long, Kate. I'm excited to be here.
- [03:35]
A
Too long. And we've just spent last 15 minutes talking and trying to catch up on everything. I believe the first time. Well, I want to give listeners a little bit of a backstory because I have a lot of new people who have listened since I think I last had you on, which was definitely pre2020. It's like there's before 2020 and after 2020. And I think I remember one of our conversations was around this introduction to video on Pinterest. And it was like, what is video going to look like? Are people going to like it? And is it going to be this, like, speed bump? When's it going to be introduced? And I loved those early days of us just having these conversations about how these new features that now are just native and normal. And we would say, most everything's a video. Yeah, right. And we would go like, will it work? And now we're at that same point with AI. We're asking those questions like, will it work? Are people gonna like it? And you wrote a newsletter two weeks ago, and I jumped on the opportunity to have you on in the podcast and it was, did OpenAI just kill Canva and I one great subject line. That's incredible. Number two, tell me about where you were when you saw that this could be that OpenAI could kill Canva. Tell us the story.
- [04:56]
B
It was a little crazy. So I got to speak at Social Media Marketing World again. And it'd been five years since I'd been there. Like, so things have changed. Like the last one I went, I remember it was just before COVID shut down. In fact, at the conference, people were like, am I going to get home? And we were flying to Florida for another conference and it was like crazy times. So I hadn't been back since then, but I was back to talk about creating AI images, because that's kind of a thing that I have started to do. I've really enjoyed it. And it was just part of my process for putting out my content. I wasn't trying to, you know, be this big, you know, creator about that. It just happened because it was a workflow that I did. Somebody saw it and they said I should be unspeak. So right before I had to speak, I was going to speak and actually was going to make fun of OpenAI because their image, Dolly images. It was like when Canva first came out. Remember when canva come out, you'd be scrolling through Pinterest and you'd be like, oh, there's a Canva template. Oh, there's another canva template. And it was the same thing with images that were created with Dall E. Like, inside of ChatGPT, you're like, it's oversaturated. It's kind of wonky. You could always see when people were using those images. And I was gonna make fun of it. Well, the thing that happened was, like, two days before I was supposed to speak, they rolled out a new image generator. And it is really good. Like, really, really good. And a couple of the features you can do is, like, you can replace things and just we can get into it. But I was like, oh, my gosh, this is really impressive. I actually. I tell a story at the beginning of my presentation, and this was the first year that I had been able to illustrate it with myself as a character. I was this cartoon character, kind of realistic cartoon character in the exact same outfit that I was presenting with on stage, like, down to the shoes. And the hard thing for AI has been to keep reliable, consistent characters throughout your generations. And you can do that now. And it solved a bunch of problems. Now it's still slow and everything, but anyway, I was scrambling to get that ready, and that's how I think, you know, when I. When I was starting to play with it and realized that I can have a conversation now and change the image. Like, the shirt wasn't coming out right. And I just went to my catalog where I bought the shirt from, and I took that image and I uploaded it and said, put that on me. And it did it. Like, I'm like, okay, this is the worst that this is going to be ever. And it's already doing this thing. What if we could do that with Canva? Because until the recent changes and I still haven't played with them all, Canva wasn't the best when it came to AI. It was not good. And it does text really well. It does all these things that we use Canva for. We'll create an image in AI and then we'll take it to Canva, put in a text overlay and whatever, optimize it. But if we can have a conversation, like I was having to add my shirt and change my expression and do all these things in a chat window. What's that say for Canva like in a year?
- [07:48]
A
Like, well, actually to, to share like a real world example. I was there were, I was in Canva and I was doing a case study about one of our ads clients and I wanted to use images on this particular case study that were not from the client. Cause I didn't. We weren't sharing who the client was. Right. But I wanted to give some ideas to like what it was about. And so I asked it. One, it took a long time to populate and two, my first response was to ask it to edit and it was like, oh, it's not able to do that. Like it's, it's not able to give me more of what I'm looking for. Which I found really frustrating. So the fact that you pointed that out and then now OpenAI has that ability to chat and to say, I'd like you to adjust this and I will share with you a story. Because I was on LinkedIn. I've read about the time of your talk and people were going crazy about how they could create great images for their CPG brands, consumer packaged goods, you know, think like protein bars or snacks. And they were saying, here's what I put in, here's what I got. And showing these images and I thought this is actually incredible. Like you've eliminated a photographer, you've eliminated a set, you've all these things that are cost prohibitive to a lot of people who are small business owners. So here's what I did. I went to chat GPT and I asked it to create an image for me about our planner or something like that. Jeff, it was terrible. Like it was so awful, it was so bad. And I think one of the things I took away from it was that you just have to play around with it and it might not yet be business to business. Like obviously I was taking like a prompt that was business to consumer and they have a package, they have all these things and they can add images like you did with, you know, I was just saying come up with this. They put the Pinterest logo on, I think every single thing they could on that image. Like I'll have to send it to you later. It was so bad.
- [09:45]
B
Have you. Was it the new image generator?
- [09:48]
A
It was.
- [09:50]
B
Or the old one?
- [09:51]
A
It was probably the old one.
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B
Okay.
- [09:53]
A
So yeah, you need to try it.
- [09:55]
B
Again and have a conversation with it because I think you'll be just so surprised. So here's, here's one of the things that I was able to do and this is what I closed my talk with and it was really relevant for this show. So the first night, the first morning, I took a picture of Michael Stelzner, who is always the opening keynote. I took a picture of the empty stage, social media marketing world. And then I took multiple shots of Mike, you know, with his hands raised or whatever. And I told it inside a chatgpt. I uploaded those images. There's like four images, the empty stage, like three or four of Mike. And I said, take image one, three and four and put him on the stage as a Lego character with using these pictures as reference. It did that amazingly well. It even got the texture of his shirt that he was wearing on the Lego character on the live stage. Had the water bottles in the back, everything. And just with a conversation, uploaded some images and had a conversation. And I'm telling you, it just, it's like when we can do that with like square graphics for canva or pins that we want to have, you know, inside of Pinterest, being able to go in there and say, yeah, I want to see that in a red background instead of blue. And it just does it like, oh my gosh, it's just going to be amazing.
- [11:08]
A
Okay, so you and I, as we were talking earlier, we talked about Pinterest recent update where they were adding AI modified. And you said, well, YouTube's already doing that. Tell me a little bit about that. Because I think people who just operate in the Pinterest space and when it's like when Pinterest makes a change, people are up in arms. When like YouTube or Meta makes a change, people are like, what can I do right? Like I'm gonna be different. So tell me about that. Landscape wise, when it comes to AI images on all these platforms, what are you seeing?
- [11:39]
B
I haven't seen any. So for example, for all of my thumbnails now for my show, because I do a live show every Friday and I create, I I from my guest, I take and make like kind of a 50s style artwork for my guests for the thumbnail and because of that you're supposed to add, you slide a little toggle that says this is AI generated artwork or whatever. And I haven't seen any difference. Like It's. They're not going to limit that because that's what they want people to use. YouTube just rolled out some new AI tools for like music and some other things. And I think, I don't think Pinterest is going to. They would be stupid if they're wanting people to, you know, it's going to harm your. The reach or whatever everybody gets all upset about. For me, it's a way to be more creative. Like, you're not looking like everybody else. In fact, we still, for our show is because Pinterest still is one of the platforms that drives a lot of traffic for my stuff is that we put our pins there. Another step that we do is we actually take those static images. I drop them into one of my favorite AI video creatures. It's called Cling AI, and it actually animates my pins. And so it actually, I can take people who. I've made those images in the show and I can make them do something for five or 10 seconds. Like, for example, one of the ones I did is I. It was unlocking the LinkedIn code and I had a girl breaking into a safe and it actually, I just rendered an image in mid journey and then it animated her and it was just, it was fabulous. And it did really, really well on social. So taking it to the next level, I wouldn't be scared of doing that. Like, it's the stuff you're able to do that will set you apart in the feed is so easy. And it's, it's just the. One of the things I talked about in my talk was this is the first time for us who have been design challenged or we didn't have Photoshop skills or Illustrator skills, where we can actually take what's in our head and get it down on paper or up on the screen. We've never been able to do that before. At least I haven't been able to. Like, I could, you know, stick figure some stuff out. But being able to do that now, man, it just opens up worlds for you as a creator and being creative that you've never had before. It's just.
- [13:44]
A
Let's talk about that actually. So when you see that downline, like walking out one year, two year, three years, take a person like you who is design challenged, how do you see that transforming your business? Whether it's productivity, workflow or even branding, like, what are the possibilities that you see?
- [14:01]
B
So it's just like when canva came out, that's the best analogy I have is when, you know, everybody started doing it and they would just try to make the easy button and you could tell like those, those templates were all the same. Being able to now to, to craft things, it's the same way you want to be able to craft things in your style, in your visual voice, all that kind of stuff. Like for us, it's always been 50s kind of retro style. Now it's easier than ever for me to create those types of images and everything is custom. Like I, my presentation did not have one single stock photo in it. It was all custom things for me. And if you can think of that and kind of just put that out there even more as your brand, like you don't have to rely on stuff that other people have shot or created. You may have that chance that that image will show up on their brand. You don't have to worry about that. You can make all custom things now for your Pinterest profile, for your, you know, everything. And it's just for me that is like, okay, it's that big step above having a template that you can modify. It's even, it's. You can modify everything and it just opens up worlds. I think for standing out now everybody's going to want to hit that easy button. The thing that you have to do as a creator is like, okay, let's do something different. For example. So here's examples like for the. When the new ChatGPT image thing came out, everybody was rendering those action figures and posting them, you know, on their profile, which is very cool, right? Great stuff. So what I did is I took it a step further and made it like the old fashioned Star wars with a wrinkled box and things like that. My friend Dustin Stout, who created Magi, he actually did it then. He made it like as somebody picking up the box and holding it, animating it with Runway and so taking it what everybody else is doing and taking in that extra step or that extra piece of creativity, that's when really cool stuff can start to happen.
- [15:51]
A
Okay, so I don't want to be Debbie Downer, which I'm not traditionally that, but I'm going to like a little bit play the devil's advocate here. And what people are asking, there's a couple of things. So does this get rid of the stock image libraries? Do we no longer need them anymore? And you know, because I think you said just a second ago, there's those images like in Canva that were being reused over and over again and they were starting to look alike. Does this get rid of them completely? Will there be no Need.
- [16:20]
B
I'm glad I do not own a stock photography site because I have. So I, I remember I would always load up on the credits for deposit photos when they'd have the sales every couple times a year. I haven't used one since I'm able to create images at all. I don't use. I mean, maybe did we ever go in and use one for some. I don't think so now you. Not even backgrounds now. Like we'll just generate them all in AI. I think they're in trouble. And in fact, if you look like some of the, the graphics ones they've, they've started. Some of the stock photo sites have actually integrated AI so you can create your own images inside of their platform, which is. They're. They're trying to hold on for dear life. I think even music libraries that we use are in trouble.
- [17:00]
A
So, yeah, kind of the old and into the new. Okay, so tell me the negative impacts of this. Like the ways in which there's always bad actors, right. And we're sometimes seeing that a little bit on the Pinterest side of people whipping up AI sites that are not real people. You know, they're, they're creators with like seven fingers and things like that, where it's not actually serving the end user. Right. So I think people get, they entangle AI, whether it's a image creation AI writing in with these kind of bad actors and say, I do not want to use it at all. Like, I'm just not going to be a part of that. I'm going to bury my head in the SAM. And it, I think it's more of like a protest to say I will not be a part of this, but because I don't want to contribute to this small. I believe it's a small amount of people doing this. So walk that out for me. Like, when you look at this, these image creations, what are the problems that you see with either people creating them, taking them. I mean, how do we get into copyright? Like, tell me the negatives.
- [18:08]
B
So there's a couple things. Like one, there's the whole ethics side because it's being trained on all these models. So that's a whole nother podcast thing. And I struggled with that a lot too. Now, if you want to really be safe, I would use something like Firefly with Adobe because they have actually, I think said that they paid their what they're training on and all that. I've kind of come down to. Well, one, the cat's out of the bag. It's Never going to go back. You can't put it. I mean, it's just not like there's no way. And the thing I kind of went to, like, even Leonardo da Vinci, the famous sculptor and artist, he actually trained by copying the masters. Like he would sit there and copy the same sculptures as the masters were doing. So copying is a thing that a lot of people gripe about. There's. They're just taking all the stuff. So I, to me, it's the same thing, but you're just doing it at the speed of light now. Like you have the whole Internet that's being copied and people are like, well, that's going to kill artists. Well, I think good artists are still going to stand out, just like good storytellers continue to stand out. I mean, I remember TV was supposed to kill radio and everything's supposed to kill the thing that goes before it. And there's still like, we're on a podcast right now. So I mean, there's still spoken word is still important. So my thought is, is like we used to see blacksmiths on every corner, right? Like that was. We had blacksmiths there. They took care of your horses. It was just like, that's. Every corner had one. We don't have that anymore. Now we still have blacksmiths. Like we used to have a farrier would come and shoe our horses because we needed it. But you don't have them on every corner anymore. And I think the market is going to change. We'll be able to tell as creatives stories better. Like, I'm. This excites me that I'm able to do the stuff that I've never been able to do before, to tell a story, help a brand, you know, teach people things. So. But it, there is some negatives. Like, you know, is it going to hurt? Like the struggling artists maybe if they can't stand out enough. So. And then there's the whole question of like, okay, we're making copies as we put out more content of a copy. Is there a copy of a copy? Going to. Copy going to start degrading everything. I don't know. Like, it's, it's moving. Like I said, it's moving so fast. As creators and business people and entrepreneurs, I think we need to take advantage of it, but also really think about the, you know, the ethics. Like, still support your local business, still support your local artists. If you like a painting that they painted down at the mall on velvet, buy it, help support that. Yeah, that person. But I don't think we can put Our head in the sand and say it's not, we're not going to use anymore. I mean they. People do that with computers so well.
- [20:39]
A
And I was telling my brother last night because he has a lumber company, right? He has, he mills lumber, he does all this stuff and I want him to fix my fence this weekend. So we're talking about boards. And I was like, you know, this could do so much for you. Like, have you used Chat GPT? He's like, no, I don't want to use it. And I said, this is very similar to how when the Internet came along, people were like, nobody is ever going to use encyclopedias anymore and the library catalog. And I'm like, where's the encyclopedias in the library catalog now? It's not like we don't know how to research or we don't know how to, but it's. These things just tend to fall by the wayside. Also, I think us as entrepreneurs and online business owners, we are at the forefront of this, the common, I'll use this term very loosely, so I hope no one gets offended by it. But the common person out there, like my brother or whatever, they're not leveraging it for a business tool just yet. Like my, my husband plays around with Chat GPT and creates like, you know, cops pulling over cats in roadster cars for like our nine year old. And this like thinks it's amazing, but he's not like doing anything with that. He's just having fun. So I think it's also this piece of there has to be forward movement and progress and we have to take. There's always the good with the bad, right? But to your point of TV's going to kill radio now we have a modern version of radio and in podcasting and it reaches more people and it impacts more businesses. So being able to sift through it and ask yourself the question, okay, will this make me more productive? Will this help me reach more people and will it help me unlock creative gifts that I wasn't able to before? Like your experience, you were saying I had all this in my head and there was no way to get it out. And I think I heard Brian Fanzo. I think I'm getting his name right. He spoke at CEX a couple years ago when I was there and he was sharing how he's using AI to create all these images, which at the time, two years ago, it feels like who even knows what program. He was old, right? I'm sure his art is even more amazing, but that's what he Said is, I'm an artist, but I also have these learning disabilities. And it was really difficult for me to get this out. Now I have a self expression that this tool has given me life to use. And I was like, oh. And I went home and told my kids, like, oh my gosh, I'm gonna use this.
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B
But you also have to have your own kind of barrier. Like, I can make Disney characters easily in midjourney. I can do all sorts of things. Now if I publish those, Disney will come after me.
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A
Like, they will.
- [23:16]
B
So you just have to be smart about it. Like, but the thing is, is learning what styles you like. It's helped me become like, I didn't know. Here's an example. I've always liked the Jetsons artwork, right? Like how the Jetsons look. If you guys, if you're young, go.
- [23:31]
A
Years and years ago.
- [23:32]
B
Yeah, go watch the Jetsons.
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A
Other Gen X listeners.
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B
And the, the style that they use is called Googie. Not Google, but Google. That's a, that's an architectural style that I had no idea about, but I did. I uploaded those Images inside of ChatGPT and one of the cool things is you can have it describe an image and it told me it was in this style. I'm like, I had no idea. Well, now when I create art, if I want it to be in that style, I can tell it exactly what it is. And so learning those different styles and colors and all those different things help you become a better creative person when you start diving into some of those things that maybe you wouldn't have done before when you're trying to kind of figure out your own visual style. So I think knowing where your, your line is and not crossing that, because you do want to support artists and you want to, you want to help people out in that way, but also don't stick your head in the sand and become a Luddite where this stuff can save you time. Like, everybody gripes about, like, the, the highest tier of ChatGPT is $200, which I get. Like, that's expensive. It is, but it's cheaper than me hiring an employee. And when I can send something out to go research something for my show and do, it does it in 20 minutes and it scours the entire Internet and makes my show that much better.
- [24:46]
A
Yes.
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B
Why not? Like, I mean, I get that. I understand why people are scared that AI will take their jobs, but for me, it's saving me time so I can serve people better and have more space.
- [24:57]
A
Well, and I think the argument I was Talking to a friend of mine the other day, and she works in logistics and shipping and all this kind of stuff. And she said, I'm just worried people are going to get stupider. And I was like, that's true. I mean, yeah, okay, I, I see what you're saying, because there is a wrestling out in the creative process that ChatGPT shortens, right? Where all of a sudden now you become creative in your prompt as opposed to creative in your writing. And I definitely think for the younger generation who hasn't had to wrestle this out, that will be a challenge because they've never had to work through it. But at the same time, there might be also really great innovation and things that come about that we didn't think about before.
- [25:41]
B
And here's the other thing is, is because these tools can tie into so much data and so much of your data. For example, I've used. I use this tool now called Lex page. I use ConvertKit for all my emails, and that's the one you got, actually. And what it does is actually ties into my dashboard for kit. It will read all of my emails and it'll read all of my subject lines and we'll. And we'll help me craft subject lines that will work for my audience based on the data that is pulled from past email opens. So for me, that's paid for free, that it's a paid one. I think there's a free version, but anyway, I'll show it to you later. It's really cool. It's like Google Docs. But that, that makes it better. I mean, I'm not, it's not making me do bad subject lines that I would never do, but it helped me come up with that line that you mentioned at the beginning of like, is OpenAI going to kill Canva? Like, it gave me some generations of that idea and then I modified it because I knew what would work and shorter is better and all that kind of stuff. But that got me there. And the other thing you can use it for is like, for this speech that I just did. So I had a quote that I wanted to pull in from Dustin Stout and Mike Alton. And I'm like, it's just, it's not working there. I uploaded my speech to ChatGPT and I said, I want this quote. Where can I have it? I want it to be a smooth transition. It wrote it for me and put it in the exact spot that I needed to. I mean, just that where it's. You're not like. I mean, think of what you could do with Pinterest pin. You could upload your most popular Pinterest pins and say, I want you to analyze this image. I want you to look at the text and the. And the title and help me discover why these 10 pins work so well compared to everyone else's.
- [27:23]
A
Yes.
- [27:23]
B
We'll give you an analysis and it will help you craft those for other pins that you're going to be posting. That to me is a tool that's getting data that would take me so much longer that I would never do it. Right. We would never do that. Yeah.
- [27:36]
A
No. And everybody who is now listening at like the 25 minute mark, ish, you just got the thing that you're supposed to do, because that's such a great tip and a takeaway. And I think that's the thing that we need to come up with these things of, like, how do we make it so smarter? And it is moving at the speed of light. And I understand that it is hard to keep up. I know, like, I'm in agency groups about how to create faster operations with AI and creating agents within your business and then all of these other pieces, and it feels overwhelming. So even as people are listening, if you're feeling that way, go back to what Jess just said, like, analyze your pins. If people are coming to me and saying, well, how do I know what's working and not working? And I'm like, go into Pinterest analytics and look at the blah, blah, blah. But there could be ways that you speed that up in order to be a more efficient and productive business owner. And I think those are the wins that can happen with this modern tool. And I think to. To address also this concern that people aren't going to be able to think. I think it's thinking in a different way. I think it's thinking in a more creative way that's like, okay, my process is broken. Okay, well, how do I fix it? Or how do I make it more effective? How do I make it better for the customer? You and I are both service providers. You know, onboarding is a huge deal. You know, there's a lot of moving parts and there's things you don't want to miss. And it's the number one place that people get buyer's remorse. If your onboarding sucks and people are like, well, this sucks, I'm not going to work with them. And so taking these tools and saying, how, how can I make this better? What are the things that I'm missing? And that's magic.
- [29:16]
B
You know, you're Talking. I just thought of something I want to try. I want to go download, you know, the pins.trench trends.pinterest.com you know, the trends report and then download my stats and then put those both into ChatGPT and say, okay, where's some overlap where I can optimize what the trends are, which some past pins that have done well and help me think of idea. And it will, it will do that exact kind of things that we were not able to do before.
- [29:41]
A
Yeah.
- [29:42]
B
But don't for think about different data you have. Upload it all to ChatGPT or whatever, you know, Claude or whatever you're using and then have it start doing some analysis on this stuff because it does make a difference. Like even that opening line that got me on this podcast because Kate read it, you know, like that kind of stuff happens because you can, it's not cheating. You're not, you know, hacking the system. You're just using data you have that's unique to you and being able to put it in a way that's better for your audience. Like I would, I would do that so so much with the different pins and think of other ways to, to stand out in the feed. Maybe if you're doing static pins, take one of your static pins, it works really well and upload it to like cling and animate it and see what you get and see if that makes a difference. If you struggle with creating video like that might be something that you could do really, really easily with these tools.
- [30:31]
A
Yeah. And I find too that a friend told me Chat GPT is like a dude, Claude is like a woman. And it's very interesting because I actually do gravitate towards Claude for all of my writing because it feels like it sounds more like me. Whereas chatgpt I like for data, I like for if I'm going to plan my travel trip. In fact, last night I asked Chat GPT I'm going to Ireland for a week with my mom, she's in her late 70s and I'm going with my sister. And so I said I need to get from the airport to our hotel, named the hotel. And I said, what is the best way for a 78 year old woman? And they said, you are best just getting a taxi. You're going to have to walk to the bus, you're going to have to walk to the shuttle. Just do this. And I was like, well, that's what I thought. But it gave me all the information and the cost. I'm like, perfect.
- [31:17]
B
It's, it's the stuff like that we don't even think about yet. Like, you know, it's moving so fast. The other thing is they just upgraded their memory. So ChatGPT is going to start remembering pretty much anything that you, that you don't tell it not to remember. So as a business owner, uploading what you know, what you're thinking about, where you want to go, what your verticals are and then be able to ask those questions, like that's going to be worth an employee that I can send out and do deep research on. Like, in fact, like ecamm's having me do a special in September. We're doing a week long training and they sent me kind of the document what they were thinking of. They made it in ClickUp, I downloaded as a PDF. I sent it to ChatGPT and I said do deep research on it. I want to know a marketing plan that I can use. What questions are people asking about ecamm that I don't know about? And, and it took 20 minutes with the deep research and then it spat me back this plan, like do this and six months out do this. I mean, stuff that we'd pay a consultant for. We'd have to work through weeks trying.
- [32:13]
A
To figure out thousands of dollars.
- [32:15]
B
It's done for you. And, and I, and I'm like, people use this now. Like, like you said, people don't know about this stuff. They, you know, we're on the, the thing is there's no experts right now. Like there's people who have been playing with things for a while, but there are no experts. It's still so new that we're still all grasping how to use.
- [32:34]
A
Totally. Okay, so I'll, I'll end it with this. What are your cautions with uploading sensitive data? Because there's a lot of conversation around open source, closed source. You know, we have had conversations here. Do we upload, you know, client data to assess, do we redact names? Kind of what are your guardrails as far as any sensitive data?
- [32:56]
B
So they're, they're becoming more and more for this. Like I would not use like deep seek for that kind of stuff because that's the one that China had and there's all this stuff with it now. I have actually built a computer that I can run locally stuff. So I think that's going to be more and more where you can have local data and you can download some of these models that are kind of distilled that are a little bit smaller that you can, that do a Great job that you can run on your own computer and have your own models. I think that's going to continue. Apple still working on their AI which they're always privacy focused so that'll be a good one. But you can actually turn off memory for stuff. But I still would not. Especially if you're doing like health care stuff. If you're doing really sensitive data that you could, that they could learn from. I wouldn't put that there. Like I would change the names like if you're going to do it. But I still think there's a lot of data you could take and say like this company is doing this and you know they have. I mean you can even put monetary stuff on there. If you don't leave that have the company name on there and you can you know, help with Facebook ads or Pinterest advertising, all that stuff. I think could could really analyzing data is its strong suit. So just even taking your Pinterest, if you're doing Pinterest ads, downloading that and then putting up there and saying tell me what you see because a lot of us just have no clue anyway. And then it'll start breaking stuff down and then you can enter a chat and like okay, what does that mean? Or can I optimize this? All these different things that you can ask now and you're not charged an hourly rate, you're just talking to the chat. Is some. Is some good things to do.
- [34:22]
A
Okay, so you mentioned a lot of tools but I'm going to distill it down. What are your top three and what do you use them for?
- [34:30]
B
Top three? The top. My top one is probably our whole company uses ChatGPT a lot for different things. That's my number one for image creation. It's Mid Journey. It's what I used a lot because you were. You can do so much, so many cool things with Mid Journey. That's when I pay for. When people are just getting starting out. I always say to use MAGI because you're able to go in and test all the models and not have to pay all the different fees. You pay one fee so you can go see everything and it has that for images as well. So if you're just starting out, that's the one I would recommend for that. So that one and then the Lex page we mentioned before was for email has been amazing.
- [35:07]
A
Okay, got it. I'm gonna. This is this last question I'm gonna spring on you which I know I said last minute ago but like what's the funniest thing, you have created either image or text, Right. Using chat gbt. What's the thing that's brought you. I won't even say funny. What's the thing that's brought you the most joy that you've created?
- [35:27]
B
Actually, the thing that I was able to do first because I tell this really funny story at the beginning of my talks. I've done it a couple of times, but this is the first time I've been able to animate it as me as a character. And so I was getting laughs from the story, but also for the image. And being able to do that was really, really powerful. Being able to have your own custom slide deck that doesn't look like anybody else's is, like, amazing because you've been there. Like, you go find stock photo and you're trying to. Okay, this is the point I want to make. Is this going to work? I'm going to shove it in here and see. You don't have to do that anymore. You can make a custom image. There's. There's tools in ChatGPT help you make images, all custom GPTs and things. But those are my. Those are my big ones. But the funniest thing I think was being able to do that. I mean, that was really, really cool.
- [36:14]
A
Yeah. Well, Jeff, I love you sharing your excitement, your creativity, and just your passion for this whole AI movement and where it's going. I think there needs to be more conversation that is positive than negative because there's a lot of negative around it and just people kind of pushing back. So I like that we were able to go to this place where we can embrace these tools and use them ethically and responsibly and really productively within our business. So where can people go to connect with you and probably get on your email list so they can see more of these, like, amazing subject lines.
- [36:47]
B
Yeah. So it's jeffc.com so that's J, F, S as in Sam, I, E, H, I before E, especially in C. That's how my mom made me memorize it. And then if you want to get on the newsletter, which, like, I do it twice a week, they're really fun. We have a great email community there. It's jeffc.com news. That's how you can get on the list.
- [37:05]
A
Nice. We'll link those below in the description. Well, thanks again, Jeff. I really appreciate it.
- [37:09]
B
Thanks, Kate. Thanks for having me.