Slow Burn: Biggie and Tupac | Plus: "East vs. West"

Date: November 30, 2019
Host(s): Joel Anderson (A), Chow Tu (B), Christopher Johnson (C)
Special Guest: Larry "The Black Spot" Hester (D), former Vibe staff writer

Episode Overview

This Slow Burn bonus episode dives deep into the role of hip hop media, particularly Vibe magazine, in the infamous East Coast vs. West Coast rivalry between Biggie Smalls and Tupac Shakur. Through an engaging, candid interview with Larry Hester—writer of Vibe’s influential "East vs West" cover story—the episode covers how the media reported on and arguably inflamed the feud, the behind-the-scenes culture of the time, and the lasting emotional burden felt by those who chronicled these tragic events. The hosts and producers also reflect on the context, reporting process, and culture of 1990s hip hop, providing historical insight for listeners.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Reluctance of Biggie and Puffy in the Beef (00:53 – 04:25)

• Biggie and Puffy generally avoided provoking the East vs. West feud, aside from Biggie’s radio call during Dog Pound’s “New York, New York” video shoot.
  • "I think you can really only point to a single time when Biggie or Puffy explicitly provoked or took an active role in the beef... But every other thing...they really did not want a piece of this.” – Joel (02:02)
• Their reactions ranged from plausible deniability in their lyrics to overt efforts to avoid stoking the tension.

2. The Role of Media in Hip Hop Rivalries (05:11 – 07:47)

• Media platforms, especially Vibe and Source, became conduits for artists to trade shots publicly. Cover stories and magazine pieces fueled public perception of the beef.
  • “This episode kind of continues to show how hip hop media at the time was playing a role in building up the hype around this East Coast, west coast feud…” – Chow (05:11)
• For many fans at the time, beef was a “white noise” staple of rap and didn’t feel particularly high-stakes—until it turned tragically real.

3. Tupac's Unprecedented Explicitness and the Shock Value Ethos (09:52 – 10:41)

• Tupac’s approach broke with hip hop tradition by explicitly naming and shaming rivals, creating a new level of spectacle and real-world consequences.
  • “Tupac was very explicit. You know, he would go out of his way to say exactly what happened or what he thought happened. And that just didn't happen in most other hip hop beefs…” – Joel (08:25)
  • “In some ways the ethos of a lot of this so-called gangsta music was a kind of shock value… Tupac come along... and it's like, I'm a really, like, this is shock value 2.0.” – Christopher (09:52)

4. Faith Evans as an Unwilling Pawn (12:03 – 12:30)

• The episode examines how Faith Evans was drawn into the feud, used by Tupac to humiliate Biggie, and how her perspective was largely overlooked at the time.
  • “The ways in which Tupac humiliated Faith... I didn't take it seriously at the time... But we didn't. I didn't think about her as like somebody who was being hurt by this…” – Joel (08:25)

5. Introducing Larry "The Black Spot" Hester & "East vs West" Cover Story (12:30 – 16:48)

• Larry Hester’s background at Vibe, his influence in discovering future stars, and the context behind writing the "East vs West" story which became infamous for intensifying the rivalry.
  • “He was a former staff writer for Vibe magazine... the guy who wrote the September 1996 cover story on Vibe that was headlined east vs West, which a lot of people think may have sort of stoked the fires around that beef...” – Joel (12:30)
  • “He wrote a really good story, a really humane, personal story about Biggie and Puffy in that time. And that's what sort of drew us to him.” – Joel (14:34)

Highlight: Interview with Larry "The Black Spot" Hester (19:05 – 65:34)

Early Days at Vibe and Influence (19:05 – 22:16)

• Started as an unpaid intern and rose through the ranks, writing the influential Notes from the Underground column, spotlighting now-legendary acts like Talib Kweli and Three 6 Mafia.
  • “I was the first to give light to Talib Kweli, Three 6 Mafia.” – Larry (20:28)
  • Anecdote: Received a demo labeled only "Kanye" from a then-unknown Kanye West, couldn't contact him. Years later, confirmed with Kanye it was likely his tape. (21:08)

Rap's Turn Toward Money and Street Dynamics (22:16 – 28:47)

• Described the industry’s shift with more money pouring in, drawing in not only artists but also "wolves"—managers, street hustlers, executives, and media, all creating a volatile “gold rush.”
  • “When the money got really big, that's when the problem started to arise.” – Larry (23:25)
  • “You had the wolves, you had the artists, you had the executives and the corporations, you had the media, you had all of these people in this gold rush of hip hop to try to get as much as they could. And the deaths and the violence and all of that was a byproduct of this crazy mix.” – Larry (24:03)

Behind the Scenes: Street Culture, Bad Boy vs. Death Row (28:47 – 31:10)

• Bad Boy’s street connections were “subtle,” while Death Row’s were overt and aggressive. This difference in approach and “company kept” played a crucial part in escalating tensions and violence.
  • “Whoever street cast that was a part of [Bad Boy], they did their thing and they let Bad Boy and Puffy do their thing... as opposed to Death Row where it was just like, you know, you get out of prison, the bus, drop you off in front of the death row office.” – Larry (30:06)

Reporting on the Rivalry—Danger, Responsibility, and Regret (31:10 – 54:35)

• Hester details the intensity and fear permeating hip hop reporting—bomb threats, shutting studios, the chance of violence at any moment.
  • “It was scary as hell, man...I don't have a car, I don't have a driver. I'm riding a train. People can see me whenever. Do I want to associate myself into this type of thing and possibly become a target?” – Larry (33:00)
• On the infamous "East vs West" headline, Hester voted against it, fearing it would escalate the feud. He still carries a sense of guilt over the coverage’s impact.
  • “I was one of the people who was not feeling the east versus west headline...because it's gonna start some shit. And it went on. And to this day, I still feel away whenever somebody says, hey, you wrote that story.” – Larry (45:28)
• A gut-wrenching reflection on the unexpected deaths:
  • “This was just supposed to be another rap battle. And now Pac is shot, you know what I'm saying? So the fact that he was dead, that he was now dead, it shook me a bit.” – Larry (49:25)

Emotional Fallout and Lessons Learned (54:35 – 65:34)

• Larry discusses the long-term burden of being tied to a tragedy, wishing he had pushed back harder or told more nuanced stories.
  • “I mean, people say like, well, hey, if you didn't do it, somebody else would have. Which is true. But still, I can't help but feel in some way partly responsible for how the things went down, the way they went down.” – Larry (54:35)
• Practical aftermath: Rappers distrusted journalists after the deaths, media was often scapegoated, and writer-artist relationships soured.
  • “Rappers did not want to really talk about anything to journalists unless it was propping up their projects. Pretty much anything that went bad was the media's fault.” – Larry (59:21)
• On whether the hip hop world learned anything from Biggie and Tupac:
  • “I think we started to learn a lot, but I think we're starting to regress...such an emphasis is being put on sensationalism, that that's the type of thing that boosts careers now.” – Larry (61:34)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Bad Boy’s work ethic and success blueprints:
  "Bad Boy was almost ran kind of like a cult. Puff had a way of making people feel like they were contributing to the overall vision..." – Larry (25:19)
• On the unknown and danger in the 1990s hip hop scene:
  “There was times...Puff would just shut down the studio. Yeah, there'd be times it would be just like, yo, everybody go home. We don't know what's gonna happen...” – Larry (34:20)
• On the seismic impact of Biggie and Pac’s deaths:
  “This was just supposed to be another rap battle. And now Pac is shot, you know what I'm saying? ... The fact that he was dead ... it shook me a bit.” – Larry (49:25)
• On the unintended consequences and media’s role:
  "I still feel like I have partial responsibility in it. Even though that wasn't my goal at the time. Indirectly I felt like my coverage of it had lent to his demise." – Larry (54:25)
• On learning (or not) from tragedy:
  “…We're a lot faster to cool things off. We're a lot faster to say, alright, let's not let this get out of hand and turn into some street craziness... But I think we're starting to regress... There would be no lesson to learn.” – Larry (61:34, 65:04)

Important Timestamps

• 00:53: Season context & introduction of hosts
• 03:22: Biggie & Puffy’s aversion to beef escalation
• 07:04: Media's role in amplifying beefs
• 09:52: Tupac’s shock value and explicitness
• 12:30: Introduction to Larry Hester & "East vs West"
• 19:05: Larry Hester interview begins
• 23:25: Money's impact on hip hop, emergence of “wolves”
• 30:06: Nature of street connections—Bad Boy vs. Death Row
• 45:28: Larry’s regrets about the “East vs West” headline
• 49:25: Larry’s reaction to Pac’s death; emotional fallout
• 54:35: Personal burden and responsibility for media's role
• 61:34: Lessons—learned and not learned—from the tragedies

Tone & Style

The episode balances journalistic reflection, hip hop nostalgia, and candid, personal testimony. The discussions are direct, often somber, but also laced with humor and brotherhood—a true behind-the-scenes conversation.

For New Listeners

This episode provides essential context for understanding how the East vs West rivalry spiraled out of artistic competition and media coverage into a defining, tragic chapter in hip hop—and what, if anything, the culture has learned in the decades since. Hear the perspectives of those who witnessed it—and wrote the first draft of its history.