#588 - Four Letter Murder - Falkner, Mississippi

Summary

Small Town Murder Episode #588: "Four Letter Murder - Falkner, Mississippi"

Overview In episode #588 of Small Town Murder, hosts James Pietragallo and Jimmy Whisman delve into the mysterious disappearance and subsequent murder of 16-year-old Steve Brown in the small town of Falkner, Mississippi. Through meticulous research and engaging storytelling, the hosts unravel the complex dynamics of the tight-knit community, the relationships between key individuals, and the legal proceedings that followed the tragic event.

Case Introduction The episode begins by setting the scene in Falkner, a rural town with a population of approximately 514. The hosts highlight the town's close-knit nature, low median household income, and limited opportunities, which contribute to its unique social fabric.

Key Individuals

• Steve Brown: A 16-year-old high school sophomore involved in the school choir and sports teams. Well-liked and popular among peers.
• Tammy Glisson (later Tammy Nance): Steve's 16-year-old girlfriend, a prominent cheerleader and basketball team member. Described as charismatic but comes from a tumultuous family background.
• Mike Muskelly: A fellow student and friend of Steve, also involved in sports. Initially dating Tammy before their relationships intertwine.

Timeline of Events

1. March 1981: Steve and Tammy amicably decide to date other people after several months together. Tammy briefly dates Mike Muskelly before rekindling her relationship with Steve.
2. March 23, 1981: Tammy informs Mike that she has resumed dating Steve, leading to tension between Mike and Steve.
3. Hunting Trip: Steve and Mike go hunting together, during which Steve does not return. A search operation is initiated by the community when Steve fails to appear for a Future Farmers of America (FFA) meeting.
4. Disappearance: Steve remains missing for two weeks, sparking rumors and theories about his whereabouts.

Investigation and Confession

• May 18, 1981: Tammy accuses Mike of murdering Steve, prompting law enforcement to investigate further.
• Polygraph Test: Mike undergoes a polygraph examination, which yields inconclusive results, leaving doubts about his involvement.
• Court Proceedings: Mike Muskelly is brought to trial based primarily on Tammy's testimony, where he initially confesses under duress, stating he acted out of "love" to eliminate Steve as a rival.

Legal Challenges

• Appeal: In 1985, Mike appeals his conviction on grounds that his confession was coerced and that crucial evidence was mishandled. The appeals court finds merit in his claims, leading to a reversal of his conviction and granting him parole after serving less than four years.
• Retrial and Plea Deal: Facing public scrutiny and insufficient evidence, Mike accepts a plea deal in 1987, pleading guilty to manslaughter instead of murder, resulting in a significantly reduced sentence.

Community and Media Impact The case becomes a focal point in Falkner, causing rifts within the community and drawing media attention. The hosts discuss the portrayal of the case in a 1989 CBS TV movie starring Christian Slater, which takes creative liberties and alters critical details of the true story, leading to controversy among those involved.

Conclusion Small Town Murder Episode #588 offers a compelling exploration of a tragic event in Falkner, Mississippi, highlighting the complexities of small-town dynamics, the impact of media portrayals on real-life cases, and the challenges within the legal system. Through a blend of investigative storytelling and comedic insight, James Pietragallo and Jimmy Whisman provide listeners with a nuanced understanding of the "Four Letter Murder."

Notable Quotes

• Mike Muskelly ([28:21]): "I did it for a four-letter word called love."
• Judge ([53:21]): "The sexual life of someone has no probative value whatsoever."
• Dwight Brown ([63:33]): "Mike had nothing to do with the disappearance of Steve Brown."

Final Thoughts The hosts emphasize the importance of seeking the truth and understanding the multifaceted nature of such cases, encouraging listeners to engage with the content through various platforms and support their ongoing discussions on justice and community impact.

Transcript

[James Petregallo]

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[Jimmy Whisman]

Oh, yeah, yeah.

[James Petregallo]

We just give the stylist our sizes, style, budget, preferences. I hope we order boxes when we want, how we want. No subscription or any of that required. And they send all just for me pieces as well. Oh, like maybe you'd like this. And it's awesome. Outfit recommendations, styling tips. You keep what you love, you send back the rest. It's super easy. You can do it. And we are doing it because it's excellent personal styling for everyone. Get started [e-mail] STM that's stitchfix.com STM.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Now back to the show.

[James Petregallo]

Hey, everybody, Just gonna take a quick break from the show and tell you a little bit more about Thrive Market. Jimmy, myself, we both want be healthy and know how to eat healthy. But the thing is, where do you start with that? If you don't know what you're doing, it's very difficult. And that's why we love Thrive Market. It's our go to online grocery store for getting all of the healthy essentials delivered. And we don't even have to leave the house. It's the no junk online grocery store that bans over 1,000 harmful ingredients from anything they have there. I know you have one thing you're particularly.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Pasta sauce drives me bananas. And rouse is there and it tells me what's good and what's not.

[James Petregallo]

And not full of sodium because that's the problem. Some of those pasta sauces loaded with sodium so you can find better options easy with Thrive Market's healthy swap scanner scan, a product that'll instantly recommend a cleaner alternative. It's amazing. Yeah, you swap out things you get like simple mills, crackers and lesser evil popcorn. Are you ready to make the switch? Well, I'm ready. Go to thrive market.com Smalltown Murder for 30% off your first order, plus a free $60 gift. That's T H R I V market.com Smalltown Murder thrivemarket.com Smalltown Murder now back to the show. When a young woman named Desiree vanishes without a trace, the trail leads to Kat Taurus, a charismatic influencer with millions of followers. But behind the glamorous posts and inspirational quotes, a sinister truth unravels. Binge all episodes of Don't Cross Cat early and ad free on Wondery. Hello everybody and welcome back to Small Town Murder Express.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Yeah. Choo choo.

[James Petregallo]

Oh yay indeed, Jimmy. Yay indeed. My name is James Petregallo. I'm here with my co host Jimmy.

[Jimmy Whisman]

I'm Jimmy Whisman.

[James Petregallo]

Thank you folks so much for joining us today on another absolutely insane murder stuffed episode of Small Town Murder Express. Ten pounds of murder in a two pound bag, everybody. And we got a wild one for you today that ended up with Christian Slater's involved in this. So you know, great. You know, it's weird when we've somehow wrangled Christian Slater into the episode, but it's all there. We'll get to that in one.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Took a break from being a scumbag and young guns to being this one.

[James Petregallo]

Oh my God, it's so weird too. The time. We'll talk all about it. First of all, shutupandgivemerder.com is the website go there to get your tickets for live shows. The virtual live show takes place on April 19th. It's our 4:20 virtual live show. It's a Saturday night and it's available to buy or to watch a hundred times anytime you want for two weeks after that. Just like a regular live show, except you are anywhere on the planet with Internet that you want to watch it in your living room. We're going to have costumes, we have the pictures and just like a real live show. Can't wait for it. We're excited. And then also get your tickets for May 17, Saturday night in Chicago at the Riviera. That is the night before is sold out in St. Louis. So that's the next live show. If you want to come see us in person in the Midwest, that is the place to go. Shut up and give me murder.com also. You want Patreon for sure. Patreon.com crimeinsports which by the way is the name of our other podcasts that you should certainly be listening to. So patreon.com crimeinsports all the bonus material you can handle, anybody $5 a month or above. You get immediately upon subscription a giant back Catalog shitload. Hundreds of episodes you've never heard before. Bonus stuff to binge on. And then new episodes every other week. One crime and sports. One small town murder. Damn it. You get it all this week. What you're going to get for crime and sports. We're going to talk about fraternity hazing over the years, different cases of it. And there's sports involved. A lot of these guys are athletes. And we'll talk all about all small town murder. We are going to talk about the upcoming Karen Reed retrial. She is the woman in Boston who is accused of killing her cop husband or not husband, boyfriend. And she instead, her. Her defense is that the entire police force has conspired against her. So. And it's possible. It's wild. We'll talk all about it and get into all the conspiracies. It's a lot of fun. And that is patreon.com crimeinsports and you get a shout out at the end of the regular show that said, I think it's time, everybody. It's time to sit back. You say, let's all clear the lungs here. Arms to the sky. Let's all shout, shut up and give me murder. Let's do this, everybody.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Okay.

[James Petregallo]

Let's go on a trip, shall we? Let's do it. We are going down to Mississippi this week.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Yeah.

[James Petregallo]

We are heading down there to Faulkner, Mississippi. Okay, there we go. F A L K N E R. Faulkner. This is in northern Mississippi. Way on up north up there. It's about an hour and 20 to Memphis. That's the closest place. So, yeah, that's up north for sure. It's about five hours to Wiggins, Mississippi, which was our last episode down there, which was Biting off More was the name of it. That was the one where the guy was biting off parts of another person that you don't want to bite off. It was pretty crazy population in this town. 514.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Teeny tiny.

[James Petregallo]

This is a real small, small town. Median household income here is about $55,000 a year, which is well under the national average Median home price here. This is crazy. 1. This is the median home price 125,400 bucks.

[Jimmy Whisman]

That's, wow, free.

[James Petregallo]

That's just. Yeah, you just. What's my mortgage like? 50 bucks a month sounds greater. Wow. History in this town here a little bit here. The creation of this village of Faulkner is related to the railroad coming here. Colonel W.C. faulkner was the president of Ripley Railroad Company. So that's how they did it. The first and only depot was Loaded. Where it was located for this company where the town of Faulkner is today and was called Faulkner Station. And then they just shortened it and they built a community around it. Listen to how cheap this is. They incorporated the community in 1992, but the aldermen of the town later abolished the incorporation to avoid paying their share of the construction of Highway 15. They didn't want to pay their share of it. The cost. Cheap bastards. And then once they figured all the roads are built and they don't have to pay for anything, they reincorporated again in 1962. Cheap. Cheap. You're not allowed. No one from this town allowed to drive on that highway. Sorry.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Just getting citizenship of Canada for April. April 13th through 16th.

[James Petregallo]

So weird. So reviews of this town. There's only two. Here's five stars. I've been living in Faulkner because. Or I'm sorry, basically my whole life since I was very young. Well, that would be your whole life. Yeah, that's. Life tends to start when you're very young. That's how it works. I even enjoy living here because of my family and friends. I recommend people to visit it sometime. Even though it is a very small town in Mississippi.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Yeah.

[James Petregallo]

And even though the awful fact there's nothing to do here at all. And there really isn't. This is a not a lot to do kind of a place. Four stars here. Faulkner is a very small town. The community is very close to one another. You'd have to be. There's no one else around.

[Jimmy Whisman]

What else are you going to do?

[James Petregallo]

There is one school in the town. I like it there because small towns are basically like a big family community. I would change that. There would be. That there be more job, more options, job wise. Well, yeah. Then you wouldn't all be so close as a community. There was different places to work. You guys all work at the same three places. So. Yeah. That's community things to do here. I don't know what's happening up here, but this is crazy. The Boots and Dukes trail ride slash field party goes on up here.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Boots and Dukes is something important.

[James Petregallo]

Let me show you a picture. Oh, no. It's like a black thing too.

[Jimmy Whisman]

That's like Boots and Daisy Dukes.

[James Petregallo]

Yeah, yeah, that's what it's for. Boots and Daisy Dukes and four wheelers. And the posters are all like black ladies in boots. Half naked ladies. Yeah, yeah, half naked. Which is just this area. I wouldn't picture like a big like black people gather. Black people gathering to ride trails is like. I never heard of that. But I mean, I'm sure family friendly.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Bring a hot chick whose ass and tits are out and bring the kids.

[James Petregallo]

Bring the kids. Well, it says get ready for a good old country time and countries with a K. For some reason, I don't know how that works. Let's ride through the trails followed by a good old field party with live music and fun. It says welcome y'all to the Mid Delta Mud Slangas Boots and Dukes trail ride field party. Get ready for a full day of fun and excitement as we hit the trails. Grab your boots and your best dukes for a trail ride like no other. That's not trail riding tire, by the way.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Also, I think they mean the ladies.

[James Petregallo]

I would hope so. Me and you will show up. Me and you gotta show up with boots and dukes on and see what happens there.

[Jimmy Whisman]

With a nut out. It's going out.

[James Petregallo]

Well, it'll fall out eventually. I mean, there's no way we're keeping both balls in a set of those things. Yeah, they're coming out somewhere.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Sorry, I've aged into these.

[James Petregallo]

Hopefully not on the trail. And then here's another one. There's another poster for a different year. Dukes and Boots, hosted by who? Featuring Tay Cheesy with a Z, hosted by Cleavy B.

[Jimmy Whisman]

What is that?

[James Petregallo]

Cleave B and DJ Eric Turner are on the set.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Oh, DJ Eric Turner.

[James Petregallo]

Oh, wow. Now I'm definitely going. Jesus, Jimmy, you gotta lend me some dukes. I'll tell you what, it really is a black party.

[Jimmy Whisman]

I like it.

[James Petregallo]

Yeah, first place trophy, longest distance as a group, all these different trophies. You know, you get tickets at a barbershop. This is crazy. This is the weirdest, like rural event I've ever heard of in my life.

[Jimmy Whisman]

It's amazing.

[James Petregallo]

So there we go. That said, let's talk about some murder here. Let's dive in. We got a lot to talk about. Let's leave Tay Cheesy out of this for now. Okay? We gotta go back in some time here. Let's set up our shop in 1981. What do you say?

[Jimmy Whisman]

Okay, yeah.

[James Petregallo]

So 1981, number one. Everything's different. Everything? Oh yeah, yeah, everything's different. I mean, most people like cable is new, put it that way. Nevermind Internet. Cable is new.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Does it exist?

[James Petregallo]

Yes. And it's new here.

[Jimmy Whisman]

It doesn't. There's no way it exists here yet.

[James Petregallo]

Actually, rural areas got cable first because it was easier to lay the lines. You didn't have to dig up sidewalks and shit. So yeah, like, like big cities got it last actually. Wow. So yeah, that's how it's weird. That's how MTV spread so big was because the first place got it first. First places that got it were like Kansas and places like that were the places that had it the heaviest because they had cable lines being thrown down in new areas and stuff. So yeah, no Internet, no cell phones. This is house phone. Oh, this is wild time, Rabbit ear tv, you know, that kind of shit. So just so you can get an idea and an overview, let's talk about a young man here named Steven Brown. Okay, Now, Steven Brown's 15 years old here, so young guy, he's a sophomore in high school. And let me show you a picture. Old Steven Brown here.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Stevie, look at those braces.

[James Petregallo]

Yeah, they are those things. They look like they're bulletproof. Those are. Those are the biggest braces I've ever seen in Life.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Those are 81 braces.

[James Petregallo]

Yeah, they are, man. And he's a good kid, Steve. His dad Dwight is a vocational agriculture teacher at Faulkner High School. That's a class there, Vocational agriculture.

[Jimmy Whisman]

What does vocational mean?

[James Petregallo]

That means it's gonna be your job. Oh, yeah, like that's. That's for kids who are gonna be. This is for kids because a lot of the kids in this area, they're not going to college, they're farming. They're gonna work on the family farm or that's just what they do. Yeah, it's a rural area, so there's no point in teaching them Shakespeare because. No, they're gonna farm. They don't want to learn.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Get you on the job experience while you're in fucking homeroom.

[James Petregallo]

Yeah, I assume if you don't want to be a farmer, there's other classes to take. But if you want to be a farmer, you can do that. So his dad's a teacher at the high school for 20 years. Steve sings in the church choir, you know, he's that kind of guy. He's a popular kid in high school, actually. He's a tall guy, just confident, plays sports, does things. He's got a nice girlfriend here too, named Tammy Glisson. Tammy Glisson is 16 here. And her father, by the way, is, and this is from a newspaper quote, a notoriously short tempered alcoholic. Yeah, so that's a nice. Those are good words to put together. Notorious, short tempered and alcoholic are all bad. So in a town like this though, honestly though, anything could make you notorious. Yeah.

[Jimmy Whisman]

But anything you do is short temper and alcohol combined with it is. Man, in a town like this, there's.

[James Petregallo]

Probably in a town like 60% of.

[Jimmy Whisman]

These people are alcoholics.

[James Petregallo]

In a town like this though, somebody may have seen you have three beers once and one time you like kicked a tree because you were angry at something like he's a short tempered alcoholic because there's just nothing else going on. She's a cheerleader here. She also plays on the basketball team and is like one of the head cheerleaders too of the whole deal. So she's, she's a, you know, hot shit for a young high school Mississippi girl here. So they're dating, these two. They start dating in 1979. Okay. Now Tammy was in the ninth grade, Steve was in the eighth grade. And that's a, that's a pull for an eighth grade boy. Yeah, yeah, ninth grade.

[Jimmy Whisman]

He aimed at another campus.

[James Petregallo]

Yeah, eighth grade girls want, you know, older guys but generally ninth grade girls don't want eighth grade boys. So Steve's a catch is what that says.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Sure is.

[James Petregallo]

So they keep, they date all through 1980, which is long term for back then for, you know, for school. And about Christmas 1980, they decided that they should date other people.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Oh, it's over now.

[James Petregallo]

They break up. Seems like it was probably Tammy's idea. When I tell you what happened next, I don't know if they decided mutually or not, but they decided that they weren't going to be steady anymore and that they would date other people. So after Christmas of 1980, Tammy began seeing another guy here named Michael Mescelli. He goes by Mike and Mischelli. Just like Jesse Muskelly, the West Memphis three. Really Killer. Yeah. Or not killer. One of the accused killers. So yeah, the one who confessed falsely there. So Mischelley, by the way, is M, I, S, K, E, L, L and then either ey or just Y, depending on which court document you look at, depending on which newspaper article there is. No one knows how to spell this fucking guy's name. I found him on a like a fucking hunting people down website and it looks like officially it's no E, it's just an ly. So he's born August 1964, same age as the rest of these kids. He, he was on the football team as well. He's a short guy though, shorter guy, kind of wiry hair, kind of that kind of deal here. But well liked though, you know, all these people are well liked. Then Thursday, March 19, 1981 comes along. So they've been together for almost three months. Yeah, Mike and Tammy here. And that's when Tammy and Mike break up. It's all over with, man. Then Saturday, March 21, 1981, two days later, Tammy starts dating Steve Brown again. Oh, she just had something for Steve and couldn't get it out of her head, you know what I mean? So then the next day, Sunday, March 22, 1981, Tammy calls Mike up and says, meet me down at the church, I gotta talk to you. Yeah, so she tells him that, look, I'm going out with Steve again so this is over. And she said, I even have a date with Steve the next evening we're going to Corinth and Monday night we got a date. So you know, this is all over with. Which good of her to tell him in person. That was nice. No text message to give it to back then. Very kind. So Monday, March 23, 1981, comes around the next day. Things happen fast when you're in high school from Wednesday to Monday. She had one boyfriend, now he's gone, another boyfriend a day. Everything can flip in high school in a second, right? So Steve goes to school, so does Mike. Steve goes to his house around 3:30 and gets changed. Now he stayed after school for baseball practice, so that's why he was there so late. And then he goes home at 3:30, gets changed out of his gear there and he is going to go hunting with Mike. Him and Mike are going to go hunting and I guess talk about how they both like Tammy. I don't know what's going on here. So now Steve is in preparation this week, by the way. The next weekend he has a solo singing appearance at the church congregation. It's his first solo singing. He's in the choir. Yeah, he's got a solo here. So he even like won't tell anybody what he's going to sing. Like his family knows. He wants it to be a big surprise. He's like, wait till you see what I fucking unfurl for you bastards. It's going to be wild. It's going to be wild. It's going to be crazy. It's just going to be the Bee Gees. How deep is my love. Which is really weird for church. They're not going to put Christ in it. How deep is Christ's love? It's going to be with disco music playing.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Oh boy.

[James Petregallo]

So Mike called Steve that afternoon when he stopped home to change his clothes, happened to catch him at home and Mike said, hey, you want to go hunting with me quick? There's a place that's got some, you know, I'm going to go about, about to head out. So if you're not doing anything. Come with me. So Steve said, well, shit, yeah, sounds good. He said, yeah, pick me up about 4, 415 at the steps of the high school. I'll be back. I'll go back there. So he. Mike comes to pick him up about 4 o'clock at the high school. And Steve is sitting there with a guy named Dwayne Hopkins. And Steve has a.22 caliber Mossberg rifle, which his father had given him to go hunting. So they're waiting to go hunting. That was a time when you could just meet. I'll get my gun and I'll meet you at the school. And that was totally fine. That's totally no problem at all. Wow. Sure. The principal come in. Hey, Steve. Hey, principal. How you doing with the fucking rifle on his shoulder? What you got there?

[Jimmy Whisman]

Oh, it's my.22.

[James Petregallo]

Is it loaded? Shit, yeah, it is. Yeah, you want to see? Here, check it out. So 8pm Comes around.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Yeah.

[James Petregallo]

And Steve's father comes knocking at Mike's house, at Mike Muskelly's house and says, I don't know where. Steve's missing. Where is he? I can't find him. Do you know where Steve went? I know he was going out with you. What's the deal here? And they, the reason why they're on the hunt for him is because Steve didn't show up for the Future Farmers of America meeting. That old ffa, you better be there. And literally the FFA was like, this is such a small town, when someone doesn't show up for the FFA meeting, they break up the meeting and go look for them. Because something, something must be wrong. Yeah, literally, it's great. The fire department put out a fucking siren. And everybody from town came to the fire department. They just put a siren out. And everybody goes, oh, we gotta go head over to the fire department.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Somebody's missing. Let's go.

[James Petregallo]

And that's to say we're gonna go look for the Steve kid. He's, you know, 16 years old at this point. And so it's about 11 o'clock, the whole group goes out looking for him. County officials, fire department, the townspeople. It's Mike, Mike's dad. Everybody's out there looking for Steve. Ms.

[Jimmy Whisman]

The FFA, James, you show up for them.

[James Petregallo]

You show the fuck up. So police talk to Mike and they go, you saw him, you know, everybody knows you went hunting with him. So what happened when you guys were hunting? And he said, I, you know, Mike said he got home from school and he called Steve and asked if Steve Wanted to go hunting. And Steve said, yeah, So I picked him up about 4 o'clock. We went target shooting in the woods near the Little Hope Cemetery in back of the Blackwell Church. And also they went up to a nearby lake and shot some stuff. Target practice. And then they went back up to my car. He goes, and that was it. He goes, I drove him back. I dropped him off in front of the bank of Faulkner because that's where he asked me to drop him off. And he goes, I went home. And then, you know, his dad showed up, the fire fucking siren went off and here we are, I don't know.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Church, school and the bank. Three places. You certainly shouldn't be bringing guns.

[James Petregallo]

All guns. He also said he picked up his paycheck at Griffin Brothers grocery store where he worked part time. Then he also said that he didn't want his dad to hear this, but he said he stashed some beer. He remembered that he had stashed some beer near the county line. Oh, that's where I keep my beer too. I keep it at the county line.

[Jimmy Whisman]

That's the thing they do.

[James Petregallo]

Yeah, the old county line there. Yep. And he went and got it and drank a can and then hid the remaining cans of beer in an abandoned pickup truck near his house so his parents wouldn't find it.

[Jimmy Whisman]

That's so funny.

[James Petregallo]

That's hilarious. That's very. Just normal teenager shit. Doesn't get any more normal than that.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Hiding 65 Chevy out in the woods, put my beers in it.

[James Petregallo]

Hiding a five pack in a fucking burnt out Ford in the woods is definitely a thing because we did that. There was a van in the woods and we used to hide shit in it. Yeah, absolutely. This van, we used to sit in it when it was cold and hot, box it. So yeah, he said he went home and the next time he heard anything was his dad coming around. So he doesn't know. And then he said, you know, the town's fire siren blows at 9 o'clock and everybody gathered at the schoolhouse and started this search. So everybody's there. This search basically continues around the clock for two weeks with no sign of Steve. He just disappeared.

[Jimmy Whisman]

And the FFA missing is what spurred the whole thing.

[James Petregallo]

That's it. He missed the ffa. They go, that's not right. Steve shows up for his FFA Shit. So full week of looking.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Let's go.

[James Petregallo]

So right after that he just, he's gone. And a lot of people think he ran away. It's. A lot of people are thinking he's a runaway because, you know, Mike said, I dropped him off in front of the bank, and I don't know. And so they think he might have ran away. That's the thing that happens sometimes. So after that, Tammy just starts dating Mike again?

[Jimmy Whisman]

Well, yeah.

[James Petregallo]

I mean, this is. Fuck it, I guess. The other guy's gone. There seems to be not a lot of boys in this town to date because just two. These are the only two that have any interest in her. So months go by. That's March, April goes by, no sign of Steve.

[Jimmy Whisman]

What the fuck?

[James Petregallo]

Then May 18th comes around, and Tammy goes to her father and she says, dad, I got something I have to tell you here. Mike told me that he killed Steve. Yeah, told me that. So the dad calls the sheriff and the highway patrol and all these authorities. He can get involved.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Anybody's got a badge. Hey, I got a story for you.

[James Petregallo]

Whoever's got a jurisdiction over here. So she said that. That's May 18th. Now, this is what she said. This is her statement. She says, this is a written statement. Steve and I began dating when I was in the ninth grade. And he was on the eighth. On March 23, 1981, Steve and I had an agreement in effect by the terms of which we had decided to date other people. What the.

[Jimmy Whisman]

I have heard this legal document you're reading.

[James Petregallo]

I've read, like, disillusions of corporations that are less fucking jargony than this. This is crazy, dude.

[Jimmy Whisman]

That's incredible.

[James Petregallo]

Divorce papers have more clear thing effect by the terms of which we had decided to date other people. However, we had a date for that night. I had not dated anyone else. I had not dated Mike Muskelly. I went places with Mike Muskelly, but I didn't call them dates. Mike Muskelly was a real close friend. I really cared for him. He was very nice to me. She's lying, by the way. We'll find out later. Absolutely. On March 23rd. On the 23rd of March, 1981. Sorry, she has to make it a very legalese. Steve Brown and I had made plans to go to Corinth that night to get him a pair of tennis shoes. He had a date the Friday night before his disappearance. And on that Saturday, we got back together. On Sunday, March 22, 1981, I saw Mike Muskelly at church, Pleasant Hill Baptist Church. I told Mike that I was going to go with Steve. The next night, Mike got up and left church. Okay, what's he going to do? Talk about it? The following morning, March 23, 1981, I went to school. And I recall seeing Steve Brown at school that day. The first night when Steve disappeared, I questioned Mike Muskelly regarding Steve's disappearance. I asked whether or not he knew where Steve was. Seems reasonable, yeah. You know where he is. If he ran away, where'd he go? Mike responded that he didn't and that if he did know where Steve was, he'd go find him. I mean, if I knew, I'd be walking back here with him, go and found him. So he said about the. She said about the first of May. Mike Boschelli began to tell me that he had something to tell me. Began to tell me I got something that he had something to tell me that he would tell me on his deathbed. Okay. One night on the telephone, he mentioned that he had something to tell me. And I told him that if he didn't tell me, I would hate him. And he said, okay, I'll tell you. This is the most high school shit ever. If you don't tell me, I hate you. All right, fine. Then he told me it was about Steve. That's all he said. The next morning in the auditorium at school. He said that he did this for me and that he thought Steve was coming between me and him. And that he'd done it for a four letter word called love. I done it for a four letter word called love. Called love. Oh, my God.

[Jimmy Whisman]

How romantic.

[James Petregallo]

I don't think that's what Queen had in mind when they were singing that song. This is a crazy little thing called lover, right?

[Jimmy Whisman]

Yeah.

[James Petregallo]

He said he'd gotten mad the Sunday before Steve disappeared. He said that he dug a hole and said the next morning he talked Steve into going hunting with him. That is premeditated.

[Jimmy Whisman]

That is unbelievable.

[James Petregallo]

Dude, to dig somebody's grave a day ahead of time before they're even dead is crazy.

[Jimmy Whisman]

That'd be mad. I dug a hole. Said, wanna go hunting?

[James Petregallo]

That is, I mean, diabolical.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Good Lord.

[James Petregallo]

Holy shit. And he said the next morning he talked Steve into going hunting with him. He said he picked Steve up at school and headed down Highway 370. He said Steve didn't talk much, but that they talked about bulldogs and the band that was at school that day. Just bulldogs. Actual dogs. Not like the Georgia Bulldogs or something. That's what I thought, too, but now it's just dogs. He said that when they got to the woods, he didn't have his gun, but Steve had his. He said they set up a bottle and shot at it with Steve's rifle. He said that they went on up into the woods. He said that he saw the hole that he had dug and he knew what he had come to do. He said he turned his head and pulled the trigger. And then turned around. Then he turned around. He said Steve took a step and then another one. And then went down to his knees and just looked at him. He said Steve mumbled something then fell. I started crying. Mike asked me not to cry. Then I settled down. She is pliable as shit. Oh, shit. Your boyfriend. I killed your boyfriend in a horrible premeditated murder. Stop crying. Okay, fine, fine. I just wanted to know more. I wanted to know where. And I asked him how it looked and he said it didn't look bad. Meaning the wound, I guess, was his whole face blown off or whatever. He said he loved Steve, but that he loved me more. Yeah, that's a crazy little four letter word. Boy. I love a boy.

[Jimmy Whisman]

And talking under bite dogs with him. But I like you better.

[James Petregallo]

I like you better, baby. He said it only took one. He said it hit Steve behind the left ear. I asked him did he have blood in his blonde hair, meaning Steve's blonde hair. He said he buried Steve together with Steve's rifle. I asked him how he covered it up to keep it from being seen. And Mike said he used, quote, the shovel to cover it up. That's all he told me that day. He never told me where. Said he did it for a four letter word, love.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Called love.

[James Petregallo]

Called love. Later on, I asked him where because I wanted Steve to be found. I loved Steve and wanted him to be found. Mike said he couldn't tell me where. Okay, so she's got a story that he's admitted to this, but we don't know where it is. So obviously the cops need to bring Mike in and have a little chitchat with him here. So he's 16 and they bring him in, and Mike, they bring him in with his dad and, you know, family, because he's a kid. Hey, everybody. Just gonna take a quick break from the show to tell you a little bit more about our safest sponsor, Simplisafe. The days are getting longer. We got longer daylight hours, which means you might be spending more time away from your house, which gives burglars more time to rob your house. That's what happens here. FBI crime data shows that break ins are more likely during daylight hours than at night, actually, which you don't think of that. But you need to protect your home with Simplisafe's proactive security that helps stop threats before they even happen. We Love SimpleLife because, number one, they're great. The alarms are great. The cameras are high quality. I love the fact that they can tell somebody and yell at them to go away from your house and they can call the cops. Right. And it's easy to install. I was so worried when we first got it. I'm not gonna know how to do this. It's super easy. They have installation if you need it. But you can do it. If we can do it, you can do it. Visit simplisafe.comsmall to claim 50% off a new system with professional monitoring plan and get your first month free. That's Simplisafe. S I M p l I safe.com small there's no safe like Simplisafe. Yes.

[Jimmy Whisman]

And now back to the show.

[James Petregallo]

Hey, everybody, just gonna take a quick break from the show to tell you a little bit more about sono bello.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Oh, sonobello.coms o n o b e l l o.com yes.

[James Petregallo]

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[Jimmy Whisman]

Now back to the show.

[James Petregallo]

So they he said, yeah, me and Steve drove to a wooded area located off Little Hope Road behind the Little Hope Cemetery. He said that he had a 20 gauge shotgun and that Steve was carrying his own.22. He said they shot at some jars. He also said he used Steve's gun to shoot at one of the jars because, you know, more fun for target practice than buckshot spray.

[Jimmy Whisman]

You don't stand back from target with shotgun.

[James Petregallo]

That's boring. I got like four of the bottles. It's going to hit a bunch of them probably. I got four of them. So he then said they returned to Faulkner and said that they were headed to another place to go hunting when Steve changed his mind and said, ah, just drop me off in front of the bank of Faulkner. I want to go home there. So that's what he did. And a cop later recounted that. He's. That's what he said. He said they shot guns. And he said that first. He said, at first Mike denied driving that day into Benton county, where they went, but after they found witnesses who said they saw him driving back from there, he said, oh, yeah, we did go there. Yeah. But he said, I didn't want to tell you why I went there because I went there to get the beer I had stashed. Had nothing to do with Steve. I had beer and I didn't want. I didn't want to sit here next to my dad saying, oh, yeah. Then I went and grabbed my six pack. So that didn't work. Yeah. So then why. They're like, well, why is Tammy saying that you said you killed Steve? Why would she say that? She's your girlfriend, right? Like, what the fuck? And he said, well, actually, she said that because that's what I told her. But I only told her that because she wouldn't shut the fuck up.

[Jimmy Whisman]

About what? About Steve. Okay.

[James Petregallo]

Yeah. He said that she continually questioned me regarding the disappearance, and she kept saying she loved Steve and wanted him found.

[Jimmy Whisman]

So I gave her a false confession.

[James Petregallo]

Yeah. So Tammy asked him over and over again where Steve was. He said, this went on for a month and a half. She kept asking me, where is he? Where is he? And I kept saying, I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. But she kept. Yeah, she kept asking. So finally she said, you killed him, didn't you? And according to him, he said Tammy asked him every day at school and called him at home about the whereabouts of Steve and said, quote, if you don't tell me where Steve is, I ain't gonna love you no more.

[Jimmy Whisman]

I'm gonna hate you.

[James Petregallo]

That's literally the quote, by the way. I didn't Mississippi that up at all. That's a quote from a newspaper.

[Jimmy Whisman]

She good cop, bad copped him without being a good cop. She just bad cop the shit out of him.

[James Petregallo]

She's not even a cop. She's just batted him.

[Jimmy Whisman]

She's a pretty good interrogator, though.

[James Petregallo]

She's not bad.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Yeah.

[James Petregallo]

So finally he said, I just told her, yes, Tammy Shore. I did it. I killed him. And Tammy said that Tammy then said, to him that, you know, what the fuck? Basically. And he said, yeah, I don't know. That's what happened. So he's telling the cops that I only said that to shut her up. He said during this period, the reason. Why. Why do you. Why did he say it? I mean, anybody. You could just say, I don't want to hang out with you anymore. Leave me alone. He said, well, she was providing sexual favors for me at the time, during this whole time period. And basically, she told me she wasn't gonna fuck me no more if I didn't tell her what happened. So I told her, and then she sucked my dick. That's how it worked. That's what he said. He literally was. Yep. Once I told her, then she resumed fucking me again. So it worked. That's what I was. I was just trying to get laid. That's what he tells the cops.

[Jimmy Whisman]

All right.

[James Petregallo]

So the cops go, okay, these are two likely stories. They're. Either one could be true. So let's sit down, take a polygraph test. What do you say? They said, here's the guy. They called him the best examiner in the state of Mississippi. He's a highway patrol examiner in Jackson, which is the capital of Mississippi. So he might be the best they have to offer. Now, he said, okay. Him, his father, his mother all came in. They went all the way to Jackson, where he underwent a polygraph examination. Now, Mike claims that they told him if he took the test and passed and they'd leave him alone and he'd be cleared and they'd move on to the next thing. He says they told him that he passed. The polygraph examiner later on tells everybody, though, that it was inconclusive, the polygraph examination. So.

[Jimmy Whisman]

So you're saying I didn't fail.

[James Petregallo]

So you're saying. So they just go, I don't know. I don't know. Everybody shrugs. Mike goes home, and it gets. And it just goes away.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Goes nowhere.

[James Petregallo]

Yeah, and it goes nowhere for a long time. Steve is nowhere to be found. No one can find Steve.

[Jimmy Whisman]

A man went. A boy went hunting with another boy where they both had guns. One boy didn't come back.

[James Petregallo]

Yes.

[Jimmy Whisman]

I don't know.

[James Petregallo]

I don't know. I dropped him off by the bank. Don't know what to tell you.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Well, we'll look at the bank.

[James Petregallo]

Well, you. You look guilty. And then you told a girlfriend. Yeah, that was just for pussy, though. You know, that don't count. Man will say anything for a blowjob. Shit.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Two with guns. One came back. Hmm. Head scratcher.

[James Petregallo]

Yeah. Jack and Jill went up the hill. What are we talking about here? Like. Yeah. So why she.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Why she come back with 250?

[James Petregallo]

This is Craig's. I was. You know, that was on the tip of my fucking tongue. I was like, I. Stopping myself from. And, hey, Jill came down with 250. So then the Brown family, Steve's family, begins getting odd phone calls. Yeah, the dad said that, quote, someone called and said we'd hear from Steve on a certain day and hung up. And they didn't hear from Steve. Another person called, a different person and said that someone was paid to keep Steve. That's what he said. And so he was. He just got these weird phone calls with, like, tips. Like, I heard this bizarre. So. And the dad said he recently dreamed that his son stood before him and was talking to him. And also his. His mother, Mary Ruth, said that she felt like her son was close. She said, he's close by. I can feel it. I can feel it. And a relative called and said that she'd had a vision that he was in a hospital in Missouri. No. No. A vision. A vision is when you're awake. A dream is when you're asleep. That's what it is. A vision's a hallucination. A dream is a dream. Those are. That's the difference there.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Yeah. Did you make the booze you drank? Ma'am?

[James Petregallo]

A vision denotes you've been drinking rubbing alcohol or possibly have a mental illness. A fucking. A dream is just a dream.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Butt chugging. Listerine. Ma'am, stop it.

[James Petregallo]

No shit. So mom said, sometimes I get depressed real bad. But sometimes I think, wait a day or two and he'll return. Well, months go by. Months. August 1981. The Mississippi Press newspaper. Faulkner residents wonder what happened to Steve Brown.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Straight through the summer.

[James Petregallo]

Yep. And Dwight, the dad said, we don't know which way to go now. I still hope that we can find him and that he's okay. And his wife said she's holding up better now. And their other child is making. Is making it fine. It's six months. I don't know how you're. Anybody's making it fine. The highway patrol investigator who's leading this whole thing, Kenny Dickerson, said that he's at a loss. He doesn't know. He said, when you don't have anything to. Anything to start with, it doesn't give you much to go on. We don't have any new leads whatsoever. We're still very much interested in it. We'll carry out any new leads. There's a good possibility the boy is still alive.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Yeah.

[James Petregallo]

What possibility? With it, he ran away and went to Mexico. He's in the future farmers of fucking America. He's got, you know, he's gonna have to come back for those little fucking rubber bands just for his braces. This is not a kid who's just gonna run off and live his life forever.

[Jimmy Whisman]

The orthodontist hasn't seen him. Those things are rusty by now.

[James Petregallo]

That's what I mean. It's fucking crazy. Now the Reverend Floyd Beasley, who's the pastor of the Faulkner Baptist Church, somehow has a more realistic view of this than the police do, which I think is mind boggling.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Well, we've got a police officer named Kenny on the fucking case.

[James Petregallo]

Old Kenny Dickerson. Yeah. He said, I don't really think he ran away. He's just not that kind of person. This has caused us to stop and think and wonder what's really going on. Things like this just don't happen in Faulkner. Well, apparently they do, motherfucker, because here you are. So, yeah, they said that they had heard that someone called authorities from Florida called saying they had a youth with an appearance that matched Steve's and they needed the parents to come see if it was their kid or not. And so a bunch of the guys from Faulkner, Dwight, and a bunch of a carload of men from Faulkner drove to Florida and it just looked like him.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Random kid.

[James Petregallo]

And he was driving a car with Mississippi tags too. And they said just a kid who looked like Steve. That's all it was, just kid with braces and a Southern accent. So. September 23, 1981, big article. Nation joins Hunt in two of state's disappearances. And it's a big article about, you know, just there's her, him and this woman that disappeared too, from the area, and no one can find either one of them. And this written by Loretta Pendergrass, who keeps with this story. For years she had the byline on, like, everything. March 1982, headline, Steve Brown, 17 missing. Still over a year now. We're talking about April 1982. They. There's an article that says, Stephen Brown trail heats up. Authorities will drain private lake next week.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Oh, my.

[James Petregallo]

Yeah, they said now foul play is high on the list of possible reasons for the youth's disappearance. A chief investigator said, we came up with some information that leads us to believe that the Brown boy was in the area at that time. That doesn't sound good if you didn't know his last name is Brown. We're not only looking for a body, but we're also looking for a gun. It's one of several possibilities. And they said the lake is. They went in the vicinity of the lake. Maybe he came back here. It's about 18 miles from where they do did their initial search for Brown. They said that it'll take two or three days to drain the 70 acre lake within three feet of the bottom. Yeah, that's a long. It's three days to drain that.

[Jimmy Whisman]

God dang.

[James Petregallo]

It's a lot of water. They said that the average depth of the lake is about 7ft. It's 8ft deep, but it's deepest point. The agencies plan to open the lower gate on the lake's dam and allow the water to flow into Walnut Creek, which is another town that we've done before. They said that they've never done this before and they said it might be tricky. Well, no shit. Then the head investigator said there's so many tales going on around there. The rumors have really hindered us. But we've got to eliminate possibilities by whatever means they can. There's several articles where they're annoyed that these small town fucking rumors are wasting their time essentially. Yeah. And driving them down wrong paths. Then on December 22, 1982, we are talking almost two years here. 20 months. 21 months. Danny Ross is a guy hunting with his father and his brother behind Blackwell Church in Benton County, Mississippi. They found a 22 caliber Mossberg rifle in a hollowed out tree in the middle of a small, small drain. They said now guy picks up the rifle and goes, look at this guys, I found a fucking rifle. Shows his father and his brother.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Don't touch that. You fucking crazy.

[James Petregallo]

They didn't know. They just found a rifle in the woods. Like look at this. Somebody left their fucking gun out here. So like oh, that's weird. They don't know of. They don't. Not everyone's following this, you know. They're not. They're not from this town. So yeah, this is in another county.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Yeah, but it's just a gun out there. I don't want to touch any gun. That's just free range.

[James Petregallo]

That's because we do a murder show. Normal people just pick things up.

[Jimmy Whisman]

That's a great point.

[James Petregallo]

Sweet to a murder. But if a, if a hillbilly finds a gun in the woods in 1981, they're not going to go, oh, nobody touched it. Back off. They're going to go free gun and pick it up. That's what they do.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Gold boys look.

[James Petregallo]

Yeah, It's a free gun. There's no anybody in the would do that. So they pick it up and they. They walk back to the location where the gun was near to see if there's anything else over there. Shit. People dropped their gun. Maybe they dropped some.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Some cash, wallet shit. Yeah.

[James Petregallo]

Pair of Ray Bans. I don't know what they find something much weirder. They return to the location and approximately two feet from where they found the gun, they find a skull. Yeah, that's not good. Just a skull. Human skull sitting there. They called the cops. Obviously they had to think about this. Is it worth the gun? Do we take it or do we gotta call somebody? So they search the area and they also find a human lower jawbone with braces on it. Oh.

[Jimmy Whisman]

What?

[James Petregallo]

Yes. So. And the skull found lying on its side had a hole behind the left earth and another hole in the forehead going out. And exit through. Yep. So they said the remains were approximately 30 paces from a hole that had been dug in the ground. Like an animal. Must have taken.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Yeah. Dug it up.

[James Petregallo]

Some of this. Yeah. And the.22 caliber Mossberg rifle was the rifle that Steve's father bought for him.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Oh, boy.

[James Petregallo]

So the body is identified from the orthodontist. Luckily, this guy has tons of dental records. Steve. To identify him with. So.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Boy, they've been taking pictures of his face for a long time.

[James Petregallo]

Yep. The orthodontist identifies the braces as his work work.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Yep.

[James Petregallo]

And it's Steve's. So cops got to talk to Mike again. Obviously have a little chit chat. A little chit chat with him. The problem is it's. Here's an article about how crazy this thing goes. Okay. Unspoken accusations hover over a town staging its own soap opera. This is from a Jackson newspaper. After Steve Brown disappeared, it was open season. A teacher left his job in the town under duress while students eyed one another suspiciously. It just turned everybody against each other. They all got crazy here. There are repeated allusions to another man's temper, meaning Tammy's father. Because they're saying people are. A lot of people in town were accusing Tammy's father of killing him.

[Jimmy Whisman]

For kissing his daughter.

[James Petregallo]

Yeah. For kissing on his young. His little girl there. So they said arson is suspected in a recent store fire. There are no direct connections, only implied ones. Anything that happens now, everyone goes, mm. It's all connected. Yep. The same small town intimacy that worked as a binding force in Walnut is threatening to choke the residents of Faulkner if skeletons falling from closets could augment a census count. The population would have tripled. This is the dark flip side of small town life. Party line politics and intense familiarity have bred contempt. Steve's father, Dwight Brown, taught the Muskelly boy. He was a teacher of Mike's. Mike's father, Wayne Muskelly, was on the town committee that raised the reward for information that led to finding Steve. Oh, so everyone's finger fucking and got something in the pie here. So they said there were sometimes. There was that. Sometimes comforting, sometimes smothering snugness. Snugness that small towns are famous for. So they talk to Mike again and they go, look, bud.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Yeah.

[James Petregallo]

Your girl said you said you shot him behind the left ear. Yeah, he's got a gunshot wound behind his left ear.

[Jimmy Whisman]

We found a head with a shot.

[James Petregallo]

Yeah, that's the place you took him hunting. You're under arrest, big guy. Yeah. Hey, take him to trial for murder. That's it. During this week long trial, by the way it is, the courthouse is choked with people. There's people that bring folding chairs and sit outside the courtroom and with their ears out trying to listen to shit. The court's full. It's crazy.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Like a milk cup.

[James Petregallo]

Yes.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Yeah.

[James Petregallo]

Hundreds of people every day, like as many people as live in this town show up to this trial every day. Insane. It's like fucking oj. Southern oj. So they call Tammy first. She's the. She's the main witness. I mean, that's it.

[Jimmy Whisman]

It's her story. Yeah.

[James Petregallo]

So she said Mike said he saw the hole that he dug earlier and knew what he had come to do, pulled the trigger and like just all the stuff he said before. Basically her exact statement, but in court here. And she also said. He told me he did it for me. He said that Steve was coming between him and me and he did it for a four letter word love called love. By the way, she's married now. She's now Tammy Nance. She just turned 18, but she's been married for over a year.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Wow.

[James Petregallo]

She was looking to settle down at some point with somebody.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Oh, shit.

[James Petregallo]

Yeah. So, yeah, he said that she said that's what happened. He went and dug a hole and he said he didn't have his gun, but Steve had his. All the same things. It didn't look that bad. And everything else. He said that when they. He said he then handed Steve's. Steve handed the gun to Mike and Mike said that Steve told him, I don't believe we're going to find any beavers here, Red. That's. He called him Red. Steve called Mike red. And he said at that point, that's when he ended up shooting him. He turned around and shot him. So that's crazy. Now here's a big deal that comes out the. Obviously the defense counsel wants to really cross examine the shit out of her and break her story down, because that's what you do with witnesses. So they said. The defense counsel says, you, Honor, there's a lot of questions I want to ask this witness pertaining to matters that took place after this disappearance. The very confession she says Mike gave her was, I guess, spread over a long period of time, culminating in something dated May 18. And if the court, uh, I want to make some ground rules now, if you're going to restrict me on my cross examination on things that took place after, I think it's important in the defense. So they say, what. What kind of shit you're gonna ask. And he says, well, going out with Mike muskelly, sexual intercourse with him, various places they went, secret meetings, notes written, all of which she has denied in statements to us, and all of which we've got other independent witnesses to impeach her with. So just to show she's a liar, because she said, I was done with him at that point. And we know from that point on, she wrote him love letters. They were having sex. She wrote notes alluding to it. I mean, there was. She's lying completely. She absolutely was like, oh, you killed him. That's horrible. Well, I guess, you know, you can still. I'll still blow you. So that's. So. I mean, it's not for. It doesn't. I mean, obviously, I mean, maybe they want to embarrass her, but it's also because it's impeaching. It's shit she lied about in court. So they. The district attorney said, you're talking about things that are totally irrelevant and immaterial. They're so far removed in time that they could have no probative value. The defense counsel said, I don't believe so. I think they're very probative. The state's trying to paint a case of a fight over a girl, and we're trying to show that she had other interests as well, your honor. And there wasn't any fight over this girl. So the court said, the judge says, well, I don't see where the sexual life of someone may or may not have occurred after this occurrence is related to. Has any probative value whatsoever. It's nothing but an attack and an assassination of her character is all it is. I Don't see where it's the basis of setting up anything as to credibility. I mean, it seems like it, yeah. You can't just lie about shit. Even if it's embarrassing, you have to say it.

[Jimmy Whisman]

It's under oath, right?

[James Petregallo]

I mean, absolutely. Yeah. Unless they changed it down there. She said, I think a person's life in that area is a very personal thing. And I'm going to rule that it's so prejudicial that it cannot contribute. That it cannot contribute nothing to the case. And I think it's a collateral thing that has no probative value. So the. Then they go into chambers and they talk about it, and the defense counsel says it's important because of the fact that here's a girl that just testified. She loves Steve Brown. She was good friends with Mike Muskelly. She loved Steve Brown so much. We're going to prove, your honor, that she had sexual intercourse with him long after Steve Brown disappeared with Mike Muskelly. Hey, everybody. Just gonna take a quick break from the show and tell you a little bit more about Chime. Life is full of extra fees. Boy, oh boy, they're everywhere. Everything you buy, there's fees. Ever buy a concert ticket or an airline ticket or anything like that? Fees, fees, fees, games, you name it. We're trying to make progress in life and we're trying to go forward. And then these fees hit you and you go backwards. You need Chime. Chime is a checking account that makes financial progress easier. You can move forward with this with features like no maintenance fees, fee, free overdraft up to $200, or getting paid up to two days early with direct deposit. Can't beat it. You can learn [e-mail] Smalltown Murder this Chime is great stuff. You always need a little help. Somebody's always coming up a little short every once in a while. It happens to people. Unexpected things come up. Not only fees that Chime won't charge you, but you never know. You blow a tire out, your car breaks down. You never know when you need a few extra bucks and you might needed early. Make progress toward a better financial future with Chime. Open your account in two [e-mail] smalltown murder that's chime.com smalltown murder Chime feels like progress. Banking services and debit card provided by the Bancorp NA or Stride Bank NA members. FDIC SpotMe eligibility requirements and overdraft limits apply. Booths are available to eligible Chime members enrolled in Spotme and are subject to to monthly Limits. Timing depends on submission of payment file fees. Apply it out of network ATMs. Hey, everybody, just gonna take a quick break from the show and tell you a little bit about life360. And I know this is Jimmy's favorite thing in the world.

[Jimmy Whisman]

I love it.

[James Petregallo]

Jimmy has. I mean, he's out there, his son is driving now. So, yeah, he goes through all the scenarios in his mind of where could he be and he doesn't have to do that and anymore. No, he just gets right on Life 360 and sees exactly what he's doing and what speed he's doing it at. As a matter of fact, it's great. Whether it's your spouse, your kids, your parents, even your friends. You love somebody, it means you're gonna worry about them a lot. We all do it. Life360 will address this anxiety with this location sharing app that puts the real time location of everyone you love right in the palm of your hand. And I'm telling you, I know you tell me all the time about how you're texting your son. He's not texting you back. You're calling. You're like, I'll see where he is right now. I've seen you do it 30 times. And then you'll text him. I see you're on this road and it makes you feel better. Get peace of mind in the palm of your hand with Life360. Visit life360.com or download the app today and use code Small Town murder to get 15% off. That's life360.com code small town murder.

[Jimmy Whisman]

And now back to the show.

[James Petregallo]

Hey, everybody, Just going to take a quick break from the show and tell you a little bit about Gold Belly. That's right. It's incredible. It's an unforgettable gift you can get. Hey, how about mom on Mother's Day? That's coming up. It's Gold Belly, everybody. This amazing site that we order from all the time and where you can get the most iconic famous foods from restaurants all across the U.S. this is great. We all move around the country and then we want the things we want from back home and it's not there or even from somewhere else that you just want to go to. And they'll ship it anywhere across the country for free in time for Mother's Day.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Unbelievable.

[James Petregallo]

Unbelievable. And there's so much good stuff on there, too. There's so much good stuff. I mean, everything from the New York bagels, that's what we got. Which is Excellent. Goldbelly will ship gift worthy cakes from Ina Garten and Martha Stewart Magnolia Bakeries, famous banana pudding, New York bagel brunch directly from the city, or even authentic deep dish Chicago pizza. If you're looking to make your Mother's Day perfect or you want to impress your friends and family with an epic meal, next time you host, go to goldbelly.com and get free shipping and 20% off your first order with promo code Smalltown Murder. That's goldbelly.com code Small Town Murder for free shipping and 20% off your 1st order.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Now back to the show.

[James Petregallo]

So you know, she's saying she was. Hated him after that she wasn't. So they said it keeps going back and forth. And the defense counsel says the purpose of this line of questioning, of this witnesses, now that we're here in chambers, they went in the judge's chambers, is to show the bias and prejudice on the part of this young girl in cooperating with law enforcement. Who we're going to show, you, Honor, served upon her father a deposition subpoena that was requested to be served, in fact issued by the clerk of the court on the same day the deposition was issued for us, for this young girl. He got served, she left town, we think, in a hurry. And the proof will show that she's given an inconsistent statement about who took her out of town. We know it does show that that's the purpose of the inquiry, is to show bias. So they ask her, they get Mike and they said, were you intimate with her? She with you? And Mike said, yes, sir, seem to be. They said, what do you mean by that? And he said, well, we had sex. And the DA objects. This is when Mike is testifying and the DA objects to that. Any talk, basically, from the minute the words I killed him came out of his mouth, anything that Tammy did or lied about is irrelevant. They said they don't care, they don't give a shit. And they object to that. They object to him saying they had sex after the fact, even though that's kind of important. Yeah, so they said if the court allows, the defense lawyer said that, you know, if the court allows this in front of the jury, that this young girl had sex with the defendant before this disappearance, after the disappearance. And she continually badgered him, harassing her, harassed him, caused herself to be a nuisance to him, picking on him, trying to. Trying to get him to say something or admit to things to her when she would suggest answers. Then it turned into a more coercive type affair. Where she would tell him she wasn't going to love him and this sort of thing if he didn't talk to her. And she would use this sex bribe, in a sense, against Mike Muskelly, repeatedly. And then she'd go out with him and then they'd have sex again. And then they'd start to work. She'd start to work on him again, and she'd get a little bit here or there. She's a great investigator, apparently. But she said they put this girl on the witness stand who appears to be like the Virgin Mary, who says she loves Steve and she's just friends with Mike, which is a lie. She's saying that I asked her point blank several times, did she have sex with Mike Muskelly before or after? She said, well, I was telling him I loved him, but I was just fooling him. And all this kind of testimony. So anyway, they basically decide that. They said, I'm going to sustain this, sustain the objection on the basis of the sex thing. Now, any relationship other than that, you can go ahead with. But if you're going to stay out of this sex business, everything I can find in the law and in the evidence in this case is purely a collateral issue. If it was a rape case, it'd be a different thing, but it's not. So they're not allowed to question Tammy about shit. Tammy goes up, says, this is what he told me. That's it. And then Mike's not even allowed to say, she blew me right afterwards. So that's, you know, whatever. So now regardless, her information was right. That's where they went.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Yeah, that's right. Yeah, but they're gonna say she knows what happened, so therefore he didn't do it.

[James Petregallo]

Yes, that. That's true. So they also, they try to say that maybe somebody dumped his body there. And the investigator said, I mean, they could have dumped his body there. It's possible. You know, we don't have any evidence around in the outside for a year and a half. So that goes into it. Now, the defense has a witness here named Tim Hopper who testifies that he saw Steve Brown at school the night of March 23rd around 7pm at the Future Farmers of America meeting. Oh, well, then why would the meeting have broken up and turned into a search party then? That doesn't make sense. So another student testified in rebuttal that Tim Hopper had told him he really didn't know if he saw Steve Brown that night. He thought he did. So Mike's testimony is. Tammy badgered me. I wanted A fucking banger. That's that. So the verdict comes in, deliberation lasts one hour, and he is found guilty of murder.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Yeah, because there was. Yeah, okay.

[James Petregallo]

Yeah. So sentencing comes around here and the judge says, you, young man, may fuck off. Life in prison.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Oh, my God.

[James Petregallo]

Of which you have to serve at least seven years before you're eligible for parole. Okay, so that's seven to life, essentially, is what it is.

[Jimmy Whisman]

That's a fascinating choice.

[James Petregallo]

Anywhere from seven to life.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Yeah.

[James Petregallo]

Based on you. I suppose so. Outside the court after this, Mike's dad is hugely pissed. He said, quote, help me, too.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Yeah.

[James Petregallo]

He said, so help me God. Mike had nothing to do with the disappearance of Steve Brown and it's my obligation to see that justice is done. He said that all of the. All the bones were found and said the gun was found sticking up from a small stream, its barrel thrust into the sand. Dad said it was a calling card. He said the wooden stock of the gun was rotten as though it had been lying in the grounds. He said that was somebody's calling card. That's somebody. Look for other cases that match up with that.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Oh, serial killer.

[James Petregallo]

Yeah. He's out of his mind. Mike's friends, 35 relatives and townspeople drove 200 miles to Jackson to present a petition with 1300 names on it asking the governor to intervene.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Yeah.

[James Petregallo]

He said, if nothing else, the truth has been presented, like all other days, dating back to day one. I've told the truth. That's what Wayne Misskeli, Mike's dad, says also, the kid who said he saw him at the meeting was there as well.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Sure.

[James Petregallo]

And, yeah, he said that I know what I saw. He said I was young, but I know what I saw. When you. When I see you sitting there, I see you. I know what I see. So there you go. And there's another. They have another person with a portfolio of affidavits and reports and newspaper clippings that say they will, quote, show the threat of the conspiracy through this thing. So we just. The Internet just makes it easier. But this is. People are always. Our brains are wired for this shit.

[Jimmy Whisman]

So they're all worried about.

[James Petregallo]

This is crazy.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Yeah.

[James Petregallo]

November 1985. He appeals this thing, okay? He appeals saying he only confessed to the girl after she threatened to withhold sexual favors. That's what the. The. Now they say the trial judge refused to allow the attorneys to adequately cross examine her. They called it. Not the. The prosecution called it nothing but an assassination of her character. So he appeals on a bunch of different grounds. Here. One is failure to prove the cause of death, which I think a gunshot wound in the back of the fucking head is pretty clear all the way through.

[Jimmy Whisman]

I mean, it's pretty obvious.

[James Petregallo]

Yeah, yeah. He also says exculpatory evidence or grant of immunity was improperly excluded. He says, I passed the lie detector and they told me if I passed it I wouldn't have to do this. That's a deal. And they say, well that's not a deal, cause it wasn't in writing. And number two, the guy says it was inconclusive. So no. Then they say they, they limited cross examination by defense counsel. The, the judges here say, we are of the opinion that the lower court unduly restricted cross examination and impeachment on the above matters. And that they were crucial on the issue of the confession or statement allegedly made by the appellant to Tammy. And they require that this be reversed and remanded for a new trial, 4 to 2 vote of the supreme Court there of whatever they get, that's what they do. So reversed. He'll be set free, by the way.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Oh, is that right?

[James Petregallo]

On bond. Yeah. So they said it to life or.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Just go on home?

[James Petregallo]

That's one or the other. He said he's eager to, quote, get used to being free.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Yeah.

[James Petregallo]

He said, you can't explain how it feels. Mike goes on, he says, it was the best feeling of my life. Yesterday was the best day of my life. He says he fucking. A few months. No, a year. A year and change. A year and change. He says he expects to be freed within two weeks. And he says he expected this to happen because he said, quote, I knew that. I knew it was flawed and I'm not even a lawyer, really.

[Jimmy Whisman]

We didn't know.

[James Petregallo]

That's shocking. So he maintains his innocence, said he plans to spend time at his parents house before entering Northwest community or Northwest Mississippi Junior College in Sentobia. He said he later plans to study law at the University of Mississippi.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Oh, he's about to be a lawyer, huh?

[James Petregallo]

He says, I want a little time to myself, to relax, to get used to being free. Though he said he worked in a garden in jail and read law books when he wasn't in his television equipped private cell. He did fine. He said, I imagine I'll always be criticized by a few people and ridiculed. I'm just gonna try to outlive it as best I can. So he's released on a $75,000 bond and the state goes, I don't know what the hell this guy's getting so comfortable for. We're absolutely retrying him for murder. So there's a couple of delays and people feel bad for him. He's been working for the Benton county supervisor, Billy Taylor, at a grocery store as a clerk. In the meantime, while he's waiting for.

[Jimmy Whisman]

His retailer, the county supervisor owns the grocery store.

[James Petregallo]

Yeah, it's. I mean, come on. He says this quote, he's a nice boy. I feel very sorry for Mrs. Brown, but I don't think he did it. You have to convince me. We had a trial. It was pretty convincing.

[Jimmy Whisman]

They're gonna do it again.

[James Petregallo]

So. June 87, retrial.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Yeah.

[James Petregallo]

This is moved, by the way. This is held in Benton county, outside of the main area here, so still shitloads of people here. Opening statements, they told him the same thing as the first trial. You know, they started seeing each other again, him and Nancy. And on May 18, there was a breakthrough when Mike told Nancy her last name is Nance now. That's why I called her Nancy. Tammy told Tammy Nance that he had shot him. He said. Then the defense said, there's no proof of any altercation between Steve Brown and Mike Muskelly. He said that Brown had a date with another girl just prior to his disappearance. And also attacked the credibility of Nancy or Nancy again, Tammy Nance. Calling the. Determining. Calling the task of determining whether to believe her or Mike. The juror's biggest jobs. So there's also testimony here. The victim, Steve's dad, talks about a creepy music teacher. Oh, yeah. He testifies that his son's music teacher once warned him, meaning Steve's father, that he would not return home. He said he's not coming back. And. Yeah, he said it was. So they taught. They looked into the music teacher big time and then cleared him. But when they were looking into him, this is a guy named Pete Doles. He said, apparently, that the private investigators and police searched this Pete Doles home. And he said, they asked the father, did he tell you that he would never see you would never see your son again? And he said yes. They also heard that his son and other Faulkner High school students used to visit this teacher's home to drink beer and watch dirty movies. He's fucking grooming them.

[Jimmy Whisman]

I don't like that at all.

[James Petregallo]

He's fucking grooming them is what he's doing. That's grooming. Giving teenagers beer and give. Porn is grooming.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Yeah, that's what Gacy did.

[James Petregallo]

Yes, exactly. Exactly. Which would be awesome. It'd be cool if another 17 year old had beer and porn.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Not a 45 year old man.

[James Petregallo]

Some 45 year old man. And why would the last thing I want to do is drink beer and watch porn with teenagers. That's the worst thing I've ever heard in my life. Sounds terrible.

[Jimmy Whisman]

I didn't want to drink beer with him, man.

[James Petregallo]

This testimony was not allowed in the first trial, by the way.

[Jimmy Whisman]

No, because he threw through his own trial.

[James Petregallo]

Yeah, no shit. He's got his own problems. He left town. He ran away. That guy.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Good.

[James Petregallo]

From this. So after about, I think it's two hours, they have a lunch break and they come back from lunch break saying, no more trial, calling it off. It's a plea deal. It's all over.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Is that right?

[James Petregallo]

Yep. We're getting a plea going. Absolutely.

[Jimmy Whisman]

His lawyer did not like the case they have against him.

[James Petregallo]

I think the prosecution didn't like it because they're bringing up creepy music teachers who are grooming kids. And now, now they can really grill Nance. Tammy Nance on cross examination too. They can fucking. They can ask her anything they want now. So he is going to plead guilty to manslaughter. Really way less than premeditated murder, which this obviously was. So his lawyer said that he did it because Mike was calling. He was calling the whole situation an oppressed hell. So he just wanted to get it over with. So the judge announced the guilty plea to manslaughter in the heat of passion.

[Jimmy Whisman]

What the hell was the passion?

[James Petregallo]

Absolutely. He planned it. This is diabolical. This is fucking horrible. That is crazy, man. Wow. The defense lawyer said he told us he had lived under this for six years. He said it was something of an oppressed hell. There was never a day where he could get away from it. So he wanted it over with. Some people are mad about this. They're not mad because.

[Jimmy Whisman]

No, I'd be mad at the plea.

[James Petregallo]

No, no, that's not what they're mad at. There's a lady in the newspaper here who's very mad that she didn't get to hear all this sex talk. That's what she came for. She said she wanted to hear about 16 year olds fingering each other and didn't get to hear I brought a.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Rabbit to the courthouse for the dude.

[James Petregallo]

I got my rose in my purse. They said I brought it through security. It's fine. This is a lady named Mrs. Magaha.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Who said slang term for a pussy.

[James Petregallo]

It does. This is my miss Magaha right here.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Fuck you in the magaha.

[James Petregallo]

I'll give you the old magaha. So she said she's second guessing her decision to drive more than 60 miles on her only day off as a waitress to see this.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Wow.

[James Petregallo]

This is 50 Shades of Crime. It was a real life novel. I was gonna say. It's a real life romance novel. That's what she was. She's like, I'm gonna see kids talking about fucking each other, then go home and diddle myself in the tub. That sounds right.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Some real hot Romeo and Juliet shit.

[James Petregallo]

She said. I had really hoped I would come down here. And the boy didn't do it. Justice would prevail. It just wasn't exciting. Courtroom drama. Many said that they expected spicy testimony, not a guilty plea. That's what they were pissed about. I thought we were getting some sex talk. There's not a porn shop in this town. Someone needs to get these people VHS tapes or something because this is crazy.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Get on out on i15. I'll bet you there's one out there somewhere.

[James Petregallo]

No shit. So they sentence him to you, sir. They fuck off again. 15 years in jail in prison with 5 years suspended. So 10 years now.

[Jimmy Whisman]

This is unbelievable.

[James Petregallo]

They said, why did they. Why did you accept a plea to the. You know, to everybody? And they said, basically, Mike Muskelly's team said besides wanting the legal case to end, they also recognized that it was a close call and he didn't want to be convicted of murder with a mandatory sentence of life. So the maximum penalty for manslaughter is 20 years. So they said it's much better odds. And they said that even though he's been sentenced and everything, he'll remain free on a bond for 30 days to, quote, take care of personal business. What are you talking about? What fucking 18 year old kid has personal business? He's got to put his companies in escrow. What are you talking about? I don't understand what's happening right now.

[Jimmy Whisman]

There's an order before I do my time.

[James Petregallo]

What the fuck? And when do we care if a murderer's affairs are in order? That's your problem. His father, despite him saying in court he did it, said he still is unconvinced that his son did it.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Unbelievable.

[James Petregallo]

He said instead, he suspected his son pleaded guilty to avoid a possible life sentence. He said, at this point, I can't say whether he did it or not, he said. But I never believed it. Now the Brown family, they're not upset. They're happy that it's over. Yeah. The dad says the family feels good that we can go home and know it's over. It's been a long time since March 23, 1981, which. Yeah. And they also expressed nice people, the Browns. They even expressed sympathy for the Muskelly family and said that we just wanted the fellow to own up to what he had done. We didn't want to torture the family. We just want to know what happened to our boy, which is. They're really nice people. So they said, well, how much time is he gonna serve here? Yeah.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Cause if he's only got 10, if.

[James Petregallo]

You get out, seven for life.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Yeah.

[James Petregallo]

Yeah. So. Well, he already did two years and 10 months in the Benton County Jail awaiting his appeal there. So the District Attorney, Larry Little, says he expects Muskelly to serve a reasonable period in prison, even though he'll be eligible for parole within weeks. Within weeks. He said, we have a pretty good idea that he'll be in the Department of Corrections for at least a while, which is a very technical term. That's what I want to hear from my elected officials. At least a while. He'll be there. I don't know. Wow. He said he's not about to walk in one door and out the other. He said, however, he doesn't know how much time he's going to serve. Now, the defense attorney said he told Mike not to expect a quick release from prison. He said, I told him he was eligible, but that meant nothing. I didn't promise him that he would get out at any time. He said that his client may have already. May already be eligible for parole. He said, I do expect him to have to serve time in the Department of Corrections somewhere, not just a county jail. So the state law requires parole officials at the time, 1987, to consider a parole for prisoners who've served one fourth of which would be two years, six months of a 10 year sentence. He's already done two years, 10 months. So he's already up for 10 year parole.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Yeah.

[James Petregallo]

So they said that they have to give him a parole hearing, like, asap. He's basically gonna get there, put his shit down on his bunk, and go right to the parole hearing.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Let's go talk about it. Yeah.

[James Petregallo]

So July 19, 1987, he finally begins serving a sentence. Okay, finally. How long will he serve? Well, October 1988, he's out paroled. So he did. They gave him a year. And anyway. Anyway, you know what? He get a total of less than four years in prison, though, for premeditated first degree murder is pretty wild.

[Jimmy Whisman]

And he only caved because he likes blowchops.

[James Petregallo]

Yeah. He was like, all right, fine. If there was another girl in this town who would put out none of this, he wouldn't have confessed to any of this and it wouldn't happen. So the movie comes out then, January of 1989. There is a CBS TV movie about this starring Christian Slater. Oh, there he is as Mike. He's the murderer. Yep. It's called Desperate for Love, Desperate for Blowjobs, Desperate for Orel it should be called. It's based on a true story and they take a lot of liberties here. The plot is Alex Cutler in Cliff Petrie. Are 17 year old teens have been close friends since they were young. Alex is the most popular guy in school with a promising future while Cliff is an introverted teen who's never had a girlfriend. Not true. Mike was not like that. Lily Becker, an attractive cheerleader who's very popular despite the fact that she's known for being promiscuous, has been dating Alex for a while, is planning to marry him after graduation. I still like her. She's a whore, but I still like her, I tell you what. Alex's father, however, feels that he should go to university and points out to him that Lily comes from a different environment. Moreover, he and Lily's father, the town's notorious low life hunter, are sworn enemies. Again, that's not it. They also move it to Georgia. It's a small town in Georgia, not Mississippi, they said. Yeah, so anyway, they sentenced to jail for eight years, released on parole after four. That's the whole movie. It's just a lot of little. So it has Christian Slater, Tammy Lauren as Lily, Brian Bloom as Alex, Veronica Cartwright, Scott Pollard and Amy O'Neill. I don't know. The family in the newspaper the next day says it's inaccurate, I'm sure. Yeah. One guy, an attorney. Oh, this is the defense attorney said, I thought they took a lot of literary license with it. It's a fucking TV movie. Yeah, Jesus Christ. They said that. It's interesting here. The movie also wrongly depicted the father, they say Thomas Glisson, Tammy's father, as a drunk who was mean to his wife. So they said he wasn't like that and they said he was mean to his wife. Wasn't mean, it was. I like to drink once in a while. They said this is Tammy's sister or. Yeah, Tammy's sister, Tommy. T O M M I E Tommy said that I didn't like it because it made my family look like trash. It made us look like poor hillbillies. And we are middle class hillbillies.

[Jimmy Whisman]

At least we're upper, we're lower. Middle, upper, upper, lower. We're not low.

[James Petregallo]

We ain't low. So there you go. That, everybody is this movie. Christian Slater stars as this murderer. It's fucking crazy. This is a crazy goddamn story.

[Jimmy Whisman]

I can't believe it. He almost got away. He may as well have gotten away with it.

[James Petregallo]

He pretty much got away with it. He got blowjobs and barely any jail time. He's fine. And Christian Slater played him in a movie. He's great.

[Jimmy Whisman]

It's pretty sweet.

[James Petregallo]

Yeah, he fucking. Yeah. Crime paid for this kid. It's crazy.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Holy shit.

[James Petregallo]

So anyway, there you go. If you enjoy this story, please, please, please. By the way, we weren't calling Tammy a whore. It's perfectly fine to.

[Jimmy Whisman]

I didn't do it.

[James Petregallo]

No, I don't care at all. Yeah.

[Jimmy Whisman]

Jesus.

[James Petregallo]

But I have to say, people will go, hey, you guys, no, no, not us, the prosecution, the defense. Nothing. We're just. We're just arbitrators on the side. We know nothing. So if you like this story, please get on whatever app you're on, give us five stars, head over to shutupandgivemerder.com, get all your information, all your tickets to live shows. We have the Virtual Live Show 4 19, April 19th, our 420 virtual live show. It's available for two weeks after that to buy, watch, do whatever you want with. Also May 8 to May 17 in Chicago at the Riviera. Get those tickets for an actual in person show. Do that right now. Shut upandgivemerder.com also follow us on social media at Smalltown murder on Instagram, Small town pod on Facebook. Definitely get your patreon on patreon.com crimeinsports it's where you get everything. $5 a month or above will get you hundreds of bonus episodes you've never heard before. To binge immediately and then new ones every other week. One crime and sports. One small town murder. This week. Crime and sports fraternity hazing throughout the years. Ben Franklin's involved in one of those. You want to hear that? Then I'm not even kidding. Then. Small town murder. We're gonna talk about the Karen Reed retrial lady in Boston who allegedly killed her cop boyfriend and blames the police force for framing her. Or they did it. We'll talk all about that. That is patreon.com crimeandsports and you get a shout out at the end of the regular show. Keep hanging out with us. Follow us on social media. Like we said, if you wanna follow us on social media shut up and givemeimurder.com has drop down menus take you anywhere you want to go. Thank you so much everybody and until next week week it's been our pleasure. If you like small town murder you can listen early and ad free now by joining Wondery plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen early and ad free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short [e-mail] survey in the early hours of December 4, 2024, CEO Brian Thompson stepped out onto the streets of Midtown Manhattan. This assailant pulls out a weapon and starts firing at him. We're talking about the CEO of the biggest private health insurance corporation in the world. World and the suspect he has been identified as Luigi Nicholas Mangioni became one of the most divisive figures in modern criminal history. I was targeted, premeditated. Admit to so terror. I'm Jesse Weber, host of Luigi produced by Law and Crime and Twist. This is more than a true crime investigation. We explore a uniquely American moment that could change the country forever. He's awoken the people to a true ignorance issue. Finally, maybe this would lead rich and powerful people to acknowledge the barbaric nature of our healthcare system. Listen to Law and Crime's Luigi exclusively on Wondery Plus. You can join Wondery plus on the Wondery app, Spotify or Apple Podcasts.