A Mystery Of Stupidity - Pound, Virginia

Summary

Small Town Murder – "A Mystery of Stupidity – Pound, Virginia"

Podcast: Small Town Murder
Hosts: James Pietragallo, Jimmie Whisman
Air Date: April 3, 2026
Summary by [Expert Summarizer]

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Episode Overview

This episode of Small Town Murder takes listeners to Pound, Virginia—a remote Appalachian coal town teetering on the edge of nonexistence—and explores the mysterious, scandal-laden 1981 murder of local resident Judy Cantrell. Hosts James and Jimmie deliver their signature combination of thorough research and comedic banter as they break down small-town quirks, a bizarre homicide, and the peculiar cast of characters at its center. The case is a convoluted web of infidelity, inept crimes, and generations-old family entanglements, all set against a “ten pounds of murder in a two-pound bag” backdrop.

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Key Discussion Points & Story Breakdown

1. Introducing Pound, Virginia (04:24–12:54)

• Location & Vibe: Far in western Virginia, near the Kentucky border; rural and isolated.
  • “There is nothing nearby... the nearest city is Pikeville, Kentucky. That's really the closest, which is not a metropolis by the way.” (04:57, James)
• Demographics: Population of only 828, once a thriving coal town now in economic collapse.
• Town Reputation and Nicknames: “The Pound,” lean-ins to innuendo, banned dancing since 1981 (“Footloose situation”).
• Community Reviews: Two extremes: affectionate lifers and meth-plagued gloom.
  • “Everyone is on meth and in and out of jail. Perfect. Nice.” (10:54, James reading a 1-star review)
• Quirky Local Events: Storytelling festival with odd tales, bans on dancing, Red Fox festival, and murals about Bigfoot.
• Standout Quote:
  • “It is illegal to dance in this town. If you just hear music and feel joy, you're not allowed to have movement to it at all unless you had a permit and you go to city hall and ask for it.” (08:56, James)

2. The Cantrell Family and Small-Town Entanglements (13:06–17:16)

• The Main Players:
  • Jeff Cantrell (“William Jeffrey ‘Jeff’ Cantrell”): 30, married since ’71, coal mine engineer, prolific adulterer.
  • Judy Cantrell (née Cantrell): Married to Jeff, both share surname from birth, raising questions of familial overlap.
  • Family Web: Homes clustered together; father Bill Cantrell lives next door; brother-in-law two doors down.
  • “Cantrell in a town of less than a thousand... if people of the same last name are getting married, you assume they're related, correct?” (14:02, James)
  • “Cantrells marrying Cantrells, that's tight knit, I would say.” (17:16, James)

3. Marriage, Cheating, and Coal Country Drama (17:19–21:31)

• Explicit Infidelity: Jeff is openly cheating with at least four women, sharing nude photos including with his wife's brother.
  • “He's showing nude photos of the woman he's banging to everyone who will look at it, including his wife's brother, which is crazy.” (20:38, James)
  • Judy leaves notes in Jeff’s lunchbox professing affection—he reads them aloud to co-workers.
• Culture of Oversharing:
  • “If they were my notes, they'd be personal is what this guy said. But he was passing it all around.” (19:52, James)

4. The Night of the Crime – December 8, 1981 (21:31–26:53)

• Judy Returns Home From Karate: Around 9 PM. Two loud booms heard by neighbors.
• Jeff’s “Break-in” Story: He screams for help, says there was a break-in and Judy’s been shot.
  • “Someone's broken in and he needs help... they've shot Judy. They've shot Judy.” (23:24, James)
• Scene Details:
  • Judy found shot dead on front steps, karate bag and keys at her feet, shotgun belonging to Jeff nearby.
  • Jeff hyperventilating, minor injuries only.
  • House ransacked in a suspicious manner (“fuck you” written in dust on the TV, valuables left behind).
  • Tracking dog finds scent going only to property line; some “stolen goods” scattered in a nearby field.
  • “Who steals a clock? I'm breaking and steal their clock. Steal their clock?” (34:31, James)

5. The Investigation and a Tale Full of Holes (33:16–46:03)

• Jeff’s Statement (31 Dec 1981):
  • Three attackers, one fat man “sat on him” for hours, tied up with his own long-johns, claims he struggled free only after the attack.
  • “Their way of subduing the hostage was the other two guys ransacked the house while the fat one sits on him.” (43:29, James)
  • No sign of forced entry or escape; witnesses report no unknown vehicles.
• Physical Evidence:
  • All injuries to Jeff are superficial.
  • “They bring in a tracking dog... the dog found a scent leading from the back of the house to a boundary fence... but the scent ended there.” (35:04, James)

6. Twists, Phone Calls, and the Case Unravels (48:09–54:00)

• Mystery Caller:
  • Wise County Police receive a call from a “man who was involved”—identified by a local officer as sounding like Jeff.
  • Lead to evidence hidden at hardware store: pistol, Judy’s nightgown and underwear, old photos. No fingerprints.
• Handwriting Clue:
  • The letter “K” on a TV in the Cantrell’s house matches Jeff’s unusual handwriting style.
• Community Theories & Family Alibis:
  • Jeff’s parents attempted to provide an alibi.
  • Defense highlights uninvestigated vehicles and rumored crime sprees, but with little solid evidence.

7. The Courtroom Circus: Trials, Appeals, and Scandal (53:06–79:14)

• Three Trials, Three Outcomes:
  • First Trial: Hung jury (60:02)
    • “That story makes sense. And the only guy on site left. But a fat guy sat on him, Jimmy.” (60:13)
  • Second Trial (1983): Guilty – Life plus one year (68:51)
  • Appeal: Conviction thrown out due to prosecutorial misconduct. Family hired a private attorney (McAfee) as “special prosecutor,” leading to a conflict of interest.
    • “He told the jury openly that he was employed by Judy's parents to assist the Commonwealth.” (69:48, James)
    • Virginia Supreme Court: “overwhelming probability of conflict of interest.” (70:33)
  • Third Trial:
    • Takes place in another county to avoid local bias.
    • New evidence: Hidden love letters from Judy’s own secret boyfriend (“your second man”), possibly hinting she was also unfaithful.
    • “She's out there cheating too. I'd look at that karate instructor first and foremost. Because they're flexible, you know what I mean?” (72:40, James)
    • Jury Convicts Again: But sentence is only 23 years (22 for murder, 1 for gun). (78:21)

8. Aftermath and Unresolved Questions (79:14–82:30)

• Town’s Reputation: The murder and trials grip the community—yet most still believe Jeff’s guilt despite legal twists and oddities.
  • “He must be guilty. So the mayor said that was just one unfortunate thing. We very seldom have break-ins or robberies... the biggest crime rate around here is drunks.” (79:50, James)
• Lack of Closure:
  • No alternate suspects seriously pursued.
  • Judy buried in Flat Gap, Virginia (“Is there any place that doesn’t sound sexual, doesn’t sound gross? No. That’s why they’re so horny though.” (82:21, James))
• Legacy:
  • Jeff likely released within a decade of third conviction, then disappears from public record.

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Notable Quotes & Moments

| Timestamp | Speaker | Quote / Moment | |-----------|----------|------------------------------------------------| | 08:56 | James | “It is illegal to dance in this town. If you just hear music and feel joy, you're not allowed to have movement... unless you had a permit.” | | 19:40 | James | “Smith said that Cantrell seemed proud of the notes. He said, if they were my notes, they'd be personal... But he was passing it all around.” | | 23:24 | James | “He’s in a tizzy. Basically he says someone's broken in and he needs help... they've shot Judy.” | | 43:29 | James | “…this was their way of subduing the hostage, was the other two guys ransacked the house while the fat one sits on him.” | | 69:48 | James | “He told the jury openly that he was employed by Judy's parents to assist the Commonwealth… with the explicit goal, in Judy's father's own words, of getting Jeff Cantrell convicted.” | | 72:40 | James | “She's out there cheating too. I'd look at that karate instructor first and foremost. Because they're flexible, you know what I mean?” | | 74:29 | James | “This letter refers to keeping joint diaries about their affair. Another refers to items marked in a Hustler magazine to give them something to look forward to.” | | 79:50 | James | “He must be guilty. So the mayor said that was just one unfortunate thing. We very seldom have any break ins or robberies. The biggest crime rate around here is drunks.” |

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• 04:24 — Introduction to Pound, Virginia
• 13:06 — Entering the Cantrell Family and Marital Webs
• 17:19 — Cheating and Small-Town Sexual Intrigue
• 21:31 — Murder Night: The Event & Initial Cover Story
• 33:16 — Crime Scene Investigation & Jeff’s Surreal Testimony
• 48:09 — Mystery Caller & Hardware Store Evidence
• 53:06 — Trials, Teetering Justice, and Legal Mayhem
• 72:26 — Letters Reveal Judy’s Secret Affair
• 79:14 — Verdict, Aftermath, and Community Fallout

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Tone & Style

James and Jimmie maintain a darkly comedic, irreverent banter throughout, subverting true crime tropes and mining both the town and the case for humor, sometimes veering into the absurd:

• Repeated innuendo around “Pound Town” and local place names.
• Ongoing disbelief at the “fat guy sat on me” defense.
• Satirical jabs at the local justice system: “overwhelming probability of conflict of interest.”
• Homespun observations of rural America’s quirks, e.g., prioritizing watching Jeopardy while someone gets shot next door.

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Conclusion: Why Listen?

This episode is a masterclass in mixing suspense, true-crime storytelling, and comic sensibility. Even as the case’s outcome remains morally and factually murky, the hosts cut through the gloom with astute observations, brutal punchlines, and an unflinching eye for small-town weirdness. The result: vigorous entertainment and insight for the crime-obsessed and comedy fans alike—no dancing permit required.

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For more:

• Small Town Murder releases new episodes every Thursday
• Patreon: Patreon.com/CrimeInSports
• Tickets, merchandise, and more: ShutUpAndGiveMeMurder.com

Transcript

[A]

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[A]

Hello everybody and welcome back to Small Town Murder Express. Yay.

[B]

And choo choo.

[A]

Oh yay indeed, Jimmy. Yay indeed. My name is James Petregallo. I'm here with my co host.

[B]

I'm Jimmy Whisman.

[A]

Thank you so much for joining us today on another crazy edition of Small Town Murder Express. Ten pounds of murder in a two pound bag, as we like to put it. Wild crazy stories. We're fitting it in there for you. Wild one as usual this week. Before we get to that, head over to shut upandgivememurder.com oh, why, James, tickets for live shows. Well, merchandise too, but tickets for live shows are going to be what you want. Our next show with tickets available is May 2nd in Denver. That's going to be awesome. Can't wait for that. Salt Lake City sold out the night before and then Buffalo sold out on May 29th. But May 30th, Royal Oak, Michigan, Detroit area. Get out there, get your tickets. And then we are in September, we take the summer off and then September in Milwaukee and Minneapolis on the 18th and 19th. And then we're Dallas, San Jose, Sacramento, Terrytown, Boston. Get in there, get your tickets. ShutUpAndGiveMerder.com is where you get all of those and more definitely. Then get yourself Patreon as well.

[B]

Please do.

[A]

Don't dilly dally. Don't hold yourself back. Don't hold yourself down, really, is what we're trying to say here. Patreon.com CrimeInSports is where you get all the bonus material. Anybody $5 a month or above and that's not going up. People have asked us that before. We're like, Nope, it's been five bucks since 2016, it's going to stay five bucks even though we keep adding more content.

[B]

Costco pricing of Patreon.

[A]

That's right. This is our hot dog. So buy our hot dog. Everybody do that. You get new episodes. You get a whole huge back catalog of hundreds of bonus episodes you've never heard before. As soon as you subscribe, then you get new episodes every other week. One crime in sports, one small town murder, and you get how much, Jimmy, do they.

[B]

Every inch of this hot dog.

[A]

Every damn bit of this hot. Okay, the inch part made it a little weird, but that's fine. For crime and sports this week we're gonna do old timey articles and ads and those are hilarious deaths and murders and weird stuff. Then for small town murder, we are gonna do the Corey Richens case, which just happened in Utah. A woman who killed her husband and then wrote a book about grief for her children. That's only the tip of the iceberg, man. That is the weirdest. I watched the entire trial. Patreon.

[B]

Com teach your kids how to grieve when you murder their dad.

[A]

That's wild. So now she's even getting sued for his likeness that she used and shit, it's wild. Patreon.com CrimeInSports Just like the name of our other show that you should also listen to. Oh, yeah. So there you go. Do that. And also you get everything. We put out ad free. And Jimmy will mispronounce your name trying to give you a shout out at the end of the regular show as well. So you can't beat it. That said, I think it's time, everybody. Oh, let's get into this. I think it's time to sit back. What do you say here? Let's all clear the lungs, deep breaths, arms to the sky, and let's all shout, shout out and give me murder. Let's do this, everybody. Okay, let's go on a trip, shall we?

[B]

We've got it.

[A]

All right, here we go. With my swollen dentist face and everything else. We're coming at it. Man, that's tough. My tongue is cut. That's not nice. But that's all right. We're gonna do this. We're going to pound Virginia. Pound town is where we're going. Jimmy, everybody, it's time to go to pound town. Who's coming?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Yeah. Here we go.

[B]

Where? It's for lovers.

[A]

Oh, Virginia Pound town is certainly for lovers. That we know. This is in the far western Virginia panhandle over there. I mean, it's near the Kentucky border. This is a very rural area. I'm talking. There is nothing nearby like you go for. Nearest city. The nearest place is Pikeville, Kentucky. That's really the closest, which is not a metropolis by the way.

[B]

Never heard of it.

[A]

We're 40 minutes from Pikeville, 4 hours and 20 minutes to Lynchburg, Virginia. Our last Virginia episode, episode 649, which was murder for My Love, which was pretty self explanatory by the title. What goes on there? This is in Wise county, area code 276. Population of this town 828. So nothing. Pretty damn small.

[B]

Again, nothing.

[A]

And it's not a small place outside of a big place. It's just a small place in the mountains. It's in the Appalachians. This is some serious rural stuff here. Median household income here. Now rest of the country the average is $69,000. Here it's 26,417 household income.

[B]

This is less than two, a little over two grand a month. That's nothing.

[A]

This is an old coal town that has collapsed basically financially. Like if you've seen American Hollow, the documentary that we did a patreon about, it's very. A similar place. Cause that was Kentucky. So it's right there. Median home cost here also pretty low, $86,000, which is.

[B]

That's still pretty high for what you're making.

[A]

For what you're making. Yeah. So there's also the Pound river.

[B]

The.

[A]

There's the Virginia Pound, which was I believe a monetary unit. And there's also a woman named Virginia Pound. Don't confuse them. She was an actress who went by Lorna Gray. Virginia Pound. Yeah, that wasn't her stage name. Little bit of history of this town. The Pound area was explored by a guy named Christopher Gist in 1751. It's said to be the oldest settlement in Wise County. Oh, there's not many people in Wise county either. The nickname of this place is the Pound. The Pound. They say stop. They lean into it too. Yeah, everything is the town of Pound, which I know. What else are you gonna call it? It's the town of Pound, but it sounds silly when you put it like that.

[B]

It does.

[A]

Really Sounds like someone's wrapping it or something. It's weird. So they say that might be a family name or from a pounding mill built in 1815. A pounding mill? The county's first post office came there in 1848. So they'd been there a hundred years before they got a post office. And then it wasn't incorporated until 1950. So it took another hundred years after

[B]

they got a post office.

[A]

It was the last town in Wise county to incorporate. Yeah, it's a big coal town. They had a bunch of tough, rugged bars that catered to coal miners only across the border in Kentucky. Then the mining went down and everything kind of collapsed. And it's not great. In the 90s and 2000s here there's a lot of problems in terms of the political setup and the tax base and things like that. So the Virginia General assembly passed a law that would revoke the town's charter unless improvements were made. Your town is such a shithole.

[B]

We're going to condemn your town.

[A]

You can't be a town anymore. We're taking it apart.

[B]

You're not allowed to be a part of this.

[A]

No. Like a gang that's like, you know, ripped a patch off somebody's jacket and was like, no, you're not allowed anymore.

[B]

Cut a tattoo off a blood's chest.

[A]

Yeah. The town had closed its police department, failed to pass a budget and had its wastewater facility taken away by the county.

[B]

They were just broke.

[A]

Yeah. After the coal mining went away. I mean, it's broke. So a law was passed specifically to potentially dissolve the town. But it's. The charter was restored in 2023, so they must have fix it. This town, by the way, banned dancing without a permit since 1981. It is illegal to dance in this town. If you just hear music and feel joy, you're not allowed to have movement to it at all unless you had a permit and you go to city hall and ask for it.

[B]

Somebody was offended by something. Right?

[A]

Yeah. This is the town Footloose is based on, essentially. This is wild.

[B]

That's amazing.

[A]

No gyrating. We ain't no gyrating in our streets. Couple reviews of this town here. Okay. We've never been here.

[B]

Maybe.

[A]

It's wonderful. Here's five stars pound Virginia is a small town with some financial issues. I've heard it almost lost its right to be a town. The buildings are starting to crumble. This is a 5 star review, by the way. Just so.

[B]

What a crazy sentence.

[A]

Five stars. Yeah. And the town doesn't get too much business. However, recently there's been a change. The town began working on tearing down the old buildings and new shops started opening up. I would love to see the town spend the new income from the businesses on repaving roads.

[B]

Holy.

[A]

Yeah, here's five.

[B]

How many roads do they have?

[A]

With 800 people, it can't be many that are paved to begin with. I would think right here's five stars. Lived here all my life. I wouldn't want to live anywhere else. Sure, we have to leave town for most things, but most of us work in other towns. We can get what we need before coming home. So basically there's nothing here. But that's all right. We all have to work hard.

[B]

How many times have you left work and gotten home and somebody been like, we're out of tv. Well, now I gotta go back.

[A]

I gotta go back to another town. Cause I didn't know here's one star. There's nothing to do here. We have to travel out to Pikeville, Kentucky, or Wise, Virginia to do all of our errands and for work. It's a very small town in the middle of nowhere. Yeah. Finally, one star. I've lived here basically my whole life. Everyone is on meth and in and out of jail. Perfect. Nice. There's literally not a single thing to do. The economy's so bad that they shut down our high school.

[B]

How do you shut down.

[A]

Sorry, kids, I don't know. What do you do? Go somewhere else.

[B]

We can't afford no learning.

[A]

Nope. No learning around here. Book learning is expensive. This is a really sad excuse for a town. The final word there things to do in this town. Search old mines for corpses. That's something you could do that. There's also look for a way out. Yeah. Try to tunnel your way out of here. There's also the Red Fox storytelling festival.

[B]

Oh, I know who that is.

[A]

Yeah. No, it's not.

[B]

I don't think it's him.

[A]

Not that one. 1D 1X. Red Fox. Not Mr. Red Fox. So they do a storytelling thing where they. Everybody comes in and they tell children's stories. How the rabbit lost its tail. Fairy Diddle. Which sounds horrible. That sounds horrible.

[B]

I don't like any of this already.

[A]

That sounds like you're gonna need a lot of therapy after Fairydiddle. Layla's Blue Ribbon. Then there's local stories around the red oak tree. Murder in the pound, which is what we're gonna be doing today.

[B]

Hey.

[A]

And stories of Bigfoot. That's literature around here. Bigfoot stories. Come tell about Bigfoot. Then they have other things lost its stake. They have a documentary called justice in the Coal Fields about a strike in 1988. Fast food women, A documentary about workers in the fast food industry.

[B]

That sounds like a porno.

[A]

That sounds like Fast Food Women. That sounds like you're getting a shake with that. I think music. They have bands. Strawberry Jam will be there.

[B]

Yeah, band name.

[A]

It's not bad. And Madison Denhard, that's a person. That's another porn name. Now that said, let's talk about some murder here. Wow, what a place. This is a wild place that we're. Everybody understand where we're settling into here.

[B]

Tons of sexual connotation and they can't afford it.

[A]

And they're not allowed to dance either. That's why they're having so much sex. They're not even allowed to dance. They're like, I need to move close to another human.

[B]

Throw these hips one way or another.

[A]

Oh. So let's go back in time here to the year they passed the no dancing ordinance. A dark year for pound 1981. Here. Let's first talk about William Jeffrey Cantrell. His name goes by Jeff now. Cantrell. C A N T R E L L seems to be a very popular name around these parts as we'll get to here.

[B]

They happen to all be related, James.

[A]

Well, I hope not, based on this relationship we're gonna talk about now. He's 30 years old in 1981. He's born and bred in Wise County. I mean, he's a Wise county boy. He marries in, what is it, 1971. He gets married, okay, to at the time, I believe, about an 18 year old young lady named Judy K. Cantrell. Now, I don't say her name is Judy K. Cantrell because she took his name. Her name to begin with was Cantrell.

[B]

That makes it easy.

[A]

So Cantrell in a town of less than a thousand, if people of the same last name are getting married, you assume they're related, correct?

[B]

They've gotta be.

[A]

And it's not Smith or Jones, it's fucking Cantrell. There has to be some distant, at least a cousin, some distant relation here, I would imagine. Oh, they're related at the very least.

[B]

I don't even think we're out on a limb to say that.

[A]

No, I think, I think we're in a very strong branch of the family tree here. I'm not sure, but I couldn't find any information about whether they're related or not. But their names are Cantrell and they're both from this area, so take your pick. I don't know. Her parents are Evelyn and Ezra Cantrell, which is crazy. So by 81 they live in a house in Wise county, kind of a. We'll talk about off of a road. Named for her uncle, by the way, and maybe his uncle too. We don't know. We're not plotting there. Possibly they have a five year old son who was born in 76, so it's 81. They've been married for nine years. Jeff is an engineer for Bethlehem Steel Company, coal mine number 26 in Shelby, Kentucky. Okay, so that's what he does, he's a coal guy. So this house here sits directly above the Orbee Cantrell highway. Orbee Cantrell is her uncle and he was a member of the Virginia House of delegates for 30 years. So he's like a powerful politician, especially in an area like this. That guy is king, you know what I mean? They're naming highways.

[B]

When you got somebody in your family that's that known around here, you should be able to know if you're related or not, right?

[A]

I think they know whether they're related to each other now. They have some neighbors around them and some family as well.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Okay. Right next door is Bill Cantrell. That's you're gonna go, well, who's he related to? He's related to Jeff. That's Jeff's father.

[B]

I was gonna say that's his first name too. So is Jeff a junior maybe?

[A]

No, this is Bill is his dad.

[B]

Right. Jeff's first name is William.

[A]

William, yeah. There's no junior on him though, so I don't know. Yeah, he could be a William. They're both William obviously, but I don't think there's a junior. Now he lives next door. Bill Cantrell. So that's Jeff's dad and who knows, possibly Judy's uncle. We don't know, or aunt or we have no idea. So they all live around here. His brother in law and sister live like two doors down in the holler or whatever the hell's going on here. So it's real. Everybody kind of lives in a little compound area. Oh boy, it's strange here. They're all in each other's shit all the time. They yell from across the yard at each other and shit. This is some back and forth going on. Tight knit. Yeah, Cantrells marrying Cantrells, that's tight knit, I would say. No, two doors down is the brother in law. Mac Mullins is his name. Mac is his first name. Now how's Judy and Jeff's marriage going? I mean, besides the fact that they share a last name, you think they would share everything, but you never know.

[B]

Is it cantankerous?

[A]

It's not going well. The main reason is because Jeff is sleeping with at least four women at this point. And some women Come in and out. But he's always got a little rotating harem of ladies that he cheats with.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

Yeah. One affair with a married woman had been going on for about a year up until this point. Now he has a ton of nude pictures of this chick. Now this is before. This is before it's on your phone. You have to ask for it.

[B]

This is 81 James.

[A]

You have to get a camera. If it's not a Polaroid, you have to take it somewhere so someone can develop it and some 18 year old kid can whack off to your pictures. That's what you got going on at this point.

[B]

Remember summer school?

[A]

I do, yeah, of course. So not only did he have nude photographs, he showed them to everybody. What he shows, he shows these nude. You remember that? You know how I'm married and I'm married banging a married lady? Right. Well, here's some nude pictures of her I got. That's what this guy's doing. This is crazy. Including. He shows it to all the guys at work. Yeah. Which seems like a coal mine thing to do. Let me show you a picture of this lady I'm banging. Hold on.

[B]

Well, what happens in the mine, that stays in the mine?

[A]

Well, yeah, it's what happens down below the earth, stays down below the earth. She also showed the pictures even to Judy's own brother.

[B]

Say what?

[A]

Even to his brother in law. He's like, hey man, I want to see a picture of my girlfriend. Aren't you married to my sister? I mean, well, yeah, but still. Okay. He told his cousin Randall Dean Donahue, while displaying these photos, he said that if anything happened to mine and Judy's marriage, I'd marry that woman as soon as she got divorced. Because she's married.

[B]

She's already married, man.

[A]

What are you talking about?

[B]

That takes another thing to happen for you to get married.

[A]

Yeah, you need a lot of moving parts to work for you there. So some of the employees at the coal company said that he would read the men notes that his wife would put in his lunchbox. His wife would put. Judy would put notes in his lunchbox. And Gary Smith, one of the people here that he worked with, said sometimes he'd read it, sometimes he'd pass it around to the guys. She wanted him to hurry up and get home. She couldn't wait for him to get home. Last night was great, that sort of thing.

[B]

How's he doing so much?

[A]

This guy's dick works overtime. I'm not sure how many hours he puts in in the mine, but his dick is working overtime because he's clocking

[B]

in as soon as he clocks out.

[A]

I'm telling you, man. She's leaving notes for. Man, you really knocked my socks off last night. And he's passing it around to the fellas like it's Vietnam. And he got a letter from his sweetheart. Like, I don't know what's going on here. Smith said that Cantrell seemed proud of the notes. He said, if they were my notes, they'd be personal is what this guy said. But he was passing it all around.

[B]

I'm not telling anybody.

[A]

Yeah. Now, the thing is, too, both Jeff and the woman that he's sleeping with, cheating with, they both say they're committed to their marriages. They're not making a plan to be together or anything. Like, she's like, well, I can't leave my husband and kids. And he's like, well, I can't leave my wife and son. And they're like, all right, well, let me take another picture. Hold on. Spread them a little wider. Click. That's what's happening.

[B]

Do that V thing.

[A]

Do that. Yeah, there you go. Point to your butthole. Perfect. I want to see it.

[B]

If it's honest and open, you've still got an honest and open to other

[A]

people about this, because they're honest and open. But there's on the peripheral. So Jeff told people that he wanted to make his marriage work. So at the same time, he's showing nude photos of the woman he's banging to everyone who will look at it, including his wife's brother, which is crazy. So we've set up the situation here. I mean, this is he's going around coal dust on his face, putting his dick into anything that will have it at this point, I can't believe it. And taking pictures of it. So let us go to December 8, 1981. That night, Judy is attending a karate class, which I don't know where you'd find a karate class in this area.

[B]

But I can't believe they have that much karate studio, variety of classes to take.

[A]

I can't believe. Maybe it was in Pikeville. I'm not sure.

[B]

Can't be nearby, right?

[A]

I wouldn't imagine so. But she's taking a karate class. That's what she's been doing. So she's coming home that night from a karate class about 9pm Mac Mullins, Jeff's brother in law there, the guy who lives a couple doors down, he said he heard two loud booms around 9pm Thought they were fireworks of some Kind somebody lighting off some shit. It's the mountains, fireworks, guns. There's all sorts of shit exploding at any time.

[B]

Yeah, there's a primer being hit somewhere.

[A]

Could just be a sinkhole forming too. You never know. It could just be the ground collapsing below you. That's all sorts of.

[B]

It could just be a pocket of flammable gas that caught a spark.

[A]

You never know whatever caused that nothing but trouble movie to go on that could be happening all around you. So he called to his father in law, who was Bill, Jeff's dad. And Bill dismissed the noises. He heard him too. But he said the noises that sounded like firecrackers are coming from the direction of a neighbor who works on guns and shoots all the time. He said.

[B]

So he probably does this a lot.

[A]

Yeah, right. So you know, shit's blowing up all the time. And Bill also said, quote, I was watching television and I didn't think anything more about it. So there you go, he's watching tv, he doesn't care about explosions happening nearby.

[B]

He's turned up the jeopardy a bit louder.

[A]

Yeah, I don't think Jeopardy is what these people are watching probably.

[B]

I'll take things that didn't happen tonight for a thousand, Alex.

[A]

Yeah, that's something. So about 9:15, Jeff calls his parents house, he calls Bill and he's kind of in a tizzy. Basically he says someone's broken in and he needs help.

[B]

Oh my.

[A]

Yeah. Now the noises that they heard, the booms happen about 9:05pm According to Bill. And he said they were about three to five seconds apart. Boom. Three seconds. Five seconds. Then another boom.

[B]

Boom.

[A]

So Jeff called, told his mother that he'd been robbed, someone broke in and robbed them and he needed help. So the Bill said that he went out on the porch and heard Jeff screaming and crying in a loud voice. They've shot Judy. They've shot Judy.

[B]

Oh my God.

[A]

Yeah. So Bill calls Mac Mullins and says, let's go over there now. He's next door. Just go over there and call dude's too. Hey Mac,

[B]

come over. Somebody's been shot. I'm gonna need a pal.

[A]

Yeah, I gotta have a buddy for that. So anyway, everyone converges on the house. Somehow Mac Mullins gets there first. I don't know how Bill is Adam awfully slow to get off the couch for they've shot Judy. So he's like. But hold on a minute, let me see. What the. It's the double jeopardy. So it's. This one's important.

[B]

They've shot my Daughter in law, what'd they wager?

[A]

Let me find out now, did they do it in the form of a question is the real thing. So Mack, I mean this is horrible. Obviously Mac gets there. When he arrived at the scene, he said at the foot of the steps leading up to the house, Jeff was holding Judy in his arms. Right out front, right out front and wailing, Judy, Judy, my Judy, you know, all that kind of shit. So Bill said he drove from his residence along the gravel road. He lives next door to his son's house and saw his son cradling Judy, saying oh baby, oh baby. And he said, get my camera. Hold on. Her boobs showing?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Mac Mullins had already arrived there and he walked over there from his house. They call the police. That seems like the right thing to do. Even in the mountains you call the police and Officer Mullins is dispatched. At 9:18pm he had been patrolling Route 23 which was the main highway. That's the Orbee Cantrell Highway.

[B]

Right.

[A]

And he saw no vehicles parked on the shoulder, no intruder, no like people leaving the area at a high rate of speed. No, nothing like that. And there's not a lot of ways in and out. You go down to the highway, nothing going on. Duke boys didn't jump over the gully. Nothing happened. So the rescue squad is there when he arrives. He arrived about 9:30 when there's already EMTs on the scene. And Judy is lying in the driveway at the foot of the brick steps. It's a five brick step, little, you know, a little stoop basically.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

She has been shot twice with a 12 gauge shotgun at close range. Wow. That is in the neck and head.

[B]

Three to five seconds apart too.

[A]

Boom and boom. Yeah, that's one on the ground. Finish him off.

[B]

What the fuck?

[A]

So yeah, this happened on the front steps. By all the evidence it looks like she was walking up the front steps to her house after karate class. And you know a chop or a well placed roundhouse isn't going to save you from a shotgun blast unfortunately. And There you go. So, 28 years old, dead in the front yard. Hey everybody, just gonna take a quick break from the show to tell you the best place to get all of your meats and seafood and anything protein. It's so Good. Good chop.

[B]

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[A]

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[B]

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[A]

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[B]

Now back to the show.

[A]

Just gonna take a quick break from the show and say thanks to homeserve for sponsoring this episode.

[B]

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[B]

Now back to the show.

[A]

Two shotgun blasts.

[B]

Oh, Lord.

[A]

Her karate bag is near her feet. Her house keys are on the steps. She's just about to open the door and drop them. Now, the shotgun here was on the grassy landing near the corner of the house at the top of the steps. It belongs to Jeff. He keeps it inside the house. Jeff's shotgun.

[B]

So somebody broke in, got the shotgun

[A]

and shot her and shot Her. But yeah. And where is he?

[B]

Left him and hauled ass.

[A]

Well, he's got a. He's. He said he was kept in there for a long time, as we're gonna find out. So there's two spent shell casings, one on the landing and one still in the ejector slot of the shotgun. Oh, it's a.

[B]

Action. Yeah.

[A]

So Jeff is lying behind her and he's being attended to by medical personnel as well. A rescue squad member named Cecil Bolling said that Jeff was hyperventilating when he arrived. His blood pressure was elevated, but he didn't recall seeing any bumps or bruises or cuts or anything on him. So they find Judy's karate bag there. They find her keys, the shotgun, the shells. They also find a knife in a leather case as well, which is interesting. Now, inside the house, the kitchen cabinets and drawers are all open. All open. So either a poltergeist has came or somebody's been rifling through shit. We don't know.

[B]

I love when they do that. That's so fun that a ghost is just like. I just want to look like I've been looking for those vice grips that are in a cabinet somewhere.

[A]

Just want to go through your junk drawer and see if you got a charger for an iPhone4. I don't know why I still. I don't even have an iPhone4 anymore. I just want to see if you had it, you know?

[B]

Yeah. Treat your kitchen like Monty Hall. Just asked for a bobby pin.

[A]

That's exactly right. Yeah. That's what everyone's junk drawer is. So there's Christmas presents unwrapped in a bedroom because this is December. So there was Christmas presents wrapped. Now they're unwrapped. Women's clothing hanging from open drawers.

[B]

So everything, they were wrapped and this person unwrapped them all.

[A]

Unwrap the gifts to see what they are. The words fuck you are written on the television screen. I believe in dust because I can't get. Has to be in the dust. Cause I can't find out if it's like in marker. There's no mention of that. So it's written on the television screen. They said the letter K is rendered in an unusual way. They described it as looking like a V with a slash mark down the front. That's what somebody made. So a weird looking K. It goes too deep. The V part of it. Judy's wedding rings were on a counter by the sink. And there was camera equipment visible in an open cabinet above the refrigerator. These are things of value that seems valuable. Yeah, yeah. And that are in the open. Two men's watches were on top of a dresser in plain sight, untouched. Jeff reports the following items have been stolen. Now, not rings and watches, but $450 in cash. A clock. Who steals a clock? I'm breaking and steal their clock. Steal their clock? Yeah, there's camera on the watches. Take the clock. Yeah, take the watches.

[B]

Those shits are expensive.

[A]

They're clocks. A.38 caliber pistol, a movie camera, 1981 style. Who knows? 16 millimeter. Who knows? Jewelry of various persuasions, a pocket knife, a hairdryer. They stole the hairdryer, but left watches and rings.

[B]

What? Who takes the Con Air Christmas presents?

[A]

A comb, money from his billfold, his pocket watch, and a. I don't know what this is. A Plextron. I don't know what a plextron is,

[B]

but 1981 sounds like technology.

[A]

Sounds like something. So they brought in a tracking dog about three hours later in rain and snow, and still brought this tracking dog in. And the dog found a scent leading from the back of the house to a boundary fence around a field on the Cantrell property.

[B]

That's great.

[A]

Yeah, it's really good. But the scent ended there at the fence. It didn't continue off the property?

[B]

No, the dog helicoptered out.

[A]

The dog turned around and came back to the house? Well, yeah, once you get there, you jet pack it from there.

[B]

Then you can fly.

[A]

Then you can fly. Now it's time to fly. That's why we didn't see any getaway cars. Looking for two guys in a jetpack. Everybody watch out.

[B]

You gotta run to get the momentum up. And then you hit the thrusters, and

[A]

then you take off and away.

[B]

Babe?

[A]

Yeah? You ever been on a plane? It's not from a seated position. It's not a helicopter.

[B]

This doesn't just take off from the gate.

[A]

Gotta get a good pace going.

[B]

You got a taxi?

[A]

You got a taxi. So the dog turned around, came back to the house. Now, in that field, they found some of the stolen items. Oh, so things just fell off of them? As you jetpack that thrust'll. Things'll fall off.

[B]

It'll chuck things out of your pockets.

[A]

Yeah. There's no trail leaving the property, no vehicles seen on the highway, no vehicles heard on the road, and no fingerprints at all on the shotgun.

[B]

Oh, wow.

[A]

Okay, Now, a palm print inside the house belonged to neither Jeff nor Judy. But there's no other prints anywhere else, just a random palm print, which in 1981 was as useful as Nothing, Absolutely. As you found, like a Pringle on the front step.

[B]

That is the equivalent of an evidence paperweight. Doesn't matter.

[A]

Nothing. So a soil sample from the bathroom windowsill matched soil behind the house. But they checked, too. It didn't match anything on Jeff's shoes. So to make sure it wasn't Jeff

[B]

climbing in the window, Jeff got locked out of the house or some shit.

[A]

Yeah. There's a broken drinking glass on the kitchen floor that is consistent with the story Jeff will tell, but also consistent with just a broken glass too, at the same time. So basically, what his story is that three men were in the house for over two hours. Wow. And essentially they disappeared into the night. And assumingly, really with nothing of value because everything has been found in the field and things haven't been taken. So really they just came in, shot. Judy will tell you what they did to Jeff and then jet packed off the scene and are gone.

[B]

Held Jeff for two hours.

[A]

Three.

[B]

And then shot her. And then.

[A]

Yeah, for over two hours. So at the hospital, Norton Community Hospital, Jeff is conscious on arrival. Blood pressure back to normal. Superficial scratches on the face. Minor swelling of the forehead where there was a small bruise. X rays, all negative for broken bones. No concussion, nothing like that. Their diagnosis was acute hysteria. He's tripping.

[B]

He's tripping his mind.

[A]

That's it. So they gave him Valium intravenously, which sounds awesome.

[B]

What? You can do that?

[A]

That sounds like it's probably really good. Yeah.

[B]

You calm down right the fuck now.

[A]

Right now you're calm. That is awesome.

[B]

I didn't even know it came in a liquid form.

[A]

You can liquefy anything.

[B]

Yeah, I guess so.

[A]

Drugs, people, you can cook it, liquefy anything. Could be shot into your veins if you really want it to be. That's awesome. You gotta really want it, is the thing, Jimmy. Now, by the following day, the swelling's gone and the cuts are nearly healed, so all very superficial stuff. Judy at the time said that they said she was hit, fired at close range from no more than 15ft, which is close for a shotgun. Yeah, that's pretty close for a shotgun within 15ft.

[B]

Dude, that's. Everything is hitting you.

[A]

Yeah. You're getting all the pellets at that point. And they said it was two blasts to her chest and neck.

[B]

Neck, okay.

[A]

Which makes it seem like chest is where you go for, you know, mass.

[B]

Center mass, center mass.

[A]

And then down and then you go for the neck. So this. They said she would have been dead real quick right now. Real quick. Yeah, she didn't last long. She probably never saw it coming. Or if she did, it was only for a second and she was gone.

[B]

So at least, even if it tears up in. Even if it doesn't tear up internals, it's going to tear so much off of you, you're just going to bleed out so fast. Mm. Horrible.

[A]

It's a lot. So there's a witness, a neighbor woman on the road that said she heard Judy Cantrell's car pass her house. Nine o', clock, 9:05. Somewhere around there. She looked out the window, as she always does when cars go by.

[B]

That's my thing.

[A]

Oh my God. Imagine living somewhere where a car going by is something you gotta get up and look out the window for. Hey, it's a car. Everyone. The kids come running. Really? Is it blue? Oh, man, I wanted to see a blue one today.

[B]

That's about a 72 Cordoba.

[A]

Oh my God.

[B]

Who gives a shit?

[A]

That's how rarely cars drive by. She said she saw Judy's vehicle. She said that's the first vehicle she heard on the road all evening. So no intruders coming or going.

[B]

That is a positive reason to do that shit.

[A]

I mean, you always have her. She's the neighborhood surveillance camera, I guess. She said she here, heard no other vehicles until the rescue squad arrived.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

All right, now the palm print, like we said. So they said there's handwriting on the tv, soil on the bathroom windowsill that matches the soil behind the house. Broken glass on the kitchen floor. Palm print that doesn't match either of the residents. No fingerprints on the shotgun or the shell casings or any of the items found in the field either. Oh, any of the stuff for sure.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Has to. So they don't get a story from Jeff. A complete and total story, because he said, oh, my head's a little. Whatever. They don't get a story from him till New Year's Eve.

[B]

How long is that? A week?

[A]

Three weeks. December 8th. Yeah. So this is now December 31st. Uh. Oh, that's a long time. But they. I guess then the holidays were coming. So it's a small town police department. I can't imagine they had the full detective unit going during the holidays.

[B]

He's gotta put up lights, man. There's so much to do.

[A]

He's got relatives coming from Kentucky. It's a lot going on. So December 31st, he provides a handwritten statement to police. He describes the attack in very vivid detail. Three men break in. All of this thing. He said he arrived home at 6:40pm entered the kitchen, didn't turn the light on as people do when they go into a dark room. 6:40 in December means dark outside as fuck, which means pitch black in your kitchen.

[B]

You're going to knock a glass off the table and break it.

[A]

Well, that's not what his story, though. He didn't turn on the light. He said he was immediately struck over the head with a hard object and seized by three men who forced him to the floor. All right, okay. The object he's hit with is a glass. He said he was hit with glass? Yeah. Now he passed out. He said. He said when he came to, he was face down on the linoleum floor with his hands and legs tied with his own insulated underwear. By the way, his long johns that done tied me with my long johns.

[B]

They tied me with my duck boots, my duck pants.

[A]

Oh, my God.

[B]

Insulated underwear means like it's warming.

[A]

Yeah, long johns. So you wear that under shit when you go hunting at five o' clock in the morning.

[B]

You call that insulated? Is that what those are?

[A]

Yeah, yeah, it's like thermal. Like a thermal type thing, almost like this. Almost like my shirt a little bit. But yeah, I think insulated usually means

[B]

it's got like a layer in between two layers. Oh, it might.

[A]

You know what I mean? It could. It could. It could be thicker or.

[B]

That's some thick shit.

[A]

Thick shit. Yeah, he's getting tied up with one of those. And he said what happened after that was the largest of the men, who was a big fat guy, sat on him. So he said he woke up to being sat on, he said, for what seemed like two or three hours. So all the rest, this was their way of subduing the hostage, was the other two guys ransacked the house while the fat one sits on him.

[B]

Hey, big guy, have a sit.

[A]

That is really low tech robbery skills there. Sit on him, will you, fat boy? Okay, fine. Okay. So he said the men beat him repeatedly. They hit his head, they banged it on the floor, broke the drinking glass on the back of his head, kicked him in the stomach. They just beat him up. He said no one spoke to him, nothing. They ransacked the house, they stole things. Then he heard Judy's car pull into the carport.

[B]

Oh, no.

[A]

And he said he screamed, judy. Judy. Trying to warn her, tried to warn her off. And he said they hit her over the head again. There. They hit him over the head again. Shut up. Yeah, shut up. And fat guy continued to sit on him. He then said he Heard two shotgun blasts about three seconds apart. He said at that point, the men gathered up all their stolen goods that they had. And kind of panicky. In a panicky fashion, and I don't think they expected her to come home and ran out the back door. He said he.

[B]

It's a story.

[A]

He said he freed himself from the underwear as best he could, hopped up to the phone, turned the light on, called his parents, went outside, and found Judy dead. And that's when they all found him out there. My baby, Judy, she's dead. That's what happened. And he's got superficial scratches on his face, a small bruise on the forehead, and some veins full of Valium at this point. That's what he got out of that. So he said that's what's going on. He had a little reddish place on some scratches is what One of the EMTs described it as.

[B]

There's gonna be a lot of questions with that story.

[A]

Lot of questions there. Yeah. Now, Jeff's girlfriend, they talk to her. They find out. They just ask around about Jeff, and they're like, did you talk to his girlfriend, the one he shows me titty pictures of all the time? She said that, yes, she and Jeff were a thing.

[B]

Fucking.

[A]

Yeah. He said that he was also involved with other women.

[B]

Oh, boy.

[A]

She ain't the only one. And she confirmed the nude photographs existed and that, yes, she knows. He shows them around. She's heard at this point, by the way, they break up. She's done with him. She's like, this is just too much for me.

[B]

You made the police come talk to me.

[A]

This is wild. Yeah. I can't be doing this now. They do the autopsy on Judy, and they find, obviously, the two shotgun wounds. Then they bury her. Then they exhume her for a second autopsy.

[B]

Poor lady.

[A]

Can't let her rest. Nope. They won't even let her rest here. They said they needed additional information on shot trajectories and patterns.

[B]

They didn't do that before?

[A]

Apparently not. They were just like, yep, those are gunshots. She sure is dead. And they're like, we should have probably done, like, more.

[B]

Did y' all stick some pencils in that to see which way they came from?

[A]

Where is she buried? God damn it. Like, this is sad. This poor woman, man. This is horrifying. And they said they thought they could gain more information on the distance from which the shots were fired because they thought that was important. So they grant the request to exhume her. Jeff didn't want her exhumed. Why are you doing that. And there's a law that says basically your spouse owns your body, essentially, and if your spouse doesn't want you exhumed, then you need a court order for it. So they have to get a warrant and all this type of shit. This is from a newspaper. The exhumation apparently concluded after nightfall. Mrs. Clella Minor of the Minor Funeral home said Wednesday night at the copper casket holding. Said Wednesday night the copper casket holding Mrs. Cantrell's body would be kept at the funeral parlor until they take her body and bring it back.

[B]

Oh, wow.

[A]

They got a used casket they're waiting for. All right. April 17, 1982. So months have gone by.

[B]

Four of them.

[A]

Four months have gone by. Jeff's been cooperative. He's been talking to the cops whenever they need him to talk. He's been walking around, people are giving him condolences, and his poor guy's wife is dead and everything like that. He maintains his story. That's all he can do. Everything's fine. And they have no evidence to the contrary to say that he's lying, other than his story is absolutely ridiculous.

[B]

Fucking crazy.

[A]

Other than the jetpack robbers. And how'd the fat one get off the ground with the jetpack? How'd that happen? He had two. We didn't even talk. He had two of them on.

[B]

Well, here's the other question.

[A]

Give me a boost. And they had to get below him.

[B]

Why did they murder a lady and leave your dumb ass here?

[A]

Yeah, that's what I mean. Did she go into a karate stance and they're like, oh, no, she knows the deadly arts.

[B]

She's dangerous.

[A]

She's dangerous.

[B]

She knows the crane, y'.

[A]

All. Oh, damn it, y'.

[B]

All.

[A]

I don't know what happened. So Officer Roy Nixon gets a phone call on this day. A man calls. It's a man's voice. It's the Wise county police station. He claims to have been involved in the murder. Oh, so we got a killer here. He tells the officers, I can prove I was involved in the murder because I can tell you where some evidence is.

[B]

He's got some.

[A]

So they go, okay. He said, there's a flower box near the Pound Hardware store in the town of Pound. You wanna go there? Pound town. Go to Pound town. So Nixon's like, is this a prank call? Just let me. No, no, no, for real. It's 4:45pm so Nixon said it was a man's voice, and he identified himself as being one of the persons who broke into the Cantrell house. He said I would find all the evidence I needed to convict the man who killed Mrs. Cantrell and that he would turn state's evidence after he was arrested. But he won't tell you who he is at this point in time. So they head on down and officer Donny Ray Mullins, I don't know of any relation to Mac Mullins. I don't know why there's only two goddamn names in this fucking town. But course, Donny Ray, Donny Ray, cousin of Mac, possibly, probably. He's listening on the other line. And he has known Jeff Cantrell for 20 years. Just in personal matter, just from around. And he'd spoken on the phone with him several times. And he recognized Jeff's voice immediately.

[B]

On the phone right now?

[A]

Yeah, he said that he. It was definitely Jeff. He said it was very similar to Jeff Cantrell's voice on the phone. So a voice could be mistaken though you never know, maybe this guy is really good at his Jeff Cantrell impersonation, that's all. You never know.

[B]

You know what, if Jay Moore called me as Christopher Walken, I'd be convinced that Christopher Walken called me today. You could do that?

[A]

Yeah. If I called you as John Wayne Gacy, you'd believe me. Except that he's dead. So. Police head to the hardware store. All right. By the way, Patreon, there's John Wayne Gacy. You'll understand it. We did a whole song. It's pretty amazing. It's pretty good. Shit, you definitely want to hear that. Police head to the hardware store. In the flower box, under some freshly disturbed soil, they find a white plastic bag taped with yellow tape.

[B]

Yahtzee.

[A]

They open it.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

A.38 pistol similar to the one Jeff has reported stolen is in there.

[B]

He doesn't have that anymore, right?

[A]

No. A dark blue ladies nightgown that belonged to Judy Cantrell.

[B]

Why was that taken? Okay.

[A]

A pair of pink women's underwear that belong to Judy Cantrell and two old photos of Judy Cantrell are in this.

[B]

Okay. Very strange, very interesting evidence bag.

[A]

Yeah. So they identify the gun as the gun that was stolen. And the gun, the undergarments, the pictures. No fingerprints on anything, by the way.

[B]

Nothing.

[A]

Nothing. So who could have buried that stuff?

[B]

Who the fuck would?

[A]

Well, there's a guy who went to high school with Jeff Cantrell and he said three days earlier, April 14, he had seen Jeff run across the street near the pound hardware store. At 11:00 at night. Yeah, yeah, just a scurrying just a scurrying along. He said that he saw him, quote, just kind of standing around near Pound Hardware on the night of April 14th. Everyone's. There's always someone watching. The hills certainly have eyes in this goddamn town. At least these hills out the window somewhere. So that was three days earlier. This guy said as he walked across the street, he had his head turned away from me. But after I drove past him, I looked back at him and he was looking straight at me. It was Jeff Cantrell. So not only that, you know how he wrote a handwritten story to the cops? They didn't even just say it and type it up. Well, that handwritten thing has a K that's written very unusually in a V with a little slash coming out of it.

[B]

Oh, he writes, oh, I can see it now.

[A]

You can see it.

[B]

So now this is bad penmanship, man.

[A]

Yep. Just. He works in a coal mine. How much writing do you have to do? You know, like, honestly, I'm not even being a dick. I'm just saying.

[B]

Hilarious.

[A]

Not an office job. He's probably not doing a lot of writing.

[B]

He doesn't know. Not everybody does that.

[A]

Nope. So they go, gee, that looks just like the K on the tv. It's a very unusual way. So they think about it and they're like, he said he got home at four and was attacked for two and a half hours. And his wife got in there and the two loud booms. And then he freed himself somehow and all that kind of thing. He's seen burying evidence. And the phone call came to us, sounded a lot like him. These jetpack criminals make no sense.

[B]

Why'd they leave him alive?

[A]

Why did they leave him alive to tell this story? So two days later, on April 19, 1982, the grand jury goes ahead and indicts him for first degree murder and use of a firearm in commission of a murder. Jeff is in deep shit. Fuck, yeah. So he goes to trial. In his opening statement, his attorney said. Here about the prosecution. He said in his opening statement, Mr. McAfee, the prosecutor said they were going to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that Jeff Cantrell killed his wife. You're being asked to find him guilty and send him to prison for life on circumstantial evidence. The prosecution started with nothing and they've gone downhill. They got ugats is what he's saying here.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

He said, not a single piece of evidence in this case links Jeff Cantrell to this crime. The mere fact that Jeff Cantrell was there, that Night does not mean that he killed her. The Commonwealth cannot prove its case.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

And he also said, by the way, this week would have been their 10th wedding anniversary. Jeff's real sad about this week.

[B]

Is there to speak. Oh, boy.

[A]

So, yeah, he argued that the prosecution alluded to the presence of an eyewitness account of his appearance at the hardware store. But he said, we have an eyewitness as well as documentary evidence that will show Jeff Cantrell was in bed at his parents house the night of April 14th. Oh, he was in bed. The witnesses are his parents, which are not the strongest witnesses in this case.

[B]

Those people are certainly willing to lie for you.

[A]

I would think so. So they also bring in his girlfriend, talks about the affairs. They bring in cousin Randall Dean Donahue, talks about the photos and says, randy Dean. Randy Dean. And he said that he talked about. He said, if anything happened to our marriage, I'd marry this woman. And Jeff's sister testified about the affairs. It's a lot. Now, a cop here said that this one cop said that Cantrell was cooperative throughout the investigation and adding his contacts with the defendant in the past led him to believe that he was a good man.

[B]

Okay, he's a good man.

[A]

He said. The only thing I've ever heard was a rumor years ago that Cantrell had stolen something while in high school. And he's also been arrested for littering. So he's like, I didn't think he was going.

[B]

Arrested for.

[A]

Arrested for. That's some hard.

[B]

You got litter, hard.

[A]

No dancing, no littering. That's what we do in this town. He was dancing, shit falling all out of his pockets. That's why they banned dancing.

[B]

You drop things, it makes you litter, for Christ's sake.

[A]

Then you litter more. Now, during cross examination here, the prosecutor sought to dispel the notion that Cantrell's head had been struck by a blunt object or glass. He asked a doctor, if a man had been struck over the head with a glass, wouldn't he have some kind of head injuries? And the doctor said, he may or may not.

[B]

Depends on how tough you are, man.

[A]

I mean, you know, he said it would depend on whether he was struck with the sharp end or blunt end of an object, the shape and position of the head and other things.

[B]

So a glass, there's variables, sure.

[A]

If you hit someone with the bottom of the glass, obviously that'd be more of a blunt. If you hit him with the top of the glass, it would break easier. So it wouldn't be as.

[B]

That makes Sense depends on which end of the beer bottle you're hit with. Because sometimes in the movies, you get hit with the Miller Light and you turn right around and throw punches, and

[A]

sometimes you collapse to the ground. You never know.

[B]

Sometimes you just die.

[A]

You just da poof. You're out cold.

[B]

It's a lot of variables.

[A]

They bring in an EMT saying he was in a state of hyperventilation. He was breathing rapidly in the field. We have no way of knowing if they're in shock or not, so we have to treat it like they are. They bring in Jeff's boss to talk about shit. And he called him a very good and steady worker. But he said he's also told me about all of his extramarital affairs he was having. He said. He told me about two or three women he was going out with. He mentioned that there was an open marriage, basically, is what he was saying. My wife knows about it, but doesn't give a shit.

[B]

He's just living his life. And she's like, go do it, baby.

[A]

That's fine, baby. Bring home that coal money. But I don't think that's true. I think he's obviously lying, probably so. They said, didn't Jeff Cantrell tell you he was having guilt feelings about one of those affairs? And this guy said, no, he didn't. He said, but it bothered me that he had them, the affairs at random. Just whoever he ran into, he would plow. He didn't give a shit. They bring in a neighbor who lives near the intersection of Route 23, which is the road leading up to the scene. He testified that the only vehicle he had seen also was Judy Cantrell's. Yeah, but Jeff. Jeff's relatives say they saw suspicious vehicles, two of them, parked beside Route 23, not far from their home, several times in the weeks preceding the murder. They were casing it for weeks. This is the big score, everybody. We're gonna get a nightgown and some clothes. Grandfather clock. And a clock. They testified that they had seen a white car and a red and white pickup truck parked in the wide part of the shoulder on Route 23, where Jeff Cantrell sometimes met persons with whom he was sharing a ride. He said they were, quote, setting where you couldn't see them from either house.

[B]

Oh, yeah.

[A]

And he said after that, after the death, he never. After Judy's murder, they never saw them again, though.

[B]

Yeah, the backwoods sit the set.

[A]

They set. Yeah, they don't sit, they set. Exactly. Now, Jeff's sister said she had seen the vehicles more than once. And on one occasion, someone driving the truck followed me to aerobics class. They sure have a lot of classes in this small town. A lot of athletic endeavors for women

[B]

to get into jazzercise around here.

[A]

Nice. This isn't bad at all. This isn't too shabby. There's a hot yoga right down from here. It's excellent. She said she didn't report the activity to the sheriff's department until after the murder. And then her husband Mack, the brother in law, said that his wife had told me about the two vehicles two or three weeks before the murder. Jeff testifies as he kind of has to. Not really though, because they don't really have a ton of evidence.

[B]

But they already got a story. What do you need to testify to?

[A]

That's it. My written one statement. That's what it is. Under direct examination from his attorney, he admits to four affairs during his marriage. He admits to.

[B]

On the stand.

[A]

On the stand. That's his own attorney. They gotta get that out of the way because otherwise they're gonna rip him a new asshole on cross about what a scumbag. He. He admitted to showing the nude pictures. He said he showed them to other people. He said there was an ongoing relationship right up to Judy's death. And he said that was something I'm very ashamed of and regret very much. It was real immature on my part to show pictures of her around and brag.

[B]

That's a great word to use, sir.

[A]

That's all you can do. So the verdict comes in here.

[B]

Oh boy.

[A]

It's a hung jury mistrial.

[B]

Stop it.

[A]

Hung jury. They say I have no evidence. Hung jury.

[B]

Are you serious?

[A]

Swear. That's it.

[B]

The only guy that benefits.

[A]

That story makes sense.

[B]

And the only guy on site left.

[A]

But a fat guy sat on him. Jimmy.

[B]

They were confused. Yeah.

[A]

If somebody in that jury said. Ever had a fat guy sit on you though, because you can't get up?

[B]

My cousin Jaleel.

[A]

He was Jaleel, though. I know there's not a lot of Jaleel in this area, I don't think. Not a ton of Jaleel.

[B]

Cousin Ramil. What was his last name? Robinson.

[A]

Robinson. My cousin, the NBA player. My cousin Anthony Peeler sat on me one time. Oh, God. Jesus.

[B]

He done sat on me on Easter. And I couldn't get up until Memorial

[A]

Day till after the ham was cold. I couldn't even do it. Hey, everybody. Just going to take a quick break from the show to tell you the best home security available out there.

[B]

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[A]

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[B]

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[A]

Which is less time than normally people would take. Just in the window waiting for a technician for they have the cameras and they can see what's going on outside before you. Even before you know what's going on while you're in your house sleeping. They could be yelling at someone through your system telling them to get out of here. The cops can be called and you're like, what's going on now? It's great. They take it. They take the initiative and they go after it before there's a problem. They make it so there's not going to be a problem for you. It is so good. We really, really love it. It's easy to get secured. You can easily customize a system that's right for your [e-mail] and it ships to your door in just a few days. With an app guided setup and no drilling required, you can install and arm your system under an hour. No need to wait for technicians or any of that. And it's not just a camera. It's a comprehensive ecosystem of sensors, cameras for inside and out and 24. 7 professional monitoring. In the event of a break in, fire or flood, Simplisafe's agents are ready to take action. No long term contracts. There's no lock ins, no hidden cancellation fees. Simplisafe earns your business by keeping you safe, not by trapping you in a contract. That's great too. Their pricing is also really good. 24. 7 monitoring for a fraction of what traditional brands charge you. And they were named America's best customer service by Newsweek week. And over 5 million people trust SimpliSafe every day. And U.S. news and World Report ranked them the best home security system of 2026. We also rank it that way as well. We want you to experience the same peace of mind that we do, which is why we've partnered with SimpliSafe to offer an exclusive discount to our listeners. Right now, you can get 50% off your new system by visiting SimpliSafe.com Small that's half off at SimpliSafe.com Small S I M P L I Safe.com Small there's no safe like Simplisafe.

[B]

Now back to the show.

[A]

Hey everybody. Jess going to take a quick break from the show and tell you a much better, easier way to shop with Thrive Market.

[B]

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[A]

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[B]

I love eggs out of my diet with them.

[A]

That's what I mean. For sour the gluten, you can filter that right out and anything with gluten in it is gone. It's awesome. And if you find some ingredient that you don't want, you can find another. Like something like that without that ingredient. It's really excellent. It really is fantastic. We love it. I really do. Can't tell you enough about Thrive Market. I love their sea salt tortilla chips by the way. Yeah, absolutely. Outstanding. I keep those stocked all the time. I order multiple bags at once. It's a lot. I love them.

[B]

Why am I a big fan of sea salt chips?

[A]

Oh, they're so good. They're so good, those sea salt chips. They really are here. It's excellent. Plus Thrive Market restricts, like we said, a thousand plus ingredients. No stressing over any of these labels or googling every additive. Who has time to do that? Every product is curated organic and non GMO brands vetted before they ever hit the site. The in app barcode scanner finds healthier swaps for almost anything in your pantry right now. They're awesome. And you pay $5 a month so you don't have to google all this stuff and worry about it. And I don't have time to do that.

[B]

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[A]

It's too much of a hassle. And the member pricing up to 30%. You end up with like 30% off every week anyway on sales and free gifts and price matching. Free delivery. It'll pay for itself. Really. It really does. It's excellent. No per order delivery fees, no service charges or figuring out what your tip's gonna be. None of that stuff. One annual cost and that's it. All the filters mean you're gonna get anything you want out of there. You want high protein, you want low sugar glp, one friendly gluten free Kato more whatever you want. It's awesome. The fact that you can filter out the whole site by high protein or low sugar in seconds, it's awesome. You guys want that? Ready to do your own spring reset. Join Thrive Market with our link thrivemarket.com Smalltown Murder for $20 off your first three orders, plus you'll get a free $60 gift.

[B]

Now back to the show.

[A]

Hey everybody. Just gonna take out quick break from the show and tell you a better way to shop for clothes with quince.

[B]

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[A]

This is the time of year where you got to rethink what's in your closet. What do I have? What do I have to put out? I've been putting big coats on and stuff all winter. Now I gotta actually show myself and I gotta show my clothes what are they? And, you know, I want to keep fewer things but better things. I don't want a closet full of junk. Basically pieces that are well made, pieces you, you can wear all the time. That's why we keep coming back to quints. The fabrics feel elevated, the fits are thoughtful, and the pricing actually makes sense. Quince makes high quality everyday essentials using premium materials like 100% European linen and their insanely soft flow knit activewear fabric, which is really good, by the way. It's soft. It feels great. Their men's linen pants, which Jimmy has, we love those linen pants. We know that. Yes, they're awesome. And their shirts are lightweight, breathable and comfortable. Basically the perfect layer for spring. The pants strike the right balance between laid back and refined. So you look put together without looking like you're trying too hard. You know, nobody wants that.

[B]

They're great for on the lake, sitting on a boat, sitting on a beach. They're great water pants.

[A]

Yeah, great water pants. And they're flow knit activewear, moisture wicking, anti odor and soft enough that you'll actually want to wear it all day. And the best part is their prices. The prices are 50 to 60% less than similar brands. And you go, well, how do they make quality stuff that's that cheap? Well, very easy. They work directly with ethical factories and cut out the middlemen. So you're getting quality, but you're not paying some salesman's salary. It's great. It's exactly what you want with your clothes. So you're paying for quality, not brand markups and advertising and all that kind of thing. Everything is designed to last and make getting dressed easier. We shop everything at Quint's. We get packages all the time. From quints. Whenever we're going on the road, I'm looking on quints for new stuff for that trip. And Sarah buys her stuff on quints. We love it. You don't need to shop anywhere else when you have quints. It's fantastic. So refresh your wardrobe with quints. Go to quints.comsmalltown murder for free shipping in 365 days. Returns now available in Canada too. Go to Q U I n c e.com Smalltown Murder for free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince.com Smalltown Murder now back to the show. So May of 1983, they have another trial. It is the literally the exact same trial, exact same evidence, two years later, exact year later, a year later. So exact same trial, exact same evidence, witnesses, you name it. It's a photocopy of the first one. This time they have a verdict, though. Oh, yeah. So is it gonna be over with? We'll find out. He is found guilty of first degree murder and use of a firearm.

[B]

Got him.

[A]

Well, maybe the judge says, you, sir, a fuck off. Life plus one year. That's for the gun. The gun is one year. So it's life plus one year. That's what he gets. So he appeals in 85. And this is directly from the appeal. The appeals court says the conviction was built on a cracked foundation. How Carl McAfee, who was the prosecutor, was actually a private attorney retained by Judy's parents for $10,100, which an 81 in this area, that is a fuckload of money. With the explicit goal, in Judy's father's own words, of getting Jeff Cantrell convicted. So he was simultaneously representing Judy's family in a civil custody action to take Jeff's child away from him. He told the jury openly that he was employed by Judy's parents to assist the Commonwealth.

[B]

I am employed to get that man.

[A]

To get him. Yeah. In closing arguments. By a private entity, not even by the state. In closing arguments, he told them that he was spe speaking as a special prosecutor for the family of Judy Cantrell. He ran the case. They say in the appeals document. He wasn't assisting, he was leading. He examined most of the witnesses he made and responded to most of the motions and objections. He gave closing argument. That's the lead attorney. That's it.

[B]

That's everything. Yeah.

[A]

They said the actual Commonwealth's attorney was present through throughout and took an active role. But McAfee was the lead attorney.

[B]

He's the guy.

[A]

They said the Virginia Supreme Court Examined this arrangement and used the phrase overwhelming probability of conflict of interest.

[B]

Overwhelming. Absolute conflict.

[A]

He's hired by. Yeah. The prosecutor has to look at it completely unbiased and decide what the right path is not. I'm gonna get him. That's not the way.

[B]

That's the way our justice system can operate. Above board 100%. And you can't. In this situation. You can't be not above board.

[A]

This is small town murder. This isn't happening in. That's a problem. You know. In a large county with a large city in it, probably. It's not gonna happen like that. So. Yeah. They said that the duty to administer criminal law impartially is essentially a judicial one. The duty to represent his civil clients with undivided fidelity and zeal. Pulled in the other direction. They said you can't serve as one. As both things. So. The Supreme Court also found it was error to exclude one of the doctors. A forensic pathologist from Tennessee who would have testified that 10 to 20% of head blow cases. There's no visible external injury.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

The prosecution had been hammering Jeff's lack of serious injuries. In closing arguments, they said if you hit somebody hard enough to knock them down, you're gonna leave something. And the judge had prevented the defense from putting up an expert to counter that claim. So this is reversed and remanded back again to re.

[B]

Sentencing or retrying?

[A]

Retrying. Yeah. The fuck. The conviction is reversed. So Jeff goes free for a while. He remarries. You know how you do.

[B]

Swinging dick. This guy's.

[A]

I mean, this guy's still. He's a lady.

[B]

Wild oats to sow. Yeah.

[A]

Then he discovers something hidden in the house in the walls. Basically letters concealed in various places in his home. He was cleaning out the home before selling it?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

He finds three letters dated July 16, September 5, and October 19, 1981. These are letters from Judy's boyfriend.

[B]

Oh. She was cheating too.

[A]

She's out there cheating too. I'd look at that karate instructor. First and foremost. Because they're flexible. You know what I mean?

[B]

He writes a lot of letters and she hides them in the walls like a World War II refugee.

[A]

Like you're hiding money in the Depression. Cantrell. Jeff said that his former attorney had advised him to make a thorough search of his house before selling it. And when he found the letters and poems and a card said I should keep them in my possession and keep quiet about them.

[B]

Keep quiet too.

[A]

He produced three love letters signed with the initials P.S.C. probably a Cantrell I imagine. And a different Cantrell. As well as a valentine and some love.

[B]

Probably Stephen Cantrell.

[A]

You never know. Probably some other Cantrell. That is probably some Cantrell. As well as a valentine and some love poems addressed to his wife. The letters to Judy, my fair, spoke of wonderful nights at your house while Jeff was away.

[B]

What?

[A]

The letter writer expressed a wish that she could learn to love him more than her husband and son, but said that he was reconciled to being, quote, your second man.

[B]

Oh, my.

[A]

This is basically Cory Richen's boyfriend. Yeah, that's what he is. Cantrell said he would turn the letters and notes over to the sheriff's department at the end of the trial to see if they would. The third trial to see if they would help track down his wife's real killer. Once we get done with my bullshit, they can go track it down. He said he's kept him sealed in a plastic case in case they might contain fingerprints. One letter stated the writer had, quote, destroyed all our pictures except the juicy ones. Dude, everyone in this town is way ahead of the curve here. This is the town.

[B]

Juicy ones.

[A]

This is the. Well, it's pound town, all right.

[B]

You betcha.

[A]

This is the town onlyfans started in.

[B]

They are so horny.

[A]

They're so horny. And they need pictures and refers to. This letter refers to keeping joint diaries about their affair. Another refers to items marked in a Hustler magazine to give them something to look forward to. They were going to send the pictures to Hustler. Oh, all those magazines would have like a, you know, regular girl feature where people send in pictures of their girlfriends or whatever.

[B]

Submission by. Yeah, the girl next door thing.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, exactly. Cantrell said he had no idea who wrote the letters to his wife, but he thought they might have some bearing on her. Murder trial number three.

[B]

Unbelievable.

[A]

Now everyone in the whole county really knows everything about this story. So they have to move to Russell County. Yeah, I mean, there wasn't a lot of people to begin with and they're related to half these people, so. So they get a third jury. The initial original indictment was null processed. Null processed, which means dismissed without prejudice because Cantrell had been arguing it was tainted by the prosecutorial misconduct. So they had to re indict him. And they do. They re indict him. So he argues double jeopardy now since they re indicted him on the same

[B]

charge, but he wasn't acquitted, so.

[A]

No, exactly. They said their Virginia Court of Appeals said no jeopardy hadn't attached to the third trial because the jury hadn't been empaneled and SW when they got rid of the indictment. If they had got rid of the indictment after that, then it could be considered that. So the trial proceeds. It goes on. They said that Cantrell had reason to believe his wife had found the evidence. This is the prosecution of his affair. That he had admitted about and became angry enough that he shot her when she returned home. And then became hysterical when he realized what he had done.

[B]

Yeah, because seeing murder will fuck you up.

[A]

Seems thin in motive, though, like she got mad at the affair. So he shot her after karate class. Not even like it escalated. Didn't make sense. She didn't get in the house yet.

[B]

He said several affairs. She probably has caught on to more than one of them. It's not gonna be. He's dealt with this before.

[A]

I would think the defense suggested enough scenarios. This newspaper article said they suggested enough scenarios to supply a season's worth of television scripts for a. Like Dallas. That, yeah, Judy had broken off with her lover and was blackmailing him. And that the man was searching her house with accomplices to recover potentially scandalous photos. So that's the three guys.

[B]

It's a story.

[A]

It's not a bad story. Diaries or videotapes mentioned in the letters. Maybe that's what he got. And that he shot her out of jealousy and fear that she would recognize him or in a panic when she arrived back home. So same story from Jeff, same evidence, minus these letters or plus these letters? Everything else. The defense also presents a similar robbery in town on 12-10-81, which is two years later, or two days after the robbery where three masked men held up and robbed a man and his family that night. Oh, so that's something. Those robbers were never identified. Okay, interesting. Now, they said that they'd have Judy's love letters. Like we said. They get put in there, they talk all about that and Judy My Fair and the juicy letters and Hustler and all that kind of shit. And the verdict comes back this time again. And he is found guilty again. This time, more guilty again. First degree murder, use of a shotgun in the commission of a murder. This time his sentencing is way different, though.

[B]

I mean, really.

[A]

You, sir, may fuck off. 23 years in prison.

[B]

Really?

[A]

Which is 22. Plus one for the gun.

[B]

What is the.

[A]

So he's gonna do 10, 11 years?

[B]

Yeah, what is the thought on that?

[A]

That judge apparently took a liking to him, took a shine to him. I'm not sure why the fuck was

[B]

impressed by his sexual prowess.

[A]

He said, man, that man's got a mighty penis. I'm gonna.

[B]

This boy throws dick. 22 years.

[A]

We can't hold a mighty penis in a cage for that long.

[B]

Our prison won't hold it for that long.

[A]

It won't.

[B]

We're gonna guess at 22.

[A]

We put it in. He picked the lock with the thing. That thing is good. I'll take it.

[B]

If he beats that against the wall long enough, he might just be free tomorrow.

[A]

You never know. You seen Shawshank? Tim Robbins had a humongous penis. That was the whole point. It's like a fireball.

[B]

He had was a rock hammer. What do you think we call that Hawk.

[A]

That's right.

[B]

That right there's a rock hammer.

[A]

If I ever saw one. I ever saw one. That's why it's from Pound. He pounds away on that. So the aftermath. Joyce Parker, who operates Joyce's restaurant, said people still do talk about it. She said the talk has dialed down after the third trial. Most of those you ask in the stores or on the street won't admit to following the trial in detail. But they said they all suspect that he's gotta be guilty.

[B]

Sounds like we treat it like a Danielle Steele round here. We don't want nobody to know we're reading it.

[A]

But we're reading it. He must be guilty. So the mayor said that was just one unfortunate thing. We very seldom have any break ins or robberies. The biggest crime rate around here is in this town is drunks. You know small towns, they get somebody down to the funeral home that's been run over with a car or shot or something like that. Everybody in town goes. Goes to the funeral as they know her. Their lawyers want evidence of other break ins. They say they want all of this. They say there's a crime spree including robberies and burglaries. And this is a big part of it. And they need this to demonstrate further convincing evidence to the jury that William is innocent as he has claimed throughout the investigation.

[B]

Nobody else has been shot in these robberies. Just one person.

[A]

That's the thing. Nobody else has been murdered. No one else has been sat on. None of this shit happened.

[B]

And why would you murder a woman and leave her husband?

[A]

Makes no sense.

[B]

Who would do that?

[A]

Makes no goddamn sense. It really doesn't. You hear her coming, you can just jet out the back. They didn't take anything from her. That's the thing. It's not like shooter and robbery. They just shot her and left.

[B]

And what they did Take. They left it at the property line before they jet packed or turned right the fuck back and went back in the house.

[A]

Why not drag her inside? Tie her up with some long johns too. Which makes no sense.

[B]

Leave her alone.

[A]

More appeals. Federal habeas corpus was the last procedural door available to a state prisoner who's exhausted all the state appeals. That didn't quite work out though. He tries to go on the fourth Amendment. It was rejected because the shotgun and other items near Judy's body were in plain view during a lawful emergency response. He tried to say that the shit that was on the front lawn they illegally searched. It's like, no, they would have seen that it was sitting in the front law.

[B]

It was laying right there as we try to do chest compressions without a chest.

[A]

And they said it's the plain view doctrine. Doesn't require the police. That police have no idea that evidence exists. Only that they know it's in a specific location in advance and intend to seize it. So. So anyway, the Fourth Circuit affirmed the court in February 1990. All avenues exhausted. He's staying in prison. He maintained his innocence throughout all the appeals, throughout everything he said, the real intruders. Three men. Fat guy on my back, glass on my head. That's it. Judy is buried in Flat Gap, Virginia.

[B]

Is there any place that doesn't sound

[A]

sexual, doesn't sound gross? No. That's why they're so horny though. Now we know why they named it all this shit.

[B]

God damn it.

[A]

She's buried at the Benjamin Balling Cemetery. So there you go, everybody. I mean, he got out. Yeah, he must have got out pretty damn soon after that. I tried finding him. Could not track him down. Don't know. He should be about 75 years old. About 75 years old. And if a 75 year old starts showing you nude pictures of women and might be Jeff Cantrell, you never know. Not positive, but there you go. Everybody there is pound Virginia.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

And a crazy ass story. We'll go through the end quick here, man. If you enjoyed this story, please get on whatever app you're on or Netflix or whatever and tell the world about it. Do it. Give us five stars. It helps a ton. Helps drive us up the charts. Head over to. I'm sorry. Find us on social media. You can do that. Smalltown murder on Instagram. Small town pot on Facebook. Patreon.com crimeinsports that is also what you need as well. Anybody $5 a month or above. You get all the bonus material. Hundreds of pack episodes. You've Never heard before. New ones every other week. One crime in sports, one small town murder. You get them all this week. No different. What you're gonna get for crime and sports is old timey articles. Deaths and murders and ads. They're so much fun from old newspapers. Crazy. Those are one of some of crazy.

[B]

What they would disclose.

[A]

Yeah. Some of our most popular episodes then for small town murder, the Corey Rich, the woman who poisoned her husband and then wrote a book about grief for her children. Crazy shit. Can't make that up. That's patreon.com crimeinsports. You get all the shows we put out. Crime and sports, you stupid opinion. Small town murder all ad free with your Patreon ad free. And you get a shout out at the end of the regular show. ShutUpAndGiveMerder.com is the website head there for all your tickets. Next date with tickets available is May 2nd in Denver. Then Royal Oak, Michigan on May 30th. Buffalo and Salt Lake City are sold out. Sorry about that, but thank you. And then September 18th and 19th in Milwaukee and Minneapolis. Shut up and give me murder dot com. Get your tickets right now. That's also where you can find dropdown menus that take you everywhere that you need to go. Merchandise and social media and all that good stuff. So do that. Keep coming back and seeing us and listening to us every damn week. And until next week, everybody, it's been our pleasure. Bye.