Brutal Idiocy - Gadsden, Alabama

Summary

Small Town Murder Podcast

Episode: Brutal Idiocy - Gadsden, Alabama

Hosts: James Pietragallo & Jimmie Whisman
Date: March 7, 2026

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Overview

In this gripping Express episode, James and Jimmie take listeners to Gadsden, Alabama, to unpack one of the most shocking, tragic, and downright bizarre cases they’ve ever covered. Through their usual blend of exhaustive research, irreverent humor, and compelling storytelling, the hosts dissect the life and crimes of Glenn William Holiday—a man with severe cognitive limitations, a criminal record a mile long, and a capacity for violence that left a small Alabama community shaken to its core. This story includes small town dynamics, a terrifying manhunt, community paranoia, and a notorious string of murders with a cast of troubled, eccentric, and unforgettable characters.

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Episode Breakdown

1. Destination: Gadsden, Alabama

[03:55–11:45]

• Setting the Scene: Gadsden is located in northeastern Alabama (Etowah County), with a population of about 34,000, low median income, and cheap housing.
• Historical Context: Once Alabama’s second industrial hub thanks to Goodyear and steel; population peaked in 1960.
• Colorful Local Reviews: The hosts read real reviews, ranging from glowing nostalgia to a hilarious, angry, one-star rant ("The jobs doesn't pay much of nothing…The houses are ran down").
  • James (08:13): "Doesn't pay much of nothing. So that means it pays a lot?"
  • Jimmie (09:36): "Spelling and grammar started to warm up there at the end."
• Things to Do: They poke fun at the dull Spring Lantern Festival and colorful local bands at the Pittman Music Festival (“Not Even Close”, “Reclaim the Empire” with a Y), as well as odd festival names.
  • Jimmie (11:36): “La Monsta. One word and Mr. Bowtie. Two words.”

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2. Introducing the Main Players

[11:45–19:55]

• Rebecca Ledbetter Holiday: The future murder victim. In 1986, she’s 31, recently divorced from Glenn, with a 12-year-old son, Shea.
• Glenn William Holiday: The focal point—portrayed as frighteningly dimwitted, incredibly strong, and fiercely violent; the hosts lay out his traumatic background:
  • Fetal alcohol syndrome, abusive parents, pervasive learning disabilities, repeated failing of grades, IQ consistently in the 49–64 range.
  • James (13:47): "Glenn's mother told state workers that Glenn was her slow child or her, quote, retarded child."
  • Jimmie (14:25): "That's real low."
  • Could not distinguish tools, failed at manual labor, illiterate, but somehow managed to get married three times.
  • James (19:16): "Forrest Gump was way smarter than him."
• Glenn’s Criminal History: Habitual criminal from youth—burglary, theft, assault—and a noted serial rapist; known for relying on others' help even when breaking laws.

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3. A Life Unraveling: Marriages, Divorces, and Violence

[31:35–37:59]

• Glenn’s Marriages: Uses intimidation to keep wives; Rebecca flees but remains in danger due to his volatility.
  • Wife #1 claimed he threatened to kill her family if she didn’t marry him.
  • Jimmie (32:16): "Coerced her."
  • Wife #3 is Rebecca, the focus of this episode.
• Rebecca’s New Life: Begins dating David Robinson, a respected, athletic Navy officer (“Male Michelle Obama”).
• First Violent Incident: In March 1986, Glenn escapes jail, breaks into Rebecca's home, beats her, and flees—foreshadowing the upcoming tragedy.

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4. The Massacre

[40:25–44:12]

• August 24, 1986: At Rebecca’s mobile home, five people are present (Rebecca, Shea, Rebecca’s sister Katrina, David Robinson, and Shea’s friend Larry Thomas Jr.).
  • 16-year-old Larry Thomas steps out for a snack and is shot dead—mistaken for David Robinson.
  • Glenn bursts in, shoves Katrina aside, ignores 12-year-old Shea, and murders Rebecca (shot from behind, bullet exits through her breast) and David (shot twice).
  • Katrina and Shea flee; the discovery of Larry’s body is harrowing.
  • James (43:10): “That’s so fucked. And now they’re going to his house. Hi, can we use your phone? And your kid's dead right there.”

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5. Community Panic and the Manhunt

[44:11–51:50]

• Immediate Aftermath: County launches its biggest-ever manhunt—state, federal, and local officers, bloodhounds, aircraft all deployed. Glenn stays on the run for weeks, hopping motels and trading cars.
• Community in Fear: Doors locked, rumors of hitlists, disguises, and bizarre sightings abound.
  • A wanted poster of Glenn Holiday is circulated; hosts joke about buying it on eBay.
  • James (46:58): "He made his own map because he can't read a map, so he made his own map, which is fun."
  • James (51:50): "He's a 6'3", 230 pound man who's gonna dress up like a woman and blend right into the crowd. No one's gonna notice."

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6. The Killing Continues

[47:40–49:40]

• September 6, 1986: Glenn murders his ex-wife’s uncle, retired trooper Doyle Wallace, while on the run, further shocking the county.
  • Kicks down door yelling, “I’m the sheriff!”—shoots Wallace in the neck and steals jewelry.

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7. Capture in Florida

[58:17–64:45]

• October 9, 1986: In Gainesville, Florida, Glenn is spotted peeping and flees police, wrestles with a deputy, and is shot multiple times.
• Confession: From his hospital bed, Glenn confesses to the murders.
  • James (63:34): "My name is Glenn Holiday. I shot and killed four people in Alabama."
  • James imitating Glenn (63:35): “She was a lying woman. She won't be lying no more.” [winks, laughs]
• The Map: Officers find a hand-drawn “map” in his car—just a triangle with numbers, representing interstates between Chicago, St. Louis, and Nashville.

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8. Prosecution, Trial & Penalty

[66:58–73:06]

• Plenty of Evidence: Eyewitnesses and Glenn’s own confession bolster the prosecution. Glenn initially takes the stand, claims “I was in Nashville that night”—a defense the hosts mock mercilessly.
• Sentencing: After referencing Old Yeller in closing argument (“Glen Holiday is now just like Old Yeller with rabies"), the judge sentences Glenn to death in the infamous Yellow Mama electric chair.
  • James (73:06): “You, sir, may fuck off. Death penalty.”

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9. Appeals and Fate

[76:07–80:12]

• Appeals Process: Over decades, appeals on grounds of intellectual disability wind through state and federal courts.
  • Supreme Court precedent (Atkins v. Virginia, 2002) means Glenn can’t be executed due to intellectual disability—ultimately resentenced to life without parole.
  • County residents (especially victims’ relatives) left frustrated by the lack of closure.
• End of the Road: Diagnosed with cancer in prison; Glenn dies in 2012.

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• James (16:39): “He has three wives... He’s crafty, this guy.”
• James (21:19): “He loves rape, so... yeah, he’s dangerous.”
• Jimmie (38:06): “He’s the reason that habitual offender laws exist.”
• James (68:19): “This is the prosecutor’s first capital murder case, by the way.”
• James on defense strategies (69:18): "I wasn't there. Confused me for somebody else."
• James on the sentencing argument (71:43): “Remember Old Yeller?... This rabid dog needs to be put out of our community.”
• James (74:59): "[Glenn] called to the sheriff and said, before they strap me into yellow mama, you boys come on back. I’ve got some more things to tell you.”

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Key Timestamps for Important Segments

• [03:55] – Introduction to Gadsden, Alabama
• [19:55] – Glenn Holiday: Background and criminal history
• [34:53] – Rebecca’s relationship with David Robinson
• [37:00] – Glenn’s first post-divorce attack on Rebecca
• [40:25] – Night of the murders
• [44:11] – The start of the manhunt
• [47:40] – Murder of Doyle Wallace
• [58:17] – Glenn’s capture and confession in Florida
• [66:58] – Court proceedings, trial, and sentencing
• [76:07] – Appeals, resentencing, and Glenn’s death

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Tone & Style

The hosts maintain their distinctive, irreverent, and highly animated comedic style throughout, offering empathy for victims while unflinchingly mocking the ignorance, violence, and institutional failures that allowed Glenn Holiday’s criminality to spiral out of control. They balance historical and legal seriousness with regular punchlines, vivid metaphors, and southern small-town color, making a tragic story both accessible and unforgettable.

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Conclusion

“Brutal Idiocy – Gadsden, Alabama” stands out as a wild, tragic, and darkly funny journey through the intersection of deep southern poverty, institutional neglect, and the singular threat of an unstoppable, intellectually disabled but violent offender. The episode is a snapshot of small town paranoia and resilience, as well as a critical look at the criminal justice system’s mishandling of mental disability, recidivism, and parole.

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For more small town weirdness, head to shutupandgivememurder.com and check out their live shows, Patreon, and bonus content!

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Memorable final words, as always:

“You, sir, may fuck off.”
– Judge, sentencing Glenn Holiday [73:06]

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End of summary.

Transcript

[A]

Whether you're into unsolved mysteries, solved mysteries, or creating your own mysteries, Amazon Music's got millions of podcast episodes waiting. Just download the Amazon music app and start listening to your favorite podcasts ad free included with Prime.

[B]

Small Town Murder is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. Fiscally responsible financial geniuses, monetary magicians. These are things people say about drivers who switch their car insurance to progressive and save hundreds. Visit progressive.com to see if you could save Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates, but potential savings will vary. Not available in all states or situations. Hello everybody and welcome back to Small Town Murder Express.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Oh yay indeed, Jimmy. Yay indeed. My name is James Petregallo. I'm here with my co host.

[C]

I'm Jimmy Wissman.

[B]

Thank you folks so much for joining us today on another absolutely crazy. This is a wild edition.

[C]

You did it.

[B]

It's crazy. This is a lot for an express episode. It's just a wild case. I can't wait to get into it before we do very quickly here. Definitely head over to shut upandgivememurder.com tickets for live shows here. We well, if you're listening to this right when it comes out, the Durham show is happening. So probably not that. But tomorrow night in Atlanta you can still see that. You can get that and also get your tickets for Sept. I'm sorry, not September, March 21st in Phoenix, the youe Stupid Opinions live show at the Standup Live. That's going to be wonderful. And then the next show that has tickets after that is Denver and that's almost sold out and that's hurry up, get in there and do that. Shut up and give me murder.com or get yourself patreon. Do yourself a favor here, patreon.com crimeinsports just like the name of the show that we do that you should be listening to do that. Anybody $5 a month or above, you are gonna get everything. We put out. Everything. Everything. All the bonus episodes. You get hundreds of bonus episodes. You haven't heard yet immediately upon subscription. New ones every other week. You can't beat it. And one crime in sports, one Small town murderer and you get it all. You get it all this week, which you're gonna get for Small Town Murder. We're gonna talk about these alp because this is the craziest thing ever. Yeah, this is Alpine Divorce where basically like if we were married, I would take you out in the woods and say like, oh, I'm gonna go look at that rock and then just leave and then never Talk to you again.

[C]

Joke's on you. I'll be fine.

[B]

Yeah, but it's a weird thing to.

[C]

That's bizarre.

[B]

It's a strange thing to think that's

[C]

how they break up.

[B]

That's it. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. That's the form of breaking up and actually like marriages. It's wild stuff. So patreon.com crimeangel in sports is where you get all of that.

[C]

Are you saying that the men do that or both do it?

[B]

Either way. Wow. Yeah. Either way it doesn't matter.

[C]

I can't wait.

[B]

It happens on both sides. I think men are more likely to do it though. Probably still. Yeah. So in addition to that, you also get a shout out at the end of the show and you get everything that we put out, all of our shows. Your stupid opinions, small town murder and crime and sports all ad free with your Patreon as well. You can't beat it. Patreon.com crimeinsports that said, I think it's time to do this. Everybody sit back. What do you say here? It's time to clear the lungs, get comfortable, get loose. And you say, let's all sit back and let's all shout. Shut up and give me murder. Let's do this, everybody.

[C]

Okay.

[B]

Let's go on a trip, shall we? Yeah. We are going to Alabama this week. Oh, yeah.

[C]

Fuck.

[B]

We're going to Gadsden, Alabama. G A D S D E N Gadsden.

[C]

Just like the purchase.

[B]

Just like it. Northeastern Alabama. This is in middle of nowhere. Let's just say this is some interesting people in this episode this week. It's about an hour and a half to Huntsville and about an hour to Talladega, Alabama. Our last Alabama episode, episode 627, the Art of Murder, which was a wild episode. They're always crazy down in Alabama. This is Etowah County. Etowah County. E T O W A H. Now I can see how it might be said, but also in northern Alabama, it might be said completely differently. So, you know, our bets are off. Yeah, it could be Etowah. We don't know. We don't know. Area code here. 2, 56 and 938 can't hold these people with one area code. Population of this town has grown decently here.

[C]

Really?

[B]

34,317. So decent size. It's a decent sized town. Median household income here is about half of the rest of the country. Well, that's not good. Not good. $35,776 is the household Income median there. And then the median home cost, though, is also. This is like the 40s or something. $84,100. Wow. You're buying a house in 1983 is what it's like.

[C]

You got half a million dollars, you're a king.

[B]

You could live forever. Yeah. A little bit of history. The town originated around 1825. It was originally called Double Springs. It was founded by a guy named John Riley near the Natural Springs on the Coosa river. And it was incorporated in 1871. So it took him about 50 years to come around to filing paperwork here. And it was renamed after Colonel James Gadsden, who was noted for the 1853 purchase. Purchase. There you go. That's exactly why in the 1800s, it became Alabama's second most important commercial and industrial site after Mobile, of course, because that's a port here. So they had a lot of heavy industry and stuff like that going on here. They actually had the most people they've ever had in 1960, when they had a lot of industry here. They had 58,000 people there then.

[C]

So what was the industry?

[B]

All sorts of shit things for steel, tires, for Goodyear. They had all sorts of stuff down here. Reviews of this town.

[C]

Sure.

[B]

Yeah, that, too. I'm sure.

[C]

Well, that's what the belts were in tires back then. It was cotton belts.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, they had also, like, coal and ironwood. They had, like, factories and stuff, too. So.

[C]

Yeah, but when Goodyear's there, it's because of the cotton, I assure you.

[B]

Yeah. Reviews of this town,

[C]

My mind.

[B]

Here's five stars.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Born in Gadsden. Moved away after high school. Lived in Wichita, Atlanta and Tampa. Kids born in Tampa, moved back to raise my kids. Best decision ever made. New mayor is changing Gadsden to draw more people. The river in Gadsden better than anywhere.

[C]

That was a fun little journey.

[B]

That was wild. This is a whole life story where his kids are born.

[C]

Quickest life journal ever.

[B]

Yeah. Love Gadsden. That's the end. Three stars. I like the fact that everything is in driving distance and some people are friendly.

[C]

Well, where were your kids born, though?

[B]

Where were you born? Have you lived in Wichita? That's what I'd like to know.

[C]

Have you seen Atlanta?

[B]

Have you seen it? I wish that we could become a better place to live instead of becoming a retirement town.

[C]

Well, there's also a river, man. Have you heard?

[B]

It's the best there is. Don't you know that? And finally, one star. This is a good one here long. They really Lay it out for you. One star. Gadsden is a terrible city to live. Do not move here. All caps. The jobs doesn't pay much of nothing. Now unpack. That. Doesn't pay much of nothing. So that means it doesn't pay a lot.

[C]

I think the jobs doesn't.

[B]

The jobs doesn't. But shit. The English. Nevermind. I'm trying to figure out. Do they mean the jobs? Because that's a double negative. That mean they pay a lot. They doesn't pay much of nothing. So that means they pay.

[C]

They pay a whole bunch of nothing.

[B]

Yeah. I'm confused. And that's the second sentence. That's crazy. If you're not in the Gadsden clique spelled C L, I C K C K or know someone really good. You can't and won't prosper in your job position. The houses are ran down. Old and antique. Ran down. Wait.

[C]

Or antique.

[B]

That's valuable.

[C]

Isn't it?

[B]

I guess. Not here. Not excited about this. And the rent is outrageous for these old homes and apartments. I don't understand how they even pass inspections. All the city do is gouge money. All the city do. The city looks ran down and trashy through the neighborhoods. But they always want to advertise downtown. The boat dock and the Nakalula Falls to make people think it's nice here. Drive through the neighborhoods. Abandoned buildings and houses everywhere. Trees that storms have blown down are still laying all over the city. Shaking my head. Trash everywhere. As if they have no city workers working. The city of Gadsden has been pulling in so much money for years. All capsules from everyone that lives here. But we have nothing to show for it. My advice is to bypass this dump. Jesus. Angry.

[C]

Started getting better and much more succinct there.

[B]

Yeah. Seems like somebody jumped in on him. And someone was like, I don't know what I'm talking about. They're like, well, I'll type it for you. What are you trying to say?

[C]

Spelling and grammar started to warm up there at the end.

[B]

They found an English translator at the end there to help him out.

[C]

Sometimes you just got to let it cook. Wow.

[B]

It's got to simmer for a little while before you can do anything. Things to do here. The Spring Lantern Festival. Which looks boring as shit.

[C]

It's not a bunch of people lighting like Japanese lanterns.

[B]

That's what it is. They're already lit and you just look at them. It sounds dull as shit. Yeah. Wander among the glowing Chinese lanterns. Each handcrafted and illuminated with vibrant LEDs.

[C]

Oh, that's not it.

[B]

Nope. Live performances too. Looks like the whole point of a Japanese lantern is that.

[C]

Is that it floats.

[B]

Yeah. No, this is Chinese. So they're not as. Not as jovial. These lanterns are a little more. They're a little angrier and not as. A little more set on task. Yeah. Not as fun. Yeah. More than just lights. It's a journey through Chinese legends and craftsmanship. And it looks boring. And there's also pit at the Pittman Music Festival. Now we're talking at the Pittman Pit at the Pittman Music Festival with bands such as Heavy Handed, Devil in the Oasis. Not even close. Hopes on hold. Reclaim the Empire with a Y. Idle Threat before there was Rosalind. I don't know who was there first.

[C]

Is that one that I know?

[B]

I don't know. I know. Minor threat. Yeah, Ian McKay. I know that one. Fugazi and Minor Threat. I don't know. I don't know much about Idle Threat. That's a different.

[C]

I like that they named their band not even close. Because they know.

[B]

Not even Close.

[C]

Yeah, we're not even going to get.

[B]

Stay Lost. There's a bunch of different bands here. Who knows? It's at the Pittman Theater there. And there's also the Gadsden Southern Soul Fest as well. Oh, boy. Powered by La Monsta and Mr. Bowtie.

[C]

La Monsta.

[B]

La Monsta. One word and Mr. Bowtie. Two words. That's not one word there. Okay. That said, let's talk about some murder because.

[C]

Let's do it.

[B]

Wow. Do we have a wild story. Okay, let's talk about a lady first here. Rebecca Ledbetter Holiday. Let's talk about her. We're gonna start in 1986 and work around that. Okay. 1986. Rebecca Ledbetter holiday. H O L L a D A Y. Holiday A D A Y. All right. Yeah. 31 years old she is at this time. Her parents are Lester and Barbara Ann. She goes by Bobby Phillips. That's her mom. She's got a sister named Katrina who will come up in this story. She has a 1986. A 12 year old son named Shay Ledbetter. Okay, so that's her little world at this point. She's recently divorced. Very recently, like in the last couple of months here. Recently divorced from a man named Glenn William Holiday. There you go. There's the holiday. He's 37, so a few years older than her. And he's an interesting cat. Let's just say that he's got some past to him. His family that he comes from is dog shit. Just, I mean, the whole thing. His mother drank heavily while pregnant with all of her children, including Glen. Nice, very nice. And Glenn, as we can tell, I don't know if the drinking while pregnant is what did it or the beatings that he took from his father, but he's got some cognitive issues.

[C]

Real nice.

[B]

Yeah, yeah. Oh, they do, yeah. Oh, he's an abusive steak right there. She's a hardcore alcoholic. His father even admitted later that he physically and verbally abused the entire family throughout all the children's childhood. Just completely abused everybody and the mother, for that matter. They said later on in a court ruling, this is from their assessment that his childhood was replete with alleged reports of Mr. Holiday beating the children. Glenn's mother told state workers that Glenn was her slow child or her, quote, retarded child. That was what she called him.

[C]

He's the worst of the brilliance in this movie.

[B]

The slow one is him. Yeah. And she drank with all her kids. And he failed first grade, which a lot of kids, they hold him back if it's socially not working. But then he failed second grade. Oh, no, that's not good.

[C]

Strike two.

[B]

He's not doing well at nine because he was so not caught up to the rest of the kids they gave him.

[C]

And only in third grade.

[B]

Yeah, well, yeah, I should have been. I think he was only in second grade. Nine is like fourth grade usually. I think he fell too. He. They gave him an IQ test and he scored a 49, which is.

[C]

That's real low.

[B]

That is great for a one game point total in basketball. If your point. If your shooting guard scored 49 points, you're doing great. But if they scored 49 on his IQ test, it's not good. They gave it to him again 20 days later just to see if maybe he was having a bad day. And he got a 56.

[C]

Oh, had a banana that morning.

[B]

Improvement. Yeah, he had breakfast, but that is still not too great here.

[C]

Oh, boy.

[B]

His school principal at the time was quoted to state workers as saying, and this is all medical and whatever how they're doing it, so don't break my balls. That he was, quote, definitely mentally retarded. He said definitely, definitely. Like, I deal. I'm a school principal. Yeah, I know which kids are what. And he's like, this one is. We thought he was.

[C]

Now we've confirmed it and this is what it is.

[B]

Well, it's well below 70. The IQ is what they're looking at. So he met all the criteria for special education. But they were all full up on special ed, so imagine they couldn't put him in. That's what it's like now because there's been a lot of cuts to things like that. So. Wow. It's not good. Not good at all. So. Yeah, but that's what we were doing back then. Age 14, they gave him another IQ test because usually gets better as you get older. And he got a 54.

[C]

It got worse.

[B]

It got worse. That's not good. It's not good. Got worse. And a report from the state in 1963 noted his IQ of 54 and described him as, quote, barely educatable or educable.

[C]

It won't even stick even if we

[B]

tell him he's not getting it at all. He quit school at 16 because you know what grade he was in when he was 16?

[C]

Fifth.

[B]

The sixth grade. I know you were joking, but sixth grade at 16?

[C]

How you driving to sixth grade, man?

[B]

You're 11 in the sixth grade. Like, just to have him around those other kids is dangerous at that point.

[C]

That's amazing.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

He could hurt somebody.

[B]

He can't read. He can't write. He'll never learn to read or write. Completely illiterate.

[C]

But he figured out how to get married.

[B]

He has three wives. There's a. That's what I mean. He's crafty, this guy. In 1986 here, by the way, being illiterate wasn't that strange. 13% of US adults were illiterate in 1986, which is too many. That's more than 1 in 10 is illiterate. That's a lot.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Now, as a social life. In his social life, he. As a teenager, he hung around either by himself or with much younger kids, which makes sense because he was in their class. Yeah, you can't. High school kids don't want to hang out with a kid their age who's in sixth grade. Who the fuck wants to hang out with that kid?

[C]

In high school, we did the botanical gardens together. That's why we do this.

[B]

We go on field trips. He loves Chuck E. Cheese. I mean, what do you expect? He has a poor vocabulary. He has trouble following conversations and keeping up. And has trouble keeping jobs. Yet somehow women. He has no problem getting to marry him. I don't understand this. Wow. It's wild. It's crazy. He couldn't. This is his work history. Okay. Tried to go start working. He couldn't operate a ladder.

[C]

That's just one foot.

[B]

There is not a no like one that opens.

[C]

Oh, he couldn't extend it.

[B]

He couldn't like do work. Whatever things you need to do with a ladder, he couldn't do.

[C]

He couldn't open it.

[B]

Couldn't figure it out. He would set it up upside down all the time. Oh, what, like you can't. No, that's not. Okay. Can't do that. Look, it's a V. No, the other. How do you say you can't. How do you.

[C]

That ladder. It's gotta be that, right?

[B]

No, he would turn it upside down. The ladder, like the feet up, it had the extended. Yeah, so that's not good. That's bad. Yeah, the V ladder, obviously, I think even he could figure out that wasn't right. If you put it upside. He's like, obviously you're joking.

[C]

The other one has the feet. So he didn't. He kept putting the feet up at the top.

[B]

Up at the top? Yeah. Couldn't figure that out. His father ran a painting business and Glenn couldn't tell the difference between a scraper and a screwdriver. He'd bring the wrong thing. They're both flat. He'd bring the Phillips head. That's the scary part. That's the part that really is frightening.

[C]

But how do you.

[B]

Yeah, he'd get.

[C]

How do you survive like that?

[B]

It's hard. He'd get frustrated. He couldn't understand directions. And sometimes if he'd get frustrated in a job, he'd just run away. He'd just run away and that was that. He'd never come back. New job.

[C]

I love that movie. Go on coast to coast, James.

[B]

It's crazy. He worked at a. Forrest Gump was like way smarter than him.

[C]

Way smarter than him.

[B]

That's the scary part. Like he would look at Forrest Gump in wide eyed admiration of his intellect, of his mammoth intellect. He worked at a tire store at Kelly's Tire, but he couldn't operate the machines. Couldn't figure them out.

[C]

Those are complicated.

[B]

I would think. So he was relegated to just manual labor and cleaning and doing that. He never figured out how to open a bank account or do anything of that nature. By the 80s, though, he's like 6, 2, 63 and strong as a fucking ox. He can bench press later on. £400. He's a huge. Oh my gosh. Strong. He's Lenny. This is. This is Lenny right here. Yeah.

[C]

It doesn't take any brain power to put it up.

[B]

No, no, not at all. As we can see. Look at, you know, the NFL and all sorts of sports. There's lots of jacked idiots Running around. Yeah.

[C]

And every gym in America.

[B]

The Paul brothers are pretty jacked, you know what I'm saying? They're morons.

[C]

There's a bunch of idiots in this country.

[B]

Absolutely. So he would be given, over his lifetime, 11 IQ tests, and he ends up basically with a score of about 64 is what they figure out.

[C]

Stop taking them, man.

[B]

They keep getting.

[C]

They're not doing better.

[B]

He never took a test and scored above 70, which is the threshold for intellectual disability, basically. He could drive a car. That's one thing he could do. Problem is, he could drive it. But he got lost really easy. He didn't like going off the interstate because he'd get lost immediately and had no idea where he was. He would pick up hitchhikers just to ask them for help. Where are we at? Where are we? How do we get here? Can you guide me? Basically, that was what he would do.

[C]

Human gps. Yep.

[B]

He traveled regular routes between Gadsden, Atlanta and Nashville and Chicago. But he'd never go off the interstate because he was scared he'd get lost and he couldn't navigate. He also is getting arrested all the time. I mean, all the time.

[C]

That's his frustration, Right?

[B]

Burglary, theft, receiving stolen property. And he loves rape, so.

[C]

Oh, my.

[B]

Yeah, he's dangerous. A dangerous person. Yeah, this is a dangerous idiot is what this is right here. This is scary.

[C]

If there's one, there's 10. Right?

[B]

There's more of these people everywhere, all over the place. Yeah, this is scary shit. Scary. He would plan burglaries if he saw a sign on a house, a security company sticker, or Beware of dog warning or anything like that. He would see a sign on a house, he would copy down the letters, not knowing what they were, then find somebody to ask them what that meant. So if it said, the Johnsons, it's fine to break in. But if it said, we have a giant fucking dog, then he would say, okay, not that house. But he would need somebody to tell him to confer with, to make sure.

[C]

Does this say Beware of Dog, or does this say we're loaded?

[B]

What is this? Yeah, what does this say here? Does it say, please steal all of our shit? We have gold bullion stacked in the back room. Help yourself adt. You might want to bring a truck. It's pretty heavy. So he would do that, which is. I mean, at least he's trying not to get caught. I think he figured that out over time. He would be just always starting as a teenager, involved with the law. The former Gadsden police chief recalls arresting him several times over the years. When he was younger, it was usually disturbing the peace or trespassing or shit like that. But later, that's when it grew to assault and battery, burglary, receiving stolen property, assaulting a police officer, and of course, the aforementioned lots and lots of rape as well. During the burglary of a Coca Cola plant. What? He tripped a silent alarm? Does he think he's got the skills to go into, like, I get some shitty house sitting somewhere? Maybe they don't have an alarm. Coca Cola probably has it together enough to keep you out a moron.

[C]

Yeah, but that's not where they have the money.

[B]

No, I don't know what, he was trying to steal equipment or something. Well, he tripped a silent alarm trying

[C]

to get the recipe.

[B]

Yeah, that's what he's doing here. He's like, that's where they keep all the money from all the coke. They all bring it around.

[C]

They have the recipe there. I'll take the recipe, I'll make the coke, and I'm the winner.

[B]

It ain't even soda. It's just a warehouse full of money. That's where they keep it. It's all that Coke money.

[C]

And he's like, it's just polar bears and soda.

[B]

What's going on? The police arrived, and he tried to flee and was shot. Not critically, but he got shot.

[C]

He got shot.

[B]

The chief said that he remembers arresting him on a rape charge and said, he surrendered to me peacefully. In that particular instance, he was, according to the Alabama Bureau of Investigation, Lt. Jim Nabors, or Joe Nabors. He called him a, quote, serial rapist.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

He would later admit to several rapes throughout the entire region. What he would do is he's a peeper. He would look in the window, see if people were home, and watch a woman do some stuff and get all fucking worked up. And then he would come back, he'd find the best. He'd peep a few windows, find out the best situation, and then go circle back to that. In and out of jail constantly. He twice tried to escape from jail, as we'll talk about as well. Yeah, the first attempt he tried was it ended pretty quickly because he injured himself while fleeing, which will happen crashing through the wall. No, no. He tied bed sheets together because I'm sure he saw that in a movie. Bugs Bunny did that one time and was using them to lower himself down the wall at the county jail, but the sheets tore because it's cheap. Sh.

[C]

And he's Fucking huge.

[B]

It's not thousand thread count Egyptian cotton here that they have at the jail, I would assume.

[C]

And you don't weigh what a rabbit weighs.

[B]

No. Yeah, bugs had the drop on you. His svelte and he hurt both of his feet and ankles. So then he was just laying there at the bottom needing help. Now please help me. While the bed sheets dangled above his face. Hey everybody. Just gonna take a quick break from the show to tell you about the safest sponsor we could possibly have. Simply safe.

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[C]

Now back to the show.

[B]

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[C]

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[C]

Oh, really?

[B]

Yes, his brother Calvin, one of the police officers said the officer was looking for a suspect and went into an abandoned building. He came upon Calvin, who was hiding behind a couch. The officer reacted to the movement and fired his weapon. So the family was later awarded $270,000 in a lawsuit settlement, which is in the early 80s in Gadsden, Alabama. Might as well be $50 million. A house now is $84,000. That's crazy. So that's what happened then. He was 20 at the time, his brother Calvin, when he was shot. He's got three ex wives at this point. He also travels under the name Bobby Hill. Yep, that's his name. He didn't know. He didn't know that would be funny someday. He had no idea.

[C]

I don't know you. That's my first.

[B]

Bobby Hill from Gadsden is who he was. And he was traveling crazy. Also, he describes people to everybody that he's, quote, best friends with animals. Oh, I really like dogs. Yeah. You could give him like a possum and he'll be. Thinks he can. Like he's like Dr. Dolittle basically.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Is what he's doing.

[C]

Little. Yeah.

[B]

Wife number one, I believe her name was either last name Morgan or first name Morgan, something like that. Apparently she said that he coerced her into marriage through threats to kill her and her family. Marry me or I'll kill your family. And she said, I guess I better marry him.

[C]

Coerced her.

[B]

Yeah, no, he's a real hot commodity. And she said, I'll kill your whole family if you don't marry me, you big sexy thing. You

[C]

don't marry me, I'm killing everybody.

[B]

Yeah, that's wild. So she married him eventually and then got divorced. Wife number Two, there was a bunch of abuse in the relationship that didn't last long. And then wife number three is Rebecca Ledbetter Holiday, who we started out with here. She's about six years younger than him. The marriage fell apart. Because he's him.

[C]

Because he's Glenn.

[B]

He's Glenn. That's just how he is. And they got a divorce. So her new life away from him, she took. Took the son, Shea, and moved into a mobile home on Tidmore Bend Road and started a new life.

[C]

Is this Glenn's son?

[B]

No, no, no, no, no, no. This kid's like 12 years old.

[C]

Okay, good.

[B]

So, yeah, Glenn was. He was married to two people. Since this kid's been born now, she also even has a new boyfriend, William David Robinson. And she must go to him because he's 7 foot tall, black, and in the Navy. He's this very steady man. It's a naval officer, for Christ's sake.

[C]

He's a wonderful human being. Very respectful, polite man.

[B]

Plays terrific post defense. Also, he's very good.

[C]

Most amazing biceps you've ever seen.

[B]

Oh, jacked. He looks jacked.

[C]

His arms are the most beautiful thing. Yeah, I was blown away by them.

[B]

Male Michelle Obama is what he looks like. He's like jacked arms. Yeah.

[C]

Ripped up.

[B]

And he goes by David Robinson, which is hilarious.

[C]

I would, too.

[B]

What year is this? This is 86. Before David Robinson was even a thing. So he set the trend. This guy.

[C]

Yeah, David Robinson's in the Navy right now.

[B]

Yeah, exactly. He's born in 61, this guy. He's one of seven children, and he was working in Georgia at the time and met her and they got together. Now, his sister Jane describes him as a kind, gentle, charming, good old boy.

[C]

David Robinson.

[B]

David Robinson. He's a good old boy with no temper and very protective of others, by the way.

[C]

Even Kiel fella.

[B]

That's right. Now, this town, by the way, all the pictures in the newspaper of everybody. Everybody is standing in front of a junked car wearing not enough shirt and with stains all over them. Every single person in this fucking story is a stained shirt guy whose best photo op is in front of their junked car in the front yard while

[C]

he was just working on it.

[B]

It's so weird. It's almost like, yeah, I'm working on this one.

[C]

It'll be running pretty soon here.

[B]

Pretty soon. Now, he knew Rebecca. They were friends from being kids and reconnected through her brother. And then they were dating, and it was starting to get More serious as 1986 goes on in March of 1986, Glenn is in jail. He's at the Cherokee County Jail in center Alabama. Now, he was there because DeKalb county had arrested him for receiving stolen property. The DeKalb facility was undergoing construction, so they shipped him to Cherokee county temporarily. Now, on a day when most of the staff was in court, there was court stuff going on. There was only one jailer on duty. Now, Glenn's a big, powerful lunatic. He overpowered the guard and took his gun and locked the jailer in the cel cell. Like a crazy Western movie overtook the. Literally said, now you get in the cell and locked him in there, and then just walked out.

[C]

The easy way for that not to happen. Don't walk up to the cell and open at all.

[B]

Don't get your gun close enough to the cell. Well, if he was taking him for a shower or taking him for something like that, I don't know, I'd wait

[C]

till everybody else gets back, I guess.

[B]

I guess. But that's what happens. So. And the county sheriff at the time said, as I remember, we only had one jailer on that particular day. About all of us were at court. Yeah. So what ended up happening after that? He and another inmate, Miller, this guy, they left that day, and they took a red pickup truck driven by Howard Courson. They carjacked a guy and made a guy drive them somewhere. They forced Corson at gunpoint to take them across the state line to Georgia.

[C]

After he locked the jailer in the jail.

[B]

After he locked the jailer in the jail. So now he is a fugitive from justice. He's armed and illiterate and a dangerous

[C]

man on his way to Georgia.

[B]

On his way to Georgia. So sometime in this, after he escaped, he showed up at Rebecca's trailer.

[C]

While he's on the run, he's there.

[B]

Yeah. So he's wanted on escape charges. He's a fugitive. He's wanted for kidnapping. But he shows up at the trailer, broke in and beat the shit out of Rebecca, and then left after the cops were called, somehow snuck away and got away from everybody. Wow. Yeah, Crafty. Now, Rebecca, obviously is scared of him after that, I don't think. Larry.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

So David Robinson here, he thought the threat was serious as well, so he brought a gun over to the house for her to protect herself with here. Now, Rebecca was afraid. Everybody was afraid. Brings a gun in, says in case Glenn comes over, shoot him in the fucking head. Ask questions later, basically, so many times. Now, he has such a long record. The County Sheriff, Roy McDowell, when questioned about Holiday's criminal record, said, you name it, he's done it, which is awesome. That's pretty fucking amazing. We've been dealing with him for 25 years now, so I'm not surprised at anything he'll do.

[C]

But don't worry, he'll be out soon.

[B]

He'll be out soon and you know, then we'll put him back in and you know, we got a real. Just kind of go around in circles around.

[C]

He's the reason that habitual offender laws exist, so that you can lock them up longer, right?

[B]

We call them the hokey pokey laws. You put yourself in, turn yourself around and put your left leg out on out. You're on out now. And that's, that's how it works. 1986, in August, he's in Nashville. He meets a man named Richard John Hardy. Dick Hardy over here. And that's Hardy, like, like hearty, like stout.

[C]

Like the soup.

[B]

I'm hearty? Yeah, like the adjective for a chunky soup. Hardy, he introduced himself as Bobby Hill from Gadsden, Alabama. So he met a person there. That'll come up again. 8-23-86, he visited Hardy at his house. While he's there, he mentioned that his ex wife's name was Becky and that she had a new boyfriend. And very matter of factly, if she doesn't stop seeing him and I'm going to kill her. So there's that. The fuck he said verbatim, quote, if she didn't stop seeing him, he was gonna kill her. That's what the guy said. He met this guy once, so I guess he figured he's talking to him under an assumed name, so who cares, I guess. Now, August 24, 1986. This evening, at the mobile home on Pope Road here. This is where Rebecca is. And there's a lot of mobile homes. They're very close together. Everybody hears everything. It's a trailer park. If one person's fucking. You're like, oh, Billy's getting it on down there, down there, number four, boy. He's letting. Oh, he's putting it on her, boy. You hear that? And there you're at number 14 too. You're well distance away here. So the police, or. I'm sorry, police, there's people present here. She's there, Rebecca, her son Shay is there, her sister Katrina is there. And also David Robinson is there practicing layup drills in the driveway, obviously that hook shot. And Also Larry Thomas Jr. Is there, who's the 16 year old from next door who's spending the night with Shea because they're best friends. Even though he's 16 and Shay's 12. Yeah, okay, whatever.

[C]

We don't know if they don't go to school together.

[B]

That's what I mean. They might be in the same class. So. Larry Thomas Jr. Is 16. His family calls him Hook, by the way, which is not a great nickname.

[C]

He's missing a hand.

[B]

It's something. No, his mom calls him that. Oh, that's like a cute nickname. He's got all his appendages, from what I understand. I'm not sure. He's the only child of Larry Thomas Sr. And Claire Fletcher. So he lives real close by. And he spending the night now, as this is all going on. Rebecca's in her bedroom. David Robinson is in there with him. Shea is in his room. And Katrine is also there. Rebecca's sister. Okay, okay. And Larry Thomas is there, like we said, spending the night at the friend's house. So this little trailer has five people in it. So we know that at some point, Larry Thomas decides that there's nothing here to eat. And he's gonna walk back to his house quick to grab a snack. Okay. And I'll be back in a minute. So he walks out the front door of the trailer to go to his house. As he's doing that, he gets shot. What? He gets shot. Someone was waiting in the darkness outside the trailer for him.

[C]

He's just going back for Baked lays. And he gets shot.

[B]

He gets shot. I don't think the word baked enters into anybody's vocabulary here. Do you have extra deep fried lays? Extra. You have ones that are worse for me. Got anything like that at all? Cooked in more fat. Do you have Lard Lays? Is that possible? So he walks out there. Apparently Glenn thought he was David Robinson. He thought it was dark. Yeah, he saw a guy walk out, so he shot him twice.

[C]

My God.

[B]

Larry Thomas Jr. Collapsed outside the trailer and dies. Killed a 16 year old. So then Glenn forces his way into the front door, armed and obviously violent. Katrina is up getting ready for bed. She saw him come in. She yells for Rebecca, holy shit, Glenn's here. She screams that Glenn, rather than shoot Katrina, just shoves her aside like a monster movie. Shoves her aside and keeps moving down the hallway. Now he stops at shay's bedroom. The 12 year old, he tries to turn the light on. He's trying to find it in the dark, and he can't find the light. So he gives up and keeps moving on. Now, Shay recognized him, you know, because there's more light in the hallway. And he's a big guy. So Glenn moves down the hall. Shay and Katrina now. Cause he's past them. So Shay runs out of his room. Him and Katrina go run next door to Larry Thomas house to call the cops. Along the way they find Larry Thomas corpse in the front yard.

[C]

Oh, that's Shay's buddy. That's so fucked.

[B]

Yes, that's so fucked. And now they're going to his house. Hi, can we use your phone? And your kid's dead right there, right? That's brutal. So they get to the back bedroom. Now Glenn gets to the back bedroom. And we know that Rebecca was crouching, she was in a ball cow, cowering from this man. And he shot her. The bullet entered the back of her head and exited through her right breast. So you know, she was all crouched down very low. Yeah. So that's horrifying. David Robinson is shot in the chest and in the arm as well.

[C]

Oh boy. Oh, the arm was probably first, right?

[B]

Not sure which. He just shot twice. Shot everybody twice. Apparently that's what he knows to do. Then he leaves the trailer. So Katrina and Shay call 911 from the trailer next door. Obviously Larry Jr. And David are dead at the scene when police arrive already. Rebecca was transported to a hospital where she died shortly after.

[C]

Oh, Jesus.

[B]

So this was a slaughter. Three people, two of them, they don't even know this fucking guy. You know what I mean? This is crazy. One of them, he doesn't even know so much he mistook a 16 year old for.

[C]

Right?

[B]

It's crazy. So Glenn is nowhere to be found and they're hunting him now. Now it's a hunt and it is insane. It's pretty much the biggest manhunt in the history of the county, really. State agencies, federal officers, bloodhounds, helicopters, planes. I mean you, anything 1986 technology they could whip out, they were doing. People are locking their doors. It's scary shit. And this. They don't find him. What? They don't find him. This goes on for how long? Weeks. This goes on for weeks. They can't find a man with a 64, a giant man with a 64 IQ. They can't come up with him. The district attorney said it was a time when everybody was keeping their doors locked, watching behind themselves and watching dark corners and everything. The sheriff at the time said the people were terrified here. Absolutely terrified. And they said it involved one of the biggest task forces with state, federal and local law enforcement participating because the case affected everybody. Where the hell did he go, so Larry Thomas Sr. Said, they'll have to kill him to get him. He said, so that's what he says. They're gonna have to kill him. There's a wanted poster here that's available on ebay, by the way. Oh, absolutely. Do you want it? I'm gonna get it. Yeah, for sure. It's a wanted poster for Roy in a picture or Roy Holliday. Glenn. Yes. I think of Roy Halliday, the pitcher that's popped in the hall of Fame picture. Popped in my mind for some reason. Glenn, William Holliday here. So he's on the move. What he's doing is he's going to the cheapest motels he can find where they don't want to look at your face twice because they assume you're either a fugitive or there for prostitution purposes or something, or to do drugs, horrible

[C]

drugs that you're gonna leave shit all over the room that poor people have

[B]

to clean up, possibly to blow your brains out in there. Either way, maybe. Yeah. None of my business what you're doing there.

[C]

All of the worst things that people do.

[B]

No one goes to the cheapest motel they could find to, like, you know, write a new verse of the Bible or something like. That's never happened or stay before. Disney. Yeah, just. Oh, come on, kids, load up. He would trade his car all the time to avoid detection and sometimes even make money. He would, like, sell the car that he just had for something better. Something better or worse or whatever. He called his brother after the murders, and we'll talk about that. He made his own map because he can't read a map, so he made his own map, which is fun. We'll find out about that.

[C]

Oh, I want to see that map.

[B]

He called his neighbor on August 29, a former neighbor named Doris Ruth Nance. She was a neighbor of his father and told her that he had, quote, done a bad thing.

[C]

I think he'd done a lot of bad things.

[B]

He's done more than one. Yeah. He told her that he did not mean to kill Larry Thomas, and he felt terrible about it. He said, I thought it was David. I don't feel bad about killing Rebecca and David. They deserved it. But he said, the kid, that was a mistake, and I didn't mean that shit, and I feel bad about it. Okay, so September 6, 1986, a retired Alabama state trooper named Doyle Embry Wallace is murdered in Southside, Alabama.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Doyle Wallace is Rebecca Holliday's uncle.

[C]

Okay.

[B]

Yes. We find out that basically Glenn showed up at his house in the morning, broke the door down screaming, quote, I'm the sheriff. I'm the sheriff. Which is not how cops enter the house. I'm the sheriff. I'm. I'm the sheriff. I'm just running into your house, arm, kicking your door down.

[C]

The sheriff ain't usually the one leading the charge.

[B]

No, you say sheriff's department. You don't say. Like Reno911. You don't say, I'm the sheriff, I'm the sheriff.

[C]

No, it's usually a deputy or a whole. Or a whole gaggle of them.

[B]

Something. So Wallace hid in the bedroom closet. This is Wallace's wife hid in the bedroom closet while Wallace was shot once in the neck at close range.

[C]

Oh my God.

[B]

Glenn stole some jewelry and left, which is crazy. So I guess he knew where this guy was. I don't know what happened here, but did Wallace survive? No, he died.

[C]

Oh my God.

[B]

He's shot in the neck at close range and murdered his wife. They never, I guess, hid in the closet. Glenn never knew the wife was even there. So she survived. So he's on the move after this now. They moved the manhunt to this area to Southside, Alabama. One of the police Officers said there's a 50, 50 chance we had a reliable sighting. Supposedly he knocked on the door of a house where a woman knew who he was. She opened the door just as her phone rang. And she saw him run across the street and into some woods. So a bunch of officers were called in. They combed the woods, they brought dogs in. They didn't find him. The police, the bullets that were found in Wallace matched the gun used to kill Rebecca. Larry and David Robinson still got the same gun. Still got the same gun. Now rumors and fear and shit is spreading like crazy. One guy here, Red Blanks. Is his name Red.

[C]

That is a birth name.

[B]

James? Yep. Red Blanks.

[C]

That is not a nickname.

[B]

Oh, no, no. He owns Blanks Barbershop.

[C]

Uh huh.

[B]

He sees the motive to the case. He said, well, this man was married to Mrs. To Rebecca Holiday's aunt. And he was killed because it had something to do with the divorce. This guy said the rumor is that he talked her into the divorce, then later played matchmaker, introducing her to Robinson. That's the rumor. People just made that shit up. Nobody knew that. They said he said he was going to get everybody that had anything to do with the divorce. So one of his friends said. Another people said. Another person said, people talk about a list, that he's got a list of People he's gonna get. What I say to them is, have you seen this list? Do you know anyone who has? It's a ridiculous thing to get rumors started like that. Yeah, I would say people are very cautious here. Everything's going crazy. They said they're getting 60 calls a day to the county with someone sees someone riding through the neighborhood on a bicycle, they'll call the cops and they got to go check it out now. So it's a lot. He said he doesn't want to discourage people from talking, but you know, people be talking, you know, if it's a 5 foot 7 black guy, probably don't call us. It's not him. You know what I mean?

[C]

And also, you think he can operate a bicycle?

[B]

I don't. Yeah, No, I don't. He can't operate a map. So more rumors here. They said, as FBI special Agent said, you hear rumor after rumor after rumor, but that's all they are, just rumors. They said that at one point there was a rumor that he dressed up as a woman so he could go to his ex wife's funeral and be undetected. He's a 6 foot 3, 230 pound man who's gonna dress up like a woman and blend right into the crowd. No one's gonna notice that that was an actual rumor that was going on. Wow. This is how ridiculous this is. This is small town murder at its finest right here. So the FBI guy said there's absolutely no truth to that. He's six foot two, over 200 pounds. People would have noticed him.

[C]

Yeah, I did hear the rumor that he was gonna pretend to be an elderly British lady and just babysit the kids.

[B]

Just watch Shay over and over just

[C]

to get his parent to die.

[B]

Jesus Christ. So there's a sighting here. A woman calls the cops. More than 40 officers went to the area around this person's house because somebody saw someone in their backyard acting suspiciously. The one guy said, oh, they look like a bunch of honeybees coming down to the hive. Talking about the cops coming. They had their vests and their dogs and their helicopter, but they didn't find him. I kept on working. I ain't scared. He's mean, but I'm meaner than him. That's one of the neighbors said that.

[C]

Oh, really?

[B]

I'm meaner than him.

[C]

I'm scared of that guy.

[B]

In the newspaper also, I'll read right from this article. To add to the mystique surrounding the case, William said he's been told by the holidays that they are Descendants of Doc Holliday. Mm. The Wyatt Earp Doc. Whose name is John Henry. His name is not Holiday. That's a fake name.

[C]

Is it not John. John Henry Holliday.

[B]

I thought it was John Henry. I thought that was his name. I could be. I think it's John Henry Holiday.

[C]

I think it's John. John Henry Holliday. But the spelling is not that way.

[B]

Yeah, with an I. But I mean a hundred years spelling.

[C]

Oh, okay. You might miss a letter.

[B]

Well, no, there's people. Petra Gallos, who are Petragala. There's ones that are that lose the I. There's people spell. Yeah. They change spellings of their names.

[C]

Really?

[B]

Oh, yeah. Absolutely. That happens all the fucking time.

[C]

Okay.

[B]

People around Gadsden say that he won't be taken without a fight. Red Blank said it's a fact. He's going down when they find him. I think all the police officers will be cautious about this. Even a good strong veteran policeman has gotta be a little scared for sure. Because he's gonna try em. That's what's gonna happen here. Um, so anyway, the other people say, the other rumors are that Holiday has a vendetta against the police because his brother was shot and killed.

[C]

Oh.

[B]

They're looking for him in the woods. One person says, this is Red Blanks again. A lot of people like to say he's in the woods and all raggedy and everything. He said. I think he's undoubtedly got people helping him. He's probably got a house somewhere near Georgia right now.

[C]

It's a lot of speculation.

[B]

Yep. And the people are buying guns everywhere. The guy who owns the gun shop said people are calling, asking about guns. How much is a gun? They don't say what kind or anything, just a gun. There's a lot of hysteria out there and I don't understand it. That's because you're the guy with all the guns. Of course you don't understand. You're like, I just unloaded all your guns. Oh, man. Then at one point, one of the guys who knows him said, quote, he ain't no mad dog.

[C]

No.

[B]

Nope. He just got in a piece of business and now he's in deep a piece of business. Was he in the Gambino family? The fuck are you talking about?

[C]

He's not mad dog.

[B]

He ain't no mad dog. He's not a mad dog. Come on now. If you were in jail and got a letter from your wife about a divorce, what would you do? There's two sides to every story. Not go to her house and murder everybody. That's what I would do. I'd get the divorce and get pissed off.

[C]

And you're married and you don't expect a letter that you're getting a divorce to.

[B]

Right?

[C]

You're an idiot.

[B]

Yeah, I would say. I would write 15 minutes of standup about it. Probably. I'd write a good chunk. That's what I would do if I'm in jail, not murder.

[C]

And I'm gonna be there a while. If I don't get a letter, I'm filing for divorce. Cause this woman will stay with any moron.

[B]

No shit. So he goes on to say, he's a good fellow. If you know him, I've got nothing against him. He's smart, okay? This guy has lost all credibility.

[C]

There goes the moron.

[B]

He's not a mad dog. He's looking up to this man intellectually, like, this is wild. He said, got to be to run from the law as long as he has another person says, what bothers me is people trying to make a hero out of him. Why? How would he be a hero? He's just going around murdering people that don't deserve it. How's that a hero? That's fucking crazy. Now, one person that was a friend of his, a neighbor of his, Mrs. Wallace Harp, who's a neighbor of Rebecca and knew him, describes Glenn as, quote, one of the nicest people you could ever know. What she said, she and her family will not sit out their front. That will not sit on their front porch without a gun for protection. But they said that he was such a nice guy, whenever he came into the store she worked. And also one time at the county fair, him and all the neighborhood kids were hanging out, including Larry Thomas. And he was treating all the children to whatever they wanted. He's just being the nicest guy. He's grooming them is what it sounds like. And the woman said, he was just having a ball.

[C]

Why you got that pistol?

[B]

Then she said, yeah, what's with all this gun? Philip, what's happening? He said, if I had seen him when he broke out of jail, I would not have reported him. That's what she said.

[C]

What?

[B]

That's what she said. Which is fucking amazing. Weeks later, he's still on the run.

[C]

This is unbelievable.

[B]

Kidnapped some other guy at one point. That's another thing that happened to use him as his own little personal gps because he couldn't know where the hell he was going. He was asking somebody for directions. Just grabbed him and said, you know where you're going, coming with me. He called his brother somewhere along the way and his brother said, quote, he said unless a miracle happened, I would find out publicly in a few days that he's gone to the next world. He said that his brother said that he was ready to give up everything and ready to join my mother and brother and go to the next world. He said that he had already talked with God and found out that things would be better in the next world. That's what Glenn said. But yeah, it was actually a guy named Gary that he met at a truck stop. And he just got confused because he doesn't spell very well. He saw it on his shirt and he was like, capital G. That's God right there. That's it. He said. I told him if you don't get right in this one, it won't be meaning you got to get right in this life or else you're not going to do that. He said he fears his older brother's flight will end the same way as his other brother who got killed. So October 9, 1986, he's in Gainesville, Florida.

[C]

Nothing good has ever happened in Gainesville, Florida.

[B]

Absolutely not. Nope. He was heading back to his hotel in Lake City and then he stopped because he saw an apartment and he wanted to peep. So he peeped. He goes peeping. A neighbor saw him peeping, called the cops. Yeah. So they send a cop there and he gets away from the cop. He gets away. Then another cop found him at this apartment complex. He got away on a foot chase from the one cop. Another cop showed up, encountered him and told him to freeze. He apparently grabbed the deputy's service revolver. This is his move that he does. The deputy had a backup weapon. Pulls that out, shoots Glenn in the abdomen, arm and in the chest. Three times.

[C]

Has to shoot him three times.

[B]

Three times he goes down.

[C]

Uh huh.

[B]

Hey everybody. Just gonna take a quick break from the show to tell you how to get the best clothes easier and much less expensive with quince.

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[C]

Yeah, it's terrific.

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[A]

Whether you're solving murders during breakfast, cracking cold cases on your commute, or playing amateur detective at bedtime, Amazon Music's got millions of podcast episodes waiting. Just download the Amazon Music app and start listening to your favorite true crime podcasts ad free included with Prime.

[B]

Small Town Murder is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. Fiscally responsible financial geniuses, monetary magicians. These are things people say about drivers who Switch their car insurance to Progressive and save Hundreds. Visitors visit progressive.com to see if you could save Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates, but potential savings will vary. Not available in all states or situations. So now he's at the emergency room saying, literally, quote, I want my mommy. I want my mommy is what he's saying.

[C]

Stop it.

[B]

So Officer Pete Bridget arrives at the scene. He's at the emergency room. Glenn's been shot three times. Potentially life threatening wounds, chest, abdomen, arm. He's receiving treatment, but he's kind of conscious and talking. So they asked the physician, mind if I read him his Miranda rights? And the doctor said, I don't give a fuck. He's conscious. Do whatever you want, basically. So he read him the rights. Glenn said he understood them. And Glenn said he wanted to talk. And then he looked up at the guy and he said, my name is Glenn Holiday. I shot and killed four people in Alabama. There you go. He thought he killed four at the time, but he didn't know that the other guy was dead. He thought he killed other people but ended up killing four that he killed. He said, they say I killed five people over a woman. She was a lying woman. She won't be lying no more.

[C]

Oh my God.

[B]

That's what he said to the cop. Then he laughed and winked. He gave him the old, you get what I'm saying? You get it, right, buddy? You know what I'm talking about. Them women be lying. He laughed and winked. He fucking winked.

[C]

As if the joke is so buried beneath the surface.

[B]

You get it, right? Kill your ex, her new husband, an uncle, a child. Just kill everybody. You understand what I'm getting at, right?

[C]

I killed for people. Oh, lying woman. She won't be lying no more.

[B]

Won't be lying no more. Winkity wank. He's under armed guard so he doesn't run away. Now, during the search of his car, they found a small piece of paper with a triangle drawn on it. A number on each line of the triangle. They couldn't figure out what it was. Then they figured out it's a fucking map he made on his own because he can't read maps. The numbers, the numbers were root numbers of the interstates connecting Chicago, St. Louis and Nashville.

[C]

Oh, he's that dumb.

[B]

He's that dumb. He just drew that one.

[C]

This one goes over here, this one goes over here, this one goes over here.

[B]

He drew himself a map. That's right. Which is wild. Wow. Now the reactions. Everybody's very happy. They said things are getting back to normal now. And now they don't have to be so scared. But other residents said, well, he escaped from jail before. Who says he won't escape again? He could be doing that. So he is never charged for the Doyle Wallace murder in the neck. Never charged for. Killed a retired cop, shot him in the neck. Not charged for it ever. There's a reason for that, as we'll talk about, Though he does admit to a lot of other shit, though. He admits that In November of 1985 he was present when a man named Elton Barksdale. Not Avon Barksdale, Elton Barksdale was killed. And his body was burned in his home in the Duck Springs community. He said he was there for that. And this is a real murder that happened. He was an elderly antique collector. Found inside his burned home. He was fatally shot.

[C]

Jesus.

[B]

Yeah, that was in 1985. So, yeah, so he admits to that. He tells investigators about multiple murders and multiple rapes he's committed all over the fucking region. Everywhere he's. He rapes everywhere he goes. Okay. And he's also.

[C]

I mean, this is kind of the dream for an investigator. You want him to just investigate?

[B]

Yeah. Scared the shit out of me for a second. Oh, just going around raping and killing.

[C]

What a weekend.

[B]

I mean, boy, this guy really lives the life, doesn't he?

[C]

I've heard of people going to Abijah,

[B]

but I was about to turn the recorder off right now. Hold on, stop, wait. We got to talking about. We got to talk. We got to have a long chat.

[C]

So as an investigator, this is like a dream come true for like somebody just be giving you all this information.

[B]

Yeah. Telling you everything.

[C]

This never. This is what we want usually, but I don't want this.

[B]

I think I just found out.

[C]

I don't want it.

[B]

They're not going to charge him with any of the rapes. Yeah, none of that stuff. They're only going to charge him. Besides the murders at the trailer, the only thing they're going to charge him with is the kidnapping charge. For kidnapping the guy when he got out of jail. When he escaped jail and held him

[C]

a gun in the red truck.

[B]

Yeah. So everybody relaxes. The man hunts over. Larry Sr. His son has been killed. Said I will rest a little easier now. But the search for Holiday is all that has been keeping me going. Because then he has to real now he has to.

[C]

That was something to do that's stopping me from grieving. Now I have to grieve. This is going to suck.

[B]

Yep. They say packing a.38 revolver and a police scanner. Thomas has spent weeks in his pickup, traveling from county to county searching for Holiday. He's just been looking for him on his own. If I find him, put a.38 slug in him. Boy, that's something.

[C]

He said, all I need is five rounds. I'll get him.

[B]

That's it. He said, if I got my pants on, I got my gun. I don't feel like I can put it. I don't feel like I can put it up yet. Just in case. They said Thomas was working on a hot water heater and listening to the police scanner when he heard a dispatcher say that Holiday had been capped, captured. And they said, did you hear? Did you hear? They got Glenn Holiday? He said that his wife told him that here, and he said, it's crazy. They said, we're relieved that Glenn isn't gonna hurt anybody else. That's the sister. So she said, that's. That trial comes up, tons of security because he's a dangerous maniac. This is the prosecutor's first capital murder case, by the way.

[C]

Nice.

[B]

Perfect. The defense say they shouldn't allow any of his statements he made at the hospital while he was.

[C]

Of course, they say that.

[B]

They said it was involuntary because he was possibly on medication. He's illiterate. He's got limited cognitive function to begin with. If he loses some blood, I can't imagine his IQ's gonna go up.

[C]

He's been shot three times.

[B]

They bring in Katrina, who said, he shoved me aside and went down the hallway. They bring in Shay to testify, who said, I saw him in the hallway with a gun. It's pretty open and shut. Whether they have his admissions or not. It's pretty open and shut. The guy from Georgia testifies that, or Tennessee testifies that Bobby Hill from Gadsden wanted to kill his wife Becky. Glenn testifies on his own behalf. Smart. He's thinking this one. Wow. He said, I wasn't even there at the trailer. I didn't kill anybody. He said, I was in Nashville that night. Oh, what about all those people that saw you there?

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

He said, well, I wasn't there. Confused me for somebody else.

[C]

They're confused.

[B]

Very confused. Verdict guilty of first degree murder.

[C]

His defense was, I wasn't there.

[B]

Wasn't me. Wasn't me. This is he actually. Do you know this? Actually? He, in the future, was a songwriter. Yeah. And Shaggy took him up on what he had going on. He was like, this is brilliant. No matter what happens, you just say, it wasn't me. But what if they say, you're on Camera one me.

[C]

Wasn't me.

[B]

One me, that's all.

[C]

What if I saw you? One me.

[B]

Wasn't me. I don't know what to tell you. So awaiting sentencing, he does a jailhouse interview like a fucking idiot and says, quote, I think I'm a good person. Some bad things have just happened to me. Some bad to me. To me, not the rape victims and all of the murdered people. Wow. He says he can bench press £400. Okay. More reason to keep you in there. You're dangerous. A maniac and scaring.

[C]

Lift a Volkswagen. Oh, God.

[B]

So during sentencing, the prosecution said that, you know, he's sick and tired of violent people in the community. The prosecutor said, yeah. He said he made an argument about Thanksgiving dinner, saying David Robinson would have been at Thanksgiving with his family the previous year if Glenn hadn't escaped from jail. Then he said, remember Old Yeller? He said, good dog, frontier family, loyal protector. Then the dog encounters a rabid animal, fights it off, but gets infected. He said, glen Holiday is now just like Old Yeller with rabies. What? Dude, this case is the craziest thing I've ever heard in my life. You don't know what mean. I. At 4:00 clock in the morning, I was doing that. I go, what am I typing? What is happening right now? He said, it's not. And it's not easy to do. I know, because almost 11 years ago, I stood right here and begged for a man's life. And it is not easy. But when you got something like, he's got rabies, you don't have any choice. You've got to kill it. And this rabid dog needs to be put out of our community.

[C]

Is that what Old Yeller got?

[B]

He was really a bad guy. The defense objected and went, you, Honor. I mean, Jesus Christ, what are we talking about? And the judge said, nope, I'm going to allow it.

[C]

I like it. It's a good analogy.

[B]

He said, it's a proper illustration of future dangerousness. Wow, Glenn, that shit affects the brain.

[C]

That dog will never heal.

[B]

Ain't never gonna be right. Glen's dad testifies and said he was a good little kid, but somewhere along the way, he just got mean.

[C]

He got bit. He got raped.

[B]

Meanwhile, his dad also said he beat the shit out of him constantly. So wonder what made him mean, stupid.

[C]

Yeah, you gave him mental rabies.

[B]

That's perfect. The judge found two aggravating circum. The court finds two aggravating circumstances. One, the offense was committed while he was under sentence of imprisonment. And escaped prison. And two, he had previously been convicted of felonies, including the threat of violence to a person. So they found non statutory mitigating factors because the death penalty is on the table. His terrible childhood, the abuse and neglect he suffered, his slight retardation, which the judge even said in open court, said that about him, his lack of formal education. But the judge also says, you, sir, may fuck off. Death penalty.

[C]

Oh, shit.

[B]

In the yellow mama electric chair, which is the county's chair, which is a bright fucking yellow electric chair. For some reason, like the yellow Mama, it's the color of a yellow Lego. Like, it's like eye searingly yellow. I don't know why they do that. The yellow mama, Yellow mama he gonna rock to sleep in the yellow mama also assessed him $10,000 in victim compensation, which, good luck with that. That he also gets convicted of kidnapping as well. And another separate trial. He's sentenced to life in prison for that. Then there's a trial of his alleged helper. There was a guy who helped him here as well. Croft is his last name. Tommy Wayne Croft. And he's found guilty of hindering prosecution by buying a car for Holiday. Croft said that. He said that he was terrified of him. He said the guy's a fucking. He forced me, he said. I wanted him to get the hell away from me. I didn't want him to come back for me, all that he's done. So I helped him. Doesn't matter. He got convicted anyway. He's gonna appeal everything here. September of 88, his conviction is affirmed and his sentence is affirmed again. Alabama Supreme Court affirmed in 89. U.S. supreme Court declined to review the case. His direct appeals were exhausted. They set an execution date for September of 1990, but it's delayed by different appeals and a new date's gonna be set and all of that. So he's denied state post conviction relief in 90 and 91. It's affirmed on appeal in 92. U.S. supreme Court denies him again in 94. He filed a federal habeas corpus petition in 94 claiming ineffective assistance of counsel. While he's on death row appealing all this, he's also telling them more shit that he did.

[C]

Really.

[B]

He called to the sheriff and said, before they strap me into yellow mama, you boys come on back. I've got some more things to tell you. That's what he said. And they said he told them all about these rapes and all about this shit. And they said he didn't show any sorrow for what he had done. He kept talking about it. He'd bring it up. He'd add details. He'd offer new information. Why is he appealing?

[C]

Everything else, then?

[B]

I don't know. It's crazy. Well, I guess his lawyers are appealing. I don't know if he has much to do with that. They said also, this sheriff said he knew this guy Glenn, before he was elected sheriff. He said he had been a shift captain and responded to a disturbance at the jail. And guess who was causing the disturbance. Glenn. He was cursing at officers, calling them names. Names and all that kind of thing. He asked Glenn why he was being so rough on law enforcement at the time. And Glenn said, the man with the biggest gun. I guess if I can get his gun, then I'm bigger than him. And you go after the. I don't know. I don't know what the hell he's talking about. I'm not sure.

[C]

All right.

[B]

He told them about killing Doyle Wallace. He said he stood on a bucket to look in the window at Wallace's house. Pulled some night stalker Richard Ramirez. Shit. Told them about the wife hiding in the closet. He said he knew the wife was in the closet. He knew that. He said, I knew she was in the closet. Just left her alone. Didn't feel like it. I got it all out. Once I shot him, I was done. Back to the appeals. The magistrate judge recommended denial in 98. The district court adopted that recommendation the same year. That's denied. The 11th Circuit Court affirmed it in 2000. U.S. supreme Court denied him again. They set a new execution date for June 22, 2000. One day before the execution, the US Supreme Court issues a stay. And that is over his mental capacity. June of 2002, the Supreme Court decided Atkins vs. Virginia, which was executing persons with intellectual ability. Violates the Eighth Amendment.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Unusual, right? Yeah. They said, quote, you cannot execute the mentally disabled. Well, 64 is low, so that's that. And also in the appeal, they said the trial judge called him, quote, slightly mentally retarded.

[C]

Slightly.

[B]

The judge called him that, James.

[C]

It was slight.

[B]

Slightly, yeah. That's true. I've been called worse, to be honest with you. I've been called worse. The State is. From our fans. Even so, the State says he's faking it. He faked a lifetime. I mean, come on, guys.

[C]

I mean, since first grade. This boy is diabolical. He's been planning this, he knows, since the 60s.

[B]

He said, quote, we don't think he's actually retarded. We think he's faking it. A man said that in court. May 2003. State sets a new execution date. Because they said, we don't care what the Supreme Court says. We're Alabama. That's fucking crazy. They file a bunch of new shit that comes out here. They argue that he's not intellectually disabled. His poor IQ scores were the result of illiteracy and laziness rather than genuine cognitive limitation. Come on, guys. And they said that his ability to plan and commit crimes demonstrated normal intelligence. No, because he always gets caught, so. Not really.

[C]

I mean, not always. He plans and commits horrible rape.

[B]

He's not like a society cat burglar, though. He's, like, sitting with a bunch of artwork he stole and, like.

[C]

No, he's doing very, very selfish crimes that are very easy to get away with if you're in and out.

[B]

He said that? This is the D.A. glenn holiday is just mean. He's a burglar, murderer, and a rapist who's just too darn lazy to learn how to read and write when he was in school. That's wild. So they bring in experts. One says, biggest moron ever. The other goes, I don't know. He's pretty sure that's basically what it is.

[C]

What he's sharp at is survivability. That's it.

[B]

Yeah. He's got actual. Like an animal, though. Yeah. I mean, an animal survives off garbage. They talk about how he confessed to having sexual relations with animals, not understanding why this would be considered strange. Because he said, they're my best friends.

[C]

You mean the animals?

[B]

The animals. He tried to give himself an enema in prison, made a giant mess and didn't seem embarrassed and was unable to adequately clean it up. They were like, that's a good sign that something's fucking wrong with them. Okay. 2006. His claims are denied again. Finally, October 2006, a U.S. district Court reviews the evidence and says, jesus Christ, he's the dumbest fuck who's ever come before me. We can't execute this guy. Whatever. So Larry Thomas Sr. Dies in 2007, by the way. 2008, the Alabama State appeals that decision, and it's affirmed. So they have a resentencing hearing in 2009, and they sentence him to. Well, the judge says, you will leave prison in a pine box. You, sir, may fuck off. Life without parole.

[C]

It's a big box.

[B]

Big old box. Then in prison, right around that time, he's diagnosed with cancer.

[C]

Oh, no.

[B]

March 12, 2012. Dead. 6:07 in the morning. He's dead. That was fast. 62 years old. Yeah. Alabama prison cancer treatments aren't that.

[C]

And also prior to being in Alabama prison Alabama lifestyle for 62 years.

[B]

Yeah, just the fried shit. Leading up to that point. DA said this will bring a conclusion to what was otherwise a dark chapter in the history of this county. And that's that. And there's that poster on ebay that you can buy. There's one that's like 40 bucks. And there's one that's like 250 bucks. I don't know what the difference is or why you would want the $250 one, but 40 bucks, you can get a wanted poster of this idiot. Yeah, I don't think it's autographed or anything.

[C]

No, I get it.

[B]

There you go, everybody. That's Gadsden, Alabama.

[C]

Holy fuck, man.

[B]

One of the craziest goddamn stories I think we've ever told in an hour and ten minutes.

[C]

I can't. That they didn't put him away longer, long ago.

[B]

It's insane. The whole thing is crazy. He's insane. It's all insane. Anyway. You know what else is insane?

[C]

We're all insane.

[B]

We're all insane. The fact that you need to head over to shutupandgivememurder.com and get tickets for live shows. If you're listening to this, as soon as it comes out. Atlanta, March 7th, that Saturday night. We're at the Tabernacle. Come down and see us March 21st in Phoenix at Stand up Live for your stupid opinion. Salt Lake City, sold out. Denver on May 2nd. There's still tickets there. Buffalo, sold out. And then you can get Royal Oak, Michigan for May 30th as well. And then there's more for the rest of the year. But those are the ones we're concentrating on. Get your tickets, shut up and give me murder.com. listen to our other two shows, Crime in Sports and your stupid opinions. Definitely get yourself patreon. Patreon.com crimeinsports all the bonus material you could possibly want. Hundreds of back episodes immediately upon subscription. New two new ones every other week. One Crime and sports. One Small Town Murder. You get it all for the low, low price of $5. Small town murder. Alpine Divorce. As we're gonna talk about this week. What the hell's going on there? And you get a shout out at the end of the regular show. You get everything. We put out ad free. You can't beat it. So, patreon.com crimeinsports you want to find us on social media? Shutupandgivemerder.com has dropdown menus that take you where you need to be. That said, thank you so much everybody for joining us and until next week, it's been our pleasure.

[C]

Bye.

[B]

Small Town Murder is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. Fiscally responsible financial geniuses, monetary magicians. These are things people say about drivers who switch their car insurance to Progressive and save hundreds. Visit progressive.com to see if you could save Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates, but potential savings will vary. Not available in all states or situations. Hey everybody listening to Small Town Murder out there. Hi. Good to see you out there. I'm here with Jimmy too. And this is an ad. But not an ad for a product. This is an ad for tour dates. Yes. Come see a live show, the 2026 Tour. All the tickets are for sale right now. Starting out with February 21st in Nashville, March 6th in Durham, March 7th in Atlanta. Phoenix is sold out. We do have tickets though, to your stupid opinions. On 21 March, Salt Lake City sold out. Denver has tickets. Be there on May 2. May 29, Buffalo, sold out. Royal Oak, Michigan. May 30, we have September 18, Milwaukee. September 19, Minneapolis. October 3 in Dallas. October 16 in San Jose. October 17 in Sacramento. November 13 in Tarrytown. November 14 in Boston. Come see us. The live shows are spectacular. Come join all of the other STM people. You're going to meet so many people. You're going to have fun.

[C]

Make some effort.

[B]

Friends like crazy. And make some new friends. Come out and see us. Shut up and givememurder.com is where you go for those tickets. Get them right now while they're hot.

[C]

See you on the road.