How to Make Every Trip More Meaningful — Without Spending More (w/ Expedia’s “Powering Travel” Host Elisabeth Goodridge)

Summary

Smart Travel: Upgrade Your Getaways

Episode: How to Make Every Trip More Meaningful — Without Spending More

Host: NerdWallet Travel (Megan Coyle & Sally French)
Guest: Elisabeth Goodridge (Expedia & “Powering Travel” Podcast)
Date: October 29, 2025

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Episode Overview

This episode explores how travelers can make trips more meaningful and fulfilling—without increasing their budgets. Sally and Megan, experienced travel journalists from NerdWallet, welcome Elisabeth Goodridge, director of content at Expedia Group and host of the “Powering Travel” podcast. Together, they distill expert advice, discuss travel trends, and share actionable strategies for maximizing travel value. Core themes include: prioritizing memorable experiences over expenses, the rise of “set-jetting,” authentic local encounters, and smart travel hacks for budget-minded explorers.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. What Makes a Trip “Worth It”? ([00:16]–[08:21])

• Memories & Experiences Trump Cost
  Hosts agree that enjoyment and memories are lasting indicators of trip value, beyond just food or accommodation luxury.

  • Quote: “Post-trip, what’s most important is the experiences you gain and the memories you make.” — Sally French [00:17]

• Expedia’s Elisabeth Goodridge’s Insights
  Elisabeth shares research and guest takeaways from “Powering Travel,” emphasizing the science of happiness in travel.

  • Quote: “You can have enjoyment, satisfaction, and meaning on any vacation, at any price point—if you’re mindful and do it right.” — Elisabeth Goodridge [09:25]

• Reevaluating High-Cost Travel
  Spending more doesn’t guarantee more meaning or fun, especially with kids:

  • Quote: “You can’t really expect a child to have a ton of fun if you spent a lot of money—just throw that idea out the window.” — Elisabeth Goodridge [11:07]

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2. Practical Money-Saving Travel Strategies ([11:43]–[12:35])

• Shop Around For Deals
  Use multiple platforms (not just Expedia) to track flight/hotel prices and snatch bargains.

  • Quote: “A lot of people look at at least seven websites... It feels really good to get a bargain.” — Elisabeth Goodridge [11:47]

• Be Aware of Hidden Fees
  Know the true cost upfront—resort fees, rental car add-ons, etc.

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3. The Rise of “Set-Jetting” and Social Media Influence ([13:02]–[16:20])

• What is “Set-Jetting”?
  Travelers are increasingly booking trips based on TV and movies (e.g., “White Lotus” in Thailand, “Downton Abbey” in the UK).

  • Quote: “More than 60%, 81% of folks on the younger side, are now basing their travel trips on movies and TV shows.” — Elisabeth Goodridge [13:24]
  • Tame Tapting Tong (“White Lotus”) offered insider tips on traveling in Thailand [14:10]

• Potential Pitfalls
  Set-jetting may clash with the desire for true local or authentic experiences—do research and rely on reviews.

  • Quote: “You show up at a hotel that’s got nothing interior-wise to represent that you’re in that country. Really do your research.” — Elisabeth Goodridge [14:52]

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4. Tips for “Authentic” Local Experiences ([17:32]–[22:19])

• Cultivating Curiosity on the Road
  Inspired by Phil Kogan (“The Amazing Race” host): Engage with locals, ask for genuine recommendations.

  • Quote: “Don’t just have the bacon and eggs in the hotel room—talk to people, get out there, ask where they get coffee.” — Elisabeth Goodridge [17:39]
  • Memorable moment: Phil Kogan eating Domino’s pizza under the Sphinx, embracing the unexpected local norm [18:35]

• Finding Hidden Gems
  Use online forums and passionate communities (e.g., niche scuba diving bulletin boards) to discover less-touristed experiences.

  • “I go on Reddit, old-school bulletins for divers… that’s where you find the authentic places.” — Elisabeth Goodridge [20:05]

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5. Why Local Experiences Leave a Mark ([21:35]–[23:26])

• Getting Out of Your Comfort Zone
  The difference between pleasure (immediate gratification) and enjoyment (social, meaningful, lasting).

  • Quote: “Enjoyment is something you do with people, and it has meaning. So seek out enjoyment and get a little outside your comfort zone.” — Elisabeth Goodridge [21:45]

• Cost is Not the Key Factor
  Dense, meaningful memories can happen close to home, with low spending—e.g., a simple walk and ice cream in Maine.

  • Quote: “Aside from the ice cream, you couldn’t have a cheaper outing. But I’ll remember it, because—new place with people I love.” — Elisabeth Goodridge [22:30]

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6. Destinations and Planning for Sustainability ([24:06]–[25:56])

• Expedia’s “Destinations of the Year”
  • Choices consider local sustainability, community balance, and meaningful travel. Highlights:
    • International: Cotswolds (UK), Hobart (Tasmania), Sardinia (Italy)
    • US: Big Sky (Montana), Fort Walton Beach (Florida) [24:41–25:26]
  • All are either accessible or exemplify “do more with less” ethos.

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7. Making Travel More Comfortable—Even on a Budget ([25:56]–[27:25])

• Road-Trip and Airline Hacks
  • Bring homemade snacks/baked goods to save money and add comfort.
    • “There’s nothing better than showing up with a whole tin of brownies…” — Elisabeth Goodridge [26:20]
  • Use a foot hammock on long flights for comfort—even in economy.

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8. Travel Hot Takes & Luggage Hacks ([27:25]–[28:56])

• Best Luggage Advice: Mix and Match

  • If traveling with a companion and checking bags, split your belongings between suitcases—so if one is lost, both travelers still have essentials.
    • Quote: “No matter what, they had each other’s clothes because they’d split up their things.” — Elisabeth Goodridge [27:40]

• Carry a Swimsuit on Every Trip

  • “Even if there’s no pool, no ocean, I’m still bringing it. You never know!” — Sally French [28:39]

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9. Listener Q&A: Maximizing Points for Star Alliance Flights ([29:22]–[31:27])

• Capital One Points Tips
  • Avianca is a great Star Alliance transfer partner—can book Turkish Airlines with Avianca miles.
  • Air Canada Aeroplan: excellent for first/business class (e.g., Lufthansa first class for 90k points if available).
  • Singapore Airlines: Also a solid strategy, though slightly higher redemption rates.
  • JetBlue now partners with United, potentially enabling creative US redemptions (mind the suboptimal transfer ratios).

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Notable Quotes & Time-stamps

• “You can have enjoyment, satisfaction and meaning on any vacation at any price point if you are mindful and you do it right.” — Elisabeth Goodridge [09:25]
• “A kid wants to have fun. He could be having fun in the ugliest hotel pool, but because it’s a pool, it doesn’t matter how much money.” — Elisabeth Goodridge [11:07]
• “Enjoyment is actually something you do with people, and it has meaning. Seek out enjoyment, and just get a little outside your comfort zone.” — Elisabeth Goodridge [21:45]
• “Aside from the ice cream, you couldn’t have a cheaper outing. But I’ll remember that... new place with people I love.” — Elisabeth Goodridge [22:30]
• “No matter what, they had each other’s clothes because they’d split up their things.” — Elisabeth Goodridge [27:40]
• “Even if there’s no pool, no ocean, I’m still bringing a swimsuit. You never know!” — Sally French [28:39]

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Segment Timestamps

• 00:16 — What makes travel meaningful
• 03:23 — United / JetBlue news, travel partnerships
• 07:31 — Introducing Elisabeth Goodridge, guest
• 09:25 — Enjoyment, satisfaction, and meaning in travel
• 13:24 — The “set-jetting” trend: travel influenced by pop culture
• 17:39 — How to find authentic, local experiences
• 20:05 — Using online communities for hidden gem recommendations
• 21:45 — The importance of enjoyment and stepping outside your comfort zone
• 22:30 — Example of a great, low-cost memory (Maine trip)
• 24:41 — “Destinations of the Year”: sustainability and meaning
• 25:56 — Making travel more comfortable and memorable en route
• 27:40 — Travel hot take: Split luggage when traveling with someone
• 29:22 — Listener Q&A: Using Capital One points and Star Alliance
• 31:39 — Social media plugs & wrap-up

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Conclusion

This episode is packed with practical advice and inspiration for travelers looking to create richer, more memorable journeys—without breaking the bank. The takeaways? Curiosity, mindfulness, and relationships matter more than what you spend. Do your research, seek authentic local moments, and use tech (and old-school tricks) to maximize your travel dollar. Remember to look beyond glossy “set-jetting” shots and build real connections—sometimes, the cheapest adventures are the most valuable.

Transcript

[A]

When too much work bogs you down.

[B]

Asana helps you handle it.

[A]

AI makes it easy to hand off routine tasks and stay focused on important work. That's how work gets handled.

[B]

Visit [e-mail] Sally, what do you think.

[A]

Makes a trip worth it?

[C]

Ooh, I mean the food while you're there. But post trip, I think really what's most important is the experiences you gain and the memories you make.

[A]

I totally agree. And that's something our guest today has been exploring on her show. She's also a fellow travel podcast host and she's talking to us today about what she's been learning from travel experts about making a trip full of memories.

[B]

Wow.

[C]

That's what I said.

[A]

Welcome to Smart Travel, a deep dive into the tips, tools and tactics to maximize your travel dollars. I'm Meagan Coyle.

[C]

And I'm Sally French.

[A]

And we're the travel nerds ready to help you plan your next big trip. Today I invited Elizabeth Goodridge, the director of content at Expedia Group and the host of Expedia's podcast Powering Travel, to join us.

[C]

And happy almost Halloween. Megan, what are you up to this Halloween?

[A]

You know, going to another wedding this weekend. It's the day after Halloween though, so I feel like I can't go too crazy on Halloween night.

[C]

Are you wearing a costume at the wedding?

[A]

I wish. Yeah, just my normal black tie costume. It is pretty silly.

[C]

Okay. I'm also not wearing a costume this Halloween. That's because I want to pack light and I am not packing a costume with me. I am heading to Europe. I am going, believe it or not, on a cruise all throughout Europe. I have never done a cruise longer than three days before and so this honestly seems a little bit scary to me because I am low key afraid of being trapped on a boat for that long. But I don't think that will be the case.

[A]

I don't think you'll even be on the boat that much anyways. Like you're going to be off the boat walking around all these cities in Europe. It's going to be amazing.

[C]

Yeah. In fact, that is why I chose this itinerary. I am sailing with Norwegian Cruise Line and it is a different port every single day. There is no day at sea. And so I'm actually going on this trip really because I want to see how much I can experience in Europe without messing around with checking into different hotel rooms, having to train or fly to all these different places. I am going to a new place every day and you know I am going to rack up so many steps. So anyone who thinks you don't get steps cruising, I am going to see if I can prove them wrong.

[A]

I will be watching your Fitbit stats. Like I also did a Mediterranean cruise last year and it was so fun. Like seeing all those cities from the water is just so beautiful. So you're gonna have a great time.

[C]

I think we should talk about it on a future show episode.

[A]

Yeah, probably in like a few weeks when I get back because.

[C]

Where are you going?

[A]

I'm going on a huge multi country trip as well. We're doing Ireland, Scotland, the uk, New Zealand and Australia.

[B]

Wow.

[C]

All over. Those places are not really close to each other.

[A]

They are not close. You should see the flight path. It's like one end of the all the way to the other end of the world. And like I should have just made a full loop, you know.

[C]

But track those frequent flyer miles. I cannot wait to hear about that when you are back as well. Let's dive into the news. Before we get to our news though, go to that disclaimer and that is that we will talk about a few credit card companies that are NerdWallet partners in this episode that does not influence how Megan and I discuss them. The benefits terms and fees mentioned were accurate at the time of posting. Things obviously can change. Some offers may have expired by the time you're listening. So for the latest details for follow the links in the episode description.

[A]

Starting us off United and JetBlue's Blue sky partnership officially launched. So United Mileage plus members can now earn and redeem United miles on JetBlue flights and vice versa. So JetBlue members can earn and redeem JetBlue points on United flights.

[C]

Then coming soon, you will also be able to take advantage of reciprocal benefits for elite status members of each program. So those are things like the free checked bag and extra legroom seats. And then you know, JetBlue does that tiles program. So true Blue members can earn tiles towards elite status when they take United flights.

[A]

There are some weird exceptions though. Like you can't earn JetBlue points on United flights from Newark to Los Angeles and also a handful of other cities because JetBlue already operates a similar route from a nearby airport, JFK. So it's very strange. You have to know which flights you can actually earn these points on.

[C]

It's like a weird don't compete thingy.

[A]

Yeah, exactly.

[C]

Okay. And then also I will say do check what your earning and redeeming rates are because you might be better just Sticking with just United on United flights and just JetBlue on JetBlue flights. If you are fine having points in both programs, this is just really good. If maybe you're taking like your one JetBlue flight in your life, but you just really want to accrue the United miles.

[A]

This partnership kind of reminds me of an old program that American used to have with JetBlue called the Northeast Alliance. R.I.P. you know, this is our Halloween episode.

[C]

Oh, send it to that graveyard.

[A]

But American and Alaska also have reciprocal benefits and you can earn points with either airline when you fly either one because they're in the same airline alliance. So now JetBlue and United have this partnership. I think that makes all these programs more attractive now than Southwest or Delta, which don't have these partnerships with other US Airlines.

[C]

Not yet.

[A]

Not yet.

[C]

All right, Megan, here's something I don't know about you, but I'm going to ask. Do you watch anime?

[A]

Mm, not a ton anymore. I used to watch more when I was in college.

[C]

Oh, really?

[A]

Yeah. Not so much anymore.

[C]

Okay, well, if you are an anime fan, which sounds like maybe not you, Delta announced that starting in early November, Crunchyroll is launching on Delta flights. So that means you'll be able to watch anime series like Black Clover, Solo Leveling and Fruits Basket on those seatback screens.

[A]

Oh, that's awesome. For Delta flyers. Delta is always like on top of their game when it comes to the in flight experience. They have free wi fi, they have seat back screen screens on a lot of their planes, free headphones. And I just think it's a great experience to fly with Delta.

[C]

And they got those Biscoff cookies.

[A]

Yeah, that would. I'm not going to put in the.

[C]

Good, good flight Biscoff hater. Send your hate mail to Megan. All right, moving over to some travel investment news, and that is that Travis Kelce is putting his money into theme parks.

[A]

I heard about this. The football star and Taylor Swift's fiance is doing it for the nostalgia, right?

[C]

Yes. So as it turns out, Travis Kelce is a Six Flags fan. News came out last week that he is investing in Six Flags. The longer story is that he just became part of an investor group that now owns about 9% of Six Flags Entertainment Corporation. And they also say they're actively trying to revive the brand.

[A]

I hope it works. It's tough out there because I think Disney and Universal set this very high, very expensive bar and I think there still is a place for less expensive theme parks. Like, I like Six Flags Magic Mountain here in Southern California. But sadly, the Six Flags in Maryland that was close to my hometown is the one that's shutting down this year, so it's tough for them. It really is.

[C]

Okay, Travis Kelsey's money might have come in too late to save the Maryland park, but hopefully he can turn around some of the other parks. Kelsey has called himself a lifelong Six Flags super fan. He said he grew up going to Cedar Point. That's the theme park in Ohio that is relatively new to the Six Flags family. Cedar Fair merged with Six Flags in 2024.

[A]

I think there's just so much entertainment these days. Like, they have a lot to compete with, not just in theme parks, but also the entertainment on your phone, on your tv. Like, a thrill ride isn't necessarily enough. So I'm curious if they're going to be investing in not just rides, but the whole experience.

[C]

Oh, my gosh. I feel like theme parks are more important than ever now because we're all just alone in our phones all day. Travis, save us.

[A]

Save us, Travis. We'll see if Travis Kelsey's investment pays off. And speaking of other podcast hosts, we're going from Travis Kelsey, the co host of the New Heights podcast, to our guest today, Elizabeth Goodrich. She's the host of Expedia's podcast called Powering Travel, where she talks to celebrities and experts about their learnings about travel.

[C]

Ooh, what kind of celebrities are we talking?

[A]

So many cool people. Phil Kogan, the host of the Amazing Race.

[C]

Oh, my gosh, I love the Amazing Race. I want to go on it so bad.

[A]

We got to get Elizabeth to connect us. I think you and I, Sally, could do really well in The Amazing Race.

[C]

10 out of 10 make it happen.

[A]

Okay. So I asked Elizabeth about what themes she was seeing through her interviews, and one really stuck out to me, and it was, how do you set yourself up for a trip that's worth it that you're going to love? And spoiler alert, she found out it does not mean spending a lot of money.

[C]

You know, I totally agree with this. I feel like sometimes the best trips I've ever taken were the ones that cost me the least amount of money, where I'm just eating food at a roadside stand and staying at a little tiny hotel that's not a big chain. I already agree with her.

[A]

Exactly. Especially if the price you're paying is more than what you would normally pay for something. Like when you're like, oh, I'm going to splurge on this really nice hotel. Except that it's five times what you would normally pay. And then you have to be like, is this experience five times better? It's hard. It's hard to live up to that. So Elizabeth talks to some of her guests about what the elements are of creating these meaningful memories and getting a real local experience, which is something that people value and they make their trip worth it. Welcome to Smart Travel. Elizabeth.

[B]

Hi.

[D]

Thank you so much for having me.

[A]

Megan, Congrats on a new season of powering travel. You've talked to some really fantastic people this season. And one thing that I noticed was that there's this through line of value and how people evaluate the value they get from their vacations. How do you evaluate what makes travel worth it?

[D]

Well, first off, travel's always worth it, but it's really the criteria and the measurement. Right, Right. So one of my episode guests was Arthur Brooks. He is a Harvard professor author because he has studied the science of happiness for years. He calls the travel business the happiness business because it brings the three kind of macro ingredients that you need. You need enjoyment, satisfaction, and meaning. And you can have that on any vacation at any price point if you are mindful and you do it right. So even down the street and taking yourself out to a small vacation in another neighborhood in New York City, you can still have value for from a trip for $0 or for just a block away.

[A]

Did your conversation with Arthur Brooks change the way you think about travel? Because if I remember correctly, you were talking about some of your recent vacations and rethinking, like, was that a good trip?

[D]

He offered some great advice on really trying to be in the moment. Everyone's taking pictures with their phones. Of course they are. But he really suggested being in the moment. So when you're taking a picture, you're not actually taking a picture for that moment right there. You're taking a picture and putting it on Instagram for six months from now. So what he really recommending is being very, very mindful. When you are on on vacation and assign someone every day to take pictures so that everyone can have their own mindful vacation, I thought it was brilliant advice.

[C]

Wow.

[A]

I've never heard of that. And I like it as well. And I never thought about how you are taking pictures, but you're actually taking pictures for your future self, not the one that's right there looking at this beautiful scenery. What about money? How does that come into how you value a vacation? Do you have higher expectations for a trip that you paid more for?

[D]

There was something really interesting for me because I have A kid. A lot of people have kids, and you can't really expect a child to have a ton of fun. If you spent a lot of money, just throw that idea out the window. Really understand that the kid wants to have fun. He could be having fun in the ugliest hotel pool, but because it's a pool, it doesn't matter how much money. So that's one thing that I've really, particularly the last couple of years becoming a travel expert is understanding you don't have to spend money to go on trips. You really just need to think about who you're traveling with and whether or not you're getting satisfaction and meaning from your trip.

[A]

What are some ways that you save money on travel?

[D]

Many ways. Okay, so you can get into the points game and the loyalty program, but there are so many different websites, not just Expedia, that can really help you assess what kind of flights are happening, what kind of deals are expected to drop or increase. So I'm a big believer in shopping. A lot of people do not believe in shopping around, but on the other hand, a lot of people look at at least seven websites. It also feels really good to get a bargain or at least get some dollars off. So just put a little bit of extra time into your trip planning and then you'll be really happy down the road.

[A]

I would say with all the technology we have that finding a good price can be really confusing. Prices are changing almost every minute. Do you have any advice for consumers about how you shop?

[D]

The other thing that you need to mention is these additional fees. And so the government has gone back and forth on making these hidden fees, these resort fees and so on, be more present. So that's one key thing, is make sure you actually know what the bottom line is when you're shopping, whether or not it's a rental car or an airline ticket or that hotel room, you always need to be up front while you're shopping. So when you are on your vacation, you're not surprised by any additional fees.

[A]

I think a big thing with paying for travel is you also want to know what you're paying for exactly, including what the destination is like. I think a lot of people find destinations through social media and through television, through film. Can you talk about why popular culture and social media are sort of changing what people expect out of their travels?

[D]

What we're seeing at Expedia Group, particularly in a new report that we're putting out, it's called Unpack 26. It's an annual travel trends report. We put out this year. Set Jenning is. It's never going to go away. More and more people, I think it's more than 60% of folks, 81% of folks who are on the younger side are now basing their travel trips on movies and television shows they've watched. It kind of makes sense because a lot of these destinations are even hotels or characters in their own right and their shows. And don't you want to be swept away as well? So we're seeing interest in Los Angeles because of nobody wants this. That new rom com on Netflix. We're seeing so much interest. Of course, thanks to White Lotus, we've had a lot of interest in Thailand because of season three. And one of my guests actually was a star on White Lotus Season 3, Tame Tapting Tong. He was the first, first guest of our first episode of season five, and he offered a lot of great advice on going to Thailand. Three days here and three days there. I'd really encourage your listeners to listen to that episode because it was a really nice insider take on what makes Thailand so special.

[A]

People are trying to exude their main character energy, it seems like, with these kinds of trips. But does Set Jetting, as you guys like to call it, seem to conflict with this desire for, like, an authentic experience when you're on vacation? Because, after all, what you're seeing on social media or in film might not be how that place actually is.

[D]

That's a really good point. And Tame actually brought up a lot of thoughts on that. Say you want to go to Thailand, you want to have the authentic Thai experience, and then you show up at a hotel that's got absolutely nothing interior wise to represent that you're in that country. So really do your research. And a key thing for us, of course, is to read the reviews. People love reviews, People trust reviews. And as people are getting more and more savvy with what they want with Set Shedding, they'll offer their own opinions and reviews.

[A]

So that social proof is just as important as the social media you saw at the beginning of planning your trip.

[D]

And social media influencers are gonna be really big contributors and inspiration. But we're seeing Set Jetting. I mean, you saw it way back when with the Sound of Music, but we're seeing it just every absolutely explode now.

[A]

And there's so much content now that there's so many different places that are able to be showcased.

[D]

I mean, just think about Downton Abbey alone. How many people have gone to explore English manors thanks to Downton Abbey.

[A]

Oh, I definitely looked up that castle. I'm going to the UK soon. I was like, can I go visit?

[D]

Where exactly are you going in the uk?

[A]

I'm going to London and Oxford for a couple of days, but also Scotland and Ireland on that trip. And in Scotland, set jetting is huge because people are going after Outlander, they're going after Harry Potter because Edinburgh is where J.K. rowling wrote Harry Potter. And so you can really see the inspiration in the land there, I suppose.

[D]

Absolutely.

[A]

All right, we'll talk more about getting a local experience at your destination after the break.

[B]

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[A]

So, Elizabeth, what makes a great authentic vacation if you are looking for that local experience?

[D]

So Phil Kogan, the host of the Amazing Race, has been to more than 170 countries. He was a great guest on my show and he really stressed curiosity. And how do you do that? How do you express curiosity to have an authentic vacation? He suggests just talking to the people you're there with. Talk to your tour guide and ask where they get coffee. Talk to to a hotel guest and say, where should we get an authentic meal? Don't just have the bacon and eggs in the hotel room. You don't have to have it every day, particularly if you want to have an authentic trip. So for example, which was just kind of turning it around, Phil said that we're at a pit stop during one show of the Amazing Race and they were at the bottom of the Sphinx in Egypt with all of the beautiful monuments to these great Egyptian pharaohs in the background. And he turns to one of the fixers and says, I think I'm hungry. And he's like, we'll order some food, don't worry. And Phil is expecting some local qu cuisine, some Egyptian food up shows, a Domino's pizza truck with lots of, lots of Domino's pizza pie. And instead of kind of turning his nose at it, he just said, okay, you know what, let's do this. All right, Here I am eating pizza underneath the sphinx in Egypt and I'm just going to enjoy it because this is what the locals are doing.

[A]

And then it takes a lot of research to be able to find some of those experiences. You have to often leave your hotel, talk to other people. How do you do that research to find kind of off the beaten path gems?

[D]

Okay, again, I'm going to stress reviews, reviews and your friends, and your friends, friends and your family.

[A]

Anyone you know, actually, if you are.

[D]

Lucky and remember travel is momentous, whether or not you have great memories or bad memories. And we've already talked about how to have good memories, happiness. But people want to talk about travel because it's such a way of practice to really move and bring you those extraordinary adventures that you'll remember those memories for so long. So people will want to share their experiences and even if it's a horrible experience, it turns out to be a great story down the road.

[A]

Exactly. The negative experiences are almost as important as the positive ones. Right. Because they're all making memories.

[D]

They're all making memories. Exactly.

[A]

And I believe you're a big diver, is that right?

[D]

I am. I like scuba diving.

[A]

How do you do the research to be able to find hidden places to dive?

[D]

What I like to do is you can get off the beaten path. And particularly in this world of over tourism, we at Expedia really try to talk about destination dupes. Where are these experiences? In these locations who can give you that same experience as you can get but at an overpopulated, over touristed place. So what I like to do, prime example scuba diving. I will go to a specific scuba diving website, but I won't just go to say Facebook. I'll go into where you know that they are die hard divers. Whether or not it's Reddit or some of these scuba diving bulletins which have been around for like 10, 15 years if you think about how old the Internet is now. And that's where I try to find the authentic places. Many places are kind of overfished and a lot of places are. There's just a lot of divers, but there's still a lot of places out there. I've gone to Bonaire, which was extraordinary scuba diving. Curacao, the north of Curacao, gave me an extraordinary amount of sea life. And then my favorite scuba diving trip of all time was in Roatan, off the coast of Honduras.

[A]

Whoa, how cool. What did you see on those trips that just make them stand out to you?

[D]

Oh, you name it. There was just so many fish you couldn't even count. And eels and turtles and Bonaire. It was just. You could snorkel right off the shore, you could scuba dive right off the shore. And then it gets just kind of like, of course I saw a turtle. Of course I saw a sea turtle.

[A]

Of course I saw another sea turtle.

[D]

Which is just a glorious. I mean, again, stories, so many stories.

[A]

Why do those local or authentic experiences on vacation stick with travelers so much? We talked a little bit about making memories, but dive a little bit deeper into that.

[D]

Everybody wants a momentous experience when they travel. Of course they do. And what you really need to do is kind of get out of your comfort zone, because that will imprint the memory even more. Arthur Brooks was really a great interview to think about. Kind of the difference between even pleasure and enjoyment. Pleasure, it's immediate. It's definitely everything, what everyone wants. But enjoyment is actually something you do with people, and it has meaning. And so that's what you should really seek out when you're traveling is seek out enjoyment and just get yourself a little bit outside of your comfort zone, because then the memories will stick.

[A]

And I noticed that in all those things you just listed, you didn't mention money as part of that. Like, you don't have to necessarily spend a ton of money to make those dense memories. Is that right?

[D]

That's absolutely right. I mean, think about it. You just need to be a little bit out of your comfort zone. I was in Maine in July with some of my favorite friends from college, and we just went for a walk along the shoreland in a new town that none of us had ever been to before. We had parked the car, we went for a walk, we had ice cream. Aside from the ice cream, you couldn't have a cheaper outing. It was so fun. I'm gonna remember that because, again, new place with people I love. Yeah, you could say I was getting some pleasure from the ice cream, but it was really.

[A]

It was really.

[D]

It was enjoyment and the meaning I was having, making sure that I was still keeping in touch with these wonderful friends who I'd known for so long from college.

[A]

And you didn't have to go super far to do that. You were based in New York. So people can make those dense memories and find new places outside of their Comfort zone. Not so far. Like they could perhaps even Dr. And treat themselves to a hotel somewhere very close by.

[D]

Okay, so that's what I did. I drove. I drove from New York. It was very easy. And think about how many places you can get to on public transportation or driving from New York. And it's just again, getting out of your comfort zone. You get into these routines, whether it's commuting or even eating, seeing your friends or going to the gym. So get out of that comfort zone. And it doesn't have to cost much money.

[A]

This is why I love travel. It just everything is new when you're traveling. Even if it's similar food maybe to what you eat at home, it's. You're in a new place, you are doing it with people that maybe you don't get to spend as much time with in your daily life. So I think that's a big motivator for my travel.

[D]

Oh, I just wanted to say too is that again, I mentioned our unpack report, which is brand new, and we offer our Destinations of the Year trip and our destinations are found all over the world. So again, you might be in New York, maybe you don't want to fly to Big sky or you don't want to fly to the French Alps, but if you're in Europe and listening to this, you can just take a train there. So particularly if you're a budget traveler, think about meaning thinking about getting out of your comfort zone. And you can find those adventures and those memorable travel experiences wherever.

[A]

What are some examples of destinations on.

[D]

The Destinations of the Year list? They're all over. You've got the Cotswolds in the uk You've got Hobart in Tasmania and Australia. People love Australia. Boy, I love going to Australia. You have Sardinia in Italy, and I don't want to give off the entire list, but boy, we've got some great places. And they were also chosen using criteria from the World Travel and Tourism Council that looked at places that are really trying to balance tourists with the local communities, making sure it's sustainable businesses. So take a look at our list and we chose a bunch of them that are really trying to be good stewards of their land and good stewards of their people. And I think you'll find someplace that's either nearby or at least really fun for you to go to.

[A]

Are there any US Destinations on that list?

[D]

Yes, we've got a couple. So we got Big sky in Montana, which is really trying to not regulate, but really trying to be mindful with its Tourism infrastructure growth to be aware of the local communities and their wants and needs. It's a great place for skiing, of course. And then you've got Fort Walton beach in Florida, which is one of those beautiful sugar sand sand beaches with glorious gulf water. I believe it's called the Emerald Coast. And again, that is a great destination to drive to.

[A]

If you are driving, maybe you're stuck in a car with a bunch of people or even if you're flying and you're in economy class. What are some things you do to make traveling more comfortable or more luxurious or maybe even make memories along the way en route to destination?

[D]

So in a car, of course you're going to pick up snacks.

[A]

Absolutely. Can't go on a car trip without snacks.

[D]

And then I really, really like to bake. So that's an economical way. Particularly if you're going with friends. There's nothing better than showing up with a whole tin of brownies when they're expecting, you know, to eat snacks from the bodega or snacks from the road, the gas station. It's a great way to save money, particularly on treats to be comfortable on the airplane. I swear by a foot hammock so you can hang it over the tray and then it's just giving you, particularly if you are on a long haul flight. It lifts your legs up and just makes the sea a lot more comfortable in economy.

[A]

So it makes it a little bit more comfortable to almost lay flat like put your feet up. I guess.

[D]

Maybe you're smaller than me. But no, I can never lay flat unless the neighbor next door isn't there.

[A]

That's what we call in my family, we call it our Wong family upgrade. We get the seats next to us totally empty and you're gonna, and you.

[D]

Get more and more excited because these flights are definitely more and more packed, at least in my experience.

[A]

So yeah, it feels really serendipitous. Okay, Elizabeth, this has been so fun, so fascinating. Before I let you go, we always ask our guests at the end of this show for a travel hot take. What is your travel hot take, Elizabeth?

[D]

Sure, not a problem. And in fact this wasn't me, but this was my aunt and uncle. Key thing, if you're traveling with somebody else and you are checking bags is split your stuff into two suitcases. They were flying from Norway to London two weeks ago and they lost one suitcase. And they weren't worried, they were just wondering if they lost the suitcase with the dirty clothes or the clean clothes. But no matter what, they had each clothes because they had split up their things between two suitcases.

[A]

I love this. I did a whole episode about how I lost my luggage earlier this year. And we should have done that. We should have split our stuff and put it half into one suitcase and half into the other. And also we should carry on one.

[D]

Of those suitcases and carry on one of those suitcases. And that's when I'm traveling by myself, particularly to a destination that has a different temperature. Say I'm leaving the Northeast in the winter and I'm going down to the Caribbean. I always pack a sundress and a bathing suit just in case I lose my luggage so I can still enjoy my vacation in the Caribbean before my luggage gets there.

[A]

I take a swimsuit on every single trip. Even if there's no pool, no ocean in sight, I'm still bringing it. You never know.

[D]

And for example, I was at a conference in Chicago. My flight got canceled. I had 48 hours to kill. And it was a beautiful. And I would have killed to be able to go swimming in Lake Michigan right there.

[A]

There you go. Everyone bring your swimsuits and pack your stuff in two different suitcases. That's great advice. Elizabeth, thank you so much for joining us today.

[D]

Megan, thank you so much. It was a pleasure to talk to you and your listeners.

[C]

Megan, amazing interview. Such great points. And everybody should go listen to Elizabeth's podcast reminder. It is called Powering Travel and you can listen to it pretty much wherever you get your podcasts.

[A]

All right, I think we have time for a listener question as well. This one is from Bill in McLean, Virginia. Shout out to Nova. That's near my hometown. His question is we've never used Avianca, but looking hard at it to access Star Alliance Airlines, most of our points slash miles are with Capital One. Can you offer other thoughts on using our Capital One points on Star Alliance Airlines?

[C]

This is a tricky question because Capital One does not have a ton of domestic airline partners. They really have a lot of international partners as airline partners. So you do really have to know your airline alliances. Bill, I'm glad you asked me and Megan. Now Bill says he's looking at Avianca and that is a really good one. I actually used Avianca to book my flights to Turkey coming up and it is not like an Avianca flight. I am flying with my Avianca miles on Turkish Airlines and they say Turkish Airlines is so good to Europe. So I did not use Turkish miles to get on Turkish Airlines.

[A]

Avianca has a really good word chart for flights on their Star alliance partners. And another good program that he could look at if he doesn't find what he's looking for on Avianca is Air Canada. The Air Canada aeroplan program has some nice redemptions, especially for first class or business class if you're into that sort of thing. For example, you could fly Lufthansa first class for 90,000 Air Canada points, but of course you have to find the availability first and then transfer your Capital One miles to Air Canada.

[C]

Another really good redemption, I would say is Singapore Airlines. They are also a Star alliance partner. Singapore is just so fancy. They are also a Capital One transfer partner and I will say I think their redemption rates are usually slightly higher than on Air Canada. Of course you should check for yourself.

[A]

And just to throw in a wild card, JetBlue is also a transfer partner of Capital One and now with the new Blue Sky Partnership, Bill could theoretically transfer miles to JetBlue and then redeem those on a United flight.

[C]

Okay, compelling option. I will say on that one though Bill, do some of your own research on this specific flight because of that transfer ratio which is 5 to 3. So tbh, I consider this more of a backup option. That said, you do have so many other good options with Avianca, Air Canada Singapore. So happy flying.

[A]

Either way, make sure to follow Smart Travel on your favorite podcast app including Spotify, Apple Podcasts and iHeartRadio to automatically download new episodes. And if you're listening on Spotify, drop us a comment right in the app.

[C]

And do make sure to follow us on social media. I am going to be in Europe so look for some good posts from Europe. I am saved with Sally on both Instagram and TikTok. And you better be following Miles with Megan Co. Because she is also going to be in Europe and she's to going crushing it on social media.

[A]

Thanks Sally. Yes, my next stop is Scotland, so we'll not be close in Europe, but do follow both of us anyway. This episode was produced by Tess Viglin and Hilary Georgi and edited by Nick Karismi. Claire Sosi helped with fact checking and.

[C]

Here'S our brief disclaimer. We are not financial or investment advisors. This info is provided for general educational and entertainment purposes. It may not apply to your specific circumstances.

[A]

We hope you're inspired to keep your passport full and your wallet even fuller. Thanks everyone. We'll see you next time.