Alligators vs Otters

Summary

Smash Boom Best: Alligators vs Otters

Podcast: Smash Boom Best (Brains On Universe)
Episode Date: May 21, 2026
Host: Molly Bloom
Debaters: Andy Hillbrands (Team Otter) & Lee Overtree (Team Alligator)
Judge: Alex from Montclair, NJ

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Episode Overview

This episode of Smash Boom Best plunges into a hilarious, fact-filled debate pitting two aquatic creatures against each other: alligators versus otters. Two passionate debaters, comedian Andy Hillbrands and writer/director Lee Overtree, square off armed with quirky facts, science, and humor to convince kid judge Alex which critter reigns supreme.

Listeners are treated to creative arguments, memorable one-liners, and zany sound effects as the teams battle it out through themed rounds. At the end, Alex must choose which species is crowned "Smash Boom Best."

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Introduction & Contestants (00:51 – 04:20)

• Host Molly Bloom introduces the episode and the premise: a "critter clash" between the "rowdy reptile" alligator and the "mischievous mammal" otter.
• Meet the Judge: Alex, a theater set builder, Taekwondo enthusiast, and aspiring graphic novelist from Montclair, NJ.

Declaration of Greatness

Alligators – Lee Overtree (04:42 – 09:59)

• Longevity & Evolution:
  "Alligators... have been pretty much the same for 30 million years. Almost every other animal has had to grow new body parts or change their appearance to survive a changing planet. But not alligators. They got it right the first time." (05:21)
• Perfect Survivors:
  Described as "apex predators" and "the top of the food chain."
• Clever Hunters:
  Use camouflage and even balance sticks on their heads to lure birds.
  "A bird sees the stick, comes on over to grab one and chomp. See ya." (07:21)
• Parental Dedication:
  "Mama gators lay eggs... [nests] give off warmth and that keeps the gator eggs so cozy." (08:19)
  "Those babies will stay close to their mom for years and she'll protect them... by viciously tearing the Flesh off of anything that bothers them. So sweet." (09:01)
• Signature Smiles:
  "Those cute little teeth. Oh my goodness, the funny lizard. He smiles." (09:36)
• Notable Quote:
  "Gators, more like graters. Am I right?" (09:44)
• Signature Sign-off:
  "See you later, alligator." (09:54)

Otters – Andy Hillbrands (12:26 – 16:32)

• Super-Cuteness & Quirky Behavior:
  "They're super cute, little round faces, the teddy bear like bodies, the fluffy fur. But don't be fooled. Otters are actually incredible hunters." (13:45)
• Tool Users:
  "Scientists have seen them using rocks to break open shells... It's the only non primate mammal that does that." (10:58)
• Ecological Importance:
  "Otters... love to munch on sea urchins. Urchins eat kelp. So without the otters to keep the urchins in check, there'd be way too many urchins and they'd eat up all the beautiful underwater kelp forests." (15:15)
• Unique Rituals:
  "Otters are real party poopers. And by that I mean they like to dance right before they poop... scientists aren't sure why." (15:38)
• Notable Quotes:
  "They dive into the water... grab their prey off the ground underwater... float on their backs like they're laying on a watery hammock, and place their little snacks on their bellies like they got little tummy tables." (13:53)

Rebuttal Round (10:52 – 11:30; 17:12 – 17:58)

• Andy (Otters):
  Highlights that otters have been documented attacking and eating alligators.
  "In Florida, a photographer caught one river otter... eating a five foot alligator." (11:19)
• Lee (Alligators):
  Jokes about otters' notoriously smelly poop and claims they are terrible restaurant tippers, keeping the rebuttal playful and humorous.
  "Besides otters having what scientists call the smelliest poop in nature... they also are terrible tippers." (17:12)

Micro Round: Three Rapid Fire Facts Each (22:11 – 27:03)

Memorable Otter Facts

• Bite Force:
  "Sea otters bite with up to 615 pounds per square inch of force... as strong as a black bear." (22:27)
• Floating Fur:
  "Baby sea otters are born with fur that floats. So before they do anything, they just float like a cork in the water." (23:44)
• Giant River Otter:
  "Scientists literally call [it] Lobos del Rio... can grow up to 5ft, 10 inches." (25:42)

Notable Alligator Facts

• Alligator vs Crocodile:
  "Alligators, they have round snouts and crocs have pointy ones." (22:49)
• Temperature-Dependent Gender:
  "Baby alligator eggs will become either male or female, depending on how hot or cold the nest is." (24:30)
• Mating Dance:
  "When a male alligator is looking for a partner, it'll shake its body in the water real fast, sending vibrations through the swamp, and it will create little spouts of water." (26:04)

Sneak Attack: Invent a Secret Handshake (29:00 – 32:00)

• Alligator Handshake (Lee):
  "The alligator death roll." Involves spinning your partner in a pool (no drowning or dismemberment included). Renamed “the alligator won’t dismember you roll.” (29:44)
• Otter Handshake (Andy):
  "The Chatty." Inspired by otter vocalizations and sleeping behavior. A 12-step handshake ending by holding hands and pretending to fall asleep, just like otters who float holding hands to avoid drifting apart. (30:51)

Final Six Words (32:16 – 33:06)

• Otter’s Closing Shot (Andy):
  "They eat alligators. Argument over. Byee." (32:16)
• Alligator’s Closing Shot (Lee):
  "Andy might be that giant otter." (32:27)

Judging & Decision (33:13 – 34:44)

• Alex the Judge:
  Reveals the debate was tied until the final six. Andy’s final punchy line about otters eating alligators tipped the scales.
  • Memorable Quote:
    "The final six, it was tied until then." (33:29)
• Winner:
  Otters!

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• Lee (Alligators):
  "Gators, more like graters. Am I right?" (09:44) "Mama gators... protect them the way any other mother would—by viciously tearing the Flesh off of anything that bothers them. So sweet." (09:01) "The alligator death roll. It's like this dangerous spinning maneuver that alligators use to subdue, drown, and dismember their prey. So in this secret handshake... the only thing I don't do is subdue, drown, or dismember..." (29:44)

• Andy (Otters):
  "Otters... are one of the only five stone tool using species on Earth and it's the only non primate mammal that does that." (10:58) "Baby sea otters are born with fur that floats... so they just float like a cork." (23:44) "They eat alligators. Argument over. Byee." (32:16)

• Judge Alex:
  "I liked the little restaurant bit. That was good. And I thought it was cool how otters keep the sea urchin populations down." (16:43) "I have always wondered what the difference was between alligators and crocodiles. So that was cool to learn." (27:08)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• 00:51 – Show Start & Introductions
• 04:42 – Declaration of Greatness (Alligators)
• 12:26 – Declaration of Greatness (Otters)
• 22:11 – Micro Round: Three Facts Each
• 29:00 – Sneak Attack: Secret Handshake
• 32:16 – Final Six-Word Summations
• 33:18 – Judge’s Decision & Winner Announced (Otters)
• 34:44 – Compliments and Farewells

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Tone & Style

• Approachable, Humorous, and Educational: Both debaters use jokes, puns, and silly sound effects but always back up their claims with cool, kid-friendly facts.
• Improv and Wit: Spontaneous banter and playful digs abound, keeping things lively and lighthearted.
• Science & Curiosity Welcome: Listeners can expect real biological facts mixed with imaginative "what if" scenarios and theatrical delivery.

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Summary Takeaways

Smash Boom Best’s "Alligators vs Otters" brings out the cleverest, quirkiest arguments for both creatures, from alligators’ evolutionary perfection and legendary bite to otters’ intelligence, ecological importance, and unexpected toughness. The judge’s ultimate decision rides on tight competition and razor-sharp punchlines, making it an episode full of laughter, learning, and memorable mic drops—just the way Smash Boom Best fans love it.

Final Winner: Otters (by a whisker—and a killer closing argument)!

Transcript

[A]

Lemonade.

[B]

Brains on Universe.

[A]

Thinking critically is more important than ever. That's why we make smashboom Best. We want every kid to know how to spot a good argument and how to call out a logical fallacy. But none of it is possible without your support. Seriously, we could disappear if our listeners don't step up. But that part is easy. Just join Smarty Pass. You'll get access to ad free versions of our shows, special online hangs with our crew, discounts on merch and more. Plus, you'll feel great knowing you're helping us pay our debaters, sound designers, writers, and more. Join [e-mail] thank you. Now it's showtime from the brains behind Brains On.

[C]

It's Smash Boom Best, the show for people with big opinions.

[A]

Hi, I'm Molly Bloom, and this is Smash Boom Best, the show where we take two things, smash them together, and ask you to decide which one is best. Today's debate is a critter clash. On one side, we've got a rowdy reptile equipped with armor and a winning smile. And on the other, we've got a mischievous mammal with webbed feet and the cutest little smooshy face. That's right, it's alligators versus otters. Here to play in the waves for Team Otter is writer, comedian and improviser Andy Hillbrands.

[D]

You ought to believe that we're gonna have a nice time here.

[A]

And here to tip the scales for alligators is writer, director, and story pirate, Lee Overtree.

[E]

Chop, chop, y'.

[A]

All.

[E]

Alligators in the house.

[C]

Yes.

[A]

And our judge for this fauna fight is Alex from Montclair, New Jersey. Alex does taekwondo, builds sets for his school plays, and wants to write a graphic novel someday. Hi, Alex.

[F]

Hi.

[A]

So how did you get started doing taekwondo?

[C]

Actually, it's kind of funny. When I was, like, five, I watched Kung Fu Panda and I thought it was really cool. And I was like, I want to do kung fu. And then my parents were like, well, this is kind of similar. And then I really liked it.

[A]

That's awesome. I really like that you were inspired by a cartoon panda. That's the best. So you also are part of the stage crew for your high school theater?

[C]

Yes.

[A]

What's the most fun thing you've gotten to to build for a show? Ooh.

[C]

So for our last show, we did so not Shakespeare's the Comedy of Errors, but the Comedy of Terrible Errors, which is a parody on the Comedy of Errors, which is kind of weird, but we built it was supposed to be like a school that was putting on, like, Romeo and Juliet, but then at the last moment, it got changed to the comedy of errors. And so we built this really big platform with a balcony that was supposed to be the famous scene from Romeo and Juliet. So that was hard, but it was really fun to build.

[A]

That's so cool. Do you have ideas for what you want your graphic novel to be about?

[C]

Well, I make a lot of my own characters, so something about them. I like sci fi and fantasy things a lot, so something along those lines. But I also, you know, I used to read a lot of graphic novels and, like, the author would tell a story about themselves, so I might do kind of like an autobiographical thing.

[A]

Very cool. Will Alex pick Team Otter or Team Alligator? Only time will tell. But first, here are the rules of the game. Every debate consists of four. The declaration of greatness, the micro round, the sneak attack, and the final six. After each round, our judge, Alex will award points to the team that impresses him the most. But he'll keep his decisions top secret until the end of the debate. Listeners, we want you to judge too. Mark down your points as you listen. At the end of the show, head to our website, smashboom.org and vote for whichever team you think won. Okay, Alex, Andy and Leigh, are you ready?

[E]

Yes, totally ready.

[D]

Oh, I've been waiting for this.

[A]

Then it's time for the declaration of greatness. In this round, our debaters will present a well crafted immersive argument in favor of their. Then they'll each have 30 seconds to rebut their opponent's statements. We flipped a coin and Lee, you're up first. Tell us why alligators are alligraters.

[E]

Okay, let me start by saying, see you later, alligator. I know what you're thinking. Starting by saying goodbye makes so much sense. Right, I agree. Because see you later, alligator is the coolest way of saying goodbye. What do otters have? Uh. Get out of the water, Otter.

[D]

No, wait.

[E]

Say hi to your daughter, Otter. No, Luke, I am your father, Otter.

[A]

Sheesh.

[E]

See? Not as cool. But also see ya later, alligator is a solid scientific prediction given what we know about these scaly swamp puppies. What I mean is, later, far in the future, you'll probably still see alligators looking the same way as they do today. Because these teethy cuties have been pretty much the same for 30 million years. Almost every other animal has had to grow new body parts or change their appearance to survive a changing planet. But not alligators. They got it right the first time. Yeah. Way to go, my sweet. Little chomp logs. And they've been able to stay the same because they're perfectly built to survive anything. And I mean anything. Because I know what you're thinking, Lee. If alligators are such good survivors, why aren't they allowed to compete on the TV show Survivor? I thought the same thing, but obviously, you know, it wouldn't be fair to everyone else.

[G]

Gary, you managed to live one month on this desert island with nothing but a blanket and a flask of water and a hockey stick that washed up on shore.

[A]

I used rocks to sharpen it into a spear.

[G]

Impressive. But alligator, you managed to survive your entire life on this island with nothing but a mouthful of teeth which can bite through a turtle's shell. Alligator, you are the winner.

[F]

Wait, I can bite through a turtle too.

[E]

Look,

[A]

Someone please call a dentist.

[E]

Alligators are also excellent hunters. They'll camouflage themselves in the water and sneak up on prey before darting out and biting down. Some of them have even figured out how to get food delivered. These alligators balance sticks on their heads during bird nesting season when birds are looking for twigs to build a nest. A bird sees the stick, comes on over to grab one and chomp. See ya.

[D]

Whoa.

[E]

That's awesome.

[D]

I have to pay extra to get my meals delivered.

[E]

Yeah, well, I guess it's just one of the perks of being an apex predator. What's an apex predator? It basically means alligators are the top of the food chain. You know, the big dog, the best of the beasties. They can eat almost anything. And once they're fully grown, they nothing dares mess with them. It's like nature already crowned them the smash boom best. But I know what you're thinking again, Lee. Why do you always know what I'm thinking? No, I mean, Lee, since they are such efficient eating machines, they must also be excellent mothers, right? Yeah. Obviously. Mama gators lay eggs, but they can't keep them warm themselves because gators are cold blooded. So they nests out of decaying plant stuff. As the plant stuff decays, it gives off warmth and that keeps the gator eggs so cozy. Clever, right? When it's time to hatch, the mama gator carefully takes the eggs in her mouth and brings them near water. She'll help her baby out and let it splish splash for its first bath. Aw, so cute. I just want to kiss you. Okay, Sorry. Don't get too close to baby alligators, okay? Those babies will stay close to their mom for years and she'll protect them the way any other mother would by viciously tearing the Flesh off of anything that bothers them. So sweet. So let's review. Alligators are survivors. They are clever hunters, loyal moms, and if you ask me, totally adorable. Those cute little teeth. Oh my goodness, the funny lizard. He smiles. Gators, more like graters. Am I right? And now, once again, I know what you're thinking. So you must be thinking, Lee, how are you going to close out such a winning argument in a way that does justice to all of the awesomeness that came before it? To which I say, with the best sign off of all time, see you later, alligator. Yes. Lee, you nailed it. Woo hoo. Yes. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. Woo.

[D]

Wow.

[A]

A heroic and adventurous declaration of greatness there for alligators.

[D]

Yeah.

[A]

Wow.

[D]

I didn't realize we were able to get Michael Bay to direct ours. That's incredible.

[A]

Alex, what stood out to you about Lee's argument?

[C]

It was very funny and I really liked all the facts about alligators. I'm very into like biology and evolution, so that like stood out to me how like alligators haven't had a lot of adaptations because they're so perfect.

[E]

Yeah.

[C]

And like comparing them to otters to defend your side.

[A]

Absolutely. Well, speaking of comparing them to otters, Andy, it is time for your rebuttal. You get 30 seconds to show why alligators don't really have bite. And your 30 seconds starts right now.

[D]

Okay. First, how would they say goodbye? They'd say, I'm otter here. I mean, it's just that simple. Second, of course we'd love to see an otter on Survivor. Did you know that the otters are one of the only five stone tool using species on Earth and it's the only non primate mammal that does that. Also, you know, it isn't that the alligators are so scary because we need to remember that there are instances of otters attacking and killing alligators. In fact, in Florida, a photographer caught one river otter, only 30 pounds, the size of a Thanksgiving turkey, eating a five foot alligator.

[E]

What?

[C]

Oh my God.

[D]

Don't let those good looks deceive you, okay?

[E]

All you had to do was say otter the size of a Thanksgiving turkey. And I stopped listening because that is the most horrific image I've ever had to contemplate in my life. Are you trying to make me wake up in a cold sweat tonight? Because you just did. And I'm not sure that exactly is the path to a winning argument.

[D]

That's not even the biggest one, buddy.

[E]

Oh my. Yikes. I'm not gonna sleep the rest of the month.

[A]

Oh my gosh. This is a very exciting debate already. We're going to be right back with more after this. Smash. Smashed. Okay, we're back with Alligators versus Otters, and Andy is about to tell us why otters are going to swim their way to victory.

[D]

Okay, almost there. Come on, think, think, think. All right, just a little more paste over here. Okay. Oh, pipe cleaners. Yes, pipe cleaners for whiskers.

[A]

Oh.

[D]

Oh, that's looking good. And I did it. The world's largest otter sculpture is finally finished. See the semi realistic artificial fur, the boopable nose. It even smells like a real otter. Come here, take a whiff. Smell that. That is dead fish. That's a commitment I had to this project. And did I mention it's 95ft tall?

[G]

Wow, that's one big otter statue.

[D]

It ought to be. I used several tons of paper mache to make this baby.

[G]

I reckon that's the biggest otter statue in the world.

[D]

I hope so. I submitted it to the Guinness Book of World Records. Now, you might be wondering, Andy, why did you quit your job and devote 100% of your time to making a 95 foot tall otter sculpture? Good question, Andy. Did you seriously clean out your retirement savings to pay for the supplies? Better question, Andy. When was the last time you slept? The answer is yes, I did quit my job and clean out my 401k. And no, I don't sleep because every time I close my eyes, I see 95ft tall otters.

[E]

Shucks, you must love otters.

[D]

More than love. I'm obsessed. They're super cute, little round faces, the teddy bear like bodies, the fluffy fur. But don't be fooled. Otters are actually incredible hunters. They dive into the water and grab their prey off the ground underwater like urchins, clams, and crabs. Then they come up to the surface, float on their backs like they're laying on a watery hammock, and place their little snacks on their bellies like they got little tummy tables. But here's a really cool thing. Because a lot of their prey have super hard shells, like clams and mussels, otters use tools to eat. Scientists have seen them using rocks to break open shells so they can slurp up what's inside. And because they often live in cold environments like the ocean, otters have to eat a lot every day to stay warm. Some eat about 25 pounds of food every single day. So please, please, never invite an otter to your restaurant.

[A]

Tonight's special will be Pacific little neck clams served in a truffle cream Sauce garnished with a. Hey, you otters, you gotta pay for those.

[D]

All this eating helps the environment. The otters, who live off the coast of California, love to munch on sea urchins. Urchins eat kelp. So without the otters to keep the urchins in check, there'd be way too many urchins and they'd eat up all the beautiful underwater kelp forests. So thank you. Otters. Plus otters are real party poopers. And by that I mean they like to dance right before they poop. Certain male otters will get on solid ground and sway from foot to foot, waving their butts in the air before going number two.

[E]

Hey, hey, check this out. I call it the Turd trot.

[B]

Nice one.

[A]

This one's called the Dung dance.

[D]

Scientists aren't sure why they do this, but it's possible they're using their dances to talk to each other. Like, hey, you should join my group. I'm super cool. Hello.

[E]

Are you Andy Hill Brands? I'm from the Guinness Book of World Records. Here you go.

[D]

Omg, I did it. Oh, I did it. Andrew Hilbrand's for the world's largest papier mache statue of an otter 94ft tall. Oh, wait, wait, wait. Please come back. It's 95ft.

[A]

Wow. A record breaking declaration of greatness there. Worth giving up your retirement savings for, I dare say. Okay, Alex, what stood out to you about Andy's declaration of greatness?

[C]

Well, first of all, I love this sound effect. Just all the facts were really cute. It was very funny as well. I liked the little restaurant bit. That was good. And I thought it was cool how the otters keep the sea urchin populations down. That's pretty cool.

[A]

Very cool indeed. Okay, leigh, you get 30 seconds to tell us why you otter not like otters. And your 30 seconds begins right now.

[E]

Okay, Alex, you mentioned the restaurant bit. Well, I have some bad news for you, my friend. Which besides otters having what scientists call the smelliest poop in nature and something you definitely want to avoid, they also are terrible tippers. Scientists have noticed that anytime otters go to a restaurant, they're only tipping like 6 or 7%. That's ridiculous. In this day and age, waiters and waitresses need a living wage. Alex. They need it.

[A]

Please.

[D]

You know what I will say. But because they're so self sufficient, they've never had to get a job in the service industry. So they don't understand that tipping 15 to 20% is extremely important. See, I was a waiter one. So I can only tip 20% even if I don't get my food.

[E]

Spoken like someone who just gave up their 401k. Apparently, for some reason I gave it

[D]

up because I don't have one.

[A]

Easy come, easy go. Okay, Alex, it is time to award some points. Please give one point to the declaration of greatness that you liked best and one point to the rebuttal that won you over. You get to decide what makes a winning argument. Did one team make stronger points? Did another show more passion? Award your points, but don't tell us who they're going to. Have you made your decision?

[C]

Yes.

[A]

Excellent. Leigh and Andy, how are you two feeling so far?

[E]

I feel great. Andy, I think that you should feel great too. Because, you know, effort is the most important thing. The quality argument less important. So congratulations, my friend.

[D]

I was about to say that I just kind of put my head in my hands and just closed my eyes and listened to your beautifully produced argument. But now I didn't realize that we were taking little passive jabs.

[A]

Oh, my goodness, I cannot wait to hear what's next. We're gonna take a quick break, so fluff your fur and floss between those

[C]

teeth and we'll be right back with more smashboom. Best.

[A]

You're listening to State of Debate, home to rage and rhetoric and awe inspiring argumentation.

[H]

Greetings, debate enthusiasts. I'm Taylor Lincoln, the most enthusiastic of debaters.

[I]

And I'm Todd Douglas, the most debatable of enthusiasts. And Taylor, I have a doozy of a fallacy for you today.

[E]

A doozy?

[A]

Do tell.

[I]

Well, you know that fallacies are debate mistakes that make your argument easy to defeat.

[H]

I sure do.

[I]

Well, I just witnessed the fallacy. Fallacy? That's when you decide that if someone uses a fallacy, their entire argument must be bad.

[H]

That is a doozy. It makes me feel dizzy.

[I]

Take a listen.

[F]

Ooh, Gret, look. That house over there, it's made of sweets. Oh, wow, Hansel, I love sweets. Let's go start nibbling on the front steps.

[B]

Hansel, that is not a good idea.

[F]

Why not? I always say when life gives you a house made out of sweets, you eat that house.

[B]

Yes, but too many sweets are bad for you. Plus, that house looks kind of old. And those sweets might be super stale. And we're in the Enchanted Forest. Everybody knows that houses made out of sweets in the Enchanted Forest belong to witches. And those witches will want to eat you.

[F]

Everyone knows. Gretel, my dear, that is a fallacy. You're assuming everyone knows this when some people might not. What a terrible argument. And since you used a fallacy, I'm sure that all your previous points are bad too. Now excuse me while I go snarf some roof shingles.

[I]

Wow, Hansel. Just because your sister used one logical fallacy doesn't mean you should ignore all of her arguments. Some of those points were solid.

[H]

It's good to look closely at all the points made and be skeptical. Especially when mysterious candy houses are involved.

[I]

Indeedy doody Taylor Tooty.

[H]

And that's all we have time for today on State of Debate.

[E]

Smash.

[D]

Boom.

[E]

Best.

[A]

You're listening to smashboom Best. I'm your host, Molly Bloom.

[C]

And I'm your judge, Alex.

[A]

And we love getting debate suggestions from our listeners. Like this one.

[B]

My name is Maxine and I live in Minneapolis, Minnesota. And my debate idea, it's kids versus parents.

[C]

Oh, my. This will start some dinner table debates for the ages.

[A]

Absolutely. We'll check back in at the end of this episode to see which side Maxine thinks should win.

[C]

And now back to today's debate. Alligators versus otters.

[A]

Get ready for round two. It's the micro round. Andy and Lee, you'll each get three chances to make a microargument backed by a cool fact. Lee started things off last round, so Andy, you get to go first. Please share your first otter of fact.

[D]

Chomp chomp. Sea otters bite with up to 615 pounds per square inch of force. You know what also does that? A black bear. That's right. It's cute. It wraps itself in seaweed and it bites like a bear.

[E]

Wait, did he just say chomp chomp? Because I thought I trademarked that for alligators at the beginning of the episode.

[D]

No, Pac man trademarked that in the 70s.

[E]

Oh, okay. Yeah, you're right. You're right. Well, I guess we're gonna be paying a lot of money to Pac Man. Okay, so my fact is that alligators and crocodiles are similar, but they're not the same thing. Alligators, they have round snouts and crocs have pointy ones. Crocs also have, like, toothier faces. And so alligators, they're so cute. They have a little underbite like that. And there's only one place in the world where crocodiles and alligators live side by side. The number one place that I avoid if I can. That's right. Florida. Truly the melting pot of large reptilian creatures. Who could eat a turtle and senior citizens?

[D]

Do you mean they would eat senior citizens or also senior Citizens.

[E]

Well, you may have just uncovered a conspiracy theory that I'm very much in favor of putting forward.

[D]

Oh, fact you. Oh, they're so sweet. Did you know that baby sea otters are born with fur that floats? So before they do anything, they just float like a cork in the water. And I think that's so sweet. And I would also like to point out that I love that the both of our arguments is me trying to make otters more scary and you trying to make alligators seem cute.

[A]

I love it.

[E]

Okay, this next one is probably my favorite fact about alligators, because they are gender curious, my friend. Male, female. For baby alligators, it's a matter of temperature. Remember those nests that I mentioned earlier? Well, baby alligator eggs will become either male or female, depending on how hot or cold the nest is, which is just wild above 33 degrees Celsius, which I could not tell you what that is in Fahrenheit, so I really don't have a frame of reference for this fact at all. But above 33 degrees Celsius, the eggs make all male babies. Below 30, 30 Celsius, they become female. What happens between 30 and 33 degrees? I guess scientists are still working on that. But here's a bonus fun fact. When the baby gator inside the egg is ready to hatch, it starts making cute little noises to let the mama know. Oh, it's like an oven timer letting you know that your cookies are done baking. But instead of cookies, it's baby gators that you should not eat because they still bite.

[C]

Maybe between 30 and 33 degrees. They're non binary.

[E]

That's what I'm thinking. Right? Which is so cool. Alligators, they've been around the longest and yet they're the most progressive.

[D]

So, yes, otters are cute, but did you know that there's the giant river otter? You know, we talked about turkeys earlier, but there is this otter that scientists literally call Lobos del Rio, which is Spanish for river wolf, and that can grow up to 5ft, 10 inches.

[E]

No.

[D]

So imagine that thing staring you down while you contemplate the ethics of adding a bonus fact in a round of three facts.

[E]

Wow. Wow. That's nightmare fuel right there.

[D]

Truly.

[E]

You know, but here's another fact about alligators, which is that you maybe thought that otters were the only ones who could dance after we heard that, you know, borderline inappropriate fact about them dancing when they go poo in order to make friends. What is this podcast rated anyway? But the alligator dance is way more appropriate for family listening, right? Because they dance to find love. When a male alligator is looking for a partner, it'll shake its body in the water real fast, sending vibrations through the swamp, and it will create little spouts of water that look like a fancy fountain. And this last part is uncorroborated, but some scientists think that they might also sing ABBA songs.

[D]

Hey, there's nothing wrong with a little movement to create a movement.

[A]

Incredible work. All right, Alex, what facts stood out to you from this round?

[C]

Well, I mean, I liked all the jokes. First of all, I have always wondered what the difference was between alligators and crocodiles. So that was cool to learn.

[E]

I'm so happy to help. Just whatever you need. I'm so glad we were able to

[C]

help and that the only place where they both live together is in Florida. I mean, I guess I could have guessed that, but. And that they danced to Mate. That was pretty cool. And then for otters, they have the same bite force as bears. That's crazy. Their fur floats. That's really cute. And a five foot long. What was it? Five feet long?

[D]

Five ten.

[C]

That's taller than me. Like, that's crazy.

[A]

Me too.

[D]

Five ten. If that was an American male, they just say six foot.

[A]

Oh, my gosh.

[C]

I mean, you got me. I'm like 5:3, but I say 5:4. So

[A]

incredible. Okay, Alex, this is tough, but it is time to award a point for this micro round. The criteria are totally subjective and totally up to you. Did you learn some new things? What fact is gonna stick with you? Please award a point, but don't tell us who it's going to. Have you made your decision? I have. Perfect. Keep it secret and we'll be right back. Want smashboom without the ad breaks? Join Smarty Pass and get an ad free feed of this and all of the other shows in the Brainzon universe. Plus, you'll get to do virtual hangs with me and the CRE and get discounts on merch. Sign [e-mail] thanks.

[D]

Boom.

[A]

Smash. All right, we're back, and it's time for our third round, the super stealthy sneak attack. This is our improvised round where debaters have to respond to a challenge on the spot. Today's challenge is secret handshake. We want you to invent a secret handshake inspired by your side. Maybe this is a handshake you do with the animal itself, or maybe it's a handshake to do with other humans who appreciate your side. We don't care. It's up to you. Please teach us how to do this handshake. Does this make sense, Lee and Andy?

[D]

Yes, it does.

[E]

Totally.

[A]

All right, Lee, we're going to start with you this time. Please teach us your top secret handshake for alligators.

[E]

Okay. My top secret handshake is called the alligator death roll, which is a real thing. The alligator death roll. It's like this dangerous spinning maneuver that alligators use to subdue, drown, and dismember their prey. So in this secret handshake, it's actually very similar to an alligator death roll. So, like, I grab you, and then we jump in the pool, and we spin. We spin and we spin. The only thing I don't do is subdue, drown, or dismember, and we get out of the pool, and then, you know, that's it.

[A]

Great. Secret handshake.

[C]

I'm glad you're not dismembering anyone.

[E]

Yeah, you're welcome.

[C]

I was worried when you said death roll.

[E]

You know, I know, I know. A lot of people are. When I try to teach them the handshake, I get a lot of no's.

[D]

That might just be a branding. That might be a branding issue.

[E]

Yeah, you're right. That is a branding issue. It's not fair.

[A]

Do you think you can come up with a new name for it?

[E]

Um, the alligator won't dismember you role.

[A]

Oh, great. Perfect. I love it. Okay, Andy, it is your turn. How would you honor otters with a secret handshake?

[E]

Yeah, I'd call it the.

[D]

The chatty. So close. You see? You know, otters have around a dozen different calls, so that's why we're gonna have around 12 steps to this handshake. But how it's going to end is you're just gonna hold the person's hand and you're gonna fall asleep together. Because otters sleep by holding hands, so they don't drift off both emotionally and physically.

[E]

That's so sweet. That's really sweet.

[A]

Are you gonna teach us all 12 steps right now?

[D]

Yeah. You put your hand out, and then you put the other hand, and then you do what we call the friend roll. So instead of tearing your shoulder and trying to subdue and dismember you, you just kind of do si do for a little bit.

[E]

Sounds fun.

[D]

And then there's nine more steps, and then you fall asleep.

[A]

Sounds great. I love a nap. Okay, Alex, think about those incredible handshakes. Does one seem more fun to do? Does one seem more memorable? Does one seem like you really want to use it with your friends? Or your enemies choose a side to award a point. But as always, keep it hush, hush. Have you made your decision?

[C]

Yes.

[F]

Great.

[A]

Then it's time for our final round. The final six. In this round, each team will have just six words to sum up the glory of their side. Andy, time to float your way to victory. With six more words.

[D]

They eat alligators. Argument over. Byee.

[A]

Okay, Lee, Alec, give it your all with your final six.

[E]

Andy might be that giant otter.

[A]

Oh, it's true. This is a podcast we can't see. Is Andy in fact a giant otter?

[E]

5, 10, or 6 foot?

[A]

Oh, my gosh.

[D]

Yeah, maybe. I do work PR for Big Otter, so.

[A]

Okay, Alex, you have heard the final words. Please think about them one more time and award your final point for the final six. Have you made your decision?

[C]

Yes.

[A]

Excellent. All right, tally up those points. Are you ready to declare one team the smashboom best?

[C]

I am.

[A]

Oh, my goodness. Drumroll, please. And the winner is.

[C]

Otters.

[D]

Yes.

[E]

No. No.

[D]

Yes. The statue wasn't in vain.

[A]

So, Alex, what was the moment that decided it for otters?

[C]

Actually, the final six, it was tied until then.

[A]

Whoa.

[E]

MG so Andy being that giant otter really convinced you, right? He's terrifying, right?

[D]

Yeah. And you set me apart.

[E]

You didn't feel threatened?

[A]

Oh, my gosh.

[C]

I was just a little confused.

[D]

Hey, whatever it takes.

[A]

Oh, amazing.

[D]

I mean, Leigh, you are so great. Your voice is absolutely wonderful. I love that. Your whole just personality and demeanor and take on the debate as well as. Yeah, alligators are cool as heck.

[E]

Thank you. That's so sweet. Andy, I can't say enough about the way that you made otters palpable for this audience. It was incredible. I mean, a lot of people just can't get that smell out of their nose from the poop, but you managed to make us even borderline. Forget it. Like, with your dulcet tones, your incredible reasoning, and your sharp wit, you really won this. And don't let anyone ever tell you you didn't.

[C]

You're so. You're so descriptive. I might. I might change my mind.

[D]

You know, don't. Don't fall for his passive aggressive tone. Are you not picking up on that? That would only make me feel good in writing.

[E]

Oh, my God. Does that mean I'm a good actor?

[A]

Yes, Lee, you are.

[E]

Finally.

[A]

Well, that is it for today's debate battle. Alex, Crown Otters the Smashboom best. But what about you?

[C]

Head to smashboom.org and vote to tell us who you think won.

[A]

This episode was produced by me, Molly Bloom, Sana Totten and Mark Sanchez. We had sound design by Rachel Breese. We had engineering help from David Amelin, and our announcer is Marlee Feuerwerker Otto. We want to give a special thanks to Austin Cross and Taylor Kaufman. Lee, is there anyone you want to give a shout out to to today?

[E]

I just want to give a shout out to everyone here for being great.

[A]

Oh, Lee, you're great. How about you, Andy? Any special shout outs?

[D]

Yeah, I'd like to give one shout out to Dottie and Frankie, my two dogs who decided not to bark while being in the room with me. And also I want to give a shout out to, of course, the crew here because I am now three. Zero.

[A]

Oh, my goodness.

[E]

Watch out. Last time I won Smash Moon Best, I was shadow band.

[A]

Alex, do you want to give any special thanks?

[C]

My parents for being awesome and supportive, my brother for tolerating my shenanigans, and my dog because she's cute.

[A]

Before we go, let's check in and see who Maxine thinks should win the kids versus Parents debate.

[B]

I think kids would win because they have better eyesight and you can learn more things if you're under the age

[A]

of 10, if you're between the ages of 13 and 18 and you'd like to be a judge, or if you're any age and you have an idea for a knockdown drag out debate, head to smashboom.org contact and drop us a line. And if you're a fan of the show and want to keep it going, head to smartypass.org to subscribe. We'll be back in the next week with a new smashboom Fest episode. Onions versus corn. See ya.

[C]

Bye.

[D]

I'm out of here.

[E]

Later, alligator.

[A]

Better than the rest.

[C]

Wait, can I say otters again? I feel like I didn't sound excited.

[E]

I wonder if there's a reason for that, though.

[D]

Let's mute Lee and just let you cook for half an hour.