Goats vs. Boa Constrictors: a curious debate

Summary

Smash Boom Best: Goats vs. Boa Constrictors – A Curious Debate

Episode Release Date: May 29, 2025

Welcome to another exciting episode of Smash Boom Best, the funny and smart debate show designed for kids and families, brought to you by American Public Media. In this episode, titled "Goats vs. Boa Constrictors: A Curious Debate," host Molly Bloom pits two fascinating creatures against each other to determine which is the best. Let's dive into the detailed summary of this engaging episode.

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Introduction

Molly Bloom opens the show with an urgent plea for donations, emphasizing the importance of supporting public media to keep shows like Smash Boom Best thriving. She highlights the show's mission to provide entertaining and educational debates that teach listeners how to defend their opinions and spot logical fallacies.

[00:01] Molly Bloom: "If there's one thing that's not up for debate, it's that the world needs more Smash Boom Best."

After the fundraising appeal, Molly introduces the debaters and the judge for today's debate.

Meet the Debaters and Judge

• Latif Nasser: Radiolab co-host and science historian, advocating for Goats.
• Alie Ward: Science TV personality and host of the podcasts Ologies and Smallogy, advocating for Boa Constrictors.
• Calista: The judge from Atlanta, Georgia, an animal enthusiast with a knack for crafts and imaginative backyard adventures.

[02:10] Alie Ward: "Quiet, cunning experts at hugging. It's boa erd bust."

Round 1: Declaration of Greatness

In the first round, each debater presents a well-crafted argument supporting their side.

Latif Nasser on Goats

Latif passionately argues for goats, highlighting their playful nature, historical significance, and unique biological features. He shares amusing anecdotes and scientific facts to illustrate why goats are exceptional.

[04:43] Latif Nasser: "Goats life is the best. No jobs, no homework, no stress, no mess. Well, I mean, actually tons of mess."

He emphasizes the domestication of goats, their role in human civilization, and their social behaviors, making a compelling case for their superiority.

[07:19] Latif Nasser: "Goats were one of the first domesticated animals. People used them for meat, for milk, for furs. Goats helped keep humans alive in a tough time."

Alie Ward on Boa Constrictors

Alie responds with humor and sharp wit, pointing out the drawbacks of goats while extolling the virtues of boa constrictors. She uses creative analogies and fun facts to make her case.

[09:58] Alie Ward: "Goats think they're so cute. Have you ever seen a barnyard animal that is more in love with itself?"

She contrasts the playful chaos of goats with the stealth and efficiency of boas, arguing that boas are superior in terms of control and utility.

Calista's Feedback

After the initial declarations, Calista shares her impressions.

[09:36] Calista: "I love that they're so social and that they could be as loving as dogs. And also, the no hands joke was hilarious."

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Round 2: Micro Round – Letters to the Editor

Each debater crafted a letter to the editor responding to issues related to their animal.

Alie Ward's Letter (Boa Constrictors)

Alie writes a humorous and eloquent letter addressing the misrepresentation of boas in fashion, advocating for more respectful terminology.

[22:04] Alie Ward: "Dear Vogue Editor in Chief, I'm writing to express extreme disappointment and frustration at your recent fashion spread featuring feather boas."

She cleverly intertwines fashion critique with advocacy for boa constrictors, highlighting their misunderstood nature.

Latif Nasser's Letter (Goats)

Latif counters with a heartfelt defense of goats, addressing misconceptions and defending their gentle nature against negative stereotypes perpetuated by boas.

[24:15] Gary the Goat: "Dear Editor in General, when others say mean things about me, I usually just ignore it."

He uses humor and personal anecdotes to strengthen his argument, making goats relatable and sympathetic.

Calista's Feedback

Calista praises the creativity and humor in both letters.

[26:40] Calista: "They were both very, very funny. I love plumage scarfs. That's great."

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Round 3: Super Stealthy Sneak Attack – Haikus

This improvised round challenges debaters to create haikus praising their side and disparaging the opponent.

Latif Nasser's Haikus (Goats)

Haiku for Goats:

[27:39] Latif Nasser: "Goats have such soft wool. They made your favorite sweater, like, the warmest hug."

Haiku against Boas:

[27:52] Latif Nasser: "Boas, pretend hug. Really? They smother and kill. Also botulism."

Latif's haikus blend poetic flair with sharp criticism of boas, emphasizing the friendly nature of goats.

Alie Ward's Haikus (Boa Constrictors)

Haiku for Boas:

[29:07] Alie Ward: "Smooth, stealthy slithers eating up rats like candy. Boas hug our hearts."

Haiku against Goats:

[29:57] Alie Ward: "Screaming, stinky goats, we're over your prestige. Goats, let ye be gone."

Alie's haikus effectively highlight the prowess and understated charm of boas while mocking the less desirable traits of goats.

Calista's Feedback

Calista appreciates the creativity and wit in the haikus.

[30:28] Calista: "I have awarded my point."

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Round 4: Final Six Words

Each debater distills their argument into six impactful words.

Alie Ward's Six Words (Boas)

[30:45] Alie Ward: "Boas don't even need legs, so."

Latif Nasser's Six Words (Goats)

[31:00] Latif Nasser: "Goodness of goats, greatest of all time, plus cheese."

Calista evaluates these succinct pitches to determine the final points.

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Final Verdict

After tallying the points from all four rounds, Calista declares Boa Constrictors the winner of this episode's debate.

[31:36] Calista: "Boa Constrictors."

Debaters' Final Thoughts

Alie Ward and Latif Nasser share their concluding remarks, commending each other and reflecting on the debate's outcomes.

[31:47] Alie Ward: "Latif is a genius... someone who can come up with a haiku that involves botulism off the dome is not to be messed with."

[32:18] Latif Nasser: "The thing I was particularly astonished by was this creature, Boa Constrictor... it was so great and imaginative and delightful, and I loved it."

Outro

Molly wraps up the episode by encouraging listeners to vote on who they think won the debate by visiting the show's website. She also teases upcoming episodes and thanks everyone involved.

[33:05] Calista: "Head to smashboom.org and vote to tell us who you think won."

The episode concludes with brief shout-outs and acknowledgments, setting the stage for future debates.

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Key Takeaways

• Goats are celebrated for their social nature, historical significance in human civilization, and playful demeanor. Latif highlighted their unique features, such as rectangular pupils and their roles within herds, making a strong case for their charm and utility.

• Boa Constrictors are praised for their stealth, efficiency as predators, and benefits in pest control. Alie effectively used humor and sharp arguments to showcase the boas' superior qualities, emphasizing their role in maintaining ecological balance.

• Calista served as an impartial and insightful judge, providing valuable feedback after each round and ultimately determining the winner based on the strength of the arguments presented.

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Final Note: Whether you're Team Goats or Team Boa Constrictors, this episode of Smash Boom Best offers a delightful blend of humor, facts, and passionate debate, making it a must-listen for families and young listeners eager to learn and engage in friendly competition.

Transcript

[Molly Bloom]

Hello, smashboom besties. Molly here. Usually, things at smashboom Best are pretty light and breezy lemon squeezy. But right now it's more like windy and cold and your lemon has mold. Because public media is threatened like never before. Funding for shows like ours is up in the air to keep going. We really need you to step up right now. It's pretty urgent, so if you listen, we are 100% talking to you. Head to smashboom. Smashboom.org donate right now. It takes less than a minute. I know what you're thinking. Smashboom Best is public media. The people behind debates like sneezing versus farting and jelly beans versus actual beans are public media people. Yeah. That's why at smashboom Best you don't just hear silly arguments. You also learn how to back up your points with facts or how to spot logical fallacies. We believe this work is important and we want it to keep going. But we can't do that unless you and all our listeners help us out today. Please hit pause, head to smashboom.org donate right now and give any amount you can. Because if there's one thing that's not up for debate, it's that the world needs more smashboom Best. Thank you so much.

[Alie Ward]

From the brains behind brains on. It's Smash Boom Best, the show for.

[Calista]

People with big opinions.

[Molly Bloom]

Hi, I'm Molly Bloom and this is smashboom Best, the show where we take two things, smash them together, and ask you to decide which one is best. Today's debate pairs a nimble climber with a silent slitherer. It's goats versus Boa constrictors. Radiolab co host and science historian Latif Nasser is here to give us the.

[Latif Nasser]

Goods for team Goats who let the goats out. Hoof. Hoof. Hoof. Huff.

[Molly Bloom]

And science TV personality and host of the podcast Ologies and Smallogy's Alie Ward is here to bring the squeeze for team Boa constrictors.

[Alie Ward]

Quiet, cunning experts at hugging. It's boa erd bust.

[Molly Bloom]

And here to judge it all is Calista from Atlanta, Georgia. Calista loves animals, especially predators, is super crafty with a hot glue gun, and loves to lead her siblings on imaginative adventures in the backyard. Hi, Calista.

[Calista]

Hi, Molly.

[Molly Bloom]

So, Calista, what kind of predators are your favorite?

[Calista]

I like big cats, especially lions. They're just like, cool. I like that they're like, bigger and tougher.

[Molly Bloom]

Do you think your heart can be opened to a non predator in the debate today? Can you put your predator love aside for a wee bit.

[Calista]

Definitely.

[Molly Bloom]

Wonderful. So what are some of your favorite crafts that you've used a hot glue gun on?

[Calista]

I took Altoids containers and I put a bunch of rhinestones on them and gave them as little trinket boxes to my siblings for Christmas.

[Molly Bloom]

Oh, that is so sweet. How many siblings do you have?

[Calista]

Not including me, I have four.

[Molly Bloom]

Okay, so there's five of you.

[Alie Ward]

Yeah.

[Molly Bloom]

You're leading adventures, you're giving them presents. It's really sweet. So do you have any advice for our debaters today?

[Calista]

Have fun.

[Molly Bloom]

Excellent advice. Will Calista side with Latif or Ally? Only time will tell.

[Calista]

But first, smashboom Bests is a nonprofit.

[Molly Bloom]

Public radio program, which means we rely on support from our listeners to keep the show going. There are lots of ways you can support the show.

[Calista]

You can donate, become a smartypass subscriber, or buy our merch like a Smashboom.

[Molly Bloom]

Best hoodie, pencil pouch, or keychain.

[Calista]

Head to smashboom.org to show your support. Thanks.

[Molly Bloom]

Now, on to the rules. Every debate consists of four. The Declaration of Greatness, the micro round, the sneak attack, and the final six. After each round, our judge, Calista will award points to the team that impresses her the most. But she'll keep her decisions top secret until the end of the debate. Listeners, we want you to judge too. Mark down your points as you listen. At the end of the show, head to our website, smashboom.org and vote for whichever team you think won. Okay. Latif, Allie and Calista, are you ready?

[Calista]

Yep.

[Latif Nasser]

Definitely.

[Alie Ward]

Never been more so.

[Molly Bloom]

Then it's time for the Declaration of Greatness. In this round, our debaters will present a well crafted, immersive argument in favor of their side. Then they'll each have 30 seconds to rebut their opponent's statements. We flipped a coin. And Latif, you're up first. Tell us what makes goats the goat for today's debate.

[Latif Nasser]

Don't think of me as Latif. Think of me as Goatif because I've joined a goatherd. I strapped on a pair of horns, pranced out to a pasture, and now I'm one with the goats. You said it, Gertrude Stein. Goat life is the best. No jobs, no homework, no stress, no mess. Well, I mean, actually tons of mess. Because me and my GFFs love to roll around in dust and soil as.

[Gary the Goat]

A way to clean ourselves.

[Latif Nasser]

I look amazing, right? And goats are so fun. They're playful, a little mischievous, and hysterical. Good one. Godus Redding. See? So funny. This is way better than being a snake, where you just, I don't know, pretend to be a stick and hope no one steps on you. Shed your skin like some kind of living banana peel. Instead, I'm out here climbing tall things.

[Gary the Goat]

And then standing on tall things.

[Latif Nasser]

I'm jumping, I'm bleeding, I'm eating grass. Mmm. So much fiber. Going full. Goat isn't as wild as it seems. In fact, about 10 years ago, a man named Thomas Thwaites spent a week in the Swiss Alps living with goats. He even built prosthetic legs so he could walk on all fours. He later said goats showed him how to be more present and relaxed. When I'm with goats, I definitely feel more chill. It makes sense. Humans and goats get along because we go way back, like around 10,000 years back. It's the dawn of civilization in a place called the Fertile Crescent, which spans North Africa and Western Asia. No electricity, no running water. Humans are just learning to farm when a brilliant idea strikes.

[Molly Bloom]

Dude, what if we farmed goats like we planted them in dirt? I don't think that's how you grow more goats, bro. No, we just keep them around the farm. Then those goats will make more goats, and those goats will make even more goats, and then we'll be goat illionaires.

[Latif Nasser]

Okay, it didn't happen quite like that, but goats were one of the first domesticated animals. People used them for meat, for milk, for furs. Goats helped keep humans alive in a tough time. Did snakes help with anything?

[Molly Bloom]

I'd offer you humans a hand, but I don't have any.

[Latif Nasser]

In fact, I'd say that in the list of most important human innovations of all time, it goes fire the wheel. And number three, the domesticated goat. But I don't just love goats for what they give. I love them for who they are. Like, have you seen their pupils? That's the black part in the middle of the eye. Ours are circles, so we mostly focus on what's right in front of us. Goats have rectangular pupils. This lets them see really far around them in both directions. Plus, I love how goats take on different roles in the herd. There's the top buck. He's the one who keeps the crew safe from predators, like mountain lions.

[Leslie the Boa Constrictor]

Back off, kitty. Or you get the horns.

[Latif Nasser]

And then there's the flock queen. She's responsible for leading the herd to the best feeding grounds.

[Molly Bloom]

The grass is always greener on the other side of the fence, which is why we're gonna hop it. Legs up, goaties.

[Latif Nasser]

And they're not just social with each other. Some scientists think goats can be as loving with us as dogs are. Which you probably already knew if you've ever cuddled to go to the petting zoo. They're friendly, they're fun, they've helped humanity. What's not to love? Come on, join the herd. What's that, Olivia? Hoof. Rodrigo, there's a fresh patch of clover down yonder. What are we waiting for?

[Gary the Goat]

Let's ride.

[Molly Bloom]

Okay, I could definitely go for some goat cuddles right about now. Calista, what stood out to you about Latif's declaration of greatness?

[Calista]

I love that they're so social and that they could be as loving as dogs. And also, the no hands joke was hilarious.

[Molly Bloom]

Yes, it was. Okay, Allie, it is time for your rebuttal. Tell us why goats really get your goat. You've got 30 seconds and your time starts. Now.

[Alie Ward]

I wish I had more time. Listen, first off, goats think they're so cute. Have you ever seen a barnyard animal that is more in love with itself? Everyone wants to start a goat farm, but what they do is that goat farm's incredibly smelly. Do you know that goats make much more methane than, say, boa constrictors do? And if you have a goat farm, you're gonna need pretty high fences. Cause they can jump all of them. Also, I don't want to have to wear prosthetic hooves in order to go on a hike with my friend who is a goat. I don't need that mistake.

[Molly Bloom]

Yeah. Takes time.

[Latif Nasser]

I'd like to pose a simple question. Everybody listening? Ali, Calista, who would you rather be trapped in a room with a goat or a snake? Sure, maybe goats think they're the goat because they are the goat. But snakes? I mean, come on, they're not even hugging you. They're just trying to steal your heat and strangle you to death. I don't know. To me, the choice is clear.

[Molly Bloom]

Right. We have a lot to think about. And here is some more. Ellie, it is your turn. Tell us why boa constrictors are joy inflictors.

[Alfalfa the Goat]

Welcome to the World Wrestling Snake Entertainment. Tonight's matchup is a real sizzler for you animal fans. In one corner, we've got the boa. You want a Noah? It's the boa constrictor. And in the other, we have a goat. First, let's say hello to our wrestlers. Leslie, the boa constrictor is a whopping 13ft long. That's longer than a moose. She Also enjoys long slithers in the moonlight, and she's logged over a hundred hours in Minecraft. And over here, we have Gary the goat. Gary screams like a human child, is prone to fainting, and never calls his mom. Because apparently goats don't appreciate their moms. Now let's get this sneaky smackdown started. And Leslie is starting strong by wrapping her powerful body around Gary the goat and absolutely squeezing. Folks, a boa constrictor is capable of exerting up to 25 pounds of pressure per square inch. That's like having a bunch of bowling balls pressing down on you. Our goat friend is in a real bind. What's this? Is. Is Gary reaching for a towel? No, he's waving a flag that says, I don't appreciate my mom. Who is that even for?

[Alie Ward]

Jeez, that goat has its priorities all out of whack. I would put my money on Leslie winning the match. Since bow constrictors are super powerful, stealthy, and cunning, the way they hunt their prey is so sly. These nighttime hunters use beautiful patterns on their scales to blend into brush so they can wait in utter silence until their prey finds them.

[Alfalfa the Goat]

Folks, it appears that Leslie the boa constrictor has straight up vanished. Our GO competitor is looking very confused. And oh, my goodness, Leslie's back. She was blending in with the ropes of the rig this whole time.

[Latif Nasser]

Ha.

[Alie Ward]

Yeah, that sounds about right. Thanks to the boas masterful swimming and climbing abilities, there's almost nowhere prey can go to avoid them. Even if a victim is out of sight, boas can still find them by sensing their body heat. And their hunting doesn't just benefit the boa, it can help us too. For example, boas can help control certain pest populations. Like a rat infestation. Can you imagine what life would be like without them?

[Anderson Cooper]

Hey there, neighbor.

[Molly Bloom]

Just wanted to stop by and say hi.

[Alie Ward]

Oh, wow.

[Latif Nasser]

Oh, wait. Are you a.

[Anderson Cooper]

A giant rat?

[Molly Bloom]

Yes, I am. Just wanted to let you know that me and my dozen kids just moved.

[Latif Nasser]

Into the dumpster across the street.

[Molly Bloom]

Oh, and heads up.

[Latif Nasser]

We're covered in fleas. Wow, that's so interesting. One sec. Hello, operator. Connect me to World Wrestling Snake Entertainment.

[Molly Bloom]

Specifically, Leslie.

[Latif Nasser]

See?

[Alie Ward]

Everyone wants a boa around. Even if you don't have flea ridden varmints to handle, Boas are great to have as pets. They're hypoallergenic, so there won't be any fur or dander to clean up. Plus, boas only eat every couple of weeks and can live for up to 40 years. That means you can grow up with these incredible animals. And fun fact, Leslie and I went to high school together. Right, girl?

[Gary the Goat]

You know it, Besty.

[Alie Ward]

And because these radical reptiles are on the quiet side, they'll never annoy you. Unlike some animals I know. Don't even fret about your boa buddy trying to eat you. It would never. It's physically impossible for a boa to fit a human in its mouth. So unless you're wrestling one, you're probably okay. Oh, that reminds me.

[Alfalfa the Goat]

And she's done it. Ladies and gentlemen, Leslie the boa constrictor is the winner of tonight's wrestling match. Gary has tapped out. And in a show of concession, he's calling his mother. All hail the Snake queen.

[Alie Ward]

Boa constrictors. They're super hunters that make great pets, take care of pests, and are simply the best.

[Molly Bloom]

Leslie. Leslie. Leslie. Oh, I was ringside for that. That was very, very exciting. Okay, Calista, what stood out to you about Allie's argument?

[Calista]

I love free pest control. And it's very sad that goats don't care about their moms.

[Latif Nasser]

That is spurious.

[Molly Bloom]

Okay, Latif, it is time for your rebuttal. Tell us why boas are Noahs. You've got 30 seconds and your time starts now.

[Latif Nasser]

Okay, there were two arguments in there, basically. One is that they're good killing machines, and one is that they're good pets. Sure, they're good killing machines. Fine. You want me to say that? I said it. But I'm someone who roots for the underdog, not the assassin. Okay, they are also not good pets. People abandon their boa pets all the time. They get bored of them because they're not that smart, they're not that affectionate, they're not that expressive. It's not a competition here. I think goats. Clearly, they're the ones you want to root for.

[Alie Ward]

Not expressive. This is someone who has never been hugged by a boa constrictor. And I understand why, to be honest, because they are heat seeking. And that's a cold heart over there if I've ever heard one. That's colder than a boa.

[Molly Bloom]

All right, Calista, it is time to award some points. Please give one point to the declaration of greatness that you liked best and one point to the rebuttal that won you over. You get to decide what makes a winning argument. Did one team's jokes make you giggle? Was another team's logic impeccable? Award your points, but don't tell us who they're going to. Have you made your decision? I have Wonderful. Allie and Latif, how are you two feeling so far?

[Latif Nasser]

Feeling great. Feeling a little cold, I guess over here, but otherwise great.

[Alie Ward]

I'm enraged, incensed. I'm furious. This is a. This is an interesting.

[Latif Nasser]

You know what could cheer you up? A goat. A goat could really cheer you up.

[Molly Bloom]

Okay, it is time for a quick break. Hop on a rock and coil around.

[Calista]

A branch and we'll be right back with more smashboom.

[Alie Ward]

Best. You're watching State of Debate. Home to rage and rhetoric and awe inspiring argumentation.

[Anderson Cooper]

Hello, debate friends. Taylor Lincoln here. And it's a bird. No, it's a plane. No, it's a dapper debater with a tweet suit and a winning smile. Tod Douglas.

[Leslie the Boa Constrictor]

Guilty on all accounts. And speaking of guilty, we caught someone guilty of doing a debate. Crime making a logical fallacy.

[Anderson Cooper]

These are arguments with criminally bad logic that weaken the point you're trying to make.

[Leslie the Boa Constrictor]

In this case, it's the straw man fallacy. That's when you create a weak or distorted version of your opponent's point and then attack that instead.

[Alie Ward]

Oof.

[Anderson Cooper]

It should be illegal. Just listen.

[Latif Nasser]

And if I'm elected mayor, I'll spend even more money on schools instead of spending half the city's budget on my own birthday party like our current mayor does.

[Molly Bloom]

Whoa.

[Alie Ward]

You're against birthday parties?

[Molly Bloom]

How can you be against birthday parties?

[Latif Nasser]

That's not what I said.

[Molly Bloom]

What's next? Outlawing cake or clowns or fun?

[Latif Nasser]

No, I just think the budget should.

[Alfalfa the Goat]

Be used for schools, not parties.

[Molly Bloom]

Re elect me and I'll never ban parties. In fact, I'll use the budget to throw myself an even bigger party next year.

[Latif Nasser]

Wow.

[Leslie the Boa Constrictor]

What a whopper of a straw man right there.

[Anderson Cooper]

Yeah. Point was about how the city spends its money, not about banning birthday parties.

[Leslie the Boa Constrictor]

You know what's always a party?

[Anderson Cooper]

Talking smack about logical fallacies with your bestie.

[Leslie the Boa Constrictor]

You know it. Let's do it again soon on State of Debate.

[Molly Bloom]

Brains on Universe is a family of podcasts for kids and their adults. Since you're a fan of Smash Boom Best, you'll love the other shows in our universe. Come on, let's explore. It's.

[Anderson Cooper]

It's Alien exercise hour. Hi Yah hoo ha. While I stretch my snoodles and bounce on my trampolini, I'll listen to a new podcast I'm going to try Forever Ago, the best history podcast ever.

[Molly Bloom]

To understand why anyone would think a TV show could change the world, we need to go way back to America in the 1960s.

[Calista]

Rock and roll was pretty new.

[Molly Bloom]

Ford released the iconic Mustang muscle.

[Anderson Cooper]

Come back here Podcast Must listen to Forever Gold.

[Alie Ward]

Now.

[Molly Bloom]

Listen to Forever Ago. Wherever you get your podcasts, Smash.

[Alie Ward]

Boom. Best.

[Molly Bloom]

You're listening to smashboom. Best. I'm your host, Molly Bloom.

[Calista]

And I'm your judge, Calista.

[Molly Bloom]

And we love getting debate suggestions from our listeners. Take a listen to this homey debate idea from June.

[Calista]

Hi, my name is June.

[Molly Bloom]

I live in Minnesota.

[Calista]

My debate idea is dollhouses versus Big regular house. There's no place like home.

[Molly Bloom]

We'll check back in at the end of this episode to see which side June thinks should win.

[Calista]

And now it's back to our debate. Goats versus Boa Constrictors.

[Molly Bloom]

That's right. And it's time for round two, the.

[Alie Ward]

Micro round.

[Molly Bloom]

For the Micro round challenge, each team has prepared a creative response to a prompt they received in advance. For Latif and Ally, the prompt was Letter to the Editor. We asked the debaters to write a letter to the editor of a publication of their choosing complaining about something inspired by either side. Latiff went first last time. So Ali, you're up. Give us your boa constrictor inspired letter to the Editor.

[Alie Ward]

Dear Vogue Editor in Chief, I'm writing to express extreme disappointment and frustration at your recent fashion spread featuring feather boas. This fluffy tuft of neck decor is far too festive for casual wear. What an insult to boa constrictors everywhere. To see humans flaunting their feather boas at raucous celebrations, flipping these ostentatious accessories hither and thither. Meanwhile, us boa constrictors are once again seen simply as a neck choking threat or a trivial fashion accessory. And as an ectotherm, you might call us cold blooded, but I'd argue that your blood runs colder to use such loaded terms for our maligned species. I pity your warm blooded need to cozy your own necks at the expense of our reputation. Instead of relying on this outdated and frankly shameful feather boa term, may I offer, in light of your lack of imagination, such snakeless phrases such as plumage, scarf or bird stoles? Perhaps the common fluff sash gets the job done. And as you scratch your hairy human heads wondering how I'm even penning this letter, as all 3,500 snake species lack limbs, well, I once again urge you to use some imagination. And remember that boa constrictors are known to flourish despite heavy constraints, especially under high pressure and tight, tight deadlines. Hot under the collar. Be constrictor.

[Molly Bloom]

Wow. An Amazing vocabulary and a passion for fashion from that boa constrictor. Okay, Latif, it is your turn. Let's hear your goat inspired letter to the editor.

[Gary the Goat]

Dear Editor in General, when others say mean things about me, I usually just ignore it. Especially when it happens in a publication as shady as the scaly Daily News. But this time, I just couldn't bear it. Not by the hairs on my chinny chin chin. The article, written by well known snake reporter Anderson Cooper, claims that a goat who looks a lot like me went out of their way to recklessly headbutt a local child. Anyone who's ever met a goat knows we'd never do such a thing. Here's what really happened happened. I work at a petting zoo. I spend my whole day hanging out with humans who want to hang out with me. As for the headbutt, it's a bit embarrassing, but I fell asleep. I have a medical condition that causes me to faint if I get too excited. And this child and I were having so much fun, I fainted on top of her. But don't worry, I'm just a tiny goat. She didn't get hurt at all. She even helped nurse me back awake. Listen, I get why snakes who kill tens of thousands of people every year would want to make us goats who kill on average 0 people every year, look bad to feel better about their snake selves. We goats are used to taking the fall for all kinds of things. Getting the blame for stuff we didn't even do. That's why they call it scapegoating. But please, next time snakes, stop twisting the facts. Sincerely, Alfalfa the goat at the Happy Horns and Hoofs Petting Zoo.

[Latif Nasser]

Hmph.

[Molly Bloom]

The greatest of all time. Setting the record straight. Calista, what did you like about Latif and Ally's micro rounds?

[Calista]

They were both very, very funny. I love plumage scarfs. That's. That's great.

[Molly Bloom]

Calista, it is time to award a point. But don't tell us who it's going to. Have you made your decision?

[Calista]

Yes, I have.

[Molly Bloom]

Fantastic. Then it's time for our third round. The Super Stealthy Sneak Attack. This is our improvised round where debaters have to respond to a challenge on the spot. Today's sneak attack is called Haiku for you. Your challenge is to write one haiku about how great your side is and another one about how terrible the other side is. Debaters, are you ready for your sneak attack?

[Latif Nasser]

Yes.

[Alie Ward]

Oh, yeah.

[Molly Bloom]

We'll start with Latif. Let's hear one haiku about the glory of the goat. And one about those bad, bad boas.

[Latif Nasser]

Goats have such soft wool. They made your favorite sweater, like, the warmest hug.

[Molly Bloom]

So nice.

[Latif Nasser]

Boas, pretend hug. Really? They smother and kill. Also botulism.

[Alie Ward]

Wow. Slander. First off, slander. So you will be hearing from our lawyers, the cdc.

[Latif Nasser]

I looked it up. They have warnings for snake owners, and one of the. One of the problems is botulism. That one of the diseases they give to their owners.

[Alie Ward]

One of one. I'm very.

[Latif Nasser]

One of many. You're right. You're right. Many, many. You're so right. You're so right about that.

[Alie Ward]

Who's a hand sanitizer?

[Latif Nasser]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Alie Ward]

You think goats don't have germs?

[Latif Nasser]

Yeah. But snakes apparently are in the highest risk category, and goats are not.

[Alie Ward]

Do you know what goats do for fun? They literally go pee pee on each other for fun.

[Latif Nasser]

You know what? I'm not here to judge anybody for what they have do for fun.

[Alie Ward]

They have talons growing out of their head and they still can't kill anything.

[Latif Nasser]

Yeah. Cause they don't want to. Why are we putting such a premium on wanting to kill other living things here?

[Alie Ward]

If they could eat a living thing, you know they would. They eat tin cans.

[Latif Nasser]

Yeah, because they're like cyclers. They like to make the best. That's like a good thing.

[Molly Bloom]

Okay, Ally, let's hear your haikus. We'll start with the beauty of the boa. And then one about those grungy goats.

[Alie Ward]

Well, first off, I just want to say I think it's very, very underhanded. Even though my team doesn't even have hands. I think it's very underhanded of Latif to exploit our hug ability and my haiku in favor of the boas. Smooth, stealthy slithers eating up rats like candy. Boas hug our hearts. And while that is true sometimes, actually, because that is how they kill their prey, they do hug our hearts from a metaphorical standpoint.

[Molly Bloom]

So many meanings.

[Alie Ward]

So many meanings. So much depth in a snake.

[Molly Bloom]

Okay, let's hear your haiku against goats.

[Alie Ward]

Screaming, stinky goats, we're over your prestige. Goats, let ye be gone. Oh, it was kind of threatening.

[Molly Bloom]

All right, Calista, it is time to award some points for the sneak attack. Think about which side impressed you the most and award your fourth point. Have you made your decision?

[Calista]

Yes, I have.

[Molly Bloom]

Perfect. Then it's time for our final round.

[Alie Ward]

The final six.

[Molly Bloom]

In this round, each team will have just six words to sum up the glory of their side. Okay, Allie, let's hear your six words for your boa besties.

[Alie Ward]

Boas don't even need legs, so.

[Molly Bloom]

I enjoyed that very much. All right, Latif, it is your turn. Give us your six words about the.

[Latif Nasser]

Goodness of goats, greatest of all time, plus cheese. Oh.

[Molly Bloom]

We are finishing strong today, everybody. This is a tough decision, Kalista, but it is time to award a final point for the final six. Have you made your decision?

[Calista]

I have awarded my point.

[Molly Bloom]

Wonderful. All right, tally up those points. Drumroll, please. And the winner is.

[Calista]

Boa Constrictors.

[Alie Ward]

Rightfully so. Calista, I knew you had it in you. Game recognized game is what that is. You know, predators get it.

[Molly Bloom]

Did it come down to the final six?

[Calista]

Yes.

[Molly Bloom]

Oh, my gosh. As close as close can be.

[Alie Ward]

Latif is a genius, and being paired with him is one of the crueler things that you all have done with me, because he is the goat. And someone who can come up with a haiku that involves botulism off the dome is not to be messed with. So I'm lucky that I had such a fierce animal to defend, because Ladif, his brain is a fierce animal. He's got a snake in there. And I mean that as a compliment.

[Latif Nasser]

Allie is like a lion in our field, and I'm so excited to be able to sit next to her and do this and watch her work. The thing I was, like, particularly astonished by was this creature. Bee constrictor. I imagined it's like B, E, A. It was like the name, like Bea Arthur or something. But that was so fashion forward, but also eloquent about how much she cared about fashion terminology. And that's just not where I thought that that was ever gonna go. It was so great and imaginative and delightful, and I loved it.

[Molly Bloom]

Well, that is it for today's debate battle. Calista crowned boa constrictors the Smashboom Best. But what about you?

[Calista]

Head to smashboom.org and vote to tell us who you think won.

[Molly Bloom]

Smashboom Best is brought to you by Brainzon and APM Studios. It's produced by me, Molly Bloom, Anna Weigel, and Aron Wolda Selassie. We had engineering help from Gene Barron, Daniel McDonald and Evelyn Bocanegra, with sound design by Anna Wegel. Our editors are Shayla Farzan and Sandon Totten, with fact checking by Rosie dupont and Rebecca Rand. And we had production help from the rest of the Brains on Universe team. Rachel Breese, Anna Goldfield, Nico Gonzalez Whistler, Ruby Guthrie, Lauren Humpert, Joshua Ray, Mark Sanchez, and Charlotte Traver. Our executive producer is Beth Pearlman. And the APM Studios executives in charge are Chandragavatti and Joanne Griffith. Our announcer is Marley Foyer worker Otto. And we want to give special thanks to Austin Cross and Taylor Kaufman. Latif, is there anyone you'd like to give a shout out to today?

[Latif Nasser]

Okay, so I'd like to thank, in addition to the wonderful staff here at this show and the wonderful staff at Radiolab and our kids show Terrestrials, I would like to thank Thomas Thwaites, the man who lived as a goat. For real.

[Molly Bloom]

Awesome. And how about you, Ali? Any special shout outs?

[Alie Ward]

Just want to shout out Latif, my opponent as well as everyone at Ologies and Smallogies, our kid friendly show. And I want to thank everyone out there who has a boa and who believed in boas. Please give them a hug back for me.

[Molly Bloom]

Yes. We are so honored to have both of you here. Your shows are some of our favorites and especially your two for kids, Smallogies and Terrestrials. Go check them out. And how about you, Kalista? Any special thanks or shout outs?

[Calista]

I would like to thank my dad cause he's the one who signed me up for this.

[Anderson Cooper]

Yeah.

[Calista]

And I would like to shout out both of the debaters. You guys both did amazing. Great job.

[Latif Nasser]

Thanks, Elissa.

[Molly Bloom]

Woo hoo. Before we go, let's check check in and see who June thinks should win the Dollhouse versus regular House debate.

[Calista]

I think the big houses will win.

[Molly Bloom]

Because you can live in the home if you're between the ages of 13 and 18 and you'd like to be a judge. Or if you're any age and you have an idea for a knockdown drag out debate, head to smashboom.org contact and drop us a line. And make sure to subscribe to Brains on Universe on YouTube where you can watch animated versions of of some of your favorite episodes. That's it for this season, but we'll be back August 14th with a big season including 16 shiny new episodes. We can't wait. Bye.

[Calista]

Adios.

[Molly Bloom]

Bye.

[Alie Ward]

See you later.

[Molly Bloom]

Oh yeah. The Smashable West. Oh, better than the rest. It's Smashable West. It's Smashable West.

[Alie Ward]

I need a hug. I don't need a pile of Milk Duds on the floor, if you know what I'm saying.

[Latif Nasser]

Right. But just be careful that hug doesn't end up being your last moment on earth.

[Alie Ward]

Never.