Raft of Passion - Snap Classic

Summary

Snap Judgment: “Raft of Passion - Snap Classic” Episode Summary

Podcast Information:

• Title: Snap Judgment
• Host/Producer: Snap Judgment and PRX
• Episode: Raft of Passion - Snap Classic
• Release Date: July 31, 2025
• Description: Snap Judgment blends real-life stories with dynamic beats to create cinematic radio experiences. This episode, “Raft of Passion,” delves into an extraordinary social experiment that tests human relationships under extreme conditions.

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1. Introduction to the Vintage Spirit

The episode opens with host Glenn Washington invoking the nostalgic essence of the 1960s, a time marked by cultural upheaval, countercultural movements, and a collective yearning for change. Washington reflects on the era's iconic figures and events, setting the stage for a story that embodies the spirit of adventure and revolution.

Notable Quote:

“I never lived it, but it seems like they had a spark, a fire, a hope that things could be different than what they are.” — Glenn Washington [02:50]

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2. Mary Gidling’s Journey Begins

Mary Gidling introduces herself as the central figure of this narrative. A 35-year-old waitress grappling with a tumultuous marriage to Cass, a seasoned fisherman. Their relationship, strained by age difference and diverging life aspirations, reaches a breaking point when Mary decides to seek a divorce.

Background:

• Marriage: Met Cass at 22; he was 48. Together for over a decade, sailing the West Coast.
• Issues: Mary's desire for independence clashes with Cass’s traditional lifestyle.

Notable Quote:

“I was no longer happy just following his ideas or his plans. I really wanted to be doing my own thing.” — Mary Gidling [05:02]

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3. The Catalyst: An Unexpected Invitation

In the midst of her personal crisis, Mary encounters Dr. Santiago Genovese, an anthropologist conducting a radical social experiment. Santiago proposes an audacious plan: an eleven-person group from diverse backgrounds will live together on a specially designed raft, the Acali, and drift across the Atlantic to study human behavior under sustained close quarters.

Details of the Experiment:

• Objective: To observe conflict, cooperation, and relationship dynamics among participants from different cultures.
• The Raft: Contrary to a typical raft, the Acali is engineered for stability with large steel pontoons, inspired by literary works like "Huckleberry Finn."

Notable Quote:

“He wanted to see what kind of conflict that would bring about, whether somebody would become violent.” — Narrator [12:20]

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4. Setting Sail: Life on the Acali

Mary joins the raft expedition, embarking on what she hopes will be a transformative adventure. The raft, colorful and artistically adorned, becomes both a physical and psychological microcosm for studying human interactions.

Participants:

• Santiago Genovese: The charismatic and controlling leader.
• Maria: The Swedish captain, embodying calm and authority.
• Other Members: Diverse individuals including men and women from various nationalities.

Daily Life:

• Activities: Navigation tasks, sharing meals, limited entertainment (primarily reading Santiago’s writings).
• Relationships: Initial camaraderie and budding romances, particularly between Mary and Santiago.

Notable Quote:

“I sort of admired that in him.” — Mary Gidling [18:50]

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5. Rising Tensions and The Raft’s Dynamics

As days turn into weeks, underlying tensions surface. Santiago’s authoritative approach begins to clash with the participants’ desires for autonomy. Despite initial harmony, Santiago’s manipulative tactics aim to stimulate conflict to achieve meaningful data for his experiment.

Key Developments:

• Control: Santiago imposes stricter rules and monitoring, including daily surveys and drawing exercises to gauge participants' psychological states.
• Relationships: Mary develops a complex relationship with Santiago, oscillating between admiration and fear, reminiscent of her toxic marriage.

Notable Quote:

“He was more manipulative. What bothered me about Santiago was that I was always having hopes that he was going to be really a principled guy.” — Mary Gidling [27:22]

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6. The Breaking Point: Near Disaster and Mutiny

The raft's journey takes a perilous turn when a massive freighter threatens their safety. Santiago’s inability to navigate the impending collision showcases his poor leadership and heightens the group's crisis.

Critical Incident:

• Freighter Collision: Santiago fails to spot the freighter in time, leading to a life-threatening situation.
• Mutiny: Faced with the imminent danger, Santiago attempts to assert absolute control, but the group's trust in his leadership disintegrates.

Notable Quote:

“It just veered slowly away. It just veered slowly away. I remember Santiago, he had this megaphone thing, like a cheerleader.” — Mary Gidling [31:27]

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7. Rescue and Reflection

After enduring 101 days at sea, the raft finally arrives near Mexico. The participants are greeted by rescuers and emergency crews, marking the end of the intense social experiment.

Post-Journey Reflections:

• Mary’s Realization: The experience mirrors her previous abusive relationship with Cass, highlighting patterns in her personal life.
• Human Condition: Mary contemplates the inescapable facets of her identity and behavior, recognizing the experiment as a reflection of broader human tendencies.

Notable Quote:

“You can't really escape from your own life. You can't escape from who you are.” — Mary Gidling [34:27]

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8. Aftermath and Continuing Impact

The episode concludes with Mary reflecting on her raft experience, now documented in her memoir titled “Point to Point.” Her journey on the Acali becomes a defining moment in her quest for independence and self-awareness.

Additional Insights:

• Memoir: Mary’s book offers a deeper exploration of her raft experience and its influence on her subsequent life choices.
• Documentary: A related documentary, “The Raft,” provides a visual recounting of the experiment, featuring interviews and reenactments.

Notable Quote:

“I will never forget the low tide. The black mud. Crawled ashore in the mud.” — Mary Gidling [08:00]

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9. Special Segment: Love Me Podcast Feature

In addition to Mary’s riveting story, the episode features a segment from the Love Me podcast, sharing an unconventional love story between Santiago Genovese and Linda, a woman battling a unique fungal infection.

Story Highlights:

• Linda’s Struggle: After being injured in the 2004 Thailand tsunami, Linda contracts a persistent fungus named Loretta, living within her knee.
• Relationship Dynamics: Santiago and Linda navigate their intimate relationship while managing the complexities of the fungal condition.
• Unique Challenges: The story intertwines themes of love, resilience, and the literal embodiment of challenges within a relationship.

Notable Quotes:

“Loretta isn’t home. She has to study.” — Linda [43:36]

“Loretta found a home in Linda's knee.” — Santiago Genovese [44:51]

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10. Conclusion: Embracing Human Complexity

“Raft of Passion - Snap Classic” encapsulates the intricate dance of human relationships under duress. Through Mary Gidling’s transformative journey and the intertwined stories of love and struggle, the episode invites listeners to ponder the depths of human resilience, vulnerability, and the unending quest for self-understanding.

Final Thoughts:

• The episode emphasizes the universality of human experiences, from turbulent relationships to overcoming personal adversities.
• It underscores the impact of structured social experiments in revealing innate human behaviors and emotional responses.

Closing Quote:

“Way is the dictator.” — Mary Gidling [29:54]

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Additional Resources:

• Mary Gidling’s Memoir: Point to Point
• Documentary: The Raft
• Love Me Podcast: Discover more unique love stories and human experiences.

Listen to the Episode: To experience the full depth and nuance of these compelling narratives, tune into “Raft of Passion - Snap Classic” on Snap Judgment.

Transcript

[Glenn Washington]

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[Mary Gidling]

So one night. Do you want me to tell that one night or even more?

[Narrator]

Is it hard for you to talk about at all?

[Mary Gidling]

Well, a little bit, but not, you.

[Narrator]

Know, the night her marriage came to an end, Mary was aboard her sailboat, the Yohoho.

[Mary Gidling]

So anyway, I'm anchored out on the boat by myself and this friend of mine, she got somebody to row her out to the boat. We sat and had some coffee and then we talked about things. She talked about her marriage and then I was telling her about my marriage and that I was thinking I needed to get a divorce.

[Narrator]

Her husband Cass, a fisherman, was watching their three kids that night. They'd met at a bar when she was 22 and he was 48. And for over a decade they'd sailed together from port to port up and down the West Coast.

[Mary Gidling]

I got caught up in him and I got caught up in his life. I liked the life of a fisherman. I liked. I didn't want a 9 to 5 job ever in my life. Never. He was like, so free and so outspoken and so charismatic. So I was to the point where I would follow him almost anywhere.

[Narrator]

But this was the problem.

[Mary Gidling]

I was no longer happy just following his ideas or his plans. I think I could not get something going for myself. I really wanted to be doing my own thing.

[Narrator]

Mary had been having an affair. And she told her friend that night on the Yoho ho.

[Mary Gidling]

There was another man in my life. And I thought there was another woman in his life. We were talking, just, you know, letting it all out. And all of a sudden I hear footsteps on the side of the Yohoho. And it was Cass. Right away I was thinking, how long has he been on deck? How much has he heard?

[Narrator]

Cass took Mary's friend ashore while Mary waited below deck until she heard his footsteps again.

[Mary Gidling]

I was thinking, I really might need some protection. I wish I wasn't on the boat out here in the middle of the bay. He came back to the boat and right away he was like, overheard everything that we had talked about. He heard that there was this other man in my life. And he was like, I want to know who that person is. I want to kill him. Then he started pouring himself some scotch, which is his favorite drink. And he's like drinking scotch.

[Narrator]

It wasn't the first time he'd hurt her. But that night it felt different.

[Mary Gidling]

He got so that he was like grabbing me and he started grabbing me around the throat and he started strangling me. And I thought, you know, he's gonna kill me. I had a feeling this is it. When he poured himself some water drink. I managed to get up and there was a table in the middle of the Yohoho. It was like a drop leaf table. So I started around the table, but then he started around to get me and so we went around the table like, two or three times. He couldn't quite get me. And then I ran up the companionway up to the deck of the boat. And I jumped in that skiff that he'd come out in. I was trying to untie the lines to get the skiff loose so I could row ashore. He came up, and at this point, he was, like, really weaving. He was totally, totally drunk. He kind of fell into the skiff with me. And I just happened to have on this huge Indian sweater. And he grabbed the arm of the sweater. And I managed to pull my arm free out of the sweater. And then I got up on the boat again. And then I just, like, ran right to the bow of the boat. And I leaped off the boat. I am a good swimmer, and it's a good thing I was. Because when you got your clothes and your shoes on, it's not that easy. And it happened to be very low tide. I will never forget the low tide. The black mud. Crawled ashore in the mud. And they got up on there, and I just feel thin, full of mud. That was the point where I filed for divorce. It took that much, you know, before I really made a move. But I was, like, just glad to be alive at that point, you know, I survived. I survived it.

[Narrator]

Mary made her way to a 7:11. And called her sister to come pick her up. The next day, she was back at work.

[Mary Gidling]

I was working at Howard Johnson's as a waitress. The home of good, good food is Howard Johnson's. The manager decided that I would just fold napkins. Because there was no shape to do anything else.

[Narrator]

Howard Johnson's is such a friendly place.

[Mary Gidling]

To have good food. Cass came into this banquet room where I was folding the napkins. And he accused me of calling the police. Cops. He was so out of it. And I was like, this is bad. I was afraid that he would not let me alone. He could attack me again, you know, he could assault me again. He was dangerous.

[Narrator]

Cass left. Mary kept on working. Later, her manager called her into his office to take a phone call.

[Mary Gidling]

We weren't allowed to have personal telephone calls. So he wasn't happy about me getting a call.

[Narrator]

The man on the other end of the line. Introduced himself as Dr. Santiago Genovese.

[Mary Gidling]

He was an anthropologist, and he had wanted to do this study.

[Narrator]

Mary had no idea what the hell this man was talking about.

[Mary Gidling]

We were going to be at a laboratory, but we were going to be on the water. We were going on a raft.

[Narrator]

Something about crossing the Atlantic Ocean on A raft.

[Mary Gidling]

And he wanted me because I had navigation experience. I was like, no, there's no way. I'm not going to. I can't. I've got three kids. I'm in the middle of a divorce.

[Narrator]

But the next day, Santiago showed up at the restaurant with a briefcase.

[Mary Gidling]

He looked very young, although he was like 48 or 49 at the time. He had a wonderfully handsome face and look about him.

[Narrator]

I keep trying to describe him to people. I'm like, he's kind of like. He's like Antonio Banderas mixed with older Michael Douglas.

[Mary Gidling]

Yeah, I would say a Michael Douglas type. Yeah.

[Narrator]

He demanded that they sit down.

[Mary Gidling]

He was an overwhelming presence in a way. It's like, not like the manager of Howard Johnson's, you know, this was a real man.

[Narrator]

Santiago really was an anthropologist from a university in Mexico, and he was attempting a radical group experiment.

[Mary Gidling]

This was in the 70s, early 70s. It wasn't that strange.

[Glenn Washington]

These are not prisoners, and this is not a prison.

[Mary Gidling]

They are college students. A lot of people were doing, like, psychological experiments and tests.

[Santiago Genovese]

The subject denies the evidence of his own eyes and yields to group influence.

[Narrator]

1, 3. Santiago's experiment required 11 people from all over the world. He wanted to study them as they shared close quarters on a raft drifting across the Atlantic.

[Mary Gidling]

He wanted to see what kind of conflict that would bring about, whether somebody would become violent. How would people of different nationalities and cultures get along together? Because he was interested in peace.

[Narrator]

Then Santiago pulled some blueprints from his.

[Mary Gidling]

Briefcase, and he opened up the plans and showed me the plans of this boat. I was like, well, this is a really stable boat. You know, this is not just a raft. This is a boat, except it's shaped like a raft. It looks like a raft on top, but it had these huge pontoons underneath, steel pontoons that were going to have tons of water in it so that it would give you stability. It won't sail like a boat, but, my God, it's stable. It's not going to sink right away. So it's not a raft. It's like Huck Finn took down the Mississippi River.

[Narrator]

It was still a crazy idea, but also an opportunity for Mary to get away from Cass.

[Mary Gidling]

The timing was pretty perfect. I'll get away. That'll be great. The divorce would happen when we were at sea. I'll wake up one morning, and then I'll be free. Why not? This will be my own adventure. Yeah. Get to fly to Madrid right away. Okay. And then come back on a raft going about two miles an hour. I realized that when we were over the Atlantic Ocean on a plane, I was like, oh my God, what have I done?

[Narrator]

At a dock in the Canary Islands off the coast of Spain, Mary saw the raft for the first time.

[Mary Gidling]

It was absolutely funny. It was hilarious. It was orange, it was purple, it was yellow. You know, it was totally colorful.

[Narrator]

A Mexican artist had painted fish on the cabin in the middle of the deck. Santiago had named the raft the Acali.

[Mary Gidling]

An Akali was an Aztec word for the house on water.

[Narrator]

The Akali was towed out into the current on May 12, 1973.

[Mary Gidling]

They dropped us and there we are, you know, goodbye to the towboat.

[Glenn Washington]

When we return, the Raft of Passion sails the high seas and things start to heat up. Stay tuned. For me, my big mistake was accepting that super high interest rate credit card in college and then buying pizza and beer with it. Turns out that wasn't really free money. And later when I needed a car, needed to rent an apartment, those pizzas came back to haunt me. Don't let pizza haunt you. Now through Chime you can be better about how you manage your credit scores. Build credit history with everyday purchases and regular on time payments. Plus get access to credit tracking tools and personalized tips for a stress free credit experience. Make everyday purchases count with Chime's secured Credit Builder Visa Credit Card get started [e-mail] snap that's chime.com snap Chime feels like progress.

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[Glenn Washington]

Do you remember normal? Because normal keeps changing. Normal skincare 20 years ago was bar soap. Now you've got a five step process. Taxis became rideshares, TV became streaming. But healthcare for healthcare, normal has stayed. In the past. Your normal annual Labs are just 20 basic markers. No hormone tests, no inflammation tests, no metabolic insight. If those limited tests come back in range, you're told that you are fine even when you know you aren't. I need it better and you do too. So I chose function because function is what happens when healthcare catches up. It just took me a couple of short visits to give them what they needed and function helped me. Stop guessing with advanced tests like T3 free, T4 free, and TPO antibodies to find out how well my thyroid is actually working. As for ferritin levels, vitamin D, leptin, insulin. Welcome to the new normal in health. Not the outdated version you grew up with. Your baseline, your body, on your terms. Learn more and join using my link, visit functionhealth.com snap welcome back to Snap Judgment. The Raft of Passion episode. When last we left, the Akali had just set sail on a journey across the Atlantic. Snap Judgment.

[Narrator]

There were six women and five men on the raft, including Santiago. They were young, they were fit, they were foreign. And Mary was about to be single.

[Mary Gidling]

So. Well, I mean, I was 35, you know, so you're still hot blooded.

[Narrator]

At night, she slept inches away from the others in the raft's plywood cabin.

[Mary Gidling]

There was no air in there. It was really cramped.

[Narrator]

During the days, she'd read books that Santiago had written, the only kind of entertainment allowed on the raft, which Mary didn't mind.

[Mary Gidling]

He was charming, he was smart. You know, he had kind of pulled himself up by his bootstraps. I sort of admired that in him.

[Narrator]

When the heat got to her, she'd go for a swim.

[Mary Gidling]

We'd swim off the raft with a rope attached to us. But then we started seeing sharks behind us, so that ended that.

[Narrator]

They lived on powdered mashed potatoes and hot dogs and the flying fish that occasionally landed on deck.

[Mary Gidling]

If you were on watch or you woke up early, you could go around the raft and collect all these flying fish and then you could fry them up.

[Narrator]

Mary hadn't been at sea long when her divorce went through. She'd marked the day on her calendar.

[Mary Gidling]

I knew I was going to be free. And then I was free. Now I could start my life over and do what I want to do. It was kind of like a private moment. I didn't say anything to Santiago. I think I told Maria.

[Narrator]

Maria was the captain of the raft, and she was also a participant in Santiago's experiment. Twice a day, she and Mary measured the angles of the sun and stars to figure out where they were.

[Mary Gidling]

So we had sort of a little bond due to that. We worked together.

[Narrator]

Maria was blonde, Swedish, quiet. She was the first female sea captain Mary had ever met.

[Mary Gidling]

It was like, mind boggling that there was a woman captain. She was really rare.

[Narrator]

The raft's doctor was a woman, too.

[Mary Gidling]

Doctors were always men. There were never women doctors. It took me a while before it sort of like dawned on me that this is possible. Women can be doctors. Why not?

[Narrator]

But this was actually part of the experiment. Santiago had placed women in positions of authority on the raft to create tension with the men. He'd also selected people he considered sexually attractive.

[Mary Gidling]

He didn't tell us that right away. It was only studying human behavior.

[Narrator]

At first, Santiago believed that violence was a result of sexual frustration. So participants were encouraged to form new intimate relationships on the raft.

[Mary Gidling]

I thought it was a great idea because it gives you more freedom. It's just like having another friend, but it just happens to be that probably sex is part of it too.

[Narrator]

The European press gave the experiments a nickname.

[Mary Gidling]

They called us a sex raft or the raft of passion.

[Narrator]

There was plenty of hooking up on the raft. Where would sex even happen on the raft?

[Mary Gidling]

I don't know. We did have, like, a roof on top.

[Narrator]

Every day, Santiago had them fill out surveys with questions like, who would you most like to sleep with on the raft? How many times a week do you masturbate? And then there were the drawings.

[Mary Gidling]

He was just supposed to draw a tree. Depending on how you drew your tree, it showed whether you were becoming more violent or less violent, I guess.

[Narrator]

Like, if this has more branches.

[Mary Gidling]

Yeah, yeah. It means you're more open. And if it's like a fir tree, then you're uptight. You're closed in.

[Narrator]

Mary kept her own observations in her diary.

[Mary Gidling]

Sunday, May 20th. Here we are on the sex raft. Sunbathing on the terrace. Tuesday, May 28. Heavy seas, winds of gale force, but felt very much in tune with it all. Thursday, June 7th. Amazing how the days go by.

[Narrator]

She shared a kiss with a Japanese man named Slk. You kissed Esilki?

[Mary Gidling]

I guess I did. Let me see. Where did I read?

[Narrator]

But she had her eyes on someone else.

[Mary Gidling]

My estimation of Santiago has gone up since yesterday. He's more intelligent and something that I blotted out. I don't know what happened there.

[Narrator]

Is it fair to say that you had a crush on Santiago?

[Mary Gidling]

Oh, definitely. It must have been very gradual, because all I remember is I sort of liked the sight of Santiago on the stern of the raft, you know, sucking in all the good air. I am hopelessly in love with this crazy, crazy man, and I feel his spirit moving me.

[Narrator]

Santiago had already slept with one of the other participants, so why not Mary?

[Mary Gidling]

When we were at sea, you know, he got tanner. His hair grew a little longer. He looked a little more like a hippie. He had a beard, and he had a little gray in the beard. Then I am drinking my coffee and smoking a cigarette when Santiago appeared nude. He'd been taking a bath on the poop deck. I am not embarrassed, really.

[Narrator]

Sometimes Mary and Santiago would share the watch, keeping an eye out for approaching ships. As the sun went down.

[Mary Gidling]

If there's no clouds, it's just like the big orange ball. And it goes down lower and lower. And then the light spreads out, and then it gets a little darker and a little darker until it's totally dark, unless there's a moon.

[Narrator]

Sitting at the stern in the moonlight, they would talk. Once, Santiago gave her a kiss on the cheek.

[Mary Gidling]

You know, he was interested in my life, where I grew up and how I grew up, and that I was sort of an adventurer like he was. I felt like I could say what I wanted to say with Santiago, because that was part of his whole project, was to be able to be honest about your feelings. So I tried to be honest.

[Narrator]

One day, Santiago asked them to write an essay about someone else on the raft. And Mary chose him.

[Mary Gidling]

It was like how I wanted to be shipwrecked on an island with Santiago by myself. All the things that we would do together, how the rest of the world wouldn't matter anymore, how wonderful the sex would be. Well, I was a little embarrassed afterwards. You know, it's kind of like when you say something, you want to take it back, but if you've written it down, you don't have any choice.

[Narrator]

Later, Santiago came to speak with Mary alone.

[Mary Gidling]

And he sort of thanked me. He was very grateful. He was a little surprised. But he also was like. He liked the fact that I liked him. You know, he didn't know quite how to treat me, and I didn't quite know how to treat him.

[Narrator]

As the days went on, Mary and her raft mates grew more and more comfortable.

[Mary Gidling]

You got so if somebody was sitting next to you and you were outside, you didn't have to talk to them. People left you alone. It didn't feel like you had to talk or socialize with everybody all the time.

[Narrator]

This was not good for the experiment. Santiago wanted to study conflict. Everybody was getting along.

[Mary Gidling]

One of the things he always kept saying was, you're all in your own little shoes. Meaning that we weren't establishing these relationships that he thought we should be establishing. I know he was under a lot of stress. He had to give these reports back, you know, to Mexico City or whatever, about what was going on on the raft. And he didn't really have a lot to report. He wanted something to happen.

[Narrator]

So he decided to make something happen. He began to single out participants and berate them. Mary wrote in her diary.

[Mary Gidling]

One day, Santiago threw a bucket of water, cold salt water in my face, and it ran down my collar.

[Narrator]

Once he slapped her in the face.

[Mary Gidling]

Santiago likes me. Of this I am deeply relieved and grateful for. Despite the fact that Santiago is vain, moody, abusive, demanding, and slightly insane.

[Narrator]

Mary's relationship with Santiago was starting to feel a lot like her relationship with Cass, her ex husband.

[Mary Gidling]

When I first met Santiago, I was like, oh, this is a really charismatic guy. Again, oh, my God. I didn't think of it in terms of, oh, this is the same kind of guy. He had a confidence, he was strong. You know, he had very strong ideas. But Santiago was more, I would say, more manipulative. What bothered me about Santiago was that I was always having hopes that he was going to be really a principled guy. Not to totally beat myself up, but in a way, I'm like, wow, you know, like, there you did it again. You just went along with somebody, you know, you didn't say no. You know, I could have said no.

[Narrator]

The raft, bobbing in the current, arrived in the Caribbean in late August. Mary knew it was hurricane season. She wrote in her diary, I would.

[Mary Gidling]

Hate to go down with a ship, unless it was a beautiful, meaningful death in Santiago's arms. Don't like crawling. This is, you know, this comes out of your fantasies, right?

[Narrator]

The weather was picking up, and Maria, the Swedish captain, didn't think it was safe to go on. So Santiago staged a mutiny on his own raft.

[Mary Gidling]

He announced that he was now the captain, that we would take, supposedly take orders from him and not Maria. To him, we were his children. You know, he liked total control over everybody. Santiago was just a dictator.

[Narrator]

A couple nights later, Mary was having trouble sleeping.

[Mary Gidling]

You know, it's hot because we're in the Caribbean, so we're just sort of tossing and turning. Anyway, somebody comes in and shakes Maria and tells her to wake up.

[Narrator]

Something was happening on deck.

[Mary Gidling]

Maria was like, kind of half awake. And then we were. Went out onto the deck, climbed over everybody.

[Narrator]

It wasn't a hurricane. It was a massive freighter, and they were right in its path. Santiago, who was on watch, hadn't spotted it in time.

[Mary Gidling]

The lights would have shown you that they were coming right for us. He didn't identify that soon enough. And it was dawn. So by the time he did, that ship was really close to us. It's not like they're going to get out of our way. We have to, but we can't get out of their way. We're too slow moving.

[Narrator]

Maria shouted at Mary, get The emergency flares.

[Mary Gidling]

I was like thinking, oh, my God, I hope we haven't used all the matches for our cigarettes. Shot up some flares. No response from the ship. It's still coming straight at us. Shooting up the flares on the radio. No response. This can't be happening to us. It's getting bigger and bigger, right? And closer to closer, and there's nothing we can do. We're totally, totally helpless.

[Narrator]

They were about to be crushed or worse.

[Mary Gidling]

If we were close, we would have been sucked up by their wake and gone down. We would have been underneath that boat and we would have all drowned. There's no way, probably about the last batch of flares, two or three flares. That ship just slowly moved enough so it just barely went by us. It just veered slowly away. I remember Santiago, he had this, like, megaphone thing, you know, like a cheerleader or whatever. And he yelled at. He goes, why don't you watch where you're going? Screamed at them. And, you know, I mean, it was really ridiculous. Everything fell apart. As far as any feelings that I had for him, it all fell apart.

[Narrator]

After 101 days, the raft finally floated its way to Mexico.

[Mary Gidling]

The first thing usually you see, you see birds. You don't. You haven't seen land yet, but, you know, land is fairly close. It comes on gradually, like it'll be like a shadow in the distance, and then it gets more and more defined, and then all of a sudden, you know, it's land. Oh, my God, I can't believe it. You know, it's kind of like you cut off your ties to land, and then when you see it again, it's like, oh, my gosh, this is scary. I'm gonna have to get back in there, you know, and start functioning like a normal person with a normal life. So many boats came to meet us, and we had so many people on the shore. Santiago had pulled out a nice white, sparkling clean pair of white shorts that he put on. Bikini type men, men, bikini type, you know. And he looks. He's like preened like a, you know, like a little rooster. He's got his white trunks. And the rest of us are like, you know, we just look really, really rough somehow. This seems to be the way my life goes. It's kind of like fate that I'm out here again with this guy, this kind of guy. I sort of like, got a little bit like, when are you ever going to learn?

[Narrator]

I think you're being a bit hard on yourself, you know?

[Mary Gidling]

I am, yeah.

[Narrator]

Because I mean, what you're. I mean, what you're describing seems to me to be just part of the human condition. Like you. You can't really escape from your own life. You can't escape from who you are. Does that feel true to you?

[Mary Gidling]

Yeah. But I think some people change, you know, if you're aware of your weaknesses, you could try to avoid that weakness later on, you know, try to compensate for it some other way. I'm stubborn. I mean, I'm open to other ideas, but I always feel like I know best. I want to be the dictator of my own life. Maybe Santiago is the same way. Way.

[Glenn Washington]

Thank you, Mary Gidling for sharing her story at the snap. Now, Mary just released a memoir. It's titled Point to Point. She still loves being on the water and Mary is still single.

[Mary Gidling]

There's no dog and there's no man. Sorry.

[Glenn Washington]

You can learn more Both the Akali experiment and the incredible documentary, it's called the Raft. You can see a completely different side of the story that you just heard here from Mary and other participants as they relive this experiment on a life size recreation of the Raft. We highly recommend it.

[Mary Gidling]

Highly how often do you masturbate? I don't count. With whom have you had sexual contact?

[Linda]

Many.

[Mary Gidling]

Many. Everybody.

[Glenn Washington]

The Raft that opened in theaters in the US Last year and starts streaming in the US In May on digital platforms everywhere. Special thanks to the director Marcus Lindeen. The original score for that story was by Leon Morimoto. It was produced by John Facilitator. When we return, find out what happens when a man falls in love with a woman and her fungus. Stay tuned. Welcome back to Snap Judgment, the Wrath of Passion episode. My name is Tim Washington and snap, and today we have a special treat for you. See one of our friends over at the podcast Love Me. When they share stories, we listen. And yes, they make stories about love, as you may have guessed. But generally they don't bother with the boy meets girl thing. No, no. Their love stories come from a completely different place. Like our next piece, it's about a man, a woman and a spore. Snap Judgment. This story does deal with some adult situation situations. As such, listener discretion is advised.

[Linda]

It was raining very hard that day.

[Santiago Genovese]

I remember her nice bright yellow coat.

[Linda]

I told you that the rain is one of the things that makes the fungus grow and you said, wow, is it growing right now? Can I see it?

[Santiago Genovese]

When I met Linda, I felt something stirring inside my cell for the first time in a long while. It turns out there was something stirring inside Linda Too.

[Linda]

In Italian, the word fungo means fungus, mold, a mushroom. And my thing is all three.

[Santiago Genovese]

Linda has a fungus that lives in her knee.

[Linda]

I was in Thailand in 2004. I was hit by the tsunami. My leg was torn apart by a piece of wood. And somewhere, somehow, this bloody fungus that usually lives in the seawater found its way inside my knee bone.

[Santiago Genovese]

But no doctor could remove was a story she had told a thousand times. The quick version to explain the scars on her legs.

[Linda]

I'm used to hearing the whole poor little girl kind of reaction. But you didn't have it. You are curious.

[Santiago Genovese]

I wanted to know everything about Linda. The story behind each scar, the tragedy that the tsunami must have been. But I didn't know if she would let me in.

[Linda]

Healing from this, finding a way to keep the fungus quiet, became the most important thing of my life.

[Santiago Genovese]

The first time we were intimate, I had to be careful not to pull Linda's leg too high, not to push against the fungus, not to squash the scars too hard.

[Linda]

You see this long scar from my knee to half of my shin. They open me from here to here. The fungus is made by countless spores, and it's impossible to take them all away with surgery. And the knee is a place where it's hard for blood to carry that proper drug that could defeat it.

[Santiago Genovese]

If Linda doesn't manage the fungus, it grows. And when it grows, it starts eating her knee and tibia tissue.

[Linda]

When I'm really sick, Loretta gets stronger.

[Santiago Genovese]

Did I mention I named Linda's fungus Loretta?

[Linda]

Remind me, why did you name her Loretta?

[Santiago Genovese]

I got the name Loretta from Monty Python's Life of Brian that I saw at least 50 times in my teenage years. While everyone else was out on dates, some rebels are planning a riot. And one of them comes out saying that he wants to be a woman. And then, proud of her new place in the world, she from now on, I want you to call me Loretta. Loretta can be a very cranky roommate. When it's humid outside, Loretta groans and stretches.

[Linda]

It feels like being blown up from the inside.

[Santiago Genovese]

When Linda eats pizza, Loretta gets bloated from the yeast.

[Linda]

And I don't want my knee to turn into a loaf of bread.

[Santiago Genovese]

Linda has to keep herself away from cakes, pastry, sweets, and everything that contains sugar.

[Linda]

Otherwise, the fungus will start to ferment.

[Santiago Genovese]

No mushrooms because they grow stronger together.

[Linda]

And no white rice or potatoes because they have glucose.

[Santiago Genovese]

Linda even had to give up her favorite hobby, salsa dancing, because Loretta isn't very athletic.

[Linda]

And no wine. And in Italy, it means that I have to start an argument with the waiter. Every time I sit at a restaurant table.

[Santiago Genovese]

Hanging out with Linda, I found out that she and I could never be alone.

[Linda]

Sometimes. You thought I was pulling out Loretta Just as an excuse because I didn't like you or I didn't want to do things with you. But it was just her. It was raining very hard that day.

[Santiago Genovese]

The air was full of water.

[Linda]

When random people found me after the tsunami, I was sitting completely naked on a mattress that had been taken away by the wave. I rescued myself by climbing on it, pulling myself out of the water. I was trying to shout help. But a toneless whiffle was coming out from my mouth.

[Santiago Genovese]

Someone carried her through the wreckage to a hotel.

[Linda]

It was one of the very few buildings left standing after the wave passed through the island.

[Santiago Genovese]

Her legs were devastated by open wind wounds. One of her rescuers brought her a muddy bedsheet so she could cover her body.

[Linda]

Somewhere. Somehow, this bloody fungus that usually lives in the seawater found its way inside my knee bone.

[Santiago Genovese]

Loretta.

[Linda]

You see this long scar from my knee to half of. After I got back to Italy, it took me five years to walk again, to become confident in my legs, to accept my scars, and to feel normal again. They opened me from here to here. My leg became the test for my potential relationships. Letting people get closer if I felt they could make my life easier. And pushing them away when I thought they were not brave, patient, or understanding enough to handle what I was going through.

[Santiago Genovese]

Sometimes I water the plants on Linda's balcony and I find some little mushroom in the plant's soil. It happened a couple of times that I started talking to them. Like a jealous father protecting his teenage daughter. Loretta isn't home.

[Mary Gidling]

Go away.

[Santiago Genovese]

She has to study. She doesn't have time for you mushroom boys. But sometimes even Loretta needs a bottle. Bit of fun.

[Linda]

Oh, what do we have here?

[Santiago Genovese]

It's our anniversary. And after a lot of research, I found the most suitable cake for Linda to eat. It's an adaptation of the traditional torta tenerina.

[Linda]

I spent seven years of my life trying to get rid of my fungus, Even if I knew I had to live with it inside me forever. But since you gave her a name. When Loretta knocks on my knee or starts to hurt me, I try to find a way to get along with her. Maybe she's not so evil. She's not the one who tore open my leg. She just crawled in there looking for a home.

[Santiago Genovese]

Loretta found a home in Linda's knee. And a home is what I've also found a home with a smart, brave girl living inside a fancy bright yellow raincoat in the closet, some plants to water on the balcony, and an oven to bake a cake once in a while to make life sweeter for both of them. To make life sweeter for all three of us, Linda, Loretta and me.

[Glenn Washington]

Big love the happy couple. And to Loretta the fungus. Thanks so much to the folks at the Love Me Podcast. Subscribe to them with a quickness. Thank you for sharing your story list now. The story was produced by Mira Burt Wintonic, Crystal Duhame and Jonathan Zenti. Find out more about the Love Me show and about Jonathan's [e-mail] It happened again. I know Snappers. I know. Do me a favor if you will. If you dig Snap storytelling, let somebody know. Wear your Snap flag high on social media at your book club. If you see these young toughs down at the corner blaring their supposed music, you roll up and hit them with some snap full blast. They can't know unless you teach them. If you missed even a moment, get the amazing Snap Judgment podcast. That's right, get the podcast. Take storytelling with you wherever you go. It's fun and easy. All that stuff you hate to do. Laundry, dishes. Your job will do it with you. Follow Snap Judgment on Instagram Snap Judgment Radio for pictures of the underground lair and all that is snap. Hit me directly on the Twitter and I'll let you know what I really think. And you know the beat doesn't happen without you. Support Snap Storytelling. Go to our patreon patreon.com snapjudgment so the beat goes on step is brought to you by the team that can make a cell phone out of a coconut. Give it up for the Uber producer Gilligan Mark Ristage the Skipper 2 Pat with CD Miller Marissa the millionaire Dodge and her wife John Facil the movie star Linz Ogorio Shayna Shealy the Professor Liz Marianne Mack here on Snap Judgment. Special guest star Eliza Smith Wardrobe by Lauren Newsom Transportation by Anna Sussman Taylor Cot on catering, Flo Wiley handles our security, Nancy Stunt Double Lopez Leon Morimoto on logistics while Nikka Singh does makeup. Well, this is not the news. No way is this a news. In fact, you could book a 10 day 11 night luxury cruise vacation through the Azores only to turn up at the dock to see a guy named Jerry sitting on a 4 by 5 foot wooden raft and recall the ad did say no refunds and you would still still not be as far away from the news as this is, but this is PRX it.