D (3:46)

Yeah. And to chime in from my perspective, Hi, everyone. My name is Sarah and I run our social media at manychat. So I handle our Instagram and YouTube primarily. I'm gonna take this question from the perspective of how you said brands versus entrepreneurs. I think that typically from a social media perspective, brands think very strategically. Like, there's not a moment where you can't have a strategy behind what you're posting. I feel like a lot of solopreneurs who are kind of doing it on their own, we're bombarded with so much to do in a day that it's really hard to sometimes step back and think more strategically because we're trying to post so much every single day, which I understand and, and can relate to as somebody building a personal brand, that stepping back and being like, you know what? Like, am I actually showing up in the best way strategically, or am I just showing up to show up because I feel like I need to post today? So for me, that would be what I feel brands kind of do. Right. But sometimes, like a solopreneur who is very busy and overwhelmed can get wrong.

B (4:54)

I love this. I love this. And I think there's like, so many things of course we can do wrong and right. But one thing that I'm really seeing the shift in is. So would you say that the shift is really from content to conversations? Cause I see a lot of people saying, okay, I'm posting this content, but I'm not necessarily converting. Right. Do you think, like, we are shifting in that, going from the content, are we shifting to the conversations? Are you seeing people do that?

C (5:21)

I would say yes and no. I do think conversations are definitely like a big piece of the Puzzle now and show. I think it's a little bit at least maybe from me, I have the PR point of view here. So, like, for us, as many chat, it's like, where are the conversations that we should be in? And so thinking of it that way, but from like the flip side of probably a creator, like, how can you, like, see the conversations that are maybe happening around your niche, around your. If you have a product around any of that and like attach yourself to those conversations or even to have something that actually starts that conversation, I think is where your content actually can become that. So it's kind of like this weird. There's not really an answer for it right now. And I think we're all trying to kind of figure this out as we go. But I definitely think that this idea of conversation is something that I know, like, a lot of us internally have been talking around that word alone conversation and seeing, like, really what that could become. And I think that there is definitely a larger story and a larger action item around this idea of conversations that we all are paying attention to a little bit more now. And especially with, like, the feed is getting so saturated as well, because there is so much content just coming out and coming out and coming out. So it's like, how do you stand out? It is. I think there is something to say there with the conversation side of it.

B (6:42)

Oh, I love it.

D (6:44)

Yeah. And I would definitely agree with you too. I think one of the things that I say to entrepreneurs who are trying to grow on socials, like, you're really trying to build your personal brand and like, you essentially are what sells your thing. People love talking to people and conversations are what sell. So from that perspective, like, I think that if you can use your content in a way that drives conversations for you, like, that's how majority of people that I've worked with in the past have seen 99% of their results. It's like, oh, this person slid into my DMs because they had questions about things. And over time I helped them with X, Y, Z things. You know, I would voice message them and I would do this. And like, that's how they generate the sales and generate the results that they're looking for or even like beyond sales, like a fan base, a community. Like, really people who, you know, show up to their live events, show up to their live streams, whatever happens. To be like, I think that's the best way to do it is to really just build those relationships.

B (7:43)

No, I love that. And I can attest to just having conversations this week, in the last three days, just having conversations with people in their DMs, and like you said, really just talking to real humans. I think we. We're in this world where it is like, I guess they call it the trust recession, right? We've been hearing a lot of people say that. So I think if you're having these real conversations and actually, you know, talking to people like they're human, like, that can lead somewhere. Even just for me, this week, I got three potential leads just for a high ticket service. So there's so many ways to just really humanize this. And I think this goes into what I want to talk about next is the DM economy, because we know Manichat is the innovator. Okay? I love Manichat. I use it all the time, and I think it's been an instrumental tool in my business. But let's talk about these DMs, because I feel like this is where the most people get stuck. Right? I think DMs are very underutilized as a sales channel. And of course, everybody always says, oh, let's jump on a discovery call. But what if the discovery call was the DMs? Like, how are you guys feeling about that?

D (8:52)

Yeah, from my perspective, I don't love doing discovery calls. I never have, just to be honest, because I feel like a lot of people get stuck in this trap where they do a ton of discovery calls and it wastes so much time because majority of people are not necessarily the right fit. So when I started using manychat, it was prior to me working at manychat because I am a creator. And so I was doing social media management. That was the service that I was selling through Instagram and through social media. And. And so I would personally use my DMs just like you said, like, as the. Like, let's qualify this person and figure out, like, are they the right fit before we hop on a call? And I think that just again, it ties into conversations. Like, you can tell From a few DMs if this person is a right fit or not. Like, you know, I never think that I'm the right fit for everybody at all. And frankly, I don't want to put myself in that position either. Like, I like to be a little selective. Like, I want to make sure it's the person perfect for every person. And I think there's a lot that you can do in the DMs, like, even just through, like, voice messages and things like that. Like, I love all of that.

C (9:59)

Yeah, I would agree with everything that Sarah just said on how, like, just being able to connect with your audience through DMs as well is such a powerful tool and being able to. I think a lot of people think of us as just the platform that can send you a link if you comment. Um, we actually, like, there's so much more that you can do within DMs that can actually help grow your business. You can help take, like, actually take your audience if they are the qualified people that you want to connect with, and actually bring them outside of just the algorithm, too, and, you know, give them access to your newsletter where you're giving them those tips and just continuing to build those connections off the feed as much as you are in your content on the feedback.

B (10:44)

Oh, I love that. And I don't think that there may be people listening. They haven't even touched all these features of Manichat. They haven't even thought about all the things that they could do. Just give me, like, two things that every creator and entrepreneur like, what are the two features, two to three features they should be using right now.

D (11:04)

Ooh, I can jump. First, I feel like the ones I've really been liking, and I've seen a lot of good results with creators asking for the follow before you deliver a freebie. So this is a really big one. Like, you can basically have it set up so that it's like, okay, they comment the word, but then before you actually deliver the link, you ask them to follow, and then they have to literally follow you before getting the thing. I was a little hesitant about it at first because I was like, I don't know how I feel about giving people an extra step, but it actually does work quite well. And then for a second one, I don't know, maybe. Oh, I've been really liking setting up quizzes in the DMs as well. So, like, for a couple of, like, the clients that I've worked with, I'll set up, like, you know, little this or that type quizzes, even just to, like, lead them to the right product or to lead them, I don't know, like a personality quiz, like, just for fun. I think that that's really a unique way to use it, and I haven't seen a lot of people using it that way. So it's my two.

C (12:03)

I think my two would probably be. I like, when I've seen creators do, like, after they do the traditional, like, comment to DM, then they have the rule that maybe 24 hours later, they follow up and like say like, hey, I saw like, you know, thanks for commenting or getting that product. Like, do you want to like be a part of my newsletter and then you can capture your leads off the back of what initial. That initial feature was. And so I like when I see that. Another thing kind of going to the fun side as well is we have seen, seen more people starting to take these like more unique approaches to the automations and doing things where it's like the automations actually like will reveal a mystery deal or a mystery, you know, link to something and kind of taking people on like a story within the automation. And so like, I know we've played around with it a little bit through we have a online publication, chronically online magazine that's part of mini chat. And so we've played around with some of these like fun, like we did a haunted house automation through around Halloween. Sarah's laughing. She knows what I'm talking about. And so like seeing some of these more unique ways of using automations and just like expanding outside of just the comment to DM feature and just playing around in the product, I think is something that you can actually see how much you can grow within that.

B (13:25)

Ooh, I love that. And you all are giving me ideas. You know, one of the features that I really love and that I've been using, um, is the, you know, as soon as someone follows you, sending the message to welcome them. And I feel like that's been going really well. But I want to step it up because I've seen some people sending videos and voice notes. I think I want to get on that level. So I'm going to change it because I do want to just go a little bit deeper. But I love that most recently I had about 2,000 new followers in a week. And I really felt like that feature just helped to get people to know about me more. But also listen to the podcast because that's what I have set up. I have as soon as you follow me. Thanks for following listen to my podcast. Cause I kind of feel like that's a free angle and it could really help them get to know me better because we're on the podcast, right? And it's just the entry point of my brand. So I really love that feature and I've been using it. But thanks for sharing those because now I'm taking notes. Okay, I am taking notes. So I love that. Um, and I think, you know, I always say people are posting but they don't have a system after the post. And so I really think that Manichat is doing an amazing job to help us have a system after we posting. Right. To get those people that we're, you know, when we have our call to action, we're saying like, hey, where are these people going? So I, I love that one question I do have as a follow up. What do you think actually makes someone respond to a DM versus ignore it? Ooh,

C (14:57)

I think there's a few different ways that you could answer this. I think it would depend on what the creator is, what the DM itself is. But I think at least if I'm going to put myself in the shoes of the person who is sending like, the dm. And I think that I would hope to get like a response if there is some sort of like, action needed or like, if I. I don't know, like, I. Sarah, you might have a better answer for this as the person who sees all of the DMs that we get from the many chat accounts.

D (15:30)

Yeah, so I guess, like for somebody who's sending DMs, I always feel like the more personal that you can make it, the better. Even if you're like a brand, because it's easy to ignore a message when it sounds robotic or like chat. GPT wrote it. Like, nobody wants to respond to that. Even like LinkedIn comments that you can tell are written by AI. Like, I usually don't even respond.

C (15:54)

I'm like, oh.

D (15:56)

Like, I just think it's like so lazy. You know what I mean? Whereas when you actually incorporate like personality, like, those are the ones that people actually want to reply to. Like, we can tell that you're a human, we can tell that you're a person. And all of that not only translates to the direct, obviously reply of the dm, but also those people are the ones that turn into your fans. They listen to your podcast, they, you know, support your posts, they comment on your other new stuff, they buy your stuff, whatever happens to be. So it's really important to pay attention to your DMs and comments and really just show up like a real person.

C (16:26)

I think also just to add to that a little bit, if you are somebody who is DMing Brands and if you're like a creator, DMing Brands and trying to. I think the same advice goes for that as well, of like being personable. Like, I'm sure that like a lot of brands kind of can tell when it's an AI written message or if it's just like a hello to the brand. Like you gotta just show like that it's like that it's you still. And those are gonna be the DMs that get noticed on the brand side. If you're like looking to have a brand deal or whatever the case may be for that, I would say that the same exact advice goes both ways.

D (17:06)

Oh yeah, I can speak to that as somebody who sees our DMs literally every day. Yeah, like a lot of people love to send the copy paste messages and you can tell that they send it to every single brand as like a pitch for a brand deal. And you know, like, I'll send you the form to fill out. But the ones who really, you can tell, like customized it, talked about our product, how they use it, the whole thing, like, those are the ones that I'll send directly to our influencer team. I'm like, here you go. So, so.

B (17:36)

Well, those were some good tips. And if you're listening and you've been doing the copy and paste message, it's probably time for you to really think about being more intentional is what I hear both of you saying. Right. Coming in from a more human perspective, we can tell when the comments are, you know, chatgpt. Now, I love a good chat or Claude or whoever you use, but when I'm really responding, I really want people to know that it's me. Even if I do respond, I almost always come back and send a voice note and say like, hey, I want you to know this is a real person. Like, because you could just think my regular messages is a, is a, is a ChatGPT message, but it's actually me. I use emoji, so it's me. And I just like to always come back with a voice note. So I love everything that you said here and I think that was really like a little masterclass on how we should be approaching brands and we should not be copy and pasting. Okay, so you heard it here first. Do not copy and paste. Okay. And so I want to talk about visibility to opportunity because this is what I talk about a lot in my content. And Maddie, I want to bring you in here to answer this question first. From a PR and communication perspective, what makes someone stand out enough to even get these opportunities? Partnerships or even speaking engagements.

C (18:53)

Relatability, to be honest. And that kind of goes exactly into what we were just saying about like personalization and just showing that you actually understand and care about what it is that you are trying to like pitch yourself as, whether that's for a brand deal, for speaking up. Even like myself, whenever I'm doing a PR pitch for one of our spokespeople. And I'm trying to always figure out like, what is the relatable aspect here that like anyone who sees this is going to like be like, oh yeah, like I, that makes sense. I've been there, I've, I feel the same way. And this is like a big, this is like a PR thing that I've been doing for years too, that if I am coming up with some sort of an angle for a pitch, that if I can't think of how it would make sense to somebody else or like I can't put myself in the other side's shoes to understand that point of view, then it's probably not relatable enough. I would say niche down to an extent with these, but if you're doing like a speaking up, sometimes going too niche is actually going to be a little bit more difficult than being more broad and relatable. And then bringing in your niche throughout what you speak about versus pitching your niche right away and it all just comes back down to just being human, I think. And especially right now in like the, the era that we are in with AI and just kind of proving that humanity a little bit. It's kind of, I hate to say that, but that's kind of like where we're at right now too. And so just anything that you can do to just like show your passion, show that you understand what you are talking about, that other people like, it's something that other people would care about as well, I think are just some of like, the more, the broader like tips I would give there.

B (20:39)

Yeah. And Sarah, I want to ask you too because I know you probably get a ton of pitches just in the DMs. And so what are your thoughts as well? What do you think makes the people who are pitching like stand out to get these opportunities? I know we said like just being relatable, but I know you get a lot of pitches in the DMs that you probably forward to the team. But like what is your perspective on that as well?

D (21:01)

Well, yeah, so my perspective, like from a, I guess a brand deal perspective, like who gets the deal, who doesn't obviously, like, I don't, I don't deal with that directly, but I work very closely with our influencer, influencer manager team who like does do those types of deals. And to be honest, like what they're usually looking for is a lot within your account. So like, for example, if you do have a very clear niche of who you're talking to, it's a little easier to get a brand deal versus somebody who is like very, very broad, generic. Like saying, you know, I'm a lifestyle creator is different than saying like, oh, I'm a creator who helps moms, you know, create recipes so that she can, you know, make school lunches easier. Like something like that. Like, it's so much more specific to where like certain brands are going to want to like go and, you know, work with you versus, like the generic creator. So for me it looks a little like that. Like they're looking usually at, you know, does your audience align with the audience that we are looking to target? And that usually comes from niche, in my opinion. I don't know if that exactly answered the question, but hopefully that was helpful.

B (22:07)

No, that definitely answers the question. And I agree. I think, you know, there are so many pictures that you all see every day. But I agree, like, we have to be human, right? And relatable. And yes, I know there's a lot of people who say don't niche down. But when I really focus on a particular niche, it just like increased my visibility. So I will say what both of you said is spot on. And I do think that people should just niche down more because you, yeah, you can be broad and talk about all the things. But you're right, if you're a lifestyle creator, okay, that could be anything, right? That could be anything. But how do you specifically help people? And I think once we get clear on that, the visibility opportunities and just the opportunities that come from that visibility increase because now you're more specific and talking to a specific person. So I love that. And let's talk about it. The money, right? Because that's why we all here, right? We love to talk about monetization. So I want to go there. Let's go there. Okay, let's go there. Where are people leaving money on the table right now? And this is for both of you. Where are we leaving money on the table?

D (23:12)

That is a good question. I feel like just to jump in first, I do see I'm going to talk to like beginner creators, like beginner creators, even like beginner entrepreneurs. I feel like for a beginner creator, they often think that the measure of success looks like, like working with a big brand or like, you know, maybe an entrepreneur. The measure of success is like selling a super high ticket product. But I think through that process of trying to get to that like big goal, we forget a lot of the little goals. So like, you know, someone who's just trying to get a bunch of brand deals, like, that's awesome. But it's kind of hard to keep that sustainable and it's hard to do if you're smaller, for sure. So, like, what I always encourage those types of creators is like, focus on building something that's your own, like, build a digital product, start a podcast. Like, something that you can literally build up and monetize over time. And then I also think, like, don't forget to pitch yourself too. So we were just talking about pitches. I'm going to say it again. But like, if you do have a podcast, like you do, Michelle, or like, if you do want brand deals, like, pitch yourself to the brands. Like, you don't have to sit and wait for the brands to come to you. I've gotten brand deals with less than 10,000 followers, easy, because I pitch to it and I'll be like, okay, I'm a creator and I can create content for your brand and it works. So I don't know, I think it's just like, it's being a little more proactive maybe is where, like the opportunities get missed.

B (24:40)

Oh, yeah, Love it.

C (24:42)

I would say similar to this too, that I think that a lot of creators are optimizing probably more for the follower count, the virality, and it's like, so they're just like pumping out the content for that sake and not really thinking about the, like, audience side of it. I'm not saying this is every creator, but if we, if you optimize for those systems and those systems to get your audience off of that into like Sarah was saying, like, to your digital product, to something that you can actually like, own that then you don't need to have 100,000 plus, 500,000 plus followers to still be as successful and to still monetize your content. Like, you can start doing that even if you aren't like, seeing, if you, even if you feel like you don't have the numbers in your follower account or in your views, like that still is a very, very viable option that can still grow your creator business while still obviously doing your content, but just like having like thinking about the systems that you're building in the background to be able to grow that side of it, I think is something that a lot of people might be not even realize that's an option, especially when you are a smaller creator.

B (25:56)

Oh, I love that. Because, look, the money, we're not trying to leave it on the table. So you all have given us just some tips that we can really leverage. And I love what you both said and I've actually been leaning more into this, right? Treating myself as a media company because somebody who has been online for the last 17 years, I mean, I've built the platforms, right? And so now I feel like it is prime time, right, to partner with brands to really leverage the platforms I've built. I mean, I love this podcast so much. It's six years into the podcast, over 655 episodes. And so I feel like if you do have a podcast, if you do have a platform, please take this advice, right, and really start to think about how you can leverage your platforms not in the regular way like everybody else is doing it, because that doesn't work anymore, to be honest. Brands are looking for a bit more, right? I think they're looking to be connected more. They're looking for more integrations and just not the one offs like that we've been. So think about it, y'.

C (26:55)

All.

B (26:55)

If you got a podcast and you're listening, okay? And if you got. You want some tips, I can give you some tips because I have been actively doing this. So it's not that we're. We're not doing enough, right? We maybe just not be doing the right things. Okay? And as we talked about here, missing the system that connects all of this. So. All right, y', all, this has been a good episode, but now it's time for the rapid fire. Okay, y' all ready for this rapid fire? Do not overthink this. Okay?

D (27:22)

No.

B (27:23)

Okay, let's go. Okay. First, one thing every entrepreneur should implement this week.

D (27:32)

Oh, my God. I don't know.

C (27:34)

I'm not rapid on this one.

B (27:37)

Maybe.

D (27:39)

Ooh, God, I don't know. Many times am I not good at rapid? Well, yeah, use many chat.

B (27:49)

I'm going to.

C (27:49)

I'm going to use the easy answer.

D (27:51)

The first thing that came into my head, though, was LinkedIn, because I was someone who. It took really long for me to get to LinkedIn. And now that I'm on it and posting consistently, the amount of opportunities that I've gotten is crazy. So for me, it would be that.

C (28:02)

That's actually a really huge. A good one. That's a really good one.

B (28:07)

I agree. LinkedIn is hot. Y' all. Get on LinkedIn if you're not one mistake creators are making right now.

D (28:17)

Not I again, I think. Well, I think there's a balance between being strategic and posting every day and posting a lot. Like, so again, remembering to post with a strategy always, like, I think that's. That's something that we forget a lot because when you start to post without it. That's when you start to get off niche. That's when you start to kind of like wander. And I don't know, I see it a lot.

C (28:38)

My brain's answer is actually really similar to that was going to be hopping on every single trend because I do see that a lot where like just because it's. That's trending that the creator might hop on every single one but then that the exact same thing happens where then it takes them away from their, it could take them away from what their niche is and take away from the strategy that they're trying to build.

B (28:59)

Yeah, I agree, I agree. And one way to stand out immediately

D (29:06)

post literally like show up. Like literally show up, show up, post, comment on other people's posts, network in real life with people in the DMs. All that.

C (29:19)

I was just gonna say show up to like. I think in person networking right now is huge, especially in this. Like there's this craving for more of this IRL connection that I'm seeing a lot in the creator economy specifically and hearing it from people. I mean we've hosted events over the last few months even and that's the thing that we keep hearing time and time is like all these creators that are like craving this in person connection and these conversations like that they can actually have offline. But then that gives them such a good connection point to like I, we had a south by event back in March and I've had people now email me referencing a conversation that they had with me at the in person event and I immediately like know who they are. And so that's a good way I think to stand out. And I'm not saying like everyone needs to go and book flights and go on trips or anything like that because realistically I know right now that's not feasible. I have seen the airline pricing but like look in your local areas too. There's lots of local creator meetups that are happening. Look at brands that might be based near you too and like see if they're doing events and things like that and see if there's any of those more unique ways to I think stand out. Just kind of putting yourself out there.

B (30:28)

Yeah. No, events have been oh the thing. Right. And you all said it in real life events. I think people are craving that connection. As you all know, I am the event person. So I am doing events online and in person every single month and it just has been amazing for my business. I love connection. That's really how I thrive. I'm real big on relationships, and I don't think that we can do it from necessarily behind the computer because honestly, I've met some people from behind the computer and then I met them in person, and it's not the same. So you all please be the same. Okay. When you are online and in person, I guarantee you that will just make the process and the conversion and what you're trying to do even better. I had somebody meet me this past week and they're like, you're exactly like you are online. Personally, I can't be a different person, and so I'm really grateful for that. So I'm glad you said that because I think that's a great note to end on and say, get in person in real life, your business will flourish. So let me say this before we wrap, okay? This has been such a great episode. I really appreciate you. Sarah and Maddie. I've met Sarah and Maddie in person, and so I love their personalities. And I said we have to get them on the podcast for behind the Brand series that I am doing. So thank you all so much for being the second to help me with this behind the Brand series. And I think that many people want to learn more about the people who work behind our favorite brands. And so I am so grateful for the both of you. So if you've been showing up, you've been posting, right? We've been doing all the things. And thank you to Sarah Taylor. Thank you so much for joining and tuning in. Sarah, for tuning in from YouTube. It's so not because you may not be working hard enough, right? I think it's because you don't have the right system. So get your pen and your notepad and go back and take notes. But as you know, that is exactly what I help my clients build a system that converts. So I am so excited. Thank you ladies again for coming on today. And please let us know where can we find you online.

C (32:36)

Yeah, so you can find me. You can my name on LinkedIn or you can also follow me at the PRGirlie on Instagram. It's a new account, so don't judge. Nudge my followers. I'm working on it.

D (32:45)

But hey, we all start somewhere, Maddie. It's okay.

B (32:49)

Exactly.

D (32:50)

Exactly. And then as for me, I'm Sarah Gav on every platform. So LinkedIn, you can find me at Sarah Gav. And my Instagram is sarah gav.social.

B (33:02)

yes, I love it. And we'll have all their information for you down in the show notes. If you're watching this on YouTube. You can also comment on YouTube. This will also be on my Facebook. LinkedIn has been having some crazy problems, but I will post this also on LinkedIn as well. So everywhere. Okay? This will be everywhere, Spotify, everywhere. So leave your comments. We want to hear from you. Okay. We want to hear from you. And thank you so much for tuning into today's live episode of behind the Brand with the amazing ladies from Manichat on today's episode of Social Media Decoded. And I cannot wait to talk to you all in the next one. Peace.

C (33:41)

Bye.