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Social Media Decoded
Why Your Lead Magnet Isn’t Working (and the Relationship Strategy That Converts) with Lauren Najar
00:29:43
In this episode, Michelle Thames sits down with business coach and lead strategist Lauren Najar to break down why most lead magnets fail and what actually drives conversions in 2025. They unpack how relationship-based marketing, intentional visibility, and simple lead-tracking systems turn everyday conversations into consistent clients—without burnout or nonstop posting.
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Lauren Najar
No.
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- [00:57]
Lauren Najar
Hey, y'. All.
- [00:58]
Michelle Thames
Welcome back to Social Media Decoded, the number one podcast for helping entrepreneurs decode what's working right now in marketing and online business. I am your host, Michelle Thames, and today I'm joined by a guest who is truly changing the game when it comes to building authority and generating leads online. You all know how I feel about that. So if you've been stuck wondering, why isn't my lead magnet working? Where are all the aligned clients at? And is it really possible to grow without dancing or posting three times a day, then this episode is for you. Today I'm talking to Lauren, a business coach and lead strategist, helping women make money online with smarter visibility, simple sales, and strong systems. She's helped hundreds of entrepreneurs turn social media into real pipelines without burning out or guessing every step. So you already know the drill. Get your pens and your notepads ready. Get ready to take notes. Let's get into it. Lauren, I am so glad to have you on the show. For those who may not know you yet, please give us a little bit about your background. And how did you get into coaching and becoming known for helping people attract align leads?
- [02:12]
Lauren Najar
Well, thank you so much for having me. I'm so happy to be here. I'm so excited to talk about lead generation. It's something I can talk about forever. You know, I think it comes down to the one thing, and you and I were talking about this before we hit record, is that building relationships is something that I do so effortlessly. And there was a time in my business where I really wanted to, like, okay, well, like, building relationships is cool, but, like, how Do I monetize that or, like, how do I teach that? Right? And that's not really something you can teach. And so when I went back to, like, thinking about, like, my life and like, my friends, and I'm just a natural connector, and I know that that is a superpower of mine, but I think there's also a way where, like, you can also utilize that to sales, right? We sell every day. We sell to our husbands, our spouses, our partners, our kids, our friends. Hey, do you want to go do this? You know, they have this, this, and this, right? Like, we sell to everyone every single day. We don't. We just, like, don't know it. And that's really, like, what I kind of started thinking about is, like, how can we actually sell and just, like, have just conversations that are just normal conversations, and then those people become our clients. Like, that's really what selling is. That's really what my mission has been, is just really, truly get people to, like, understand. Like, it is all only about building relationships. And that's something that can come easily from you.
- [03:38]
Michelle Thames
Yes, I love building relationships. And let's. Let's get into it. I know that most entrepreneurs say that they want more leads, right? But what's actually the problem that most people are facing when their legion feels like, kind of off the.
- [03:54]
Lauren Najar
You know, the thing that I see most times, and it's something super simple. It's. They aren't tracking. And that is the tangible, maybe even the masculine thing to do if. If you're into masculine, feminine, whatever, people are not tracking. So I know, you know, a lot of times I have clients that are like, I don't know where my leads are, but they are actively on social media, having conversations, sending DMs, like, doing all of the things, but they're actually not doing it in any intentional way. Therefore, they're not tracking. And so whenever I. I hear that and I hear people tell me, well, I don't know where my leads are. I don't know. I don't have any leads. It's. I tell them that they're wrong because you have leads. You talk to them every single day. You have people that are liking your posts, you have people that are opening your emails. You have people that are clicking on your sales pages. You're just not paying attention. And so I think, like, you know the question. Sometimes the question also is like, well, how do you, like, talk to people? It's like, that's the wrong question to ask. The question actually is like, you need to start Tracking, you need to be a little bit more intentional. You know, I think it's so easy because we have these apps on our phones and we can open up messenger whenever we want on the go. We're working and multitasking, but that's when it becomes messy and that's when we don't track our leads. And I think truly, like 75% of people out there that say they don't have leads or struggle with lead generation is you're actually not tracking your leads. And that is probably the most simple thing that you can tweak. Like right now, right? And just start a list, pen and paper, or even like a good old Google sheet. You don't have to have an elaborate system, but just start tracking them.
- [05:37]
Michelle Thames
Truly, that's good. I like how you said we don't need an elaborate system because some people may think they need ClickUp and asana and you just said a Google Doc. So just start tracking via a Google Doc. Simple, right? Do you think that people are relying too much on social content to do all the heavy lifting for them?
- [05:58]
Lauren Najar
Yes. I say that with so much almost like disdain because I think that, you know, I don't want to, I don't want to, I guess I don't want to be, get into specifics, but I do want to say there are, there is a mindset out there that more content and only content is going to, like you said, do the heavy, heavy lifting for you. And you don't have to talk to people, you don't have to send DMs, you don't have to build relationships. And the, and again, like, I don't want to rant about that, but it's just so completely untrue. You can have the best content out there. And I think that if I offer this different perspective is that you know, when you, you can have the best piece of content, right? And then if you get 2 likes and no one sees it, then you're going to instantly think that it's the worst piece of content. And you could be the best writer, you could be the best, you know, reels creator, you can have the best TikTok videos, but because only three people liked your post, you're going to think the world is over. But if you were actually doing some engagement, if you were actually sending messages, if you were actually tracking even the smallest of people that were engaging with your posts, engaging with your stories, you were having conversations with, you're going to see how well things are actually performing versus like just the surface level analytics Right. And so I think that's my biggest point that I try to get across is like, good content is still important, right? Like, we need to rely on good content. We need to have a good content strategy. We need to have a good marketing strategy. But you can ten times the speed of conversions if you're actually having conversations with people that are already engaging with your stuff so they work in concert with each other.
- [08:00]
Michelle Thames
This is so good. And you all, I hope you are taking notes because I agree with you. You know, I literally look at every person who watches my story every single day. Why? Because I want to see, like, is there a pattern of people who watch my stories all the time? And there are. And then what if those people reach out to me or if I do a poll, I use Instagram intentional. I think the reason, like you said, why most people hate Instagram is because you are not intentional on how you're using it. You're not seeing who's liking your posts or commenting, and then you're not engaging with them either. Then your next client could be very much so following you, Right? And they could been following you for two years. And then one day you do a webinar or something and you are super intentional and you're following up and then they decide to work with you. I think it's so easy to think because so many people are sharing these type of things online, that it's just you post and people just come and they're just there. But in 2025, and you know this, and I both know this, and we were talking about this before, it's not like that. And so I'm glad you said that because so many people hate Instagram and will get mad and they say no one is engaging. But then I go to their posts, they're not responding to comments. They're probably not looking at their stories. They're probably not keeping track and having a true system and treating Instagram like the top of the funnel app that it is in the customer journey. And I may be getting technical, but it's marketing. And if you're not following up and building relationships, it's going to be hard for you to do the type of things that you want to do unless you have millions of dollars for ads, which we were talking about, which is may not even work. Right. But I know that you're very intentional, just like me. And we both talk about ecosystems as an approach to lead generation. So can you walk us through, like, how you help clients build a lead engine that converts and even more Importantly, that works for them and their business because there's many different ways.
- [10:13]
Lauren Najar
I love what you just said there about. Yeah, there are a bunch of different ways, but there's also so many different industries and businesses and clients that you're attracting, right? And the like, the first example I can give is, you know, I have a client who's a hormone coach and her ideal client are going to be like normal everyday people. And I, I use the phrase normies where they're, you know, you might have, you might run into a lot of private accounts, right? Like, you know, we were just talking about how we're going to send dms and engage with people. Well, you might not be able to do that. So your lead generation tactics are going to look a little different. You can't just like DM private accounts all the time. You're not going to get, you know, a lot of responses from those. You also can't really engage with them unless you friend request them and whatever. But we don't really want to do that either. And so then the opposite is true where like a business like mine, I can literally reach out to any business. A lot of times I'm not running into private accounts. I can engage with people all day long. And so I think like that's the very, that's a polar opposite thing, right? Like one size does not fit all. And that's so huge to know. And if you ever run into a coach or a social media manager or anyone who's going to tell you otherwise, please run the other way. Because there are so many different nuances even to service based businesses. I know that there's a difference between service and product, right? There, there are similarities and there are differences, but then there are differences between then who it is that you help. And it all comes down to your client, right? And so ecosystem, ecosystem is so important. I think when you, for instance, use Instagram only as your source of income, there is a better opportunity for you to create the ecosystem. It's so funny, I don't know if this client's gonna listen to it, but there is a call one time I kept saying ecosystem. I felt like I needed to take a drink every time I would say the word ecosystem because I just said it so often and I had coffee with me and I'm like, I'm gonna take a sip every I say ecosystem because it is so important, it is so important that you have that in your business because you have Instagram. Great. Instagram is there for content, for nurturing, for building relationships. You can definitely make conversions off of Instagram. But imagine having something else to leverage that, like an email list or your website or a blog or YouTube channel. And you can have all of these kind of talk to each other. You're not native, you know, you're not just creating for Instagram. Oh, then I need to do these videos for YouTube and then I need to do this and this and this for these other platforms. There's this giant repurposed structure you can create in your business where you think of long form content. For instance, if you have aspirations to start a YouTube channel, if you have a blog or if you want to get back into blogging, that can be your long form content. That long form content then can be created for all of your other content and all across all of your channels and you can repurpose it and think of like how a lead finds you, right? There's so many different entry points. You can think of how they find you on Instagram. Okay, great, they're gonna binge your content on Instagram, they're gonna watch your stories. But I guarantee you they're probably gonna need more. They want a longer video, they wanna learn from you. Maybe you do a masterclass, maybe you do an Instagram live training. All of those are really great. But imagine just having like this again, ecosystem where your lead can bounce around very easily and very seamlessly to just getting more content and nurtured by you a lot quicker. Video does really well. Long form content does really well, especially if you're educating someone. But I think then, you know, if they're, you know, going around your, your client, your client journey, the ecosystem that you have, then think about, oh yeah, and then you're going to send them a message, right? Like imagine that that's going to turn this client into like turn this into a conversion very quickly. If you have those things kind of talking to each other and if you're leveraging different systems too.
- [14:17]
Michelle Thames
Oh, I love that because there's so many different systems and you just explain like all of them work, but which one works for you, right? And just having that plan on how we're generating leads because it is what keeps your business going. Without any leads, you kind of don't have a business. So I like how you explain that. I know there may be some people listening who may need tools or systems. So what are some tools or systems that you always recommend to your clients to like help them with this whole journey?
- [14:50]
Lauren Najar
So I love ClickUp. That's where I have everything. That's where my team is, you know, I have a marketing agency as well, so a lot of clients that I work with have us set up in their own ClickUp and that's what I've recommended to them. It's just, it's great for project management, it's great for content planning. We use it for pretty much everything. I use it for my business. I especially use it for my lead tracking. I know we said earlier we don't need systems necessarily like that to get started, but yeah, I mean, for a long time I was using like Microsoft Excel or Google Sheet. Um, ClickUp can be utilized the same way. You can just use it as a list for leads and things like that. Um, there is a free option that you can use ClickUp for, you know, but ClickUp is just the capabilities you can use it for just truly everything. Um, I, I do use airtable for podcast management, but it is a really good way to have your leads in there as well. I've seen people use that, so I would recommend that. But you know, if you want to automate too, like, if that's something that you are wanting, like, oh yeah, it takes a lot of work to just like enter my leads or remember my leads every once in a while. I think that having automation such as, like Zapier, just to have some automations to go, you can have like, oh yeah, I had this conversation or this person clicked on this link, now add them to my ClickUp, they're on your lead list. You don't have to like manually go and check things. So you can have those automations set up too. But I mean, we won't get super technical, I guess. But ClickUp. ClickUp is something that I absolutely love.
- [16:28]
Michelle Thames
Yes. No, I love ClickUp. I've used it for a while. It's the one of the best tools. But that Google Sheet works too. So don't feel like you got to go and get ClickUp, but when you do expand, it is a great tool to have. I want to talk about visibility because a lot of people think that posting more equals getting more leads, but we know that that's not the case. But I know you always talk about quality over quantity and the right energy behind the content. So what does intentional visibility look like in 2025?
- [16:59]
Lauren Najar
Ooh, building relationships. That would be the short answer. But I think like, that's something that I want to point out is, you know, I built a pretty successful business over the last seven years and my follower count, I, I guess I don't really put a lot of stock in My follower account, right. Like I think at this, at the point of this conversation we're having, I think I'm at 4, 300 followers on Instagram. And I've had that Instagram for seven years. I had a Facebook group that I would religiously post in and do lives in for probably the first 5 and a half ish years of my business. I don't utilize Facebook groups anymore. Um, but that only had 1100 people in it. And so, you know, I think at there was a time in my business I thought, oh yeah, I need like 10,000 followers or 20,000 followers or 20,000 group members, right? But I've constantly worked with people who do have a lot more followers than me who aren't making any sales. And so I think like my case study, my own very like case study is, you know, I sold out of one on one coaching at the very beginning of my business and I didn't have a website, I didn't have a Facebook group, I didn't have Instagram. I was just posting within others Facebook page or Facebook groups. And I signed five clients like within the first couple months of my business. And so like you hear stories like that again and again and again that you can generate a lot of money and generate a lot of leads. When you are being intentional and you're just focusing on what makes your strategy, just like you're laser focused on your strategy, right? So you are just focused on what you need to do, not what everyone else is telling you to do. You are building relationships and having those conversations. That's really what it comes down to. And again, like I sign clients every month and I'm not putting a lot of stock into growing my following. I'm putting stock into the connections and the engagement that I'm receiving. My Instagram posts have never been better. I've been getting 13, 15, 20 comments on recent posts and that's what matters to me. Like I want to start a conversation, I want to build those relationships and I want to post content that's going to resonate with people, not just, well, this is what I have to do. And so I think like if anything like visibility, like you have to, you have to get in the dms. Like we're going to, we're going to really hit that point home here today. You have to be in the dms, you have to be building relationships and people can sense that you're just messaging them to message them or if you actually care, like so literally just care about the people on the other side of the Screen.
- [19:42]
Michelle Thames
That was a bar. Just care about the other people on the screen. And yes, I'm right there with you. Now, I know I do have, like, 37,000 people following me on Instagram, but listen, y', all, I hope you open up your ears here. Those 37,000 people are not all my clients. And I have built this over the last. Whenever Instagram started, I never, like, switched over my account. So it's an old account. And like Lauren said, I'm still making money every day with the people who I have because there have been so many people who have surpassed me. And like, some days I'm in my head, like, oh, my God, like, you're not growing. But it's like, no. Because the people who are there and the community and the relationships I built matter more than me growing my Instagram. Yes, I can get visible to more people, but whether they follow me or not, I want the people who are of quality to follow me. I don't want just random people following. So I like how you said that, because I think a lot of people do think that they need 10,000 followers and you don't. I have clients every day who make hundreds of thousands of dollars from social media with a very small following. It is about building relationships, and it's not the same social media that we had in 2020 when the pandemic first started, when people were just making money and doing all these things. What Lauren is saying here today, I hope that you are really listening because it's not as easy as it used to be. And if you're not super intentional about building relationships in this point of your business, getting out, even to go to networking events, to meet other people, to be in the room to get leads. Like, you should have a flyer that has your QR code so they can sign up for your email list at the event, because that's gonna be more impactful than you yelling to a void of people who you don't even know.
- [21:33]
Lauren Najar
Right.
- [21:33]
Michelle Thames
Or who may not be connected with you in some type of way. So this is really practical advice, and I hope that I know that you are all taking notes. But even speaking more to practical, I do want to bring this up about lead magnets. Why do so many people just throw up a PDF and just are like, nobody's opting in. What have you seen that really works for any type of lead magnets in 2025?
- [21:58]
Lauren Najar
I think over delivering is one thing, and I think that just goes to, like, the client experience as well. Right. So if we think of our brand we think of how people come across our brand, whether that is social media, email, website, whatever it is. Like what is the experience we want them to have. And again like we can think of like DMing and stuff too. But when it comes to lead magnet is like people don't want another download that's just going to give them a checklist. Right? They want to know what it's like to work with you. And this is, and it's actually something I've been teaching on for the last few years is like, you know, it has to make sense for your client journey and your funnel and whatever it is that you have set up in your business, you have to give them a win. Like, okay, great, you're giving them free advice. Okay. But like give them the win so then they come and work with you. Because if we, and this is a lot of businesses, I think that when we think of the word freebie or lead magnet, we're instantly thinking like, well I don't want to attract freebie seekers. And then okay, great, like don't attract freebie seekers. Create for the people that want to work with you and just need a little bit more extra behind the scenes what it's like to work with you and create a really great magnet. A free training video. Um, what is something that could be different than just here are a hundred templates. I mean I guess if that would make sense if you're a social media manager. But if you like for me for instance, I'm a business coach, so I did a 30 day sales invisibility challenge and it's literally giving you an action item for 30 days that are actual tangible action items. Not like go journal this it is. Go talk to five people today, tomorrow, track your leads. Like it's going to be diff. Like different. Definitely different things. Every single day where you have an action item where you're, it's tangible, people have booked calls from those things, right. And they may not have ever worked with me or ended up, you know, hiring me as their coach, but guess what? They gotta win. They're gonna share about it. How did I find out about it? Right? Like they, they came back and told me, I booked a call from your, from your challenge. Having a challenge is really fun. Having a quiz is really fun. Video trainings, mini courses, whatever that is. Those are really great lead magnets I've seen. If, if you know you want to do one of those, but I think then going to like a specific business, I would just ask you what is that first step into working with you, you know, you may have a framework, you may have something that you are known for. For me, I love thinking about like clarity, marketing and lead generation. And so anything that I can do to give someone clarity or give someone some tangible like lead generation, like momentum, that's what I'm going to give them in my magnet. So like I've, I also have a lead generation ebook as well, but it's like very involved. I have trainings with the emails as well, video training. So just over deliver, like what is that thing that they're going to get a win for? Just literally give. I, I saw this from a mentor of mine one time. It was like, give them the farm. Like just give, give away the farm. You know, you're not going to tell them how, how to harvest it, but just give the, give away the farm. And so like that's exactly my mindset. These last, like you have to just give them all the answers, right? But we know the people that hire us, they're going to hire us because they need accountability. They need to know how to apply it to their businesses. So like you're okay with giving the information? I think, I think it's also outdated to be like, well, I don't want to give away free information. It's like, well they can Google a lot of this stuff, they can chat GPT it now, right? So just give them, give them the advice and then they're still going to hire you at the end of the day because they need the accountability or they need someone to actually help.
- [25:59]
Michelle Thames
That was a masterclass, perfect everything. And I agree with everything that you said and you are so right over deliver. I love that how you said like give them the farm. Because my whole thing is, well, if Michelle gave away all this really good free information, I just imagine what it's like to work with her, right? Imagine what it would be like to work with Lauren if we give away this free information. Because, right, you don't have the tools and the strategy to implement it. You don't know what to do. You could take what I give you. That's what I always try to tell people behind the paid wall is the way, like I can give you the DM scripts that I use, but how are you gonna use them? Like you can figure it out or you can come and get the shortcut that I have to get to tell you how to actually do it, to show you my DMs, to show you the process, to show you my framework. But I'm not going to give away that because you could Google some DM scripts or ask ChatGPT, but also, how do I do it? That's the secret sauce. How does Lauren do it? It's the secret sauce on what you have, that then that's what you sell. And the accountability, because most people, especially the clients that I talk to and work with, I'm sure you too, they need me to be like, checking on them to make sure that we're actually moving along in our businesses and not just, you know, getting the course, but never implementing it. So that's why you do need community. That's why you do need accountability groups. That's why you do need a coach, right, to help you do that. So perfectly said. This has been a great episode. I don't even want to end. I know we said we could talk forever and ever, but before we head out, most underrated lead generation strategy right now.
- [27:42]
Lauren Najar
Building relationships in the DMs, it's a constant thing. You. I just, it's just so easy. It's lit. You can literally time it. It is from the moment. And I track this the moment I send the first conversation to someone. Converting it takes three months. How crazy? Like, you can literally time it. Sometimes it takes sooner, sometimes takes a little bit longer. But how crazy would it be if you could just like literally change your business in 90 days just by talking to people? Because that's what's going to happen.
- [28:16]
Michelle Thames
That's good. Build relationships, talk to more people, get in the DMs and have a strategy. Lauren, this was so good. You dropped so many gems. Thank you for number one, keeping it real. Me and Lauren met for the first time. We've been following each other on social media and have some mutual connections. And we decided to do this podcast. This is why I always say visibility, because if. If we weren't both visible, how do you connect with people who are doing similar things? So stay visible, people. So, Lauren, where can listeners connect with you? And do you have any resources to help them get it started with building leads right away. We would love to hear about it.
- [28:54]
Lauren Najar
So you can connect with me on Instagram. That's where I'm most active at. Lauren Najar. Just my first and last name. I am also starting a podcast that has its own Instagram business over Cocktails, so you'll have to. It's launching in August or I guess this month, so it'll probably be launched by the time this airs. And then my website's laurenajar.com as well. And the free resource that I mentioned earlier in our conversation is the 30 day sales and visibility challenge. So for 30 days you're you know you're going to get all 30 days of course upfront. But take one action each and every day for 30 days and you're going to build three. So much momentum and it's real tangible things, right? It is sending DMs, tracking your leads, following up, send an email, create a lead magnet. It's going to be something every single day. So that is the free resource that I recommend and I've seen a lot of success with that. So hopefully you like it.
- [29:55]
Michelle Thames
Yes no thank you for sharing. I'm sure the community will love this. So make sure you all check down below in the show notes for Lauren's information how you can connect with her. And I am just so excited for and I'm do the 30 day challenge too. Like I always learn something new when I do challenges so tap in with that challenge and we are so excited that you listened to this episode. If you felt it was helpful, go ahead and tag me on Instagram, Michelle Thanes and ocialmedia Decoded Pod and let us know what your takeaway from today's episode was. Again, thank you Lauren for coming on and sharing so many gems. And until next time, everyone stay visible and stay empowered. I will talk to you in the next one. Peace.
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