131: Keep it Kosher with Raanan Hershberg | Soder Podcast | EP 129

Summary

Soder Podcast Episode 131: Keep it Kosher with Raanan Hershberg

Aired April 28, 2026
Host: Dan Soder
Guest: Raanan Hershberg

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Episode Overview

In this lively episode, Dan Soder is joined by comedian Raanan Hershberg for an unstructured, free-flowing conversation covering stand-up comedy, the process of writing jokes, Jewish culture, religion, the reality of the comedy business, and their comedic inspirations. This unpretentious hang delivers a blend of funny anecdotes, honest reflections about the craft of comedy, and sharp insights—sprinkled with riffs on religion, conspiracy theories, and the unique quirks of fellow comics.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Nature of the Podcast and Comedy Conversations

• Dan admits his podcast doesn’t have a formal concept, focusing instead on honest, organic conversations with comics he likes:

  “Why I like doing this show is because I get to hang out with comics that I like. And then I just hope the people that like me like them.” (03:40)

• They discuss the "illusion" of stand-up—a patchwork act made to seem effortless:

  "You have no idea how patched together this is." (02:57, Dan Soder)

2. Comedy Inspirations and Preferences

• The duo debates their comedic roots:
  • Dan’s sense of humor is rooted in Mel Brooks (“My sense of humor is based on Mel Brooks…” 06:07)
  • Raanan credits Woody Allen (“I relate more to Woody Allen... I actually got into comedy because of Woody Allen.” 06:41)
• Preference for Mel Brooks' warmth and collaborative spirit over others:

  “His comedy… It's based on love.” (07:05, Dan Soder) “Oh yeah. And there's joy and fun…” (07:17, Raanan Hershberg)

3. Influence and Tragedy in Comedy

• Richard Pryor as a case study in comedy from trauma, with nods to his tough childhood and the alchemy of pain into humor:

  “Prior was like the absolute, to me, example of the alchemy of, like, turning absolute into funny stuff.” (08:25, Dan Soder)

4. On Joke Writing, 'Junkyarding', and Evolution

• The process of recycling bits:

  “You can take a line from a bit that worked, but the bit didn't work…put it in another joke… It's like a spark plug.” (02:37, Dan Soder)

• Discussion of how comedic personas and hours are constructed, not innately developed.

5. The Myth of the 'Real Artist' in Stand-up

• Dissecting the belief that some comics are naturally funny while others are architects—“funny vs. mathematicians”:

  “70% of comics are actually funny. And 30% of them are like mathematicians…” (04:39, Dan Soder)

6. Legacy & Resilience: George Carlin and Others

• Reflecting on George Carlin’s career, public perception of “washed up,” and comeback spirit inspired by critical mockery:

  “It shows Bill Burr and he's like, yeah, me and my friends…thought we were gonna go watch a washed up dude... he comes out and he's a fucking howitzer.” (12:21, Dan Soder)

• Bill Burr’s advice on writing new material:

  "It should be at least two to three years because you’re a different person…“ (10:39, Dan Soder)

7. Hunter S. Thompson, Gonzo Journalism & Substance Myths

• They dive into Hunter S. Thompson’s work, debunking the idea that drugs made him a great writer (“His drug addict kept him from being a [great writer].” 14:29, Raanan Hershberg).
• Discussion of gonzo journalism, the Kentucky Derby piece, Thompson’s relationship with Ralph Steadman and eccentric lifestyle.

8. Conspiracy Theories and Social Commentary

• They riff on conspiracy thinking, especially antisemitic tropes:

  “Conspiracy theories…eventually...you throw in Jews at the end to finish it off. You know, it’s like a glue that holds together conspiracy theories.” (28:11, Raanan Hershberg)

• Joking about “Jewish self-control” and why Jews don’t have drinking problems (28:57–29:25).

9. Jewish Culture, Shame, and Sexuality

• Deep dive into differences between Jewish and Christian—especially Catholic—guilt and attitudes toward sex:

  “Because we don’t have shame attached to sex like you guys do.” (31:02, via Louis Katz from Dan) “With original sin and Christianity, you’re guilty with your thoughts. In Judaism, you’re not guilty with your thoughts... it's actually about the deeds.” (31:24, Raanan Hershberg)

• Raanan explains living kosher and breaking it, describing the psychological impact (chicken and guilt: 41:37–43:44).

10. Organized Religion & Commitment

• Dan and Raanan analyze organized religion’s oddities, unity in delusion, and pragmatic origins for certain religious laws (e.g., pork prohibitions due to health).
• Comparative glance at Judaism, Christianity, and Islam (“Muslims…acknowledge other messiahs” 40:38–40:41).

11. Comedy Industry Realities

• Discussion of fake comics, “party promoters,” and the dilution of stand-up as “art,” listing MTV VJ types, etc.

  “We inherited everybody. That should have been an MTV vj. Should have been a dj, should have been a party promoter.” (60:22, Dan Soder)

• Lamenting that some successful comedians don’t actually love comedy.

12. Reflections on Comedy Fame, People-Pleasing, and Crowd Dynamics

• Disputing whether celebrity always trumps material:

  “Madonna at the Cellar, she bombed. First five minutes…” (54:43, Dan Soder)

• People-pleasing as a comic, and learning to value your own standards:

  “I think that’s why my standup was weak until my HBO special – I was such a people pleaser…” (58:28, Dan Soder)

13. Honoring Genuine Talent

• Both comics champion “real comedy” and bemoan industry phoniness while big-upping each other’s craft:

  “He’s a great comic… He’s not one of them [bad comics].” (65:04, Dan Soder on Raanan)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the illusion of stand-up:

  “The illusion is, I'm just talking. We're just having a conversation.” (03:02, Dan Soder)

• On Mel Brooks and Woody Allen:

  “I would so much rather be that person [Mel Brooks]. He’s such a better person.” (06:51, Raanan Hershberg)

• On Richard Pryor’s trauma:

  “This guy had the worst childhood I’ve ever heard… Prior was like the absolute… example of the alchemy of, like, turning absolute into funny stuff.” (08:07–08:25, Dan Soder)

• On Jewish vs. Christian shame:

  "We don't have shame attached to sex like you guys do… With original sin and Christianity, you’re guilty with your thoughts. In Judaism, you’re not guilty with your thoughts." (31:02–31:24, via Louis Katz & Raanan)

• On “junkyarding” material:

  “When you junkyard a joke, you can take a line from a bit that worked… It’s like a spark plug." (02:37, Dan Soder)

• On comics who are mathematicians:

  “70% of comics are actually funny. And 30%... are like mathematicians.” (04:39, Dan Soder)

• On antisemitism in conspiracy theories:

  “Eventually… you throw in Jews at the end to finish it off.” (28:11, Raanan Hershberg)

• On the fake-out of mean comics:

  “One of my pet peeves is when someone says something mean and it doesn’t get a reaction… so they go, 'I was just joking.' But you weren’t.” (62:48–63:02, Dan Soder)

• On self-acceptance in comedy:

  “If you don’t like it, move down the bar and have a beer. I’m not one of these people that’s like, you… what you like.” (66:32, Dan Soder)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• [02:37] On junkyarding jokes and the illusion of seamless stand-up
• [06:07–07:05] Mel Brooks, Woody Allen, and the basis of comedic influence
• [08:07–08:25] Richard Pryor's childhood and comedic transformation
• [10:39] Bill Burr’s philosophy on building an hour
• [12:21] Carlin’s comeback via anger at criticism
• [28:11] Raanan on antisemitic glue in conspiracy theories
• [31:02–31:24] Louis Katz/Raanan on Jewish attitudes toward sex
• [41:37–43:44] Raanan discusses breaking kosher and attached guilt
• [54:43] Madonna’s failed attempt at stand-up; fame vs. joke quality
• [60:22] Dan on "MTV VJ" types and the dilution of comedy
• [65:04] Dan’s appreciation and recommendation for Raanan’s comedy special
• [66:32] Soder’s attitude: If you don’t like it, move down the bar

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Final Thoughts

The episode offers a warm, deeply funny, and genuine look at what it means to create, curate, and live within comedy—mining neuroses, cultural quirks, and industry frustrations for both insight and laughs. Raanan and Dan bounce between big themes (religion, shame, legacy) and small details (who can and can’t eat cheeseburgers), maintaining an open, inviting tone all the while.

Highlight: Raanan’s special “Morbidly Jewish” is recommended by Dan Soder and can be found via the link provided in the video bio.

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For listeners craving a real, inside look at comedy and its characters—with plenty of laughs and honesty—this episode is a must.

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Sponsored segments and ads (Liberty Mutual, Warby Parker, etc.) have been omitted.

Transcript

[Dan Soder]

Neighbor game.

[Ronan Farrow]

Oh, there's nowhere I wouldn't go to help someone customize and save on car insurance with Liberty Mutual. Even if it means sitting front row at a comedy show. Hey everyone, check out this guy and his bird. What is this your first date? Oh, no. We help people customize and save on car insurance with Liberty Mutual together. We're married. Me to a human, him to a bird. Yeah, the bird looks out of your league. Anyways, get a'@libertymutual.com or with your local agent. Liberty, Liberty, Liberty, Liberty. Want to keep up with everything trendy? From breaking news to shareable jokes, pop

[Dan Soder]

culture bites to viral food spots.

[Ronan Farrow]

It's all on TikTok.

[Dan Soder]

Download TikTok now to explore. Hey everybody. The golden Retriever of comedy tour might be closed, but I'm still on the road. I'm still a stand up comedian. We're taping the special in June. I got a couple shows that I'm going to be running through to, you know, get it nice and nice in there. Nice and right where we want it. So come check me out first. I'm going to be at the Omaha Funny Bone May 15th and 16th. Got four shows bringing Brendan Sagalo. That's going to be a blast. May 6, I'm going to be at the Avalon Theater for Netflix. As a joke. We're doing a movie. Watch long. We're watching a a very fun JLO movie. It's already been approved. My guest is a very cool guest.

[Ronan Farrow]

It's Tim Dillon.

[Dan Soder]

May 6th Avalon Theater dance order dot com. May 15th and 16th I'm going to be at the Funny Bone in Omaha, Nebraska. Four shows to really finish tightening that hour before we film it in June. I got Sago coming with me. Four shows. Omaha Funny Bone May 15th and 16th and and then New Jersey Performing Arts Center. I'm going to be there June 5th, Friday, June 5th. It's the last time I'm running this hour before I tape it. Go get tickets@dan soder.com I'm very excited about that. Also, little surprise shows in June, June 1st and 2nd. If you live in Key West, Florida, go buy tickets because I'm coming down to Key west on Monday, Tuesday. It's random but it'll be Fun as hell. Danceoder.com I'm gonna make sure those are up on dancer.com too. Just go dancer.com for a link. See at Netflix is a joke. I'll see you at Omaha and I'll see you in New Jersey. I like junkyarding jokes because when you Junkyard. A joke. You can take a line from a bit that worked, but the bit didn't work. Yeah, but the line worked.

[Ronan Farrow]

Right.

[Dan Soder]

And then you take it out and you put it in another joke that works, and you go like, whoa. It's like a spark plug.

[Ronan Farrow]

It's all a junkyard. Every hour was just like, Yeah. A couple survivors of a platoon strung together.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah. You know what's funny is the illusion

[Ronan Farrow]

that this is what you always intended it to be.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah.

[Ronan Farrow]

Even though there's so much, like, things that didn't work. Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

You have no idea how many. How patched together this is.

[Ronan Farrow]

That's the illusion. Right. It's like. It's like. It doesn't look well.

[Dan Soder]

The illusion is. We're. I'm just talking.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

We're just having a conversation.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Like, I was saying that about Ali Sadiq. That's, like, one of my favorite things about him.

[Ronan Farrow]

He is.

[Dan Soder]

He's like a guy where you go, those jokes, look.

[Ronan Farrow]

He's got that black hypnotism.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah. It's just. You know what it is? That's just like. I've seen white dudes that have it, too. White dudes. Giannis has that. Giannis can like talking. He's doing bits. But you're like, we on, by the way? Yeah, we've been on.

[Ronan Farrow]

We've been on. Okay.

[Dan Soder]

All right.

[Ronan Farrow]

No, cool. I just. I forget the. Yeah. The old merits, like, recording, you know, I feel like they're not doing that

[Dan Soder]

as much anymore, which is rolling.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

I. Here's the deal. I don't have a premise for my podcast, and I also. Why I like doing this show is because I get to hang out with comics that I like.

[Ronan Farrow]

That's how I.

[Dan Soder]

And then I just hope the people that like me like them.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

That's all this.

[Ronan Farrow]

Just wanted to see people.

[Dan Soder]

That's all this is. Yeah, it really is. It is like a playdate. I love podcasts. Yeah, it's a podcast playdate.

[Ronan Farrow]

I love doing podcasts where they try to explain to you the premise. But it's just. Every podcast, but they try to set up, like. So with this, you can just. We'll just talk, and you can just take it wherever you want.

[Dan Soder]

Just.

[Ronan Farrow]

Just, you know, it's just a conversation. Just go wherever.

[Dan Soder]

And you go, that's a podcast.

[Ronan Farrow]

That's a podcast. That's not a theme.

[Dan Soder]

Oh, we just want to make it, like a hang.

[Ronan Farrow]

And just, like, if there's a joke and you want to, like, commit to that joke, just do that. And if you want to riff.

[Dan Soder]

That was like morning radio. Bob and Tom used to do that where they'd go, bring in five of your bits and we'll lead you into it. And you go, I'm just funny. Yeah, yeah, we can, I can just.

[Ronan Farrow]

Funny.

[Dan Soder]

You know, we could just hang out and I'll be funny.

[Ronan Farrow]

But there are some funny comics who aren't funny.

[Dan Soder]

You know, I would, I would say it is 70, 30, 70, like, funny. 70% of comics are actually funny. And 30% of them are like mathematicians, math.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah, yeah.

[Dan Soder]

And they just learn.

[Ronan Farrow]

It's like autism. Yeah, yeah, but. And they're like very serious. But I mean, you could be a great comedian. I, I saw an interview with Woody Allen where he's like, people meet me and, and, and they think I'm funny, but I'm actually miserable.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah, yeah. You know what's funny? I've seen Woody Allen movies. I understand people think he's a genius.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

I don't get, I've never, I've never been a big fan and I don't

[Ronan Farrow]

okay to say now.

[Dan Soder]

Well, no, that's what.

[Ronan Farrow]

Back in the day, I would have shamed you, but I can't do that anymore. Back in the day, I'd be like, you don't know comedy.

[Dan Soder]

Tell you what. It's, it's like I, I, I feel like a drunk that got through a car accident. I went, I'm okay, I'm okay.

[Ronan Farrow]

Back in the day, I would have been, you don't know comedy. You're anti Semitic.

[Dan Soder]

You don't see my argument.

[Ronan Farrow]

Now I got to be like, me neither.

[Dan Soder]

You go, what a monster. But my thing is, is it just missed me.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Like Zeppelin. Zeppelin missed me.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

I got into my 30s, I listened to the, or my late 20s, my early 30s, I listened to Zeppelin and I was like, oh, it's really good. Like Woody Allen. I listen to a stand up. Very funny. Stand up's very funny.

[Ronan Farrow]

Incredible. Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

I'm a Mel Brooks guy. I grew up with Mel Brooks.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

My sense of humor is based on Mel Brooks is like that. When I just watched the Judd Apatow documentary.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

I was like, it was, I was like hoop hooting and hollering at the TV because it got me so excited.

[Ronan Farrow]

Think about Mel Brooks. I love Mel Brooks too. And there's a great interview with Mel Brooks where they ask him if he's friends with Woody Allen and he goes, no, nobody's friends with that guy.

[Dan Soder]

See, that's what I mean. Like the fact that everything I Watch about Mel Brooks. I go, I feel like. I feel there's a part of me that goes, oh, I'm disingenuous. I. Lot of my personality is just Mel Brooks.

[Ronan Farrow]

Well, he is also just I. In my heart. I relate more to Woody Allen as a. Like, he got you. I'm actually got into comedy because of Woody Allen.

[Dan Soder]

Okay. And I got into comedy because of Mel Brooks.

[Ronan Farrow]

Right. But Mel Brooks is also someone like. I would so much rather be that person. He's such a better person.

[Dan Soder]

I always liked his comedy because there was. And they say this in the documentary, and it finally, like, they put words to it. It's based on love.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yes.

[Dan Soder]

And it's like, there's a lot collaborative. It's just very loving. It's like he talks about people and he Fun of people, but, you know, the base level is like, I really always enjoyed the warmth of Mel Brooks.

[Ronan Farrow]

Oh, yeah. And there's joy and fun and. And.

[Dan Soder]

And also when I read Richard Prior's autobiography and he talked about writing that

[Ronan Farrow]

and how he wrote for. What's it called? The Big.

[Dan Soder]

The Big Blazing Saddles.

[Ronan Farrow]

But he wrote specifically on Blazing Saddles for that. He loved writing for the manga. Yeah, yeah. He's the one who wrote. Yeah. Manga. He wrote that. You think he's writing like the. The l. You know, that was Mel Brooks in the documentary.

[Dan Soder]

In the documentary, they even. They. Mel said that he goes. Richard was very enamored with.

[Ronan Farrow]

I think he connected the sadness because Richard Pryor, there's such a sadness with.

[Dan Soder]

I mean, you read that biography and you're like, this guy had the worst childhood I've ever heard. His. His first memory of making people laugh is slipping in. In his front yard. And he just did it again because they laughed.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Oh, it's so you go, oh, there's the hardwiring.

[Ronan Farrow]

There is. Well, it's in his act, too. I mean, there.

[Dan Soder]

He walked in on his mom blowing a local politician. His mom was a grandma, ran a whorehouse.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah, I know that. Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

And his dad was like, you know, like her and like. But it wasn't like he should have

[Ronan Farrow]

been like, well, you lost my vote, sir.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah, I won't vote for you, sir. No. But Prior was like the absolute to me example of the alchemy of, like, turning absolute into funny stuff.

[Ronan Farrow]

Oh, yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Because he was just so.

[Ronan Farrow]

He's the best community of all time, in my opinion.

[Dan Soder]

I. The only reason I would put Chappelle about above him is because Chappelle has had more hours of proof. I Think Richard Pryor show and Chappelle show or even I think live in concert, 1978 and killing him Softly or

[Ronan Farrow]

even now, I think Live in Concert to me is bad. I mean, obviously kill him Softly is great.

[Dan Soder]

I don't know, man starts and doesn't stop.

[Ronan Farrow]

It's true. They're both like two. They're both like top five.

[Dan Soder]

But live and Live in Concert has moments where he dials it in and you go, this is the greatest thing. The story of his dad having a heart attack and at the same time is like one of my favorite bits.

[Ronan Farrow]

It's also like, oh, can I really quickly do promote my special?

[Dan Soder]

Sorry, Yeah, I mean, we're gonna put the link in here.

[Ronan Farrow]

Okay. All right, well, never mind. I feel like an.

[Dan Soder]

No. If you go watch Ron on special, it's morbidly Jewish. Morbidly Jewish. If you can't tell he's Jewish, he is Jewish. He's morbidly Jewish.

[Ronan Farrow]

All right. Sorry.

[Dan Soder]

But no, dude, the whole. Yeah, the link.

[Ronan Farrow]

Okay, good. Yeah, I just always. I get it. Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

I don't do intros.

[Ronan Farrow]

I go on like, you know, some radio show to promote my special and then I'm talking about dildos and I'm like, I never brought it up.

[Dan Soder]

There's no need. Yeah, well, absolutely. And I'll do it at the end too. I'll really make sure if they stay to the end, I'm really gonna promo the out of your special.

[Ronan Farrow]

But yeah, I mean, Live in Concert, when you watch it, you're like, I don't even know this. It like transcends stand up. It's like a one man show in a way. It's like some of it's just like pure physicality. It's wild.

[Dan Soder]

Comes out with the lights still on. Surprises everyone.

[Ronan Farrow]

Which is.

[Dan Soder]

Which everyone thought Louie did first. Yeah, but you're like, no, that's a Richard Pryor move number two.

[Ronan Farrow]

Everyone thought Louie did first. That should be the name of like a lot of our era. He writing an hour once a year. George Carlin never did that.

[Dan Soder]

Did Carlin do it once a year? I'm pretty sure because I know that's a. That's some British. That's like Edinburgh.

[Ronan Farrow]

They do it once a year and have a theme.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah. And they have it all connect, which is crazy.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Maybe work on it two years.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah. It's always my advice, formula. Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

But Burr Burr had a great quote where he said it should be at least two to three years because you're a different person. You like grow Enough in three years that you're a different person.

[Ronan Farrow]

It's true. But I guess I. I've been doing once a year, but really, I got nothing else going on but, like.

[Dan Soder]

Well, that's not true, because you write and you do a lot of other stuff, but what you do once a

[Ronan Farrow]

year, you have an hour, a little a year. And Shane, I'm the first person to do that.

[Dan Soder]

By the way, Ronan did it first. Oh, yeah. Carlin did 10. I know he did 10. HBO. Well, he did 14. Some of these must be albums. Oh, these are HBO Specials. He did 14. HBO.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah, I think it was once a year. I think maybe. Yeah, yeah.

[Dan Soder]

The. The Life Is Worth Losing one is the. The second to last one. That was the one.

[Ronan Farrow]

The ones where he starts rhyming, you're like, maybe it's time to retire.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah.

[Ronan Farrow]

The one when he comes out as doctor Suits.

[Dan Soder]

Did you watch that documentary about him?

[Ronan Farrow]

I did it.

[Dan Soder]

I'm going to tell you right now, all you need to watch as a comedian is the last 15 minutes of ep, of the first episode.

[Ronan Farrow]

Really?

[Dan Soder]

There's two episodes. And the whole first episode is about his early life growing up in Harlem, him being in the armed services, him kind of finding his way. He starts doing comedy, silly. And then it goes through his first big push of hippie, dippy, weatherman.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah, yeah.

[Dan Soder]

And all the fucking things. And then it gets to the 70s and it ends with everyone's on him for rhyming. And they're like. They show SEC tv, make fun of him. Oh, really? Where he's like. He's like, I've heard of green beans. Why can't there be red beans?

[Ronan Farrow]

Oh, but that's. That's like, yeah, yeah, yeah. Never see blue and blue. Why is blueberries blue? Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

And it's Rick Moranis doing a really funny impression of bearded.

[Ronan Farrow]

No, I don't want browns and ham. No, I don't want.

[Dan Soder]

It's exactly it. And then it shows. It's. Cheech and Chong are talking about it, and she has a quote where he goes, man, George Carlin. No one gives a. About him. And they start. I'll give credit to Apatow on this. The way he directed it is great because it starts doing that thing where it shows a criticism, shows another one, and then starts doing that thing where it goes fast, where it's like, yeah, you see all the criticisms. And then it cuts to George Carlin's Notebook, and he's like, I'm going to prove all of them wrong. Like, I'm going to show them what's up. And it's like a ramp up. It shows Bill Burr and he's like interviewing Bill Burdy. He's like, yeah, me and my friends went to go see him at the 80s and we thought we were going to go watch a washed up dude. We were like going to make fun of him. And then he comes out and he's a fucking howitzer. Just like that. And it's like, dude, that part like

[Ronan Farrow]

the anger from getting attacked.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah.

[Ronan Farrow]

That made him too angry to rhyme anymore.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah. He was like, I don't care if the words connect, but I watched that in a hotel room and I was ready to run through a wall.

[Ronan Farrow]

That's.

[Dan Soder]

I watched it like after a Thursday night show at a club and I was like, it's fucking incredible.

[Ronan Farrow]

People always like, people become legends and then you think their whole career was like, just on the top and it's just not true. There's so many moments where people are like, he's done.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah.

[Ronan Farrow]

So many moments where people are like, Steven Spielberg's done.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah.

[Ronan Farrow]

Or like, whatever.

[Dan Soder]

You know, the Spielberg thing, when he did Schindler's List, everyone was like, what the are you doing? You make feel good movies.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah, exactly.

[Dan Soder]

He's like, well, I'm a Jew and I want to make a movie about the Holocaust.

[Ronan Farrow]

They're like, all right, fine.

[Dan Soder]

But they were also like, I don't think people are gonna like it. Yeah, it's like one of the greatest movies of all time. And if it's just like an incredible movie and that there is. There's everything.

[Ronan Farrow]

Every writer Hemingway, like, was it drug washed out at time? It's like, it's like. But then when you look back, you're like, oh, they're a legend the whole time, you know?

[Dan Soder]

Well, that was my thing with, you know, I kind of a hacky thing. But I really liked Hunter S. Thompson when I got to college, but I liked his writing.

[Ronan Farrow]

Why is that hacky?

[Dan Soder]

Because it was hacky. Because the other people that liked Hunter S. Thompson liked him because he was a drug addict.

[Ronan Farrow]

Oh, no, no. His drug addict kept him from being a.

[Dan Soder]

That's what sucks. And like Doug Douglas Brinkley, who used to run his, like.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

He, like, I think is like the executive of his literal literary estate or something. I used to. I used to be super into Hunter S. Thompson's writing.

[Ronan Farrow]

Great. From my hometown.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah. Louisville, Kentucky, I think. Ashes, Clay.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yep. I think Fear and Loathing Las Vegas is like one of the top five funniest books of all time. And he has a lot of other great.

[Dan Soder]

I would say his best book is Fear and Loathing on the campaign trail

[Ronan Farrow]

in 1972, when he has an acid flashback during. He's, like, riding about. He's, like, on the plane, doing journalism for the president. He's like, oh, what am I asking?

[Dan Soder]

Flashbacks. I think that's the best book about modern American politics.

[Ronan Farrow]

I did love that book.

[Dan Soder]

It's phenomenal. And if you read it around an election cycle, it holds up in a very spooky way.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Because he says basically, like, if you want to get elected in this country, you got to bash the other guy and be unapologetic and be unethical. And he's like.

[Ronan Farrow]

Because there was the other guy who got. They. Who was, like, actually a really good politician, but they found out he had mental.

[Dan Soder]

It was McGovern's first pick for vice president. He was, I think, the governor of South Dakota. And it had been proven that he had been institutionalized. And that electric shock therapy. And it ruined it.

[Ronan Farrow]

And it was, like, legitimately good. Like a legitimately good.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah. He had, like. He had the. He was aligned with McGovern on a lot of his policies, and they were running it. But the thing about Hunter S. Thompson is. Is he starts doing cocaine in the 80s.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

And his writing goes to.

[Ronan Farrow]

I know. The drug thing. It's the opposite of what people think.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah. He was bumped up on drugs. And you're like, no, man. This is a guy that, when he was a kid, would read on his typewriter, type out Hemingway.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

To hear the rhythm of the keys.

[Ronan Farrow]

And you're like, that's a guy I. I've always loved. Like, there's just something about his sentences. When I read them, I just get excited. There's just something so cool.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah.

[Ronan Farrow]

The way he writes. I don't know. It's hard to explain.

[Dan Soder]

But I would say for anybody that hasn't read that, if you don't want to read Fear and Loathing Las Vegas or on the campaign trail, Hell's Angels is great, But I would say look up the book Generation of Swine, because it's. He's on cocaine in some of it, but it's. He's still got his fastball.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

So he's, like, writing a lot of stuff. He writes about Reagan a lot in it.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

And you're like, oh, this guy.

[Ronan Farrow]

I think I've read that one.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah. It's great. It's right there. It's right behind you. It's the yellow Backed one.

[Ronan Farrow]

I. I don't know why, but I just love the way he uses the amber sand.

[Dan Soder]

You know, he smashes an amper.

[Ronan Farrow]

He really just.

[Dan Soder]

He loves it.

[Ronan Farrow]

I just love it. Every time he had it, I'm like, it's so cool. But I also feel like Andy is for squares.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah. Yeah. He's like, why would I use a fucking.

[Ronan Farrow]

Like a.

[Dan Soder]

Well, his thing was always. He said, F. Scott Fitzgerald wrote the perfect book in the Great Gatsby. Yeah. Because it's so concise and it's so short.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

So he was, like, struggling to get Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas down to the shortest he could. Because he wanted it to be as concise as the Great Gatsby.

[Ronan Farrow]

Wow. Yeah. No, I mean, it's. It's a fucking amazing book and it's so funny.

[Dan Soder]

But then when Hunter S. Thompson's talks about. They're like, you know, he had a suitcase full of drugs and it's like. Yeah. You should also look into more how fascinating the character, the person Oscar Acosta was.

[Ronan Farrow]

Oh, that lawyer.

[Dan Soder]

It was the lawyer.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

He was a Chicano lawyer from la. That was like, in these streets. Yeah, like, he was in these streets. Like, the street gangs, the. The Latin street gangs were, like, down with him. He was a lawyer. He'd get these guys out of jail and shit.

[Ronan Farrow]

I just.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah, and he was scary.

[Ronan Farrow]

He was amazing.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah, he was like a. He called him the big brown Buffalo. He's like, fucking scary, dude.

[Ronan Farrow]

I just remember there's one line that I've always loved in it where they go to, like, a drug conference. It's like some kind of police. And he's like, that was.

[Dan Soder]

That was fair. That was in Las Vegas.

[Ronan Farrow]

And he's like. We felt like we have the, like, drug. Like, the junkies or whatever should have a voice in this meeting or something. I forget the line, but it was so. It's such a good.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah, that was this. Because the first part of Fear and Loathing Las Vegas was him going to cover the Mint motorcycle race, like the 400 for sports. Illustrate.

[Ronan Farrow]

Right.

[Dan Soder]

They hired him, and then it just became a disaster.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Because he went to Vegas to do a bunch of drugs. And then when he sent it into Jan Wenner at Rolling Stone, Jan Wenner was like, this is unbelievable.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

And he would just, like, fax him. You just fax him.

[Ronan Farrow]

It feels like notes. Like, it's concise, but it feels like you're reading notes and there's such a. It's just very present.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah.

[Ronan Farrow]

Like it just feels so real.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah.

[Ronan Farrow]

And it's, it is, it is one of the funniest books of all time because it is both really funny, but also just like, you know, it's happening.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah.

[Ronan Farrow]

And he's not being.

[Dan Soder]

Guys, Mother's Day is on the way. What do I mean by that? I mean you gotta get your mom something. I got my mom and I do mean this. I got her an aura frame and she loves it. You update it with digital photos right from your phone. You can, you know, you take a new picture of the baby or new picture of the house, something you want to send to your mom, boom, put it on her. It's just a way that you could reach out and show somebody a picture without texting them or bullying them into looking at your phone. You can just update your aura frame for, you know what a gift. Give them the gift of new pictures and photos of a. Also got unlimited storage, which is huge because people are like, well, how many photos you got? Guess what? Unlimited. Unlimited storage. You can personalize your gift and they have gift block a gift box which includes packaged in a premium gift box with no price tag. So when they get it, they're not like, oh, this is what you think of your mother on Mother's Day. It's named number one by wirecutter. And you can save on gifts moms love by visiting auraframes.com for a limited time list. Listeners can get 25 off their best selling Carver mat frame with code soder. That's a U R A frames.com promo. Code Soder A U R A frames.com promo code soda. Support the show by mentioning us at checkout. Terms and conditions apply. Warby Parker is so nice and cool. Back in the day before I got my LASIK surgery, which by the way, I will be returning to glasses. I understand that when you get glasses you're like, where the hell do I go? Where do I get caught up? I'm telling you, man, I. These are one of those things where this is a sponsor now, but it's a sponsor because I actually used it. When I used to wear glasses, I would go to Warby Parker. They have first off checkups in the store and then you just go to the front of the store and you can pick up, you can pick the frames that your new glasses are going to be. So it's every there. Everything you need right there, including also if you want contacts. But like I said, eye exams, sunglasses that are prescription huge all in one place, which makes everything a lot easier. Maybe the best part of Warby Parker, for every pair they sell, they also give a pair to someone in need. That's kind of nice. With all the greed that's going on in the world, it's like, hey, thank you for giving someone that can't see free glasses. Probably a big gift. Right now, buy one prescription pair. There we go. And get 20% off any additional prescription pairs. They really are like, hey, say prescription. We know you kind of have a tough one, but it's true. Right now, buy one prescription pair. Get 20 off any additional prescription [e-mail] Sodor that's 20% off additional prescription pairs. When you go to W A r b y parker.com Sodor Warby parker.com soda of course, here's the thing about Hunter S. Thompson that I think got misconstrued to younger generations. He's not being an asshole to be an. No, he's being himself and almost wedging himself into places and going, this is just who I am.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

So I'm gonna do weird shit to you. But he wasn't going out of his way to, like, attack people.

[Ronan Farrow]

No.

[Dan Soder]

He was just with them. If they came into his proxy, if he just came around him and he.

[Ronan Farrow]

I mean, it's making fun of himself. He's kind of like a clown quite a bit.

[Dan Soder]

Well, he's like, I'm an idio. Know I ate all my cantaloupe.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Or grapefruit.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

And if. I mean, if you go read his first gonzo. I mean, Hell's Angels could be argued as his first gonzo.

[Ronan Farrow]

Well, the thing about the Kentucky Derby.

[Dan Soder]

That's the first one. Fear and Loathing at the Kentucky.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah. Which was where he discovered his style, basically.

[Dan Soder]

Well, and the first time he worked with Ralph Steadman.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah. And he's so amazing. Just a British guy that's like, what in the is this? And he's like talking about. And you know, because you're from Louisville, he's like, oh, everyone thinks the Kentucky Derby is this high society thing. And he's like, bunch of animals. Bunch of animals. That's what he wanted to show. And the way that Ralph drew it, forget if it was for Harper's Bazaar, I forget which magazine it was for that he wrote that. But you see the original illustrations. And he nails it. He nails. What I like about Ralph Steadman is he nails the. The monstrosity of very wealthy people.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yes.

[Dan Soder]

He really nails the, like.

[Ronan Farrow]

Oh, he's incredible. He reminds me, like, you see, like, Weimar Art. Like German art. Like, where it's so grotesque. Yes. And just like all the decadence and people' faces. Yeah. He's just. He's what, Ralph Steadman? Yeah, he's one of my all time favorites.

[Dan Soder]

And if you watch that documentary and hearing him talk about like meeting Hunter and like. Yeah. Because Hunter has. Thompson just wanted to shoot guns.

[Ronan Farrow]

He's a big gun guy.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah. And they brought it up. There's a New York Times article that just came out about was his suicide. Like, you know, I read the article. I got sent it because my friends know I'm really into Hunter S. Thompson and my friend Vic and my friend Jason sent it to me and they were like, have you read this? And I read it and I stopped midway through because I was like, you can't trust any piece of media now.

[Ronan Farrow]

Well, what was it saying? I don't know.

[Dan Soder]

It was basically saying that his wife, his second wife, Anita, didn't really trust that it was suicide. But his son was going like I did himself.

[Ronan Farrow]

Of course he loves Hemingway and also agreed.

[Dan Soder]

He also talked about it.

[Ronan Farrow]

It's an homage to Hemingway.

[Dan Soder]

He talked about it a lot. That the reason I. The reason I put down the article and was not interested in it, it was because of his suicide letter. That was the most. Hunter S. Thompson thing.

[Ronan Farrow]

Of course this is going to hurt or something.

[Dan Soder]

The football season is over.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah. Yeah, yeah. And no more. No more.

[Dan Soder]

No more pain.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Because he said that that was the most. That was when. After the super bowl was when he was always the most depressed.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Because he didn't have football. Because he loved football. And what I loved about Hunter S. Thompson was he. He was a 49ers fan. Yeah. Because of his time in San Francisco. And then he liked the Denver Broncos because of his time in Aspen at Woody Creek.

[Ronan Farrow]

Nice.

[Dan Soder]

And he was a gambler, but in a real way.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

He wasn't an app gambler. Yeah. He was a. I'm gonna put money down. I need the rush.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

I need to. I need skin on the game. That kind of. Which I respect.

[Ronan Farrow]

He definitely killed himself. Yeah. Because it's like, it's like.

[Dan Soder]

But I started reading it and they were like, talk about his ex wife trying to get this weed strain approved and like how she still lives in Woody Creek and she'll rent it out to Airbnb. And I was kind of like, what

[Ronan Farrow]

are they trying to be like a. What do you mean? Like a weed conspiracy?

[Dan Soder]

No, they're trying. I. It just sounded like she was trying to Drum up business.

[Ronan Farrow]

Oh, yeah.

[Dan Soder]

With his name on it. Yeah, yeah. Which is like when his son is like, dude, my dad killed himself.

[Ronan Farrow]

Why do they. They always have side conspiracies about people where it makes 100. Like Kurt Cobain. Yes. They're like, maybe it wasn't. Sounds like every song's like a suicide. He's like, I'm gonna kill myself.

[Dan Soder]

I'm gonna do it with the shotgun.

[Ronan Farrow]

Oh, man. I think it was. I think it was Courtney or whatever. Love.

[Dan Soder]

The only time conspiracies I think are right. And this is because of Big J on the bonfire. He thinks the yourself on a doorknob is auto erotic asphyxiation. And they up.

[Ronan Farrow]

You think that's what was doing in prison?

[Dan Soder]

No, I think he was murdered by the government. I think he could go either way.

[Ronan Farrow]

Which is the most. The most. I've gone to a conspiracy theory because I'm very against it.

[Dan Soder]

He might have been.

[Ronan Farrow]

I still.

[Dan Soder]

No, no.

[Ronan Farrow]

I think he could have commits.

[Dan Soder]

I'll tell you right now, he definitely

[Ronan Farrow]

wasn't happy in that situation.

[Dan Soder]

No. He also had a lot of information.

[Ronan Farrow]

He did have a lot of information.

[Dan Soder]

That's the point where you go.

[Ronan Farrow]

It really can go both ways. I see. I could see him getting murdered, though. I don't believe. I just don't believe anyone has the competence to do it and get away with it. I certainly don't believe Trump.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah.

[Ronan Farrow]

Can do it and not like, talk about it in a tweet.

[Dan Soder]

Oh, he would Epstein today. He would bring it up in a way for as a brag.

[Ronan Farrow]

What I just put on True Social. I didn't know it'd be leaning against

[Dan Soder]

the frame of Air Force One. And you go, well, I killed Jeffrey Epstein. You didn't care about that. You're like. You can't say that. He. Epstein would. To me, it would make sense that he himself, because of the loss of power. Because a guy. Yeah. That guy like that. That's all of his, like, control.

[Ronan Farrow]

I would kill myself if I was in his situation. Then, like, I don't know, man.

[Dan Soder]

Because I like the idea of just blowing people's up. I'm just being like, I'm gonna rock your shoe.

[Ronan Farrow]

But if you're like a narcissist and the whole world hates you and you're about to have like, judgment.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah.

[Ronan Farrow]

Like, that is definitely an option in

[Dan Soder]

that, you know, 100%.

[Ronan Farrow]

I mean, that's the thing. I just think like, I feel like, like. But murder it could possibly be. I still think even that I Still think, like, it's probably suicide. I guess I just think incompetence really destroys most conspiracy theories.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah.

[Ronan Farrow]

You know, and so it's just 911

[Dan Soder]

being an inside job. There's no way that it would.

[Ronan Farrow]

You can't complete a full sentence, but he can complete 9 11.

[Dan Soder]

The only way I can see it being, the only reason I can see conspiracy theories working is if they, like, don't tell Bush. If it's like one of those things, like what they've been doing with like alien technology.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah, yeah. Where they go implausible deniability.

[Dan Soder]

People don't even know.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Like how like the government has parts of the government that the government doesn't even know about. But, you know, it goes like, we control all the technology, that foreign alien, you know.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah. Because Trump would bring it up, I guess.

[Dan Soder]

Yes.

[Ronan Farrow]

Maybe they hit it Clinton. Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

So they're all narcissists.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Dan Soder]

To be a president, you have to love yourself.

[Ronan Farrow]

But my issue is conspiracy theories is that eventually you try to get there and you can't make it sense all the way, so you throw in Jews at the end to finish it off. You know, it's like a glue that holds together conspiracy theories.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah. You guys are. You guys really are like the slapstick.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

For, you know, like.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah, we're the, the cement.

[Dan Soder]

Or the way he puts it on and goes, stop. Fle. Just choose. Yeah.

[Ronan Farrow]

Like, yeah. It holds it all together because you're like, like, well, what about this? Is it like, well, that doesn't make sense to Jews.

[Dan Soder]

So you're like, ah, I. I see in a world where I'm under educated and not into comedy, where I believe that a lot more because it always blew my mind when I was younger that I didn't see a lot of Jewish families with drinking problems. That was one of the first conspiracy theory that I noticed.

[Ronan Farrow]

Just, we get tired when we drink.

[Dan Soder]

You guys did this thing. All my parents, all my mom's friends that were Jewish would do this thing where they would have two drinks and go, oh, that's, that's enough.

[Ronan Farrow]

It's very accurate.

[Dan Soder]

And all the other boys that we knew were just pounds.

[Ronan Farrow]

I think that's where anti Semitism started. You see, Jews have self control. And you're like, that's what I mean. That's what I mean.

[Dan Soder]

And the self.

[Ronan Farrow]

You're good with money. You have self control.

[Dan Soder]

Don't explain the banks.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Don't explain the thing.

[Ronan Farrow]

You're not. You think you're better than me because you don't get drunk and we lose all your money. You. You Jews. Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

You guys took down the towers.

[Ronan Farrow]

There's truth to that.

[Dan Soder]

I know. I believe it.

[Ronan Farrow]

There is a sense of responsibility. Like. Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

If you think about it, with money, you go, well, I'm gonna save a little.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Dan Soder]

And you go, why are you saving it?

[Ronan Farrow]

Blow it off. The goy is just like throwing the money away. Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Because the thing that I. That I talked to Louis Katz about, that we laughed about, is I always said, my friends that were Jew Jewish were always very horny.

[Ronan Farrow]

Oh, yeah.

[Dan Soder]

And I said, why are you so horny? And Louis Louie Katz is one of my favorite human beings on earth. Yeah.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Because he has this number one. He's a hilarious, great human being, but he has this thing where he isn't a yes man, where if you say something to him and he doesn't agree with it, he goes. He pushes back. He goes, yeah. I don't think that's true.

[Ronan Farrow]

I mean, honest.

[Dan Soder]

Yes. Yes, he's honest. I've been talking shit about people. We've been having dinner, and I've been talking shit about people. And he goes, think that's true? And it'll stop me and go, like, yeah, maybe I'm. I have personal feelings.

[Ronan Farrow]

I don't want to toot my own horn, but I feel like I kind of similar and have people not like me because of that. Even if someone says a movie they like, like that I like, that's even. That'll bring.

[Dan Soder]

That's where I tell you. I go, all right.

[Ronan Farrow]

But I choose. I choose honesty.

[Dan Soder]

You're getting a real conspiracy theory on this.

[Ronan Farrow]

I choose honesty over people liking me.

[Dan Soder]

I admire that. I admire that in a way that, as a people pleaser, I admire that quality as much as I do people that go to the gym consistently.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

I go, I don't know how the you do that.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

I. I did it for a little bit. And it's very hard. Yeah, it's very hard. But I asked him, I was like, why are all my Jewish friends horny? And he goes, because we don't have shame attached to sex like you guys do. And I was like, very true. When he said that.

[Ronan Farrow]

Very true.

[Dan Soder]

We were at the Sacramento Punchline.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

And it was like a light bulb went off in my head. And I was like, that makes so much.

[Ronan Farrow]

Because with. With original sin and Christianity, you're guilty with your thoughts. Yes. In Judaism, you're not guilty with your thoughts. And Judaism, it's actually about the deeds sure. And to the point where you don't even have to have faith. You just do the deeds and the faith can come later.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah.

[Ronan Farrow]

So we don't have this, like, we don't have the shame. Yeah. I don't have it. I really don't.

[Dan Soder]

It really is insane to me because I, I've always had, I've had. Every nut in my life has had, Shane.

[Ronan Farrow]

Really? Now, are you Catholic?

[Dan Soder]

No, but my mom was.

[Ronan Farrow]

Okay. Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

I was raised Episcopalian, which is English Catholic. Yeah. Which if you don't know, was only created so that the king of England could get divorced.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

That's truly funny. The only reason why he did it was like.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Just gotta get rid of this.

[Ronan Farrow]

Just a religion over. Getting rid of a. Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

And I've always. My friends that are religious, I, I, I know a lot of Catholics. I have very good friends that are Catholic. I respect their faith. If you're Catholic, I totally agree with it. I don't believe in organized religion.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

At all. It doesn't make sense to me. Organization.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

It just feels like a store you're going to buy. It's like going to a store instead of farming. Well, yeah. You're telling me if I, I can only buy lettuce from fairway.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

And that's the, the true lettuce.

[Ronan Farrow]

It's kind of like religion is kind of like a bunch of schizophrenics having an agreed upon delusion.

[Dan Soder]

Yes.

[Ronan Farrow]

Like what? Most schizophrenics are just alone y and they just have their vision. It's like schizophrenics working together.

[Dan Soder]

It's, it's unity and schizophrenia.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

And then they go, this is right. And you're like, but that was written by a man. Yeah.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Because that was the questions I had. My mom was excommunicated from the church because she got no way.

[Ronan Farrow]

Oh, wow. Which is the whole point of the thing was for the divorce.

[Dan Soder]

Well, this. She was Catholic.

[Ronan Farrow]

Oh, Catholic.

[Dan Soder]

She was Irish Catholic, actually.

[Ronan Farrow]

Then that makes sense.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah, it makes sense. Hold on. I'm gonna turn my fan on because it's getting hot in here. Guys. Getting older is tough because you're like, you've got responsibilities. You got people that look for you for reasons you know. And sometimes you need insurance and you're like, where the hell do I go with life insurance? Well, protect your family with life insurance from ethos. You can get up to $3 million in coverage in as little as 10 minutes. All you got to do is go to ethos.comsoder Application times may vary and rates may vary, but go get yourself covered. Takes 10 minutes to get covered today with life insurance through Ethos. Get your free [e-mail] Sodor Again, that's E T H O S.com Soder Application times may vary. Rates may vary. Go get it done. Protect your family. If you love comedy that keeps you guessing, playoff hockey is right up your alley. NHL on TNT has the best coverage and it is just as entertaining as a great stand up set. Paul Bissonnet is hilarious on the panel and Wayne Gretzky breaks down the action like a pro. Every game is intense with overtime and big hits that make every shift matter. Studio coverage adds to the fun, making it the best place to watch. Watch the Stanley cup playoffs on TNT, TBS, TruTV and HBO. Max.

[Ronan Farrow]

And Doug there's nowhere I wouldn't go to help someone customize and save on car insurance with Liberty Mutual. Even if it means sitting front row at a comedy show. Hey everyone, check out this guy and his bird. What is this your first date? Oh no, we help people customize and save on car insurance with Liberty Mutual together. We're married. Me to a human, him to a bird. Yeah, the bird looks out of your league. Anyways, get a'@libertymutual.com or with your local agent. I didn't even know she was sick. She seems so. Wait, what?

[Dan Soder]

First off, I to let everyone know on the podcast I got up to turn on the fan because it's hot in here. Catherine o' Hara died.

[Ronan Farrow]

Hey, Kevin could have waited on that one.

[Dan Soder]

It really is a mood shift. We're just in the middle of talking about religion.

[Ronan Farrow]

I was watching a movie and someone texted me that Robert Williams died in the middle of the movie. I mean, they didn't know I was watching it, but I'm like, like damn, I really shouldn't have looked at my phone.

[Dan Soder]

I was going to Coney island to ride the roller coaster. My friend Joey Owens texted me and he was like, robin Williams killed himself. And I was like, what's up? I was about to get on a roller coaster. Do you know how weird that is to be sad on a roller coaster when they're like, watch your moms and legs.

[Ronan Farrow]

And I go, even at the end, Robin Williams stealing from Richard. Jenny.

[Dan Soder]

Oh, with a gun though. That's what a way he went out.

[Ronan Farrow]

Don't fact check my joke. Richard. What's his name? Richie Redding. Yeah, he's marrying a Jew. I was on stage. I'm like, the Jew on the show last night, he goes up before me, he pulls a full Tim Watley. He talks about he's marrying a Jew. All Jew jokes the whole time.

[Dan Soder]

This is what we were talking about yesterday. All Jew jokes, the Tim Watley thing

[Ronan Farrow]

and the Holocaust jokes. He literally. And they're good. They were good too. He was like, my wife the other day, she was like, yeah, we have a Jew in the oven. I'm like, you're not supposed to say that cuz she's pregnant. I up that joke, but she's pregnant. Whatever. I really.

[Dan Soder]

That joke, that's so funny.

[Ronan Farrow]

Can you edit that? So I say she's pregnant.

[Dan Soder]

Watch Mike's editing skills.

[Ronan Farrow]

Like he's doing Jewish jokes, Holocaust jokes. And I'm like, the Jew on the show. You go, that's my stuff. I'm like, what the.

[Dan Soder]

We were talking about Tim Watley said that. He's like, does it offend you as a Jewish person? No, it offends me.

[Ronan Farrow]

His opening thing. And it was very funny. He's very funny writings to me.

[Dan Soder]

He's the podcast. I love Richie. I love Richie a lot.

[Ronan Farrow]

I'm joking.

[Dan Soder]

But like used to open for Cat Williams.

[Ronan Farrow]

Oh, did he?

[Dan Soder]

Like not a little.

[Ronan Farrow]

I guess now he can do black jokes because he opens for Cat Williams.

[Dan Soder]

You see him once, he's like, I've

[Ronan Farrow]

been telling these motherfuckers these Jews are out here.

[Dan Soder]

He's doing Cat doing Jewish material.

[Ronan Farrow]

His opening joke. I can't believe I'm Jewish. All right, I don't care. His opening joke was like. He was like, yeah, we're raising the kid Jewish because I do not have the energy to argue with a pregnant Jewish woman.

[Dan Soder]

That's great.

[Ronan Farrow]

If there's anyone you can want to argue with, it's a pregnant Jewish woman. I'm like, what the fuck?

[Dan Soder]

That's a good joke.

[Ronan Farrow]

It's a good joke. Yeah, he. And then I had to go up. I'm like, frankly, I'm. I'm married to a Catholic, so I could just do Catholic jokes. Cuz that's now how it works now.

[Dan Soder]

But are you, Is your wife Catholic?

[Ronan Farrow]

Oh, she was raised Catholic. Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Do you see the. It's weird about Catholics is because they, they, they still, even if they're not Catholic anymore, they still. It's in there. Yeah, yeah, it's in there until the day they die. My mom is still like, Easter is huge for.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, hell's not something you really, you know, it's learn that a young age.

[Dan Soder]

This is the same Thing about the sexual shame. Jews don't have hell.

[Ronan Farrow]

We don't have hell. Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

I mean, it really is like you go, what if you were to put monotheistic religions out there? As far as the one I'd go, talk to me about the one without hell.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Now, hell is you can't mix your dairy and your meat. Well, now we're up.

[Ronan Farrow]

No, hey, I choose. I choose not believing in hell over a cheeseburger.

[Dan Soder]

Well, I didn't know what. I didn't know what kosher was. And my first job ever was at my friend Adam's parents owned a kosher bagel Denver, and I was 13. And they're like, yeah, you can work here. You just work in the back with, like, the dough and stuff and bringing in. And then I got a lunch break, and it was my first lunch break at my first job ever. And I walked across the parking lot to Burger King and got a double Whopper with cheese. And I was about to walk in, and one of the guys that worked there went, what's in that bag? A double Whopper with cheese. He went, this is a kosher. I was outside. I was like, about in the back.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Walk in. And he goes, you can't bring that in here. He goes, do you bring that in here? We got to get a rabbi with a flame. Seriously, a flamethrower to bless all the ovens. And I was like, that can. I just want to see that. I almost brought the cheeseburger in to be like, sold. Dude, go get your boy. I want to tell him the. Fire up the flamethrower.

[Ronan Farrow]

You know why you can't have it? Mix milk and meat.

[Dan Soder]

Why?

[Ronan Farrow]

Honestly, it's because it's perverse and which kind of makes sense, cooking an animal in the milk, in its mother's milk. That's what it says in the body. It's up that we do that. You're killing a cow and then eating it with the milk of that cow's mother.

[Dan Soder]

That is wild. That is wild that it was a Jewish person that went a little up. I don't know. You guys think this is a little up? And they go, yeah, it really is.

[Ronan Farrow]

That really is what it's about. They're like. It's like, you shouldn't. Don't cook meat, and it's a mother's milk. Like, they're just kind of like, it's kind of. Kind of perverse.

[Dan Soder]

I took a theology class in, like, my freshman year of college or whatever, and they were talking about how a lot of these beliefs in religion were. Because they were like, People were getting sick.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

They had to write like Muslims, you know, it was the last monotheistic religion to be made.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah, yeah.

[Dan Soder]

And they were like. The pork thing was probably because people were getting sick eating pork.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah, yeah.

[Dan Soder]

So they're like, no pork.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah, yeah. No alcohol.

[Dan Soder]

It was like making people have a problem.

[Ronan Farrow]

It was all just. Yeah. It was just. Yeah. I guess. Health issues.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah.

[Ronan Farrow]

It was like the coveted vaccine.

[Dan Soder]

Exactly. They're like, we're just putting this in and they're like, no pork. And then it just held for.

[Ronan Farrow]

And that's. Suddenly Christianity came about.

[Dan Soder]

Well, I think it goes Judaism, Christianity, Muslims.

[Ronan Farrow]

Oh, Muslims. That. Yeah. Because isn't it funny? Because it feels first, doesn't it?

[Dan Soder]

Well, Muslims, the thing that they don't get credit for is they acknowledge other messiahs.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah. Jesus and Moses are both prophets.

[Dan Soder]

Both prophets in the Muslim religion where

[Ronan Farrow]

you go, oh, it's kind of funny. You're like, they really collab. They really bring everyone together until they don't.

[Dan Soder]

Until they go, everyone must die.

[Ronan Farrow]

On the surface, very.

[Dan Soder]

It is weird because you go, well, why are you guys trying to kill all the infidels if you're also acknowledging the infidels? Main guys.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah, you know, it's.

[Dan Soder]

That's what I was. What's interesting to me is like, I respect people that are religious because I know, well, you have. You can commit. Yeah, yeah. It's commitment. It's a commitment in a way. That's why I'm saying, like, my friends that are catholic, I know they go to a church on Wednesday and Sunday and I'm like, it's just like.

[Ronan Farrow]

It's just. I mean, the reason I don't. I want to be. I'm just boring.

[Dan Soder]

So it was always just so boring. I used to have to go with my mom and it was.

[Ronan Farrow]

I'm basically choosing. Oh, I. I'd rather not have meaning in my life to just not be bored.

[Dan Soder]

Were your parents. Did they dry? Did they want you to be like.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah, I kept kosher till college.

[Dan Soder]

Really?

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

What was the first? Non kosher. What'd you break with?

[Ronan Farrow]

I. I've talked about this before, but it's. It's. So I had chicken, which is just. Is unkosher if it's not prepared right, you know, because meat with kosher has to be cut with this knife.

[Dan Soder]

Knife.

[Ronan Farrow]

It's this knife that's really sharp. So the animal's supposed to die painlessly even though. Damn.

[Dan Soder]

You guys really do think about the

[Ronan Farrow]

animals we do, but it doesn't. But the problem, this is kind of the problem with religion is that now that is not the most humane way to kill an animal.

[Dan Soder]

Sure. Now it's like some machine that yeah.

[Ronan Farrow]

Just crushes your head. Right. But. But we still are doing what humane like Flip it,

[Dan Soder]

flip it. If I worked at a slaughterhouse, that's all I would do. Be so funny just to dress like that.

[Ronan Farrow]

It's so funny if in no country like when he does that scene, the guy's like are you just doing two face for Batman?

[Dan Soder]

He goes, oh brother. I read the, I read the Pulp comics. This is just two face.

[Ronan Farrow]

It just feels like court McCarthy just didn't know about two face.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah. It's so like when a comic's doing a bit that he doesn't know another comic has to bit of. He goes, do you know that guy does that bit?

[Ronan Farrow]

He goes, son's like I got a new villain. He gives riddles out

[Dan Soder]

his 16 year old lover goes, you don't read Batman, do you? Son of bed chomping her gun.

[Ronan Farrow]

I love the character from no country but that is very much a two faced thing.

[Dan Soder]

Flip it. And he's like, you don't big Batman fan. That's all that guy had to say.

[Ronan Farrow]

I said no, but yeah, you're a

[Dan Soder]

big Batman fan, son.

[Ronan Farrow]

But so yeah, so sheeta knife was you made but now it's not.

[Dan Soder]

You know, damn, you really throw some on that you didn't really get in there.

[Ronan Farrow]

So I, I had chicken and it was a big deal. It was college.

[Dan Soder]

It was.

[Ronan Farrow]

I had a piece of chicken or a couple pieces, whatever. And I woke up the next day with a cold sore. For real?

[Dan Soder]

Yeah.

[Ronan Farrow]

And I, I was like, you know, I assumed it was guilt. I assume, God, what was it? I think it was psychological guilt that led to a cold sore.

[Dan Soder]

So when you ate the chicken, you also the girl's herpes also eat some on. On a loose woman. Yeah, but so when you ate it, were you like I felt here I

[Ronan Farrow]

go, yeah, like I'm not shameful about sex, but I was shameful about eating chicken.

[Dan Soder]

You know, I mean honestly, I would take that trade. I would take that shameless nuts versus going like you get a cheeseburger but

[Ronan Farrow]

you get hell and, and being ashamed every time you sex.

[Dan Soder]

Every time I squeeze a nut out, I go, who am I?

[Ronan Farrow]

I don't feel guilty about masturbation at all. Which is interesting.

[Dan Soder]

I used to feel a lot of people feel a lot of guilt about

[Ronan Farrow]

people tell Me, they do. And I have friends who have. Who actually have done the no fapping or whatever it's called. And I'm just like, by the way, those.

[Dan Soder]

Those boys are just trying to edge as much as possible. That's just straight up gooning. Yeah, yeah. You're not. You're not above anybody.

[Ronan Farrow]

Well, you know what it is was like, master, like. Because I've, you know, I have friends who are like, yeah, you like, who think they're sex addicts, but then they're also like. You're probably a sex addict too. You don't realize it. Not that I do anything like that, but just. Just, I don't know, just thinking about

[Dan Soder]

it, just enjoying sex.

[Ronan Farrow]

But in my head, I'm just like. Like masturbation. Even if it is an addiction, it's a healthy addiction.

[Dan Soder]

I think it's. Well, I don't know if I mean

[Ronan Farrow]

physically, it's not bad for you.

[Dan Soder]

I think it is the equivalent of de venoming a snake. When they take that, when you see it where they put the snakes.

[Ronan Farrow]

Right.

[Dan Soder]

The glass and the venom comes out. You're just de venoming yourself so you

[Ronan Farrow]

don't have to shoot up a school. Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Or you're not harassing a comedy club waitress.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah, exactly.

[Dan Soder]

You just are like when you have empty nuts.

[Ronan Farrow]

Right. Louie never jerked off and that's why this happened. Yes.

[Dan Soder]

And that's why he should have been doing it in his private life. Then he could have came in way more even headed. But there is something to be said about, like, doing it and being. That's why, like, I think a lot of comics are surprised when they find out that every comic gets to their hotel room and jerks off.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Because you're just de venoming yourself. You got it for the city. Well, you know, I'm a visitor here. I should probably take the venom out of me.

[Ronan Farrow]

Jack it off is like, after you jack off, you're kind of like, oh, I'm not stressed about things anymore.

[Dan Soder]

You also go, who's that guy?

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

I'm always like, what the. Was I going?

[Ronan Farrow]

I know there is. Yeah. I don't feel shame, but I do feel that, like, you're. Yeah. Louie talks about like, you're back to reality and you're like. It's like kind of like coming to. At a car scene. A car traffic accident.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah. It is how I used to feel when I would get drunk.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

And then I would wake up and I'd go, like, who was that? Yeah, that wasn't me. And then that's how you get when you're, like, super horny.

[Ronan Farrow]

Right.

[Dan Soder]

Then you. And then you masturbate and you go,

[Ronan Farrow]

but, you know, I have, like, a pretty strong libido because I'm a. Yes, I'm a Jew.

[Dan Soder]

But got that. He believed that he.

[Ronan Farrow]

So, like, I think jacking off is bad. If you. If you then are having sex with your partner later and you can't. Yeah, that's. That's.

[Dan Soder]

What's the fuel.

[Ronan Farrow]

That's the fuel. You're wasting your seed. But I can usually still.

[Dan Soder]

That's crazy.

[Ronan Farrow]

So it's like. It's not an issue to me. In fact, I have enough libido, I think, where I can be a sex addict and my wife. Life consistently.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah. That. That would be to me. To the point where I'd go, this might be too much.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Because I think in my early 20s, I was like that. My. My 20s. And then as I hit my late. My late 20s, I started being like. It was also coincided with me quitting drinking, because when I quit drinking, I got, like, super horny.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

And then it. It dissipated, like, within the year, it started being, like, back to normal.

[Ronan Farrow]

I mean, it's not as strong as it used to be, but I'm still. I always like.

[Dan Soder]

Like, I think I would have had a higher libido if I wasn't so shamed about it.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah. Yeah, probably.

[Dan Soder]

I think I would have felt more inclined to be like, this is a good. It would have made me go into it instead of going like, well, I like my problem.

[Ronan Farrow]

Right.

[Dan Soder]

Is this a problem?

[Ronan Farrow]

My. I think most guys either. If they have sexual problems, they lean towards either, like, coming early or not being able to get it up.

[Dan Soder]

Sure.

[Ronan Farrow]

I always lean towards coming early, which I always felt was like, a sign of a libido.

[Dan Soder]

Oh, really?

[Ronan Farrow]

So turned on.

[Dan Soder]

I always took it as a sign of tenderness that you're like, I'm so tender. So tender. Please. Kind of.

[Ronan Farrow]

You know, it's gentle. Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Just such a tender boy. But I always think it's interesting where you're, like, watching how people. What people are sensitive towards or what people have shame for.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

And then to see how they grow up. And you go, that's the interesting part. And yes, this episode's brought to you by Better Health, but that's. To me, the interesting part of therapy is, like, following the cord to something and going like. Like, I remember asking my therapist, I was like, hey, is it possible that I was molested? And I blocked it out and that's the reason I have, like, a weird time being intimate. And my therapist was like, no, you just completely lack intimacy. He's like, you just need to work on you allowing intimacy in.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

And you go, that's such a less sexy answer than going, I think you got sucked off by your uncle when you were four. That's what I was hoping, because that's such an easy fix.

[Ronan Farrow]

Well, I think the blocking out thing is pretty rare. I think usually when you get. You remember it when you get.

[Dan Soder]

But I do think there are people that block it out, because I do think there is a trauma response that goes. My body's. It's. It's the same thing we were talking about with the government about how they just wall off those conspiracy theories. The government just walls off the rest of the government for finding out about it. I think your brain can do that.

[Ronan Farrow]

It can. People can also have false memories, too.

[Dan Soder]

Sure. Oh, absolutely. I think that's. That's a very.

[Ronan Farrow]

Like those 60 women, Bill Cosby, allegedly.

[Dan Soder]

All false memories. You never do that. Go watch the Dennis bit on himself and tell me that man's a.

[Ronan Farrow]

Wasn't that funny? When people are defending him? And it just kept on being more and more women, and they're like, eventually defending him became really exhausting.

[Dan Soder]

Is that lady. It's the meme of the lady smoking the cigarette out back of the Wendy's. They're just like, I can't. I think what's crazy about the whole Cosby thing is that Hannibal did it in a. Like a riff.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Like a finished joke.

[Ronan Farrow]

A little. It was a riff. Someone filmed that.

[Dan Soder]

It ended, and he was like, pick up your pants. And he goes, what about those ladies you.

[Ronan Farrow]

It was like a. Yeah. It was just like.

[Dan Soder]

It really was a throwaway line.

[Ronan Farrow]

I filmed on a phone. The original. I feel like there's. There's three major comic moments that were filmed there. Was that Bill Burr telling everyone to

[Dan Soder]

go Philly on the virus, too. Yeah.

[Ronan Farrow]

Telling everyone to get with big black dicks or whatever.

[Dan Soder]

When he was on Bobby Kelly's podcast with, like, me, Nate Lewis, and List, we asked him about that, and he was like, I was afraid that was gonna become my thing.

[Ronan Farrow]

Right.

[Dan Soder]

Where, like, I would go do stand up, and people would just yell at me, and I would have to fight back.

[Ronan Farrow]

And he did get bigger from that. Right.

[Dan Soder]

Which. That was a viral. So it's interesting because they booed Dom Herrera.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Like, a bunch of people before him. And he went out, like, looking for the fight.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it's interesting because people. Bill Burr's such a pure artist and we, we talk about people that go viral for something. He really did go viral for something

[Dan Soder]

that was like one of the first viral stand up.

[Ronan Farrow]

You have that. And then Kramer's crowd work that when

[Dan Soder]

Big J and I. Big J quotes that in the funniest way where we were making fun of someone. What if he did that? And then he said. And then Big J hits the line. He goes, see, there's that word again. There's that word.

[Ronan Farrow]

And it's like Lenny Bruce trying to like, see the George Carlin.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah. They're just words. Yeah. PJ nails that exact part of it. Everything.

[Ronan Farrow]

We're all just worried.

[Dan Soder]

That's what he is.

[Ronan Farrow]

Y.

[Dan Soder]

There's that little word.

[Ronan Farrow]

Full George Carlin. You. You N word. Piece of.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah, These words. Yeah. Because when you see how Kramer. How mad he gets at dude. When you watch the. Have you watched the Letterman apology recently?

[Ronan Farrow]

Was Michael Richard just Jerry.

[Dan Soder]

Michael Richards and Seinfeld's there.

[Ronan Farrow]

I remember Seinfeld be there. I remember the audience laughing and Seinfeld going, it's not funny.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah.

[Ronan Farrow]

And I remember thinking Michael.

[Dan Soder]

Cuz he comes on and they go, this is. This is like before the Internet's everywhere. So they just go like, oh, it's Kramer. And he goes, I'm really sorry. And they go, oh. And Jerry's like, it's not funny.

[Ronan Farrow]

I always felt it was a little Seinfeld saying that. I don't know why. It just really rubbed me the wrong way that the audience is laughing because they don't know what's going on. And he's like, quit laughing. But it's like you're here trying to save your residuals for Seinfeld and we

[Dan Soder]

won't have to edit this out because I'll never have to bump into him. He was a guy that when I moved here, I was so excited to like.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

I was obsessed with the documentary. Comedian obsessed with it.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

That's why Colin Quinn is like my favorite part of that whole documentary. And I was obsessed with that documentary. My friend Zach gave it to me on my seventh.

[Ronan Farrow]

Pretty genius. Like, who do you get? Who can you cast to make Seinfeld look likable?

[Dan Soder]

Make Seinfeld look.

[Ronan Farrow]

Look just grounded.

[Dan Soder]

The. When he tells the story about the band landing in the field at Stand Up New York.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

I was like, he's the man. He understands standup. And it was like I was a comedy nerd. So it fed everything I wanted. I was moving I was like, part of the reason why I moved to New York City was tough crowd. Opie and Anthony and comedian.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

And, like, watching comedian, I was like. Like, I still think about that documentary where I'm in the hallway about to go up at the Cellar. And I think about that, like, when Jerry walks up and Sherrod Small is hostess, and he goes, go up. Charlotte goes, you're going up. Wait.

[Ronan Farrow]

Charade's in it.

[Dan Soder]

Very young. Shroud small. First five minutes when it shows. Manny, go. There's a certain compulsion. I've noticed.

[Ronan Farrow]

Oh, wow.

[Dan Soder]

Go watch that documentary. I used to watch it once a year.

[Ronan Farrow]

God, smells like 400 years old. He's like. He's like, I remember when Forrest Gump. I opened for pictures. I opened for Mark Twain.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah. He goes, mark Twain's real name was Samuel Clemens.

[Ronan Farrow]

You talking about Sammy?

[Dan Soder]

Sammy. I knew Sammy before he went by marsh dweller.

[Ronan Farrow]

Out for so long.

[Dan Soder]

He's in, like, all these old pictures, like. Like Jack Nicholson in the shining. It's like, 1919.

[Ronan Farrow]

I saw Don Rickles do his first open mic. I was like, this kid has something.

[Dan Soder]

I was friends with two out of the three Marks brothers. Holy. That's crazy. But that documentary, like, this is how Joe List and I became such good friends.

[Ronan Farrow]

Oh, really?

[Dan Soder]

Because we would go do open mics and, like, have beers or whatever. We quoted at each other without queuing each other up on it. We do the Colin Quinn where he's in the tuxedo, and he goes, what are you doing this weekend? He goes, this weekend working here. That was, like, one of our favorite lines.

[Ronan Farrow]

But you know what? You know what Seinfeld says, All that I just actually really think is not true. I've learned Seinfeld at one point goes, even if you're a celebrity, even if you're Jack Nicholson up there after a couple lines are like, what's next? And I'm like, that's not true. You could be a celebrity on stage. Maybe they won't laugh a lot, but they'll say they love it because crowds are star.

[Dan Soder]

True. But I push back on that. I think Jerry's right. And I would say pulling a real

[Ronan Farrow]

Louis catch right now, he's my inspirado.

[Dan Soder]

I. I'm gonna. I'm gonna. I'm gonna do the thing.

[Ronan Farrow]

I know this is hard for you too. You're such a people pleaser. You're like, I'm gonna disagree with you.

[Dan Soder]

Find your instinct.

[Ronan Farrow]

You have the voice in your head,

[Dan Soder]

come on, Daniel, do it.

[Ronan Farrow]

Your instinct is Just to be like, you're totally right.

[Dan Soder]

I know. God, what a good point. Push back.

[Ronan Farrow]

You're like. You so be like. I'm gonna disagree.

[Dan Soder]

Madonna at the Cellar, she bombed.

[Ronan Farrow]

Did she bomb?

[Dan Soder]

First five minutes. It's exactly what Seinfeld said. They said, all right, Madonna. And then. And then she bombed.

[Ronan Farrow]

All right. Well, I.

[Dan Soder]

She bombed so bad, Liz wouldn't send me the tape. And I asked. I said, liz, I gotta see that set. And Liz goes, I'm not sending you that tape. And I was like, fair. That's right.

[Ronan Farrow]

All right. I wanted to watch that.

[Dan Soder]

And she kept doing the thing.

[Ronan Farrow]

Let me rephrase. A famous man. No.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah. That might not be wrong.

[Ronan Farrow]

Well, I saw Michael Rappenford do an hour once, and the audience seemed happy. There wasn't anything.

[Dan Soder]

But.

[Ronan Farrow]

He sounds like he's a comic.

[Dan Soder]

He sounds like he does a rhythm. There are. There are fugazi in this business. Yeah, yeah. That. You go if from half of comics. Well, yeah, from. From a 15 foot. My buddies, when I worked in Alaska, they'd call these. It was such a mean thing, but I thought it was so funny. They'd call women 15 foot fake outs. You go, like, from 15ft away. These guys that live on boats.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah, yeah.

[Dan Soder]

But they'd go, like. They'd see a woman. That girl's hot. 15 foot fake out.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah, yeah.

[Dan Soder]

And you walk up and in Alaska, it was. It was so funny.

[Ronan Farrow]

I mean, that's probably the majority of comics. Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

But I'm saying from their act, you

[Ronan Farrow]

go, oh, I guess it sounds like it. Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Because they do the. They do the rhythm, they do the cadence, and they go, oh. It's probably how a lot of rappers feel.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Because they go, this doesn't.

[Ronan Farrow]

It's kind of ain't saying, but it's just. Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Goes home, I'm. And they go, I don't even know if you're rapping.

[Ronan Farrow]

I had that realization. I was listening to a recording once at a club. I. I performed, and I was listening to the audio the next day, and I do this one joke. I was doing well, so there was already a rhythm going. I did this one joke, and I got the punchline completely in reverse or just where it didn't make sense and the audience still laughed. It was like realizing how empty this

[Dan Soder]

is in that moment when Joe List became friends with Louis CK which watch. To watch in real time was incredible.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Because, I mean, we're talking about me. Him and Nate used to sit around and debate, like, oh, my God. When that special came out. Yeah. I remember being at Barcelona bar, having beers and being like, this joke sucked. This joke was incredible. We were arguing with it. I think me and Nate were team Burr and List was team Louie.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

So we would argue, like, no, this joke for joke. Literally go joke for joke. But we were friends. And then List becomes friends with Louie. And List would always say this thing about Chris Rock where he would go, there's a line in. I think it's bigger and blacker where he says, when you're. When you're white, the sky's the limit, and when you're black, the limits. The sky.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah, yeah.

[Dan Soder]

And List would, like. He would give what that means speech about it.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah, it does.

[Dan Soder]

It. It's.

[Ronan Farrow]

It's the same thing, but the rhythm, the limits. This guy, you're right.

[Dan Soder]

And he's doing the Chris Rock thing. The limit.

[Ronan Farrow]

That is the sky.

[Dan Soder]

And it, like, gets a huge laugh. It's. Dude, this is one of my favorite stories. I don't know if Joe's ever told this publicly, so if he does, if I get in trouble, Joe, I love you and forgive me for telling the story, but I think this is so funny. So Joe's on the road with Louie and they're having, like, breakfast or something. I forget where they are. They might even be in New York, but they're having a meal and they're talking comedy. And List brings this up, this point that I. He's opined on before that I know he has in the chamber.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Dan Soder]

And he brings it up to Louie, and Lou's texting and. And. And Joe's like, yeah, it just doesn't make any sense. And Louie puts his phone down. He goes, yeah, I just texted Rock that you said that. And Joe goes, we don't text him.

[Ronan Farrow]

Why you want to break it down?

[Dan Soder]

I thought that was one of my favorite. Lou's like, just listening. And he goes, yeah, I just texted him what you said. I just thought that was like one of my favorite moments. Where you go. That would give me so much anxiety. Where I go, don't text him. Please edit that.

[Ronan Farrow]

I mean, it's. It's like laughter is kind of instinctual, so it's like you. You need the rhythm. Like, it is true.

[Dan Soder]

Like, I think that's why I hated being a people pleaser so much. I also think that's why my stand up was weak until my HBO special was because I was such a people pleaser that I would do bits that you would get reactions, and I would still Kind of know that the bit wasn't finished, but it got a good reaction. So I go, well, it's making people.

[Ronan Farrow]

Right, right, right. Laugh.

[Dan Soder]

So it's good. Good. And until my HBO special, that was the first time where I was like, what we're talking about at the beginning. Like junkyarding.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah, yeah.

[Dan Soder]

This bit isn't good, but there's good lines in it.

[Ronan Farrow]

Right. Well, you have to learn how to crush and then you can make the decision to, you know.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah. Because people don't realize. Can crush.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah, yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Like, can crush.

[Ronan Farrow]

That's why. I mean, comedy is like the one art form which I really.

[Dan Soder]

I really.

[Ronan Farrow]

I know.

[Dan Soder]

I hate calling it. It's carney work.

[Ronan Farrow]

The truth is it's half an art form and half, like a sport.

[Dan Soder]

Sport. Because carnival behavior.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Half fear of doing actual art. That's what I think it is.

[Ronan Farrow]

Well, let's just say this. It can be artistic.

[Dan Soder]

I think it's in its best. It can be artistic.

[Ronan Farrow]

But it's. It's one field where you're just. With so many used car salesmen who just. And I just have to like. Like Hemingway didn't have to hang out with some.

[Dan Soder]

Some beat writer that's like.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

I don't know, dude. I'm a pulp writer. Just making up.

[Ronan Farrow]

I just write the same poem every week to get.

[Dan Soder]

You still working on your fish book? Yeah, it's called Old man in the Sea.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

It's kind of a big deal. It's a. It's an analog. Never mind. Yeah, but you.

[Ronan Farrow]

I mean. And you can tell it's a shitty field because also the only. If it is an art form, it's the only field where the. Some of the biggest names endorse trump.

[Dan Soder]

Well, yeah. Well, it's also. We're at the point now where standup has left its containment area and spread to the point where. And I. I'm sorry, you know, if you're a fan of this podcast and you've listened, you've heard me make this point before. We inherited everybody. That should have been an MTV vj. Yeah.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Should have been a dj.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Should have been a party promoter.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah. Should have been a serial rapist.

[Dan Soder]

Criminals focused criminals and bad people files. Yeah. You just get people that come in here because they know they can fake it.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

And it'll be.

[Ronan Farrow]

And they're still called a comedian.

[Dan Soder]

Sure. Even though I know people that grew up, I knew people that are successful at comedy. Right.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

That don't like comedy.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know.

[Dan Soder]

I Can name over and again. You know the rule.

[Ronan Farrow]

I'm the second part of that.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah, but if you see me alive, I'll give you names. I will not give it publicly. But if in person you come to one of my shows and you go, hey, you were talking about this. I'll give you the list. I don't give a.

[Ronan Farrow]

Like, imagine if it's off air. It is like, imagine if you're just like, what's it like? You're just like a classical composer. And there's another person who's called a classical composer, but all they are is a racist. They're just a racist.

[Dan Soder]

Beethoven's like, do you understand? I'm deaf? This guy, I'm still writing music.

[Ronan Farrow]

This guy is just saying racist things. And he has millions of followers.

[Dan Soder]

Beethoven watching like someone like that, where he's not even a composer. And he's watching, going, come on,

[Ronan Farrow]

I'm not even crying.

[Dan Soder]

He's like, I've been composing his own. I can't even hear what I'm saying. And they're like, like the flight of the. Like, if he hear like Bach or something, he's like,

[Ronan Farrow]

I like how he got. I think he got deaf in his like 50s. But I like how he still takes the voice.

[Dan Soder]

Oh no, I'm giving him the deaf voice. That's the deaf voice.

[Ronan Farrow]

Which. The deaf voice. People took the deaf voice to do the R word voice.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah.

[Ronan Farrow]

Cuz it's like how being politically correct after I already said it. Can we edit that so I'm.

[Dan Soder]

It's like when you kissing during a rape. It's like crazy.

[Ronan Farrow]

This Edward comes over with his African American.

[Dan Soder]

You let him fly with an R. He's fucking crazy. But yeah, I think the deaf voice is the R word of voices.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah, for sure. Beethoven. Did she go deaf like a month ago? Don't you know how to talk?

[Dan Soder]

Shooting their lips. That's just Beethoven. What the fuck did you say?

[Ronan Farrow]

But so, yeah, it's just like there are people in our field who are just. We know comedians and I know these people, people who go on stage and just say mean things.

[Dan Soder]

I'm joking.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah, but they're not even funny. They're just mean. And everyone's like, that's awesome.

[Dan Soder]

Katie and I were talking about this exact thing yesterday, which is one of my pet peeves, is when someone says something mean and it doesn't get a reaction they want, so they go, I was just joking. But you weren't.

[Ronan Farrow]

But you weren't until that.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah, we were talking about you're just joking.

[Ronan Farrow]

Like, when I asked a girl if I want to make a move, and she's like, no. And I'm like, it was just a bit. Yeah, exactly.

[Dan Soder]

But we were talking about the coach of the Denver Broncos, Sean Payton. Their quarterback, Bo Nix, broke his ankle. And then it turned out that he had had a broken ankle in high school and a broken ankle in at Auburn before he transferred to Oregon. And. And Sean Payton went, oh, in that case, I wouldn't have drafted him if I would have known that. And he's like, no, I'm just joking. He goes, no, that was real. Like, I actually meant that. And then a couple days later, he was like, yeah, he kind of hid information from me that that ankle was a problem. And Bo Nix was like, I never hid any information. And he's like. And I don't think he should have said that. And you're like, so he wasn't. Because he did a second thing where you go, that is what you believe.

[Ronan Farrow]

Well, it's literally like, yeah. Like, I. I remember the first time I made a move on a girl. I was like, we should, like, make out. And then she.

[Dan Soder]

I used to do that all the time.

[Ronan Farrow]

And that would have been a joke

[Dan Soder]

before if I kissed you right now.

[Ronan Farrow]

And that's literally what Trump is doing with. Maybe we'll cancel the elections. Well, it's a joke unless I get away with it.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah. Which Obama should have, really. If he would have known that was coming. Obama doing that would have been funny. He's like, I'm gonna every white woman in America just joking. I'm just joking.

[Ronan Farrow]

My favorite.

[Dan Soder]

I'm gonna make you all have black husbands. Just joking. Back to our point of being in a field where you watch people fake it. I think that's important because I think that makes good comics more valuable.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

And I think we're going through a place right now where people are going, there's so much out there. And I go, there is a lot of.

[Ronan Farrow]

But there's very few good comics.

[Dan Soder]

But that's what's good about it. They're embracing them.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Like, blow on those embers. Fan those flames.

[Ronan Farrow]

No, I really.

[Dan Soder]

I'm very loud. I like having you on here, cuz. You put out great comedy. Morbidly, morbidly Jewish.

[Ronan Farrow]

Morbidly obese. I don't even know. Morbidly kike, fat K. Whatever it is. Out now.

[Dan Soder]

Morbidly, morbidly Jewish to recall.

[Ronan Farrow]

Fat funny if I just called him morbidly obese.

[Dan Soder]

Just morbidly obese Please go watch Run on special. He is. I know we talk a lot of about people out there that suck. He's not one of them. He's a great comic that be the. I just, like, genuinely love this, and I love people that love this, and that's always what I want to like.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Push is like, there are people that grew up watching Woody Allen Brooks that when they were little, they were like, I could never do this. Then you get to do it, and you go, like, how cool is it I get to do.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah. No, I would like, sometimes someone comment like, you're not funny to me. And I. And I want to be arrogant, but I just kind of want to comment back because, like, I write jokes like, you should like. Like, that's such a rare thing.

[Dan Soder]

It's like, yeah, my. My thing is I've. I've have too many tax returns that disagree.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Dan Soder]

I can just go look at tax returns and go, yeah, you. And you might not think I'm funny. That's fine. You don't have to think I'm fun funny. There are a lot of people that do. And I'm gonna go, yeah. You know what I always think about? It is my favorite thing about being funny and what's always got me in trouble at other jobs was I always liked making my co workers laugh, and I always liked being a part of the job where it was like a relief, where it was like, we were sitting. We're waiting tables. We're sitting off in the hutch, making each other laugh. If I'm working at Bed, Bath and Beyond, we're unpacking boxes.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Each other laugh. It's always been, I'm at the bar having a beer with you. I would say, stylistically, that's what I want as my comedy. You don't have to be in the break room with us.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

If you don't like it, of course.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

Go empty other boxes.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

You don't like it, move down the bar and have a beer. I'm not one of these people that's like, you. You what you like.

[Ronan Farrow]

Yeah.

[Dan Soder]

You can find something you like, and if it ain't me, it ain't me. But I don't need to engage with you anymore.

[Ronan Farrow]

No, of course not. Yeah, yeah. No, you just. Yeah. It's not worth it. Yeah. And there's enough people on the planet. You can just find whoever, 8 billion,

[Dan Soder]

there's someone for you.

[Ronan Farrow]

When I think about 8 billion, I'm like, I really should have a bigger fan base.

[Dan Soder]

Like, Every time it breaks my heart.

[Ronan Farrow]

Like there's 8 billion people and I got 20 people to see me.

[Dan Soder]

Yeah, but you don't realize 2 billion of them live miles below our poverty line, where if you brought them a glass of clean water, they'd be like, you're my favorite comic. You're my favorite comic. And subscribe. Subscribe to your Patreon. Patreon. Because it's indoor plumbing. Your Patreon is a bath.

[Ronan Farrow]

Right, right, right, right.

[Dan Soder]

And you're like, that's pretty cool. But morbidly Jewish is the special. The link is in the bio down here of the video. Ronan is hilarious. And I'm glad you came by.

[Ronan Farrow]

Oh, it's always a pleasure. Thanks for having me.

[Dan Soder]

Thanks, buddy.

[Ronan Farrow]

And Doug, there's nowhere I wouldn't go to help someone customize and save on car insurance with Liberty Mutual. Even if it means sitting front row at a comedy show. Hey everyone, check out this guy and his bird. What is this, your first date? Oh, no. We help people customize and save on car insurance with Liberty Mutual together. We're married. Me to a human, him to a bird. Yeah, the bird looks out of your league. Anyways, get a [e-mail] or with your local agent. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Hey, sweetie.

[Dan Soder]

Your mother showed me this Carvana thing

[Ronan Farrow]

for selling the car. I'm gonna give it a try.

[Dan Soder]

Wish me luck.

[Ronan Farrow]

Me again.

[Dan Soder]

I put in the license plate. It gave me an offer.

[Ronan Farrow]

Unbelievable. Okay, I accepted the offer.

[Dan Soder]

They're picking it up Tuesday from the driveway. I haven't even left my chair.

[Ronan Farrow]

It's done. The car is gone.

[Dan Soder]

I'm holding a check anyway.

[Ronan Farrow]

Carvon, give it a whirl.

[Dan Soder]

Love ya.

[Ronan Farrow]

So good you'll want to leave a voicemail about it.

[Dan Soder]

Sell your car today on Carvana.

[Ronan Farrow]

Pick up fees may apply.

[Dan Soder]

From GEICO Subconscious News. I'm Tammy Racing thoughts tonight. You just left for work and had a non specific feeling that something was happening to your place. And it wasn't good, Dan.

[Ronan Farrow]

Exactly, Tammy. It could be smoke damage, theft or just too much caffeine, but you can't stop thinking about it.

[Dan Soder]

But with renters insurance through geico, you, your stuff is covered so you don't have to worry.

[Ronan Farrow]

And that's great. Cause the weekend is coming up and it's chock full of social obligations that are ready to fill that void.

[Dan Soder]

Oh boy, will they. Dad. It feels good to worry less. It feels good to geico.