Nick White - I play the Sims a LOT

Summary

Sofieland with Sofie Hagen

Episode: Nick White - I play the Sims a LOT
Date: July 7, 2026
Host: Sofie Hagen
Guest: Nick White

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Episode Overview

This heartfelt and humorous episode features Sofie Hagen in conversation with comedian, content creator, and self-described Sims enthusiast Nick White. What starts as mutual fanfare quickly becomes an honest exploration of creativity, mental health, authenticity in comedy, and—of course—deep dives into The Sims. The two discuss creative processes, the angst of self-critique, the power of friendship, and the joys and absurdities of both real and simulated life. Listeners are guaranteed candid stories, practical advice, and plenty of laughter.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Creative Careers & The Algorithm

Timestamps: 09:55–12:00

• Both identify as comedians and content creators, but Sofie admits to posting less online.
• Nick shares he prefers to “keep it light” with content, making things only when inspired:

  “If I try to keep it light and fun and I actually only post things when I feel inspired to, then I don't overthink the algorithm and all that stuff.” (Nick, 11:09)

• Both express that performing live brings a magic missing from online content.
• Discussion of how ticket sales have become more challenging despite online presence (11:27).

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2. The Sims Obsession

Timestamps: 12:52–17:14

• Nick reveals his roots: studied architecture, but the Sims “was like seeing God” for him as a child.

  “I went, what is that? And he's, oh, it's the Sims. And I said, whoa, whoa, whoa. You say that too casually. It was like I was seeing God.” (Nick, 13:27)

• The Sims helped inspire his career path; he played daily for eight years, does everything from building to storytelling.
• Sofie also plays in bursts—sometimes nonstop, sometimes not at all.
• They joke about in-game social anxieties (“Needs No One” reward), and the intersection of their real and Sims lives.

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3. The Dogs of Real Life

Timestamps: 16:02–18:29

• Nick talks about his Golden Retriever, Billy, and the joys and struggles of being a dog parent.
• Dogs as mirrors: both feel their dogs reflect parts of themselves, including quirks and stubbornness.
• Sofie’s therapist quote:

  “Oh, you do know that you never get the dog you want. You get the dog you need.” (Sofie, 17:36)

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4. Self-Compassion & Growth

Timestamps: 19:06–23:54

• Conversations about being hard on oneself, and the fallacy that self-criticism drives improvement.

  “The nicer you are to yourself, the better you are at the thing.” (Sofie, 19:33)

• Sofie recommends Self Compassion by Kristin Neff; Nick admits to needing reminders of kindness.
• Both joke about oversharing and the joys (and hazards) of personal openness in comedy.

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5. Comedy, Identity & Truth

Timestamps: 25:02–34:59

• Nick discusses moving from stand-up to character shows, and how his audience’s familiarity can make him “lazy” with material, but that he misses doing direct stand-up.
• Migration journey: Brisbane → New York (came out as gay, found queer performance spaces) → Sydney → Melbourne.
• Sofie reflects on seeing stand-up as a “fixed thing” and the artificial hierarchies within the craft.

  “We have a tendency, those of us [...] doing it in like, spaces like London and New York [...] to see stand up as a specific thing.” (Sofie, 34:02)

• Both conclude that trusting one’s comedic voice is most important.

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6. Emotional Health, Daydreams & Relationships

Timestamps: 35:00–37:56

• Nick admits undergoing an “emotional growth spurt” during the festival; wishes for a boyfriend but recognizes the need for self-compassion before a new relationship.
• Both acknowledge how growth is messy and moves in “two steps forward, one step back.”

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7. Spirituality & Self-Care

Timestamps: 38:28–43:12

• Nick shares light dabbling in Tarot, regular journaling (especially after a calming joint), and the idea that “we create our own reality.”

  "Everything is funny and nothing really matters." (Nick, quoting David Hughes, 39:37) “If I say I’m pretty, I’m pretty because that's my truth.” (Sofie, 42:11)

• Discuss the challenge of comparing themselves to others in the creative field.

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8. Collective Self-Doubt in Comedy

Timestamps: 43:12–45:36

• Comedians’ tendency to believe silence from peers means judgment or dislike.
• Hilarious anecdotes about disruptive audience members—reinforcing how subjective and varied both performance and perception are.

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9. Sofieland’s Government & Laws

Timestamps: 45:36–48:23

• Sofie invites Nick to create a law for Sofieland. He proposes structured pedestrian lanes:

  “Maybe like four lanes. [...] First lane, you can dawdle and you can even stop. Second lane, you're not in a rush. [...] Third lane, people who are in a rush, like me.” (Nick, 45:59)

• They discuss logistics, previous guests’ harsher proposals, and the need for specialized citizen lanes for everyone’s comfort.

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10. The Magic & World-Building of The Sims

Timestamps: 48:24–54:10

• Discussion of other comedians who create fictional worlds for shows, like “Planet Courtney.”
• Sofie and Nick talk about Sims house tours, world-building, and their play styles (practical houses vs. elaborate creations).
• They muse on the Sims as manifestation of their desires (and areas where real pets get neglected in favor of digital ones).

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11. Authorship & Touring

Timestamps: 53:36–54:57

• Sofie reveals she’s written two books (Happy Fat and Will I Ever Have Sex Again?).
• Nick wraps up with his tour plans—limited for now, but promises extensive touring next year, especially shows focused on his “truth.”

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Notable Quotes

• Nick White, on creativity and the algorithm:

  “I've always just made content that I'm excited to make, and if I don't feel like making it, I don't.” (10:36)

• Sofie Hagen, on stand-up:

  “I love stand up so much and I love being at festivals because you're just surrounded by stand up and you can see so many shows.” (30:27)

• Nick White, on personal growth:

  “I think I need to just have a bit of a reset after this festival.” (36:57)

• Sofie Hagen, on belonging:

  “Everyone just wants to belong. Everyone just wants to be part of something.” (23:15)

• Nick White, on dogs as mirrors:

  “He’s really chill and gentle, but also a bit weird and really sensitive and get scared easily. Oh, yeah. So he's. He's kind of like me.” (18:14)

• Sofie Hagen, on body image and reality:

  "If I say I'm pretty, I'm pretty, because that's my truth.” (42:11)

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Memorable Moments

• Nick’s description of seeing The Sims for the first time as “like seeing God” (13:27).
• Sofie’s ongoing struggle to “trust the path,” realizing that real trust means relinquishing control (31:30).
• The running gag about being hard on themselves, and using self-help for reminders of self-worth.
• Hilarious recounting of challenging or awkward audience members, and how performers internalize (and exaggerate) others’ perceived judgments (44:20).
• The law of multi-lane pedestrian walkways in Sofieland—an ongoing community debate on urban etiquette.

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• 00:00–09:34 — Host update, intro, Sofie’s thoughts on adulthood and new friendships
• 09:34–12:00 — Comedy careers, social media and presence
• 12:52–17:14 — The Sims: childhood fascination, architecture, in-game habits
• 17:14–19:06 — Dogs, what pets reflect about us
• 19:06–23:54 — Mental health, self-compassion, oversharing
• 25:02–34:59 — Content vs. stand-up, creative voice finding, migration and coming out
• 35:00–37:56 — Relationships, personal growth, emotional pressure-cooker
• 38:28–43:12 — Spirituality, journaling, weed, reality creation, body image
• 43:12–45:36 — Comedy anxieties, audience stories
• 45:36–48:23 — Sofieland laws, pedestrian lanes for all speeds
• 48:24–54:10 — World-building, the Sims as an extension of self
• 53:36–54:57 — Books, tour plans, Patreon bonus tease

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Tone & Feel

The episode is candid, witty, and warm, blending deep introspection with playful banter. Both speakers are unfiltered yet compassionate, and while much of the conversation is focused on creative professions and The Sims, the emotional resonance is universally relatable.

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For full episodes and bonus content, visit Sofie Hagen’s Patreon or Substack.
Follow Nick White on Instagram (@NickWhite49) for updates and tour announcements.

Transcript

[A]

Dear citizens of Sophie Land, I will let you listen to the episode in approximately 60 seconds. But first I just want to let you know that my brand new show, I think some of this is my fault, will be going to the Edinburgh Fringe this August and then in November I'm taking it to Soho Theater in London. Then it's going on tour to Denmark, Copenhagen, Unser and Aarhus, Sweden, Melmurg and Stockholm. Then I'm going to Berlin, I'm going to Rotterdam. The UK dates have just come out which are Leicester, Sheffield, Selby, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Aberdeen, Birmingham, Manchester, Liverpool, Reading, Brighton, Cambridge, London and Exeter. Tickets can be found on sophie hagen.com link is in the show notes alongside the link for the Patreon or the substack. Because this podcast is self produced, meaning I do all of the stuff. I do the editing, the uploading, the booking of the guests, the interviews, every single effing thing. So your support means the whole world to me. So if you sign up for the Patreon or the substack, you will get extra fun bonus content and you get to support me. I really appreciate it. I really love you. Thank you so much for listening. Please enjoy this episode. Thank you. Hello citizens of Sophie Land. It's me and I'm talking to you again. There was a while where I didn't speak to you before the episode, and now I'm back to speaking to you before the episode. We are going through changes. We're going through a lot of changes. I just wanted to speak to you again. I get that jumping straight into an episode has its perks, has its upside. Some people prefer that. I think I prefer speaking to you. I want to tell you what's going on. I want to tell you what's on my mind. And the podcast is going to find its feet or the podcast's feet is going to find their place. I don't know. I'm going to figure out what the podcast is. I am speaking to you from my car in the woods. If you're watching this on YouTube or on Spotify, I think you will be able to see the woods behind me. All of the trees. Well, not all of the trees. A select few of the trees. But you know, I. I promise you there are trees behind that. It was raining right before. I hope it's going to rain again so that you can hear it. I have become obsessed with sitting in my car. As you may know, my current living situation is a little bit stressful. I have a new roomie called mom and it's really hard when you live with your parents and, well, parent. I would have no idea what it would be like to live with parents. Oh, it's raining again. I hope you can hear it. It's weird when you. I'm 37 years old and I go straight back into being a teenager, except I am. Like, before I shout, I can stop myself because I am an adult, but there are times when I. I hear myself beginning to say mom. Or the Danish version, of course, because she's Danish, which is moa. It sounds the same, doesn't it, in each language. So what I've enjoyed since getting my driver's license last year is just going to the woods and sitting in my car. It feels. It. Do you know what? It feels a bit illegal. Every time I just sit in my car, I feel like I'm breaking some kind of rule. So anyways, I thought, hey, now I have an excuse. If I speak to you guys from my car, I have an excuse. And what an adult. What an adult thing to do compared to when I did my first podcast, my second podcast. Well, also my first. Whenever I would do these introductions, I would be lying under my duvet because I was living in a house full of comedians, and now I live in a flat full of. Mother. Mother. And this is just another way to get away and have a. Well, I'm not going to say a soundproof studio because it's not a sound. I learned that recently. By the way, I've been using my car as a soundproof studio since I got it, like, six months ago. Meaning, oh, I have screamed. You know, I have had fake arguments in the car, just shouting, just getting all of my anxiety and frustration out. I have sung. I am telling you, I have sung, screamed along to various songs, thinking no one can hear me. I've sat in parking lots and gone through. Oh, my God. I've sat in. I sat in a parking lot outside of the venue where I was about to do my show. And I've gone through the entire show. And I knew that there were people from the audience sitting nearby, but I was like, that's okay. They just think I'm on the phone. And then my sister said, we walked past the car and we could hear, like, something coming from inside. And she said, oh, it's so embarrassing when people think you can't hear them when they're inside the car. And I was like, what? Oh, you must be able to hear this rain. Okay. This is a lot of rain. Okay, it might. Is it too much rain? No, it's cozy. I'M going to vote for this. Being cozy. If it's too much rain, I won't do this again, but please, I think I could live in my car. I think I could. I once put the seat down and just had a half of a nap. As in, I had one eye open because I was scared I was breaking the law and it was incredible. So let's get into it. Nick. Nick White. Nick White. Such a joy. It's always a bit weird meeting someone for the first time and then doing a whole podcast with them because, you know, you're thinking, what if we don't get along? What if he's not nice? What if he's boring? What if we have no chemistry? What, like, this could go wrong. I don't know this person. I saw his show last Melbourne and loved it. I of course, know him from Tick Tock, where he does incredible sketches and it's just incredibly funny. And then he was just the nicest guy in real life. He was just so nice and so sweet and so funny. And we stayed talking afterwards for a bit, even throughout the bonus episode. Like, after the bonus episode, we just kept talking for a bit and, like, gossiped. And I'm actually now, a couple of months later, I'm like, why didn't we hang out more? I should have met him for coffee or something. I think I even said it to him. I said, like, oh, can I meet your dog? And he was like, yeah, yeah, sure. And then we just didn't. Which I'm now upset about because he was so great. And I feel like maybe sometimes in my adult life I'm bad at grasping the new friendship, you know, just like, oh, great guy, we should hang out. And then we don't. I need to make more of an effort. I made a new friend last week. Not new friend. He was an old friend, but we've never been, like, that close. And then we hung out and it was great. We had so much in common. And I was like, we could be like proper friends. And I have it in my mind, I'm like, that will happen. I need to work on this as a friendship. I cannot forget about this and be like, that was just a one off. No, I'm gonna insist on this becoming a proper friendship, as I should have done with Nick White. You are gonna love this episode. Nick White is great. I'm so happy he did the podcast. The bonus episode is great too. Hint, hint. If you want to go to patreon.com SylvieHagen or substack if that's Your.

[B]

Your.

[A]

Your jazz. If that's your jazz, you can go sign up there. I hope you'll come see me on tour. All the dates are. Well, not all the dates. We still have dates coming up, but most of them are out now and we have stuff like Manchester and London. I'll be in Soho Theatre in London in November. I'm of course, doing the entire Edinburgh Fringe in August this year. I am. Oh, my God, there are people running. People are running in the woods, in the rain. You're so brave. People are so brave. And then I'm deciding my tour next year, February. I'm doing Denmark. I'm doing Sweden. Hi, by the way. Hi, Sweden. Could you buy just a couple more tickets? Because I have sold two tickets in Malmo and they put me in a 520 seater. So if there are any listeners in Malmu, could you bring 538 of your friends to. To the show, please, because this is embarrassing and I would. I would love more people there. And I'm sorry for everything I've ever said about Sweden, by the way. Maybe I should have mentioned that before, before trying to sell tickets there. I am also going to Rotterdam and Berlin and I'm in Denmark and I am in the uk, all over the uk. And more dates will be added. And I hope, hope, hope, hope you'll come and see my new show because I'm very excited about it. But as for now, do enjoy Nick White. The lovely, lovely Nick White. You're gonna love him. I love him. I'm gonna insist on the friendship the next time I see him. And. Hi. I'm glad I'm speaking to you directly again. Hi. Okay. Enjoy the episode.

[B]

Hello, beautiful people.

[A]

I love that.

[B]

How long have you been doing this pod?

[A]

This one? Four months.

[B]

Oh, cool.

[A]

But I have a history of podcasting, so I bring. I brought people over. They're used to this media.

[B]

Okay. Yeah.

[A]

From me.

[B]

Oh, I hope. Please watch.

[A]

Okay. What do you. Comedian, stand up, comedian, creator. What words do you use?

[B]

You wouldn't say, like comedian and content creator.

[A]

Yes, yes. And a good one. Oh, stop. As such. Good one. A very such good one.

[B]

And you're comedian and podcaster and content creator.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah, I don't think I can. I can live up to the content creator. I've not posted that much for so

[B]

long, it's hard to keep.

[A]

So how we started? We've started. Welcome. What? Yeah. How do you feel about the. What a boring question. Why do you feel about the algorithm?

[B]

It.

[A]

Right.

[B]

It can get. No, I'm kidding. Well, it's. It's tricky because I've always just made content that I'm excited to make, and if I don't feel like making it, I don't. And if I do, then I do. But every now and then depend. It depends who you hang out with too. If you hang out with people who are really strategic and they're like, you need to post this much and don't post too many Instagram stories, but. And then you start to be like, oh. And then you start to overthink it, then it's not fun and it. It stresses me out. But if I try to keep it light and fun and I actually only post things when I feel inspired to, then I don't overthink the algorithm and all that stuff.

[A]

I love that. And that seems to work. I feel like you sense it when you watch your content. You sense that this is like, you enjoy this.

[B]

Yeah, I don't really want to post anything that I don't find funny or I don't want to force anything.

[A]

I love that.

[B]

But then this year, I don't know if you found, like, ticket sales are kind of trickier for everyone. And I started to have a bit of an identity crisis. I was like, I'm not posting enough. And then I was like, just chill out. Yeah, just relax, Nick.

[A]

Yeah, I don't get the people. I mean, I just think you're such a treat to watch on stage and online. But, like, I think maybe people online are just like, well, we have everything on we need online. But there's such a different, like, being at this festival. Like, it's magical to be on stage in a room in front of people.

[B]

I know.

[A]

It feels so much better.

[B]

It's really cool. Hey.

[A]

Yeah, it's nice.

[B]

But I've realized because I'm doing a full character show this year, I miss stand up. I miss, like, storytelling and just interacting and connecting with people as myself, you know, even though my characters are a part of me. But I think next year I'll do a stand up show because I miss it. Is yours just pure stand up?

[A]

Pure stand up. Oh, nice characters that I. Whenever I've tried to do a character, I've either ended up doing just a friend of mine.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Just like, this is how they would act. Or I think we clash.

[B]

Oh, we clash.

[A]

I think so.

[B]

I'm at 6:00pm yeah, I'm at 6. 10. Yeah.

[A]

It was a good time, though. Good for us.

[B]

It is good.

[A]

Good for us.

[B]

How good is it? Hey. Hey. We're in bed.

[A]

By seven.

[B]

30 nights free. Yeah. Truly. Have you seen many shows?

[A]

I've seen so many shows. I love it. I love it. But then yesterday I had an. An early night. And that was also very good, isn't it? It's very Sleep or at. I don't know which one to choose.

[B]

I know, I know.

[A]

Can I ask you. I did a little, very little research, but then I saw the word. The Sims.

[B]

Oh, my God.

[A]

Can we talk about the Sims, please?

[B]

Can we please, please talk to me about this?

[A]

Because you were an architect, you studied architecture.

[B]

I. Yeah, I have a Master's. Isn't that crazy? I worked for like five years.

[A]

And what is that to do with the Sims? Or is that a different thing?

[B]

No, pretty much. Like, I just. I. I remember I was 10, and my brother and I went to some friends house on school holidays just for the day, and one of them was playing the Sims, Sims 1. This is 2003. And I went, what is that? And he's, oh, it's the Sims. And I said, whoa, whoa, whoa. You say that too casually. It was like I was seeing God.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I was like, what? What is it? And then he explained it to me and I went, I need that immediately. And then kind of from that day forward, I played it every day in my life until for at least, I'd say for at least, like, eight years. And I still play it now, but not every day. But, yeah, I think that's one of the main reasons I got into architecture. I just love. I'm just so obsessed with how people live.

[A]

So are you a builder or a liver?

[B]

Everything. I did everything on Sims, like the storytelling, the characters, the architecture, all of it. Yeah, I used to. I used to upload, like, little stories to thesimstrue.com. are you a Sims player? Of course. Okay, nice.

[A]

Yes. And I remember Sims 1.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And then I remember trying SimCity and being like, it's too cold for me.

[B]

Yeah, that's. Where's the heart?

[A]

Where's the high?

[B]

See my people in bed dreaming. You need that charm.

[A]

Oh, I love it when they added, like, scars and tattoos and.

[B]

Oh, yes. Do you still play?

[A]

Yes, I do.

[B]

How good is it?

[A]

But in periods. And I like, not touch it for months. And then I'll be like, I need to now do this for 14 hours a day.

[B]

Same. You just get obsessed. And then. And then it's kind of like making content. Sometimes I'll go to play the Sims. I'm like. I feel like I'm forcing it.

[A]

My heart's not in it.

[B]

Yeah, truly. So then I'm like, I'll come back in a few months.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I love it so much.

[A]

I really. I realized yesterday, and I'm gonna try and put it in my show, I realized that my social anxiety stretches into the Sims. Like, when my Sims are too social, I don't like it. The first thing I add is the one where they don't need each other. My first thing I buy is, like, needs no one.

[B]

Wait, what? Buy? How do you buy.

[A]

You know, when they do the. The. What's it called? When they.

[B]

The rewards that you can buy.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Oh, can you buy that?

[A]

Are you kidding? Wait, what? I thought you were a connoisseur of the Sims. I.

[B]

Well, so is it like the inspiration

[A]

rewards, the aspiration reward.

[B]

Oh, you can buy needs. No, I haven't bought that one.

[A]

If you scroll all the way down, there's a needs no.

[B]

1.

[A]

There's also, like, doesn't need the toilet. Doesn't need to.

[B]

Oh, yeah. I know those ones. Yeah.

[A]

But needs no. 1 just means that their social need never goes down.

[B]

Mine usually live with people.

[A]

Too many. It's too much.

[B]

Which neighborhood do you like? The cottage town. I love that.

[A]

I love the cottage.

[B]

That's a good town to live alone. When this festival's over next weekend, I'm just playing the Sims for a week. I'm walking my dog and playing the Sims. That's all I'm doing.

[A]

I've. I've been so obsessed with the Sims as well that I feel the need to tell people that I do still walk my dog.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Don't worry. Do you have Chapel?

[B]

Oh, a Sharpie? Yeah.

[A]

Like the Droopy.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

What do you have a Golden retriever? Oh, yeah. He's a lot of work, but he's so worth it. I've been neglecting him this festival.

[A]

How old?

[B]

He will be 2 in July. So he's like a teenager. Yeah.

[A]

Oh, that's so cute.

[B]

He's a. He goes during festival. He goes to daycare every day. Just because I feel bad. Like, I just feel like a bad parent. During festival, do you live alone? I live alone. Yeah.

[A]

Like in the Sims.

[B]

In the. Yeah. I don't. I need people. Needs no one. I wish I'll be at home, like, what's everyone doing?

[A]

But then a Golden Retriever seems perfect. Right? And really social.

[B]

A really social guy. It's so nice to come home from. If I have, like, a bad show or something, and then he's just there like, hey, I still love You.

[A]

Oh, I love. What's his name?

[B]

Billy. I'll show you Billy.

[A]

Show me Billy. Billy.

[B]

I know. He's so precious.

[A]

Oh, that's an adorable dog.

[B]

That's a beautiful dog.

[A]

Oh, well done on that life choice.

[B]

Thank you.

[A]

Feels like the perfect thing to do

[B]

some days where I'm like, did I make the wrong decision? But then there's other days where I'm like, I can't imagine not having him now.

[A]

And I think that's normal for any relation, relationship, child, anything. You have days where you go, oh, no. And then you realize, no, it's fine.

[B]

You're like, it's worth. It's worth the work. It's worth the effort.

[A]

When my. When I got my dog, my therapist laughed out loud and said, oh, you do know that you never get the dog you want. You get the dog you need.

[B]

Oh, wow. I like that.

[A]

Do you find that?

[B]

I guess so. I mean, I knew I always wanted a golden retriever as my first dog solo dog. And I. I live in an apartment, so. But I, you know, I work for myself. I work from home, so I am able to walk in heaps. And I guess he has helped with my health because I'm doing, like 10, 000 steps a day, and he is a lot of work, but it's forced me to be social with my neighbors. I'm friends with so many of my neighbors now from just, like, going to the park, and I think he was kind of the dog I was meant to get at this point in my life, for sure. He's kind of forced me to, like, go outside a lot and be social, so. Oh, and he's just so. He's. He's actually just like me in dog form. He's really chill and gentle, but also a bit weird and really sensitive and get scared easily. Oh, yeah. So he's. He's kind of like me.

[A]

And do you. Okay, this is a deep one. Oh, so do you. Other things that you see in him that you have in yourself that maybe is easier to then deal with because it's happening to someone, something you really love? Do you know what I mean? Maybe because Hank is stubborn. Like, really stubborn, but really smart. So there are times when I'm like, how are you still not wanting to get your harness on to go? You love walks, but you're refusing to do the thing that makes it easy for you to go. And what? And I'm like, oh, hi. Hi, me. And it's fine because I love him.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I'm like, maybe I should have compassion again, like, towards myself. If I feel like this about him, I should feel like this about myself.

[B]

That's so true. How hard are we on ourselves? Hey.

[A]

Right?

[B]

Are you hard on yourself? Yeah, I'm so hard on.

[A]

I'm reading Self Compassion by Kristen Neff.

[B]

Is it good?

[A]

You need to read it, like, once a year.

[B]

I need to read something, like, especially during this festival. I've been so hard on myself. I need a book like that.

[A]

The thing that we tell ourselves, you know, illogically, is, well, if I'm hard on myself, I'll do better. That's not how things work.

[B]

I know.

[A]

So false. But we're like, but if I was nice to myself, I would never get anything done. That's just not the case. The nicer you are to yourself, the better you are at the thing.

[B]

I know. Because you're telling yourself, like, I can do anything. I. I have everything I need. But then we just forget that.

[A]

Unless I'm a piece of shit.

[B]

Yeah. It's like I could do everything if I wasn't such a stupid fucking up. But I'm.

[A]

I'm trying so hard. I. My God, like, five minutes before you came to this hotel, I saw my ex. And I've been planning because I knew there was a risk that I'd run into him.

[B]

Wait, wait, wait, wait. Your ex lives in Melbourne?

[A]

Yes. Right now he does.

[B]

Oh.

[A]

And so I knew I was. I've been like, okay, I'm probably gonna run into him, so what am I gonna say? And I was, like, practicing, like, hi, how are you? I hope you're well. Like, I hope you don't think this is weird. Like, I've been practicing that. Doesn't that sound natural? Hi. I hope you're well. It's very good.

[B]

Sounds very mature.

[A]

But I hadn't thought about the sort of getting to that point. So suddenly he didn't see me, but I saw him. And, like. So in a split second, I was like. And he's like, get his attention. So I went like.

[B]

He was like.

[A]

He was a dog or a horse or something.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And then he didn't turn around.

[B]

Oh.

[A]

So people around me were just like,

[B]

well, he just walked past.

[A]

He didn't see me. Or like he heard it, but maybe he didn't.

[B]

Hey, maybe he wasn't meant to see you.

[A]

That's what. That's what I'm leaning against that.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

The pain was how many people saw me go to a grown man.

[B]

You know what? They don't matter. Their opinion of You. None of your business. They could be like that horse lady. Let her do her thing, you know, that's. And they can.

[A]

Thank you. She communicates.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah. Wait, so I'm guessing you can't say too much about this ex on here. Do I know them?

[A]

You maybe know them.

[B]

Okay. Oh, my God. I don't even know this is either an.

[A]

This is a pa. That's a Patreon kind of conversation.

[B]

Oh, yeah.

[A]

We'll get full names and addresses on

[B]

the Patreon address, tax file number. Wait, is he Australian?

[A]

You know the thing where. This is me ignoring that question in a very elegant way. It's that thing of where you eat, and then for the rest of your life, some of your food will have some stench on it.

[B]

I have so many questions, but I feel like you're not going to answer them.

[A]

I feel like I'm not legally allowed to answer.

[B]

Oh, tell me after that. Yeah, because I'm so. My head is just like, I just need to know.

[A]

I know.

[B]

Okay, we'll get to it later.

[A]

We'll get to them. And I. Oh. And every single fiber in my body want to just say everything to everyone about everything, but that. Then lawyers get involved, and we shouldn't do that anyways.

[B]

Are you an oversharer?

[A]

Yeah. I have to fight it really hard. And I think it's. I think I. It's because I love it when other people do it.

[B]

Yeah, me too.

[A]

I love it when people just like, oh, cool.

[B]

We're all just being open and honest.

[A]

Yes, exactly.

[B]

And then sometimes you say something, people go, oh. And you're like, oh, did I cross a line? I thought we're just being open.

[A]

And also, if you. If you. I. I like to. About things, but I. I feel like I always do it with, like, so much compassion in my head. So I'll go, what a. And then in my head I'll add, but of course, she may have, you know, been going through something, and actually, I want her to be happy, and. And I understand that she should. But then people don't hear that. They just hear, she's a bitch.

[B]

Exactly.

[A]

And then they go, I know, but you're like, I quite like her. And you're like, no, but I also like her.

[B]

But I also see that she's trying to heal, but she sucks.

[A]

But she sucks.

[B]

That's not my fault. And that annoys me, and that annoys me. And I'm the main person,

[A]

and I deserve more.

[B]

I deserve the best. But we do deserve the best.

[A]

We do deserve the Best. And I think you should read Self Compassion. It's really good. One of the things she says is this thing of everyone just wants to belong. Everyone just wants to be part of something. And when I started looking through that as like a. The filter of seeing other people, through that filter, you go, oh, so maybe everyone aren't out to get me and attack me. Maybe they all just want to belong.

[B]

I know. Okay. Is it an audiobook? I might listen to this.

[A]

It's also an audiobook.

[B]

Yes. Thank God. I don't have the capacity to read anything right now.

[A]

It's even better as an audiobook, I think.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Because someone's telling you.

[B]

Is it a woman's voice?

[A]

I think so.

[B]

I think she.

[A]

I feel like she maybe read it herself.

[B]

I. Because I need that, like the tenderness and kindness of a woman. I. I hope it sounds like someone I would come out to. You know what I mean?

[A]

Yeah, yeah. You're not, you're not out?

[B]

No, I'm out. But like, just that. Vi, imagine if this is me coming out.

[A]

Do not figure out. Oh, no.

[B]

What do you mean? Nah, I just love people who have that vibe. You're like, oh, I'd come out to you.

[A]

Yeah. I feel like self help books by men, they're very rarely like, it's always

[B]

like, what are you trying to prove?

[A]

Yeah, it's like, yes, okay. You know about, you know about mental health? Sure. You do?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Can you tell a woman to tell me what you just said?

[B]

Good. Thank you so much. Yeah. Get a woman to translate that to me, then I'll understand.

[A]

Do you. Is there a thing in. Because I really love what you said about approaching like comedy and content creation from just like, what would be really fun and nice to do. So are there any things that you've tried to do on stage or in content creation that just has never worked? Like something you've just never. Is there a thing you're trying? Like, you know that thing where you go, like, one day this will.

[B]

Well, I mean, in content create. Well, I've tried characters and just random things that don't work and then I kind of abandon them. Unless it's something I really love that I'm like, this will. People will eventually catch on and then I might do it for a bit longer and sometimes people vibe with it. But I also get bored of things quickly and I do move on. But on stage, I sometimes think, and I think I need to get better with this as well. I sometimes think my humor doesn't always translate to the masses and, and I think it's because sometimes I'm a bit more subtle or I don't know what it is. And I think that's been the beauty in finding my audience online because they come to my shows and they already know my vibe and like, they know they just kind of get me a bit more. But I think it has made me a little bit lazy with my joke writing and with my stand up because I'm used to the people coming and just knowing my vibe. And then, then I'll go into a club and I'll bomb and I'll be like, oh, well, they don't get me. But I think doing this character show, I'm having fun, but I really miss stand up. And I just want to. Because I used to gig a lot, like years ago, like in New York and in Brisbane, and I used to write jokes. New York?

[A]

You lived in New York?

[B]

I did.

[A]

You did.

[B]

You said.

[A]

Wait, what's your story? What's your. When did you start? What did you.

[B]

Born in Brisbane. Born in Brisbane, 1993.

[A]

Okay. Yes. No, let's go all the way back.

[B]

Yeah, had a great childhood, but then I was gay, so that was hard. No, I lived in Brisbane till 2018 and then I moved to New York and then I moved back in 2021 and then I moved to Sydney in 2021 and then I moved to Melbourne in 2024.

[A]

And did you start doing stand up

[B]

in New York in Brisbane? About eight months before I went to New York.

[A]

Oh, so did you like. Do you do all like the. The New York comedy clubs where you. That they have a reputation for being really, really hard?

[B]

I did some like, I was still pretty new, but I did this thing called. What's it called? Is that the Broadway comedy club? And they have like a bringer show where you kind of audition and then I got a few like I had like a month long residency there where I just got some spots, but. And then I came out when I was in New York and then I started doing a lot of like queer mics and stuff like that in Brooklyn. But yeah, I was there for like 25. Yeah, 25 when I moved there.

[A]

Oh, so you came out quite late.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And when did you come out to yourself?

[B]

When did you know I knew I was gay when I was like 14, so. But I was just too scared. Yeah, I was scared.

[A]

It's Brisbane like a. Is that like a smaller. I've never been. Is it like a smaller, really nice.

[B]

Brisbane is kind of like the Texas of Australia. Well, Queensland is. Queensland's like the Texas and then bris. Yeah, Brisbane. It's. It's really interesting and there is a great art scene, but it is a bit more old school and a bit more, you know, like, rough and, like, rugby and, like. Yeah, so I was like, oh, I don't know, I don't like that. So, yeah, and then I went to New York and I was like, oh, now I feel safe to be myself every day. And. Yeah. And then I've never looked back, really.

[A]

Oh, it's hard to look back from that, isn't it? Hard to go back in.

[B]

So. Yeah, but. But, yeah, I think I really want to just get serious about stand up again because I think I got a bit lazy and I think I kind of relied on my characters a bit too much that. Yeah, I think I just got a bit lazy.

[A]

Could you not. I mean, you're absolutely not asking me for input here, but could you not do a thing where you do a character that's yourself? Like in this next character is, however old Australian, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, trying to do stand up and then you just do your stand up?

[B]

Yeah. Interesting.

[A]

Might add, like, a meta layer of, like, what is a character? Who am I, really?

[B]

Oh, that is a good idea.

[A]

And that's like a little.

[B]

Everyone will also be thinking, like, what's going on right now?

[A]

We haven't seen this character before, but maybe this is us meeting the actual Nick wise.

[B]

Yeah, it could be me just being like, guys, this is me doing, like, new material.

[A]

Here's a comedian doing new material at an open mic and this is you doing whatever you want.

[B]

How long have you been doing stand up?

[A]

16 years.

[B]

16 years.

[A]

16 years.

[B]

How old are you, can I ask?

[A]

37.

[B]

Oh, yeah, I know my age. 32.

[A]

I'm basically 32.

[B]

Same thing, basically. So you started when you're 21? Yeah, true. In Denmark.

[A]

It started in Denmark. In Danish.

[B]

Oh, you started in Danish, then two

[A]

years later moved to the uk. Yeah, never looked back until last year when I looked back.

[B]

Wait, so why'd you move back to Denmark?

[A]

Oh, many things, but I just. I was. Became the godfather of a lovely little girl and I wanted to be in her life.

[B]

Oh, that's nice.

[A]

Yeah, it was. And also I live with my mother, so I pay zero rent, which is a. That's a. That's very nice.

[B]

That is good.

[A]

I don't think people talk about it

[B]

enough after living in London for so

[A]

long, after paying everything I ever earned to rent.

[B]

Were you doing comedy full time? In London.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, true. I've been doing it for a while.

[B]

It's.

[A]

It's weird. Weird. It's very strange.

[B]

I love. I do shows in at the Angel Comedy Club every year.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

And I also did 21 Soho once and I did Underbelly Boulevard once.

[A]

That's a really beautiful venue. I haven't done it yet, but I'm considering doing it on my next tour. London is great.

[B]

I know. I love it and I do.

[A]

I love stand up so much and I love being at festivals because you're just surrounded by stand up and you can see so many shows.

[B]

I know. And I think, yeah, every festival I learn a big lesson because it's just a pressure cooker for a month and then it's over and I go, whoa. And then I play the Sims for a week. But then after that I reflect and I think this, this one I've just learned like, I think I like to back myself with my abilities and my characters and stuff, but also that I do love stand up and I want to prioritize it again.

[A]

Do you know yet what your big lesson for this one is?

[B]

I think, I think I'm. I will need to process and figure it out, but I think that those are two. Like, don't. I think like just working on that compassion and just like my self doubt has been crazy this festival and I think, yeah, really revisiting stand up and like getting passionate about it again and. And just kind of trusting the path. I need to trust the path.

[A]

We need to trust the path.

[B]

I know. Well, we trust the path. It's hard too.

[A]

It's. It's what I. What I think what I thought was trusting the path was that was actually me trying to control the path.

[B]

Really? Yeah.

[A]

I was like, no, of course I trust the path and the path is this and it will end there.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But that's not what it is.

[B]

So easy to think. You know what the path has in store for you. Hey.

[A]

It is very, very hard to realize. Oh. Actually that means shutting up and not trying to plan and just letting things happen.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But then when you do that, great things happen.

[B]

Oh, I'm excited. How long have you been trusting the path?

[A]

Since like last night. No, but this is like you are. Everything you're saying is like on Wednesday, you know, Lara Ricata.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Incredible comedian, clown. And just as like a. The art form. Not like and a moron. And she. On Wednesday she kind of just grabbed me and was like, are you an artist? I was like, oh my God. Maybe I don't know. And she was like, what's your truth? Like, are you saying the truth in your show? And I was like, oh, I know. I don't think I am. And then I had like a complete, like, artistic breakdown of just looking at my show going, oh, no, I'm not actually saying the thing I want to say. I'm saying the thing I think I should be saying or the thing I wish I was saying.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And then I spent five hours last night rewriting it completely, throwing out half the show and just going up on stage going. I was just like, I'm. I'm sorry. I'm having notes on stage now because I'm gonna say so much stuff I haven't said before, and it's gonna be a mess. It's not going to be perfect. And you're going to be the first people to hear this and maybe the last. And are you in? And they were. And I said, okay, here we go. And then I just did, you know, a lot of the same stuff, but then a very, very big, honest, raw, unedited, very, very honest and vulnerable bit. And then it was incred. Not that the show was incredible, but like, I felt like, oh, I just said the thing I meant, I was meant to say this whole time.

[B]

Oh, I wish I could see your show.

[A]

It was. I hope you will. Are you gonna do Edinburgh or something?

[B]

I think when I write my stand up show for next year, that I'm already thinking about that. I don't. I love this character show and this one's more like for the fans to see the characters in real life. But I'm like, I'm not. I think I need to be speaking my truth as well. I think that's the thing. And I think, which I did with my last show, I loved my last show.

[A]

It was a great show. I loved it so much.

[B]

Thank you.

[A]

I really loved it.

[B]

Thank you.

[A]

And you do just create there some. I also say, I think we have a tendency, those of us who've been doing this for, for long and who've been doing it in like, spaces like London and New York, and we tend to see stand up as a specific thing. You know, it's the Louis CK it's the John Mulaney. Like, there's like a. This is what real standup is. And then anything that is not that is like, you know, are we cheating? Are we just doing a thing? Like, my audience just kind of loves whatever I say, so it can't be like real stand. Like, if they don't laugh in the clubs. It's probably not good standard, and I think we need to just kind of go away from that and be like, that's like a genre that's, like, doing jazz but being like, oh, but it's not rock. Like, it's not.

[B]

I know.

[A]

And we just have to go, well, if they laugh, it's probably funny.

[B]

I agree. And I think we just also have to trust that, like, we are funny people who know what we're doing, and we work hard, and we just have to trust our voice.

[A]

It's.

[B]

It's kind of.

[A]

It's kind of difficult, guys. This is a real house.

[B]

It's not easy.

[A]

I don't think anyone can really relate. Everyone.

[B]

During this festival, I've just been talking to friends, being like, how are you? And they're like, you know, is my mic working? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[A]

Oh, yeah.

[B]

Cool. Just. Just.

[A]

I'm editing you out of this, and

[B]

I would be fine with that now. I'm kidding. I actually wouldn't, but, no, it is hard. And you know what? I want to say I'm proud of us.

[A]

I'm proud of us. I think we're doing really well.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

I think we're doing really well.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Right? Yes.

[B]

Yes, yes.

[A]

Are you a daydream, dreamer? Do you daydream?

[B]

I. Yeah, I would say I. I am a daydreamer. Yeah.

[A]

What's your daydream? What is it, like, award speeches or, like, is it romantic? Is it.

[B]

Oh, romantic, probably. Yeah. I am so ready for a boyfriend. Even during this festival, I'm like, it'd be so good to have someone to just, like, feed and walk my dog. And then I could come home to them and vent and be like, the crowd was like this tonight, but. And I just don't have that. Yeah. But I think I need to do a bit of work on myself, and then I'll find that that's the plan. This time last year, I had a boyfriend, but that was only for four months.

[A]

Do you know what the work is that you need to do?

[B]

Compassion for myself.

[A]

Yeah. Is that because otherwise you would. You would make them like. Is that because otherwise you would find a partner to give you the thing you can't give yourself?

[B]

Maybe. Or I also just sometimes think because I'm so hard on myself, I think that probably makes me a bit harder on other people as well. And maybe when I'm more critical of myself, I'm more critical of others. And I think. And, like, I don't know this honestly, the last few Months have just been like, a bit of a pressure cooker mentally for me. But I made a lot of good progress last year. Last year, I was kind of just floating around like, it just comes in waves. But I think I need to just have a bit of a reset after this festival. It's kind of. Yeah. How many times have I brought up that I'm struggling this month?

[A]

Feels like it's not. Feels like it's not ideal.

[B]

Well, I just think it's. It's just made me really question things, like. Just like what we're kind of just talking about, like, what kind of comedian do I want to be?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But I think that's good. I think if I just went into this festival and I was like, everything's fine, then it's like, how am I going to grow?

[A]

I think growth hurts.

[B]

I know. So even though I'm, like, kind of going through it this month, I do every festival. I'm just a sensitive boy, so I know it's going to all pay off.

[A]

It's good to know at least. My therapist once said that all progress is two steps forward, one step back. Because when you make, like, a big leap and a big, like, big. How to process progress, your brain, like, you panic, you go, oh, no, this is very new. Oh, no, what if this is, like, it wants to go back to what was safe. So every time you make progress, you go, oh, okay, I'm gonna go back in my cave and do the stuff that usually works.

[B]

And.

[A]

And then once you're like. Then you make two steps forward again.

[B]

Yeah. Because then you're kind of used to whatever that was. You're like, okay, I've done that. So now that's not.

[A]

Now. The. The thing that was scary is now kind of old. And then.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So usually when I'm, like, having a rough time, well, I check my period app, and usually it's that. Other than that, it's like, oh, yeah, I've just done a really big scary thing. I've just been really brave. I've just done a really good thing. So of course, I'm now panicking and, you know, retreating into what felt safe.

[B]

Yeah, true.

[A]

So it could just be, like, growth spurs.

[B]

And I think it's just a growth spurt. A spiritual growth spurt.

[A]

But. And are you spiritual? Do you believe in, like, the universe?

[B]

Yeah, big time.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

What's your thing? What's your things like tarot crystals, universe, religion.

[B]

If a tarot video pops up, I watch it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And even if I'm like, There's no way this is about my life. I. It still makes me think about the things in my life that I can connect it to, but I really think that I believe in. Everything's connected. Everything is energy, vibration, and it's like, I believe in all of that. I just forget it sometimes.

[A]

Yeah, same. And I just feel like there are people who do it every day. They do tarot every day. They have their crystals every day. And I envy it because I forget that it exists. And then as soon as it comes into my life, I'm like, you know

[B]

what I saw last night? Do you know Hughesy? David Hughes?

[A]

Yeah. Yeah.

[B]

He's like the biggest comedian in Australia, pretty much. And I saw a clip of him last night, and it was just, like, really profound. And he's just like, yeah. I just, like, every journal entry, I end it with saying everything's funny and nothing really matters.

[A]

And.

[B]

Because, you know, we all create our own reality. And I just say things to myself every day. I say, you're the funniest comedian. And even though you might not think that's true, it's my reality. I create my reality. You create your reality. And I'm like, hughesy is so right. Wow. We create our own reality. And it's like. And if people disagree with what we think or say, it's like, as long as we're not harming other people, it's like we can think whatever we want to think because it does create our reality. And I watched that and I went, okay, Hughesy.

[A]

Huh?

[B]

And then I watched a bunch of YouTube videos last night. Just also, every night during the festival, I hit my weed vape because I'm

[A]

like, you need to just.

[B]

I just need to. But it's kind of good because then I watch videos of, like, we create our own reality. And I go, we low key. Do we picky?

[A]

Do.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Do you do morning pages? Do you journal?

[B]

I don't do morning pages, but I do journal pretty. I'd say at least once a week.

[A]

Okay. Because that is a game changer.

[B]

I know I don't do it as much as I should, but usually. So when it's not festival time, I Usually on a Friday night, my ritual is I smoke a joint. Like, one joint a week on a Friday night. And then I just, like, kind of. I just, like, get really calm and, like, my ego is dissolved, and I just kind of process things I've been thinking and feeling, and I just journal. And I'm like, oh, you were just feeling this because of this. But Everything's actually fine. And like, and then like I feel so reset and it's so good. I feel like recalibrated, you know, I love that.

[A]

And there's a ritual.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Like a self care ritual.

[B]

Yeah. Because like during the week life is just a bit crazy. So I don't have time to always be like, hang on, you have this feeling, let's think about why. And I'm like, I don't have time every day. So like once a week I like really check in with myself and I just, I'll be like, hey, everything's actually fine. That thing you were feeling, you're just feeling that because of this negative thought you had because of this childhood wound. Everything's fine.

[A]

Yes. When I re. The thing about like we create our own reality. When I, I remember realizing that when I was 21 or something when it was about body image because someone was, it was so simple. Someone was like, oh, you feel the way you do because of adverts. And I was like. And it just like, wait a minute. There's no objective truth that fat is bad or you have to look like this to be pretty. Because every single person have their own object, subjective experience. So that means that if I say I'm pretty, I'm pretty because that's my truth.

[B]

And then any.

[A]

Everyone else will have exactly their own truth. But there is no objective, there's no. Because everything is created in like systems and, and history and society. And it blew my mind and fixed a lot of things. So why, why do we need, why do I need to be reminded of that like once a week? I know, because why is that not the same?

[B]

Because our brains are just wired to like, for us to suffer. I say stop that. I say stop that, please.

[A]

But it's also our brains trying to protect us.

[B]

I know. And it's like, thank you.

[A]

It's like, thank you. Thank you. Please stop.

[B]

Thank you. Next. Thank you. Stop. But I think, I think, yeah, I think that's with this festival. I have been comparing myself too much to other people. And I think it's because I've been questioning the kind of show that I'm doing. And then I get really in my head and then I was like, wait, it doesn't matter what other people think. I'm doing a show that I think is fun, my audience are enjoying it. So I'm like, truly, why am I suffering for no reason?

[A]

And also how many people are comparing themselves to you? I know, going, oh my God, I should be doing that. Or like, I'M not posting enough. Or I'm like, we're all doing.

[B]

Never ending. We're all doing it.

[A]

We're all just like, I messaged Elf Lyons. I saw her whip, and I was like, oh, my God, I forgot to tell you. I loved your whip. And she was like, I thought you hated it. And I was like, yeah, I. Every single time I know a comedian is in my audience and they haven't messaged me afterwards, I'm like, yeah, they hate the show. They hate me. They want me to die. Yeah. Everyone wants me to die right now. This is horrible. I might as well go kill myself. Like.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I didn't do it myself because I was like, does she know she's great? Like, everyone loved her. She doesn't.

[B]

And that's the other thing. You always assume everyone else knows they're killing it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Like, I went to a really good. I went to Kate Dolan show.

[A]

I've heard great things.

[B]

Oh, my God, it was so good.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And the night I went, I. I was like, everyone's loving this. And then I messaged her after. I was like, oh, my God, so good. And she's like, oh, that was. That was hard work. Right? Like, they did. Like, that wasn't great, was it? I was like, are you serious? If that's your bad night. I was like, babe, we're all. We're all hard on ourselves.

[A]

It was so hard on. I had a man in my audience, which is fine, but just them being there, which is fine. That's. Whatever. I can't change that.

[B]

But, like, who knows what he was doing there?

[A]

But we have to maybe. What? He tried to find the bathroom, and it went into my show, but he was in the front row, like, right in front of me. And he was like this the whole time, like, moving.

[B]

Oh, wait, I know him.

[A]

The man.

[B]

The man in the comedy show, the Shaky Man.

[A]

And he would, like, comment. And, like, every time I held a pause that was, like, longer than a couple of seconds, he'd go, like. And then what? What? And then, like, just like, mumbles are like, oh, yeah. Like, if I, like, asked a rhetorical question, he would immediately try and answer. And the whole show is just like this. And because no one else could hear him, because it was just, like, right up here. And I was like, I'm gonna look insane if I suddenly go, shut the fuck up. Yeah, someone in the audience. And it was so. And everyone who saw that show who was like, oh, good show, or whatever, I was like, no, that was. I hope I wish you hadn't seen that. But they hadn't noticed it. Yeah, but I was rushing through the whole show because I didn't want him to leave, to have any gaps, to say something.

[B]

That's so annoying.

[A]

But it's so weird how, again, everyone had their own subjective experience, and that was not my objective idea of what it was. Oh, my God. Anyways, in Sophie Land, which is, by the way, the title of the podcast and what you're doing right now.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Everything will be very nice, and everything is very nice. And I've decided that of course you can. You can stay here if you want, but you can also leave. It's not that kind of dictatorship. And I would also love for you to be on the government if you want.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And you can make a law. I can veto it, but you can make a law.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

To make this place a nicer place. What would you do?

[B]

Well, I don't know if this is too drastic, but I. I'm quite impatient when I'm. When I'm a pedestrian. And I don't know if we've walked around Melbourne CBD much, but people just don't know how to walk. And I think we should design maybe like one. Maybe like four lanes. Well, I guess it would maybe three lanes one way, three lanes the other way. Different walking speeds. First lane, you can dawdle and you can even stop if you want. Second lane, you're not in a rush, but you're. You're moving. Third lane, People who are in a rush, like me.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Because I. Because every time during this festival, I'm like, oh, I'm going to, like, this other gig or to see another show.

[A]

I'll just. I'll walk.

[B]

I'll walk 20 minutes. And then it ends up being stressful because I'm like, get the fuck out of my way. So. Something like that. What do you think?

[A]

What I love and what people might know when they listen this, I think. I don't remember who did it, but one of the first people who mentioned this just said, death penalty for anyone who walks.

[B]

Oh, okay.

[A]

And then Celia, you know Celia Pakula.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

She added just one fast lane, and you're going all the way in. So, like, we need more structure, and I'm way more on the more structured thing.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

So what this means is that the citizens are of Sophie land. They've been through a little bit of a. It was a rough first week, but now. Now, at least they're not there.

[B]

Now we're kind of meeting them at a Place where it's like, we won't kill you.

[A]

Okay, too.

[B]

But we need to do something.

[A]

And also. But what I like is that the idea of a fast lane would also stress me out because I'd be like, am I fast enough? But having a medium lane, I feel like that's my lane. That's my lane. I'm moving, but I'm not running.

[B]

And then some days, hey, maybe I'll dip my toe into the fast lane. Other days I. I can't do the fast lane.

[A]

But then what will we do when a gay and a non binary walk together? Because the gays will be over there whilst the non binary will be, like, stuck in the medium lane.

[B]

Well, then they. One of them will have to compromise.

[A]

Or we'll just meet you there.

[B]

Or meet you there. But I think that's where we can't do everything. We've done enough by providing the lanes. Now it's up to them. We say, hey, you figure it out now.

[A]

You figure it out.

[B]

I've done my job.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I say, I'm doing the comedy festival. I came up with the idea for the lanes. I'm done.

[A]

Yeah, that's true. That's.

[B]

That's above my pay grade to kind of. You know what I mean?

[A]

And in Sophie land, we will have a bunch of experts who, if anything comes up.

[B]

I love the sound of this place.

[A]

It's actually very good.

[B]

How do you pay for all this?

[A]

We tax the billionaires and they're the only ones not allowed to leave.

[B]

Okay. Yeah. So they live there.

[A]

That's how we fix that.

[B]

Many people live in Sophie land.

[A]

As many as well as who wants to.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

And it's big enough for everyone and people can come in if they want.

[B]

I love this.

[A]

Yes. Everything is. It makes.

[B]

Have you done a live show called Sophie land?

[A]

Not yet.

[B]

Do you know the New York comedian or. I think she lives in L. A now. Her name's Courtney o'. Donnell.

[A]

No.

[B]

Is it o'? Connell? O'. Donnell, I think I used to gig with her in New York, but she has this, like, fictitious world called Planet Courtney.

[A]

Lovely.

[B]

And she's built this whole world about it, and it's like. It's just so funny. And now she does live shows called Planet Courtney.

[A]

I love that.

[B]

So it's like really just world building this. It's very, like. I don't know how to explain it. It's like, very. About consumerism and like, just like real, like, weird. Like, I don't know. It's really funny, but I just Love how she's world built it to the point where she does live shows as it now.

[A]

I love that. And also how the Sims of her. How are the Sims of us? How are the Sims? Wait, what Sims? The Sims.

[B]

What about it?

[A]

World building.

[B]

Oh, I know building. Do you. I'm going to start doing live. No, not live. I'm going to start doing house tours on YouTube of my Sims houses.

[A]

Cuz I Do you know Daniel Fox? The comedian Daniel Fox?

[B]

No, his last name's Fox.

[A]

F O X X Fox.

[B]

Oh, Fox. Oh. I was like, whoa. Does he like claims to. Oh, Daniel Fox? No, I don't Fox.

[A]

So he, he built Deborah Vance, the one from Hacks I Love. He built her entire house in the. In the in the Sims.

[B]

Took him age her Vegas house.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

And did like played her whole life in the Sims to be like correct.

[B]

Oh, wow.

[A]

And he, he sent me a video of the tour through the house and it's incredible. Like the details are incredible.

[B]

Oh, see I love that show. I love house tours and I would watch, watch that. So then I'm like. And people are like, would you ever do house tours? And I'm like, I should because I spend a lot of time on my houses.

[A]

Oh, I love that. I'm so bad at building the houses.

[B]

I love it.

[A]

I manage just very practical.

[B]

Well, that's all you need.

[A]

This very like square one.

[B]

Your people live in real simple houses and they live alone.

[A]

They live alone. But then. And there's usually some kind of like some sunroom, like an outhouse, all windows and plants.

[B]

That's what you need. Do you have pets?

[A]

I can't do that. I feel so guilty.

[B]

I always neglect them when my.

[A]

The Sims are like walking their dog while my dog is real life dog is sitting next to me and I'm like, no, sorry, we can't walk right now.

[B]

Yeah, I know.

[A]

I need to play with this dog and this fake dog. I can't do it.

[B]

Yeah, that's so fake.

[A]

I can't do it.

[B]

My dogs sometimes run away on the Sims because they get so neglected and then.

[A]

Yeah, but I'll have a. I'll have a cow and a horse.

[B]

Oh God, yeah. And chickens.

[A]

Or chickens and the llama. Whatever it is.

[B]

I can't wait to play the Sims.

[A]

I'm really.

[B]

10 days from now.

[A]

Have you tried the new one? The Kings and queens one?

[B]

No, I don't know if that's my vibe.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

I like realism.

[A]

I like the. The land is fun. It's a fun landscape.

[B]

Okay. True.

[A]

Yeah, I like that one. But man, I got it for free. So I was like, fine, but I wouldn't have.

[B]

Oh, I got heaps of them for. I did a brand deal with the Sims like a year and a half ago.

[A]

Dream.

[B]

And then my manager's like, oh, yeah. They said you can have some of the games for free if you want. I sent this big list.

[A]

Yeah. All of them. Could be everything.

[B]

Yeah. All the kits I got heaps. I didn't. I didn't get them all. I didn't want to be greedy. But I got a lot.

[A]

What, they can't afford it.

[B]

I kind of left like one off the list.

[A]

Haven't they just like sold themselves to some kind of Saudi Arabia or something? They can afford to give you all

[B]

the games, but I think Will Wright, the creator of the Sims, he's up to something again. He's doing something which I am.

[A]

A good thing.

[B]

A good thing. Because I don't think he's involved in the Sims anymore. Oh, I think he's gone.

[A]

And ethical Sims would be fun.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And we wanna.

[B]

But I think it's gonna be like VR ish.

[A]

Oh, yeah, yeah.

[B]

We'll see. We'll see.

[A]

I just want one where you can be in a band.

[B]

Oh, yes.

[A]

That would be incredible. I want to be able to be in the. I don't want to be a stand up comedian on the Sims.

[B]

You can be a pop star.

[A]

I want to be in a band.

[B]

Okay. That's fair.

[A]

I want to play a lot of instruments.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Get something out of it. This is my truth. That's my truth.

[B]

Sometimes that's how I find out what my truth is or what kind of want. I just. I see the dream life I make for my Sims and I go, okay, that's what I should be striving for. Yeah.

[A]

The country house.

[B]

Yeah. Or they're always like. They're like painters and authors and comedians and musicians and. And they're all. And I'm like, oh, I should be exercising more too because I watch how much I make that. I'm like, yeah, I should probably do what they're doing.

[A]

I want to get my max. Max body.

[B]

My body's low at the moment. My creativity's high though. Yeah. My writing's high.

[A]

Yeah. Publish several books a day.

[B]

And I publish several books a day. Have you written a book before?

[A]

Two.

[B]

Have you really?

[A]

Two books.

[B]

Whoa. What are they?

[A]

One is called Happy Fat about why it's okay to be fat. And then the other one is called Will I ever have Sex again. Which is about how I hadn't had sex in a long time. Oh, say I hadn't.

[B]

We can say haven't, haven't, or hadn't.

[A]

It's about how I hadn't, but I still haven't.

[B]

Oh, you still haven't. True. Oh, that's interesting. Where can I find these books?

[A]

In any good bookshop and on the Internet? I actually think it is in Australia.

[B]

Oh, cool.

[A]

I'll try and get them.

[B]

I know you were an author as well.

[A]

Author as well.

[B]

What haven't you done?

[A]

Why haven't I done exercise? Exercise. Worked on my abandonment issues. But other than that.

[B]

Yeah, burst time.

[A]

Who has time for that? I'll try and get you some copies. That would be very, very fun.

[B]

Oh, yeah.

[A]

But tell people where to go and see you. So are you doing anything other than this festival? I don't think they'll. This will come out in time.

[B]

Only doing. I'm doing two shows in Sydney, one show in Brisbane. I've decided I'm not going to tour this show.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

To the extent I tour every other show. Just because, I mean, we've already discussed it's. I like this show, but I want to tour a show that is me speaking my truth. I think so. Next year. Yeah, next year. Catch me on the road next year. Well, it depends what happens with the world, but yeah, yeah, that's the other thing.

[A]

But the world is still there. Next year, Catch me on the goddamn road.

[B]

Otherwise, next shelter, everything is okay. Next year I will definitely be back in the UK and I'll be everywhere. So just follow me on Instagram Nick White49.

[A]

Yeah, love that. Thank you so much for doing this. We're gonna do a little Patreon thing.

[B]

Okay, nice. Thanks for having me.

[A]

Thank you. That is also, by the way, our jingle. We I temporary jingle. Okay. I will eventually try and get like a. A newer one. Or maybe I don't. Maybe I. Maybe I don't. Maybe I just keep this one. I. I'll tell you a little bit about this. This jingle madness. I thought I could make my own jingle. I went to a website where you could. Could click on instruments and then you could like mix it all together. And I thought surely I can just like bring ding dong ding and then that will become a jingle and then I can use that. Because I refuse. Refuse to use AI. Refuse which everything. Every single person I asked was like, you can just use AI to make a jingle? No, no. But also turns out I can't just improvise playing instruments So I searched for the word jingle on my computer and I found the jingles for all of my old podcasts. And I found this little beautiful instrumental that was originally created by Harriet Brain. And I emailed her and I said, harriet, may I use this little instrumental that you originally made for the Made of Human podcast? Can I use that in my new podcast, Sophie Land? And I think it's beautiful and lovely. And now we have. Now I don't have to sing like a. Like a mad person before and after the podcast. And I'm very, very happy. What about that Nick White? Wasn't that great? Isn't he great? Isn't he lovely? You can hear more Nick White stuff if you sign up for Patreon and or substack links in the show notes and on the website and everywhere. It's not hard to find. And that means that then the podcast will become weekly because then every other Tuesday you have a main episode. Then every other Tuesday other than the other, that one, the up the other other Tuesday, you get a bonus episode right in your feed. How lovely is that? I highly recommend. And then you help. You help support the pod, you help support the podcast and me. And me. Hey, do you know what? I would love to not still live with my mother when I'm 40, please. And come see me on tour. See me in Edinburgh. I hope you enjoy my new show. I am loving it very, very much. And I feel like there was one more thing I had to say. Now it's gone. I'll say it next week. If you. If you're watching this on YouTube, by the way. Hi. Hello. It's new podcasting on video for me. New. A lot of editing goes into it. So thank you for watching. Or Spotify. I guess you can watch on Spotify as well. Anyways, if you're watching. Hello. Isn't it great that everything's video now? Isn't that lovely? Didn't we all just ask for that? Didn't we all just think it was like the time there was radio and people just went, oh, can we just see the people doing the radio? You know how everyone said that? Yeah, great, great, great, great. Love you guys. I'll speak to you next week or next. Next week. Next episode. I'll speak to you next episode. Okay, bye. Thank you so much for listening to that episode. If you want some sweet, sweet, sweet special extra bonus content, do go and sign up to Patreon or Substack and within the week, you'll get an extra fun bonus episode. And there's so much fun and there are so much. Did I mention fun? Go to Patreon or Substack. The links are in the show notes and I'll see you on tour. I'll be all over the place. The Edinburgh Fringe, Soho Theater, Denmark, Sweden, Germany, Netherlands and all over the uk. And more dates will be announced soon. Please sign up for my newsletter. The link is also in the show notes and just big thank you. Thank you for subscribing. Thank you for telling people about the podcast. It's completely self produced. I don't know if I've mentioned it, but I love you very much and thank you for listening and I will speak to you again soon. Thank you so much. Bye. Here's the end jingle made by me.