Some Work, All Play — Episode 14: Heart Rate Training & Translating Enthusiasm to the Work Environment

Hosts: David Roche and Megan Roche, M.D.
Date: September 15, 2020

Overview

In this episode, David and Megan dive into the science and practicalities of heart rate training, dig deep into how enthusiasm and supportive coaching styles can transform environments like academia, and tackle questions about training for athletes of all experience and pace levels. As always, they infuse the conversation with lighthearted banter, personal anecdotes, and a lot of encouragement.

Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. The “Some Work, All Play” Playlist & Musical Motivation (00:02–06:31)

• Playlist Collaboration: The episode opens with the hosts playfully debating the curation of their new "Some Work All Play" playlist. Megan boasts an eclectic taste, while David roots for 90s/00s hip hop and pop-punk.
  • Notable quote (David, 00:35): "You have a much more sophisticated taste and...I come in with, like, the 90s, early 2000s hip hop..."
• Song Choices & Significance: Each shares two meaningful tracks:
  • David's picks:
    • "Walk it Out" by Unk — Motivates him for daily movement: "It speaks to me so much, like, on my soul level..." (01:28)
    • "Colorful" by Jukebox the Ghost — Inspires positivity and growth; notably, David listened to it on repeat for a 22-mile run (03:58): "My goal, is to get older, but to never grow up with you."
  • Megan's picks:
    • "Shake Ya Tail Feather" by Nelly — Brings unexpected joy on runs.
    • "Shake It Out" by Florence and The Machine — Touches on self-forgiveness and empowerment: "Whenever I listen to that song, I just, like, feel empowered and it's beautiful." (05:30)
• The Power of Music: Both agree that the right song can instantly improve a run or mood.

2. Life, Relationships, and Empathy in Unusual Times (06:31–11:08)

• Audience Engagement: Shoutout to listeners for great questions, leading to podcast content (06:31).
• 36 Questions Activity: David and Megan discuss completing (part of) the famous "36 questions to fall in love," leading to shared stories and bonding (07:03).
• First Day Back at School: Megan recounts Zoom woes, technical glitches, and renewed empathy for students and teachers adapting to online learning (09:08–10:19).
  • Notable quote (Megan, 09:57): "I'm just empathetic right now to teachers who are trying to make this education system work...I can't imagine what it's like...to be a younger student experiencing this."
• Hosts' Advice: Listeners are encouraged to have infinite empathy and "swag" for themselves in these challenging times.

3. Heart Rate Training: Theory & Practice (11:13–20:42)

a. Heart Rate Zones and Why They Matter

• Aerobic Threshold:
  • Transition from burning fat to carbohydrate as fuel; "easy" to "moderate" running.
  • Megan (11:47): "...the body often has enough oxygen to function without producing significant amounts of lactate..."
  • David (12:31): "It's more of just a general feel for what easy running is."
• Personal Learning Moments:
  • Both share anecdotes of overtraining when starting out—running hard every day led to fatigue, stagnation, and even hospital visits (14:12–14:47).
  • David (14:12): "I would do tempo runs, like, every single day...I had no idea it was the wrong way to do it."
  • Megan (14:47): "I go out the door, I run really hard to a point, and then I try to run back faster every day...It worked great for a period... until I hit up against those aerobic limitations."
• Key Learning: Nearly everyone benefits from spending most training time below aerobic threshold.

b. Lactate Threshold and VO2 Max

• Lactate Threshold:
  • The point when the body starts accumulating lactate faster than it clears it — roughly your fastest pace for an hour.
  • Overdoing these runs does more harm than good.
• VO2 Max:
  • Maximum oxygen uptake—mostly genetic, tough to test, but not highly trainable for most.
  • Emphasizes systems work in spectrums, not discrete jumps.

c. How to Determine Your Thresholds

• Lab Tests: Gold standard, but not practical for everyone.
• Field Tests:
  • The "Friel test" is recommended: 30-minute time trial, average HR of last 20 min = lactate threshold (17:01).
  • Use ~85% of that for aerobic threshold.
• MAF 180-age Formula: Noted as a “very rough estimate”.
• Spot-Checking: Confirm easy runs are truly easy; heart rate can spot-check you if you're bad at perceived effort (Megan, 17:43).

d. Practical Tips for Heart Rate Training

• Perceived Exertion vs. HR: RPE is great if honest, but HR helps those prone to under- or overestimating effort (18:22).
  • Megan (17:43): "If you're like me and you're kind of like zoning out..., it can be really helpful to have these metrics..."
• Use HR as Confirmation, Not Constant Fixation:
  • Don’t check your HR every second—review after workouts (18:54).
  • Wrist-worn HR monitors are unreliable for running; consider chest straps.
  • Heart rate data is “noisy”: altitude, temperature, caffeine, nutrition, and even a bad sensor battery can affect it (19:51).
• Heart Rate is Most Useful at Higher Mileage:
  • Lower-mileage runners can go more by feel (20:30).

4. Translating Enthusiasm from Coaching into Academia (20:44–26:15)

• Listener Question: Can a coaching mindset—positive feedback, encouragement—be effectively applied to teaching and mentoring students, especially in formal environments like academia?
• Hosts’ Answer:
  • YES—and it’s essential.
    • Megan (21:28): "...enthusiasm in academia is underrated...bringing that into academia...is going to be a problem-solver."
  • There’s a tradition of seriousness and withholding praise in academia/business that needs changing.
    • David (22:19): "There's this culture where you withhold affection...because I was abused as a graduate student...So I need to not then...give that to the next generation."
  • Lead with Affirmation and Openness: Use encouragement in emails, meetings, and feedback—even when others don’t immediately reciprocate. Set clear expectations and communicate openly.
    • Megan (23:05): "I've realized over time that when I'm not that way, when I'm just more authentic and enthusiastic, that it actually just creates a deeper level of conversation early on."
  • Model Unconditional Support: It’s contagious and transformative for teams, classrooms, or coaching squads. Criticism, when needed, should come from a "place of love."
    • David (25:09): "Formality is putting up barriers to openness..."
    • Megan (25:59): "It's so obvious when it comes from that place of unconditional support..."

5. Training for “Slow” Runners—Everyone Deserves Elite Coaching (26:16–29:49)

• Listener’s Dilemma: A passionate runner feels “stuck,” finds little advice tailored to slower or bigger athletes, and wonders if they should just “keep working.”
• Hosts’ Key Message: You are not a jogger, you’re an elite athlete boss.
  • David (26:59): "You are a freaking elite athlete boss. And embrace that elite athlete identity as the first step."
• Training Principles:
  • The same concepts that work for top athletes apply to everyone—periodization, variety, strides, and strength.
  • Strides and Intervals: Short bursts (e.g., 4x20 or 30 sec) are valuable for all levels; adapt with standing or walk recoveries as needed.
    • Megan (27:30): "We can tweak some of these principles a little bit to make them a little bit more sustainable...But it's the same thing."
  • Embrace Your Identity: Do the work, check your health (bloodwork if progress is stalled), and don’t talk yourself down.
• Find or Build Your Community: Support—whether from a team, coach, or online resources—is for everyone.
  • Megan (28:41): "...find a team that supports that passion. Like you are an elite athlete and you're deserving of a strength coach, a nutrition coach, a running coach..."
• End Note: “Be your own biggest fan”—no matter your speed, size, or experience, own your swag and do the work!

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

| Timestamp | Speaker | Quote | |-----------|---------|-------| | 00:51 | Megan | “Are you telling me that Nelly’s not sophisticated?” | | 03:58 | David | “My goal is to get older, but to never grow up with you.” | | 09:57 | Megan | “I’m just empathetic right now to teachers...I can’t imagine...to be a younger student experiencing this.” | | 14:12 | David | “I would do tempo runs, like, every single day...I had no idea it was the wrong way.” | | 17:01 | David | “What we really prefer is the Friel test...Essentially what it amounts to is a 30 minute time trial...” | | 22:19 | David | “There’s this culture where you withhold affection...And it creates this thing where, okay, I was abused as a graduate student...So I need to not then, you know, give that to the next generation.” | | 25:09 | David | “Formality is putting up barriers to openness. Right?” | | 26:59 | David | “You are a freaking elite athlete boss. And embrace that elite athlete identity as the first step.” | | 29:40 | David | “Be your own biggest fan...This is the boss episode. Live with Swag. Run with Swag. Train with Swag.” |

Important Timestamps

• 00:02–06:31: Playlist banter and the emotional/sporting power of music
• 06:31–11:08: Life updates, empathy for students and teachers, personal stories
• 11:13–20:42: Heart rate training deep-dive—zones, mistakes, practical advice
• 20:44–26:15: Coaching/mentoring philosophy—using enthusiasm and affirmation in academia and beyond
• 26:16–29:49: Training advice for all paces—everyone can (and should) train like an athlete

Takeaways

• Music can be a seriously motivating training tool—and don’t be afraid to laugh about your taste.
• Heart rate training is valuable as a spot check and guide, not a straitjacket.
• Most runners, regardless of genetics or pace, thrive on easy running—with a smart touch of “fast.”
• Bring your coaching enthusiasm everywhere: academia, work, sport, life. Don’t let tradition or “seriousness” stifle affirmation or authenticity.
• Every athlete deserves high-quality training, feedback, and support—no matter their speed, weight, or starting point.
• Always own your “boss” identity in training and life—bring the swag and the science.

Closing Line (David, 29:49):
"Be your own biggest fan...This is the boss episode. Live with Swag. Run with Swag. Train with Swag."

You’re awesome. They love you. We love you. Go out and crush it!